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Just imagine if we would have won week 17....lol. We would have had the 2nd pick in the draft and could have traded down with Washington and got all of those picks plus kept Peyton.....oh wait we could still have done that with the first pick. Guess I just would have done things differently.

Well, considering that would mean St. Louis would have the first pick they would have traded that pick, so there goes all the hypothetical trade power you predicted Indy would have.

The past is past, the future is now. Get over it.

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Fleener is going in the 1st. No doubt about it. His pro day proved that. I would be surprised if he got past Harbaugh's 49'ers. I wouldn't mind if the Colts took Konz from Wisco to replace Saturday. Boom, there is your new center QB combo.

Exactly........will not get past Harbaugh. I also agree that the most important selection after QB is the center that Luck will have his hands under for the future. That relationship starts now....and not with a one or two year fill in.

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As far as any WR's you guys all seem to want. Blackmon is the only one that is worth anything. Give all of the others a look, they are either drunks (Floyd) J. Russell versions of WR (Jeffrey) teensy-tiny 5'9" WR (Wright) or too slow (every other WR). Look at DB, DT, or C. I like Konz. I also like the OK State safety in later rounds.

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As far as any WR's you guys all seem to want. Blackmon is the only one that is worth anything. Give all of the others a look, they are either drunks (Floyd) J. Russell versions of WR (Jeffrey) teensy-tiny 5'9" WR (Wright) or too slow (every other WR). Look at DB, DT, or C. I like Konz. I also like the OK State safety in later rounds.

Or 6"5 teensy-tiny 206+ lb WR Stephen Hill who tore up the combine.

He's so teensy-tiny and terrible, they might as well just have me in the draft.

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Or 6"5 teensy-tiny 206+ lb WR Stephen Hill who tore up the combine.

He's so teensy-tiny and terrible, they might as well just have me in the draft.

Believe me, I know of Stephen Hill. Are you saying you would have no problem spending a 2nd round pick on a guy who has caught less than 50 passes in his entire college career? Let me repeat that: In his entire college career he has caught (drumroll please) >50 passes! Don't make me remind you of the dropped balls either, you won't like that.

Please dude, just because he is a beast gym-rat doesn't mean he is a beast football player... (See Dontari Poe from Memphis for exactly what I mean(except Hill is an extreme version of that)).

I am really hoping I cleared this up for you. Really really hoping. I truly hope that you no longer see the merit in his incredible 40 time and wingspan. The Colts are not in the position to be spending draft picks willy-nilly on PROJECT PLAYERS! I don't want to sound like an * but I mean come on..

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Believe me, I know of Stephen Hill. Are you saying you would have no problem spending a 2nd round pick on a guy who has caught less than 50 passes in his entire college career? Let me repeat that: In his entire college career he has caught (drumroll please) >50 passes! Don't make me remind you of the dropped balls either, you won't like that.

Please dude, just because he is a beast gym-rat doesn't mean he is a beast football player... (See Dontari Poe from Memphis for exactly what I mean(except Hill is an extreme version of that)).

I am really hoping I cleared this up for you. Really really hoping. I truly hope that you no longer see the merit in his incredible 40 time and wingspan. The Colts are not in the position to be spending draft picks willy-nilly on PROJECT PLAYERS! I don't want to sound like an * but I mean come on..

I agree with some of the things you are saying but the guy still averaged 29.3 YPC, he's tall, athletic and has game. At the same time I do think that they could still get a solid WR in the later rounds like Jenkins, Dwight Jones, Fuller. I would have no problem with them getting a DT or DB but it seems like Samson Satele is going to be our center anyways so that excludes drafting a center high in the draft. Grigson was high on Samson.

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Dgambill and BloodOnTheTracks get it. Some of the more youthful posters don't. You never, never draft for need unless you have only one or two

weak spots left on your roster. I have witnessed 45 drafts now, and have seen teams die a slow, agonizing death by going for need. Thanks to a decent-looking draft in 2011, we go into 2012 in the second year of a four-year rebuild. With the exception of Cory Redding, none of the players Grigs has brought in can be expected to be quality starters for us in the future. They are more likely quality backups.

This year, and next year we are looking for quality starters, so we must emphasize best value in each round. I don't care if it's CB, or NT, or WR, unless the value between the available position types is equal. In that case you can go for need. The intelligent way to go about this is to recognize that as you build, your draft choices are going to be later in the round each year. Therefore, you must consider how difficult it is to successfully fill that position ( i.e. where in the draft order you will likely need to be ). For example, if you need a QB, you will likely need a top 15 pick. A left offensive tackle, shutdown corner or pass-rushing DE will likely require a top 20 pick. Other positions can be filled with mid to late first rounders, and you can find excellent interior offensive linemen in rounds 2-3. You also have to factor in where the strength of the draft class is, and plan accordingly. This year, the strength is in wide receivers and interior offensive linement. There is good depth at CB, but few blue-chippers.

Let's take a look at our potential value at the 34th pick. The most important position we can fill that would impact the team is NT. The 3-4 defense

pivots around a great NT, and we don't have one. However, there doesn't appear to be a value player available at that pick. I project that Washington NT Alameda Ta'amu is a late second-round value, and that's where he will go ( Pittsburgh?). The real value at 34 will be first-round talent that got pushed out of the 1st round by a combination of some teams going for need, and a logjam of talent at certain positions. Based on the draft reports I've seen, I think the value will be at WR and interior O-linemen. Coby Fleener's workout makes him the only TE worthy of a first-round grade, but I expect the Giants to take him.

You have to keep in mind that the 2012 Colts are going to suck anyway. There are going to be 'holes' in the roster that will hamstring us.

Looking at the 2012 schedule, I don't see more than 2-3 games where the matchup is not lopsided. We are going to have a top-10 pick next year.

It is therefore vital that we fill the most important and coveted positions first, and go for value in every round. Patching holes willy-nilly in order to get to 8-8 makes no sense. We need the best quality building blocks in order to build a dynasty. That is the goal, right? Based upon his performance so far, it's beginning to look like Grigson understands perfectly what is necessary, and how to negotiate effectively with other teams.

I hope he refuses to compromise, and that Irsay has given him the green light to build the team the right way.

When Peyton Manning joined the Colts in '98, the team was far advanced in it's building compared to now. They already had Marvin, Tarik and several other fairly good starters. When Manning's learning curve exceeded expectations in '99, and the team went 13-3, that ended the early draft picks for the Colts for many years, at a stage in their development where the defense was not properly constructed. Today, we need two more years of early draft picks to build around Andrew Luck. Freeney and Mathis won't be part of the core of that team in 2014. It appears that we need to take advantage of the excessive value of receivers and O-linemen this year, make some other team pay heavily to get Barkley next year, and draft for defense ( where there's value ) then. Go Grigs!

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Dgambill and BloodOnTheTracks get it. Some of the more youthful posters don't. You never, never draft for need unless you have only one or two

weak spots left on your roster. I have witnessed 45 drafts now, and have seen teams die a slow, agonizing death by going for need. Thanks to a decent-looking draft in 2011, we go into 2012 in the second year of a four-year rebuild. With the exception of Cory Redding, none of the players Grigs has brought in can be expected to be quality starters for us in the future. They are more likely quality backups.

This year, and next year we are looking for quality starters, so we must emphasize best value in each round. I don't care if it's CB, or NT, or WR, unless the value between the available position types is equal. In that case you can go for need. The intelligent way to go about this is to recognize that as you build, your draft choices are going to be later in the round each year. Therefore, you must consider how difficult it is to successfully fill that position ( i.e. where in the draft order you will likely need to be ). For example, if you need a QB, you will likely need a top 15 pick. A left offensive tackle, shutdown corner or pass-rushing DE will likely require a top 20 pick. Other positions can be filled with mid to late first rounders, and you can find excellent interior offensive linemen in rounds 2-3. You also have to factor in where the strength of the draft class is, and plan accordingly. This year, the strength is in wide receivers and interior offensive linement. There is good depth at CB, but few blue-chippers.

Let's take a look at our potential value at the 34th pick. The most important position we can fill that would impact the team is NT. The 3-4 defense

pivots around a great NT, and we don't have one. However, there doesn't appear to be a value player available at that pick. I project that Washington NT Alameda Ta'amu is a late second-round value, and that's where he will go ( Pittsburgh?). The real value at 34 will be first-round talent that got pushed out of the 1st round by a combination of some teams going for need, and a logjam of talent at certain positions. Based on the draft reports I've seen, I think the value will be at WR and interior O-linemen. Coby Fleener's workout makes him the only TE worthy of a first-round grade, but I expect the Giants to take him.

You have to keep in mind that the 2012 Colts are going to suck anyway. There are going to be 'holes' in the roster that will hamstring us.

Looking at the 2012 schedule, I don't see more than 2-3 games where the matchup is not lopsided. We are going to have a top-10 pick next year.

It is therefore vital that we fill the most important and coveted positions first, and go for value in every round. Patching holes willy-nilly in order to get to 8-8 makes no sense. We need the best quality building blocks in order to build a dynasty. That is the goal, right? Based upon his performance so far, it's beginning to look like Grigson understands perfectly what is necessary, and how to negotiate effectively with other teams.

I hope he refuses to compromise, and that Irsay has given him the green light to build the team the right way.

When Peyton Manning joined the Colts in '98, the team was far advanced in it's building compared to now. They already had Marvin, Tarik and several other fairly good starters. When Manning's learning curve exceeded expectations in '99, and the team went 13-3, that ended the early draft picks for the Colts for many years, at a stage in their development where the defense was not properly constructed. Today, we need two more years of early draft picks to build around Andrew Luck. Freeney and Mathis won't be part of the core of that team in 2014. It appears that we need to take advantage of the excessive value of receivers and O-linemen this year, make some other team pay heavily to get Barkley next year, and draft for defense ( where there's value ) then. Go Grigs!

VERY Good point. I am guessing we will win 3 to 4 games but my heart says we can make the playoffs....LOL.......I know, quite a delta

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Believe me, I know of Stephen Hill. Are you saying you would have no problem spending a 2nd round pick on a guy who has caught less than 50 passes in his entire college career? Let me repeat that: In his entire college career he has caught (drumroll please) >50 passes! Don't make me remind you of the dropped balls either, you won't like that.

Please dude, just because he is a beast gym-rat doesn't mean he is a beast football player... (See Dontari Poe from Memphis for exactly what I mean(except Hill is an extreme version of that)).

I am really hoping I cleared this up for you. Really really hoping. I truly hope that you no longer see the merit in his incredible 40 time and wingspan. The Colts are not in the position to be spending draft picks willy-nilly on PROJECT PLAYERS! I don't want to sound like an * but I mean come on..

Hmm. Lets see Georgia Tech runs a triple option heavily run orientated offense. Could it be that they did not have a passing qb to take advantage of Hills skill? I don't remember Antonio Gates catching tons of balls in college. I think he played basketball. Sure he has to have some skills but I would much rather take a flyer on a guy with the physical assets of someone like that then an undersized guy with avg to poor speed that was part of a system offense. How many college teams run a spread offense and throw the ball 40 times a game. Production doesn't always equal skill/ or transition to the nfl. Sure I would like to see more from Hill but if you work him out and you see talent then he is by far the best prospect in the draft outside Blackmon. Rookie WRs usually take a year or two to develop. I would be happy to draft Hill if he is available (in most mock drafts he is the second or third wr off the board and all in the first round). He may be raw but he has tons of talent and upside. You look at someone say like Blackmon or Floyd who are obviously better right now but they have much more limited upside. It is kind of how you rate alabama guys as safe picks but they are overvalued because most have maxed out their skill sets because they are so well coached.

Dgambill and BloodOnTheTracks get it. Some of the more youthful posters don't. You never, never draft for need unless you have only one or two

weak spots left on your roster. I have witnessed 45 drafts now, and have seen teams die a slow, agonizing death by going for need. Thanks to a decent-looking draft in 2011, we go into 2012 in the second year of a four-year rebuild. With the exception of Cory Redding, none of the players Grigs has brought in can be expected to be quality starters for us in the future. They are more likely quality backups.

This year, and next year we are looking for quality starters, so we must emphasize best value in each round. I don't care if it's CB, or NT, or WR, unless the value between the available position types is equal. In that case you can go for need. The intelligent way to go about this is to recognize that as you build, your draft choices are going to be later in the round each year. Therefore, you must consider how difficult it is to successfully fill that position ( i.e. where in the draft order you will likely need to be ). For example, if you need a QB, you will likely need a top 15 pick. A left offensive tackle, shutdown corner or pass-rushing DE will likely require a top 20 pick. Other positions can be filled with mid to late first rounders, and you can find excellent interior offensive linemen in rounds 2-3. You also have to factor in where the strength of the draft class is, and plan accordingly. This year, the strength is in wide receivers and interior offensive linement. There is good depth at CB, but few blue-chippers.

Let's take a look at our potential value at the 34th pick. The most important position we can fill that would impact the team is NT. The 3-4 defense

pivots around a great NT, and we don't have one. However, there doesn't appear to be a value player available at that pick. I project that Washington NT Alameda Ta'amu is a late second-round value, and that's where he will go ( Pittsburgh?). The real value at 34 will be first-round talent that got pushed out of the 1st round by a combination of some teams going for need, and a logjam of talent at certain positions. Based on the draft reports I've seen, I think the value will be at WR and interior O-linemen. Coby Fleener's workout makes him the only TE worthy of a first-round grade, but I expect the Giants to take him.

You have to keep in mind that the 2012 Colts are going to suck anyway. There are going to be 'holes' in the roster that will hamstring us.

Looking at the 2012 schedule, I don't see more than 2-3 games where the matchup is not lopsided. We are going to have a top-10 pick next year.

It is therefore vital that we fill the most important and coveted positions first, and go for value in every round. Patching holes willy-nilly in order to get to 8-8 makes no sense. We need the best quality building blocks in order to build a dynasty. That is the goal, right? Based upon his performance so far, it's beginning to look like Grigson understands perfectly what is necessary, and how to negotiate effectively with other teams.

I hope he refuses to compromise, and that Irsay has given him the green light to build the team the right way.

When Peyton Manning joined the Colts in '98, the team was far advanced in it's building compared to now. They already had Marvin, Tarik and several other fairly good starters. When Manning's learning curve exceeded expectations in '99, and the team went 13-3, that ended the early draft picks for the Colts for many years, at a stage in their development where the defense was not properly constructed. Today, we need two more years of early draft picks to build around Andrew Luck. Freeney and Mathis won't be part of the core of that team in 2014. It appears that we need to take advantage of the excessive value of receivers and O-linemen this year, make some other team pay heavily to get Barkley next year, and draft for defense ( where there's value ) then. Go Grigs!

TY! I think you are right on on your assessment so far. On offense the line is pretty set and we have a couple solid backs, qb will be addressed in the first round and we have two good receivers. On offense I would be especially surprised we draft anything outside a wr and te in the middle rounds. Defense we have needs at every single spot. I feel we take the best position player available because we don't have 1 single proven starter in the 3-4 scheme outside the LB we brought in from Baltimore. Even Mathis and Freeney aren't proven starters because it is a new scheme. They might not even play well in it. Freeney is gone next year so we have plenty of holes. The fact is if they just take the best player on the board we will be fine. Every position is a need. Not just CB or TE. If we simply take the best CB or TE on the board and they are simply an avg rated player or later graded player and we pass up a steal or great LB or DT then we are not helping ourselves. People need to understand. Would they rather draft 2 or 3 long time quality starters or possibly pro bowlers or would they rather draft a "need" and possibly take an an avg talent at that position. We definately NEED TE and CB but if we pass up a future pro bowler just to take one..that is stupid because we have 0 pro bowlers on this team at their current positions. Freeney and Mathis aren't playing their normal positions so there are needs across the board. I agree with your assessment and believe we will be back at the top of the draft next year and if we are extremely lucky we can trade back to get more picks to build our team.

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As far as any WR's you guys all seem to want. Blackmon is the only one that is worth anything. Give all of the others a look, they are either drunks (Floyd) J. Russell versions of WR (Jeffrey) teensy-tiny 5'9" WR (Wright) or too slow (every other WR). Look at DB, DT, or C. I like Konz. I also like the OK State safety in later rounds.

>_< posts like this make me smh. Theres more question marks surrounding Blackmon than Floyd or Wright.
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Fleener is going in the 1st. No doubt about it. His pro day proved that. I would be surprised if he got past Harbaugh's 49'ers. I wouldn't mind if the Colts took Konz from Wisco to replace Saturday. Boom, there is your new center QB combo.

We have our new center...Samson Satele. We just signed him 3 years 10.5 million to replace Saturday. So I dont think we go much OL in this draft.

I am hoping a good CB drops like Dre Kirkpatrick or Janoris Jenkins. If not, then a good DE/OLB like Nick Perry or WR like Kendall Wright.

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This is a much different era than when we brought in Manning. You can actually do a fair job of mending a team quickly through free agency more easily now than 15 years ago. There is no doubt that this team has some major holes... NT, CB, RB, WR, TE, and more. However, there are still three major time periods left to stock up on talent. The draft, the after draft free agent rookie signing period (where I think the Colts will do VERY well), and cut time before week #1 in early September. As for Tight Ends, I don't think we will have the chance to take Fleener, but a guy like Chris Pantale, Boston College, may be a nice pick up on day 2 of the draft:

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=83933&draftyear=2013&genpos=TE

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were decent at wr with wayne,collie,avery but horrible at cb. were switching to 3-4 which requires alot of man. powers is the only decent man cover cb on our team and he's a #2 cb. if janoris jenkins falls we have to take him .

Agreed. I would be thrilled to have either Janoris Jenkins or Dre Kirkpatrick with our 2nd round pick. Then we can worry about WR, TE, NT in rounds 3-7.

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As far as any WR's you guys all seem to want. Blackmon is the only one that is worth anything. Give all of the others a look, they are either drunks (Floyd) J. Russell versions of WR (Jeffrey) teensy-tiny 5'9" WR (Wright) or too slow (every other WR). Look at DB, DT, or C. I like Konz. I also like the OK State safety in later rounds.

If Floyd is a drunk, then every college student is a drunk. He made some dumb choices for sure, but he is not a drunk.. He will be a beast as a WR, just watch..

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To me this is really just all conjecture. The draft is so crazy it is hard to tell who and what will be on the board. I'm hoping 5 qbs go in the first round (probably wont) and all kinds of other crazy runs. All that means is highly graded quality players fall back later in the draft. We see so many years that there are runs on positions. It could be CB or WR or DT or G..who knows. As long as we don't reach for a position..that means a really good player should fall to us. The only thing with being as bad as us is that no matter who we take if its the BPA it should help us. Until the draft it will be impossible to tell what will be the right choice. We all know what our needs are. CB,TE,WR,DT, G but we don't know who will be left. Heck..we may even trade back at 34 and pick up an extra 3rd or 4th rounder. I'm ok with that if there will still be quality players available. We just don't know what will happen and I don't think we can argue about who should go first until it is actually here. Then we can argue who we thought was better. We really don't know who will be left on the board.

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To me this is really just all conjecture. The draft is so crazy it is hard to tell who and what will be on the board. I'm hoping 5 qbs go in the first round (probably wont) and all kinds of other crazy runs. All that means is highly graded quality players fall back later in the draft. We see so many years that there are runs on positions. It could be CB or WR or DT or G..who knows. As long as we don't reach for a position..that means a really good player should fall to us. The only thing with being as bad as us is that no matter who we take if its the BPA it should help us. Until the draft it will be impossible to tell what will be the right choice. We all know what our needs are. CB,TE,WR,DT, G but we don't know who will be left. Heck..we may even trade back at 34 and pick up an extra 3rd or 4th rounder. I'm ok with that if there will still be quality players available. We just don't know what will happen and I don't think we can argue about who should go first until it is actually here. Then we can argue who we thought was better. We really don't know who will be left on the board.

Plus teams like the Raiders and Bengals always pick some player no one thought would go in the first round.

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Plus teams like the Raiders and Bengals always pick some player no one thought would go in the first round.

Sadly the Raiders don't pick until round 5!!! Cincy however has two first rounders. They have developed into a nice football team.
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You draft the best player on your board that fits a need. What I mean by that is just say the best player left on the colts board at 34 is a qb. Since we just took one with the first pick you would either trade the pick or go to the next best guy on our board who fits a need rather it be a dt cb wr or what ever.

If you target specific positions in rounds you normally end up reaching or trading up when you don't really need to to make sure you get a certain position. For an example say the colts decide they want to go te in round 2 and realize flenner is the guy he wants but then realize saw the giants are going to take him at 32 and tbe next best tightend is 3rd round grade. They then have two choices if they have boxed themselves into a tightend reach for the third rounder or trade up to get in front of the giants. If they go bpa that fits a need though they could stay put and while they wouldn't get flenner they might get a dt who fits a need and is worth the spot they took him.

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You draft the best player on your board that fits a need. What I mean by that is just say the best player left on the colts board at 34 is a qb. Since we just took one with the first pick you would either trade the pick or go to the next best guy on our board who fits a need rather it be a dt cb wr or what ever.

If you target specific positions in rounds you normally end up reaching or trading up when you don't really need to to make sure you get a certain position. For an example say the colts decide they want to go te in round 2 and realize flenner is the guy he wants but then realize saw the giants are going to take him at 32 and tbe next best tightend is 3rd round grade. They then have two choices if they have boxed themselves into a tightend reach for the third rounder or trade up to get in front of the giants. If they go bpa that fits a need though they could stay put and while they wouldn't get flenner they might get a dt who fits a need and is worth the spot they took him.

You mean, don't do what the Polians did the past 5 years or so? Well said.

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This team is rebuilding for 2 more seasons, though we're going to win games and likely see our QB go to a pro bowl by year 2 or 3. We draft positions for the future more so than immediate need. If the best TE in the draft is available at 34, simply put, we TAKE Fleener. Lets not even consider the fact that he's one of Luck's best friends, 4-year roommate, and has ridiculous chemistry with Luck. (Did I not see that 30% of Luck's career passes and/or TDs went to Fleener). We don't have a pass receiving tight end on the roster, period. We have a really good corner, two really good WR. We need all three positions. Fleener addresses both a major position of need and a rebuilding block for 10+ years. You pick him. The TE talent is suspect, at receiving TE, down the draft board.

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You mean, don't do what the Polians did the past 5 years or so? Well said.

Well the difference between then and now is that we have needs everywhere and then we only had needs at a few positions while we were just trying to tweek things to win the Super Bowl.

I agree that we should take the best player available but the more and more I look at the draft I like moving back in the second round and getting another draft pick or swapping picks with the Eagles like trading 34/64 for eagles 46/51. Depending on the runs at positions I think there will be very good players at those two picks that we would target at 34. Perhaps getting two guys we want at 34 with the 46/51 picks.

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