DeflateGate: Brady suspension expected (mega merge / updated)

[Flash7]

Uhh.. What if the Patriots lose all 4 of those games, plus a couple with Brady and they don't make the playoffs and the Colts do. That helps the Colts out a lot in my opinion. One less hurdle to jump during the playoffs.

It would be great if the Patriots lose all 4 games. That would benefit the Colts, sure.

 

But it would provide a W for other competitors in the AFC and not necessarily the Colts. We would benefit indirectly, and I personally see the Steelers as a big up-and-coming team that can challenge the Colts. I certainly don't want them to directly benefit by playing a Brady-less Pats team.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Let's talk about this for a second.

 

You're saying the NFL was less concerned about the integrity of the game than it was in catching the Patriots? If it's all about the integrity of the game, then why is it ok with any of you that the NFL allowed the entire first half of the AFC Championship Game to be played with the Patriots having an unfair advantage? 

 

Just trying to follow the logic here...

 

Its not okay ..

 

 

A referee had confirmed before the game that the balls were fully inflated — and the report found that sometime after that, but before kickoff, Patriots locker room attendant Jim McNally took the balls into the bathroom and likely released air from them, perhaps acting on quarterback Tom Brady's orders.

 

In a culture where people believe winning is more important than integrity the opportunities will always be there , The penalties need to be severe enough to make this type of behavior unimaginable .

[PuntersArePeopleToo]

Report: “Everything” on the table regarding Tom Brady punishment

Posted by Darin Gantt on May 7, 2015, 1:30 PM EDT

Getty Images

At the moment, the idea that the NFL is targeting poor Tom Brady in the DeflateGate investigation seems concentrated to a group of Patriots fans and/or Tom’s dad.

But it’s clear that the league is taking this one seriously.

As Florio pointed out this morning, a suspension of the Patriots quarterback seems unavoidable, as unlikely as that might seem on its face.

At the very least, it is being considered at the league level.

According to Armando Salguero of the Miami Herald, a league source familiar with the disciplinary process said we shouldn’t dismiss the possibility that Brady might go away for a period of time.

“Everything is being studied, everything is being considered,” the source said (emphasis Armando’s, not mine).

The league has gone hard on the crime-and-punishment from since being embarrassed by the Ray Rice debacle, as players such as Greg Hardy can attest.

But to suspend the starting quarterback of the defending Super Bowl champions (who kick off the season on national television) would be a huge move.

Of course, conspiring to break the rules of the game, and not cooperating with an investigation would be considered a huge lapse as well.

I really hope that they do. They need to be shown what does happen to cheat

[amfootball]

Am.. it might be a poorly  written document , I didn't read it. Bottom line is it happened. You can't have equipment guys sneaking footballs into bathroom and deflating them. He could have taken a different path on this in that January presser. He chose the path he took. He is now caught up in an obvious lie. 

 

Your take seems to be on how stupid the long investigation was. Fine call it stupid.. doesn't really change anything. Brady , the NE Pat team and fans now need to buck up and take whatever punishment is handed out. Maybe it will be minimal ? Maybe it will be excessive. If it is , I would say "geezzz" , I guess you should have told the truth. But there's nothing wrong with appealing and getting a 4 game suspension down to 1 or 2. It's all part of the process and I would have no problem.

 

What I d have problem with is NE fans , Kraft and so far Bray's attorney (that;s his job so not so much here) calling the investigation unfair , biased .. bla bla bla. 

 

 

God... you all need to buck up and be upset with the unnecessary cheating and subsequent whining rather than the "nature " or "quality" of the report.

Just read the footnotes ...

 

The report was completely biased. No mention of how Anderson was told before the game by Grison about the balls and yet somehow in 19 years of working he lost track of the balls? Yet the report praises him as being this great ref, blah, blah. The league slant is unbelievable in this. It is fine to slam the Pats, I get that but not one mention of any mishandling by the refs? Anderson did not even write down his gauge readings but was going from memory and thinks he used the same gauge for all the balls. Good heavens ... and then they could not gauge all the Colts balls because they ran out of time??

 

How about a comment from the ref that did the Jets game and the balls being inflated to 16 psi? Not one word from him on how/why that happened?

 

BTW, they said the Bill's explanation of the psi being raised from ball prep was in fact proven to be true but that the pressure returns back to normal after 30 minutes.

[PeterBowman]

I really hope that they do. They need to be shown what does happen to cheat

not just cheaters..........multipe time offenders

[csmopar]

I believe this is what AM may have been talking about in terms of how notifying the before hand may have gone a long way in avoiding this whole thing. "As one league source with no connection to the present controversy explained it to PFT in January, past Commissioners like Paul Tagliabue would have informed the Patriots of the situation," Florio wrote, adding that Tagliabue would have "warned them that the NFL is paying attention, that the league reserves the right to check the air pressure in the footballs during the game, and that any funny business would be met with a decidedly unfunny reaction from the league office."

 

It doesn't in any way make what the Patriots did ok...but people tend to behave when they know they are being watched. Plus...since it is ALL about the integrity of the game...right? It seems the NFL did not do all they could to make sure everyone was on a level playing field. 

 

 

they were notified...by letter in 2004......

[amfootball]

they were notified...by letter in 2004......

Read the report people....please. That game was noted in the report and there was no negligence found by McNally at all. Wells said he did not consider that incident relevant to this report but only as background. Which again begs, why include it at all if it is not relevant??

[ReMeDy]

I am hearing that Brady may be suspended for 2 or 4 games. This punishes NE and Brady, but we don't necessarily benefit from this. 

 

Not necessarily. If the Pats go 0-4 in Brady's absence, it will be a tall order for them to make the playoffs. Even if they do, it's not unusual to think they at least won't get a playoff bye, or lose home-field advantage. If someone can knock the Pats out in the wildcard round, or if the Pats fail to qualify for the playoffs, that's a definite win for us.

[csmopar]

Read the report people....please. That game was noted in the report and there was no negligence found by McNally at all. Wells said he did not consider that incident relevant to this report but only as background. Which again begs, why include it at all if it is not relevant??

 

 

I have.....and I've provided links to show it.  Just because you are in DENIAL does not mean no one else has read the report......Geez, they seriously need to test the water in Boston....

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Come on, guys! This isn't ISIS!

 

Of course not the Patriots are from the Darkside with 1 redeeming quality they got cookies ..

[Buck Showalter]

Read the report people....please. That game was noted in the report and there was no negligence found by McNally at all. Wells said he did not consider that incident relevant to this report but only as background. Which again begs, why include it at all if it is not relevant??

HEY GUYS CAUSE WE NEED CONSTANT REMINDERS OF THE RULES, YOU CAN'T BRING THAT UP...

BWAHAHAHAHA

[amfootball]

So you're more upset that league tried to catch the Pats cheating than that the Pats cheated to begin with?

 

How about this? Don't cheat and none of this ever happens?

Both. But more the former because your GM alerted the officials beforehand and somehow Walt Anderson lost track of the game balls. First time in 19 years that has happened for him apparently. And after losing track, he did not gauge them before kick-off allowing the Pats to play with potentially underinflated footballs for an entire half. If this is truly about the integrity of the game then you should also be just as upset. This whole thing, the investigation, the 100 days, could have been avoided if they actually did something with Grigson's complaint and the game could have been played on the up and up.

[lollygagger8]

 

BTW, they said the Bill's explanation of the psi being raised from ball prep was in fact proven to be true but that the pressure returns back to normal after 30 minutes.

[lollygagger8]

From Reddit: This is like the guy who gets mad at the police when the bait car stops running.

hahhahahaha!! 

[csmopar]

HEY GUYS CAUSE WE NEED CONSTANT REMINDERS OF THE RULES, YOU CAN'T BRING THAT UP...

BWAHAHAHAHA

I find it down right comical she wants us to play by her arbitrary rules and not bring up prior incidents when her own team cant even follow the rules.

 

[Buck Showalter]

Both. But more the former because your GM alerted the officials beforehand and somehow Walt Anderson lost track of the game balls. First time in 19 years that has happened for him apparently. And after losing track, he did not gauge them before kick-off allowing the Pats to play with potentially underinflated footballs for an entire half. If this is truly about the integrity of the game then you should also be just as upset. This whole thing, the investigation, the 100 days, could have been avoided if they actually did something with Grigson's complaint and the game could have been played on the up and up.

yeah heaven forbid a referee expect teams to be on the up & up...

[amfootball]

yeah heaven forbid a referee expect teams to be on the up & up...

He was told by YOUR GM.

[jvan1973]

Both. But more the former because your GM alerted the officials beforehand and somehow Walt Anderson lost track of the game balls. First time in 19 years that has happened for him apparently. And after losing track, he did not gauge them before kick-off allowing the Pats to play with potentially underinflated footballs for an entire half. If this is truly about the integrity of the game then you should also be just as upset. This whole thing, the investigation, the 100 days, could have been avoided if they actually did something with Grigson's complaint and the game could have been played on the up and up.

Or perhaps the pats could stop breaking the rules

[csmopar]

He was told by YOUR GM.

 

AND YOUR TEAM WAS TOLD BY THE NFL NOT TO ALTER OR MESS WITH GAME BALLS DATING BACK TO 2004....

 

see I can do it too...

[pgt_rob]

Not necessarily. If the Pats go 0-4 in Brady's absence, it will be a tall order for them to make the playoffs. Even if they do, it's not unusual to think they at least won't get a playoff bye, or lose home-field advantage. If someone can knock the Pats out in the wildcard round, or if the Pats fail to qualify for the playoffs, that's a definite win for us.

 

That would be hilarious if happened. Pats lose those games without Brady, miss playoffs, and the Colts go to win the Superbowl. How's that for Patriots and Colts forever linked up?

[dw49]

Just read the footnotes ...

 

The report was completely biased. No mention of how Anderson was told before the game by Grison about the balls and yet somehow in 19 years of working he lost track of the balls? Yet the report praises him as being this great ref, blah, blah. The league slant is unbelievable in this. It is fine to slam the Pats, I get that but not one mention of any mishandling by the refs? Anderson did not even write down his gauge readings but was going from memory and thinks he used the same gauge for all the balls. Good heavens ... and then they could not gauge all the Colts balls because they ran out of time??

 

How about a comment from the ref that did the Jets game and the balls being inflated to 16 psi? Not one word from him on how/why that happened?

 

BTW, they said the Bill's explanation of the psi being raised from ball prep was in fact proven to be true but that the pressure returns back to normal after 30 minutes.

 

 

You have me about to pull my hair out. Brady was involved. No if's ands and what's about it. It has to be the water there. Kraft is saying just about what you are ." It doesn't matter if NE cheated. What matters is the nature and perceived "slant" (according to NE people) of the investigation. "  You had equipment people sneak the balls into a pee place and deflate them. Before you were all saying it couldn't be done in 70 seconds .. bla bla bla. 

 

He did it. He did it. No doubt about it in a reasonable person's mind. All the stuff you bring up doesn't change the fact that he did it. The fact that they played the first half with deflated footballs (you say shame on the NFL) ... doesn't change the fact that Brady cheated. This footnote and that footnote ad BB's science doesn't change it. 

[Superman]

I believe this is what AM may have been talking about in terms of how notifying the before hand may have gone a long way in avoiding this whole thing. "As one league source with no connection to the present controversy explained it to PFT in January, past Commissioners like Paul Tagliabue would have informed the Patriots of the situation," Florio wrote, adding that Tagliabue would have "warned them that the NFL is paying attention, that the league reserves the right to check the air pressure in the footballs during the game, and that any funny business would be met with a decidedly unfunny reaction from the league office."

 

It doesn't in any way make what the Patriots did ok...but people tend to behave when they know they are being watched. Plus...since it is ALL about the integrity of the game...right? It seems the NFL did not do all they could to make sure everyone was on a level playing field. 

 

I love how the Tagliabue administration is so romanticized all the time.

 

The last time the Pats were accused of doing something wrong, the NFL sent out a memo to all teams. The Pats still broke the rules and were eventually punished for it. That was Goodell. 

[amfootball]

You have me about to pull my hair out. Brady was involved. No if's ands and what's about it. It has to be the water there. Kraft is saying just about what you are ." It doesn't matter if NE cheated. What matters is the nature and perceived "slant" (according to NE people) of the investigation. "  You had equipment people sneak the balls into a pee place and deflate them. Before you were all saying it couldn't be done in 70 seconds .. bla bla bla. 

 

He did it. He did it. No doubt about it in a reasonable person's mind. All the stuff you bring up doesn't change the fact that he did it. The fact that they played the first half with deflated footballs (you say shame on the NFL) ... doesn't change the fact that Brady cheated. This footnote and that footnote ad BB's science doesn't change it. 

 

 I am not denying the Pats at all. Never have been. Please don't pull your hair out.

[amfootball]

I love how the Tagliabue administration is so romanticized all the time.

 

The last time the Pats were accused of doing something wrong, the NFL sent out a memo to all teams. The Pats still broke the rules and were eventually punished for it. That was Goodell. 

And Goodell also burned the tapes too.

[OffensivelyPC]

Read the report people....please. That game was noted in the report and there was no negligence found by McNally at all. Wells said he did not consider that incident relevant to this report but only as background. Which again begs, why include it at all if it is not relevant??

It just doesn't form any basis for the current report, but it is, however relevant.  It adds context to the whoever will rule on Tom Brady's discipline on two levels.  First, one question that many people, including the Commissioner, will rightly ask is, well if he's done it before, for how long has it been going on?  Possibly as far back as 2004 according to the report.

 

 While that takes an assumption, one in which I wouldn't fault the NFL if it disregarded, it does however, play a more important role in Tom's credibility.  You mean to tell me that McNally has been in charge of handling and preparing Tom Brady's footballs for at least the past 10 years, and Tom Brady didn't know him?  No one, not even you can believe that.

[Superman]

 

The report said there's a temporary increase in PSI that dissipates within 15-30 minutes. The footballs were initially tested by the refs an hour and 45 minutes after the Pats turned them in, IIRC. 

 

Long and short, entirely irrelevant.

[amfootball]

It just doesn't form any basis for the current report, but it is, however relevant.  It adds context to the whoever will rule on Tom Brady's discipline on two levels.  First, one question that many people, including the Commissioner, will rightly ask is, well if he's done it before, for how long has it been going on?  Possibly as far back as 2004 according to the report.

 

 While that takes an assumption, one in which I wouldn't fault the NFL if it disregarded, it does however, play a more important role in Tom's credibility.  You mean to tell me that McNally has been in charge of handling and preparing Tom Brady's footballs for at least the past 10 years, and Tom Brady didn't know him?  No one, not even you can believe that.

Yes, Brady needs to speak and soon. Apparently a lot of his testimony was left out. He needs to say exactly how he characterized his relationship with McNally.

[Superman]

And Goodell also burned the tapes too.

 

[Restored]

I believe this is what AM may have been talking about in terms of how notifying the before hand may have gone a long way in avoiding this whole thing. "As one league source with no connection to the present controversy explained it to PFT in January, past Commissioners like Paul Tagliabue would have informed the Patriots of the situation," Florio wrote, adding that Tagliabue would have "warned them that the NFL is paying attention, that the league reserves the right to check the air pressure in the footballs during the game, and that any funny business would be met with a decidedly unfunny reaction from the league office."

 

It doesn't in any way make what the Patriots did ok...but people tend to behave when they know they are being watched. Plus...since it is ALL about the integrity of the game...right? It seems the NFL did not do all they could to make sure everyone was on a level playing field. 

Here's the thing. The Patriots/Brady shouldn't have to all of a sudden obey the rules because they are being watched. Yeah the NFL could've stepped in right that second and checked the balls and changed them out but that's really not the issue here. It's the fact that the violation was already committed.

 

Both. But more the former because your GM alerted the officials beforehand and somehow Walt Anderson lost track of the game balls. First time in 19 years that has happened for him apparently. And after losing track, he did not gauge them before kick-off allowing the Pats to play with potentially underinflated footballs for an entire half. If this is truly about the integrity of the game then you should also be just as upset. This whole thing, the investigation, the 100 days, could have been avoided if they actually did something with Grigson's complaint and the game could have been played on the up and up.

 

I think you are missing the point AM. That game itself wasn't exactly the issue. It was the cover-up. It was the probability that it wasnt just the Colts who got affected by this.  It was also the perception that Brady was ducking questions (in particular during his Bob Costas interview before the Super Bowl). There's no need to view this with tunnel vision.

[Gramz]

He was told by YOUR GM.

You never answered my earlier question.

Do you believe Brady is innocent..???   One simple question.

[csmopar]

Just read the footnotes ...

The report was completely biased.

By your own words you have not read the report.....footnotes ARE NOT the report.

Are you flipping serious? You want to tell others to read the report and you've not even done it yourself, just read the Foo notes and determined that the report was bias.......

[OffensivelyPC]

Both. But more the former because your GM alerted the officials beforehand and somehow Walt Anderson lost track of the game balls. First time in 19 years that has happened for him apparently. And after losing track, he did not gauge them before kick-off allowing the Pats to play with potentially underinflated footballs for an entire half. If this is truly about the integrity of the game then you should also be just as upset. This whole thing, the investigation, the 100 days, could have been avoided if they actually did something with Grigson's complaint and the game could have been played on the up and up.

The football was intercepted in the second quarter with 9 minutes or so left and subsequently the underinflation was discovered.  Stop making it like the NFL knew the footballs were underinflated for the entire half.  You're at best assuming facts for which there is no support and at worse, making it up completely.  They found out sometime after the interception and before the end of the first half, a period of time in which there was only one Patriots possession.

[Superman]

Both. But more the former because your GM alerted the officials beforehand and somehow Walt Anderson lost track of the game balls. First time in 19 years that has happened for him apparently. And after losing track, he did not gauge them before kick-off allowing the Pats to play with potentially underinflated footballs for an entire half. If this is truly about the integrity of the game then you should also be just as upset. This whole thing, the investigation, the 100 days, could have been avoided if they actually did something with Grigson's complaint and the game could have been played on the up and up.

 

This has probably been going on since before the 2014 season, based on the text messages. One half of a game to determine for sure that the Pats were cheating is absolutely in the best interests of the game and its integrity. 

 

To the bolded, I'm not upset by that at all. There's nothing wrong with it. It was the best way to determine whether anything was going on or not, and because they did it that way, not only are the Pats caught red-handed, but more importantly, the league will probably adjust game day protocols to keep this from happening anymore. To inform the Pats before the game would have been penny-wise and pound-foolish.

[amfootball]

The football was intercepted in the second quarter with 9 minutes or so left and subsequently the underinflation was discovered.  Stop making it like the NFL knew the footballs were underinflated for the entire half.  You're at best assuming facts for which there is no support and at worse, making it up completely.  They found out sometime after the interception and before the end of the first half, a period of time in which there was only one Patriots possession.

It is in the report that Grigson notified them before the game. He also said this at the combine.

[Lawrence Owen]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/06/more-probable-than-not-carries-important-legal-meaning/

 

Here is an answer to what "more probable than not" means to the nfl.  This entire wordage was made by the NFL to show cause enough to carry out strict punishment without a 'smoking gun'.

[amfootball]

This has probably been going on since before the 2014 season, based on the text messages. One half of a game to determine for sure that the Pats were cheating is absolutely in the best interests of the game and its integrity. 

 

To the bolded, I'm not upset by that at all. There's nothing wrong with it. It was the best way to determine whether anything was going on or not, and because they did it that way, not only are the Pats caught red-handed, but more importantly, the league will probably adjust game day protocols to keep this from happening anymore. To inform the Pats before the game would have been penny-wise and pound-foolish.

You are missing this. Gauge the balls before kick-off then to ensure the game is played with proper footballs. Why wait until half time especially when Walt lost track of the balls?

[csmopar]

It is in the report that Grigson notified them before the game. He also said this at the combine.

 

 

The report by which you actually have not read, just the footnotes. I'm on page 212... you read the foot notes so you know it all dont you

 

[amfootball]

The report by which you actually have not read, just the footnotes. I'm on page 212... you read the foot notes so you know it all dont you

 

I have read the entire thing. I was telling DW to read just the footnotes as they are the most damning part of the report in terms of the holes with the entire investigation.

[OffensivelyPC]

I love how the Tagliabue administration is so romanticized all the time.

 

The last time the Pats were accused of doing something wrong, the NFL sent out a memo to all teams. The Pats still broke the rules and were eventually punished for it. That was Goodell. 

It's like everyone forgets that he was commissioner during the period of time in which the NFL committed infractions that would eventually form the basis for a $1 Billion class action lawsuit related to head trauma.  Goodell might not be popular, but you don't see him going around saying repeated hits to the head while playing football doesn't cause brain damage.

[amfootball]

Poor Ed Reed. Terrible day to announce your retirement .