Luck favors bringing Jonathan Martin to Indy

[HarassedOffTheSite]

I'd rather have Incognito than Martin

 

Telling.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

can he play guard?

 

Exactly! Would be something easy to find out.

[Patagonia Chris]

Telling.

 

how so?

[Gavin]

Just no

[Dustin]

Might be a decent 3rd tackle. Don't know if he could play guard but having a 2nd round pick as a backup couldn't hurt. 

[pacolts56]

I agree with you about Incognito. The other two have done nothing wrong. If they can play, the circus will go away. Why bring one or both of them in if the staff thinks they can help? Because it is the right thing to do.

I don't trust the media to back off....it's their job not to back off and in these kinds of high profile situations I'd trust them even less.

 

Opinions vary on all three of them for all kinds of reasons....but I just wouldn't sign Martin or Incognito, or draft Sam. There are much better and very legitimate alternatives to upgrading the positions these guys play. JMO

[Iancolts]

Why not sign both incognito and Martin to low level contracts

[NewColtsFan]

Personally, I don't want Martin in Indy.  His actions have shown he doesn't have much character and he has no trouble throwing a teammate under the bus.  He doesn't seem like a very mature individual, and above all, his play in Miami wasn't that great

 

wth?!?     

[NewColtsFan]

I agree with you on that, but keep in mind he also dished it out.  He wasn't innocent in the big scandal that came up from that

 

He "dished it out" as a defensive mechanism...   to be one of the boys and hopefully have the other guys leave him alone.

 

He didn't do it because he liked to or wanted to.    I'm guessing you haven't been following this very closely.

 

This behavior was as far from JM's universe as possible.    He did it because he thought he had to,  not because he wanted to.

[NewColtsFan]

I'd rather have Incognito than Martin

 

I'm truly sorry you feel that way.

 

I don't care that you don't want Martin.

 

But Incognito?    Really??

[Patagonia Chris]

I'm truly sorry you feel that way.

 

I don't care that you don't want Martin.

 

But Incognito?    Really??

 

Did I say I wanted either of them? No. I was simply stating that Martin is the last player I'd like to see the Colts add.

[Track Guy]

I wouldn't mind picking up Martin cheap after the Dolphins let him go. He's not going to start over Costanzo or Cherilus but we do have depth problems at O-line. I'm more worried about center though.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

how so?

 

Well, let's see...

 

One began displaying the behavioral problems that would follow him throughout his career when he arrived at College. During his second game, he was accused of spitting on a player. Two weeks later, he was ejected for picking a fight in a blowout loss. In the second-to-last game of the season he was flagged for a 15-yard personal foul penalty late in the game that largely contributed to his team's loss. He got in a fight during practice and was suspended indefinitely by his head coach. Who then sent him to anger management treatment.He was then involved in another fight and was charged with three counts of assault. He was suspended indefinitely for repeated violations of his College team's rules. And then he got into another fight in the locker room. He was forced to transfer to another school, only to be dismissed from that team a week later. By the grace of God he was drafted and voted (by fellow NFL players) the dirtiest player in the league. He harassed a female volunteer at a celebrity golf tournament. He rubbed her privates with a golf club, pressed his johnson against her behind and when he was immediately rebuffed he threw a glass of water in her face. Forcing other Dolphins players to intervene and apologize for his behavior....behavior that led to an out of court settlement by turd boy. Prior to joining the hapless Dolphins, in four years with the Rams he drew 38 penalties, including seven unnecessary roughness calls (more than any other player during that span). Fined 5 times for $75,000 and warned by the league that he faced suspension if he did not change his on the field behavior.

 

The other was one of two freshman starters on a College offensive line that allowed a conference low seven sacks, enabling Andrew Luck to lead that conference in passing efficiency. And on the ground, his RB rushed for a school-record 1,871 yards and 28 touchdowns. Gaining (again as a freshman) honorable mention All-Pac 10 and a second team freshman All-American honors. His sophomore year, was named a first team All-American as a member of an offensive line that allowed six sacks and enabled Andrew Luck to again lead the Pac-10 in passing efficiency. As a junior, he was again an All-American. Drafted by a crap franchise, coached by a halfwit offensive line coach (who has since been fired) and placed in a position he did not play in college while enduring criminal behavior by his "teammates", his performance magically just fell off.

 

I think the overwhelming majority of Colts fans would choose the latter and run the former clean out of town.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

I wouldn't mind picking up Martin cheap after the Dolphins let him go. He's not going to start over Costanzo

 

I'd be willing to bet you cash money that given a full off-season & pre-season, he would be the eventual replacement once Castanzo's contract ran out....if not downright supplanting him before then.

[Iancolts]

I don't know if Martin can replace costinzo maybe replace out guards but not the LT

[21isSuperman]

He "dished it out" as a defensive mechanism...   to be one of the boys and hopefully have the other guys leave him alone.

 

He didn't do it because he liked to or wanted to.    I'm guessing you haven't been following this very closely.

 

This behavior was as far from JM's universe as possible.    He did it because he thought he had to,  not because he wanted to.

http://thebiglead.com/2014/02/03/here-are-over-1000-text-messages-that-richie-incognito-and-jonathan-martin-allegedly-exchanged/

There are instances where he goes out of his way to text Incognito.  It doesn't appear to be a situation where he responds because he has to.  Not only does he respond, but he asks questions to start conversations and even responds in the same crude manner Incognito was using.  To me, that doesn't show that he did he because he had to.  If he felt like he had to respond, I would think he would simply give one word answers or something very minimal.  He wouldn't go out of his way to start conversations and say the things he did.  It looked like he wanted to take part in whatever kind of dynamic they had going on

 

 

 

wth?!?     

Problem?

[Patagonia Chris]

Well, let's see...

 

One began displaying the behavioral problems that would follow him throughout his career when he arrived at College. During his second game, he was accused of spitting on a player. Two weeks later, he was ejected for picking a fight in a blowout loss. In the second-to-last game of the season he was flagged for a 15-yard personal foul penalty late in the game that largely contributed to his team's loss. He got in a fight during practice and was suspended indefinitely by his head coach. Who then sent him to anger management treatment.He was then involved in another fight and was charged with three counts of assault. He was suspended indefinitely for repeated violations of his College team's rules. And then he got into another fight in the locker room. He was forced to transfer to another school, only to be dismissed from that team a week later. By the grace of God he was drafted and voted (by fellow NFL players) the dirtiest player in the league. He harassed a female volunteer at a celebrity golf tournament. He rubbed her privates with a golf club, pressed his johnson against her behind and when he was immediately rebuffed he threw a glass of water in her face. Forcing other Dolphins players to intervene and apologize for his behavior....behavior that led to an out of court settlement by turd boy. Prior to joining the hapless Dolphins, in four years with the Rams he drew 38 penalties, including seven unnecessary roughness calls (more than any other player during that span). Fined 5 times for $75,000 and warned by the league that he faced suspension if he did not change his on the field behavior.

 

The other was one of two freshman starters on a College offensive line that allowed a conference low seven sacks, enabling Andrew Luck to lead that conference in passing efficiency. And on the ground, his RB rushed for a school-record 1,871 yards and 28 touchdowns. Gaining (again as a freshman) honorable mention All-Pac 10 and a second team freshman All-American honors. His sophomore year, was named a first team All-American as a member of an offensive line that allowed six sacks and enabled Andrew Luck to again lead the Pac-10 in passing efficiency. As a junior, he was again an All-American. Drafted by a crap franchise, coached by a halfwit offensive line coach (who has since been fired) and placed in a position he did not play in college while enduring criminal behavior by his "teammates", his performance magically just fell off.

 

I think the overwhelming majority of Colts fans would choose the latter and run the former clean out of town.

 

I know what Incognito's past is, but you can't blame all of Martin's struggles on Incognito. He isn't the first NFL player to be hazed nor will be the last. Don't you find it funny that hardly any of the Dolphin's players have come to Martin's defense? Maybe you should go read the official report. At the end of the day, I don't think Martin is cut out for the NFL and that's ok. I think he will have a productive life in whatever else he tries to do. There were more people involved then just Incognito so let's not act like he's the worst human being in the NFL. I'm not supporting anything that he did but who are to judge him, you weren't in the locker room and neither was anyone else on here. So let's not be the one to judge. Colts fans didn't chase Ed Johnson, Christian Peter, Eric Foster or Dominic Rhodes out of town. Check the facts before you try and step on a pedestal.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

I know what Incognito's past is…

 

Even more telling.

 

… but you can't blame all of Martin's struggles on Incognito.

 

I clearly did not.

 

He isn't the first NFL player to be hazed…

 

Nobody said or implied he was. I said he wasn’t “hazed”.

 

Don't you find it funny that hardly any of the Dolphin's players have come to Martin's defense?

 

No.

 

Maybe you should go read the official report.

 

I did.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

There were more people involved then just Incognito…

 

I know. That’s what I wrote.

 

…so let’s not act like he is the worst human being in the NFL.

 

His fellow NFL players think he is.

 

…who are to judge him…

 

I’m Brian with a brain. I can’t judge Incognito but you can judge Martin? Hahaha

 

….. you weren't in the locker room…

 

Neither were you.

 

So let's not be the one to judge.

 

Oh, I’ll judge other people's behavior and character all day long.

 

Check the facts before you try and step on a pedestal.

 

I did. I typed them up above this post.

 

;)

[Narcosys]

I dont get what red flag he is talking about.  red flag on the colts, on martin?  Honestly we dont need him though.  No need to take a tackle when we have good ones already.

[Track Guy]

I'd be willing to bet you cash money that given a full off-season & pre-season, he would be the eventual replacement once Castanzo's contract ran out....if not downright supplanting him before then.

 

If he's really that good we should definitely go after him. If he was going to supplant someone for 2014 I would think the most likely way would be he moves to G and beats out Thornton. 

[shecolt]

If the Colts think that Martin is a good fit, I have no problem with him being on the team.

 

And, I'm not worried about any media circus as I seem to remember that being one of the objections on this site to Manti Te'o after the social media hoax (or whatever it was called).

 

Yet, I can't remember reading much about that this year when he played for the Chargers as he seemed to blend in well and just go about business

 

And, I have no reason to think that Martin wouldn't do the same.

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

Did I say I wanted either of them? No. I was simply stating that Martin is the last player I'd like to see the Colts add.

 

I understand.

 

And I'm still sorry you feel that way......

 

But, to each their own....

[NewColtsFan]

http://thebiglead.com/2014/02/03/here-are-over-1000-text-messages-that-richie-incognito-and-jonathan-martin-allegedly-exchanged/

There are instances where he goes out of his way to text Incognito.  It doesn't appear to be a situation where he responds because he has to.  Not only does he respond, but he asks questions to start conversations and even responds in the same crude manner Incognito was using.  To me, that doesn't show that he did he because he had to.  If he felt like he had to respond, I would think he would simply give one word answers or something very minimal.  He wouldn't go out of his way to start conversations and say the things he did.  It looked like he wanted to take part in whatever kind of dynamic they had going on

 

 

 

Problem?

 

I'm simply mystified with how you see this event.

 

But, perhaps it's like art....   and we all see the same thing differently.

[Gavin]

I'd be willing to bet you cash money that given a full off-season & pre-season, he would be the eventual replacement once Castanzo's contract ran out....if not downright supplanting him before then.

He may be brought in as a back up RT and in a pinch back up LT but replacing Castonzo? Wont happen, Have you watched Martins feet? Not a LT

[BLUEx40]

I'd rather have Incognito than Martin

no thank you I don't think that entire o-line should play again none of them know how to treat any one like a teammate

[BLUEx40]

If the Colts think that Martin is a good fit, I have no problem with him being on the team.

 

And, I'm not worried about any media circus as I seem to remember that being one of the objections on this site to Manti Te'o after the social media hoax (or whatever it was called).

 

Yet, I can't remember reading much about that this year when he played for the Chargers as he seemed to blend in well and just go about business

 

And, I have no reason to think that Martin wouldn't do the same.

I feel like those are two totally different situations

[southwest1]

I will say that INDY would be a great environment for Martin to get his NFL feet back firmly underneath him. Honestly, I didn't watch too many Miami Dolphins games this year so I have no idea how good Martin is. I'm not opposed to bring him into camp, but don't give up anything significant for him. 

 

I'm not making a charity case here, but if he gets no substantial interest from other NFL squads, let's see what he can do at guard like Jvan said. There is no harm in seeing what Martin's motor & shedding blocks looks like to me. Just kick the tires & see what his ceiling is or his floor if nothing else. 

[21isSuperman]

I'm simply mystified with how you see this event.

But, perhaps it's like art.... and we all see the same thing differently.

Well said. I agree, we see things differently. I just think Jon Martin is being given a free pass by some when we doesn't deserve it. To each his/her own

[southwest1]

I don't trust the media to back off....it's their job not to back off and in these kinds of high profile situations I'd trust them even less.

 

Opinions vary on all three of them for all kinds of reasons....but I just wouldn't sign Martin or Incognito, or draft Sam. There are much better and very legitimate alternatives to upgrading the positions these guys play. JMO

They would if Robert Mathis, Reggie Wayne, or Andrew Luck said "Look, we understand that journalists have a job to do & deadlines to meet, but Jonathan is a Colt now & as such I expect you to treat him with the same respect you treat me. Judge him on his game by game performance not his previous NFL team tenure. Every season is a fresh start for every athlete in this locker room including Mr. Martin & from this moment he should be treated accordingly based on his on the field execution. No one in this organization will waste time with questions that distract us from competing for a Lombardi trophy.  Thank you. Next question." 

 

Media always backs off when they know their access to players & coaches will be restricted or cut off completely if they fail to move on & discuss relevant football matters.  Trust me. 

[HarassedOffTheSite]

He may be brought in as a back up RT and in a pinch back up LT but replacing Castonzo? Wont happen, Have you watched Martins feet? Not a LT

 

Gavin I understand that YOU really appreciate your perspective on the talent of football players. However, Martin's feet are just fine. He protected Luck's blindside in the Pac-10 in College. And I don't doubt for a second that he can do it in the pros too.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

I will say that INDY would be a great environment for Martin to get his NFL feet back firmly underneath him.

 

Absolutely.

[Patagonia Chris]

Gavin I understand that YOU really appreciate your perspective on the talent of football players. However, I do not. Martin's feet are just fine. He protected Luck's blindside in the Pac-10 in College. And I don't doubt for a second that he can do it in the pros too.

 

 Well then maybe you're the one who should adjust their perspective. You do realize that Martin has struggled thus far in the pros right? Tony Mandrich was a beast in college and guess what? HE STRUGGLED MOST OF HIS CAREER. Martin has done nothing in his career so far to prove that he is a top level NFL tackle.

[TKnight24]

Did I say I wanted either of them? No. I was simply stating that Martin is the last player I'd like to see the Colts add.

Martin is the last person you'd want the Colts to add?

So where does Blaine Gabbert, Cortland Finnegan, Bradley Sowell, & Morris Claiborne fall on that list?

[Nobody]

I agree with you on that, but keep in mind he also dished it out. He wasn't innocent in the big scandal that came up from that

in that situation you do all you can to help the torture fade a bit, and being "one of the guys" and doing what they do probably was a way to become more accepted and call off the dogs a bit. Just an opinion from someone who's been in the locker room, young men being together type of scene. If you are the softie who never says anything mean it only gets worse.

I for one think his treatment in Miami means it would be worth picking him up and seeing how he plays with us, we're the best situation in the league for him. Old friendly faces all around and a supportive family type atmosphere with strong mature leadership would be a welcome change that hopefully could draw out the best player in him. He was great at Stanford.

[Nobody]

Martin is the last person you'd want the Colts to add?

So where does Blaine Gabbert, Cortland Finnegan, Bradley Sowell, & Morris Claiborne fall on that list?

Sign me up and play me at tackle then!

[TKnight24]

Sign me up and play me at tackle then!

I'm saying! At that case, sign me up for ILB next to Freeman. I'm 6'4 260 & I'd probably run a 5.0 flat in the 40 yard dash

[southwest1]

As a former Marine who no doubt endured more (constructive) psychological trauma in 1 day at Parris Island than Martin did while with the Dolphins organization, I'm stunned by your comment.

 

Have you read the Wells report? There is no place in Football or any other sport for what he endured. That wasn't hazing. It wasn't forcing humility on him in order for him to learn respect and his place in the big picture of team sports. It wasn't a constructive process of breaking him down in order to build him back up in a particular mode. That was physical assault and repeated intimidation. Not only by the P.O.S. Incognito (who NEVER should've been allowed to assume a Captain's role by the hapless coaching staff and organization) but several other players as well who were infected by said P.O.S. The franchise had a systemic problem from the GM on down that removed all safe-guards.

 

And Martin choosing to walk away from that unacceptable situation is the issue? Wow, perhaps he'd be seen in a more favorable light if he was being a racist, sexually harassing innocent women and physically assaulting others.   

Thank you for your Marine Corp service Brian. I agree with your perspective on this whole Miami disaster too. [What I bolded] Yes, the Dolphins are the poster child for systematic dysfunction. Maybe never winning the AFC EAST division crown year after year just made them snap. Sorry bad joke. 

 

21isSuperman is a good guy who I think just believes that INDY can still flourish & win Playoff games without Incognito or Martin. Just my take on it. That's all. 

[Gavin]

Gavin I understand that YOU really appreciate your perspective on the talent of football players. However, Martin's feet are just fine. He protected Luck's blindside in the Pac-10 in College. And I don't doubt for a second that he can do it in the pros too.

If ya say so.......

[southwest1]

Telling.

 

 

how so?

I find it odd Royals3052 that you cannot understand why a person might be shocked & not subscribe to your statement that "I'd rather have Incognito than Martin." Now, that belief is indeed your right. However, why both I & Brian object to it is this: Why would you invite Incognito's brand of demeaning humiliation into a locker room to spread like a wildfire? Plus, why reward Mr. Incognito by putting him on a Playoff winning, SB contending squad after the Wells Report was published? The guy is lower than pond scum IMO. 

 

Also, the veterans in our locker room are all about business not nonsense. They know every man on that 53 man roster must have a clear mind & laser like focus to win every week. Incognito is the antithesis of professionalism, a bully, & he serves no purpose but to tear other players down to inflate his own self centered ego.