Are we contenders?

[Yoshinator]

Just now, braveheartcolt said:

If we WERE so bad last season, and came so close to winning the division, it should'nt be so hard to get that little bit better and win it. But that doesn't fit with the hate.

Why would I hate the Colts? What you said was completely untrue if serious. Not all teams are completely equal, it's not a coin flip who wins the division every year, it's who's the best coached and most talented. The Texans are getting Watt back (who they didn't have last year), the Titans have 6 picks in the top 75 of the draft, even the Jags have a new coach and another high pick that they can get a franchise RB like Leonard Fournette on. You seem to be of the opinion that if we get a bit better, it will completely overshadow the rest of the division getting better. We have to get talent on the team, period. Luck can't carry the team, which is evident by the 8-8 records the last two years as we have missed on drafts.

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Answer me honestly, would you bet real money that the Colts could beat the Pats or Steelers? Something that could affect your pocketbook? The Raiders are a problem too with Carr back. I think we can win the division, but a new GM by himself won't make us contenders, he still has to fix the team and hit on a lot of new players, which it seems you are assuming is a given.

The question was are we contenders not are we going to win the SB?  You think we can win the division.  I guess that puts us in the playoffs and yes that makes us a contender.  Any team that makes the playoffs is a contender IMO.

[braveheartcolt]

44 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Why would I hate the Colts? What you said was completely untrue if serious. Not all teams are completely equal, it's not a coin flip who wins the division every year, it's who's the best coached and most talented. The Texans are getting Watt back (who they didn't have last year), the Titans have 6 picks in the top 75 of the draft, even the Jags have a new coach and another high pick that they can get a franchise RB like Leonard Fournette on. You seem to be of the opinion that if we get a bit better, it will completely overshadow the rest of the division getting better. We have to get talent on the team, period. Luck can't carry the team, which is evident by the 8-8 records the last two years as we have missed on drafts.

Ah, so everyone can get better and we can't. I understand.

[Smonroe]

7 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

The question was are we contenders not are we going to win the SB?  You think we can win the division.  I guess that puts us in the playoffs and yes that makes us a contender.  Any team that makes the playoffs is a contender IMO.

 

That's right.  The year the Cardinals made it to the SB they were 9-7 and I doubt many people thought they'd go very far.  They got hot at the right time and came pretty close to winning it all.

 

Like a previous poster said - when you have a franchise QB your odds are pretty darn good.

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, braveheartcolt said:

Ah, so everyone can better and we can't. I understand.

Nice deflection. Not what I said at all. You just seem to think if we improve a bit, that will put us over the top regardless of how our rivals do. We have the least room for error in our division to improve. We have the most holes on our teams. With Luck, we are an 8-8 team as of now. That's it. It's not just about us improving, it's about them missing as well. When we are improving, it's likely they are improving. Oh, and when we were messing up drafts, they made the division competitive. Not sure what you see that we have besides Luck and Hilton as of now. Blind optimism causes people not to take you seriously. 

[Yoshinator]

17 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

The question was are we contenders not are we going to win the SB?  You think we can win the division.  I guess that puts us in the playoffs and yes that makes us a contender.  Any team that makes the playoffs is a contender IMO.

What do you assume contenders mean? That puts us in the playoffs and makes us a contender for the SB? Obviously the question by the OP meant are we SB contenders. Also, if we made the playoffs Vs the Pats or Steelers, would you bet a significant amount of money on the Colts?

[Yoshinator]

13 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

That's right.  The year the Cardinals made it to the SB they were 9-7 and I doubt many people thought they'd go very far.  They got hot at the right time and came pretty close to winning it all.

 

Like a previous poster said - when you have a franchise QB your odds are pretty darn good.

If we're putting our hopes on one of those once in a blue moon scenarios where it could happen to anyone, then we are in bad shape. It's like a slot machine player relying on possibility to win a jackpot Vs a blackjack player relying on probability to win a couple hundred every time, and we are the slot machine player.

[2006Coltsbestever]

17 hours ago, jbaron04 said:

What do that have to do with colts, falcons gonna be back to there 10-6 or 9-7 selves, panthers fell apart after one good season 

It goes to show if the Falcons can make the SB anyone can is my point. They were coming off an 8-8 season and nobody had them even labeled as a contender. Everyone already had the Panthers penciled in as Division Champ and they went 6-10.

[BR-549]

4 hours ago, Chucklez said:

We don't count the Jags, 33% really.... 

 

Is that why we almost lost to them both times?  Their roster is better than ours and somehow they still figured out how to lose.  I don't expect that to be the case this year..

[braveheartcolt]

13 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Nice deflection. Not what I said at all. You just seem to think if we improve a bit, that will put us over the top regardless of how our rivals do. We have the least room for error in our division to improve. We have the most holes on our teams. With Luck, we are an 8-8 team as of now. That's it. It's not just about us improving, it's about them missing as well. When we are improving, it's likely they are improving. Oh, and when we were messing up drafts, they made the division competitive. Not sure what you see that we have besides Luck and Hilton as of now. Blind optimism causes people not to take you seriously. 

You just can't live with the thought that we could improve enough to win the division. In fact, you also fail to believe that our divisional rivals could go backwards. Which happens a lot. Even if our squads stayed exactly the same next year, I would take us confidently to win the division this time round. So all this doom and gloom is misplaced. But it is the NFL, so who knows. 

[GwinnettColt]

I don't think we are contenders right now.  We're rebuilding (about four years later than we should be).

 

O-line (which is improving)

Ground game (which will improve a little with a better O-line but RB is also a factor).

Pass Rush-I think we need a DT and a fast OLB.  

Run D-I think the issue lies with ILB's and DT.  

 

One problem is that we squandered some first round picks and another is that we have older FA's that were expensive.  The cost-benefit didn't match.  The name was known but the performance was below what was expected.  Andre Johnson, for example.  

 

I would love to see us come out and surprise people but the weight rested on Luck's shoulders for far too long.  

[OffensivelyPC]

Well, considering that there's a lot that supposed to happen between now and pre-season, how could you expect anyone to begin to answer this?  Like, literally, every post on here doesn't matter until bare minimum after April 29, at about 5pm - and even then there's too much to process to begin to even answer the question.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, OffensivelyPC said:

Well, considering that there's a lot that supposed to happen between now and pre-season, how could you expect anyone to begin to answer this?  Like, literally, every post on here doesn't matter until bare minimum after April 29, at about 5pm - and even then there's too much to process to begin to even answer the question.

I agree, until the Draft happens and Free Agency happens it's impossible to analyze this. What if we nail the Draft and pickup 2 great Defensive players in Free Agency? I am sure the people in here saying NO would change their tune.

[coltsfeva]

9 hours ago, Chucklez said:

Injuries happen, you cant use them as excuses. Key people will get injured next year too, it's part of the game and has to be accounted for.

I get it's the time to be optimistic about your team and there is so much hope in FA and the draft, but until it becomes a reality, we are what we are and that is unequivocally NOT a contender. There's no guarantee we draft well, there's no guarantee we bring in good FAs.

If Ifs and buts were candy and nuts etc etc.....

 No excuses. Just saying that starters are starters for a reason and adding defensive starters that have already played in this system  is a plus. You are correct: no guarantees FA and draft will be good but should we assume it won't ? Either way, the team will field some new players this year and some of the young players that started last year will have some experience under their belts and could provide depth. I agree with you that as it stands, this team is not good enough to be considered a contender to win it all. Fortunately, they can be, with some playmakers added this offseason.

[Architects08]

Andrew Luck and TY Hilton can be considered elite, but our offense as a whole isn't elite yet. We have a 34 year old RB. A WR that hasn't been healthy, and one WR who doesn't do anything. We could lose Doyle, and still have question marks on the right side of the line.

[richard pallo]

35 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

What do you assume contenders mean? That puts us in the playoffs and makes us a contender for the SB? Obviously the question by the OP meant are we SB contenders. Also, if we made the playoffs Vs the Pats or Steelers, would you bet a significant amount of money on the Colts?

Contenders means contenders for the SB.  That's pretty obvious.  When you make the playoffs you are automatically a contender for the SB the teams that don't lost their opportunity to win a SB.  Pretty straightforward I would say.  You seem hung up on the willingness to bet a significant amount of money on the Colts as a way to prove your point.  That's your measure of proof. I don't gamble so if that makes you happy so be it.  I guess you win the argument then.  Pretty silly reasoning IMO.

[OffensivelyPC]

4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I agree, until the Draft happens and Free Agency happens it's impossible to analyze this. What if we nail the Draft and pickup 2 great Defensive players in Free Agency? I am sure the people in here saying NO would change their tune.

And honestly, unless you're looking for the reassurance or the need to lay waste to a disagreeable post, this thread is just speculation upon speculation on things we coudln't even begin to speculate on.  It's like double secret probation, but with speculation.

[braveheartcolt]

4 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

And honestly, unless you're looking for the reassurance or the need to lay waste to a disagreeable post, this thread is just speculation upon speculation on things we coudln't even begin to speculate on.  It's like double secret probation, but with speculation.

You do know this is just a place for football * chat don't you? You make out it's actually more important than it is. 

[PeterBowman]

I see no reason the Colts couldn't make an Atlanta type turnaround this season. But, even if they nail the draft, you usually don't see those fruits until the 2nd season on, but you never know.

[OffensivelyPC]

25 minutes ago, braveheartcolt said:

You do know this is just a place for football * chat don't you? You make out it's actually more important than it is. 

I thought I was chatting about football...

[ManningGM]

28 minutes ago, PeterBowman said:

I see no reason the Colts couldn't make an Atlanta type turnaround this season. But, even if they nail the draft, you usually don't see those fruits until the 2nd season on, but you never know.

I see a reason, one word:

 

Pagano. 

 

[TheRustonRifle#7]

1 hour ago, OffensivelyPC said:

Well, considering that there's a lot that supposed to happen between now and pre-season, how could you expect anyone to begin to answer this?  Like, literally, every post on here doesn't matter until bare minimum after April 29, at about 5pm - and even then there's too much to process to begin to even answer the question.

Spot on!

[Smonroe]

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

If we're putting our hopes on one of those once in a blue moon scenarios where it could happen to anyone, then we are in bad shape. It's like a slot machine player relying on possibility to win a jackpot Vs a blackjack player relying on probability to win a couple hundred every time, and we are the slot machine player.

 

Well, IMO Luck improves the odds on those slots. 

 

 I thought this was interesting. Look at the 2016 playoffs and take the team to win strictly by how good a season their QB had.  Forget everything else (record, O or D standings, etc ).  

 

I think the only argument may have been in the SB, and maybe by a hair.  

[GoColts8818]

At the moment no.  We finished in third place in a one playoff team division.  With the right moves we could at least become a playoff contender again but we need a lot of help on defense and to be more consistent on offense to be a Super Bowl contender.

[Jesse Lafantaisie]

We are definitely not cotenders for making it to the super bowl contenders for playoffs yes. We could easily become contenders if we get a good draft and good free agency and our Offense is not as good as you guys seem to think our passing game is good but overall offense is average compared to other teams.

[Jesse Lafantaisie]

2 hours ago, Smonroe said:

 

Well, IMO Luck improves the odds on those slots. 

 

 I thought this was interesting. Look at the 2016 playoffs and take the team to win strictly by how good a season their QB had.  Forget everything else (record, O or D standings, etc ).  

 

I think the only argument may have been in the SB, and maybe by a hair.  

football doesn't work like this, so not sure how its relevant.

[Jesse Lafantaisie]

4 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Nice deflection. Not what I said at all. You just seem to think if we improve a bit, that will put us over the top regardless of how our rivals do. We have the least room for error in our division to improve. We have the most holes on our teams. With Luck, we are an 8-8 team as of now. That's it. It's not just about us improving, it's about them missing as well. When we are improving, it's likely they are improving. Oh, and when we were messing up drafts, they made the division competitive. Not sure what you see that we have besides Luck and Hilton as of now. Blind optimism causes people not to take you seriously. 

Exactly take away luck/hilton we are still that 2-14 team from 5 yrs ago but even worse. We are a team that should be drafting in the top 5 but because we have andrew luck we are in the middle. Which sucks but I think already having your QB would be better than having a good team and no QB like the Broncos for example. Give Broncos Luck and they likely repeat SB champs.

[Smonroe]

12 minutes ago, Jesse Lafantaisie said:

football doesn't work like this, so not sure how its relevant.

 

Football did work exactly like that last year.  Did you even understand the example?

 

It's relevant because it shows how a franchise QB can carry a team through the playoffs.  Not every year, but enough for it not to be sheer coincidence.  

 

 

[OLD FAN MAN]

4 hours ago, GwinnettColt said:

I don't think we are contenders right now.  We're rebuilding (about four years later than we should be).

 

O-line (which is improving)

Ground game (which will improve a little with a better O-line but RB is also a factor).

Pass Rush-I think we need a DT and a fast OLB.  

Run D-I think the issue lies with ILB's and DT.  

 

One problem is that we squandered some first round picks and another is that we have older FA's that were expensive.  The cost-benefit didn't match.  The name was known but the performance was below what was expected.  Andre Johnson, for example.  

 

I would love to see us come out and surprise people but the weight rested on Luck's shoulders for far too long.  

i concur

[OLD FAN MAN]

32 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

Football did work exactly like that last year.  Did you even understand the example?

 

It's relevant because it shows how a franchise QB can carry a team through the playoffs.  Not every year, but enough for it not to be sheer coincidence.  

 

 

i concur

[OLD FAN MAN]

5 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

It goes to show if the Falcons can make the SB anyone can is my point. They were coming off an 8-8 season and nobody had them even labeled as a contender. Everyone already had the Panthers penciled in as Division Champ and they went 6-10.

i agree

[Smonroe]

2 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

At the moment no.  We finished in third place in a one playoff team division.  With the right moves we could at least become a playoff contender again but we need a lot of help on defense and to be more consistent on offense to be a Super Bowl contender.

 

Yet inspite of having what may be the worst defensive personnel in the league we were still in contention for the division. 

 

The Texans had one of the best Ds in the league, the Jags have been amassing high draft picks for years but neither team has a reliable QB.  And for some reason we seem to have the Titans number.  

 

So it's not far fetched that a non comatose GM could recognize that and bring in significant help on D.  We already have a top 10 offense with an O line that showed improvement.  

 

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I can't see why anyone thinks we won't be a contender.   

[OLD FAN MAN]

3 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

Yet inspite of having what may be the worst defensive personnel in the league we were still in contention for the division. 

 

The Texans had one of the best Ds in the league, the Jags have been amassing high draft picks for years but neither team has a reliable QB.  And for some reason we seem to have the Titans number.  

 

So it's not far fetched that a non comatose GM could recognize that and bring in significant help on D.  We already have a top 10 offense with an O line that showed improvement.  

 

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I can't see why anyone thinks we won't be a contender.   

i concur

[GoColts8818]

12 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

Yet inspite of having what may be the worst defensive personnel in the league we were still in contention for the division. 

 

The Texans had one of the best Ds in the league, the Jags have been amassing high draft picks for years but neither team has a reliable QB.  And for some reason we seem to have the Titans number.  

 

So it's not far fetched that a non comatose GM could recognize that and bring in significant help on D.  We already have a top 10 offense with an O line that showed improvement.  

 

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I can't see why anyone thinks we won't be a contender.   

The Texans also nearly played the whole year without their best player and a real starting QB.  Let's not kid ourselves and act like the Texans are on the same level as New England.  Yet they still won the division over the Colts.  The Texans were a very flawed team that probably doesn't go to the playoffs in any other division.  Yet the Colts couldn't beat them once and now have a three game losing streak to them.

 

The Colts need to worry about catching the Texans before they start dreaming of Super Bowls.  In order to get there they are going to need a major defense overhaul that is probably going to take more than one off-season to do and the offense is going to have to stop having halves of games where they do nothing except go three and out and turn the ball over and finding themselves down three scores before they get going. 

 

Can the Colts make the moves to catch the Texans in one off-season?  That's possible, however despite the Colts having the Titans number the Titans are probably going to get better as well so I wouldn't just chalk up the Colts beating them.  Also even though the Colts beat them twice the Titans still finished ahead of the Colts in the division standings this year so beating them alone isn't enough.

 

I also think becoming a contender in the AFC South is one thing, being a contender for a Super Bowl is a whole other animal that the Colts aren't really close to at the moment. 

[Lawrence Owen]

11 hours ago, Rackeen305 said:

Easy with the "put up points on anybody". See Pittsburgh game (28-7), KC game (30-14), Denver game (34-20).. I'm optimistic that the team will get better, but I'm also a realist. And the 3 teams I just mentioned made the playoffs so...

20 points is respectable.  and against denver's defense...good.  Luck did not play pitt...and KC goes under 'any givin sunday'.  as in a team can beat anyonyone (or have a very bad game) any givin sunday.

The other side of the score board is what is needed looked at more so...34 by denver,..30 by KC, and 28 by pitt.  That is unacceptable.

[Smonroe]

6 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

The Texans also nearly played the whole year without their best player and a real starting QB.  Let's not kid ourselves and act like the Texans are on the same level as New England.  Yet they still won the division over the Colts.  The Texans were a very flawed team that probably doesn't go to the playoffs in any other division.  Yet the Colts couldn't beat them once and now have a three game losing streak to them.

 

The Colts need to worry about catching the Texans before they start dreaming of Super Bowls.  In order to get there they are going to need a major defense overhaul that is probably going to take more than one off-season to do and the offense is going to have to stop having halves of games where they do nothing except go three and out and turn the ball over and finding themselves down three scores before they get going. 

 

All true, and I doubt the Texans QB situation will be any better this year with Savage breathing down Osweiler's neck.   

 

As far as JJ, back injuries are tough, there's even been trade rumors.  

 

Obviously we we need to improve on D.  I still contend we're not that far off.  

[NannyMcafee]

Technically every team is a contender.

[Jules]

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, Jules said:

 

Oh come on you know we could roll right into Foxboro and dethrone the Pats  

[Jules]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Oh come on you know we could roll right into Foxboro and dethrone the Pats  

 

We could if we got Marlon Brando.