Is Wes Welker done? [Merge]

[sweetsurrender]

I think he may be close to done. Depends on how serious this latest concussion is. What is concerning is the number of concussions in such a short time span. Not to mention the position he plays. Very tough. I wish him well.

[southwest1]

It also doesn't help that Peyton floats passes into the middle of the field, where his receivers are the most defenseless. He's has that rep for years.

Yes, some NFL broadcasters & analysts have said that about #18 that is true VL. But what QB hasn't thrown a high pass that a WR or TE had to go up & get it. & paid the price for it bell rung wise? I get your point: Put it low in by their jersey number so they can protect themselves & get down. Fair point. 

 

That's a fair point....if I remember right Dallas Clark got waffled pretty good a couple of times.

 

Guys like Swearinger and others live for these nasty intimidation hits...and those routes over the middle can put a WR right in their cross hairs.

 

Peyton Manning can process a LOT of information....but knowing the closing angle of some of these head hunter safeties as the play develops is asking alot.

 

I'm guessing Swearinger will be fined for this....but it doesn't matter...he's achieved the desired effect and seeing some "alligator arms" from some WRs versus the Texans won't be terribly surprising.

Dallas Clark, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne all had to grab a pass out of the air off their fingertips once in awhile I agree, but it's not like every pass 18 throws is a floater though. Love your point on the closing distance of safeties though PAC56! An excellent point since no NFL QB can always counteract that factor. 

 

Your football IQ is off the roof. Below video is a sample and a tribute to you. Recollect the QB name?.

 

Good point Shane any QB can throw a high floater. Sometimes, the ball just leaves a field general's hand funny or with an awkward trajectory overall. I love Wes Welker just like I loved Austin Collie, but someday I know Wes will be done just not now. IMO. Wishful thinking? Perhaps...

[southwest1]

It also doesn't help that Peyton floats passes into the middle of the field, where his receivers are the most defenseless. He's has that rep for years.

I only liked this post because some high throws by Manning did in fact lead to harsh concussions. I won't lie about that, but let's not create the false impression that 18 cannot throw a beautiful deep ball TD with some tremendous touch on it either. That's all I'm saying. Perspective, meaning the whole NFL career picture, matters. Not job some balls that got away. 

 

I get your point generally, but your point is hardly conclusive every time Peyton receives & releases the ball under center. Brees, Brady, Rogers, & Rivers have all throw floaters let's just remember that please. 

[pacolts56]

Dallas Clark, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne all had to grab a pass out of the air off their fingertips once in awhile I agree, but it's not like every pass 18 throws is a floater though. Love your point on the closing distance of safeties though PAC56! An excellent point since no NFL QB can always counteract that factor. 

It's really the great unknown for a QB and a WR/TE going into a play designed to go over the middle.

 

A number of NFL QBs...and Peyton better than others....can often anticipate an open target using his pre-snap mastery.

 

But a safety lining up a WR for a nasty hit, by hanging back and essentially allowing the WR to make the catch and then "making them pay" seems to be on the increase.

 

The Broncos saw this physicality from the Seahawks and it really set the tone for that game by fouling up Denver's timing. The league can minimize damage by ruling out these head shots....but very physical hits can still be made on WRs....and an offense can't totally shy away from underneath/across the middle patterns.

 

Receivers just gotta be careful out there.

[ViriLudant]

Your football IQ is off the roof. Below video is a sample and a tribute to you. Recollect the QB name?.

That's funny, Colt fans above agree with me. Or did you just become a Colts fan? Austin Collie? Clark ? Brandon Stokely? Now Wes Welker?

Where there is smoke, there's fire.

Peyton is infamous for this. Sorry if you didn't know this well known fact.

[Vance]

That's funny, Colt fans above agree with me. Or did you just become a Colts fan? Austin Collie? Clark ? Brandon Stokely? Now Wes Welker?

Where there is smoke, there's fire.

Peyton is infamous for this. Sorry if you didn't know this well known fact.

 

The funny part is the example he gave, Brady didn't even throw it over the middle, and he didn't float it.

 

Shane has trouble constructing logical arguments or dealing with adverse criticism that doesn't fit into his worldview, though.  It's a sickness.

[ViriLudant]

The funny part is the example he gave, Brady didn't even throw it over the middle, and he didn't float it.

Shane has trouble constructing logical arguments or dealing with adverse criticism that doesn't fit into his worldview, though. It's a sickness.

Yeah, it's been pointed out to him many times by various people . But don't worry , he'll claim it's because people don't understand his argument, not because it's a poorly constructed , illogical argument .

[PrincetonTiger]

That's funny, Colt fans above agree with me. Or did you just become a Colts fan? Austin Collie? Clark ? Brandon Stokely? Now Wes Welker?

Where there is smoke, there's fire.

Peyton is infamous for this. Sorry if you didn't know this well known fact.

The injuries to those guys weren't due to the QB but the type of routes they ran

[ViriLudant]

The injuries to those guys weren't due to the QB but the type of routes they ran

Except that not every slot player ends up like those guys.

Looks like this NFL writer agrees with me:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/curran-manning-has-share-blame-welker-concussion

[amfootball]

Except that not every slot player ends up like those guys.

Looks like this NFL writer agrees with me:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/curran-manning-has-share-blame-welker-concussion

Wow. Those were some strong comments from Curran. He said had Welker's agent not gotten so greedy he would still be in NE and healthy.

[southwest1]

The funny part is the example he gave, Brady didn't even throw it over the middle, and he didn't float it.

 

Shane has trouble constructing logical arguments or dealing with adverse criticism that doesn't fit into his worldview, though.  It's a sickness.

Come on now Vance. We are all guilty of that. Showing favoritism or preferential treatment toward athletes & film stars we like & we often ignore or confront either issues or people who tarnish our view of them. It's hardly a sickness just how thick we choose to make our blind spots generally. There's no crime in that. Hades, I do it everyday day actually. It called exercising discriminating tastes. No need to pick on Shane there. 

[Vance]

Come on now Vance. We are all guilty of that. Showing favoritism or preferential treatment toward athletes & film stars we like & we often ignore or confront either issues or people who tarnish our view of them. It's hardly a sickness just how thick we choose to make our blind spots generally. There's no crime in that. Hades, I do it everyday day actually. It called exercising discriminating tastes. No need to pick on Shane there. 

 

Having bias is one thing, constructing arguments made out of toilet paper and failure is another.

[PrincetonTiger]

Come on now Vance. We are all guilty of that. Showing favoritism or preferential treatment toward athletes & film stars we like & we often ignore or confront either issues or people who tarnish our view of them. It's hardly a sickness just how thick we choose to make our blind spots generally. There's no crime in that. Hades, I do it everyday day actually. It called exercising discriminating tastes. No need to pick on Shane there.

Very true

[southwest1]

Except that not every slot player ends up like those guys.

Looks like this NFL writer agrees with me:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/curran-manning-has-share-blame-welker-concussion

I always like when writers say stuff like that "Brady knows how to treat a smaller WR like Welker not that Manning doesn't." nonsense man. Can you say darning with faint praise? It's like a mother who has 1 drop dead gorgeous daughter & 1 who is shall we say average looking. Of Kathleen you look stunning dear. Oh Samantha, you look nice too honey." 

 

In fairness to VL & PAC56, you're not wrong. Peyton Manning did throw a few high balls to Dallas Clark, Austin Collie, & Wes Welker which resulted in head trauma & missing a half or even a few games that is entirely accurate & a valid point, but it would be more than a little dangerous & disingenuous to convey a repetitious pattern of bad throws across the middle that defines 18's QB pedigree. 

 

Yes, I respect Manning, but I am practical. Not every WR or TE Peyton threw the ball to got a concussion. A few are yes, but not a monumental proportion of them are in my estimation. 

 

And why does that writer blame Wes Welker's agent for his concussions? That's ludicrous. His agent is just trying to get him the most money to set him up for life financially. Life advice & meaningful counsel pertaining to an athlete's career or retirement options is never found on your payroll. That remark was beyond stupid. 

 

It's never the agent's job to hold your hand & tell you when to walk away. That's what doctors, mothers, & wives are for. I want an agent only focused on 1 thing: Stuffing my bank account with a ton of cash. Nothing else & securing me that fattest contract extension possible. 

[jvan1973]

Except that not every slot player ends up like those guys.

Looks like this NFL writer agrees with me:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/curran-manning-has-share-blame-welker-concussion

A patriots writer. Shocking.

[chad72]

Wow. Those were some strong comments from Curran. He said had Welker's agent not gotten so greedy he would still be in NE and healthy.

 

Curran is a patriots insider and he starts off with a biased opinion, like a bitter ex not being able to let go of the fact that Welker left New England. No wonder you agree with him (we all remember your strong feelings when Welker went there ).

 

I have said this before - Marvin and Reggie were masters in the art of getting down but then, they played outside more. Putting all the blame on Peyton is very short sighted without looking at each hit by the safety/LB on its own merit. Curran is talking like a fan in the stands waving his Patriots homer flag, that is what it felt like in this segment. Any Patriots homer could have a blog post like this, just wont have his clout to talk on TV, that is all.

 

One thing I could definitely say about Collie is he did not get down fast enough like a Marvin or Reggie. He took 2 giant steps before that Eagles safety gave him his first concussion in a helmet-to-helmet hit where Collie and Coleman lowered their heads. That was the start of things after that - never did recover completely.

 

If this was a bang-bang play, I would have attributed it more to Peyton, it was not. Swearinger lowered his shoulder and Welker did not get down fast enough though he could take a step easily and Welker being shorter, his head was the victim. Maybe Welker has slowed down a tad bit not allowing him to get down as quickly as he could in his prime??? Maybe the Pats did know that, not sure about that.

 

There have been bang-bang plays with Collie or Clark or Stokely in the past with Peyton throwing to them but this was not one of them, neither was Welker's first major concussion vs the Chiefs when he was running around for too long, much like Collie's first big concussion when he had a chance to take two steps before running into the Eagles safety Coleman. Like Southwest said, Curran is grasping for straws making it seem like Peyton needs to be vilified because the majority of his throws to the slot cause concussions. He is definitely a bitter ex.

[southwest1]

Having bias is one thing, constructing arguments made out of toilet paper and failure is another.

TBH. Even though I admire & respect what the Patriots have accomplished ever since BB was hired as the HC in 2000, it does trouble me sometimes how NE is always placed at the top of the NFL pyramid despite not winning a SB since 2004. Yes, I know INDY hasn't won a Championship since 2006. My point is this: While NE is a premier football franchise & deservedly so, I wish the media would widen their scope of Lombardi front runner praise a little bit more & widen the net. 

 

That's what I think Shane was getting at. This unwritten symbolic mist in the air that NE is perfect & never makes any mistakes almost as if the only way to win is to replicate the Patriot Way & formula. Their coach is deemed a genius, their owner is deemed a model blue print of impeccable ownership, & their QB walks on water like Jesus. I'm being sarcastic here BTW. Sometimes, journalists covering Boston football need to tone down the blinding hero worship considerably that's all I saying. Does Manning have overzealous hero worship in Denver too? Oh you bet your caboose he does. 

 

If I were to boil it down to it's most elemental level, I would say this: Shane just got fed up with this reporter mentality that NE sets the agenda for everything that happens in the NFL & that Tommy Terrific & the Grey Hoodie never make a false move or mistake. That's why he posted the video: Frustration over this skewed NFL landscape love affair with NE. Shane just wanted to show that an elite QB like Brady is not a God; he too can make mistakes, throws a bad ball once in awhile, or turns the ball over occasionally. He is in fact--human with faults in his own game. JMO. 

[southwest1]

Curran is a patriots insider and he starts off with a biased opinion, like a bitter ex not being able to let go of the fact that Welker left New England. No wonder you agree with him (we all remember your strong feelings when Welker went there ).

 

I have said this before - Marvin and Reggie were masters in the art of getting down but then, they played outside more. Putting all the blame on Peyton is very short sighted without looking at each hit by the safety/LB on its own merit. Curran is talking like a fan in the stands waving his Patriots homer flag, that is what it felt like in this segment. Any Patriots homer could have a blog post like this, just wont have his clout to talk on TV, that is all.

 

One thing I could definitely say about Collie is he did not get down fast enough like a Marvin or Reggie. He took 2 giant steps before that Eagles safety gave him his first concussion in a helmet-to-helmet hit where Collie and Coleman lowered their heads. That was the start of things after that - never did recover completely.

 

If this was a bang-bang play, I would have attributed it more to Peyton, it was not. Swearinger lowered his shoulder and Welker did not get down fast enough though he could take a step easily and Welker being shorter, his head was the victim. Maybe Welker has slowed down a tad bit not allowing him to get down as quickly as he could in his prime??? Maybe the Pats did know that, not sure about that.

 

There have been bang-bang plays with Collie or Clark or Stokely in the past with Peyton throwing to them but this was not one of them, neither was Welker's first major concussion vs the Chiefs when he was running around for too long, much like Collie's first big concussion when he had a chance to take two steps before running into the Eagles safety Coleman. Like Southwest said, Curran is grasping for straws making it seem like Peyton needs to be vilified because the majority of his throws to the slot cause concussions. He is definitely a bitter ex.

A very balanced, well articulated entry Chad! You know it never dawned on until you made the connection that Collie never got down as fast or out of bounds as fast as Marvin & Reggie did. I just seem to recall Austin trying to get the most yardage from the line of scrimmage vs just taking what the defense gave him & not pushing for better field position. I knew that Collie loved to stretch his body for extra yards for years, but your valid reminder clued me into to something I'd forgotten Chad. Austin never learned avoiding big hits= a longer NFL career the Michael Vick syndrome for lack of a better term. 

 

It's cool to be mentioned in a post by a friend & football mind I really respect. Thanks man! Sorry if that remark came across as self indulgent egotism BTW. LOL! 

[Fx Stryker]

The Patriots were right. I think that is obvious. But, no, I don't want him to be done. I never wish for a player's career to end on anything but their own terms. But I also don't think concussions are something to mess with when your 33 and at the twilight of your career.

Really? I mean I'm sure they were so glad they let him go, especially Tom. He wouldn't have liked a real target at all last season.

Definitely wouldn't have helped put them into the Super Bowl. Nah, Talib wouldn't have left with an injury. Tom wouldn't like the chemistry with his WR so he wasn't over throwing them.

[Shane Bond]

The funny part is the example he gave, Brady didn't even throw it over the middle, and he didn't float it.

 

Shane has trouble constructing logical arguments or dealing with adverse criticism that doesn't fit into his worldview, though.  It's a sickness.

Firstly, on the topic, point is any receivers who live in the middle are bound to have lot of hits ( Ex: the video shown ). QBs have nothing to do with it.

 

Secondly, since i joined this forum, first time i ever interacted with you was 2 days ago and you got burned with the topic.

 

Of course, you chase my posts and make personal comments ( bolded ) outside the topic.

[Shane Bond]

lol. Not too many players that have left the Pats have gone on to great careers after. Just a handful. And I have never referred to a player as garbage.

I am sure you wish you had Welker last year. Not only he was taken away from Tom but could have prevented Aqib Talib hit.

[Shane Bond]

Yeah, it's been pointed out to him many times by various people . But don't worry , he'll claim it's because people don't understand his argument, not because it's a poorly constructed , illogical argument .

Let me try it again for you. You mentioned Welker's hit is due to Peyton. I gave an example, its not due to a QB, its the position they play.

 

Of course, when you are cornered, you always try to make garbage statements like above which has no relevance to the topic.

[amfootball]

Really? I mean I'm sure they were so glad they let him go, especially Tom. He wouldn't have liked a real target at all last season.

Definitely wouldn't have helped put them into the Super Bowl. Nah, Talib wouldn't have left with an injury. Tom wouldn't like the chemistry with his WR so he wasn't over throwing them.

Edelman more than made up for Welker last year. Tom didn't miss him in the slot at all. Gronk? Aaron Hernandez? Different story. Missed those guys a ton.

 

Talib is soft. You will see that again this year. Welker did not "injure" him. He just didn't want to play with a sore rib and knee.

[amfootball]

Curran is a patriots insider and he starts off with a biased opinion, like a bitter ex not being able to let go of the fact that Welker left New England. No wonder you agree with him (we all remember your strong feelings when Welker went there ).

 

I have said this before - Marvin and Reggie were masters in the art of getting down but then, they played outside more. Putting all the blame on Peyton is very short sighted without looking at each hit by the safety/LB on its own merit. Curran is talking like a fan in the stands waving his Patriots homer flag, that is what it felt like in this segment. Any Patriots homer could have a blog post like this, just wont have his clout to talk on TV, that is all.

 

One thing I could definitely say about Collie is he did not get down fast enough like a Marvin or Reggie. He took 2 giant steps before that Eagles safety gave him his first concussion in a helmet-to-helmet hit where Collie and Coleman lowered their heads. That was the start of things after that - never did recover completely.

 

If this was a bang-bang play, I would have attributed it more to Peyton, it was not. Swearinger lowered his shoulder and Welker did not get down fast enough though he could take a step easily and Welker being shorter, his head was the victim. Maybe Welker has slowed down a tad bit not allowing him to get down as quickly as he could in his prime??? Maybe the Pats did know that, not sure about that.

 

There have been bang-bang plays with Collie or Clark or Stokely in the past with Peyton throwing to them but this was not one of them, neither was Welker's first major concussion vs the Chiefs when he was running around for too long, much like Collie's first big concussion when he had a chance to take two steps before running into the Eagles safety Coleman. Like Southwest said, Curran is grasping for straws making it seem like Peyton needs to be vilified because the majority of his throws to the slot cause concussions. He is definitely a bitter ex.

First, I didn't say I agreed with Curran. I said his comments were strong even for a Patriots reporter.

 

I think he raised some valid points. As others have said on this thread, Manning is known to be a QB that has hung some of his receivers out to dry (Collie, Clark) and now Welker in literally one season and a preseason has three concussions and has missed games. This never happened in NE. Also, his point about his agents wanting to get every last penny is true. The Denver deal was not that much better then what the Pats offered (2 mil total) and actually may have been less had Welker hit some of the $6mil that was on the table with the Pats deal in terms of incentives. The fact is Welker became a star in NE, was loved by the fans and had his relationship with Brady. I get that he was not fond of Bill but it is looking like he made a mistake not staying in NE for many of the reasons Curran stated.

 

I agree about receivers being able to get down but when you go over the middle you are exposed and can't always see the defenders coming at you. That is why it is more on the QB to keep the passes low or off-shoulder even away from the contact.

[Shane Bond]

Talib is soft. You will see that again this year. Welker did not "injure" him. He just didn't want to play with a sore rib and knee.

Yet the game changed after his injury?.

How much can you contradict yourself

[sweetsurrender]

I think everything has caught up with Welker. His age, the number of hits, etc. There is a reason why no other teams besides the Broncos came to the table for him and even then there offer was not that much better than the Patriots. Once a receiver is over 30 all bets are off. It is a shame though that it is his head getting hurt as that can have ramifications long after he retires. Perhaps he would have better in NE just because of the familiarity with the O and Tom and not having to learn a new system. I remember him saying last year how he had to completely get used to Manning and where to be on certain plays and so that can sometimes expose you more to big hits because you are not in your comfort zone.

[amfootball]

Yet the game changed after his injury?.

How much can you contradict yourself

It did change. I didn't say he was not a vital player for the team but that he was soft. And that is true. The Welker hit should have never removed him from the game. He won't play with any discomfort. It is also why I am happy he is now with Denver and Pats got Revis. Denver can deal with his "injuries."

[ViriLudant]

TBH. Even though I admire & respect what the Patriots have accomplished ever since BB was hired as the HC in 2000, it does trouble me sometimes how NE is always placed at the top of the NFL pyramid despite not winning a SB since 2004. Yes, I know INDY hasn't won a Championship since 2006. My point is this: While NE is a premier football franchise & deservedly so, I wish the media would widen their scope of Lombardi front runner praise a little bit more & widen the net.

That's what I think Shane was getting at. This unwritten symbolic mist in the air that NE is perfect & never makes any mistakes almost as if the only way to win is to replicate the Patriot Way & formula. Their coach is deemed a genius, their owner is deemed a model blue print of impeccable ownership, & their QB walks on water like Jesus. I'm being sarcastic here BTW. Sometimes, journalists covering Boston football need to tone down the blinding hero worship considerably that's all I saying. Does Manning have overzealous hero worship in Denver too? Oh you bet your caboose he does.

If I were to boil it down to it's most elemental level, I would say this: Shane just got fed up with this reporter mentality that NE sets the agenda for everything that happens in the NFL & that Tommy Terrific & the Grey Hoodie never make a false move or mistake. That's why he posted the video: Frustration over this skewed NFL landscape love affair with NE. Shane just wanted to show that an elite QB like Brady is not a God; he too can make mistakes, throws a bad ball once in awhile, or turns the ball over occasionally. He is in fact--human with faults in his own game. JMO.

Uh, Vance has nothing to do with the Patriots, if I recall.

His post is about Shane's unwillingness to use facts and rational arguments at times, and when no one gets his "argument", he cries, "AD HOMINEM!" and claims that people just don't get his argument . It's a pattern with Shane.

And, what's amusing, is that his video has nothing to do with what we were discussing.

[amfootball]

TBH. Even though I admire & respect what the Patriots have accomplished ever since BB was hired as the HC in 2000, it does trouble me sometimes how NE is always placed at the top of the NFL pyramid despite not winning a SB since 2004. Yes, I know INDY hasn't won a Championship since 2006. My point is this: While NE is a premier football franchise & deservedly so, I wish the media would widen their scope of Lombardi front runner praise a little bit more & widen the net. 

 

That's what I think Shane was getting at. This unwritten symbolic mist in the air that NE is perfect & never makes any mistakes almost as if the only way to win is to replicate the Patriot Way & formula. Their coach is deemed a genius, their owner is deemed a model blue print of impeccable ownership, & their QB walks on water like Jesus. I'm being sarcastic here BTW. Sometimes, journalists covering Boston football need to tone down the blinding hero worship considerably that's all I saying. Does Manning have overzealous hero worship in Denver too? Oh you bet your caboose he does. 

 

If I were to boil it down to it's most elemental level, I would say this: Shane just got fed up with this reporter mentality that NE sets the agenda for everything that happens in the NFL & that Tommy Terrific & the Grey Hoodie never make a false move or mistake. That's why he posted the video: Frustration over this skewed NFL landscape love affair with NE. Shane just wanted to show that an elite QB like Brady is not a God; he too can make mistakes, throws a bad ball once in awhile, or turns the ball over occasionally. He is in fact--human with faults in his own game. JMO. 

Not at all SW. I think most are just fumed that the Patriots were right in parting ways with Welker when they did. Their two year deal was spot on for what he was going to bring to the table and Denver may actually over pay for him this year at $8 mil pending on how much he is even on the field and/or effective when he plays. And the Pats filled his production with Edelman.

 

I remember the threads on this forum this time last year. Saying how much the Pats would miss Welker's durability as if it was almost a skillset. Never materialized much to everyone's disappointment as Edelman played all 16 and Welker did not.

[crazycolt1]

Not at all SW. I think most are just fumed that the Patriots were right in parting ways with Welker when they did. Their two year deal was spot on for what he was going to bring to the table and Denver may actually over pay for him this year at $8 mil pending on how much he is even on the field and/or effective when he plays. And the Pats filled his production with Edelman.

 

I remember the threads on this forum this time last year. Saying how much the Pats would miss Welker's durability as if it was almost a skillset. Never materialized much to everyone's disappointment as Edelman played all 16 and Welker did not.

Just because a player got injured you can't correlate saying one was hurt while the other wasn't. I don't understand why all the hate for Welker by Pats fans. He was Brady's #1 receiver for a long time. He more than earned the money made in New England when he was there. So what if he decided to go to another team in the twilight of his playing days. Pats have this attitude that players should remain Pats players for life and when they don't they are traders. Sad part is I just read earlier that Brady never passes over the middle and has never had one of his receivers get hit hard because he is so accurate. That pile is getting deeper and deeper.

[amfootball]

Just because a player got injured you can't correlate saying one was hurt while the other wasn't. I don't understand why all the hate for Welker by Pats fans. He was Brady's #1 receiver for a long time. He more than earned the money made in New England when he was there. So what if he decided to go to another team in the twilight of his playing days. Pats have this attitude that players should remain Pats players for life and when they don't they are traders. Sad part is I just read earlier that Brady never passes over the middle and has never had one of his receivers get hit hard because he is so accurate. That pile is getting deeper and deeper.

No Pats fans hate Welker although I was very disappointed that he did not re-sign given the Pats made him two offers at two different times but if a player feels he needs to go because he dislikes the coach or can make more money both which were true for Welker than more power to him.

 

My issue is not with Welker but the media backlash that somehow the Pats were wrong for doing more to resign him. The Pats wanted Welker back. They offered him a contract for 2 years at 16 mil that he turned down so they franchised him paying 9.5 mil and then offered him another contract that he turned down to sign with the Broncos. It was his decision but the flak the Pats took was unwarranted like he was the only receiver Brady had ever turned into a star. And all Brady did last year was taken Edelman and make him one of the most productive slot receivers last year as he had done with Troy Brown to start his career and then Welker after. It was borderline ridiculous on just how much the Pats were going to miss Welker when in truth they did not miss at him at all and the main thing touted about him was his durability and now that is in question as the Pats figured it would given his age and wear and tear. They missed AH and Gronk more. And from everything I have been reading on the Broncos, they will not really miss Welker either should be miss time because they have Sanders who can fill the slot and replace his production and bring much more speed to the position.

[TKnight24]

It also doesn't help that Peyton floats passes into the middle of the field, where his receivers are the most defenseless. He's has that rep for years.

.......... Austin Collie

What a beautiful sight it would've been to see & hear "Luck to Collie"

[GoPats]

I don't understand why all the hate for Welker by Pats fans. He was Brady's #1 receiver for a long time. He more than earned the money made in New England when he was there. So what if he decided to go to another team in the twilight of his playing days. Pats have this attitude that players should remain Pats players for life and when they don't they are traders. Sad part is I just read earlier that Brady never passes over the middle and has never had one of his receivers get hit hard because he is so accurate. That pile is getting deeper and deeper.

 

This isn't a Patriots fan thing, it's a Boston fan thing. 

 

We have very old teams in all four of the major sports and tradition is strong. The Red Sox are of course an historic MLB franchise; the Bruins are among the Original Six; the Celtics have won more overall titles than any other NBA team; and the Patriots are an original AFL franchise.

 

When players leave, they leave, and there is usually not a lot of tears shed for them. 

[GoPats]

As for Welker...

 

I feel for the guy, having three concussions in 10 months is not good. For anyone. And as much as I like Wes as a player and appreciate his contributions in NE, he wasn't exactly a Mensa candidate to begin with. 

 

Wes was unbelievably durable in NE considering the beating he took. I can't say I remember a lot of head shots though. I'm not going to chalk it up to anything in particular because I don't know either way. A lot of the balls he caught in NE were those ones down around his knees, Brady used to go low to him all the time. There was even a Revis quote about it that I remember... something like, "You think you got him covered, but Tom throws it down by his shoe tops and the next thing you know he's got it wrapped up and they're moving the chains..." 

 

Wishing him good health first and foremost. Football is not worth what happened to the likes of Junior Seau and others. Good luck Wes. 

[Shane Bond]

Uh, Vance has nothing to do with the Patriots, if I recall.

His post is about Shane's unwillingness to use facts and rational arguments at times, and when no one gets his "argument", he cries, "AD HOMINEM!" and claims that people just don't get his argument . It's a pattern with Shane.

And, what's amusing, is that his video has nothing to do with what we were discussing.

I directly replied and explained it again but you ignored it and do what you do best. Garbage writing.

[Nadine]

Several posts were removed from this thread because they were either baiting or personal shot or quoted something that was removed.

Several warnings were issued.

 

If you do not like someone,put them on your ignore list.  If you feel you are being persecuted, consider your role in this.

 

But don't post comments were you are talking about other members or directly insulting them.

 

It's not what we want on the boards.  I get that some of you don't like each other,that's fine.  Just don't post about it.

[Vance]

Firstly, on the topic, point is any receivers who live in the middle are bound to have lot of hits ( Ex: the video shown ). QBs have nothing to do with it.

 

Secondly, since i joined this forum, first time i ever interacted with you was 2 days ago and you got burned with the topic.

 

Of course, you chase my posts and make personal comments ( bolded ) outside the topic.

 

LOL, the fact that you say I got 'burned' with yet another ridiculous statement which I couldn't even reply to because the thread was locked, is pretty sad.

 

Of course it was personal. You just said something personal to me, because your comment is directed AT ME. When you quote someone, it pretty much makes it personal.

 

Thirdly, as I've already stated, that video is a poor example for what you are trying to prove.

[lollygagger8]

I know there's no fail safe way to avoid concussions, but you would think with a helmet like that, there'd be a lot more potential to avoid them. 

 

[JerodMayo51]

TBH. Even though I admire & respect what the Patriots have accomplished ever since BB was hired as the HC in 2000, it does trouble me sometimes how NE is always placed at the top of the NFL pyramid despite not winning a SB since 2004. Yes, I know INDY hasn't won a Championship since 2006. My point is this: While NE is a premier football franchise & deservedly so, I wish the media would widen their scope of Lombardi front runner praise a little bit more & widen the net. 

 

That's what I think Shane was getting at. This unwritten symbolic mist in the air that NE is perfect & never makes any mistakes almost as if the only way to win is to replicate the Patriot Way & formula. Their coach is deemed a genius, their owner is deemed a model blue print of impeccable ownership, & their QB walks on water like Jesus. I'm being sarcastic here BTW. Sometimes, journalists covering Boston football need to tone down the blinding hero worship considerably that's all I saying. Does Manning have overzealous hero worship in Denver too? Oh you bet your caboose he does. 

 

If I were to boil it down to it's most elemental level, I would say this: Shane just got fed up with this reporter mentality that NE sets the agenda for everything that happens in the NFL & that Tommy Terrific & the Grey Hoodie never make a false move or mistake. That's why he posted the video: Frustration over this skewed NFL landscape love affair with NE. Shane just wanted to show that an elite QB like Brady is not a God; he too can make mistakes, throws a bad ball once in awhile, or turns the ball over occasionally. He is in fact--human with faults in his own game. JMO. 

 

 

While I agree to some extend, you have to keep in mind that there are many flavors of ice cream out here in the Boston media.  Just look at Mike Felger and Ron Borges, they might say 1 nice thing about the Patriots and Belichick per month if you're lucky.  

 

They're target audience are the people that love to hate on the team, so they feed into that mentality and fan base.  Then there are other writers that feed into the blind homerism that some fans have.

 

There are a few that are pretty fair and balanced, but ultimately you'll always have a little bias one way or the other when its from local media.

[JerodMayo51]

Yet the game changed after his injury?.

How much can you contradict yourself

 

He didn't contradict himself at all.

 

Talib had lots of boo boos while with the Patriots, and missed both AFC Championship Games.  His hip flexor was a recurring, nagging injury that he brought over from Tampa and has missed a lot of games in his career.

 

The type of character that Talib has makes him a very dangerous person to give a boat load of guaranteed money and a huge contract to.  He was playing like a mercenary for the Patriots and playing well (when he was on the field) but when the lights got the brightest in the biggest games, he was limping off the field with some nagging injury, one of which was received from a 180lb receiver in Welker.

 

I was not happy to see Talib leave to the Broncos because it left a big hole for us, but after landing Revis I couldn't be happier.  Revis is a pro and a class act, you know what you're going to get every Sunday from him.

 

 

Im a little scared about what they're going to do with Devin McCourty though... They need to extend Revis and McCourty.  They can probably use the Franchise Tag on McCourty and pay Revis, but they would need to cut Mankins or Wilfork to free up a lot of cap space to make that possible.

 

Mankins is nearing the end of his hall of fame career and is on the books for lots o money.. so they might look to trade or move on from him at some point as a salary cap decision.

 

You cant lose a young stud like McCourty for an aging stud like Mankins.

 

sorry i went a little off topic