Marvin Lewis gets another year

[oldunclemark]

The Bengals coach signs through 2017...

It answers something we've talked about here. The question goes something like......

 

 If you make the playoffs every year but lose consistently in the first round.

Should you 1.) Be retained and rewarded for making the playoffs every year...

...or 2.) Be fired for not advancing the playoffs with obviously good teams.

 

The answer seems to be '1'

 

 

[21isSuperman]

I may be in the minority here, but I like Marvin Lewis.  He's come quite a long way from taking the Bengals from the joke of the AFC to an annual contender with a solid defense.  They should have won last year were it not for some awful calls by the refs and his team having a complete brain fart, which I don't think was his fault.  I think he's a good coach

[ReMeDy]

There's a reason they're called the Bengals. They can't get over the hump.

 

I disagree with this resigning btw.

[jvan1973]

9 minutes ago, ReMeDy said:

There's a reason they're called the Bengals. They can't get over the hump.

 

I disagree with this resigning btw.

Most teams don't go into a season with a lame duck coach.   He can still be fired if they have a disappointing season

[oldunclemark]

7 hours ago, 21isSuperman said:

I may be in the minority here, but I like Marvin Lewis.  He's come quite a long way from taking the Bengals from the joke of the AFC to an annual contender with a solid defense.  They should have won last year were it not for some awful calls by the refs and his team having a complete brain fart, which I don't think was his fault.  I think he's a good coach

I like him, too

....and I would keep a coach who made the playoffs every year//even if he got bounced  in the first round

[Valpo2004]

On 4/9/2016 at 11:24 AM, oldunclemark said:

The Bengals coach signs through 2017...

It answers something we've talked about here. The question goes something like......

 

 If you make the playoffs every year but lose consistently in the first round.

Should you 1.) Be retained and rewarded for making the playoffs every year...

...or 2.) Be fired for not advancing the playoffs with obviously good teams.

 

The answer seems to be '1'

 

 

 

It seems like every time an already good team fires their head coach because he just can't seem to get over that hump then that team ends up imploding over the next few seasons.

 

And to be fair, the Bengals have had some rotten luck when it comes to the playoffs.  A couple years ago AJ Green was injured for their first playoff game.  Then last year they had Dalton injured.

 

Keeping Marvin Lewis is the right decision IMO.  

[oldunclemark]

The Bears are the latest example

[southwest1]

Unbelievable...12 years in Cincinnati & not 1 playoff win on Marvin Lewis's resume. 

 

How much time can the 2000 SB Champion DC from the Baltimore Ravens get to underperform in Ohio? 

 

This is such a joke now it's beyond funny & simply ridiculous....

[BigQandTheManiac]

Wow, talk about a cat with nine lives.

[southwest1]

On April 12, 2016 at 9:18 AM, Valpo2004 said:

 

It seems like every time an already good team fires their head coach because he just can't seem to get over that hump then that team ends up imploding over the next few seasons.

 

And to be fair, the Bengals have had some rotten luck when it comes to the playoffs.  A couple years ago AJ Green was injured for their first playoff game.  Then last year they had Dalton injured.

 

Keeping Marvin Lewis is the right decision IMO.  

So, it's perfectly fine to retain a HC that always crumbles in post season? Also, don't buy into this unfounded belief that only Marvin Lewis can make the Bengals a respectable contender in the AFC North either. 

 

You're entitled to your opinion of course V-2004, but why reward a head coach that is always a disappointment in the post season? You don't reward incompetence; You eliminate the dead weight & move forward. 

[crazycolt1]

If my memory is correct Bill Cower won one super bowl in 15 years. It also took him 14 years to do that. People in here talk about him like he is a legend. But because it's the Bengals I guess it makes a difference.

[Jules]

I hope this stupid team doesn't make the playoffs again but then again if they do I want to play them since they always find a way to choke it away in the first round.

 

Although playing the Steelers is a lot scarier then the other AFC North rival teams for us but at the same time I have some small amount of respect deep down for how the Steelers are in big games. I still think the Steelers (if healthy) were the best obstacle for Denver in the recent postseason. 

[Dustin]

Marvin Lewis is a top 10 coach in the NFL.  

[Jules]

28 minutes ago, Dustin said:

Marvin Lewis is a top 10 coach in the NFL.  

 

In terms of other coaches choices to coach up against. 

[Dustin]

Just now, Jules said:

 

In terms of other coaches choices to coach up against. 

 

ok

[southwest1]

28 minutes ago, Dustin said:

Marvin Lewis is a top 10 coach in the NFL.  

That may very well be Dustin, but in Cincinnati he should be given his pink slip. 

 

How long of a grace period does Lewis deserve in 1 city to win 1 playoff game? 12 years? 20 years? A half a century? 

[southwest1]

44 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

If my memory is correct Bill Cower won one super bowl in 15 years. It also took him 14 years to do that. People in here talk about him like he is a legend. But because it's the Bengals I guess it makes a difference.

Bill Cowher was close to winning a SB in 1995 vs Dallas & his team always came prepared to play respectable ball in the playoffs under his tenure in Pittsburgh. 

 

I'm so sick & tired of so many people blaming a lack of player production on the Bengals squad for over 10 years.  Come on. At some point, the coach has to take the heat for under achieving. 

[Dustin]

9 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

That may very well be Dustin, but in Cincinnati he should be given his pink slip. 

 

How long of a grace period does Lewis deserve in 1 city to win 1 playoff game? 12 years? 20 years? A half a century? 

 

Until he decides to retire. His coaching tree is amazing, spawning 4 head coaches, including 3 current ones. He'll probably have a 5th if his DC gets a job next season, which he probably will. He also plays a big role in the roster management of the team. He's brought a bunch of low-character guy to the teams and turned them into productive players. 

 

The team went 12-4 without their starting QB for a good chunk of the season and was 30 seconds away from winning a playoff game with a backup QB. Yeah, it sucks he hasn't had that much success in the playoffs, but it's not as if he's ever had multiple years of high-level QBs playing for him. There's nobody out there who's better than him and firing a coach just to fire him is how teams go from 12-4 to 6-10. 

 

[southwest1]

24 minutes ago, Dustin said:

 

Until he decides to retire. His coaching tree is amazing, spawning 4 head coaches, including 3 current ones. He'll probably have a 5th if his DC gets a job next season, which he probably will. He also plays a big role in the roster management of the team. He's brought a bunch of low-character guy to the teams and turned them into productive players. 

 

The team went 12-4 without their starting QB for a good chunk of the season and was 30 seconds away from winning a playoff game with a backup QB. Yeah, it sucks he hasn't had that much success in the playoffs, but it's not as if he's ever had multiple years of high-level QBs playing for him. There's nobody out there who's better than him and firing a coach just to fire him is how teams go from 12-4 to 6-10. 

 

Who cares about coaching trees? The last time I checked coaches are paid to make deep playoff runs & compete for SBs, Season records don't mean a darn thing if you can't even play in December or early January. 

 

Marvin Lewis is paid to get to SBs & win them not be given a lifetime achievement award for how far he has improved a dismal team that he inherited in 2003. 

 

No playoff wins in 12 years is beyond pathetic & you know it Dustin. Please...

[Jules]

2 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

 

No playoff wins in 12 years is beyond pathetic & you know it Dustin. Please...

 

Exactly. And as much as this forum sometimes goes off on our own coaching and Pagano we have won a few playoff games. Chiefs, Bengals (cough) and a huge upset in Denver in 2014. 

 

Our brick wall is the Patriots in the playoffs........

[chad72]

Marvin Lewis sticking around is good news, gives hope to every other AFC team that makes the playoffs to get their own monkey off their backs IF the Bengals make it too and they get to face them.

 

This is worse than Marty ball. 

[Dustin]

59 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

Who cares about coaching trees? The last time I checked coaches are paid to make deep playoff runs & compete for SBs, Season records don't mean a darn thing if you can't even play in December or early January. 

 

Marvin Lewis is paid to get to SBs & win them not be given a lifetime achievement award for how far he has improved a dismal team that he inherited in 2003. 

 

No playoff wins in 12 years is beyond pathetic & you know it Dustin. Please...

 

Sure, but who is better that is out there at the moment? Unless you have a legitimate alternative you're firing him just to fire him and not doing it to improve your team. 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, southwest1 said:

Who cares about coaching trees? The last time I checked coaches are paid to make deep playoff runs & compete for SBs, Season records don't mean a darn thing if you can't even play in December or early January. 

 

Marvin Lewis is paid to get to SBs & win them not be given a lifetime achievement award for how far he has improved a dismal team that he inherited in 2003. 

 

No playoff wins in 12 years is beyond pathetic & you know it Dustin. Please...

 

Not sure if you noticed,  but Lewis only got a 1-year extension.     That's one.     Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

 

Which basically means he now has a two-year contract which means if the team under-performs in 2016,  then the Bengals will likely fire him and pay him his remaining year and that will be that.     The owners didn't want Lewis to be a lame duck this year.    So they gave him one additional year.     That's it.

 

Oh,  and you sentence about December and early January makes ZERO sense.    The NFL's regular season runs into early January so everyone plays to early January.       Perhaps you mean January and February?    You know,  the playoffs?

 

 

[southwest1]

21 minutes ago, Dustin said:

 

Sure, but who is better that is out there at the moment? Unless you have a legitimate alternative you're firing him just to fire him and not doing it to improve your team. 

Hue Jackson before he took the Browns job would have been an acceptable replacement in my view. 

 

I respect you Dustin & I know what you meant that Marvin is a smart coach worthy of holding a top position for a football franchise. I agree 100% & I'm also a firm believer in hiring more black coordinators for HC vacancies as they open up. 

 

Mr. Lewis deserves to be a head coach just no longer in Ohio that's all. If your team can't win a playoff game in over a decade, 1 more year won't change that drought in all likelihood. 

[southwest1]

17 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Not sure if you noticed,  but Lewis only got a 1-year extension.     That's one.     Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

 

Which basically means he now has a two-year contract which means if the team under-performs in 2016,  then the Bengals will likely fire him and pay him his remaining year and that will be that.     The owners didn't want Lewis to be a lame duck this year.    So they gave him one additional year.     That's it.

 

Oh,  and you sentence about December and early January makes ZERO sense.    The NFL's regular season runs into early January so everyone plays to early January.       Perhaps you mean January and February?    You know,  the playoffs?

 

 

Name another coach that received a 12 year window of NFL employment with no playoff appearances? From my perspective, Marvin Lewis should have been given no extension. Lame duck status means absolutely nothing. How bout not getting bounced out with an early playoff exit? What a novel idea. 

 

So, you never made a typo eh? Come on NCF. You knew exactly what I meant. No need to be cute. 

 

I don't reward coaches who consistently get eliminated when games really matter. 

 

I like you NCF, but I find this defense of Marvin Lewis record just astonishing. Not just you, but the people who act like his playoff shortcomings don't matter; they actually do. This is a results oriented business not he's a swell guy business. 

[NewColtsFan]

19 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

Name another coach that received a 12 year window of NFL employment with no playoff appearances? From my perspective, Marvin Lewis should have been given no extension. Lame duck status means absolutely nothing. How bout not getting bounced out with an early playoff exit? What a novel idea. 

 

So, you never made a typo eh? Come on NCF. You knew exactly what I meant. No need to be cute. 

 

I don't reward coaches who consistently get eliminated when games really matter. 

 

I like you NCF, but I find this defense of Marvin Lewis record just astonishing. Not just you, but the people who act like his playoff shortcomings don't matter; they actually do. This is a results oriented business not he's a swell guy business. 

 

It's my understanding that the Bengals have kept Lewis around all these years because the younger Brown,  not his father,  recognizes that Lewis works very well within a very dysfunctional organization.     That Lewis and his staff have worked well within the structure and have actually helped the Bengals not become the Cleveland Browns.      In other words,  without Lewis,  Cincy might actually be much, much worse.

 

Cincinnati is basically giving Lewis one more year.    Good for Lewis.    I'm not in favor of a lifetime contract,  but he's got some unique circumstances there that the owner recognizes and so he's been loyal to Lewis.

 

That's what I've read and heard over the years.....      I've got no problem with it....

 

[southwest1]

19 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

It's my understanding that the Bengals have kept Lewis around all these years because the younger Brown,  not his father,  recognizes that Lewis works very well within a very dysfunctional organization.     That Lewis and his staff have worked well within the structure and have actually helped the Bengals not become the Cleveland Browns.      In other words,  without Lewis,  Cincy might actually be much, much worse.

 

Cincinnati is basically giving Lewis one more year.    Good for Lewis.    I'm not in favor of a lifetime contract,  but he's got some unique circumstances there that the owner recognizes and so he's been loyal to Lewis.

 

That's what I've read and heard over the years.....      I've got no problem with it....

 

I will acknowledge that prior to Marvin's arrival, the Bengals were a put a paper bag over your head fan base as a franchise. Certainly, I'm not cutting Lewis's check so the owner Mike Brown can do whatever he wants of course. 

 

Like Dustin said earlier, Lewis has a knack for getting the most out of troubled players with a checkered past. Even I can't dismiss that fact. I guess if I owned the Bengals I'd make a coaching change & some front office changes in order to build a sound organization. Maybe the owner is simply a cheap skate I don't know. But why have a team at all if you're not willing to change the culture of losing or accept losing as commonplace or the normal way of conducting business? 

 

I just think it's so disrespectful to season ticket holders to put a product on the field that always comes up short. If an owner accepts failure, then that's all he or she will achieve year in; year out. 

 

I'm not blaming you personally NCF. I just want a quality squad that crosses the darn finish line. 1 playoff victory in 12 years is not asking a lot. Seems perfectly reasonable to me. 

[Defjamz26]

22 hours ago, southwest1 said:

Bill Cowher was close to winning a SB in 1995 vs Dallas & his team always came prepared to play respectable ball in the playoffs under his tenure in Pittsburgh. 

 

I'm so sick & tired of so many people blaming a lack of player production on the Bengals squad for over 10 years.  Come on. At some point, the coach has to take the heat for under achieving. 

 

Especially when you have as many high round draft picks as the Bengals. Their roster is stacked from going BPA every year. Sure you have some lame ducks like Margus Hunt, but their roster is deep. Too deep for them to have lost 5 straight times in the first round of the playoffs. That's awful.

 

Its gotta be coaching however you look at it? Player development falls under coaching anyways. We've seen coaches just as good and better than Lewis fired for less. Fox got fired from 2 teams he took to the Super Bowl. Johnson won 2 SB's with Dallas and got fired. Lovie Smith took a terrible Rex Grossman lead Bears to a Super Bowl and got fired on a 10-6 season. How Lewis is still employed is beyond me.

[krunk]

21 hours ago, southwest1 said:

Name another coach that received a 12 year window of NFL employment with no playoff appearances? From my perspective, Marvin Lewis should have been given no extension. Lame duck status means absolutely nothing. How bout not getting bounced out with an early playoff exit? What a novel idea. 

 

So, you never made a typo eh? Come on NCF. You knew exactly what I meant. No need to be cute. 

 

I don't reward coaches who consistently get eliminated when games really matter. 

 

I like you NCF, but I find this defense of Marvin Lewis record just astonishing. Not just you, but the people who act like his playoff shortcomings don't matter; they actually do. This is a results oriented business not he's a swell guy business. 

So what if he gets past the 1st round on his lame duck contract and they lose in the 2nd round or AFC Championship. Does he still need to be fired? I see where you are coming from SW1 and I felt like that at one point. However I will say this, name me one African American head coach that has been allowed a very long tenure over a team and I bet you can't give me a real solid answer. And this guy wins just about every year. Its not like hes a loser. You have white counterparts like Marty Schottenheimer and Jim Mora who were given 10 year plus terms, and they didn't always end up with winning records. And as CrazyColt mentioned how the Steelers stuck it out with Bill Cowher through good and the bad. I'm sure there are other examples as well we can pull from history. The league has a long history of discriminatory hiring and practices against African Americans and colored people in general so I'm glad to see the owner stick it out with the guy and do something different. Yes its a results oriented business and I think the Bengals have done everything they could to get Marvin over the hump. The one year contract signals time is running out and I'm okay with that. The Ultimate goal is advancing in the playoffs and the Super Bowl and Lewis should be accountable. However somewhere in the Bengals minds I believe they want to be part of the history that shows Black coaches who win should be stood behind just as much as anybody else. I can't fault the for giving full support to their guy. A lot of owners would not.

[Superman]

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

Especially when you have as many high round draft picks as the Bengals

 

They've actually had pretty average draft position lately. 21, 24, 21, 17, 4, 21, 6.

 

Before 2009, they don't have anyone remaining, I don't think. Their best defensive player was a 4th rounder. Their QB was a 2nd rounder.

 

But you're right, their drafting has paid off.

[Superman]

On 4/14/2016 at 5:04 PM, Dustin said:

Marvin Lewis is a top 10 coach in the NFL.  

 

Not in order, just running through some names: Belichick, Carroll, Tomlin, Harbaugh, Arians, McCarthy, Payton... arguably, Kelly, Reid and Garrett. No love for newbies.

 

I guess you're right.

[NewColtsFan]

21 hours ago, southwest1 said:

I will acknowledge that prior to Marvin's arrival, the Bengals were a put a paper bag over your head fan base as a franchise. Certainly, I'm not cutting Lewis's check so the owner Mike Brown can do whatever he wants of course. 

 

Like Dustin said earlier, Lewis has a knack for getting the most out of troubled players with a checkered past. Even I can't dismiss that fact. I guess if I owned the Bengals I'd make a coaching change & some front office changes in order to build a sound organization. Maybe the owner is simply a cheap skate I don't know. But why have a team at all if you're not willing to change the culture of losing or accept losing as commonplace or the normal way of conducting business? 

 

I just think it's so disrespectful to season ticket holders to put a product on the field that always comes up short. If an owner accepts failure, then that's all he or she will achieve year in; year out. 

 

I'm not blaming you personally NCF. I just want a quality squad that crosses the darn finish line. 1 playoff victory in 12 years is not asking a lot. Seems perfectly reasonable to me. 

 

The Brown's are notorious for being among the cheapest owners in football.    Until recently they had among the worst facilities in all of the NFL.     They don't pay well to anyone....   coaches, staff,  and until recently,  players as well.       So, they certainly don't like paying anyone who isn't working for them.

 

Normally, this is not a well run franchise and it's my understanding that the Brown's give Lewis a lot of credit for the modest success they've had there the last 4-5 years.      They may not be winning in the playoffs,  but they're reaching the playoffs.     So, slowly but surely.     And if they don't improve on that,  Lewis will be easy to let go....

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Hopefully we play them in Round 1 so I can chalk a win up  

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

On April 14, 2016 at 9:24 PM, Jules said:

 

Exactly. And as much as this forum sometimes goes off on our own coaching and Pagano we have won a few playoff games. Chiefs, Bengals (cough) and a huge upset in Denver in 2014. 

 

Our brick wall is the Patriots in the playoffs........

 

Shut up Jules! Always have to remind me of the Patriots. 

[southwest1]

On April 15, 2016 at 8:09 PM, krunk said:

So what if he gets past the 1st round on his lame duck contract and they lose in the 2nd round or AFC Championship. Does he still need to be fired? I see where you are coming from SW1 and I felt like that at one point. However I will say this, name me one African American head coach that has been allowed a very long tenure over a team and I bet you can't give me a real solid answer. And this guy wins just about every year. Its not like hes a loser. You have white counterparts like Marty Schottenheimer and Jim Mora who were given 10 year plus terms, and they didn't always end up with winning records. And as CrazyColt mentioned how the Steelers stuck it out with Bill Cowher through good and the bad. I'm sure there are other examples as well we can pull from history. The league has a long history of discriminatory hiring and practices against African Americans and colored people in general so I'm glad to see the owner stick it out with the guy and do something different. Yes its a results oriented business and I think the Bengals have done everything they could to get Marvin over the hump. The one year contract signals time is running out and I'm okay with that. The Ultimate goal is advancing in the playoffs and the Super Bowl and Lewis should be accountable. However somewhere in the Bengals minds I believe they want to be part of the history that shows Black coaches who win should be stood behind just as much as anybody else. I can't fault the for giving full support to their guy. A lot of owners would not.

Dennis Green was head coach of the Minnesota Vikings from 1992-2001, that's almost a decade. 

 

I don't doubt that African American coordinators have a difficult time being considered for head coaching vancanies & being given ample time to succeed under their football program. Let me ask you question krunk? How many American Indian head coaches do you see in the league right now? How about Asian American head coaches for that matter. African Americans aren't the only race or nationality to experience discrimination in NFL circles or life in general for that matter. 

 

Now, perhaps their isn't a surplus of Native American or Asian  American coaching candidates in the league at the moment. However, let's not try & create the misguided impression that African American coaching candidates exclusively experience the most intense employment hurdles in the league alone as a segment of society alone either. 

 

All I'm saying is this: Win 1 playoff game & Marvin Lewis deserves an extended time frame in which to stay in Cincinnati & if he can't do this after 12 seasons when the hades, if ever, will he prove that he's capable of winning games late in the year? How much of a grace period does 1 HC in 1 city get? I'd say this regardless of a person's race too BTW. 

 

I do agree with you krunk that the shortness of this extension tells Lewis that the handwriting is on the wall & that whatever cushion Marvin had to win a playoff game is evaporating quickly. A head coaching position on any football team in NFL is not a lifetime appointment without minimal expectations being met from both a fan's & owner's perspective. Plain & simple. 

[BloodyChamp]

I came here to stick up for Marvin but since the race card is out I won't bother. Jim Mora's team was an expansion team for heck's sake. NU UH HE WAS NOT IS DUH FIRST COACH!!!!!! OK just the first coach to like...win...in New Orleans. And Indy wasn't in the best shape when he got there either. Marty S. won in Cleveland. The only guy there who has done 1/10 of what he did in Cleveland since, and it was a pretty long time ago, was some guy named Bill. Meanwhile he got fired after going 8-8 in season 1 from a later gig in a town that isn't known much for winning since some guy named Joe. I like Marvin but to use the race card as an example through Jim Mora and Marty S. is a joke. 

[jvan1973]

56 minutes ago, BloodyChamp said:

I came here to stick up for Marvin but since the race card is out I won't bother. Jim Mora's team was an expansion team for heck's sake. NU UH HE WAS NOT IS DUH FIRST COACH!!!!!! OK just the first coach to like...win...in New Orleans. And Indy wasn't in the best shape when he got there either. Marty S. won in Cleveland. The only guy there who has done 1/10 of what he did in Cleveland since, and it was a pretty long time ago, was some guy named Bill. Meanwhile he got fired after going 8-8 in season 1 from a later gig in a town that isn't known much for winning since some guy named Joe. I like Marvin but to use the race card as an example through Jim Mora and Marty S. is a joke. 

Neither went 12 years for one team without a playoff win.    The race thing is ridiculous.    Lewis is a good coach,   but those comparisons are not good.   No coach has ever been winless in one place for 12 straight years

[BloodyChamp]

No coach has the exact same stat sheet as another coach.  All 3 have the same stigma whether it's 12 years or 10 years or whatever. They also have the same qualities though, and race isn't a quality or a stigma or reason for anything between those 3.