Tweet about Luck's bicep 2-16-18

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, rockywoj said:

To those suggesting the Colts waste their first round pick on a QB, I say that would be THE most foolhardy thing the Colts could do!

 

Even IF Luck suffers a setback, thus requiring a second surgery to clean things up ... and even IF that puts his 2018 in jeopardy, you simply cannot waste the pick on a developmental rookie QB when you will most assuredly have your star QB back for 2019.

 

In other words, what we have here is a possible stopgap situation, and as Pat Kirwin mentioned a couple of months ago, if the Colts are not convinced that Luck will make it back for 2018, you wade into free agency to get a free agent QB to compete with Brissett for the starter role, for 2018, for there is an unusual amount of starting caliber QBs available in this year’s free agency.

 

Example ... his own frailty aside, a guy like Sam Bradford is a very competent starting QB.  He won’t command big dollars because of all the injury concerns around him, but he’s healthy now and could easily serve as the bridge the team needs until Andrew makes it all the way back.

 

In the meantime, you use your draft assets AND free agency to build the rest of the team, so that when Luck does make it back, he has a team around him that can compete.  I wholeheartedly agree!

 

So once again in other words, the calls for the Colts to draft a QB with their premium first round pick represents the most ill advised, panicked, franchise wrecking course of action that the team could possibly make.  We are not and will not become the Cleveland Browns.  You build the rest of the team, so that when you DO get your star QB back, the team around him is better than when he left.

 

 

If Luck is not healthy enough to start but he is still being paid his contract money it wouldn't be wise to go a veteran QB and the salary it would require to sign one. Not too sure how paying two QCs 45-50 million a year would work out. There are more pressing needs throughout the roster and another high dollar QB would hamper signing players who are needed. Ballard said Brissett was drafted for the future and I believe him.

[deedub75]

10 hours ago, a06cc said:

After him going to Europe to see specialist... Do you think one of them would say “Hey you might want to get your bicep looked at”? Team will issue an update around FA. 

 

I don't recall Luck saying he went the Netherlands to see a specialist.  He said he took his therapist to the Netherlands because his therapist had access to a clinic that had "treatments" that were not available in the US.  He didn't specify what those treatments were but said he didn't have any injections.  It was also a mental thing - he just needed to get away.  I still wonder what these mysterious "treatments" were.  

 

The transcript can be found here:

 

http://kentsterling.com/2017/12/30/no-injections-or-surgery-colts-andrew-luck-told-the-truth-about-trip-to-the-netherlands/

 

To me, reading it is not as convincing as hearing it.  These 2 questions stand out to me:

 

Could you have received the same treatment over here in the United States?

“The therapist that I worked with, his resources were over in the Netherlands and clinic and other help. So that’s why – in one specific place. So no, I could not have done what I did there here from some of the people involved aspect of it.”

 

What was the treatment? What did you do there that you couldn’t do here?

“It had a lot to do with him (the trainer). The Colts have been really, really supportive.”

[Reich_MVP]

Hello all, this bicep revelation is super old information. Also the doctors who remain nameless are obviously not the ones that have treated or inspected Andrew. If they are they are in serious privacy law trouble. I came on here to see if anyone on your forum had any real indication of Andrews future? 

[ColtsUrUs]

It's Tiki Barber so take everything he says with a grain of salt. And plus he has no stache so I could never trust a man w/o a stache plain and simple. 

[Reich_MVP]

Didnt Tiki also say Eli Manning couldnt win a championship.

[a06cc]

4 hours ago, deedub75 said:

 

I don't recall Luck saying he went the Netherlands to see a specialist.  He said he took his therapist to the Netherlands because his therapist had access to a clinic that had "treatments" that were not available in the US.  He didn't specify what those treatments were but said he didn't have any injections.  It was also a mental thing - he just needed to get away.  I still wonder what these mysterious "treatments" were.  

 

The transcript can be found here:

 

http://kentsterling.com/2017/12/30/no-injections-or-surgery-colts-andrew-luck-told-the-truth-about-trip-to-the-netherlands/

 

To me, reading it is not as convincing as hearing it.  These 2 questions stand out to me:

 

Could you have received the same treatment over here in the United States?

“The therapist that I worked with, his resources were over in the Netherlands and clinic and other help. So that’s why – in one specific place. So no, I could not have done what I did there here from some of the people involved aspect of it.”

 

What was the treatment? What did you do there that you couldn’t do here?

“It had a lot to do with him (the trainer). The Colts have been really, really supportive.”

That statement about the therapist having resources and other sorts of help furthers my point. I’m sure someone has the knowledge to say “hey you may want to look at your bicep”. I’m saying just relax because Luck said he doesn’t need another surgery. I’m in belief that he’ll be ready to go.

[ColtsBlueFL]

On 2/16/2018 at 6:19 PM, jbaron04 said:

I had the same surgery and the doctor fixed the bicep at the same time as the labrum, but it was torn but the recover is only like 2-3 months 

 

If anyone researches correctly, they'll see bicep tenodesis is most often performed on non overhead  throwing people, often aged 35-40 and greater.  Also,  it is not the bicep per se .. see below-

 

5 hours ago, BrissettMVP2018 said:

Hello all, this bicep revelation is super old information. Also the doctors who remain nameless are obviously not the ones that have treated or inspected Andrew. If they are they are in serious privacy law trouble. I came on here to see if anyone on your forum had any real indication of Andrews future? 

 

No, we are still in wait and see mode, notably if he can progress through an interval throwing program without any setbacks.... again.

 

3 hours ago, a06cc said:

That statement about the therapist having resources and other sorts of help furthers my point. I’m sure someone has the knowledge to say “hey you may want to look at your bicep”. I’m saying just relax because Luck said he doesn’t need another surgery. I’m in belief that he’ll be ready to go.

 

It's not the bicep proper, it is the tendon and attachment.  Here, just read these and become more

enlightened.

 

https://www.rothmaninstitute.com/specialties/treatments/biceps-tenodesis

 

https://www.verywell.com/biceps-tenodesis-2549885

[Reich_MVP]

15 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

No, we are still in wait and see mode, notably if he can progress through an interval throwing program without any setbacks.... again.

 

 

 

Ok thanks for responding. Hard to believe a guy that looks that strong cannot pick up and throw a football. I know that's foolish because of how many muscles and tendons are probably involved and the beatings that he has recieved. I really hope all the negative rumors are not true, love watching Luck play.

[HectorRoberts]

I think it’s  time we build around jacoby. until luck is 100% this is jacobys team

[throwing BBZ]

On 2/17/2018 at 9:01 AM, rockywoj said:

To those suggesting the Colts waste their first round pick on a QB, I say that would be THE most foolhardy thing the Colts could do!

 

Even IF Luck suffers a setback, thus requiring a second surgery to clean things up ... and even IF that puts his 2018 in jeopardy, you simply cannot waste the pick on a developmental rookie QB when you will most assuredly have your star QB back for 2019.

 

In other words, what we have here is a possible stopgap situation, and as Pat Kirwin mentioned a couple of months ago, if the Colts are not convinced that Luck will make it back for 2018, you wade into free agency to get a free agent QB to compete with Brissett for the starter role, for 2018, for there is an unusual amount of starting caliber QBs available in this year’s free agency.

 

Example ... his own

frailty aside, a guy like Sam Bradford is a very competent starting QB.  He won’t command big dollars because of all the injury concerns around him, but he’s healthy now and could easily serve as the bridge the team needs until Andrew makes it all the way back.

 

In the meantime, you use your draft assets AND free agency to build the rest of the team, so that when Luck does make it back, he has a team around him that can compete.  I wholeheartedly agree!

 

So once again in other words, the calls for the Colts to draft a QB with their premium first round pick represents the most ill advised, panicked, franchise wrecking course of action that the team could possibly make.  We are not and will not become the Cleveland Browns.  You build the rest of the team, so that when you DO get your star QB back, the team around him is better than when he left.

 

 

 

Such blathering by Kirwin.
He knows nothing of what is really going on.
Our staff will know a lot by draft day.
I will take a shot that Bradford gets $15M plus in year one, and likely a multiple year contract with a good bit more than $15M guaranteed. Not a Bridge QB.
 Lucky may not have the arm he once had when he comes back.
Anyway, there will be a solid QB prospect available in rd 2 for development.

[rockywoj]

31 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

...
Anyway, there will be a solid QB prospect available in rd 2 for development.

No thanks.  To me that would still be a total waste of of an impoortant roster building asset.  Build the roster to help whomever is QB.

[Smoke317]

My issues is we had a surgeon come out last year saying Luck could need the bicep surgery...  Why in the heck do we keep waiting until the last minute to do these things?  Why did we let Luck play that meaningless game against Jax 2 seasons ago & not get an early jump on the surgery?

 

Why didn’t we get an early jump on this “bicep” surgery if one is needed?  If it turns out he does need the bicep procedure, I’m really gonna be upset with the franchise.  Time to start being proactive instead of reactive. Early rather than late.  

[ColtsBlueFL]

8 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

My issues is we had a surgeon come out last year saying Luck could need the bicep surgery...  Why in the heck do we keep waiting until the last minute to do these things?  Why did we let Luck play that meaningless game against Jax 2 seasons ago & not get an early jump on the surgery?

 

Why didn’t we get an early jump on this “bicep” surgery if one is needed?  If it turns out he does need the bicep procedure, I’m really gonna be upset with the franchise.  Time to start being proactive instead of reactive. Early rather than late.  

 

There really isn't any clear consensus on the treatment of shoulder injures in the overhead athlete, especially those in the event of a failed SLAP (superior labrum anterior posterior) repair. SLAP repair in overhead athletes has had relatively poor results with return to play outcomes I've seen in several reports. However, it was recently concluded in another study that Biceps Tenodesis in an overhead throwing athlete is an acceptable option for a failed SLAP repair.

 

But this is up to the patient and his surgeon.  Most of the elite ortho surgeons Ive studied do not perform a biceps tenodesis along with/in lieu of SLAP repair in overhead throwing athletes, contrary to what quite a few here have posted.  I have heard it is common to do so for non athletes, most especially those over 40 years of age. In athletes, a more conservative treatment plan is usually the course, then corrective treatment if the treatment doesn't work.

I think Andrew should have had an arthroscope in late December to see what correction may be necessary... if any.  He elected not to do that.  So we wait for him to advance through another interval throwing program, and hope for the best.

 

Another thing to be aware, biceps tenodesis moves the anchor point on the long head of the biceps tendon from the labrum to the upper part of the arm bone (Humerus). This changes the setup and mechanics of the superior labrum–biceps complex (SLBC). So since there is no arthroscope post SLAP repair to determine possible damage that still needs corrective action, we await Luck to finish his interval throwing program regimen.  If he cannot complete that, I would the consider the SLAP repair a failure, and then that biceps tenodesis people talk about on here may be the corrective action needed to get Luck back into action down the road.  Until then, let's see what happens.  It's Luck's body, he chooses his treatment and recovery based upon all information given him from his physicians. Nobody can force him to an procedure, just inform him and let him decide. Period.

 

[Smoke317]

23 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

There really isn't any clear consensus on the treatment of shoulder injures in the overhead athlete, especially those in the event of a failed SLAP (superior labrum anterior posterior) repair. SLAP repair in overhead athletes has had relatively poor results with return to play outcomes I've seen in several reports. However, it was recently concluded in another study that Biceps Tenodesis in an overhead throwing athlete is an acceptable option for a failed SLAP repair.

 

But this is up to the patient and his surgeon.  Most of the elite ortho surgeons Ive studied do not perform a biceps tenodesis along with/in lieu of SLAP repair in overhead throwing athletes, contrary to what quite a few here have posted.  I have heard it is common to do so for non athletes, most especially those over 40 years of age. In athletes, a more conservative treatment plan is usually the course, then corrective treatment if the treatment doesn't work.

I think Andrew should have had an arthroscope in late December to see what correction may be necessary... if any.  He elected not to do that.  So we wait for him to advance through another interval throwing program, and hope for the best.

 

Another thing to be aware, biceps tenodesis moves the anchor point on the long head of the biceps tendon from the labrum to the upper part of the arm bone (Humerus). This changes the setup and mechanics of the superior labrum–biceps complex (SLBC). So since there is no arthroscope post SLAP repair to determine possible damage that still needs corrective action, we await Luck to finish his interval throwing program regimen.  If he cannot complete that, I would the consider the SLAP repair a failure, and then that biceps tenodesis people talk about on here may be the corrective action needed to get Luck back into action down the road.  Until then, let's see what happens.  It's Luck's body, he chooses his treatment and recovery based upon all information given him from his physicians. Nobody can force him to an procedure, just inform him and let him decide. Period.

 

How long is the recovery time for the bicep repair?  Generally speaking...

[deedub75]

1 hour ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

There really isn't any clear consensus on the treatment of shoulder injures in the overhead athlete, especially those in the event of a failed SLAP (superior labrum anterior posterior) repair. SLAP repair in overhead athletes has had relatively poor results with return to play outcomes I've seen in several reports. However, it was recently concluded in another study that Biceps Tenodesis in an overhead throwing athlete is an acceptable option for a failed SLAP repair.

 

But this is up to the patient and his surgeon.  Most of the elite ortho surgeons Ive studied do not perform a biceps tenodesis along with/in lieu of SLAP repair in overhead throwing athletes, contrary to what quite a few here have posted.  I have heard it is common to do so for non athletes, most especially those over 40 years of age. In athletes, a more conservative treatment plan is usually the course, then corrective treatment if the treatment doesn't work.

I think Andrew should have had an arthroscope in late December to see what correction may be necessary... if any.  He elected not to do that.  So we wait for him to advance through another interval throwing program, and hope for the best.

 

Another thing to be aware, biceps tenodesis moves the anchor point on the long head of the biceps tendon from the labrum to the upper part of the arm bone (Humerus). This changes the setup and mechanics of the superior labrum–biceps complex (SLBC). So since there is no arthroscope post SLAP repair to determine possible damage that still needs corrective action, we await Luck to finish his interval throwing program regimen.  If he cannot complete that, I would the consider the SLAP repair a failure, and then that biceps tenodesis people talk about on here may be the corrective action needed to get Luck back into action down the road.  Until then, let's see what happens.  It's Luck's body, he chooses his treatment and recovery based upon all information given him from his physicians. Nobody can force him to an procedure, just inform him and let him decide. Period.

 

 

Well put!  Are you a doctor or did you play one on tv?  

[ColtsBlueFL]

2 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

How long is the recovery time for the bicep repair?  Generally speaking...

 

I can't predict that for Andrew Luck, anymore than his original surgery (hint: I didn't back then either).  Here's an article pointing out the low return rate for baseball pitchers after biceps tenodesis.  Maybe it is easier for a football QB, maybe not.  Nevertheless, it's harder for a QB to recover than a typical non athlete, just as it is much easier for a baseball position player to return to play than a baseball pitcher.  Check out this article-

 

https://www.healio.com/orthopedics/sports-medicine/news/print/orthopedics-today/{e5e50cc5-d096-4f08-8a99-81ff2f170815}/baseball-players-see-low-return-to-play-after-biceps-tenodesis-for-slap-tears

 

36 minutes ago, deedub75 said:

 

Well put!  Are you a doctor or did you play one on tv?  

On TV...     and I do stay at Holiday Inn EXPRESS a lot... (I like them)

 

OTOH, even though there's no M.D. after my name, i have been deeply involved in the medical field since 1979.  I do not live in Indiana. I'll leave it at that.

 

{disclaimer- my opinions are my own only and do not reflect those of my employer(s), colleagues, or associates.}

[colt18]

Boy, the previous regime really ruined Luck's recovery, smh

[Aluckiswolverine]

Crazy to think Grigson and Pagano ruined Lucks career. I think he will be back but if not I blame those 2. 

 

 

[Smoke317]

10 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

I can't predict that for Andrew Luck, anymore than his original surgery (hint: I didn't back then either).  Here's an article pointing out the low return rate for baseball pitchers after biceps tenodesis.  Maybe it is easier for a football QB, maybe not.  Nevertheless, it's harder for a QB to recover than a typical non athlete, just as it is much easier for a baseball position player to return to play than a baseball pitcher.  Check out this article-

 

https://www.healio.com/orthopedics/sports-medicine/news/print/orthopedics-today/{e5e50cc5-d096-4f08-8a99-81ff2f170815}/baseball-players-see-low-return-to-play-after-biceps-tenodesis-for-slap-tears

 

On TV...     and I do stay at Holiday Inn EXPRESS a lot... (I like them)

 

OTOH, even though there's no M.D. after my name, i have been deeply involved in the medical field since 1979.  I do not live in Indiana. I'll leave it at that.

 

{disclaimer- my opinions are my own only and do not reflect those of my employer(s), colleagues, or associates.}

Damn that sucks.  Good read though.  Sounds like Luck may be better off going the rehab route & only attempting the bicep surgery as a last option...  I hope his career isn’t ruined.  He’s a joy to watch ball out.