Colts activate Pittman

[EastStreet]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Harris to PS during this week.  I figured he'd be retained instead of Fountain, but was wrong.  IMO, Harris will be called up before Fountain will though.  I think Harris just needs more reps on the PS whereas Fountain is kind of a known quantity at this point.

What we've heard from several (including Walker IIRC), and the reality is, we have a bunch of Fountain like guys, but are lacking the Harris type guys (speed slots) with PC out. That's why Fountain was at risk. He simply didn't get many snaps or targets, and when in, IIRC he was used as decoy on rubs and clear outs more than anything. 

 

Personally, I'd just prefer to see TY move to slot, and use the other guys on the outside. But it's really not a competition between Harris and Fountain. It's really a competition between Fountain, Johnson, Dulin, etc., and other outside guys more than anything. 

54 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

No one! Fountain is another Colts practice squad fan favorite, that’s it. He hasn’t done anything to warrant the love fest this forum has for him

He's played well in camp, and just not used. He's done nothing to not be liked by fans. And the favorite WR is always the guy not being played when the passing game is not doing well lol. Sometimes it's true, mostly it's not.

27 minutes ago, Indyfan4life said:

I just hope we get Pittman involved. Dude needs some catches.

I'm uber excited. He brings an element we've been missing for a long long time.

13 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

You guys are making me agree with Doug, that's how dumb this proposition is. 

Post of year candidate lol.... 

13 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

The question of whether we should move Hilton might be valid. If we were struggling to compete in the division or conference, it would be worth serious consideration. I brought it up earlier this season. 

This is where I'm at. We're all in on this season as far as I can think. The timing of a trade now would be silly. If you're going to do it at all, it would have been before the season. And I don't think we're an org to do that. Belichick would have though lol.

13 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

But getting rid of Hilton, to preserve a spot for Reece Fountain? This shouldn't be a thing. First, Fountain will probably be right back on the PS. Second, he has done nothing to warrant this kind of attention. This move is a footnote, because Fountain is a footnote. 

 

Meanwhile, Hilton has been a big part of the organization for nine seasons. 

 

The entire concept is nonsensical. 

yup. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Did Harris go back to the PS after the Bengals game? If so wonder if he is called up again. He provided something a little different.

[Dogg63]

11 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Did Harris go back to the PS after the Bengals game? If so wonder if he is called up again. He provided something a little different.

Yes, on Monday, Oct 19 they reverted Harris and Eldrenkamp to the PS.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, Indyfan4life said:

The issue, to me, seems that people think Fountain will outperform Hilton. Since Hilton isn't putting up 100 yards a game that he's bad. Fountain is the new Mike Hart.

Fountain is popular because Ballard drafted him.  Just like Cain was, for the same reason.

 

And also wishful with the type who never knew we had/have bad WR talent...for....years... or doesn't think it matters. 

 

Talk about dumb.

[richard pallo]

Dalton's not playing for the Cowboys tomorrow.  They should lose so we trade for Amari Cooper on Tuesday and move TY to the slot.  Problem solved.  

[Yoshinator]

Lot of responses to me, so I will address them in one post.

 

First off, I don't think Fountain is better than TY. I think TY still has value and I'm trying to trade him before he loses all his value by the end of the year. By doing this it would of opened up a spot to activate Pittman without having to release Fountain.

 

Second. Everyone who is disagreeing with me is thinking like an emotional fan. You don't want to lose Hilton, loyalty, the best receiver on the team and all that junk. I'm thinking like a GM. I'm thinking of it as a business. TY is an asset, an asset with value that is losing value as his career goes on. What is he worth to the Colts anymore? What is he worth to other teams? Right now, not that much. Parris Campbell was better than him when playing before he got injured. I believe that will be the case when he comes back, and he is much younger. Rivers doesn't favor Hilton like Luck did, he spreads the ball around. Hilton isn't very important, he's replaceable to us. Time to take Hilton, trade him for a pick, and get an asset that you can have for 10 more years. WR's are replaceable. They are easy to find. Hilton isn't any better than Pascal, Marcus Johnson, and hopefully not Pittman or Campbell anymore. He's just a JAG.

 

Time to get something Ballard can use going forward to get us a player that is 10 years younger and let him work his magic. Better to trade him a year too early, than a year late and get nothing in return. This locker room is fine without him. It has been before, it will be after, and now Pittman is back as well. Trade deadline is here, get what you can for him.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I think everyone was rooting for Fountain because that injury. But he just can’t compete with how good Johnson has been.

[Superman]

22 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Lot of responses to me, so I will address them in one post.

 

First off, I don't think Fountain is better than TY. I think TY still has value and I'm trying to trade him before he loses all his value by the end of the year. By doing this it would of opened up a spot to activate Pittman without having to release Fountain.

 

Second. Everyone who is disagreeing with me is thinking like an emotional fan. You don't want to lose Hilton, loyalty, the best receiver on the team and all that junk. I'm thinking like a GM. I'm thinking of it as a business. TY is an asset, an asset with value that is losing value as his career goes on. What is he worth to the Colts anymore? What is he worth to other teams? Right now, not that much. Parris Campbell was better than him when playing before he got injured. I believe that will be the case when he comes back, and he is much younger. Rivers doesn't favor Hilton like Luck did, he spreads the ball around. Hilton isn't very important, he's replaceable to us. Time to take Hilton, trade him for a pick, and get an asset that you can have for 10 more years. WR's are replaceable. They are easy to find. Hilton isn't any better than Pascal, Marcus Johnson, and hopefully not Pittman or Campbell anymore. He's just a JAG.

 

Time to get something Ballard can use going forward to get us a player that is 10 years younger and let him work his magic. Better to trade him a year too early, than a year late and get nothing in return. This locker room is fine without him. It has been before, it will be after, and now Pittman is back as well. Trade deadline is here, get what you can for him.

 

1) I understand that your proposition isn't about Hilton vs. Fountain. But that was the original premise, right? And since this a Saturday morning move, trading Hilton isn't really on the table. The original premise was 'we should have gotten rid of Hilton rather than Fountain,' so the responses about Hilton vs. Fountain aren't really directed at you. At least, mine were not.

 

2a) You're one of the most emotional posters on this site. So the first bolded is rich.

 

2b) The second bolded is dead wrong. And I like a lot of our young guys. (I don't want to argue this. We can just agree to disagree.)

 

2c) The Colts are still in the race for 2020, and Hilton is our best receiver. (Again, we disagree.) You're claiming on one hand that Hilton could bring back a fourth (another point of disagreement, from my standpoint), while on the other hand claiming that he's not worth very much to either the Colts or anyone else. I said earlier that I don't think a team like the Packers would give up a 4th for a 30 year old receiver on an expiring contract. So if WRs are replaceable and easy to find, then why have the Colts struggled to find someone to complement Hilton -- we're talking seven years now -- and why would a contending team give up a 4th rounder for 8-9 games of his service? I think you're making conflicting arguments here.

 

3) It's rare for teams that are in contention to trade away mainstay players at the trade deadline. Teams that are not in contention trade away malcontented players who are unlikely to re-sign. Sometimes, good teams trade away really good players that they won't be able to afford (which is where the Belichick protocol comes into play). So your insistence that you're thinking like a GM doesn't quite hold up. A team like the Colts, at 4-2, trading away a player like Hilton, isn't something that most GMs would do.

 

Additionally, if the Colts move on from Hilton after this season and he signs somewhere else, we'd be likely to get at least a fifth round comp pick for him. So 'getting nothing' isn't really what we're worried about here.

 

Lastly, you can offer the 'unemotional business decision' characterization of this idea as a reason to disregard the locker room and team culture, but just because you don't value Hilton's impact to the locker room and team culture doesn't mean his impact has no value. This is another point of disagreement.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Lot of responses to me, so I will address them in one post.

 

First off, I don't think Fountain is better than TY. I think TY still has value and I'm trying to trade him before he loses all his value by the end of the year. By doing this it would of opened up a spot to activate Pittman without having to release Fountain.

 

Second. Everyone who is disagreeing with me is thinking like an emotional fan. You don't want to lose Hilton, loyalty, the best receiver on the team and all that junk. I'm thinking like a GM. I'm thinking of it as a business. TY is an asset, an asset with value that is losing value as his career goes on. What is he worth to the Colts anymore? What is he worth to other teams? Right now, not that much. Parris Campbell was better than him when playing before he got injured. I believe that will be the case when he comes back, and he is much younger. Rivers doesn't favor Hilton like Luck did, he spreads the ball around. Hilton isn't very important, he's replaceable to us. Time to take Hilton, trade him for a pick, and get an asset that you can have for 10 more years. WR's are replaceable. They are easy to find. Hilton isn't any better than Pascal, Marcus Johnson, and hopefully not Pittman or Campbell anymore. He's just a JAG.

 

Time to get something Ballard can use going forward to get us a player that is 10 years younger and let him work his magic. Better to trade him a year too early, than a year late and get nothing in return. This locker room is fine without him. It has been before, it will be after, and now Pittman is back as well. Trade deadline is here, get what you can for him.

My response wasn't emotional.  There are business decisions that go beyond the talent vs pick equation. 

 

Its not like we have decided we don't why TY back next year.  And the 4th round pick is just going to get us more depth JAGS, which we already have aside from Pittman and Campbell, both of whom are second round picks that the new 4th round guy won't displace.

 

All we're doing is risking losing TY if he plays better, with only our typical off the team/on the team revolving door talent to replace him this year.

 

And, if we keep him this year and he signs elsewhere in the spring, we might get a 4th round pick anyway, albeit a year later.

 

To me, it all adds up to keeping a family member in the family hoping that production improves, until the employment contract runs out.  Then you talk business.

[jshipp23]

4 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Actually, @csmopar had half the answer right. The perfect situation was to trade Hilton for a good draft pick, keep Fountain on the 53, and then activate Pittman to the 53 man roster. That would of been perfect to sell Hilton before he declines and get Pittman and Fountain on the 53. After that, when Campbell comes up, he can take the Hilton role over and you have a extra solid draft pick for next year.

Depends on pick..for a high 3 rd maybe

[Myles]

Almost humorous that people who say WR is one of the Colts weakest position are the same ones who want to trade the Colts best WR.  Would the team be better this season without Hilton.  Obviously not.  The Colts are 4-2 and they want to throw in the towel.  

Especially dumb would be giving up Hilton and a 4th round comp pick for only a 4th round pick.

[holeymoley99]

Hilton is making plays , just unfortunate penalties have negated some of his best and some of the others resulted in P.I. calls which we gained yardage (Have said before wish NFL kept track of yards gained through P.I. drawn for players, they are just as good as catches in reality) . I'm not saying he is what he was just saying he doesnt seem to have fallen off a cliff either. As for Fountain, small school guy who has measurables (Nothing like Cain who helped lead Clemson to a national title vs the best NCAA competition and had even better measurables ), injury put him behind and doesnt look fully back while others have passed him like Johnson and even Harris.  Hope he gets a P.S. spot somewhere if not us and hope he eventually makes it as a team's 5th or 6th WR, that is likely his upside.

[csmopar]

6 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

That would be a mistake. He’s more worth to us at least requiring safety over the top every now and then than in any trade. Just my two cents.

 

When Pittman and Campbell are back, his production will go up. 

 

6 hours ago, Superman said:

 

This is a joke right?

 

6 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

Is that you Bill O'Brian? 

I was being sarcastic. 
 

that said, this is a what have you done for me lately league and so far, I’ve not seen the TY of old since December 2018. I’d be fine with moving on, I really don’t think we’d suffer much if any loss

[Superman]

33 minutes ago, csmopar said:

I was being sarcastic. 

 

Got you. Didn't mean to overreact.

[danlhart87]

I would have been fine trading Hilton but now with his production Colts would be lucky to even get a 6th. 

[GoColts8818]

I think TY provides more value on the roster for the Colts than anything he’s going to bring back in a trade.  With one the number two WR out for an extended period of time if not the year and the number three WR being a rookie working his way back from injury I don’t think trading your number one when you are 4-2 is what many NFL teams would do in that situation.  
 

it’s clear TY is struggling and I do think some of that is age but I also think some of it is that TY is the only player in the Colts passing attacking teams fear so they blanket him.  If the Colts can establish another weapon on a consistent basis I think you will see TY’s production go up.

[GoColts8818]

6 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Lot of responses to me, so I will address them in one post.

 

First off, I don't think Fountain is better than TY. I think TY still has value and I'm trying to trade him before he loses all his value by the end of the year. By doing this it would of opened up a spot to activate Pittman without having to release Fountain.

 

Second. Everyone who is disagreeing with me is thinking like an emotional fan. You don't want to lose Hilton, loyalty, the best receiver on the team and all that junk. I'm thinking like a GM. I'm thinking of it as a business. TY is an asset, an asset with value that is losing value as his career goes on. What is he worth to the Colts anymore? What is he worth to other teams? Right now, not that much. Parris Campbell was better than him when playing before he got injured. I believe that will be the case when he comes back, and he is much younger. Rivers doesn't favor Hilton like Luck did, he spreads the ball around. Hilton isn't very important, he's replaceable to us. Time to take Hilton, trade him for a pick, and get an asset that you can have for 10 more years. WR's are replaceable. They are easy to find. Hilton isn't any better than Pascal, Marcus Johnson, and hopefully not Pittman or Campbell anymore. He's just a JAG.

 

Time to get something Ballard can use going forward to get us a player that is 10 years younger and let him work his magic. Better to trade him a year too early, than a year late and get nothing in return. This locker room is fine without him. It has been before, it will be after, and now Pittman is back as well. Trade deadline is here, get what you can for him.

Does that include Ballard since he doesn’t seem to be looking to trade Hilton?

[GoColts8818]

10 hours ago, csmopar said:

Hilton.

Yeah no.  Can people stop trying to be the smartest person in the room and having controversial takes so they can go back and say look at me the one time they are right out of 100?  To be fair that isn’t 100% directed at you.  That’s just become a disturbing trend around here and this post made me think of it.  With that. Said i don’t think you are always trying to be the smartest person in the room.
 

I also don’t get the love for Fountain some have.  Don’t get me wrong I am pulling for the guy to come back from the injury he had but I am not going to suggest keeping him over Hilton.  I know Hilton is having a very down season but hes still done more this year than Fountain has.  Fountain has barely played and the little he has he hasn’t looked good.  Also, and I know you aren’t the person who said this so this isn’t directed at you I just don’t want to make a second post since I am already on the subject, but why fear not getting him back?  What’s he done to make you think teams are going to be lining up to sign him?  If it were Marcus Johnson then yeah I’d say that fear was warranted but fearing it over Fountain is unrealistic.

[Yoshinator]

39 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

Does that include Ballard since he doesn’t seem to be looking to trade Hilton?

Well, you can't prove he isn't trying to trade Hilton. As to including Ballard to the bolded, I don't believe he has the capability of a Belichick yet where he can trade players one year before they decline or fall off. He hasn't got any experience at it though, because the players he did have when he joined at GM were mostly bad, and his drafted players since 2017 are all still young.

[GoColts8818]

6 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Well, you can't prove he isn't trying to trade Hilton. As to including Ballard to the bolded, I don't believe he has the capability of a Belichick yet where he can trade players one year before they decline or fall off. He hasn't got any experience at it though, because the players he did have when he joined at GM were mostly bad, and his drafted players since 2017 are all still young.

I have more evidence than just wildly throwing it out there that they should be and anyone who doesn’t think that way is just thinking like a fan.  The only place TY’s name is being mentioned in trade talks is here.  People who get paid to know this stuff aren’t reporting a thing about it.  There is zero evidence to suggest the Colts are trying to trade him and just saying well you can’t prove they aren’t doesn’t mean that idea has any truth behind it if there is zero to support it.  

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

I have more evidence than just wildly throwing it out there that they should be and anyone who doesn’t think that way is just thinking like a fan.  The only place TY’s name is being mentioned in trade talks is here.  People who get paid to know this stuff aren’t reporting a thing about it.  There is zero evidence to suggest the Colts are trying to trade him and just saying well you can’t prove they aren’t doesn’t mean that idea has any truth behind it if there is zero to support it.  

I would hope the trade we would eventually do (if we do one), doesn't get reported. Did you hear anything about the Buckner trade earlier this year? I didn't think so. If I would of suggested Buckner for a 1st before it happened, you would of shot that down as well. 

 

Ballard does stuff all the time that isn't what the obvious fan thinks. So I wouldn't count him out of doing something that hasn't been reported for weeks just yet.

[GoColts8818]

20 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I would hope the trade we would eventually do (if we do one), doesn't get reported. Did you hear anything about the Buckner trade earlier this year? I didn't think so. If I would of suggested Buckner for a 1st before it happened, you would of shot that down as well. 

 

Ballard does stuff all the time that isn't what the obvious fan thinks. So I wouldn't count him out of doing something that hasn't been reported for weeks just yet.

Until there is evidence that he’s actually looking into it from someone other than someone stating it’s what they should do on a message board and saying anyone who doesn’t think that way is just thinking like a fan I am going to assume it’s just made up by someone who wants to be smartest person in the room put zero stock in it.

[Yoshinator]

4 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

Until there is evidence that he’s actually looking into it from someone other than someone stating it’s what they should do on a message board and saying anyone who doesn’t think that way is just thinking like a fan I am going to assume it’s just made up by someone who wants to be smartest person in the room put zero stock in it.

So should we shut down the message board? You don't believe anything I say, I don't believe anything you say. We can only have credibility if it's the most likely, obvious thing that could happen. You are now treating Ballard like a fan thinking he can only do the most predictable things without 100% evidence, and you should know better than that seeing his past moves.

[GoColts8818]

40 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

So should we shut down the message board? You don't believe anything I say, I don't believe anything you say. We can only have credibility if it's the most likely, obvious thing that could happen. You are now treating Ballard like a fan thinking he can only do the most predictable things without 100% evidence, and you should know better than that seeing his past moves.

That’s not what I said but we shouldn’t assume just because someone on the message board says we should trade TY Hilton and anyone who disagrees with me is thinking like a fan means Ballard is thinking that when there is zero proof to suggest he is.

 

That would be like me saying Jim Irsay should sell the team to Vince McMahon and anyone who thinks otherwise is just wrong and just because you can’t prove he’s not thinking about it means it’s happening and I am right!  
 

Most of the time when you cant prove something is happening it’s because it’s not.  

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

That’s not what I said but we shouldn’t assume just because someone on the message board says we should trade TY Hilton and anyone who disagrees with me is thinking like a fan means Ballard is thinking that when there is zero proof to suggest he is.

 

That would be like me saying Jim Irsay should sell the team to Vince McMahon and anyone who thinks otherwise is just wrong and just because you can’t prove he’s not thinking about it means it’s happening and I am right!  
 

Most of the time when you cant prove something is happening it’s because it’s not.  

You're assuming Ballard can't do anything that isn't obvious to a fan. The Buckner trade wasn't obvious to the fans. How much Ballard got from the Jets in 2018 wasn't obvious to the fans. Free Agency is a surprise every year to the fans. Whomever Ballard drafts every year is a surprise to the fans every year. You won't acknowledge this because it destroys your argument. Ballard is unpredictable. GM's are unpredictable. It's not even just about TY Hilton in particular, it's the fact on this forum that people won't believe any prediction made unless it's rumored or extremely obvious. Whether I'm right or wrong on Hilton is irrelevent. It falls in line with an unpredictable move a GM could make that fans would never think of, and then get surprised at later when it happens. That's why people on here are reacting like fans when I suggest this, and that's why fans on 32 teams act like this when moves such as this happen to their favorite team and they get caught off guard.

[crazycolt1]

I think you guys are having the same thoughts, just wording it different. 

[GoColts8818]

27 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

EYou're assuming Ballard can't do anything that isn't obvious to a fan. The Buckner trade wasn't obvious to the fans. How much Ballard got from the Jets in 2018 wasn't obvious to the fans. Free Agency is a surprise every year to the fans. Whomever Ballard drafts every year is a surprise to the fans every year. You won't acknowledge this because it destroys your argument. Ballard is unpredictable. GM's are unpredictable. It's not even just about TY Hilton in particular, it's the fact on this forum that people won't believe any prediction made unless it's rumored or extremely obvious. Whether I'm right or wrong on Hilton is irrelevent. It falls in line with an unpredictable move a GM could make that fans would never think of, and then get surprised at later when it happens. That's why people on here are reacting like fans when I suggest this, and that's why fans on 32 teams act like this when moves such as this happen to their favorite team and they get caught off guard.

I didn’t say Ballard couldn’t do what was obvious to a fan but I also don’t think he’s thinking about trading TY.  Just because you think they should doesn’t mean it’s going to happen or even something Ballard is thinking about which is why I think you went too far when you said anyone who doesn’t think the Colts should trade TY is thinking like a fan because I don’t think the Colts GM is thinking about it.  
 

The reason why is that it doesn’t make sense.  Trading back to get more picks the year they got Nelson made sense.  Trading for Buckner made sense.  Also, no people didn’t nail the details on those moves but the fact the Colts were looking to trade back and wanted a DT weren’t secrets that no one thought of.  People, including people who get paid to know this stuff, were speculating about the Colts trading back and what they might do before that move.  No one besides people here on a message board are talking about the Colts trading TY.  Also, yes when trades happen most of the time word does get out before a trade is made that the player is being shopped.  Normally it’s either by the players camp to make it known he wants out to force a trade or a team letting it out so that it’s known that player is available, especially with in season trades.  
 

As for why trading TY doesn’t make sense is that Colts have no one to take his place and at 4-2 and a game out of first place in their division they aren’t going to throw the towel in on the year by trading their number one WR when they have no one ready to take that roll.  You’ve mentioned the Pats moving on from a guy a year early several times in this thread.  The part you are leaving out is that they always had a guy ready to take that role that allowed them to do that until Brady and how’s that working out for them?

 

The Colts don’t have a WR who ready to be a number one right now besides TY.  Add into that their number two is hurt and not coming back anytime soon and their number three is a rookie coming back off surgery they would be left to depend on Pascal or Johnson to fill that roll.  Pascal isn’t exactly lighting the world on fire in his current role as is and Johnson had one good game before that he was on the practice squad.  He needs to perform more than one week to make you go okay hey we can dump TY and go with Johnson as the number one.

 

Again, I go back to the fact the Colts are 4-2.  They aren’t going to make a move that doesn’t make them better for this season because they aren’t giving up on this season right now and trading TY for a fourth round pick, if you can get that for him, doesn’t make them better right now and help them win this year which is what they are trying to do.  It makes them worse.  So no I don’t think they are looking to trade TY and no I don’t think that means l am looking at it like a fan because I am not caught up in any kind of emotional attachment to TY It doesn’t make football sense.  If the Chiefs called and said hey we will give you Patrick for TY I’d be saying TY who?  However that’s not going to happen.  
 

I do expect the Colts to let TY walk this off-season but I don’t expect them to trade him now when they have no one to replace him and they are 4-2 fighting for a playoff spot.  

[JPFolks]

18 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Ugh to Fountain being waived, I don't think we'll get him back. Very happy Pittman is being activated though!

It seems pretty clear that even though we're short on healthy WRs, they do not value him enough to hold on to him, so I am not sure why we need to keep revisiting him on and off the team. Haven't they had ample opportunity to evaluate him? If he was cutting it, they would make room for him. 

[JPFolks]

18 hours ago, csmopar said:

Hilton.

So just eat his salary and lose what little speed and veteran leadership we have in that group? 

[JPFolks]

17 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Actually, @csmopar had half the answer right. The perfect situation was to trade Hilton for a good draft pick, keep Fountain on the 53, and then activate Pittman to the 53 man roster. That would of been perfect to sell Hilton before he declines and get Pittman and Fountain on the 53. After that, when Campbell comes up, he can take the Hilton role over and you have a extra solid draft pick for next year.

Who is going to be a willing trade partner? If Fountain isn't good enough to keep around, you want to still keep him and give away (cause you aren't getting anything significant for TY right now) our only veteran and team leader in that group? What are you guys smoking? 

[JPFolks]

17 hours ago, Superman said:

 

First, define "good draft pick," then explain what team is eager to give up said pick for Hilton. 

 

Second, we're not 1-5 and out of the running. We're one game out of first place in the division, and two games behind the Steelers. 

And we have 2 games against the leader in our division ahead.  These guys have no clue.  

[JPFolks]

17 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

4th rounder and Packers. They are interested in Will Fuller, so Hilton could be just as good for them.

Wow I underestimated how bad your ideas were on this matter.  Hilton is just as good as Will Fuller?  Do you watch the league this year? 

[csmopar]

12 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

So just eat his salary and lose what little speed and veteran leadership we have in that group? 

See below

11 hours ago, csmopar said:

 

 

I was being sarcastic. 
 

that said, this is a what have you done for me lately league and so far, I’ve not seen the TY of old since December 2018. I’d be fine with moving on, I really don’t think we’d suffer much if any loss

 

[JPFolks]

17 hours ago, w87r said:

Thanks for answering.

 

If we let TY walk at the end of year we would probably be in line to receive a comp pick out of him, which would probably be around a 4th round pick. So we wouldn't lose him for nothing.

 

I'm not going to set here and give TY a pass for his play this season. It has been very underwhelming for sure. A few things play into that. 1. He is receiving most of the defenses attention. 2. Rivers has historically liked tall long arm WRs throughout his career. 3. He definitely seems to lost a little bit.

 

He needs to be used in the slot, and be moved around more often, IMO.

 

I think his veteran leadership is needed for this young group for at least the rest of the season though. I can't imagine how tough it would be for our other wrs if TY isn't there taking away the pressure right now.

 

I did cut TY off my fantasy team this week though.

I blame the lack of play calling and good game planning to get him involved in the game.  If he's not involved, he doesn't even work as a decoy.  I think he's had 3 uncharacteristic drops this year (that I can think of anyway), I am not sure you toss away a team leader over a couple bad plays.  In several games Rivers flat out did not have time for Hilton to even get down field into his routes.  Since he can't roll out, the line, though they've kept sacks down, have really only done that because Rivers dumps the ball so fast.  But if Hilton's routes aren't developed before Rivers has to dump the ball, I don't think he's as much of the problem alone as others seem to think.  Hopefully the line will tighten up on the hurries and pressures they've allowed to give Rivers time to target Hilton down the field where he's most effective.  I do agree that for some reason they aren't giving TY some short routes more often than they are.  

[JPFolks]

9 minutes ago, csmopar said:

See below

 

You don't think there are other factors like an immobile QB, a line that gives him little time to throw (which he has to bail quickly on deeper routes to keep from getting sacked) or simply ineffective play calling?  I've seen little innovation or diversity to how they are using TY this year.  

[Yoshinator]

50 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

Wow I underestimated how bad your ideas were on this matter.  Hilton is just as good as Will Fuller?  Do you watch the league this year? 

I didn't say that. I said he could be just as good as Fuller for them. To take the pressure off Davante Adams and provide a no2 receiver. Read the comments carefully.

[Yoshinator]

6 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

I didn’t say Ballard couldn’t do what was obvious to a fan but I also don’t think he’s thinking about trading TY.  Just because you think they should doesn’t mean it’s going to happen or even something Ballard is thinking about which is why I think you went too far when you said anyone who doesn’t think the Colts should trade TY is thinking like a fan because I don’t think the Colts GM is thinking about it.  
 

The reason why is that it doesn’t make sense.  Trading back to get more picks the year they got Nelson made sense.  Trading for Buckner made sense.  Also, no people didn’t nail the details on those moves but the fact the Colts were looking to trade back and wanted a DT weren’t secrets that no one thought of.  People, including people who get paid to know this stuff, were speculating about the Colts trading back and what they might do before that move.  No one besides people here on a message board are talking about the Colts trading TY.  Also, yes when trades happen most of the time word does get out before a trade is made that the player is being shopped.  Normally it’s either by the players camp to make it known he wants out to force a trade or a team letting it out so that it’s known that player is available, especially with in season trades.  
 

As for why trading TY doesn’t make sense is that Colts have no one to take his place and at 4-2 and a game out of first place in their division they aren’t going to throw the towel in on the year by trading their number one WR when they have no one ready to take that roll.  You’ve mentioned the Pats moving on from a guy a year early several times in this thread.  The part you are leaving out is that they always had a guy ready to take that role that allowed them to do that until Brady and how’s that working out for them?

 

The Colts don’t have a WR who ready to be a number one right now besides TY.  Add into that their number two is hurt and not coming back anytime soon and their number three is a rookie coming back off surgery they would be left to depend on Pascal or Johnson to fill that roll.  Pascal isn’t exactly lighting the world on fire in his current role as is and Johnson had one good game before that he was on the practice squad.  He needs to perform more than one week to make you go okay hey we can dump TY and go with Johnson as the number one.

 

Again, I go back to the fact the Colts are 4-2.  They aren’t going to make a move that doesn’t make them better for this season because they aren’t giving up on this season right now and trading TY for a fourth round pick, if you can get that for him, doesn’t make them better right now and help them win this year which is what they are trying to do.  It makes them worse.  So no I don’t think they are looking to trade TY and no I don’t think that means l am looking at it like a fan because I am not caught up in any kind of emotional attachment to TY It doesn’t make football sense.  If the Chiefs called and said hey we will give you Patrick for TY I’d be saying TY who?  However that’s not going to happen.  
 

I do expect the Colts to let TY walk this off-season but I don’t expect them to trade him now when they have no one to replace him and they are 4-2 fighting for a playoff spot.  

Went to bed last night and missed your comment. It makes perfect sense because you are trading an asset that has gotten worse and is starting to lose its value. Again, trade a year early instead of a year late. Hilton as a 30 year old receiver, with Rivers, is no better than any other receiver on the roster for the most part. He's replaceable even with our current receivers. What he has is name value. Take advantage of that name value to another team that hasn't figured out he's starting to decline yet, and get a 4th rounder or so. TY isn't a no1 receiver anymore either. He's just part of the team, as good as every other receiver now and older. Makes perfect sense to deal him now and give all the kids a chance to see who breaks out, especially with Pittman back, and Campbell coming back in a few weeks.

[csmopar]

2 hours ago, JPFolks said:

You don't think there are other factors like an immobile QB, a line that gives him little time to throw (which he has to bail quickly on deeper routes to keep from getting sacked) or simply ineffective play calling?  I've seen little innovation or diversity to how they are using TY this year.  

I’m sure all those are a factor. 
 

as for little time to throw, according to multiple statistic tracking sites, Rivers has the most time to throw and has had the lowest percentages of pressures of all QBs in the league. 

[Stephen]

21 hours ago, richard pallo said:

I couldn't agree more.  We are in a race for the division and only two games behind the Steelers.  And people want us to be sellers and trade Hilton our best WR.  Ridiculous.   

Steelers  may go undefeated 

[NannyMcafee]

3 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Went to bed last night and missed your comment. It makes perfect sense because you are trading an asset that has gotten worse and is starting to lose its value. Again, trade a year early instead of a year late. Hilton as a 30 year old receiver, with Rivers, is no better than any other receiver on the roster for the most part. He's replaceable even with our current receivers. What he has is name value. Take advantage of that name value to another team that hasn't figured out he's starting to decline yet, and get a 4th rounder or so. TY isn't a no1 receiver anymore either. He's just part of the team, as good as every other receiver now and older. Makes perfect sense to deal him now and give all the kids a chance to see who breaks out, especially with Pittman back, and Campbell coming back in a few weeks.

 

Hilton is one of the only WRs on this team that has gotten interferences  from apposing players. 

 

The passing game would take a step down and all for the sake of a "4th round pick or so"... 

 

Not a fan of this. The offense needs all the WRs it can get. If ballard wants a 4th he will find a way to do that without letting go our best WR on the roster regardless of the catches. 

 

Not 1 WR is lighting it up. Let's not pretend Hilton doesn't hold value because Rivers throws to the RB or TE 90% of the time.