Colts have traded Jerry Hughes for Bills LB Kelvin Sheppard

[Colts_Fan12]

I certainly dont agree Sheppard is an upgrade over Angerer......Angerer had 148 tackles in 2011 as a starter, 2 forced fumbles and a pick and 1 sack, in 15 starts last year for Sheppard he had 80 tackles 2 sacks and 1 pass defensed, Now I get its not alla bout stats but the NFL is a production business, dont produce and your expendable

Wasn't Pats best year when he was playing in a 4-3 tho?

[Gavin]

Sheppard graded out better than Angerer in 2011 by pro football focus, if you put stock into them

I'd have to see there reasoning, it seems way way far fetched that he would warrant a better grade

[Luck_Is_Skilled]

If Brown is healthy he will be a dangerous change of pace Back who can start even needed, assuming we have an O line that can block this year

Maybe we can use this as a "selling point" to trick someone into agreeing to trade for him.

[TKnight24]

We're constantly trading man. Makes you wonder who's next?

I know some of the guys on the team have to be shaking in their shoes thinking they could be the next one out the door

[Coltscodeblue]

All in all it was a good trade no matter all the things people in the last 5 pages of this thread say, J.Hughes was a 3rd round talent taken as a 1st and Sheppard is a 3rd round talent so it was an even trade, both showed at times good plays, J.Hughes was expendable and with P.Angerer injured most of last year so bring in another ILB was a good acquisition and a good solid trade, you all my argue semantics but it was an even trade and the money is so small that it's not a big deal anyway.

 

Again C.Pagano will bring out the best in K.Sheppard.....

 

Parafrazing TKnight85 from an earlier quote: you can't make everybody happy on this forum :}LOL

 

Go Colts!!!!!

In Grigson I trust!!!!!

[Balzer40]

You can't predict it, but it's bound to happen.  A few no-names like Freeman and Shipley always come along and make their mark.  After camp and few injuries pop up(as they always do) the depth chart and player rotations will look nothing like people are predicting today. 

 

 

 

there is no doubt that 1 or possibly even 2 make it on the final roster, but I've seen people predicting 4 or 5 make it and that is completely insane.

[HtownColt]

I'd have to see there reasoning, it seems way way far fetched that he would warrant a better grade

They just said that Sheppard was their 28th rated ILB in 2011 better than Angerer and Lawrence Timmons

[John Adams]

A Bills fan came over to weigh in. I have nothing against Kelvin Sheppard and your muted reaction is probably right. He's not been much of a player in Buffalo, and despite a good D-Line, never did jack behind them. He often ends up running into their backs and I don't recall him ever making a single play since he was in Buffalo. There was almost no chance he was making the Bills this year. 

 

I have no idea if Hughes will help much, so I figure it's your junk for our junk, but I believe Hughes has more upside (though it costs a little more). Sheppard is probably making his last stop before he's out to pasture. 

 

Anyways, good luck (except when playing the Bills). 

[House]

Until this offseason, I never realize how personally invested members were in some of these players.

Hughes was a bust, despite potential it's time to move on. Sticking with guys who aren't helping us for too long, is how this franchise got into trouble in the first place.

[House]

Side note, Polian has to feel a strong slap to the face everytime Grigson unloads one of his guys. One by one by one lol.

[Gavin]

Wasn't Pats best year when he was playing in a 4-3 tho?

yep but he also had 28 tackles in just 3 starts in a 3-4, 

[Gavin]

They just said that Sheppard was their 28th rated ILB in 2011 better than Angerer and Lawrence Timmons

I dont buy it, not even close, Timmons had 93 tackles in 2011, 2 sacks, a pick and a forced fumble

[ColtsDude27]

Really interesting IMO. Wanted to give Hughes one more year but like a previous poster said writing was on the wall. Kinda like Kelvin Sheppard though...

[HtownColt]

I dont buy it, not even close, Timmons had 93 tackles in 2011, 2 sacks, a pick and a forced fumble

Here is the whole paragraph from them:

"Sheppard was announced the starter on Oct. 17 and from week 8 on, he started in every game and played in 385 of the team’s 649 defensive snaps in that timeframe. Sure, he wasn’t an every-down LB, but he was efficient in his play and was grading out effectively in his play. He only had one week where he graded negatively in run defense, but his pass coverage and efficiency in the passing game is what needs improvement. His tackle/snap percentage was impressive in his 385 snaps as starter. He recorded a solo tackle on 11.9% of his snaps and a tackle/assist on 14.8% of his snaps. In just 433 snaps, Sheppard was the 28th ranked ILB, grading out better than guys like Lawrence Timmons, Pat Angerer and Rey Maualuga during the season. Overall, Sheppard graded out a +5.8. His +8.5 grade against the run clearly displayed his run stopping abilities that Buffalo hoped they were getting when they drafted him in the 3rd round."

[John Waylon]

Well, ok. That's cool, I'm just trying to figure out why. I mean, ILB is a position we are, in all honesty, really strong at. We signed Walden to "set the edge" and the drafted Werner to do the same, so outside of Mathis, Hughes was really our only blitzer. If Mathis happens to miss time, who are we gonna use at rush?

 

I certainly think we got the better talent end of the deal, his production far outshines Hughes', and a team who is running a 4-3 defense traded for a guy who floundered in a 4-3 previously. Just another bad move by the Bills. Buddy Nix and Doug Marrone reached to draft their "franchise QB" in a guy who was a day 3 pick otherwise, and it's going to be the downfall of them both. This move is just another nail in their coffin.

 

I just wish made more obvious sense for us.

[Superman]

You are completely over thinking this! There is one major flaw in your thinking though...Sheppard wasn't good against the run last yr..

 

According to what?

[Buck Showalter]

Montori Hughes is brought in Jerry Hughes is shipped out...

Apparently there is a one Hughes limit...

BWAHAHAHAHA....

if someone already made this joke I appologize, I did not read six pages of this...

maybe I should just appologize for the joke anyways...

[ztboiler]

Maybe the coaches just didn't like Hughes' attitude/personality/etc. I don't have anything against him, or know the relationship between him and the rest of the team, but sometimes you just don't get along with someone for whatever reason. 

You make a good point, because at the very least, it is our staff making a conclusive judgement about the career value of Jerry Hughes.  We play essentially the same scheme as Buffalo now and we gave him up for a player of less positional value.  I like the trade, but you don't give up a pass rusher if you believe in him.

[Superman]

I don't see why everyone is getting psyched over this trade. We trade an OLB who showed signs of improvement after being switched to OLB in the 3/4...Why? Because we picked up and drafted a few OLBs who we have never seen play on our team, and have no idea if they are going to be better than Hughes in his second year in the system or not. In return we get an underwhelming Bills player; I don't see anything to get excited about.

Hughes is not the greatest player in the league, but he is not as bad as many on this board make him out to be. I can't wait to see who the herd names as the next forum whipping boy.

 

Personally, I'm not psyched about it. I'm concerned about what this does for our depth at pass rusher. But I do think we got the better player, based on past production. Hughes was a reserve/rotational player for us, Sheppard will probably be a starter/rotational player, and at a position with arguably less competition at the top of the draft chart.

 

By the way, Hughes and Brown had co-forum whipping boy honors. Now I think Brown will share that with Fleener for a while, with honorable mention to Cassius Vaughn.

[Superman]

Well, ok. That's cool, I'm just trying to figure out why. I mean, ILB is a position we are, in all honesty, really strong at. We signed Walden to "set the edge" and the drafted Werner to do the same, so outside of Mathis, Hughes was really our only blitzer. If Mathis happens to miss time, who are we gonna use at rush?

 

I certainly think we got the better talent end of the deal, his production far outshines Hughes', and a team who is running a 4-3 defense traded for a guy who floundered in a 4-3 previously. Just another bad move by the Bills. Buddy Nix and Doug Marrone reached to draft their "franchise QB" in a guy who was a day 3 pick otherwise, and it's going to be the downfall of them both. This move is just another nail in their coffin.

 

I just wish made more obvious sense for us.

 

I agree with your concerns; I don't agree that we were "strong" at ILB.

[Buck Showalter]

Watch Hughes turn into a Pro-bowler ala Tim Jennings...

[GOCOLTS_ROLLTIDE]

All in all it was a good trade no matter all the things people in the last 5 pages of this thread say, J.Hughes was a 3rd round talent taken as a 1st and Sheppard is a 3rd round talent so it was an even trade, both showed at times good plays, J.Hughes was expendable and with P.Angerer injured most of last year so bring in another ILB was a good acquisition and a good solid trade, you all my argue semantics but it was an even trade and the money is so small that it's not a big deal anyway.

Again C.Pagano will bring out the best in K.Sheppard.....

Parafrazing TKnight85 from an earlier quote: you can't make everybody happy on this forum :}LOL

Go Colts!!!!!

In Grigson I trust!!!!!

Donald Brown, cassius Vaughn, Mike Mcglyn for Adrian Peterson... If that doesn't make everyone on the forum happy idk what will. ..

[Bleedin Blue]

kinda sucks, Hughes was never given a real chance to show anything. he has been stuck behind Mathis and Freeney. and now when he gets the opportunity he gets traded.  

 

I don't agree with this.  He's been given many changes to show pass rush ability.  He's been borderline invisible as a pass rusher and he is a liability in space as a pass defender.  I'm glad we cut bait.

[ztboiler]

Well, ok. That's cool, I'm just trying to figure out why. I mean, ILB is a position we are, in all honesty, really strong at. We signed Walden to "set the edge" and the drafted Werner to do the same, so outside of Mathis, Hughes was really our only blitzer. If Mathis happens to miss time, who are we gonna use at rush?

 

I certainly think we got the better talent end of the deal, his production far outshines Hughes', and a team who is running a 4-3 defense traded for a guy who floundered in a 4-3 previously. Just another bad move by the Bills. Buddy Nix and Doug Marrone reached to draft their "franchise QB" in a guy who was a day 3 pick otherwise, and it's going to be the downfall of them both. This move is just another nail in their coffin.

 

I just wish made more obvious sense for us.

Buffalo plays essentially the same scheme as we do now.

[John Waylon]

I agree with your concerns; I don't agree that we were "strong" at ILB.

Well, with Freeman, Conner, and Angerer we have two starters and a quality spell man. If one of them were to be injured it would muddy things a bit, but it wouldn't be like we would be totally sunk in the middle.

[Superman]

Well, with Freeman, Conner, and Angerer we have two starters and a quality spell man. If one of them were to be injured it would muddy things a bit, but it wouldn't be like we would be totally sunk in the middle.

 

I think Freeman is a solid starter. Conner has his limitations, but is a good part of a rotation. Same with Angerer. But I think the position was -- and still is -- very upgradable. I see Sheppard as a bigger and more agile Conner, personally.

 

The position was screaming for attention, but I wouldn't go so far as to call it "strong."

[FearTheNeckBeard]

I don't mind the trade.. With Werner full time oposite to Mathis.. again.. no place for Hughes.. and he proved he's no show in reduced snaps.. maybe playing "starter" snaps with Bills he may turn out to be a decent DE/OLB

[Balzer40]

According to what?

 

 

 

This, and everything else I've read and heard on him.

 

 

 

 

 

Colts acquired LB Kelvin Sheppard from the Bills in exchange for LB Jerry Hughes.

A 2011 third-round pick, Sheppard started 24 games the past two seasons, including 15 at MIKE linebacker in 2012. Sheppard may compete with Kavell Conner at left inside linebacker in Indianapolis, but played just 521 snaps despite "starting" last season, and fared poorly against the run.

 

 

[John Waylon]

Buffalo plays essentially the same scheme as we do now.

HAHAHAHA!

 

So, let me get this straight...

 

Not only did the whole drafting EJ Manuel debacle transpire, but Buddy Nix hires a guy who wants to run a defense that will make a DE they took, who didn't translate into a good rush LB, a guy they gave a massive, cap choking contract to, an OLB again?

 

Seriously, say all you want about the 31 other teams in the NFL, in the last 5 years the Bills have been the worst run organization in all of the NFL. 

From the hiring of chan gailey, the way they gave Ryan Fitzpatrick a deal to make him the franchise QB, and in the exact same breath declared an intent to draft a franchise QB, to drafting EJ freaking Manuel in the middle of the first, to all the other stuff they have done, the Bills have very stealthily become the biggest joke in the NFL.

 

And the Jets have tried so very, very hard...

[Insert Colts Pun Here]

This, and everything else I've read and heard on him.

I've seen reports that claim he's good against the run but poor in coverage and others that say the exact opposite.

In my opinion, he's good against the run and decent in coverage. I don't think he struggles with or is particularly poor at either.

I also think he'll become our best linebacker pretty quickly.

Of course, you may feel free to completely discount everything I just said. What do I know after all? Just thought I'd share my opinion on the guy.

[Superman]

 

This, and everything else I've read and heard on him.

 

 

 

Link?

 

Not that I don't believe you, but what makes that quote gospel?

 

Another thing, is that conclusion taking into account the scheme changes in Buffalo?

 

Last thing, I'm not arguing that he was a great run defender last season. But I'm not just taking the Internet's word for it, either. And even if he was, he has attributes that fit our defense, and has produced fairly well in a similar scheme.  I guess this is an auxiliary part of an already auxiliary discussion. I'm just saying I'm not worried about Sheppard's play against the run. He ought to fit our hybrid front better than he did the Bills four down front last season.

[Insert Colts Pun Here]

We're constantly trading man. Makes you wonder who's next?

I know some of the guys on the team have to be shaking in their shoes thinking they could be the next one out the door

At least they'd be guaranteed a job with a trade! Its much better than being cut!

[braveheartcolt]

I felt a lot better about Hughes than I ever did about Brown.

Maybe we can use Brown to fleece someone out of a decent cornerback.

Are you the cousin of the poster who saw flashes of brilliance in Hughes?

[Kyle]

You build ur team to win ur division.

 

our division RBs: Foster, CJ, MJD

 

our division QBs: Schaub, Locker, Gabbert

 

I really like what we our doing these last 2 off seasons!

[Superman]

HAHAHAHA!

 

So, let me get this straight...

 

Not only did the whole drafting EJ Manuel debacle transpire, but Buddy Nix hires a guy who wants to run a defense that will make a DE they took, who didn't translate into a good rush LB, a guy they gave a massive, cap choking contract to, an OLB again?

 

Seriously, say all you want about the 31 other teams in the NFL, in the last 5 years the Bills have been the worst run organization in all of the NFL. 

From the hiring of chan gailey, the way they gave Ryan Fitzpatrick a deal to make him the franchise QB, and in the exact same breath declared an intent to draft a franchise QB, to drafting EJ freaking Manuel in the middle of the first, to all the other stuff they have done, the Bills have very stealthily become the biggest joke in the NFL.

 

And the Jets have tried so very, very hard...

 

The Bills have been a joke, but what was wrong with Mario Williams as a rush linebacker? He actually did pretty well, he just got hurt and missed 11 games.

 

He reportedly didn't want to continue being a rush linebacker, so there's that. But he didn't do a bad job of it, in my humble estimation.

[Balzer40]

Link?

 

Not that I don't believe you, but what makes that quote gospel?

 

Another thing, is that conclusion taking into account the scheme changes in Buffalo?

 

Last thing, I'm not arguing that he was a great run defender last season. But I'm not just taking the Internet's word for it, either. And even if he was, he has attributes that fit our defense, and has produced fairly well in a similar scheme.  I guess this is an auxiliary part of an already auxiliary discussion. I'm just saying I'm not worried about Sheppard's play against the run. He ought to fit our hybrid front better than he did the Bills four down front last season.

 

 

 

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/6620/kelvin-sheppard

[HtownColt]

Pro football focus did a tackling efficiency stat in November that had Kelvin Sheppard ranked 18th and just 2 missed tackles out of all inside linebackers and 4-3 outside linebackers, and Moise Fokou was one of the worst in this statistic.

Tackling efficiency is determined by – (Tackles + assists + missed tackles) / Missed tackles.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/15/signature-stat-snapshot-tackle-efficiency/

[John Waylon]

The Bills have been a joke, but what was wrong with Mario Williams as a rush linebacker? He actually did pretty well, he just got hurt and missed 11 games.

 

He reportedly didn't want to continue being a rush linebacker, so there's that. But he didn't do a bad job of it, in my humble estimation.

He just didn't seem to handle the conversion very well, ala Freeney.

[bayone]

no Castanzo was.

 

 

No. AC.

 

 

Castonzo was

 

 

Was Hughes the Polian's last first round pick?

 

Hughes # 31  2010

 

AC # 22 in 2011

[Crazycoltsfan12]

1. I'm chill

2. I know who's better

3. Still doesn't answer why

why not?