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GoPats last won the day on January 31 2015

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  1. GoPats

    Gronk is retiring

    Ben Coates called and was wondering why you didn't bring him up in this post. Since you're ALWAYS so free with the history lessons, interesting how you didn't bring him up. Google failed you this time!
  2. I just like the way y'all selectively look at evidence when it comes to things like solicitation, harassing trainers at Tennessee, and using HGH that's delivered to your house in your wife's name.
  3. I'm sorry that you find it repulsive. I guess it comes down to one question: "Did Robert Kraft knowingly support a human trafficking organization/operation?" If you believe that the answer is "yes," you're making assumptions. If you believe that the answer is "no," you're making assumptions. But I get it... I'm a Patriots fan, so my opinion (no matter what facts I have to support it) is not as of much value around here as the opinions of other posters. Enjoy your Indianapolis Colts love-in, then. Just don't come here expecting any reality.
  4. Go back and actually read my posts. I didn't say a single word about getting off on a technicality. All I've said through this entire thread is that soliciting prostitution is not human trafficking.
  5. I don't know, but I bet you it's accurate.
  6. Then you don't read much. But don't let that stop you from being all Judge-y McJudge-rton. If you can put a lid on the sanctimonious, holier-than-thou stuff for about a minute, and realize that we're having more of a legal discussion than a discussion about morals and values, maybe this would be worthwhile. You're also stating options as fact. "It's not anywhere near the majority of them," you said. Really? You KNOW that? If you do, please share how, or a source, or whatever. Did you miss this yesterday? "But it appears Kraft was caught on camera getting services from two women who are not victims of human trafficking: the 45-year-old manager of the spa, Lei Wang, and 58-year-old spa employee Shen Mingbi, also believed to be an operator of the business — both licensed masseuses and Florida residents." https://nypost.com/2019/02/28/how-patriots-owner-robert-kraft-could-get-off-in-prostitution-case/ I've said it at least twice, and I don't know how else to say it, so I'll just repeat it I guess? If Kraft is guilty of the charges he's facing, then I've lost a lot of respect that I had for the man. I don't believe in condemning human beings for making mistakes like this one though. He didn't kill anyone, he didn't hurt anyone, he didn't steal from anyone. He took part in an illegal activity that also carries a heavy moral burden for a lot of people. This is a guy who has been very generous with a lot of charities and overall has done far more good than bad in this world. I have to wonder if you guys would even care if this was, say, the owner of the Browns, or Arthur Blank, or basically any other team!
  7. All good points... thanks man. I think we're far closer to agreeing on most of this than we are on disagreeing. Sometimes its just a matter of talking it through! I won't lie, it can sometimes be very frustrating to be a lifelong fan of the Patriots, despite their success on the field. Whether you're a player, coach, or game-day personnel, you've got to know that the spotlight is always on you and that any slip-up will be magnified. It infuriates me when they do stupid stuff like this.
  8. I can only speak for myself but I didn't feel that way at the time. I figured, for a guy like Irsay, having $30K on you is the equivalent to me carrying $50 around in my wallet. I am also sympathetic to what he went through. I had a problem of my own with painkillers following an injury and surgery about 18 years ago. I still don't take Percocet or Vicodin to this day... the strongest drug I'll put in my body is ibuprofen. @Flash7 and @Narcosys... I could agree with you guys on this, but then we'd all be wrong. Seriously though, and with all due respect... You guys can't really and truly believe this. Basically you're saying that every prostitute on the planet is a trafficked sex slave. Though I can't speak from experience, I would guess that is not accurate. Seems to me that plenty of them do what they do of their own free will and accord. If Kraft wanted to avoid any chance of this story coming out, all he had to do was go to Nevada instead of Florida. Which is why I think it's fair to surmise that he was oblivious to the status of the women he visited at the spa. If you want to look at it from a different, perhaps more objective point-of-view... I don't know how you could argue against this point: Why is soliciting a misdemeanor in most states, while any sort of human trafficking crimes would be felonies? It's pretty simple. Because one of those things, though subject to people's individual moral judgement, is far less of an offense and in and of itself doesn't hurt anyone else. The other is far more reprehensible and just downright EVIL. I'm not trying to minimize what he did. As I already stated, I've lost respect for the man. But let's not make him out to be some horrible monster because you guys don't like his football team. That's not fair at all.
  9. You basically made my point for me here by taking "solicitation" and turning it into "human trafficking." Also, Irsay's offense wasn't using drugs, it was operating a vehicle while he was severely impaired. Although I am apparently "willfully ignorant" in your own words... I'm simply trying to make a point in a civil manner. No, it is not "disingenuous" to assume that Kraft did not know the status of any of the women working at this spa. In fact, it's irresponsible to assume anything. Do you really think a guy like Kraft would risk his fortune, status, and - most importantly -- his reputation by knowingly soliciting sex slaves? I don't. Nobody is happy about it, or blowing it off. It's an embarrassment to the organization. My view on Kraft is certainly forever changed. The only thing I've taken exception to is how many people here have stretched the actual charges Kraft faces into something much worse. What if, after Irsay's arrest, someone had said, "Well he was found with almost $30K in cash, so he MUST be selling drugs to school children!" You guys would be pretty upset with something like that. If evidence comes to light that he knew these girls were victims of human trafficking then I'll be the first to further condemn his actions. But it's not fair to take a misdemeanor and turn it into a completely reprehensible act like many have done. For the love of all that is holy, NO VIDEO! OMG, lol... I concur Gramz. No one needs to see that!
  10. This is disappointing and, on a personal level, pretty disgusting, but I think a lot of people are making a bit of a leap here insinuating that Kraft would be aware of the status of any of these women. Soliciting, versus being involved in human trafficking, are two very, very different things. Plus if you're going to apply the moral compass to Kraft how can you ignore some of the things Irsay has done? Seriously? That's the ultimate case of hypocrisy if you want to go there, but whatever. I'm not happy. I don't condone it. But let's not make this more than it really is because, itself, it's bad enough.
  11. Just out of curiosity, are you guys talking about the Colts trading Brissett as a "sell high" kind of thing? Or is there some level of dissatisfaction with him? I don't think they would get as much in return as some of you are thinking, and I also feel like not having a capable backup in this league is extremely risky.
  12. I don't know if the Patriots will make a strong effort to re-sign him or not, but I can almost guarantee you they won't use the tag on him. I don't think that was ever an option. (At least not a realistic one.) Hard to say what Flowers would be somewhere else. The Patriots get a lot of their pass rush from scheme, rather than just lining guys up and asking them to win one-on-one battles. (Though of all their D-linemen, Flowers has been one of the only guys who can do that regularly.) He's made some big plays at times too, which is another trait that guys tend to carry from one team to another. I don't want to see him go, but I've gotten used to it over the years, lol...
  13. Was Flacco really an upgrade though? Aside from one outstanding postseason run, he hasn't done a whole lot in the league.
  14. I feel like the timing of Hunt's release by KC, relative to where they were in the 2018 season, was a major factor to them not beating the Patriots in the AFCCG. I know Williams was filling in admirably, but it seems like Hunt makes a big play in every game against NE and that they really missed him from a match-up perspective. That said, it feels like it's too soon to sign this guy. I think I would have let the legal situation play out a bit first. Or maybe wait until at least a little of the backlash subsides.
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