Fire Grigson?

[YOUR GM]

I personally feel that Grigson's biggest problem is that he looks for players that fit the mold of what he was when he played (blue collar, hard working, max effort but with limited physical ability) so much to the point that he overthinks it a little. That's why we don't have that many game changers or elite level athletes drafted outside of Luck and TY. He needs to start looking for potential studs, not just overachieving role players

I also think the coaching staff needs some significant shaking up done in the off-season. Gilbert and Manuskey are becoming liabilities, at this point. I would be thrilled to see them both replaced

[esmort]

and just because you don't want to believe it to be true doesn't make it untrue. I at least have a quote to back up my point of view. What do you have to back up yours besides your opinion?

Also, if the Colts weren't serious about RG3 and had already made up their minds why on earth did they spend time scouting RG3? Heck, the league even said they could start their negotiations with the top pick early if they wanted too if they knew who they were taking and they didn't. Again, if the decision was a done deal why wait on that? That makes no sense. I think they were leaning Luck's way all along but Grigson didn't rush into it and made a smart and informed decision.

Grigson was the GM who picked Luck he gets credit for it just like he gets blame for the T-rich trade. You don't just get to cherry pick what happens on his watch and just give credit or blame on the things you want to because trust me had he made the wrong choice and picked RG3 people sure as heck would hold it against him.

 

There are stories all over the internet that suggest that Irsay made the Luck pick, and had decided it before Grigson was even hired ... far more people in the know believe and have written/said as much.  And as far as the TRich trade ... I believe that was Grigsons "brainchild", although I do believe that Irsay signed off on it and could have stopped it, but let his faith in Grigson get in the way of good judgement. While we will never be able to prove anything for sure ... IMO it is naive to believe that a billionaire business man would not make the biggest decision facing his business in nearly 20 years; a decision that would have ramifications that could last years and cost 100's of millions of dollars, but instead would leave this decision to a newly hired 1st year GM ... makes perfect sense.

[GoColts8818]

There are stories all over the internet that suggest that Irsay made the Luck pick, and had decided it before Grigson was even hired ... far more people in the know believe and have written/said as much.  And as far as the TRich trade ... I believe that was Grigsons "brainchild", although I do believe that Irsay signed off on it and could have stopped it, but let his faith in Grigson get in the way of good judgement. While we will never be able to prove anything for sure ... IMO it is naive to believe that a billionaire business man would not make the biggest decision facing his business in nearly 20 years; a decision that would have ramifications that could last years and cost 100's of millions of dollars, but instead would leave this decision to a newly hired 1st year GM ... makes perfect sense.

when that billionaire used to make those decision and regularly got them wrong thus he hired a football person to make them yeah I believe he lets the GM make the calls. Does Irsay have a say? Of course he owns the team. However, like a smart owner, he knows enough to listen to his GM. Had Grigson concluded RG3 was better then RG3 would have been the pick. Grigson didn't spend time scouting RG3 because he had nothing better to do. While I agree Luck was the leader in the club house they took a strong look at RG3 and it was Grigson who did most of the looking at him as well as Luck and my guess was he sat down and told Irsay which one he wanted and why.

Again, had the Colts draftes RG3 Grigson would be getting the blame for that. So since he took Luck he gets credit for it. You don't get to cherry pick which moves someone makes that they do and don't get credit for. That's just spinning the arguement to make it fit whatever point of view one might have.

When you look at everything Grigson has done since he got here and what the excretions were when he was hired the idea that he should be fired as suggested by the orginal poster is ridiculous.

[esmort]

when that billionaire used to make those decision and regularly got them wrong thus he hired a football person to make them yeah I believe he lets the GM make the calls. Does Irsay have a say? Of course he owns the team. However, like a smart owner, he knows enough to listen to his GM. Had Grigson concluded RG3 was better then RG3 would have been the pick. Grigson didn't spend time scouting RG3 because he had nothing better to do. While I agree Luck was the leader in the club house they took a strong look at RG3 and it was Grigson who did most of the looking at him as well as Luck and my guess was he sat down and told Irsay which one he wanted and why.

Again, had the Colts draftes RG3 Grigson would be getting the blame for that. So since he took Luck he gets credit for it. You don't get to cherry pick which moves someone makes that they do and don't get credit for. That's just spinning the arguement to make it fit whatever point of view one might have.

When you look at everything Grigson has done since he got here and what the excretions were when he was hired the idea that he should be fired as suggested by the orginal poster is ridiculous.

 

First, much of the initial Luck/QB scouting (and discussions on the subject with Irsay) was done by Polian who has come out and said on many occasions Irsay liked Luck from the beginning. I have heard this with my own ears coming from Polian live on Sirius NFL. When he describes the amount of time he put into scouting Luck and discussing it with Irsay I would not be surprised if he scouted Luck and RG3 more than Grigson.  Second, if you truly believe Grigson was the primary decision maker on this than there is no sense in discussing it any further, because it is insane to believe Grigson made the Luck decision; and nothing short of Irsay coming out and stating it adamantly in no uncertain terms will convince me otherwise. So we will just have to agree to disagree.

[Jason_]

Had Grigson concluded RG3 was better then RG3 would have been the pick.

 

 

Oh I don't believe that for a second.  I also remember Irsay saying, prior to hiring Grigson, that he (Irsay) would be making the decision on Manning and on the #1 pick but that after that, his new GM would have full control of the team....or something to that effect.  I don't think Irsay would have even hired Grigson as GM if he wasn't fully onboard with drafting Luck.

[TheEdgeis1]

Gimme a break! 

Arians formulated this team in Luck's 1st year and coached them to 11-5.

Chuckles took over Arians team in the 2nd year and rode them to another 11-5.

Andrew had his break-out year in the 3rd year and pushed the team to 11-5 in spite of Coach Chuckles.

Pagano has led nothing...he cannot motivate his players, he cannot prepare his team for a big game, he cannot manage the game making good in-game adjustments and he can't even objectively evaluate the players he has.

Geez...mindless, freakin' cheerleader.

 

I have to agree with what most is being said here, I would just replace "cannot" with "most of the time".  I think our weakest link on this team is the coaches, not the players.  I mean that game plan for NE was like they game planned for a pre-season game.  VANILLA VANILLA VANILLA

[Jonathan24]

I am kind of indifferent on keeping Grigson.  The reason being is that when grigson came in they were building a team to compete with the Patriots.  Since Chuck and Grigs has gotten there the Colts are 0-4 and none of those where close games.  I think if every coach and person returns for next year we will get a good look at what the team can actually be being under the same system for several years.

[JustAColtsFan]

   is they need draft rg , rt in next draft  in 1st  too 3 rd .  better have young o'line  then go Fa guys playing only 1 too 3 years.  he can,t pick any good offense  play being he is one . that would prove he was a bad GM. thinking that why he afraid draft 1 , 2 round offense  linemen.

Huh!!  You can spell out your words.  This isn't a text message lol!  (Oh, Sorry - Laugh Out Loud).

[JustAColtsFan]

I think we could have done a little better with the FA so I agree with Dustin there but I don't wanna fire him just yet he has had some real good moves the Vontae 1 was a steal and one of the best moves we could have made but I think this offseason he needs to go after Terrance "pot roast" Knighton

If he could land Fitzgerald that would be huge.  We are going to need a veteran WR if Reggie retires.

[Jonathan24]

The Donald Thomas signing was the worst GM move.  Donald Thomas has only played 2 games with the colts since being siged.

[el duderino]

The Donald Thomas signing was the worst GM move.  Donald Thomas has only played 2 games with the colts since being siged.

 

injuries happen, why is that Grigson's fault?

[Defjamz26]

No.

 

So far his worse move has been the Richardson move. Other than that he's been solid. He knocked the 2012 draft out of the park. Brazil blew his own shot, Ballard just keeps having unfortunate injuries, and Chapman will be cut soon. Other than that it was solid. 2013 draft was a mixed bag, and 2014 was great with limited picks. FA signings are up and down though.

 

 

I think his biggest flaw is that he isn't always aggressive and is to often content with inferior players. It's cool to go for the diamonds in the rough sometimes, but UDFA's and CFL players don't win you championships. Like when he talked about not getting a safety in last years draft and said "I like what we have in house" and as big of a fan as people were of Howell, he wasn't anything special. He's also failed to really draft defensively at all, although it may have been for Luck's benefit. The 2015 draft is a very big test for Grigson. What he does this draft will determine if we make it over our hump, next season.

[throwing BBZ]

I personally feel that Grigson's biggest problem is that he looks for players that fit the mold of what he was when he played (blue collar, hard working, max effort but with limited physical ability) so much to the point that he overthinks it a little. That's why we don't have that many game changers or elite level athletes drafted outside of Luck and TY. He needs to start looking for potential studs, not just overachieving role players

I also think the coaching staff needs some significant shaking up done in the off-season. Gilbert and Manuskey are becoming liabilities, at this point. I would be thrilled to see them both replaced

 

 More of what  he says.  Andrews short game skills must vastly improve to beat a great D.

 He and Pep are a BAD Mix for that to happen. Pep WILL LEAVE soon, this year or next. Locking in the right O-Coordinator NOW to Make Andrew get better at it ASAP would be Awesome for us.

 Pray Pep goes ASAP.

  Mewhort is rock solid and a slightly slower athlete than McGlynn. Tall and light in the britches, a nice choice to hamper a run game. Grade D by Grigson. A BAD draft pick.

[Superman]

injuries happen, why is that Grigson's fault?

 

Because of hindsight, which is generally the problem when fans start talking about who is and isn't a good GM.

[BOTT]

How to be a successful GM? To quote Bill Polian: acquire a good QB

Let's face it, the perception of coaches and GMs is heavily screwed by QB play.

[Jason_]

No.

 

So far his worse move has been the Richardson move. Other than that he's been solid. He knocked the 2012 draft out of the park. Brazil blew his own shot, Ballard just keeps having unfortunate injuries, and Chapman will be cut soon. Other than that it was solid. 2013 draft was a mixed bag, and 2014 was great with limited picks. FA signings are up and down though.

 

 

I think his biggest flaw is that he isn't always aggressive and is to often content with inferior players. It's cool to go for the diamonds in the rough sometimes, but UDFA's and CFL players don't win you championships. Like when he talked about not getting a safety in last years draft and said "I like what we have in house" and as big of a fan as people were of Howell, he wasn't anything special. He's also failed to really draft defensively at all, although it may have been for Luck's benefit. The 2015 draft is a very big test for Grigson. What he does this draft will determine if we make it over our hump, next season.

 

lol...why would chapman be cut?  he just finished his first full season as a full time starter and he's still on his very cheap rookie contract.  

[Jonathan24]

injuries happen, why is that Grigson's fault?

 

 

Because of hindsight, which is generally the problem when fans start talking about who is and isn't a good GM.

 

No its because Donald Thomas has been injury prone his whole career.  Only had two season where he played 16 games. and of those 32 games he only started 19.

[a06cc]

when that billionaire used to make those decision and regularly got them wrong thus he hired a football person to make them yeah I believe he lets the GM make the calls. Does Irsay have a say? Of course he owns the team. However, like a smart owner, he knows enough to listen to his GM. Had Grigson concluded RG3 was better then RG3 would have been the pick. Grigson didn't spend time scouting RG3 because he had nothing better to do. While I agree Luck was the leader in the club house they took a strong look at RG3 and it was Grigson who did most of the looking at him as well as Luck and my guess was he sat down and told Irsay which one he wanted and why.

Again, had the Colts draftes RG3 Grigson would be getting the blame for that. So since he took Luck he gets credit for it. You don't get to cherry pick which moves someone makes that they do and don't get credit for. That's just spinning the arguement to make it fit whatever point of view one might have.

When you look at everything Grigson has done since he got here and what the excretions were when he was hired the idea that he should be fired as suggested by the orginal poster is ridiculous.

The original poster which was me never said he should be fired. I'm 50/50 on him and the choices he has made. All I wanted to see is what everyone's feelings were about him. We were never rebuilding. It was stated from day one that the team was reloading.

[NewColtsFan]

The original poster which was me never said he should be fired. I'm 50/50 on him and the choices he has made. All I wanted to see is what everyone's feelings were about him. We were never rebuilding. It was stated from day one that the team was reloading.

 

Irsay, Grigson and Pagano called it re-loading because they've got season tickets to sell.    More people want to come see a reload than a rebuild.

 

But the roster has almost completely turned over in just 3 years.    That's a rebuild,  whether they want to call it that or not.

[hoosierhawk]

Colts have 4th best record in the league behind Denver, NE and Seattle if my figures are correct. Denver 38-10, NE 36-12 and Seattle 36-12. Colts 33-15 after coming off the worst record in the league prior to Grigson taking over (2-14). Really, fire him?

[Coffeedrinker]

The moves that have been made. Do some of you think he should be fired before we have a Polian 2.0 on our hands. A guy masked by good quarterback play.

Yeah, I hope the Colts don't have another 5 time Executive of the Year on their hands.... That would be unbearable.

[Jason_]

Irsay, Grigson and Pagano called it re-loading because they've got season tickets to sell.    More people want to come see a reload than a rebuild.

 

But the roster has almost completely turned over in just 3 years.    That's a rebuild,  whether they want to call it that or not.

 

exactly...we have what, like 5 guys leftover from the old regime and 1 coach?  Plus new offensive and defensive schemes.  Yeah that's pretty much a complete tear down and rebuild.

[coming on strong]

You guys don't fully under stand how bad grigson truly is ..... What has improved since he took over . This team has no run game ,defense, offensive line.

His free agent signings are horrible, if the colts didn't get 6 free wins a season playing horrible teams they would be exposed . the colts were below 500 against teams with winning records and get a free trip to the playoffs because of the horrible division .

Put the colts in the afc north and there record would be 8-8 or 9-7 if that, if they went 11-5 gettting 6 free wins then the colts would easily get swept by the steelers split with the ravens and lose one or two more changing the record from 11-5 to mediocre .

The only thing grigson did was draft solid weapons for luck , but people here love to overrated our weapons like their the broncos even though they probably are top 5 in drops the last 3 years, and get man handled by good teams like the pats and can't get seperation .

[GoColts8818]

You guys don't fully under stand how bad grigson truly is ..... What has improved since he took over . This team has no run game ,defense, offensive line.

His free agent signings are horrible, if the colts didn't get 6 free wins a season playing horrible teams they would be exposed . the colts were below 500 against teams with winning records and get a free trip to the playoffs because of the horrible division .

Put the colts in the afc north and there record would be 8-8 or 9-7 if that, if they went 11-5 gettting 6 free wins then the colts would easily get swept by the steelers split with the ravens and lose one or two more changing the record from 11-5 to mediocre .

The only thing grigson did was draft solid weapons for luck , but people here love to overrated our weapons like their the broncos even though they probably are top 5 in drops the last 3 years, and get man handled by good teams like the pats and can't get seperation .

they did go from 2-14 to the AFC title game under him so clearly something improved.

Also for all those who say the Colts would get destroyed in the AFC north they went 4-1 vs. that divison this year.

[GoColts8818]

exactly...we have what, like 5 guys leftover from the old regime and 1 coach?  Plus new offensive and defensive schemes.  Yeah that's pretty much a complete tear down and rebuild.

mathis, wayne, reitz, Castonzo, adam, and McAfee are the players hold overs I can think of. The coach is Clyde but I think this is correct, that's all that is left. So two special teamers. Two linemen, a WR and one player on defense.

[bsteves]

This thread should be closed.. I stopped reading after the first page.. I'm surprised to see it at the top of the forum day after day. It's just ridiculous.

[Brad Nichter]

No, but I'll give him another couple years to move us onto the next big step. That being said, I don't put all of the turn around from the 2-14 season. any gm in his spot would've drafted Luck, well most anyways. Without the #1 pick, we'd be talking different. What makes me wonder is with the recent overpaid signings and last couple of drafts. All in my opinion of course:)

[BOTT]

they did go from 2-14 to the AFC title game under him so clearly something improved.

Also for all those who say the Colts would get destroyed in the AFC north they went 4-1 vs. that divison this year.

That sounds similar to what Mark Sanchez fans use to say. I'm not calling for Grigson to be fired, but trotting out a teams record isn't proof he is doing a swell job.

[OLD FAN MAN]

2012 draft, hits, luck, fleener, allen, ballard, misses, chapman, brazill, j Anderson, fugger,harnish 4 out of 8. 2013 draft hits none, misses, werner, thornton, holmes, boyette, k. Williams, Cunningham.0 out of 6  2014 draft hits moncrief, misses mehort, newsome, a. Jackson, ulrick 1 out of 5. this is why I don't value draft picks to help the team other than qb and receivers, the other positions I would rather have proven free agents. draft picks are to iffy.

[esmort]

2012 draft, hits, luck, fleener, allen, ballard, misses, chapman, brazill, j Anderson, fugger,harnish 4 out of 8. 2013 draft hits none, misses, werner, thornton, holmes, boyette, k. Williams, Cunningham.0 out of 6  2014 draft hits moncrief, misses mehort, newsome, a. Jackson, ulrick 1 out of 5. this is why I don't value draft picks to help the team other than qb and receivers, the other positions I would rather have proven free agents. draft picks are to iffy.

 

I dont give him credit for Luck.

 

Mewhort not a miss

 

Newsome unknown

 

A. Jackson unknown

 

Thornton, Holmes, .... Big question marks can still go either way... I am not high on them though

[bsteves]

I dont give him credit for Luck.

Mewhort not a miss

Newsome unknown

A. Jackson unknown

Thornton, Holmes, .... Big question marks can still go either way... I am not high on them though

How do you not give him credit for luck? We could've went rg3.. A lot of people were split on who to pick. Polian and Dungy both said they would have picked rg3.

And Newsome was a late round pick that made a heck of a lot of plays this year. What is unknown?

This thread is ridiculous. Grigson has done a great job REBUILDING as much as he and we do not want to use the term. He is not going to hit on every draft pick and free agent move. Please name 5 gm's that have done a better job in the last 3 years. If you can do it great but I bet you cant name 10. Ridiculous thread.

[NewColtsFan]

The Donald Thomas signing was the worst GM move.  Donald Thomas has only played 2 games with the colts since being siged.

 

The guy has been hurt both years!    Players don't come with tags that say "Don't sign me, I'm going to get hurt!"

 

Your observation is made in hindsight, not foresight.

 

It doesn't take much to see what has gone wrong or right after the fact....    

[NewColtsFan]

That sounds similar to what Mark Sanchez fans use to say. I'm not calling for Grigson to be fired, but trotting out a teams record isn't proof he is doing a swell job.

 

It isn't?    Since when?

 

What is more important than a team's record?

[NewColtsFan]

No its because Donald Thomas has been injury prone his whole career.  Only had two season where he played 16 games. and of those 32 games he only started 19.

 

He was a back-up at New England,  not a primary starter.

 

We signed him to start for us.    And he's been hurt both years.

 

He hasn't been injury prone his whole career....

[John Dee]

Next season is big for everyone...  

[esmort]

How do you not give him credit for luck? We could've went rg3.. A lot of people were split on who to pick. Polian and Dungy both said they would have picked rg3.

And Newsome was a late round pick that made a heck of a lot of plays this year. What is unknown?

This thread is ridiculous. Grigson has done a great job REBUILDING as much as he and we do not want to use the term. He is not going to hit on every draft pick and free agent move. Please name 5 gm's that have done a better job in the last 3 years. If you can do it great but I bet you cant name 10. Ridiculous thread.

 

First, I am not in favor of firing him, but I think this off season (FA and Draft) will go a long way toward determining his fate.

 

He did not pick Luck, Irsay had decided Luck was the pick before Grigson was even hired. Very few people were really split on who was going first, regardless of how much the media wants you to believe it.

 

Newsome has shown flashes and I agree he looks like he might turn out to be good, but too many people are getting ahead of themselves on Newsome ... several of the big highlight plays that have many posters hyping him came when he was completely unblocked.

 

10?? That's a third of the league, being in the top 1/3 of GMs would not be that special.

[OLD FAN MAN]

How do you not give him credit for luck? We could've went rg3.. A lot of people were split on who to pick. Polian and Dungy both said they would have picked rg3.

And Newsome was a late round pick that made a heck of a lot of plays this year. What is unknown?

This thread is ridiculous. Grigson has done a great job REBUILDING as much as he and we do not want to use the term. He is not going to hit on every draft pick and free agent move. Please name 5 gm's that have done a better job in the last 3 years. If you can do it great but I bet you cant name 10. Ridiculous thread.

newsome was picked in rd 5, brady and mathis were picked in the sixth, is he as good as either of them? could not see him in the pats game. invisible.

[mintor]

injuries happen, why is that Grigson's fault?

 

 

because they should be a way too waiver a player is on ir.  if on ir a long time then time too get rid of them with no fines are penalty to the cap. 

[bsteves]

First, I am not in favor of firing him, but I think this off season (FA and Draft) will go a long way toward determining his fate.

He did not pick Luck, Irsay had decided Luck was the pick before Grigson was even hired. Very few people were really split on who was going first, regardless of how much the media wants you to believe it.

Newsome has shown flashes and I agree he looks like he might turn out to be good, but too many people are getting ahead of themselves on Newsome ... several of the big highlight plays that have many posters hyping him came when he was completely unblocked.

10?? That's a third of the league, being in the top 1/3 of GMs would not be that special.

I do think the obvious pick was Luck but there was a decision to be made.

Newsome, I am just saying, can you really expect more from a 5th round pick in his rookie yr?

I first said name 5 that are better then if you can name 10. That doesn't exactly put him at 10th. But are you saying that we should fire Grigson if he is the 7th(even 10th) best in the league because he isn't "special?" Not many people are "special."

[esmort]

I do think the obvious pick was Luck but there was a decision to be made.

Newsome, I am just saying, can you really expect more from a 5th round pick in his rookie yr?

I first said name 5 that are better then if you can name 10. That doesn't exactly put him at 10th. But are you saying that we should fire Grigson if he is the 7th(even 10th) best in the league because he isn't "special?" Not many people are "special."

 

There was a decision to be made and Irsay made it (he decided on Luck) before Grigson was hired (So no credit Grigson)

 

No, I didn't expect more from Newsome in his rookie year, he did decent ... but he is being over hyped and has not shown enough yet to help Grigson one way or the other. 

 

You also limited the GMs to the last 3 years which makes for a difficult comparison, because there are some good GMs whose teams have had a couple down years ex. Jerry Reese

 

I don't have a specific ranking among GMs that I would base his firing on, if I thought he should be fired it would be based on "How do I think the Colts look after the 2015 season" 

 

If it was legitimately quantifiable and we could say without a doubt Grigson is the #10 GM than I may not fire him immediately but I am actively looking for a replacement.  Being the bottom of the top 33% is replaceable in my book ... you think "graduated in the top 1/3 of my class" is something someone puts on a resume to persuade someone to hire them?