A look at Luck's stats for this year.

[Valpo2004]

Was looking over Luck's stats for this year compared to other years.

 

In terms of passer rating he's sitting at 95.4 which is his 2nd highest behind 2014 which was 96.5.  

 

His Int rate is 1.5% which is his best in his career narrowly beating out 2013's 1.6%

 

His TD rate is 4.9% which is way below his 2014 rate of 6.5% but way better then his first 2 years which where 3.7% and 4%.  It's actually close to his 2015 rate which was 5.1%

 

YPG is 293.8 his 2nd highest behind 2014 which was at 297.6.  And he's currently tied with Phillip Rivers for 4th place in terms of passing yards. And 5th place with Brees & Stafford for TD's.  

 

Completion percentage is 63.9%  Career best by more then 2%.  (2014 is 2nd with 61.7%)

 

So despite what many people might think Luck is playing well.  

 

Ok but now for the bad news.  In 5 games he's already taken 20 sacks.  That is on pace for 64 sacks on the season which is TERRIBLE.  His rookie year which was his worst in terms of sacks he took 41 sacks.  

 

 

[Malakai432]

1 minute ago, Valpo2004 said:

Was looking over Luck's stats for this year compared to other years.

 

In terms of passer rating he's sitting at 95.4 which is his 2nd highest behind 2014 which was 96.5.  

 

His Int rate is 1.5% which is his best in his career narrowly beating out 2013's 1.6%

 

His TD rate is 4.9% which is way below his 2014 rate of 6.5% but way better then his first 2 years which where 3.7% and 4%.  It's actually close to his 2015 rate which was 5.1%

 

YPG is 293.8 his 2nd highest behind 2014 which was at 297.6.  And he's currently tied with Phillip Rivers for 4th place in terms of passing yards. And 5th place with Brees & Stafford for TD's.  

 

Completion percentage is 63.9%  Career best by more then 2%.  (2014 is 2nd with 61.7%)

 

So despite what many people might think Luck is playing well.  

 

Ok but now for the bad news.  In 5 games he's already taken 20 sacks.  That is on pace for 64 sacks on the season which is TERRIBLE.  His rookie year which was his worst in terms of sacks he took 41 sacks.  

 

 

 

Yeah he is, still too much pressure getting to him and the play calling is still highly questionable but he's making the best of it.

[BullsColtsFan1]

His numbers are impressive because he's under pressure a lot.  He needs to stop taking hits.  He's on pace to get sacked 60 times.  If he has a clean pocket and time, he's deadly.  It's done a good job limiting turnovers as well.

[Valpo2004]

42 minutes ago, BullsColtsFan1 said:

His numbers are impressive because he's under pressure a lot.  He needs to stop taking hits.  He's on pace to get sacked 60 times.  If he has a clean pocket and time, he's deadly.  It's done a good job limiting turnovers as well.

 

That's actually the most exciting thing to me.  He's managed to get a close to 5% TD rate while having a 1.5% INT rate.

 

It seems like he's taken the best of 2013 and the best of 2014 and put them together.  

[BullsColtsFan1]

20 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

That's actually the most exciting thing to me.  He's managed to get a close to 5% TD rate while having a 1.5% INT rate.

 

It seems like he's taken the best of 2013 and the best of 2014 and put them together.  

I totally agree.  On the downside it seems like his o line and defense are failing him worse than ever.  I hope they can figure some things out.  He's taking way to many hits, they need to limit that, I don't want to see him getting hurt again like last year. 

[Jdubu]

It would be interesting to know how many of these sacks are on him for holding it too long vs how many of them are because his oline didn't. Lock very well at all. The good thing I seen about this last game was, yes he was sacked but known of them were crushing blind hits (iirc). 

 

Sacks are going to happen (unless your a colt defender  but limiting the big crushing sack is crucial. Our offensive coordinator really needs to get these shorter middle crossing routes and bubble screens figured out and for the love of God, we need to figure out how to run a screen period. If we can get that down, that will take a lot of heat off him because teams can't just pin the ears back and rush every down. 

[Valpo2004]

On 10/10/2016 at 1:56 PM, Jdubu said:

It would be interesting to know how many of these sacks are on him for holding it too long vs how many of them are because his oline didn't. Lock very well at all. The good thing I seen about this last game was, yes he was sacked but known of them were crushing blind hits (iirc). 

 

Sacks are going to happen (unless your a colt defender  but limiting the big crushing sack is crucial. Our offensive coordinator really needs to get these shorter middle crossing routes and bubble screens figured out and for the love of God, we need to figure out how to run a screen period. If we can get that down, that will take a lot of heat off him because teams can't just pin the ears back and rush every down. 

 

It would be hard to determine in some cases.  

 

I think when someone immediately gets into the pocket then it's clear that it's the responsibility of the OL.

 

But the question then becomes. . . on whom do you pin the blame for coverage sacks?  

 

Say Luck's in the pocket for more then 3 seconds, but everyone is covered and therefore any throw he makes would be at risk to be intercepted.  If Luck can't get out of the pocket to throw the ball away or advance the ball by running (due to the position of defenders or that the down and distance would not allow that.)  Then is Luck responsible for that sack?  The receivers?  OL? A combination of the 3?  

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

1 hour ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

It would be hard to determine in some cases.  

 

I think when someone immediately gets into the pocket then it's clear that it's the responsibility of the OL.

 

But the question then becomes. . . on whom do you pin the blame for coverage sacks?  

 

Say Luck's in the pocket for more then 3 seconds, but everyone is covered and therefore any throw he makes would be at risk to be intercepted.  If Luck can't get out of the pocket to throw the ball away or advance the ball by running (due to the position of defenders or that the down and distance would not allow that.)  Then is Luck responsible for that sack?  The receivers?  OL? A combination of the 3?  

 

Need more crossing short routes. I would say it's on the OC for calling so many long plays, at which point we make the OLINE look horrible, and WRs look slow. 

[NewColtsFan]

5 minutes ago, Indianapolis-Colts-Fan said:

 

Need more crossing short routes. I would say it's on the OC for calling so many long plays, at which point we make the OLINE look horrible, and WRs look slow. 

 

I'm confused....

 

We are running fewer longer patterns than we have in Luck's 4 and a half seasons.     More intermediate and more short patterns than ever before.

 

 

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'm confused....

 

We are running fewer longer patterns than we have in Luck's 4 and a half seasons.     More intermediate and more short patterns than ever before.

 

 

 

Its great to do that but when your long routes come on 3rd and short there maybe an issue. 

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

31 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'm confused....

 

We are running fewer longer patterns than we have in Luck's 4 and a half seasons.     More intermediate and more short patterns than ever before.

 

 

That may be the case but Luck must not know that. He's either missing these guys on the short routes or they're not getting open. 

 

Look at his time in the pocket, it's quite a bit this year. Yet supposedly we're calling much more short/intermediate routes? Something doesn't add up. 

 

I think Luck is still looking too much for the long play or just plain doesn't trust our guys on short routes. 

[NewColtsFan]

33 minutes ago, Indianapolis-Colts-Fan said:

 

Its great to do that but when your long routes come on 3rd and short there maybe an issue. 

 

I would not disagree with that!      I have wondered a fair amount about the WHEN of when we throw long....

 

Fair point!  

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

3 minutes ago, Gabriel Alexander Morillo said:

That may be the case but Luck must not know that. He's either missing these guys on the short routes or they're not getting open. 

 

Look at his time in the pocket, it's quite a bit this year. Yet supposedly we're calling much more short/intermediate routes? Something doesn't add up. 

 

I think Luck is still looking too much for the long play or just plain doesn't trust our guys on short routes. 

 

Well....   he's completing a career high 64% of his passes....   and he's throwing 41 a game....   so he's got to be doing something right....

 

 

[Steamboat_Shaun]

2 hours ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

It would be hard to determine in some cases.  

 

I think when someone immediately gets into the pocket then it's clear that it's the responsibility of the OL.

 

But the question then becomes. . . on whom do you pin the blame for coverage sacks?  

 

Say Luck's in the pocket for more then 3 seconds, but everyone is covered and therefore any throw he makes would be at risk to be intercepted.  If Luck can't get out of the pocket to throw the ball away or advance the ball by running (due to the position of defenders or that the down and distance would not allow that.)  Then is Luck responsible for that sack?  The receivers?  OL? A combination of the 3?  

 

If the pocket is intact for 3 seconds, it's definitely not on the o-line, and there were several of those instances on Sunday. If no one's open, throw it away, & if you can't do that, than go down before the contact from defenders get there, like Manning did for all those years. 

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

30 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Well....   he's completing a career high 64% of his passes....   and he's throwing 41 a game....   so he's got to be doing something right....

 

 

That wasn't my point at all. What I'm saying is that Luck is getting lots more time in the pocket=more chance to complete his throws (obviously, right?)  and I think he's just completing a lot of long ball plays. Not necessarily go routes but long throws of 15+ yards none the less. Which is also why hes getting sacked at a record pace, because he has so much time but looks for the deep play instead of short plays. 

 

I know Luck is having a great year, there's no arguing that. I just don't see us using short throws or even smart play calling in general. 

[NewColtsFan]

12 minutes ago, Gabriel Alexander Morillo said:

That wasn't my point at all. What I'm saying is that Luck is getting lots more time in the pocket=more chance to complete his throws (obviously, right?)  and I think he's just completing a lot of long ball plays. Not necessarily go routes but long throws of 15+ yards none the less. Which is also why hes getting sacked at a record pace, because he has so much time but looks for the deep play instead of short plays. 

 

I know Luck is having a great year, there's no arguing that. I just don't see us using short throws or even smart play calling in general. 

 

I don't know if the formatting will hold,  but look at our receiving stats.    Only Hilton and Dorsett have any kind of yards per catch numbers.    And Hilton's might be the lowest or near the lowest of his career.   Then there's Dorsett.     But everyone else has very, very low average per catch.    Look at the first five receivers...   Hilton, then running back, tight end,  tight end, and running back.

 

In this case,  the stats are NOT lying.   We're throwing mostly short passes.     We're not throwing 15+ nearly as much as you think we are.   The stats tell you that we're not.     It's in the average per catch.     Sometimes stats can lie.     This is NOT one of those times.

 

Receiving

PLAYER	REC	YDS	YDS/REC	LONG	TD
						T.Y. Hilton	35	507	14.5	63	3
Josh Ferguson	19	127	6.7	14	0
Dwayne Allen	17	183	10.8	20	2
Jack Doyle	16	151	9.4	22	2
Frank Gore	14	70	5	14	1
Phillip Dorsett	11	241	21.9	64	1
Donte Moncrief	7	73	10.4	32	1
Chester Rogers	5	63	12.6	23	0
Robert Turbin	4	18	4.5	12	0
Quan Bray	3	36	12	22	0

[BPindy]

On 10/10/2016 at 0:07 PM, Valpo2004 said:

Was looking over Luck's stats for this year compared to other years.

 

In terms of passer rating he's sitting at 95.4 which is his 2nd highest behind 2014 which was 96.5.  

 

His Int rate is 1.5% which is his best in his career narrowly beating out 2013's 1.6%

 

His TD rate is 4.9% which is way below his 2014 rate of 6.5% but way better then his first 2 years which where 3.7% and 4%.  It's actually close to his 2015 rate which was 5.1%

 

YPG is 293.8 his 2nd highest behind 2014 which was at 297.6.  And he's currently tied with Phillip Rivers for 4th place in terms of passing yards. And 5th place with Brees & Stafford for TD's.  

 

Completion percentage is 63.9%  Career best by more then 2%.  (2014 is 2nd with 61.7%)

 

So despite what many people might think Luck is playing well.  

 

Ok but now for the bad news.  In 5 games he's already taken 20 sacks.  That is on pace for 64 sacks on the season which is TERRIBLE.  His rookie year which was his worst in terms of sacks he took 41 sacks.  

 

 

 

Not only are the number of sacks terrible, 64 would be one of the highest of all time. He's having a fantastic year, just don't want to see him slow down on the back half due to the hits adding up...

[Larry Horseman]

@NewColtsFan I think you are a bit off on this shorter routes argument. Luck is dumping the ball of a ton to TEs and RBs, but there are way too many intermediate to long routes with our WRs. Hilton's YPC, considering his volume of targets, is actually high. For example, he is third in the league in receptions and has a higher YPC than Brown and Green (the two with more catches) and everyone else in the top 10 in catches aside from Greg Olson (an aside, Olson is having a heck of a year). Also, Hilton is 5th in the league in receiving yards (507) but 38th in yards after catch (104). Finally, Luck is second in passing yards and second in air yards (yards the pass travels in the air) with 62% (meaning only 38% are YAC). For comparison, Matt Ryan, a perfect example of a successful short to intermediate passing scheme thus far this season, is fourth in passing yards but only 48% of his yards are air yards. All this tells me two things: 1) the Colts actually do run a lot of longer routes; 2) the short dump offs are ineffective (Gore with 14 receptions and 70 yards...yuck). 

 

I think a glaring issue is the lack of both ran and completed WR screens, slants, digs, etc., that would take pressure off of the OL and Luck and allow TY and Dorsett to get YAC. This has been an issue from Arians to Pep to Chud. I have to wonder if Luck just prefers a scheme that focuses on longer route combinations. Of course, Arians and Chud are from the same school, and Pep was well, Pep. 

 

At any rate, Luck is missing some open receivers and getting hit too much (some due to holding the ball too long), but despite these issues having a heck of a season. The scary thing is that the offense and Luck have some warts and he is still fantastic. 

 

 

[Kirie89]

Another thing that doesn’t get mentioned much and don’t show up in any stat, is the fact that Luck (as far as I can remember) don’t have any almost interceptions.

 

Except for the three interceptions, there hasn’t been any throws where defenders almost get it, drops it, get in each other’s way or similar.

 

That to me is also a big positive that is promising for the future.

[NewColtsFan]

15 minutes ago, Larry Horseman said:

@NewColtsFan I think you are a bit off on this shorter routes argument. Luck is dumping the ball of a ton to TEs and RBs, but there are way too many intermediate to long routes with our WRs. Hilton's YPC, considering his volume of targets, is actually high. For example, he is third in the league in receptions and has a higher YPC than Brown and Green (the two with more catches) and everyone else in the top 10 in catches aside from Greg Olson (an aside, Olson is having a heck of a year). Also, Hilton is 5th in the league in receiving yards (507) but 38th in yards after catch (104). Finally, Luck is second in passing yards and second in air yards (yards the pass travels in the air) with 62% (meaning only 38% are YAC). For comparison, Matt Ryan, a perfect example of a successful short to intermediate passing scheme thus far this season, is fourth in passing yards but only 48% of his yards are air yards. All this tells me two things: 1) the Colts actually do run a lot of longer routes; 2) the short dump offs are ineffective (Gore with 14 receptions and 70 yards...yuck). 

 

I think a glaring issue is the lack of both ran and completed WR screens, slants, digs, etc., that would take pressure off of the OL and Luck and allow TY and Dorsett to get YAC. This has been an issue from Arians to Pep to Chud. I have to wonder if Luck just prefers a scheme that focuses on longer route combinations. Of course, Arians and Chud are from the same school, and Pep was well, Pep. 

 

At any rate, Luck is missing some open receivers and getting hit too much (some due to holding the ball too long), but despite these issues having a heck of a season. The scary thing is that the offense and Luck have some warts and he is still fantastic. 

 

 

 

 

Larry.....    thanks for the thoughtful post....     

 

I'm sorry,  I can't get the stats to stick in proper formatting,  but on TYH's personal page here on the website,  it shows that his average per catch is the 2nd lowest of his career.     Only in his 2nd year, when he hurt a leg was his average per catch ever lower.     Here is TY's page.

 

http://www.colts.com/team/roster/T.Y.-Hilton/1bfc81a4-87be-4e0e-bc21-25099996be55

 

He's at 14.6 now....   typically he's in the 16's and 17's per catch.     So, even with Hilton,  we're not throwing as much deep to him as we have in the past.      And, at least for now,  I'm perfectly fine with that.      I don't care where he is league-wide.      I care where he, and others are compared to what we've done in years past.    And the stats say we're throwing more short passes than ever before.

 

As far as I can see,  we are literally throwing shorter to almost every single receiver on the team.    The stats say we are.....     I'm not sure how anyone is not understanding this.

 

[Larry Horseman]

9 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

Larry.....    thanks for the thoughtful post....     

 

I'm sorry,  I can't get the stats to stick in proper formatting,  but on TYH's personal page here on the website,  it shows that his average per catch is the 2nd lowest of his career.     Only in his 2nd year, when he hurt a leg was his average per catch ever lower.     Here is TY's page.

 

http://www.colts.com/team/roster/T.Y.-Hilton/1bfc81a4-87be-4e0e-bc21-25099996be55

 

He's at 14.6 now....   typically he's in the 16's and 17's per catch.     So, even with Hilton,  we're not throwing as much deep to him as we have in the past.      And, at least for now,  I'm perfectly fine with that.      I don't care where he is league-wide.      I care where he, and others are compared to what we've done in years past.    And the stats say we're throwing more short passes than ever before.

 

As far as I can see,  we are literally throwing shorter to almost every single receiver on the team.    The stats say we are.....     I'm not sure how anyone is not understanding this.

 

I literally just showed you stats that say we aren't, but I know that trying to get you to change your mind is hard. Regarding TY, I actually think it is near worthless to compare this year's YPC to previous years. The reason being that TY is a target monster this year. He is on pace for 176 targets and 112 catches. The most he has had in a season is 139 and 82 (the year he averaged 13.2 YPC). I was comparing him to the league because his target numbers are comparable to the other high volume WRs for the first time in his career, and his YPC is higher than theirs. At any rate, if you do the math (subtract YAC from total yards and divide by catches), the average distance of pass in the air to catch (so depth of route) for TY is 11.5 yards. Dorsett's is 17.7. Rogers' is 12. Bray's is 11.6. I  don't think that any of those are short, perhaps you do. Perhaps we have a different definition of a short route--I want to see screens and less than 5 yard routes that are focused on YAC. 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Larry Horseman said:

I literally just showed you stats that say we aren't, but I know that trying to get you to change your mind is hard. Regarding TY, I actually think it is near worthless to compare this year's YPC to previous years. The reason being that TY is a target monster this year. He is on pace for 176 targets and 112 catches. The most he has had in a season is 139 and 82 (the year he averaged 13.2 YPC). I was comparing him to the league because his target numbers are comparable to the other high volume WRs for the first time in his career, and his YPC is higher than theirs. At any rate, if you do the math (subtract YAC from total yards and divide by catches), the average distance of pass in the air to catch (so depth of route) for TY is 11.5 yards. Dorsett's is 17.7. Rogers' is 12. Bray's is 11.6. I  don't think that any of those are short, perhaps you do. Perhaps we have a different definition of a short route--I want to see screens and less than 5 yard routes that are focused on YAC. 

 

Our receiving stats....   for the Colts receivers....   they completely dispute the stats you present.

 

Every receiver except Dorsett is averaging fewer yards per catch than they normally do.     All but Dorsett.

 

Receivers 2, 3, 4 and 5 are running backs and tight ends and they all are catching passes for fewer yards than ever before.     Hilton is at his 2nd lowest yards per catch in his career.     The rest of the receivers averaging fewer yards per catch.....      it goes on and on....

 

What most of your stats show is how Luck and the receivers compare to other QB's and other receivers in the NFL.

 

That doesn't prove anything about the COLTS offense.     It only compares the Colts to other teams.

 

It does not show how the Colts offense has changed from year to year.

 

Until you grasp that,  you're not going to get it.     I'm sorry.

 

[Gavin]

Luck has thrown 19 balls 20+ yards down field through 5 games. That's averages out to 3.8 a game or basically 4.

 

-136 of his 205 pass attempts have come while trailing in games

 

This is Lucks completion percentage by quarter according to ESPN splits on Luck:

 

1st Quarter: 22 of 45 48.9%

2nd Quarter: 35 of 48 72.9%

3rd Quarter: 23 of 36 63.9%

4th Quarter: 51 of 76 67.1%

 

17 of his 20 sacks come after the 1st Quarter

 

 

[coltsfanatic24]

He's been great this year but I would like to see him throw the ball quicker at times. Sometimes I think he's holding on to the ball too long looking for the big play.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Larry Horseman said:

I literally just showed you stats that say we aren't, but I know that trying to get you to change your mind is hard. Regarding TY, I actually think it is near worthless to compare this year's YPC to previous years. The reason being that TY is a target monster this year. He is on pace for 176 targets and 112 catches. The most he has had in a season is 139 and 82 (the year he averaged 13.2 YPC). I was comparing him to the league because his target numbers are comparable to the other high volume WRs for the first time in his career, and his YPC is higher than theirs. At any rate, if you do the math (subtract YAC from total yards and divide by catches), the average distance of pass in the air to catch (so depth of route) for TY is 11.5 yards. Dorsett's is 17.7. Rogers' is 12. Bray's is 11.6. I  don't think that any of those are short, perhaps you do. Perhaps we have a different definition of a short route--I want to see screens and less than 5 yard routes that are focused on YAC. 

 

 

Here's a one week example for Luck.....   from PFF:

 

Furthermore, he was extremely accurate on throws downfield, as he completed 10 of 14 attempts that traveled 10 or more yards from the line of scrimmage.

 

Luck attempted 39 passes and 25 of them traveled LESS THAN 10 YARDS.    14 traveled LONGER than 10 yards.       Isn't that good?      Isn't that what we want?      Isn't the short passing game part of what helps a poor pass blocking line?       Hasn't Chud talked about getting the ball out of Luck's hand to his receivers and letting them run?   

 

This is a completely different offense that we had under Pep or under Arians.    And I'm fine with it if the o-line can just learn how to protect Luck better.....

 

[Superman]

He's clearly ruined.

[Larry Horseman]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Our receiving stats....   for the Colts receivers....   they completely dispute the stats you present.

 

Every receiver except Dorsett is averaging fewer yards per catch than they normally do.     All but Dorsett.

 

Receivers 2, 3, 4 and 5 are running backs and tight ends and they all are catching passes for fewer yards than ever before.     Hilton is at his 2nd lowest yards per catch in his career.     The rest of the receivers averaging fewer yards per catch.....      it goes on and on....

 

What most of your stats show is how Luck and the receivers compare to other QB's and other receivers in the NFL.

 

That doesn't prove anything about the COLTS offense.     It only compares the Colts to other teams.

 

It does not show how the Colts offense has changed from year to year.

 

Until you grasp that,  you're not going to get it.     I'm sorry.

 

 

No, you don't get it. I'm saying we need our WRs to run shorter routes. The stats show their routes are all over 10 yards on average. I'm not talking about our RBs or TEs. Do you not understand that YPC has nothing to do with route depth?

[ColtsBlueFL]

Or, the Eveready Energizer Pinata...

 

QB        Hits     Sacks     career Andrew Luck

2012      116        41
2013      109        32
2014      107        29
2015       43        15
2016       40        20
________________________
Total     415        137

[Larry Horseman]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

Here's a one week example for Luck.....   from PFF:

 

Furthermore, he was extremely accurate on throws downfield, as he completed 10 of 14 attempts that traveled 10 or more yards from the line of scrimmage.

 

Luck attempted 39 passes and 25 of them traveled LESS THAN 10 YARDS.    14 traveled LONGER than 10 yards.       Isn't that good?      Isn't that what we want?      Isn't the short passing game part of what helps a poor pass blocking line?       Hasn't Chud talked about getting the ball out of Luck's hand to his receivers and letting them run?   

 

This is a completely different offense that we had under Pep or under Arians.    And I'm fine with it if the o-line can just learn how to protect Luck better.....

 

Actually you read the article incorrectly.  He attempted those 14 passes over 10 yards in a clean pocket. PFF said he had 32 attempts in a clean pocket. https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-chi-ind-grades/. That means 43% of clean pocket throws were over 10 yards. I don't know about the other 7 attempts. 

 

In week 1, 20 of his 47 attempts were over 10 yards. 42% https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-det-ind-grades-andrew-luck-earns-weeks-highest-qb-grade-in-colts-loss/

 

I don't have stats for the other games. 

 

I do think working in more WR screens and short routes would be helpful. Luck does and always has done business at 10+ yards, but with a young OL, it's going to result in hits and pressures. 

 

 

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Larry Horseman said:

 

No, you don't get it. I'm saying we need our WRs to run shorter routes. The stats show their routes are all over 10 yards on average. I'm not talking about our RBs or TEs. Do you not understand that YPC has nothing to do with route depth?

 

I just showed you that 25 of our pass attempts were UNDER 10 yards,  and it's gone no where with you....

 

So....

 

Maybe we have a different idea of what a short route is....   and we'll leave it right there...    We're missing each other....

 

[AZColt11]

He's fine.  Least of my worries right now.  His numbers do not surprise me at all.  The problem is every little mistake he makes is magnified and blown out of proportion in the media.  The simple fact is he has no margin for error with this team.  If he makes any big mistakes this team cannot win, while other QB's will do the same but their team still wins because of the team around them.  Some will say with his contract he shouldn't make any mistakes but that is preposterous.  EVERY QB is going to make one from time to time.  The difference is he can't get away with it like others can.

[JPFolks]

On 10/10/2016 at 0:07 PM, Valpo2004 said:

 

 

So despite what many people might think Luck is playing well.  

 

Ok but now for the bad news.  In 5 games he's already taken 20 sacks.  That is on pace for 64 sacks on the season which is TERRIBLE.  His rookie year which was his worst in terms of sacks he took 41 sacks.  

 

 

Only trolls think Luck is doing poorly this year. 

 

And this simply is another proof that Grigson can't pick talent and hasn't improved anything while he has been here.  His only impactful moves were the obvious Luck pick, the Hilton pick and the Davis deal.  The rest of his actions seem at best to be some random good or bad results that any random GM would have accomplished and any good GM would have surpassed.  

[Larry Horseman]

11 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I just showed you that 25 of our pass attempts were UNDER 10 yards,  and it's gone no where with you....

 

So....

 

Maybe we have a different idea of what a short route is....   and we'll leave it right there...    We're missing each other....

 

 

See my post above. It was actually 18, not 25. My point is that I want short WR routes worked into the offense on a regular basis and want Luck to make those throws. The facts show by and large WR are running 10+ routes. You can disagree and think it is fine for short routes to be ran the vast majority of the time by RBs an TEs. That's fine, but you don't have to be so demeaning and condescending to everyone. 

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

Most our of out short routes are just nonsense flat dumpoffs to Ferguson. The amount of catches he has, his yards, and his inability to stay up is just ridiculous.  Thats not shorter routes; it's just a check down.

 

I don't think I've seen one Slant or Curl route. 

[NewColtsFan]

8 minutes ago, Larry Horseman said:

 

See my post above. It was actually 18, not 25. My point is that I want short WR routes worked into the offense on a regular basis and want Luck to make those throws. The facts show by and large WR are running 10+ routes. You can disagree and think it is fine for short routes to be ran the vast majority of the time by RBs an TEs. That's fine, but you don't have to be so demeaning and condescending to everyone. 

 

Question:

 

Why are your facts right and my facts wrong?

 

I submit something from PFF that say 25 and you say it was 18.       How are we missing on that.

 

Here's another question:      Was the TD pass to Hilton a good play?      I mean, clearly it was, it was a TD.

 

But,   Luck didn't hold the ball long,  it was a timing play,  the ball got out quickly and it went over 10 yards.   A lot over 10 yards.       Is 10 yards going to be the line at which you're going to say good play or bad play?

 

I've preached the whole off-season about running an offense where Luck gets the ball out of his hands quickly and now we have it and you seem to be saying we don't have enough of it.     That we need even more of it.

 

Perhaps that's where we cross and disagree?

 

My apologies for being cross with you.    I don't want to be demeaning or condescending to anyone.   An internet fan message board can often be a contentious place and things can escalate quickly.     I'll try to do better.

 

[Larry Horseman]

54 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Question:

 

Why are your facts right and my facts wrong?

 

I submit something from PFF that say 25 and you say it was 18.       How are we missing on that.

 

Here's another question:      Was the TD pass to Hilton a good play?      I mean, clearly it was, it was a TD.

 

But,   Luck didn't hold the ball long,  it was a timing play,  the ball got out quickly and it went over 10 yards.   A lot over 10 yards.       Is 10 yards going to be the line at which you're going to say good play or bad play?

 

I've preached the whole off-season about running an offense where Luck gets the ball out of his hands quickly and now we have it and you seem to be saying we don't have enough of it.     That we need even more of it.

 

Perhaps that's where we cross and disagree?

 

My apologies for being cross with you.    I don't want to be demeaning or condescending to anyone.   An internet fan message board can often be a contentious place and things can escalate quickly.     I'll try to do better.

 

 

I read the stats in the PFF article as talking in the context of clean pocket throws, not all throws. All I'm saying is that the stats support that we are not running under routes or screens with the WRs. I'd like to see more of that while our young OL is maturing. Perhaps you don't and that's fine. We can move on. 

 

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Larry Horseman said:

 

I read the stats in the PFF article as talking in the context of clean pocket throws, not all throws. All I'm saying is that the stats support that we are not running under routes or screens with the WRs. I'd like to see more of that while our young OL is maturing. Perhaps you don't and that's fine. We can move on. 

 

 

 

 

I'm perfectly fine with that.     I'd like to see more screens to our WR's, especially Dorsett.

 

And I'd like to float this thought for consideration.....

 

This conversation has somehow been boiled down to throws over and under 10 yards.

 

What I'd like to see this evolve to is throws that are short,  intermediate and long.

 

I think we're throwing far fewer deep passes, which I'd peg as over 20 yards.      I'm in favor of that.

 

I think we're throwing a fair amount of intermediate passes,  which I'd characterize as between 10 and 20 yards.

I'm mostly in favor of that, but while the OL is maturing (as you noted)  I'd like to see more passes closer to 10 yards than to 20.      I'm guessing you'd like that too --- so we may agree there?

 

And, I'd like to see as many under 10 yard passes as possible that keep the chains moving and that lead to YAC for our WR's.      I'm guessing you'd this this too.

 

So,  with the smoke hopefully cleared,  perhaps we agree more than we disagree?      That's my hope.

 

Sorry this discussion went sideways.....

 

[dw49]

22 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Well....   he's completing a career high 64% of his passes....   and he's throwing 41 a game....   so he's got to be doing something right....

 

 

 

I don't feel like reading through the whole thread so if this has been mentioned , excuse me. But the 64% is good and maybe it also needs as asterisk as the 2016 Indy Colts lead the league in dropped passes with 12. 

 

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/team-receiver-drops-percentage/2016/

[BCoop]

12 minutes ago, dw49 said:

 

I don't feel like reading through the whole thread so if this has been mentioned , excuse me. But the 64% is good and maybe it also needs as asterisk as the 2016 Indy Colts lead the league in dropped passes with 12. 

 

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/team-receiver-drops-percentage/2016/

 

If we cut those drops in half, we end up middle of the road (15th) and Andrew has a 67% completion rate. If you match teams like Dallas, Atlanta, and Washington with only 1 drop, Andrew is completing 70% of his passes. He's been impressive this year regardless of the pressure.

[Gavin]

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/14874/andrew-luck

 

Here is Lucks splits. I don't think they have accounted for the Chicago game when you get down to By Pass Play. They only account for 166 passes which would leave out the Chicago game