Deflategate merge -- pending appeal results

[crazycolt1]

In matters of integrity of the game the CBA specifically states that the commish had to hand out the punishment. The PA cited the specific article in its letter to the league before the appeal. What is interesting here is Roger said he gave authority to Vincent to hand out the punishment so that way he could hear the appeal. The letter sent to Brady came from Vincent. But when pressed on this issue Roger said he gave his approval for the punishment so it seems he wants to have this both ways. I do think per your previous post that if this does end up in federal court the league yet again will have failed to follow the CBA and the suspension will be revoked. There is also the issue of fair and consistent punishment as well that they have also violated with its unprecedented punishment for ball tampering.

What difference does it make who signed the letter? Goodell and Vincent are part of the NFL committee that oversees infractions. It is not done by one person.

[OffensivelyPC]

I could easily see the courts siding with the NFLPA on that issue. It's stupid, but sometimes legal proceedings and courts are stupid. You know that better than I do.

Oh I don't disagree.  It very well could get turned over on that.  In reality though, it's just an excercise in form rather than substance.  Some Pats fans seem to think that's a homerun or something.  If it gets turned over on those grounds alone, the effect is simply to hit the reset button..  It's like when a complaint gets dismissed for not stating the correct requirements and permits the plaintiff to re-file the complaint.  In otherwords, it's dismissed "without prejudice." 

[Cynjin]

yeah...knocking out the opponent's star players doesn't benefit anyone...lol

 

Tell you what - you set the football to whatever PSI you like and we'll deliberately injure Luck. Who gets the advantage there?

 

But according to AEI the Saints did not injure opposing players at a higher rate than other teams.  Are you questioning the quality of the report that AEI released regarding Bountygate?

[amfootball]

Oh I don't disagree.  It very well could get turned over on that.  In reality though, it's just an excercise in form rather than substance.  Some Pats fans seem to think that's a homerun or something.  If it gets turned over on those grounds alone, the effect is simply to hit the reset button..  It's like when a complaint gets dismissed for not stating the correct requirements and permits the plaintiff to re-file the complaint.  In otherwords, it's dismissed "without prejudice." 

If it does get over turned on that it is just further evidence that this league and commish have no idea what they are doing in matters of discipline and only underscores the incompetence that has been front and center this past year in every case that this administration has handled or should I say mishandled. And again anyone with half a brain understands that this attempt at an "investigation" was a total sham which pretty much goes right in concert with what this commish has done since he took office.

[dw49]

Jason Cole is apparently reporting that the NFL is now acknowledging that the science doesn't hold up and would be willing to cut a deal with Brady if he agrees to not take them to court that would essentially exonerate him but leave in place a smaller penalty for not cooperating with the investigation.

What does "apparently reporting " mean. I looked at his twitter page and nothing was there as of a while ago. Do you have a link ?

[amfootball]

Jason Cole is apparently reporting that the NFL is now acknowledging that the science doesn't hold up and would be willing to cut a deal with Brady if he agrees to not take them to court that would essentially exonerate him but leave in place a smaller penalty for not cooperating with the investigation.

You got a link to that?

[Gramz]

Jason Cole is apparently reporting that the NFL is now acknowledging that the science doesn't hold up and would be willing to cut a deal with Brady if he agrees to not take them to court that would essentially exonerate him but leave in place a smaller penalty for not cooperating with the investigation.

Not seeing this anywhere other than your post.

[Superman]

 a total sham which pretty much goes right in concert with what this commish has done since he took office.

 

^^^ Pure applesauce.

[Bad Morty]

But according to AEI the Saints did not injure opposing players at a higher rate than other teams.  Are you questioning the quality of the report that AEI released regarding Bountygate?

no...I'm questioning the comment that plotting to injure players doesn't impact the outcome of games.

[Bad Morty]

You got a link to that?

They were talking about it on Sports Radio...it's a podcast I think.

[Cynjin]

no...I'm questioning the comment that plotting to injure players doesn't impact the outcome of games.

 

 

But according to the AEI report the Saints did not injure opposing players at any higher rate than other teams.  If they were actually carrying out this plot to injure players, then they would have a higher rate of injuring opposing players, yet somehow that did not occur according to AEI.

[Bad Morty]

But according to the AEI report the Saints did not injure opposing players at any higher rate than other teams.  If they were actually carrying out this plot to injure players, then they would have a higher rate of injuring opposing players, yet somehow that did not occur according to AEI.

I'll try this again...I'm questioning the comment that plotting to injure opposing players (whether carried out successfully or not) wasn't done for the goal of gaining an advantage in a game.

[Cynjin]

I'll try this again...I'm questioning the comment that plotting to injure opposing players (whether carried out successfully or not) wasn't done for the goal of gaining an advantage in a game.

 

Okay, well if the plot was not carried out, which according to AEI it was not, then there was no advantage gained.  Also, the plotting could have been done for purely monetary reasons according to multiple former players that commented on Bountygate.

[Bad Morty]

Okay, well if the plot was not carried out, which according to AEI it was not, then there was no advantage gained.  Also, the plotting could have been done for purely monetary reasons according to multiple former players that commented on Bountygate.

Yes. I agree. If no opposing players were actually injured, then there was no advantage gained. Similarly, if footballs weren't deflated below where you'd expect them to be deflated based on the outside conditions, then no advantage was gained.

 

We're talking about motivation here in both cases. So then I will ask you...why would a team offer a monetary reward to players if they took opposing players out of the game? I mean you aren't going to tell me with a straight face that the ultimate motivation behind a scheme to reward players for injuring other players had nothing to do with improving the Saints odds of winning, are you? Can we just agree on this one, very obvious thing?

[ColtRider]

That's sensible, wouldn't you think? This authority conferred upon Goodell is actually collectively bargained, so it would stand to reason that it would be largely untouchable. 

 

Yet, courts have undermined the authority of the commissioner several times in issues of player discipline. It makes no sense to me. And what Tagliabue did with the Bountygate case was even worse.

 

All that said, you're right, this isn't like other cases. People who are arguing against the league's authority to hand down this punishment on Brady are largely being unreasonable, and that's just the nice way of saying what I really think...

Exactly, Man of Steel! Try to picture this down the road ...

1. Zebra uniform and whistles replaced by robes and micro phonic gavels

2. Head Coaches replaced by attorneys

3. 12 hour football games entangled with play by play litigation

4. Side Bars with a conference bench along each end zone

5. Jury Box seated at the 50 yard line

6. Players in flexible suit and ties over equipment (also their legal eagles)

7. Judges in luxury suites tied into 25 camera replay booths

... and so on ... and so on ...

[Swan Ronson]

Nice little piece of sophistry re what Jason Cole said. What he actually said was that the NFL have doubts about the science, but they believe from a common sense standpoint, if you look at the text messages, they believe that Brady was still involved in the deflation of the footballs. He also said that they want to make sure that some suspension sticks , but they will only think about reducing the suspension if Brady agrees not to take any further legal action. If he does not agree to that then the NFL will uphold the four games.

 

That could all be nonsense still. but what he said was not exactly what it has been portrayed as here.

[SteelCityColt]

Cool story...

 

Needs more dragons...

[SteelCityColt]

^^^ Pure applesauce.

 

Indeed... 

 

Some of the bones people have picked with the league about this whole mess are just plain ridiculous...

 

"Wasted money on an investigation" - So wait, they shouldn't have bothered bringing in an independent investigator, maybe one who's had experience of NFL investigations? What they should have done it in house, because I can hear the cries of league bias all the way from New England here in the green and verdant land of England (original and best ). As for the money... is it tax payers money?! No it's league funded so what do you care about how much it cost. 

 

"Should have spoken to the Pats prior to the AFC Championship game"/"It was entrapment I tells ya!" - So let's pick a horrible metaphor... you have information that someone has been I dunno stealing previously but never been caught and there's no easily available historical evidence. Do you really think the right way is to have a quiet word in their ear? You'd pretty much have to accuse them of being a thief knowing you have no proof which can open you up to all sorts or things. Or you can be aware, keep an eye out, and you know what if they do ahead and steal again on your watch it's their own darn fault. For all this arguing about science etc etc. the undeniable fact is a Patriots employee acted improperly in removing those balls. The argument is about what exactly he did with them and on who's instruction. Arguments that their is total innocence and nothing wrong happened at all are just blind homeristic fandom. 

 

You know what, this isn't about what happened any more. I'd imagine for the average fan they're just tired about this being news and how it's dragging on for so long. But again.. who's to fault for that? There have been cries of the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Let's just for argument sake say Brady knew, he told his guys to prep the balls in a certain way but within the legal standard and one guy went too far. IF he'd just held his hands up saying hey I like them prepared in a certain way, I asked my guys to do this, they way to far then he'd probably have got away with zilch or at worse a slap on the wrists. But no, the whole Pats organisation circled wagons and started demanding apologies while making really badly though comparisons to extremist organisations. For me that's the bug bear for people... the sheer arrogance shown by members of the organisation, by Brady, and by a large proportion of the fan base. Take this topic for example, there is some decent conversation between fans on both sides about the technical aspects and the science... but it's ruined by jingoistic ra ra. 

 

Meh I say, Meh!

 

/Rant

[amfootball]

Nice little piece of sophistry re what Jason Cole said. What he actually said was that the NFL have doubts about the science, but they believe from a common sense standpoint, if you look at the text messages, they believe that Brady was still involved in the deflation of the footballs. He also said that they want to make sure that some suspension sticks , but they will only think about reducing the suspension if Brady agrees not to take any further legal action. If he does not agree to that then the NFL will uphold the four games.

 

That could all be nonsense still. but what he said was not exactly what it has been portrayed as here.

All that seems unlikely IMO. Brady was seeking full exoneration. If the NFL wants to go into court believing text messages that can have different inferences will outweigh the actual science than good luck to them. That being said, if they do knock it down to a game or two and say it is for non-coop that is different but sounds like from Cole they want to still pin the deflation on him somehow so I don't see anything changing really.

[Swan Ronson]

All that seems unlikely IMO. Brady was seeking full exoneration. If the NFL wants to go into court believing text messages that can have different inferences will outweigh the actual science than good luck to them. That being said, if they do knock it down to a game or two and say it is for non-coop that is different but sounds like from Cole they want to still pin the deflation on him somehow so I don't see anything changing really.

I have no opinion on the veracity of what Cole said, was just pointing out that he was being misrepresented.

[amfootball]

I have no opinion on the veracity of what Cole said, was just pointing out that he was being misrepresented.

Do you have a link? I went up to BR but the story did not have the video. It was weird. Thanks in advance if you do have it.

[Bad Morty]

Indeed... 

 

Some of the bones people have picked with the league about this whole mess are just plain ridiculous...

 

"Wasted money on an investigation" - So wait, they shouldn't have bothered bringing in an independent investigator, maybe one who's had experience of NFL investigations? What they should have done it in house, because I can hear the cries of league bias all the way from New England here in the green and verdant land of England (original and best ). As for the money... is it tax payers money?! No it's league funded so what do you care about how much it cost. 

 

"Should have spoken to the Pats prior to the AFC Championship game"/"It was entrapment I tells ya!" - So let's pick a horrible metaphor... you have information that someone has been I dunno stealing previously but never been caught and there's no easily available historical evidence. Do you really think the right way is to have a quiet word in their ear? You'd pretty much have to accuse them of being a thief knowing you have no proof which can open you up to all sorts or things. Or you can be aware, keep an eye out, and you know what if they do ahead and steal again on your watch it's their own darn fault. For all this arguing about science etc etc. the undeniable fact is a Patriots employee acted improperly in removing those balls. The argument is about what exactly he did with them and on who's instruction. Arguments that their is total innocence and nothing wrong happened at all are just blind homeristic fandom. 

 

You know what, this isn't about what happened any more. I'd imagine for the average fan they're just tired about this being news and how it's dragging on for so long. But again.. who's to fault for that? There have been cries of the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Let's just for argument sake say Brady knew, he told his guys to prep the balls in a certain way but within the legal standard and one guy went too far. IF he'd just held his hands up saying hey I like them prepared in a certain way, I asked my guys to do this, they way to far then he'd probably have got away with zilch or at worse a slap on the wrists. But no, the whole Pats organisation circled wagons and started demanding apologies while making really badly though comparisons to extremist organisations. For me that's the bug bear for people... the sheer arrogance shown by members of the organisation, by Brady, and by a large proportion of the fan base. Take this topic for example, there is some decent conversation between fans on both sides about the technical aspects and the science... but it's ruined by jingoistic ra ra. 

 

Meh I say, Meh!

 

/Rant

What they should have done was handed out a $50K fine to the team just for the suspicion that ball tampering occurred and moved on. What they've don is created a major issue out of what should have been a minor issue. Whatever happened had zero bearing on the outcome of the game. That should be the standard when launching major investigations.

[Swan Ronson]

Do you have a link? I went up to BR but the story did not have the video. It was weird. Thanks in advance if you do have it.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2506352-insider-buzz-deflategate-text-messages-critical-to-upholding-brady-suspension?search_query=jason%20cole

[amfootball]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2506352-insider-buzz-deflategate-text-messages-critical-to-upholding-brady-suspension?search_query=jason%20cole

Thank you. I opened in another browser and the video came up.

[SteelCityColt]

What they should have done was handed out a $50K fine to the team just for the suspicion that ball tampering occurred and moved on. What they've don is created a major issue out of what should have been a minor issue. Whatever happened had zero bearing on the outcome of the game. That should be the standard when launching major investigations.

 

While the end result might have been more palatable than this, do you think that any organisation or individual is going to accept punishment for the "suspicion" of something. Especially if was dropped just before the the Superbowl. 

 

Ok I retract the previous statement about it being more palatable. There would have been a massive outcry, the league would be screamed at to "prove it" and we again end up with the Wells report but even more bad blood for the fine being levied without proof. 

[Bad Morty]

I have no opinion on the veracity of what Cole said, was just pointing out that he was being misrepresented.

The NFL acknowledging doubts about the science is a pretty significant concession. It has been the speculation of one of our local sports radio guys here (who is not a Pats supporter...just the opposite) that the "out" here to avoid court is that the league will eventually exonerate Brady based on the weak science but that he will serve a smaller suspension for not cooperating with the investigation.

[amfootball]

The NFL acknowledging doubts about the science is a pretty significant concession. It has been the speculation of one of our local sports radio guys here (who is not a Pats supporter...just the opposite) that the "out" here to avoid court is that the league will eventually exonerate Brady based on the weak science but that he will serve a smaller suspension for not cooperating with the investigation.

Yeah, that part is huge IF true. I have to believe the NFL lawyers are giving Roger a lot of counsel on this. The science makes up 50-60 percent of the report so the rest loses its luster if you don't have the actual violation. Not to mention the shotty job of the way the NFL tried to handle the science to prove it. Then you also have the CBA violation of Vincent handing out the punishment which could get this thing tossed just on that point alone. I don't see Brady making any deals to avoid court if they want to suspend him.

[PonyUp]

How does Deflategate fit into there mission?  Also, there seems to be a statement missing how their economics professors are qualified as experts in the Ideal Gas Law.  If the AEI considers Deflategate to be a "most important issues of the day", then they really need to re-read their mission statement.

 

They took a break from denying global warming and selling out to their right-wing investors to take an interest in the NFL.

[Bad Morty]

Yeah, that part is huge IF true. I have to believe the NFL lawyers are giving Roger a lot of counsel on this. The science makes up 50-60 percent of the report so the rest loses its luster if you don't have the actual violation. Not to mention the shotty job of the way the NFL tried to handle the science to prove it. Then you also have the CBA violation of Vincent handing out the punishment which could get this thing tossed just on that point alone. I don't see Brady making any deals to avoid court if they want to suspend him.

So basically, everyone who dismissed AEI and all the other criticisms of the Wells science was wrong if the league itself is now acknowledging the flaws.

 

I tend to agree with you - if I'm Brady, and I know that the league thinks it's on shaky ground with the science, I go all the way with it. Seriously - they can't prove the balls were deflated. Nothing else matters!

[bababooey]

yeah...knocking out the opponent's star players doesn't benefit anyone...lol

 

Tell you what - you set the football to whatever PSI you like and we'll deliberately injure Luck. Who gets the advantage there?

So you're saying some players don't try to tackle as hard as others? Unless you are going to try to twist ankles like Burfict or stomp on people like Haynesworth or Suh I don't see how it's possible to try to injure someone on purpose in a quick play. 

 

But that's not the case which brings us back to....

 

Tom Brady attempted to rig the game to his benefit.

[OffensivelyPC]

If it does get over turned on that it is just further evidence that this league and commish have no idea what they are doing in matters of discipline and only underscores the incompetence that has been front and center this past year in every case that this administration has handled or should I say mishandled. And again anyone with half a brain understands that this attempt at an "investigation" was a total sham which pretty much goes right in concert with what this commish has done since he took office.

lol okay.  If who signs the letter is a sign of incompetence, then what does that say about the patriots and the inflation of footballs?  that's the side you are defending.

[SteelCityColt]

So you're saying some players don't try to tackle as hard as others? Unless you are going to try to twist ankles like Burfict or stomp on people like Haynesworth or Suh I don't see how it's possible to try to injure someone on purpose in a quick play. 

 

But that's not the case which brings us back to....

 

Tom Brady attempted to rig the game to his benefit.

 

There's plenty of opportunity? Just off the top of my head, you're going in to sack a QB and dive at his knee/legs there's a fair chance you do some serious damage, or I dunno just pick them up and body slam them?

 

 

Even you limit yourself to "legal" tackles it's quite possible to go out with the intention hurting someone, it can and has happened. 

 

Don't be myopic just to try and prove your point. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

In matters of integrity of the game the CBA specifically states that the commish had to hand out the punishment. The PA cited the specific article in its letter to the league before the appeal. What is interesting here is Roger said he gave authority to Vincent to hand out the punishment so that way he could hear the appeal. The letter sent to Brady came from Vincent. But when pressed on this issue Roger said he gave his approval for the punishment so it seems he wants to have this both ways. I do think per your previous post that if this does end up in federal court the league yet again will have failed to follow the CBA and the suspension will be revoked. There is also the issue of fair and consistent punishment as well that they have also violated with its unprecedented punishment for ball tampering.

 

Here are the articles in the CBA the NFLPA was referrng to-

 

****************************************************

 

ARTICLE 46

COMMISSIONER DISCIPLINE

Section 1.

(a) League Discipline:Notwithstanding anything stated in Article 43:(a) All disputes involving a fine or suspension imposed upon a player for conduct on the playing field (other than as described in Subsection (b) below) or involving action taken against a player by the Commissioner for conduct detrimental to the integrity of, or public confidence in, the game of professional football, will be processed exclusively as follows: the Commissioner will promptly send written notice of his action to the player, with a copy to the NFLPA. Within three (3) business days following such written notification, the player affected thereby, or the NFLPA with the player’s approval, may appeal in writing to the Commissioner.

________________________

Section 2.

Hearings:

(a) Hearing Officers.

For appeals under Section 1(a) above, the Commissioner shall, after consultation with the Executive Director of the NFLPA, appoint one or more designees to serve as hearing officers. For appeals under Section 1(b) above, the parties shall, on an annual basis, jointly select two (2) or more designees to serve as hearing officers. The salary and reasonable expenses for the designees’ services shall be shared equally by the NFL and the NFLPA. Notwithstanding the foregoing, the Commissioner may serve as hearing officer in any appeal under Section 1(a) of this Article at his discretion.

 

***********

 

So language might be the sticky point.  If Goodell had to hand out 1st punishment and then appoint an appeals officer, then the courts might send it back and have NFL re do according to the process.  Who knows.

 

The cynic in me starting to wonder if NFL didn't botch the process on purpose to 'look like' they are coming down hard on Pats/Brady, and yet give NFLPA-courts opportunity to vacate the punishment because of due process technicalities...   

 

Then issue minimal punishment on reset, to avoid further litigation...    hmmmmm.....

[bababooey]

There's plenty of opportunity? Just off the top of my head, you're going in to sack a QB and dive at his knee/legs there's a fair chance you do some serious damage, or I dunno just pick them up and body slam them?

 

 

Even you limit yourself to "legal" tackles it's quite possible to go out with the intention hurting someone, it can and has happened. 

 

Don't be myopic just to try and prove your point. 

Ya got me (walter white voice). Not even the point of discussion here which brings us back to.....

 

Tom Brady successfully rigged the game to his benefit.

[SteelCityColt]

Ya got me (walter white voice). Not even the point of discussion here which brings us back to.....

 

Tom Brady successfully rigged the game to his benefit.

 

Well it kinda was in the discussion you were having with them or are you saying engineering a situation where an opponent is unable to play in the game through you hurting them isn't beneficial to you? The fact you've probably done this via some form of illegal (illegal according to the rules) action would kinda suggest you've "rigged" a game situation that is beneficial to you. 

 

In no way does this excuse what the Pats are accused of, just saying your point was flawed. 

[pgt_rob]

Brady & Crew should be happy with only missing 4 games. At least they aren't this guy. He is missing 2 years of competition pretty much.

 

Dempsey lost his cool after the Sounders' Michael Azira was sent off, leaving Seattle with eight players. He took referee Daniel Radford’s notebook and threw it to the ground, earning a yellow card for dissent. Dempsey then tore up the notbeook, drawing a straight red card for abuse. Since MLS clubs enter the U.S. Open Cup in the later rounds, Dempsey could miss more than two years of the competition. “Due to the suspension, Dempsey cannot play in any U.S. Open Cup matches in 2016 or 2017, and possibly longer depending on the number of tournament games in which Dempsey's team participates in those years,” said the statement.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/dempsey-gets-two-ban-u-open-cup-194127014--sow.html

[amfootball]

Here are the articles in the CBA the NFLPA was referrng to-

 

****************************************************

 

ARTICLE 46

COMMISSIONER DISCIPLINE

Section 1.

(a) League Discipline:Notwithstanding anything stated in Article 43:(a) All disputes involving a fine or suspension imposed upon a player for conduct on the playing field (other than as described in Subsection (b) below) or involving action taken against a player by the Commissioner for conduct detrimental to the integrity of, or public confidence in, the game of professional football, will be processed exclusively as follows: the Commissioner will promptly send written notice of his action to the player, with a copy to the NFLPA. Within three (3) business days following such written notification, the player affected thereby, or the NFLPA with the player’s approval, may appeal in writing to the Commissioner.

________________________

Section 2.

Hearings:

(a) Hearing Officers.

For appeals under Section 1(a) above, the Commissioner shall, after consultation with the Executive Director of the NFLPA, appoint one or more designees to serve as hearing officers. For appeals under Section 1(b) above, the parties shall, on an annual basis, jointly select two (2) or more designees to serve as hearing officers. The salary and reasonable expenses for the designees’ services shall be shared equally by the NFL and the NFLPA. Notwithstanding the foregoing, the Commissioner may serve as hearing officer in any appeal under Section 1(a) of this Article at his discretion.

 

***********

 

So language might be the sticky point.  If Goodell had to hand out 1st punishment and then appoint an appeals officer, then the courts might send it back and have NFL re do according to the process.  Who knows.

 

The cynic in me starting to wonder if NFL didn't botch the process on purpose to 'look like' they are coming down hard on Pats/Brady, and yet give NFLPA-courts opportunity to vacate the punishment because of due process technicalities...   

 

Then issue minimal punishment on reset, to avoid further litigation...    hmmmmm.....

Yes, I have had those thoughts too. Kraft capitulating like he did is the biggest red flag to me on this being a snow job by the league to look big and bag against those cheating Pats. Perhaps he and Roger discussed Brady's appeal and the lessening of punishments? I dunno. Nothing at this point would surprise me but this thing has reeked from the start.

[jvan1973]

Yes, I have had those thoughts too. Kraft capitulating like he did is the biggest red flag to me on this being a snow job by the league to look big and bag against those cheating Pats. Perhaps he and Roger discussed Brady's appeal and the lessening of punishments? I dunno. Nothing at this point would surprise me but this thing has reeked from the start.

Yes, from the start when the pats decided the rules don't apply to them

[amfootball]

Yes, from the start when the pats decided the rules don't apply to them

Right. So the narrative goes and Mort's bogus report and the trick plays vs the Ravens ... those big bad cheating Pats haven't done anything in 8 years but ... I am sure Bill paid off Carroll too to make that horrendous play call ..

[bababooey]

Well it kinda was in the discussion you were having with them or are you saying engineering a situation where an opponent is unable to play in the game through you hurting them isn't beneficial to you? The fact you've probably done this via some form of illegal (illegal according to the rules) action would kinda suggest you've "rigged" a game situation that is beneficial to you. 

 

In no way does this excuse what the Pats are accused of, just saying your point was flawed. 

Ok then to be more granular, deflating footballs is intended to affect 100% of the game, intending to injure would rarely affect 100% of the game unless your star receiver got injured returning the opening kick which now is rarely returnable.