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2022 Colts at Bill (Pre Season) Post Game Thoughts


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41 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

A couple of contending teams have already lost their starting centers for the season.  Not saying Ballard would trade him now but you never know.

I don't think it happens this year. However he's getting up there in age, he isn't one of our youngest players anymore, and I think Ballard has shown he can draft OL decently well. I don't think Kelly is a scub by any means, but the further things progress the more replaceable he looks. There is also an aspect of leadership that we don't get to see as fans. I believe he is the players rep for the team, not sure how much weight that holds though. 

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i thought because we have a new QB an a young wr room frank would open up the offense more .  i thought the point of playing matt ryan a full quarter was to get chemistry with his new weapons .   every play felt like a run up the middle with hines that went no where .    its a little concerning to watch our 1st stringers struggle a bit vs the bills second stringers being down 7-3 before the starters were pulled .

 

however its the first preseason game so i am not worried just some observations . 

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Neither good or bad, but the way everyone talked up Matt on how fast he gets rid of the ball, I imagined it being slightly faster than what I saw today.  Could be because our receivers aren’t good enough yet to get open that fast though.  Plus Buffalo young secondary were surprisingly good at press at the line
 

No big deal, I still enjoyed a lot of his play today

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2 minutes ago, AustinnKaine said:

I don't think Foles has played good football in a long time. He's been on multiple teamsn now in a QB hungry league and he hasn't found success since that one year with Frank in Philly. I have been a supporter of Sam since he joined the team. I think what he lacks in certain areas he can makeup for with his athelticism and motor. When it comes to Foles he's got all the negatives of a pocket passer, with very few positives in terms of physical talent. I was actually surprised we signed him after Reich failed with his former lover Wentz. 

 

Even in Foles' good years, he was inconsistent and highly reliant on talent around him. He had some good runs at times within seasons, but never saw him as great. I'm fine with him as QB2 though. 

 

Keep in mind Buffalo has one of the best secondaries in the league. And we made it easy on them in the first half with all the scripted short possession stuff. And with both their safeties out, we didn't test them deep to take advantage. In the 2H, I didn't see much, if any of Buffalo's top 4 CBs or Safeties. which means Sam was playing with guys like Woods, Ogletree, Lindsay, Patmon, Dulin, Coutee, and the rest, against guys that likely won't make the Bills roster. And Sam was free to create with a lot less script. So I simply can't get hyped on Sam lol. He had a great game. But there's a lot of context to consider. 

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6 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

Even in Foles' good years, he was inconsistent and highly reliant on talent around him. He had some good runs at times within seasons, but never saw him as great. I'm fine with him as QB2 though. 

 

Keep in mind Buffalo has one of the best secondaries in the league. And we made it easy on them in the first half with all the scripted short possession stuff. And with both their safeties out, we didn't test them deep to take advantage. In the 2H, I didn't see much, if any of Buffalo's top 4 CBs or Safeties. which means Sam was playing with guys like Woods, Ogletree, Lindsay, Patmon, Dulin, Coutee, and the rest, against guys that likely won't make the Bills roster. And Sam was free to create with a lot less script. So I simply can't get hyped on Sam lol. He had a great game. But there's a lot of context to consider. 

I agree, I wouldn't say im overhyped or anything, I just think he showed flashes of what he can do. I don't imagine Sam as a starter on most teams, and really reminds me of a guy like Trevor Heineicke. Low ceiling kind of guy, but won't give you a game like Jacob Eason coming in and immediately throwing a pick. I'd be fine with Sam being number 2 over Foles. Obviously this won't be the case, but I think if you look at pure talent thats the way it should be. Of course Frank will put Foles at 2. 

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16 minutes ago, TaylorStillTruckedYou said:

Neither good or bad, but the way everyone talked up Matt on how fast he gets rid of the ball, I imagined it being slightly faster than what I saw today.  Could be because our receivers aren’t good enough yet to get open that fast though.  Plus Buffalo young secondary were surprisingly good at press at the line
 

No big deal, I still enjoyed a lot of his play today

Receivers were covered very well the whole time - I made this same comment to a friend, but when I watched closer I realized our WR just cannot get separation.  They'd be covered by boulders if they were on Mars.

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13 minutes ago, aceman16 said:

Outside of their long snapper and FG kicker Buffalo didn't have any starters play today (including their linemen).

 

I get it. But I'd say guys like Shakir and Hodgins are starting WRs on most teams. IMO, Shakir will end up starting for Buffalo.

OJ Howard was a first round TE, and starter for TB. RBs Cook (who would start for a lot of teams) and Moss are both good. Cook will likely play a Hines a role, but just better between the Ts. And Keenum and Barkley, who played the whole game, are vets, not really your typical scrub QBs. And on D, Elam and Benford both played a ton, and both are in contention for starting jobs. Guys like Epenesa, Basham, etc are heavy rotational guys. Epenesa would start for a lot of teams, and probably start for the Bills had they not picked up Vonn Miller. 

 

So in short, while not playing a bunch of returning starters, a lot of the guys that played are in battles for starting spots (several should win), and a lot of others are high snap count vets who played a lot of the game. Didn't really see them go full scrub until 2H when Sam was playing against mostly guys that won't make the roster. 

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A couple of thoughts:

1. Reich called his typical ultra conservative pre season game. He’s not going to take the leash off until the games mean something. Until the season starts, it will be a double dose of vanilla. Even then, we’ll have to see how good Ryan is at ad libbing at the line. Wentz stunk at it which caused a lot of the problems. If Ryan clicks at it, the O will look much better. Patience is required for now. 
2. The backup tackles were revolving doors tonight. Raimann was a deer in the headlights and not ready for prime time. First game….Not a big surprise. But Murray at RT? Awful. Van Demark wasn’t much better…. But it’s his first game too. Depth may be a problem once again. It’s something to watch over the next 2 weeks. 
3. The rookie TEs did ok for their first games, and Gransen showed up well. 
4. That 3rd string QB for the Bills played well. He stuck some passes in there under pressure that were spot on and had to be. Give him some credit. 
5. I really liked Weatherford. Played solid D and was a pest on STs. I thought he was the clear unexpected star on the field tonight for the Colts.
6. And then there was Sam E. I know it was against 2nd and 3rd stringers, but the guy is a pure football player. He makes things happen. I like him for the 53 man squad.

 

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18 minutes ago, Catloaf said:

Receivers were covered very well the whole time - I made this same comment to a friend, but when I watched closer I realized our WR just cannot get separation.  They'd be covered by boulders if they were on Mars.

Lol yea we may have trouble with Man schemed teams this season.  I can see us fairing much better against a zone team, with the quickness and size of our receivers 

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18 minutes ago, AustinnKaine said:

I agree, I wouldn't say im overhyped or anything, I just think he showed flashes of what he can do. I don't imagine Sam as a starter on most teams, and really reminds me of a guy like Trevor Heineicke. Low ceiling kind of guy, but won't give you a game like Jacob Eason coming in and immediately throwing a pick. I'd be fine with Sam being number 2 over Foles. Obviously this won't be the case, but I think if you look at pure talent thats the way it should be. Of course Frank will put Foles at 2. 

 

I'm just being realistic. Reich's love for Foles means he's a led pipe lock. 

 

Personally, I'd be happy with Sam as QB2. I don't think Foles' contract was overly high, but I thought it was money that could have been better spent. 

 

Overall, I just don't place as high of value on QB2 like some due. I prefer to draft mid/late, develop, and realize value/savings. And if I do sign a vet, I'd be happy with a less costly guy like Hoyer, Barkley, Rosen, etc. lol. 

 

I'm not writing off Coan at this point though. He's not a guy you can eval playing with bottom barrel talent. He's a pocket passer. There's no use playing him or even attempting to eval him if he's playing with a horrible OL. He's not going to extend plays and be creative like Sam. It's just not his game. IMO, it was a waste of time to toss him in there at the end of the game. 

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41 minutes ago, TaylorStillTruckedYou said:

Neither good or bad, but the way everyone talked up Matt on how fast he gets rid of the ball, I imagined it being slightly faster than what I saw today.  Could be because our receivers aren’t good enough yet to get open that fast though.  Plus Buffalo young secondary were surprisingly good at press at the line
 

No big deal, I still enjoyed a lot of his play today

I'd say it's a combo. Buffalo's DBs Elam and Benford are minimum locks for the 53, and most think they are pushing for starting CB jobs. I like Elam, Benford, and Johnson, all more than I like their current starting CBs (White and Jackson). 

 

And when you run a bunch of short perimeter routes, you're just not going to challenge DBs much, or create much separation. Same crap as last season to be honest. Need more slants and go routes. But I really see this more of a play selection problem, than I see it as a pass catcher problem. 

 

 

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Didn't think Raimann looked all bad, got beat by Smith a couple of times, but Smith will start or be rotational after his suspension. 

Still don't like Strausser. I would move Smith to RG. Let Pryor and Raimann play tackles. I like Pinter more than Kelley. We can scheme the weakness on the outside than straight up the middle better. 

Roger's looked great. Lindsay looked great others not so much. I'm concerned about WR separation as well. Some of you may not remember Harbaugh playing here, but I can't believe how similar Sam looks to Harbaugh. Brooks looks decent as well.

 

Fire away at the Smith comment.

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1 hour ago, Catloaf said:

Receivers were covered very well the whole time - I made this same comment to a friend, but when I watched closer I realized our WR just cannot get separation.  They'd be covered by boulders if they were on Mars.

George Pickens for the Steelers. Killing it. Oh I forgot, Ballard craves character. U know the kind of character that  wins at home against the Raiders and beats the Jags at their home park who eventually get the #1 pick with the Colts play offs on the line. Did I get that wrong lol?? Oh character the  of these players has served us so well. Pickens has red flags and injury history but oh well, he is killing it.  Maybe  instead of this  love for Wayne,  we should offer the Steelers wr scout lots of money??  U know they draft stud after stud and we get what year after year. Look at their wr talent. It's ridiculous and we cannot get one.

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38 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

I'd say it's a combo. Buffalo's DBs Elam and Benford are minimum locks for the 53, and most think they are pushing for starting CB jobs. I like Elam, Benford, and Johnson, all more than I like their current starting CBs (White and Jackson). 

 

And when you run a bunch of short perimeter routes, you're just not going to challenge DBs much, or create much separation. Same crap as last season to be honest. Need more slants and go routes. But I really see this more of a play selection problem, than I see it as a pass catcher problem. 

 

 

Fair assessment, I on the other hand enjoyed the play calling today.  Wanted to see how our receivers separate off of the line, and also see which linemen are lacking in specific areas.  It was the physical game I wanted honestly.  Maybe next week we’ll introduce more of an intermediate gameplan with some deep shots thrown in

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9 minutes ago, Matabix said:

Didn't think Raimann looked all bad, got beat by Smith a couple of times, but Smith will start or be rotational after his suspension. 

Still don't like Strausser. I would move Smith to RG. Let Pryor and Raimann play tackles. I like Pinter more than Kelley. We can scheme the weakness on the outside than straight up the middle better. 

Roger's looked great. Lindsay looked great others not so much. I'm concerned about WR separation as well. Some of you may not remember Harbaugh playing here, but I can't believe how similar Sam looks to Harbaugh. Brooks looks decent as well.

 

Fire away at the Smith comment.

Lol I would only say that having Raimann and Pryor as both starting tackles would kill our QB and RBs.  I could handle one, and maybe seeing how Raimann is at RG but I wouldn’t want both as starters on the ends at the same time 

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3 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Not many thoughts. It’s just preseason but a few observations.

 

Ryan throws a very smooth and pretty ball. 
Dayo looked pretty good. 
 

Fearured Hines a lot so I am not worried about the WR. Plus they don’t scheme up pass plays and it’s just very vanilla.

 

Sam is vastly improved from last preseason. Woods looked good.

I like where Granson is at in his develelopment!  Liked the catch from Woods also 

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2 minutes ago, TaylorStillTruckedYou said:

Fair assessment, I on the other hand enjoyed the play calling today.  Wanted to see how our receivers separate off of the line, and also see which linemen are lacking in specific areas.  It was the physical game I wanted honestly.  Maybe next week we’ll introduce more of an intermediate gameplan with some deep shots thrown in

 

I just prefer a more well rounded and balanced game on O. 

I'm going to watch again, likely while on my back lol, and look closer. 

I just didn't see many routes that are separation creating routes. Didn't see much focus on second and third level routes. 

And for the life of me, can't understand the heavy use of Hines in the running game. We know he's a lock. Constant chatter about more targets in the passing game, but he only got 2 targets in his 10 touches. If we're going to run it on the interior, just no reason not to give the depth guys those reps. We know exactly what he brings to the running game. 

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2 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Of the starters, Smith was not his typical perfect self. Not worried though.

Kelly was not impressive at all to me. And that is a concern given his decline last season. 

Both those guys had key penalties too. 

Thought Nelson and Pryor did fine. Didn't notice any bad stuff from Pinter....

 

Of the backups, not impressed with any. Have to rewatch, but seem to recall Van Demark, Murray, and Kemp all getting abused at times. Seen some folks critical of Raiman. Not great from him, but thought others looked far worse.

Who was the right tackle that had the Denzell Good #71 on ?  He was getting smoked

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3 minutes ago, holeymoley99 said:

Murray who is on my Tuesday cut list, cant teach 6'9 BUT...can be slow as a glacier either.

 

He's definitely not on my 53 projection now, but I'd like to see him get more action in the next preseason game to see how he responds. I'd also like to give him one more year on the PS to work on S and C. He's definitely the "project" type. Wouldn't be shocked if he's cut though. 

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2 hours ago, coming on strong said:

i thought because we have a new QB an a young wr room frank would open up the offense more .  i thought the point of playing matt ryan a full quarter was to get chemistry with his new weapons .   every play felt like a run up the middle with hines that went no where .    its a little concerning to watch our 1st stringers struggle a bit vs the bills second stringers being down 7-3 before the starters were pulled .

 

however its the first preseason game so i am not worried just some observations . 

Be afraid....be very afraid haha

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21 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

I just prefer a more well rounded and balanced game on O. 

I'm going to watch again, likely while on my back lol, and look closer. 

I just didn't see many routes that are separation creating routes. Didn't see much focus on second and third level routes. 

And for the life of me, can't understand the heavy use of Hines in the running game. We know he's a lock. Constant chatter about more targets in the passing game, but he only got 2 targets in his 10 touches. If we're going to run it on the interior, just no reason not to give the depth guys those reps. We know exactly what he brings to the running game. 

Haha yea it’s been a long day, give that back a rest.  Hines did not need to be out there, I agree.  He’s probably more involved in setups that aren’t going to be shown until the regular season.  Can’t tip your hat too early.  It’s clear the staff is stressing the evaluation of our O-line to choose the best guys to be out there.  A lot of the basic calls, will give us the best view on where the line is as a unit and who best serves us now.  
 

WR is probably secondary on that list, which we’ll probably see more of as the weeks come.  For the first couple of weeks though, the goal is to solidify our starting offensive line unit in order to build chemistry into the season

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4 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Yup.

And let's face it. Coan is a UDFA to begin with. And he got uber conservative play calls. Short quick passes... that's it. He's not a dual threat like Sam, so wouldn't expect much from him in mop up time anyway. But yup, he didn't give 3 Bills scores lol. Our D did that. 

Maybe they wouldnt have if coan actually sustained a drive

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1 minute ago, Stephen said:

Maybe they wouldnt have if coan actually sustained a drive

Sorry. Sustaining drives doesn't directly correlate with the D sucking. 

And the D sucked. Two different units. 

 

Coan is pocket passer. Don't expect him to play well without a good pocket lol in mop up duty. 

Sam is sandlot guy. He can create and play backyard ball when needed. That's not Coan. 

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1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

George Pickens for the Steelers. Killing it. Oh I forgot, Ballard craves character. U know the kind of character that  wins at home against the Raiders and beats the Jags at their home park who eventually get the #1 pick with the Colts play offs on the line. Did I get that wrong lol?? Oh character the  of these players has served us so well. Pickens has red flags and injury history but oh well, he is killing it.  Maybe  instead of this  love for Wayne,  we should offer the Steelers wr scout lots of money??  U know they draft stud after stud and we get what year after year. Look at their wr talent. It's ridiculous and we cannot get one.

Pickens went the pick before we picked Pierce. Steelers did a better job at route selection during their preseason game.

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3 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I see we are already in mid season form arguing about stuff. 
 

This season I am taking a different approach. Going to state my thoughts and be done. I am really not in the mood this season goibf around and around in a circle with everyone. Just enjoy the season. 

Yet you're already talking about other's posts and opinions, and how you'll rise above it all...

That's not really different lol. Just rise above it. No need to call out others, or announce your rising. 

 

It's a board. Every sports board is basically the same. Doesn't matter if it's preseason or regular season. Folks are hungry for football. And nobody is really changing personalities. I have seen a few Sybil types though on the board. 

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3 hours ago, AustinnKaine said:

I don't think it happens this year. However he's getting up there in age, he isn't one of our youngest players anymore, and I think Ballard has shown he can draft OL decently well. I don't think Kelly is a scub by any means, but the further things progress the more replaceable he looks. There is also an aspect of leadership that we don't get to see as fans. I believe he is the players rep for the team, not sure how much weight that holds though. 

Ryan Kelly has played below average the  last two years.   I had hoped they would trade him this past offseason and move Pinter to Center.  Kelly has a big cap hit in 23.  It’s time for him to step up his game or the Colts should move on after this season. 

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1 hour ago, TaylorStillTruckedYou said:

Haha yea it’s been a long day, give that back a rest.  Hines did not need to be out there, I agree.  He’s probably more involved in setups that aren’t going to be shown until the regular season.  Can’t tip your hat too early.  It’s clear the staff is stressing the evaluation of our O-line to choose the best guys to be out there.  A lot of the basic calls, will give us the best view on where the line is as a unit and who best serves us now.  
 

WR is probably secondary on that list, which we’ll probably see more of as the weeks come.  For the first couple of weeks though, the goal is to solidify our starting offensive line unit in order to build chemistry into the season

 

Honestly, I don't agree on the OL, at least not relative to the 1st team. 

 

Our 1st team OL is pretty locked. So no need to be overly basic for that. Every single one of them started at times last year. None are new to the system or team. 

 

Now in terms of OL depth, I agree. But that's not really a factor when we're talking about bland O performance in the 1Q. Letting Pittman, Campbell, or Pierce for example run an intermediate or deep slant, or simple go route isn't tipping the cap. They are basic plays that everyone runs (rare for us though even in the regular season lol).. 

 

I think WR is locked for the top 2. But we'll see a good 4 man rotation IMO this season. I guess the battle for the 3rd spot is still in question, as well as the 4th. On that note, happy they are pushing Pierce, but seems like they may be trying to hard to push at times. In camp, others have shown just as good. Gilmore has gotten the better of him on a regular basis (that's no shame as Gilmore is one of the best press CBs), and Elam (Bill's rook CB) looked to get the best of him today. In short, I want to see him continue to get 1st team reps to learn, but I also don't want to eliminate guys automatically like Dulin and Coutee from the contest. And Pierce's value simply drops a decent amount if you're not going to give him sideline go routes or deep slants. 

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7 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

Taking Sam out of the game didn't cause the Bills to score 3 times in 8 minutes.

And it has nothing to do with whether or not Frank Reich wants to win it or not.

They put Coan in during mop-up time to give him a chance to play, and show what he could do.  It turned out, not very much.  In the meantime, our bottom-of-the-depth-chart defensive guys allowed them to leap down the field and score at will.

 

The best thing I saw in that whole terrible final minute:  Gus Bradley blitzing on the final two plays.  Eberflus wouldn't have done that.  You go, Bradley.  Best thing that happened to this team this offseason.

Sorry to disappoint but Gus Bradley defenses blitz even less than Eberflus' defense. You might say he didn't want to show his cards by blitzing more than regular in a preseason game. :D

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5 hours ago, EastStreet said:

 

I get it. But I'd say guys like Shakir and Hodgins are starting WRs on most teams. IMO, Shakir will end up starting for Buffalo.

OJ Howard was a first round TE, and starter for TB. RBs Cook (who would start for a lot of teams) and Moss are both good. Cook will likely play a Hines a role, but just better between the Ts. And Keenum and Barkley, who played the whole game, are vets, not really your typical scrub QBs. And on D, Elam and Benford both played a ton, and both are in contention for starting jobs. Guys like Epenesa, Basham, etc are heavy rotational guys. Epenesa would start for a lot of teams, and probably start for the Bills had they not picked up Vonn Miller. 

 

So in short, while not playing a bunch of returning starters, a lot of the guys that played are in battles for starting spots (several should win), and a lot of others are high snap count vets who played a lot of the game. Didn't really see them go full scrub until 2H when Sam was playing against mostly guys that won't make the roster. 

Buffalo has SOOoooo much talent. It's kind of obscene. And they have it at all the right places too. They are what I wish the Colts looked like, team building-wise. 

 

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If we go 0-3 in preseason it really doesn't matter. Just getting some reps in for some of our key players is the key. I couldn't even get a feel after yesterday's game because JT didn't play. I am pretty sure we score a TD after our redzone INT if JT is in there. People complain because Hines up the middle, Hines doesn't get those Carries if JT plays. The going for it on 4th down around the 40, both teams were doing it on several possessions. That is what teams do in preseason. So that wasn't Frank calling bad plays, that is simply experimenting when wins and losses don't matter. Any novice fan knows this. Buffalo was doing the same thing.

 

Opening day can't get here fast enough. 

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