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Move the sticks-Colts having debate whether to take tackle or another weapon for Wentz


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18 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

 

I listen to locked on Colts but sometimes I swear they point out the obvious and think that its breaking news haha

I don’t know if that is obvious. I would say I wouldn’t expect them to take a WR over a tackle at 21. He does exaggerate what people say sometimes and adds his own commentary which I don’t like.

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We can still add great weapons on Day 2. Nico Collins would be a great addition to the offense. Plus with a healthy Campbell and Mack coming back I hope they use Hines as a more pass threat. Get the ball in these guys hands and let them get YAC. 

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14 minutes ago, DaColts85 said:

We can still add great weapons on Day 2. Nico Collins would be a great addition to the offense. Plus with a healthy Campbell and Mack coming back I hope they use Hines as a more pass threat. Get the ball in these guys hands and let them get YAC. 

Agree. We need to keep our new franchise QB upright and safe. And get the other team’s QB on the ground. Which means no toys for Wentz until after the 2nd round!

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I’m in the tackle over the weapon camp. 
 

That said...   but once again, I’d ask the same question many of us ask whenever a rumor like this leaks....

 

How?  Would?   They?   Know??

 

How would ANYONE know?

 

The Colts RARELY leak.   So I’d question and doubt these kind of leaks.  
 

Plus, Ballard is a build the trenches guy, also, this a great and deep WR class.  So we could take tackle with our first pick, and a wide receiver with our second, and we would have addressed both of our concerns. 
 

Hard to imagine this is a big debate...  but I guess you never know...  

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Unless the T is a elite type 10 year plus franchise LT, I'd rather get a playmaking weapon if available at #21.....especially when 3 of our weapons TY, Campbell, and Mack have issues of staying on the Field and our TE group is pedestrian. 

A non-elite T should be found in round 2 in this deep OL class.

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4 hours ago, Zoltan said:

 

I listen to locked on Colts but sometimes I swear they point out the obvious and think that its breaking news haha

All they do is tweet out the most obvious information 

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I'm trying to imagine a scenario where one of the Bama guys slip into the late teens which should become striking range for us, that would be ideal imo, given we miss out on the elite tackles. It's just hard to imagine them getting past NY/Philly/NE. NE going QB could help.

 

 

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I feel like we need to get in front of Washington @ 19. They're going to snipe either an elite T or WR I feel and I'm going to punch my WFT supporter friend that I'll be watching with. Miami would probably be willing to move off of 18.

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26 minutes ago, 07dleigh said:

I feel like we need to get in front of Washington @ 19. They're going to snipe either an elite T or WR I feel and I'm going to punch my WFT supporter friend that I'll be watching with. Miami would probably be willing to move off of 18.

I don't see Ballard giving up a couple of day two or three picks to move up a couple of spots when we don't even have a 3rd.   

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10 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I don't see Ballard giving up a couple of day two or three picks to move up a couple of spots when we don't even have a 3rd.   

 

No yeah I don't either realistically. I don't even see us picking Thursday altogether in actuality. A pipe dream of mine. 

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14 hours ago, Wentzszn said:

I don’t know if that is obvious. I would say I wouldn’t expect them to take a WR over a tackle at 21. He does exaggerate what people say sometimes and adds his own commentary which I don’t like.

Ok on the exaggerating, but adding his own take.....I mean, it's his podcast, not an AP release..... What is he supposed to do?

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1 hour ago, richard pallo said:

I don't see Ballard giving up a couple of day two or three picks to move up a couple of spots when we don't even have a 3rd.   

I'm in the boat of, we don't even need an elite T..... Despite what people say, Castonzos best attributes were consistency and durability.... He was solid, but he wasn't elite.  I'd be fine with getting a Braden Smith level OT, a really good one..... And that's likely available in rd. 2, I'd love a trade down and take BPA with whatever their first pick ends up at, and an OT with 54

 

 

 

 

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I have seen that on some mock drafts that Carlos Basham Wake rising too bottom have of 1st rd nfl good morning football reported he is. I like him and I like Ossai from Texas. Both are in 270 range. I like them both also But DE Northern Iowa Emerson Smith is rising up draft boards This article was from KSTP 5 Sports reported by Darren Wolfson. 2019 stats 14 sacks and 21 for loss! I like him Too

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13 hours ago, Wentzszn said:

 

Yeah, I just saw that... having watched Ballard draft players like Lewis, Basham, Green ... this is no surprise really. Basham fits almost to a T what Ballard seems to like from his LDEs. I wonder where he goes. If Payton Turner is gone at 54 IMO Basham would be a great pick there. No idea if he lasts until then though. 

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17 hours ago, Zoltan said:

 

I listen to locked on Colts but sometimes I swear they point out the obvious and think that its breaking news haha

and if Vegas took a betting line on their predictions...bet against whatever they predict

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Sounds like someone got a private screening of a future With the Next Pick episode. 

 

However, weapon is not necessarily WR...it could mean TE. I still think Friermuth is a very real possibility.

 

But this WR group is very strong...and I don't think the WR talent available at #54 will match the OT talent. So it's a pretty valid discussion to have. Right now, there's a good chance that 5-6 WRs go in the 1st round. And there's a chance that all of Bateman, Moore (both Elijah and Rondale) and Marshall are all gone by #54. Brown might be as well. 

 

So unless you love a guy in that 10-15 range...pulling the trigger when you can would be smart.

 

Also...they didn't add to the WR group this offseason (outside of a flyer on a guy like Nelson). And if not for Irsay stepping in, they would have let Hilton go as well. Contrast to TE...where they at least signed depth players who have actually started...seemingly setting them up to draft a developmental OT prospect outside of the 1st round.

 

Will be very interesting to see how it plays out. 

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1 hour ago, stitches said:

Yeah, I just saw that... having watched Ballard draft players like Lewis, Basham, Green ... this is no surprise really. Basham fits almost to a T what Ballard seems to like from his LDEs. I wonder where he goes. If Payton Turner is gone at 54 IMO Basham would be a great pick there. No idea if he lasts until then though. 

 

It does seem like a Ballard pick...and it seems like a very uninspiring 2nd round pick...shades of Tyquan Lewis. Like many Ballard picks...Basham is on the older side.

 

Give me someone younger with more projection. Turner would be alright. Would love to get a guy like Tryon as well.

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I don't see Ballard picking an offensive weapon early. Might use that as leverage though for teams really interested in a 1st round WR. But honestly, Ballard will either pick a Edge with #21 and OT in the 2nd. Or trade back to pick up a 3rd round pick. Because after our 2nd round pick #54, we're off the board for a long time until 4th round #127.

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17 hours ago, DaColts85 said:

We can still add great weapons on Day 2. Nico Collins would be a great addition to the offense. Plus with a healthy Campbell and Mack coming back I hope they use Hines as a more pass threat. Get the ball in these guys hands and let them get YAC. 

Maybe. Nick Collins has traits, but didn't exactly elevate the MI offense....

 Of course, I could play qb about as well as his did, so there's that...

 

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58 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

Sounds like someone got a private screening of a future With the Next Pick episode. 

 

However, weapon is not necessarily WR...it could mean TE. I still think Friermuth is a very real possibility.

 

But this WR group is very strong...and I don't think the WR talent available at #54 will match the OT talent. So it's a pretty valid discussion to have. Right now, there's a good chance that 5-6 WRs go in the 1st round. And there's a chance that all of Bateman, Moore (both Elijah and Rondale) and Marshall are all gone by #54. Brown might be as well. 

 

So unless you love a guy in that 10-15 range...pulling the trigger when you can would be smart.

 

Also...they didn't add to the WR group this offseason (outside of a flyer on a guy like Nelson). And if not for Irsay stepping in, they would have let Hilton go as well. Contrast to TE...where they at least signed depth players who have actually started...seemingly setting them up to draft a developmental OT prospect outside of the 1st round.

 

Will be very interesting to see how it plays out. 

Who did they sign at TE?  Jordan Thomas? Surely that's not who you are thinking actually factors into their draft strategy....Cox? Ok so you kept a depth guy that for whatever reason you haven't really utilized (lack of trust?).   MAC is no longer a basketball player, he's an NFL vet now, so he's nearing his ceiling.... I don't think they've even come close to alleviating the pressing need for a dynamic TE..... Certainly not to the point it lessens any need going into the draft.  WR either.....

 

 

 

 

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16 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Unless the T is a elite type 10 year plus franchise LT, I'd rather get a playmaking weapon if available at #21.....especially when 3 of our weapons TY, Campbell, and Mack have issues of staying on the Field and our TE group is pedestrian. 

A non-elite T should be found in round 2 in this deep OL class.

How's this, some other team picks at 21, and they take a OT and a weapon for the offense in round 2.... And we just decide to be trend setters and play with no one at DE this year lol

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17 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I’m in the tackle over the weapon camp. 
 

That said...   but once again, I’d ask the same question many of us ask whenever a rumor like this leaks....

 

How?  Would?   They?   Know??

 

How would ANYONE know?

 

The Colts RARELY leak.   So I’d question and doubt these kind of leaks.  
 

Plus, Ballard is a build the trenches guy, also, this a great and deep WR class.  So we could take tackle with our first pick, and a wide receiver with our second, and we would have addressed both of our concerns. 
 

Hard to imagine this is a big debate...  but I guess you never know...  

True.  but using your logic, the pool of OTs is significantly larger, and the dropoff from tier one to tier two much more gradual, than the situation at WR in the draft....for whatever that's worth

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5 hours ago, 07dleigh said:

I'm trying to imagine a scenario where one of the Bama guys slip into the late teens which should become striking range for us, that would be ideal imo, given we miss out on the elite tackles. It's just hard to imagine them getting past NY/Philly/NE. NE going QB could help.

 

 

If you trade into the teens, you haven't missed out on the top tier of OT though.

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35 minutes ago, Shafty138 said:

 And we just decide to be trend setters and play with no one at DE this year lol

 

Well that's on Ballard, not me. He ignored the position in FA & trades, and let Autry and maybe Houston walk knowing this years Edge class not so talented or deep...AND you seem to think he missed on his DE picks last couple seasons(Turay, Lewis,etc..)?

:thmup:

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47 minutes ago, Shafty138 said:

How's this, some other team picks at 21, and they take a OT and a weapon for the offense in round 2.... And we just decide to be trend setters and play with no one at DE this year lol

 

I DO THINK some other team will be picking at 21...... haha

 

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1 hour ago, Shafty138 said:

True.  but using your logic, the pool of OTs is significantly larger, and the dropoff from tier one to tier two much more gradual, than the situation at WR in the draft....for whatever that's worth

I don’t subscribe to that view.   I’ve been saying for months that the class is filled with guys who are more right tackle than left.   And picking at 54, I don’t like the odds of a tackle we like falling all the way to our pick. 
 

I just read an article from The Athletic.  The view of the tackle class from NFL personnel staff and scouts is this....

 

O-ver-rated!  
 

Id rather try to lock down that spot far more than DE.   

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1 hour ago, Shafty138 said:

Maybe. Nick Collins has traits, but didn't exactly elevate the MI offense....

 Of course, I could play qb about as well as his did, so there's that...

 

Nothing about Michigan’s offense is good so I am not worried about that at all. Senior Bowl and pro days this guy has shown he has what you want plus he has incredible size and speed. He is a talented 6’4” guy that can run routes and be an amazing Redzone target. 

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24 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I don’t subscribe to that view.   I’ve been saying for months that the class is filled with guys who are more right tackle than left.   And picking at 54, I don’t like the odds of a tackle we like falling all the way to our pick. 
 

I just read an article from The Athletic.  The view of the tackle class from NFL personnel staff and scouts is this....

 

O-ver-rated!  
 

Id rather try to lock down that spot far more than DE.   

I'd take that bet.... I don't think all of sewell, slater, darrisaw, little, jenkins, radunz, cosmi, Leatherwood, carman, eichenberg, and maybe a vera-tucker if you think he can play T, are gone by 54... And definitely not all gone if you trade out of the first, by the early second..... sure, a few are probably RT....(leatherwood). But I doubt most of them are not playing LT the majority of their careers and there seem to be enough for the teams in need of an OT

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5 minutes ago, Shafty138 said:

I'd take that bet.... I don't think all of sewell, slater, darrisaw, little, jenkins, radunz, cosmi, Leatherwood, carman, eichenberg, and maybe a vera-tucker if you think he can play T, are gone by 54... And definitely not all gone if you trade out of the first, by the early second..... sure, a few are probably RT....(leatherwood). But I doubt most of them are not playing LT the majority of their careers and there seem to be enough for the teams in need of an OT

 

Read my post again. 

 

I didn't say all those tackles would be gone.    I said I didn't like the odds of the tackle we would like would still be there.

 

Big difference.    

 

And with the tackle spot,  I don't want to settle for the best of what's left over.    I'd rather do that with Edge or WR.

 

If we only get one spot right this week,  I want it to be Left Tackle.   The others, while important,  are less important to me.

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I'm more or less coming to the conclusion that as long as our picks help out team I'm happy. I of course have my preference of OT at 21 and DE at 54, but in reality I hope we stick pretty close to our board be it a CB, WR, LB, etc...

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3 hours ago, Shafty138 said:

True.  but using your logic, the pool of OTs is significantly larger, and the dropoff from tier one to tier two much more gradual, than the situation at WR in the draft....for whatever that's worth

WR is very deep this year.  So is corner.  So is OT.  Dropoff will be factored in of course but I doubt it drives the decision.

 

The Colts just gambled big time on Wentz.  It was an informed gamble with a coach who knows and loves him but it's still a gamble and they need to double down to ensure he's protected.  You can't mess around with LT.

 

If LT is there in round one for them then LT will be the pick.  If not, then you're talking trade down to ensure value on the next tier option, or reaching for that option, or waiting until round 2.  I would guess move down is preferred at that point but who's on the board staring them in the face?  They may have to take that player if the value is great and then move up from round 2 if necessary.

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