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2017-2018 Indiana Pacers and Everything NBA Thread


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58 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

As CBE has already told you JJ is a deadly 3 shooter and he's still overpaid too

He is overpaid in terms of his overall game. That said 76ers are like us in the sense that they have to overpay to get free agents right now. Maybe in a couple more years they won't but now they do. That said in the new nba where Steph curry gets 40 million paying olidepo half isn't horrible. His salary won't look nearly as bad when the whole NBA gets on new cba numbers. Compared to an Avery Johnson at 10 mil yes he is overpaid...compared to dru holiday st 25-30 million no he isn't. His salary will fall in line as time goes on.

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But dg....a lot of folks here ARE saying tank like the 76ers.

 

..One thing we have to stop doing is going back to the 80s and 90s.

You have many more draft choices then and players did not come out of school regularly in bulk at age 19..

 

You draft guys to develop them but to really improve...you have to get free agents.

Boston paid $100 mil for Al Horford and they're willing to pay another $100 mil for Gordon Hayward.

They wanted to pay big bucks for PG

They have more and better draft choices than anyone else in the league, right?

But they are going all out to sign free agents to try to win the conference... Why?

 

Because you need to be extremely lucky or get a once in generation player (Steph, LBJ)  to build a anything through the draft anymore. You must sign free agenst on their 2nd and 3rd contracts.   (Durant, Horford. Hayward)

They aren't waiting. Because you cant play future picks

 

So you do not lose intentionaly (which is what stripping your team is) to get picks because it cheats the fans... and it never works

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2 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

But dg....a lot of folks here ARE saying tank like the 76ers.

 

..One thing we have to stop doing is going back to the 80s and 90s.

You have many more draft choices then and players did not come out of school regularly in bulk at age 19..

 

You draft guys to develop them but to really improve...you have to get free agents.

Boston paid $100 mil for Al Horford and they're willing to pay another $100 mil for Gordon Hayward.

They wanted to pay big bucks for PG

They have more and better draft choices than anyone else in the league, right?

But they are going all out to sign free agents to try to win the conference... Why?

 

Because you need to be extremely lucky or get a once in generation player (Steph, LBJ)  to build a anything through the draft anymore. You must sign free agenst on their 2nd and 3rd contracts.   (Durant, Horford. Hayward)

They aren't waiting. Because you cant play future picks

 

So you do not lose intentionaly (which is what stripping your team is) to get picks because it cheats the fans... and it never works

Mark....where did Lebron and Durant go to play.....teams that had to spend time in the lottery but built good young teams through the draft. Once they drafted enough assets by sucking for many years they became targets for free agents. You have to start somewhere. Yes those 19year olds take time to develop. Yes they won't win right away...but you need a few with star potential. Teams aren't going to let a star just leave off a 2nd contract and if one gets away they aren't going to Indy....not a single superstar has ever come to Indiana to play in free agency. We drafted our Reggie millers, Danny Grangers, we traded for a young teenager to get jermaine O'Neal...we drafted Paul George.....if we want our next superstar he will be found in the lottery Mark....just like we found Myles in the lottery. It will take losing to get our next star. We aren't luring a Heyward to Indy....heck we have max money and he won't even interview and he is a home town kid! You draft stars and you hope to build around them...you get better and hit on some mid round guys but you have to start somewhere. Signing a bunch of avg players with no go to guy will get you nowhere. Maybe drafting in the lottery won't either...but I'm ok because it's taking a shot at greatness. Playing for 8th seed doesn't excite me. I'd rather watch young guys with potential show me flashes of greatness and lose then old vets grind out s few wins with no hope they will ever win a playoff series.

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One final thing Mark....do you know how a lot of teams get great players?? They trade draft picks to get them....like Wiggins for love....those top draft picks in the lottery have a much better chance to land you a star....so even if you don't like young 19 year olds....that kid with top potential has a much better chance to land you say a Kevin Love or Melo or Chris Paul or whomever your targeting. So even if you don't want that kid they can get you Jimmy Butler or another you want. It works both ways....what doesn't work is signing guys like Monta Ellis and Al Jefferson or JJ Reddick who are past their prime. I don't mean to argue but strategically going young and trying build through the draft has its advantages too. We just differ in opinion I guess.

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7 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Mark....where did Lebron and Durant go to play.....teams that had to spend time in the lottery but built good young teams through the draft. Once they drafted enough assets by sucking for many years they became targets for free agents. You have to start somewhere. Yes those 19year olds take time to develop. Yes they won't win right away...but you need a few with star potential. Teams aren't going to let a star just leave off a 2nd contract and if one gets away they aren't going to Indy....not a single superstar has ever come to Indiana to play in free agency. We drafted our Reggie millers, Danny Grangers, we traded for a young teenager to get jermaine O'Neal...we drafted Paul George.....if we want our next superstar he will be found in the lottery Mark....just like we found Myles in the lottery. It will take losing to get our next star. We aren't luring a Heyward to Indy....heck we have max money and he won't even interview and he is a home town kid! You draft stars and you hope to build around them...you get better and hit on some mid round guys but you have to start somewhere. Signing a bunch of avg players with no go to guy will get you nowhere. Maybe drafting in the lottery won't either...but I'm ok because it's taking a shot at greatness. Playing for 8th seed doesn't excite me. I'd rather watch young guys with potential show me flashes of greatness and lose then old vets grind out s few wins with no hope they will ever win a playoff series.

Lebron didnt go to Miami to find a team that built through the draft

He brought in Bosh with him an d they stacked the bench with vets

LeBron did go to  the cavs to find a team that built through the draft..

 

The draft has changed. The game has changed.

..and stop with the "Indiana is so bad nobody will come here" 

Trust me. They say that in EVERY NBA CITY..

If you believe that..then sell the franchise.

It isn't true..David West came to Indy and played on very good teams.

.also..Myles Turner is not a superstar ....not even close

 

..and shouldnt we start thinking about trading him at midseason because he wont stay in terrible place like Indianapolis???

We've got to live with the fear that every body will leave us because we live in such a horrible NBA city.

We've got to lose all our games so the next 19 year old God (whose name we don't know because he's a freshman in high school) will come to us for a couple of years before he leaves in free agency because 'no superstar has EVEER come to Indiana in free agency'

 

Seriously....Do you realize how negative and hopeless you sound.?

Can a franchise...any business..operate that way???

 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, dgambill said:

One final thing Mark....do you know how a lot of teams get great players?? They trade draft picks to get them....like Wiggins for love....those top draft picks in the lottery have a much better chance to land you a star....so even if you don't like young 19 year olds....that kid with top potential has a much better chance to land you say a Kevin Love or Melo or Chris Paul or whomever your targeting. So even if you don't want that kid they can get you Jimmy Butler or another you want. It works both ways....what doesn't work is signing guys like Monta Ellis and Al Jefferson or JJ Reddick who are past their prime. I don't mean to argue but strategically going young and trying build through the draft has its advantages too. We just differ in opinion I guess.

we do indeed differ..

but keep in mind.. You don't have to throw seasons to acquire free agents.

To get lottery picks year after year..you have to tank seasons...and cheat your fans....you just have to

 

I do not want to do that....its wrong

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3 hours ago, Luck is Good said:

Anyone know how to ignore?

Why argue with him. He's the one that was arguing for months that there was no way this team would trade Paul George. He is the biggest homer in the world and when he's wrong about something, he'll try to make himself right in anyway.

 

He said that he told us we wouldn't trade for picks but he said this on Friday.

On 6/30/2017 at 9:48 AM, oldunclemark said:

   I think we'll settle for Avery Bradley, Jae Crowder and one (not two) of the high Boston picks.

That allows the Pacers to stay competitive AND get a high pick (Maybe 2 with their own) in 2018

 

..and it allows Boston to occupy LeBron with PG, take their shot at the title (keep {G away from Cleveland) and keep a high draft choice for 2018 and 2019

 

He's a hypocrite. Let him be.

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54 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

we do indeed differ..

but keep in mind.. You don't have to throw seasons to acquire free agents.

To get lottery picks year after year..you have to tank seasons...and cheat your fans....you just have to

 

I do not want to do that....its wrong

Not if your fans are begging for it. I'm not talking about years of it. Just saying no matter what we try to do this year with PG gone and no real assets there is no hope of an nba title. Perhaps bringing a bunch of kids and see if one has potential. If we lose so be it. Your not the only fan. We all have been here through thick and thin too. We stuck through it after the malice at the palace. We knew when we would suck but we had faith we would draft well and get better. Ill stick by if they have a plan. I was at the next home game after the Detroit atrocity. I still supported us when we got blitzed by Orlando and Dwight when we suited up like 7 guys and had no shot to win. I was there cheering on Fred Jones going for like 30. We played kids and bench dudes and did the best we could but I stuck by. I'll stick by if we have a coupe sucky years again if we try to get some stars in the draft. Tell you what I don't like watching. Mediocre basketball with no hope of being better than medicore. At least sell me on the dream and be up front we are building something but don't give me ground chuck and tell me it's steak....it just isn't and I know it will never be. Good discussion though.

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2 hours ago, dgambill said:

He is overpaid in terms of his overall game. That said 76ers are like us in the sense that they have to overpay to get free agents right now. Maybe in a couple more years they won't but now they do. That said in the new nba where Steph curry gets 40 million paying olidepo half isn't horrible. His salary won't look nearly as bad when the whole NBA gets on new cba numbers. Compared to an Avery Johnson at 10 mil yes he is overpaid...compared to dru holiday st 25-30 million no he isn't. His salary will fall in line as time goes on.

The 76ers didnt overpay to lure JJ. They overpaid so it would only be a 1 year deal. Theyre just trying to avoid being in the same situation Lakers are currently in, where you have to unload talent just to get Mozgov/Deng of the books.

 

The reason Olidepo's contract is so bad, is because its 4 years with 3 years left for a sub-par starter. You generally have to give up top talent or a draft pick to unload such an awful contract. Indy took the terrible contract and gave up their star player at the same time. I havent seen a team get fleeced like this since Billy King was running the Nets

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19 minutes ago, HOFClipboardHolder said:

The 76ers didnt overpay to lure JJ. They overpaid so it would only be a 1 year deal. Theyre just trying to avoid being in the same situation Lakers are currently in, where you have to unload talent just to get Mozgov/Deng of the books.

 

The reason Olidepo's contract is so bad, is because its 4 years with 3 years left for a sub-par starter. You generally have to give up top talent or a draft pick to unload such an awful contract. Indy took the terrible contract and gave up their star player at the same time. I havent seen a team get fleeced like this since Billy King was running the Nets

Good points the last part makes me sad lol 

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49 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Good points the last part makes me sad lol 

Cheer Up!! At least Boston got completely screwed

 

They traded away Fultz to Philadelphia to increase their assets in hopes of getting either Butler or George. The Bulls gave away Butler for pennies on the dollar and we know what just happened to George. So, now we have Boston sitting on a ton of young assets which are solid enough to get you to the playoffs, but not good enough to win you a championship. Essentially, just stuck in limbo for all eternity. Which in today's NBA is the worst place you can be.

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16 minutes ago, HOFClipboardHolder said:

Cheer Up!! At least Boston got completely screwed

 

They traded away Fultz to Philadelphia to increase their assets in hopes of getting either Butler or George. The Bulls gave away Butler for pennies on the dollar and we know what just happened to George. So, now we have Boston sitting on a ton of young assets which are solid enough to get you to the playoffs, but not good enough to win you a championship. Essentially, just stuck in limbo for all eternity. Which in today's NBA is the worst place you can be.

That's where we are too lol but at least we have company haha

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To all criticizing this trade, Pacers got a young fella who avg 16 ppg and is a darn good player even though people state he's overpaid.  He could also be better for the Pacers not being around a ball hog like Westbrook.  Sabonis has UNTAPPED, literally UNTAPPED potential and we have no idea how good he could be for the Pacers.   For a one year rental for OKC the Pacers actually got a pretty good deal.  Yeah, a lottery pick would've been nice but that lottery pick could've turned out to be total crap.  I can't wait to see Lance and Victor, two fellas who can ball it out on the D side of the ball.  Pacers won't drop off much from where they were. 

 

People want them to tank so they can draft lottery picks but yeah, we see that it hasn't worked out for the Sixers, or Wolves for that matter.  I do agree though they're kind of going to be stuck in this limbo stage, 30-40 wins, low playoff seed, or no playoffs.  Turner has to step up and become the face of the franchise but the team wasn't that good with PG, Teague and only made the playoffs because they brought Lance back = true.  Pacers would have probably not made the playoffs if it wasn't for Lance so it's good to see they brought in a very solid player on both sides of the ball.  I think Victor can actually be a stud for the Pacers.  Elite superstar status, probably not but we have no clue.  

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4 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

we do indeed differ..

but keep in mind.. You don't have to throw seasons to acquire free agents.

To get lottery picks year after year..you have to tank seasons...and cheat your fans....you just have to

 

I do not want to do that....its wrong

That's what we need to do now bring in young guys. A lot like the Colts are doing. Ian Clark,

J Simmons, Caldwell-Pope are RFA I'd look at Shabbazz Hardsway Jr. a couple of FA's Ross and Patterson. then Trey Burke is behind  Wall. I'm not sure if he's a RFS but McCaw in GS is 21 I'd love to get him. We can add some young players ready to take off. We have miniutes to offer. 

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7 hours ago, dgambill said:

Some tank on purpose like the 6ers...nobody is saying that. Other however realize your not going anywhere with a few marginal free agents. You invest heavily in young players in their growth by playing them and letting them grow...you draft a Kyrie Irving, a Steph curry, Thompson, Wiggins and then when you have enough valuable young pieces you can trade them for those stars you talk about on their second or third contract like a Love or you add that free agent like a Durant. Few get there by buying their way to a championship. The Bulls didn't, the Celtics, Lakers, Pistons didn't. They drafted their grants, Pippen, and mJs. Their Thomas and dumars, they went through tough times and got their birds, mchales and magics and worthy. More often then not you get your star through the draft. Few get gifted a super star....unless one begs a trade like PG. Look at the best teams in the NBA...GS was great by the draft and got greater by a free agent gifting them. Cleveland built enough talent to lure Lebron and then trade for another star. Spurs drafted most of their team too. Boston has a ton of draft picks and a couple free agents and a nice move to get Thomas. Washington drafted well. Utah the same. OKC too. Only team that didn't that is relevant is Houston....they've tried over and over to buy great teams and it hasn't worked well. Can't just throw stars together and expect it to gel. You draft great and then become a target for a another star to come. I wish we had Paul as we would be closer but fact is he didn't want to be on this team...so start at square one and find us our next Paul and that will be found in the lottery I'm afraid.

Is pick 10 considered a lottery pick?  That is where George was drafted by the Pacers. Danny Granger was drafted at pick 17.

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22 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Is pick 10 considered a lottery pick?  That is where George was drafted by the Pacers. Danny Granger was drafted at pick 17.

The teams in the lottery are the teams who did not make the playoffs. I believe that is 1-14 now. It obviously increased as the league size increased. Reggie Miller and Myles Turner both were selected at #11. Reggie was not a "lottery pick" because in 1987 only 7 teams were in the lottery. 

 

PG 10th was a lottery pick but Granger 17th and Kawhi Leonard 15th were both outside the lottery. That provides some insight on the much debated topic on the board last night Do you need to tank to draft All Star caliber players?  No

 

The All NBA teams further illustraties the point. This season 7 of the 15 players to be named to the All NBA team were not lottery picks. 3 of the 7 were.not even 1st round picks. Leonard 15th Gobert 27th Antetokounmpo 15th Butler 30th were not lottery picks and Thomas Green and Jordan were 2nd rounders. 

 

The NBA All Defensive team you will find just 2 lottery picks among the 10 players selected. Half of the team members were 2nd round draft picks. 

 

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7 hours ago, HOFClipboardHolder said:

The 76ers didnt overpay to lure JJ. They overpaid so it would only be a 1 year deal. Theyre just trying to avoid being in the same situation Lakers are currently in, where you have to unload talent just to get Mozgov/Deng of the books.

 

The reason Olidepo's contract is so bad, is because its 4 years with 3 years left for a sub-par starter. You generally have to give up top talent or a draft pick to unload such an awful contract. Indy took the terrible contract and gave up their star player at the same time. I havent seen a team get fleeced like this since Billy King was running the Nets

Yes one year for JJ makes a difference. When all said and done this isn't nearly as bad as paying Monta or AL for 3-4 years at 10 to 11 a piece. 20 million is going rate for starting sg in NBA. Granted I would love to have my sg shoot lol but dipo has other assets. He is a slasher and great defender and can make plays for others. OKC was a horrible fit because they asked him to play off Russ and their games don't mesh. Only problem I see is Lance plays the very same game. If we had a Steph curry pg that can't defend and shoots the 3 I would love to have a dipo next to him. Dipo can guard other teams best guard and get to basket while our pg stands around at 3pt line. It honestly explains why we are interested in hill again. We would have to guards that defend well but hill is a spot up shooter and Dipo more of a facilitator driver. Dipo contract is getting more in line by the day. I would have loved to get more for him but I seriously doubt better young players were being offered. I also think Sabonis is the key to the trade. He defends pretty good and is a banger and can get buckets inside while he is still developing an outside game. Perfect compliment to Myles outside in game.

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1 hour ago, crazycolt1 said:

Is pick 10 considered a lottery pick?  That is where George was drafted by the Pacers. Danny Granger was drafted at pick 17.

Yes. Of course. If you don't make the playoffs you are entered into the lottery for a chance for your top 14 pick to be top 3....rest are seated by win loss. Your right Granger was just outside lottery....Turner/PG definitely lottery picks.

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25 minutes ago, akcolt said:

The teams in the lottery are the teams who did not make the playoffs. I believe that is 1-14 now. It obviously increased as the league size increased. Reggie Miller and Myles Turner both were selected at #11. Reggie was not a "lottery pick" because in 1987 only 7 teams were in the lottery. 

 

PG 10th was a lottery pick but Granger 17th and Kawhi Leonard 15th were both outside the lottery. That provides some insight on the much debated topic on the board last night Do you need to tank to draft All Star caliber players?  No

 

The All NBA teams further illustraties the point. This season 7 of the 15 players to be named to the All NBA team were not lottery picks. 3 of the 7 were.not even 1st round picks. Leonard 15th Gobert 27th Antetokounmpo 15th Butler 30th were not lottery picks and Thomas Green and Jordan were 2nd rounders. 

 

The NBA All Defensive team you will find just 2 lottery picks among the 10 players selected. Half of the team members were 2nd round draft picks. 

 

It would be easy to say Cousins, KAT, Irving, Thompson, George, and Heyward desearved to be on the all NBA team as much as Green and Jordan and maybe IT. The Greek freak and Leonard being a couple my favorite players are definitely exceptions. Butler and gobert too. I think if you look at the top stars in the league they are lottery type guys. Champions are built around those types. But I agree that you can find a star outside it.....which is why I get ticked off the last several years when we go giving away our draft picks and young talent like Plumlee to get old vets who are supposedly the final pieces to a championship like Scola and Young. I hate it. I just want to invest in the draft to revuild this and ok with taking a step back to do it. Some want to go all in every year and that's how we end up with horrible contracts like Monta and AL in my opinion.

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3 hours ago, akcolt said:

That's what we need to do now bring in young guys. A lot like the Colts are doing. Ian Clark,

J Simmons, Caldwell-Pope are RFA I'd look at Shabbazz Hardsway Jr. a couple of FA's Ross and Patterson. then Trey Burke is behind  Wall. I'm not sure if he's a RFS but McCaw in GS is 21 I'd love to get him. We can add some young players ready to take off. We have miniutes to offer. 

I would rather over spend on those types (because you have to otherwise their teams will match the offer) then for an aged vet that is what he is and on the decline...ala Monta Ellis. Yes I'd go that route...but apparently that's tanking so we can't do that.

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4 hours ago, Malakai432 said:

To all criticizing this trade, Pacers got a young fella who avg 16 ppg and is a darn good player even though people state he's overpaid.  He could also be better for the Pacers not being around a ball hog like Westbrook.  Sabonis has UNTAPPED, literally UNTAPPED potential and we have no idea how good he could be for the Pacers.   For a one year rental for OKC the Pacers actually got a pretty good deal.  Yeah, a lottery pick would've been nice but that lottery pick could've turned out to be total crap.  I can't wait to see Lance and Victor, two fellas who can ball it out on the D side of the ball.  Pacers won't drop off much from where they were. 

 

People want them to tank so they can draft lottery picks but yeah, we see that it hasn't worked out for the Sixers, or Wolves for that matter.  I do agree though they're kind of going to be stuck in this limbo stage, 30-40 wins, low playoff seed, or no playoffs.  Turner has to step up and become the face of the franchise but the team wasn't that good with PG, Teague and only made the playoffs because they brought Lance back = true.  Pacers would have probably not made the playoffs if it wasn't for Lance so it's good to see they brought in a very solid player on both sides of the ball.  I think Victor can actually be a stud for the Pacers.  Elite superstar status, probably not but we have no clue.  

I agree with the part about what we got...there is still potential there....but how can you say Minnesota hasn't done well in the draft????  KAT, Wiggins, Rubio...Dunn and Lavine who were traded to land you Jimmy Butler. They moved Rubio to get space for Teague but those picks have worked out nicely. Honestly 6ers tank job was bad because they took longer because they drafted poorly at the top. Obviously that won't help you....also investing in 3 centers when it's a guard league doesn't make a lot of sense.

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20 minutes ago, dgambill said:

I agree with the part about what we got...there is still potential there....but how can you say Minnesota hasn't done well in the draft????  KAT, Wiggins, Rubio...Dunn and Lavine who were traded to land you Jimmy Butler. They moved Rubio to get space for Teague but those picks have worked out nicely. Honestly 6ers tank job was bad because they took longer because they drafted poorly at the top. Obviously that won't help you....also investing in 3 centers when it's a guard league doesn't make a lot of sense.

So much truth in this post. Timberwolves have drafted pretty damn good players the last so many years. They'll make the playoffs. They just need to make sure they don't get the 8 seed. That spot is a death wish the next few years. And on the 76ers, yeah why invest in so many C's? Need a good supplement of guards as well

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In an effort to change the tone of the thread....with what we have on the roster...who would you like to sign in free agency moving forward. There are some nice rfa out there but you have to overpay to get them. Wr have huge hole at pg and sf right now. We all know Lance can't really be our pg solution and Leaf can't start at sf as a rookie. I'd like to target Darren Collinson. Played here before...solid starter and a great locker room guy for youngsters. He also would be reasonable probably 10 million a year. Do a 1+1 deal for him. Then I'd like to go after a Thabo Sefalosha or maybe Moute from Clippers. I don't think either will be huge investments and will give us a defensive minded team. We aren't going to out score anyone next year so let's change this mindset to make other team earn it. Build a culture. It would allow us to possibly keep like 10-12 million under salary cap and give us flexibility to take on a bad contract some team is trying to move and maybe get a draft pick out of a deal. It also would mean we will be competitive on the floor but likely still a lottery team. That's my hope.

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8 hours ago, Malakai432 said:

To all criticizing this trade, Pacers got a young fella who avg 16 ppg and is a darn good player even though people state he's overpaid.  He could also be better for the Pacers not being around a ball hog like Westbrook.  Sabonis has UNTAPPED, literally UNTAPPED potential and we have no idea how good he could be for the Pacers.   For a one year rental for OKC the Pacers actually got a pretty good deal.  Yeah, a lottery pick would've been nice but that lottery pick could've turned out to be total crap.  I can't wait to see Lance and Victor, two fellas who can ball it out on the D side of the ball.  Pacers won't drop off much from where they were. 

 

People want them to tank so they can draft lottery picks but yeah, we see that it hasn't worked out for the Sixers, or Wolves for that matter.  I do agree though they're kind of going to be stuck in this limbo stage, 30-40 wins, low playoff seed, or no playoffs.  Turner has to step up and become the face of the franchise but the team wasn't that good with PG, Teague and only made the playoffs because they brought Lance back = true.  Pacers would have probably not made the playoffs if it wasn't for Lance so it's good to see they brought in a very solid player on both sides of the ball.  I think Victor can actually be a stud for the Pacers.  Elite superstar status, probably not but we have no clue.  

 

 

Get ready for some very mediocre basketball. That's what happened. I wasn't going to pay attention closely to this team if it's not competing for something anyway (the NBA is really rather boring as a whole). So they can win 35-40 games and people can be ok with that, but until this team actually rebuilds around relevant talent (that's not Victor Olidipo, guys) they're in the mud. This was a lateral move (actually it's not even lateral, it's backwards) that does nothing for them in the long term and doesn't provide anything of interest in the current. NBA purgatory is the worst. If this team, based on it's location and inability to maintain talent is going to ever win a title they're going to have to amass young talent and hope they peak together. We didn't get the picks for PG that give the team the potential to get those guys in the future, so it's not even a wash. It's a fail and frankly a bad one. 

It's not Boogie walking on Sac bad, but it's not far off.

 

21Superman's post a few pages back was pretty well thought out btw.

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15 hours ago, Luck is Good said:

Anyone know how to ignore?

Go to forum.colts.com/ignore and you should be able to add people to your ignore list on there

 

Mod note to everyone: please think twice before posting.  Things are getting a little bit edgy, so please refrain from all personal shots and insults.  Let's keep things focused on basketball in this thread

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3 hours ago, dgambill said:

I agree with the part about what we got...there is still potential there....but how can you say Minnesota hasn't done well in the draft????  KAT, Wiggins, Rubio...Dunn and Lavine who were traded to land you Jimmy Butler. They moved Rubio to get space for Teague but those picks have worked out nicely. Honestly 6ers tank job was bad because they took longer because they drafted poorly at the top. Obviously that won't help you....also investing in 3 centers when it's a guard league doesn't make a lot of sense.

The wolves are also in the running for Paul Millsap that would be crazy 

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46 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

Go to forum.colts.com/ignore and you should be able to add people to your ignore list on there

 

Mod note to everyone: please think twice before posting.  Things are getting a little bit edgy, so please refrain from all personal shots and insults.  Let's keep things focused on basketball in this thread

I'm not gonna ignore anyone. Just something I happened to say

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3 hours ago, dgambill said:

In an effort to change the tone of the thread....with what we have on the roster...who would you like to sign in free agency moving forward. There are some nice rfa out there but you have to overpay to get them. Wr have huge hole at pg and sf right now. We all know Lance can't really be our pg solution and Leaf can't start at sf as a rookie. I'd like to target Darren Collinson. Played here before...solid starter and a great locker room guy for youngsters. He also would be reasonable probably 10 million a year. Do a 1+1 deal for him. Then I'd like to go after a Thabo Sefalosha or maybe Moute from Clippers. I don't think either will be huge investments and will give us a defensive minded team. We aren't going to out score anyone next year so let's change this mindset to make other team earn it. Build a culture. It would allow us to possibly keep like 10-12 million under salary cap and give us flexibility to take on a bad contract some team is trying to move and maybe get a draft pick out of a deal. It also would mean we will be competitive on the floor but likely still a lottery team. That's my hope.

 

Before the OKC trade I read the Pacers were interested in Rondo. I'm not sure they still are now because Rondo is not a good fit (skill wise) next to Lance or Victor. I think Collison could be a good fit though.

 

I like the idea of bringing in guys who are defensive minded. Prichard hinted that he wants to get tougher. I think Thabo and Moute would be nice additions for a year or two.

 

Shabazz Muhammad might be worth a look too. He will probably want to go somewhere he can show what he can do and that is not going to happen with Wiggins and now Butler in Minnesota. 

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4 hours ago, dgambill said:

I agree with the part about what we got...there is still potential there....but how can you say Minnesota hasn't done well in the draft????  KAT, Wiggins, Rubio...Dunn and Lavine who were traded to land you Jimmy Butler. They moved Rubio to get space for Teague but those picks have worked out nicely. Honestly 6ers tank job was bad because they took longer because they drafted poorly at the top. Obviously that won't help you....also investing in 3 centers when it's a guard league doesn't make a lot of sense.

The sixers only had one bad draft. Taking Okafor. Hinkie, the GM, wanted Porzingis and the owner wanted Okafor.

 

And trading Noel for nothing, but at that point Colangelo took over as the gm. During last summer, the Sixers were being offered Marcus Smart for Noel. Before the trade deadline last year, the Sixers being offered the trade that landed DeMarcus Cousins in New Orleans, but for Okafor instead. In both cases, Colangelo got greedy and held out for more. Terrible GMs are going to be terrible. This is the same guy that drafted Andrea Bargnani and traded a first for an over the hill  Jermaine O’Neal

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9 hours ago, dgambill said:

I agree with the part about what we got...there is still potential there....but how can you say Minnesota hasn't done well in the draft????  KAT, Wiggins, Rubio...Dunn and Lavine who were traded to land you Jimmy Butler. They moved Rubio to get space for Teague but those picks have worked out nicely. Honestly 6ers tank job was bad because they took longer because they drafted poorly at the top. Obviously that won't help you....also investing in 3 centers when it's a guard league doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

Yeah they drafted some good players but the team just remains stagnant and feels like it has been for ages.  However, that may change this year.  They seem pretty loaded.  KAT, Teague, Wiggins and Butler. 

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56 minutes ago, PrincetonTiger said:

There is a rumor out there that the Pacers are trying to acquire Cory Joseph

That would be a positive....only 26....he;s been in the NBA 7 years..

Never had a full chance to start

 

The kind of player we need..  Low perice $7 mil..signed for 2 years.

WE could bring Lance ff the bench where he'll excel..

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1 hour ago, MTC said:

Watching the summer league game against the Hornets. TJ Leaf looks pretty bad on defense and not physical enough.

One game but he didn't show much.

Travis Leslie looked good again..but he's 27

 

Joe Young seems ready to play regularly for us

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