The Three Blowouts: NE, Pitt., Jacksonville

[King Colt]

The very large fly in the soup is the fact that for three games this past season the Colts were trashed to say the least and one by one of the worst if not the worst team in the NFL. Is this due to the coach on the sideline on those three days or is it on the management up in the booth? My memory cannot come up with any season when the Colts were in the running when they were crushed three times in any season and I doubt any team that made the playoffs were beaten so badly three times, once by a team like Jacksonville. Those three loses are not example of the "on any given day" fact that runs in all sports rather it was proof there is a huge gap in the methodology of  keeping a team in the hunt. So we have the same coach and GM while firing assistants. Assistants are part of the backbone so who is to say it is their fault while the HC and GM sip champagne? It took an inexpiable long time (years) to address a monstrous problem which was the offensive line and there can be no valid reason for it. I just hope we are not in for "Four More Years"!

[MTC]

NE game was a blowout?

[chad72]

10 minutes ago, MTC said:

NE game was a blowout?

 

It was not. But the 7 pt. margin did not reflect the fact that it was a 2 TD game where we were in no shape of form going to challenge the Patriots till that garbage TD happened.

 

But I do agree with the OP - consistency outside the division and/or on the road will be the first thing examined next year, defensively and offensively.

 

However, I do not think Pagano and Grigson will get the four more years for certain if the same mistakes keep happening. I'd give them 2 years at best and they will be shown the door if the same blowouts keep happening. 2 more years with new coaches and time to learn from 4 years of mistakes should be plenty to find out if the coaches and GM have truly learnt. I don't think their contracts are guaranteed anyway.

[krunk]

Care to share the fact that Pitt and Jacksonville we played with 2 back up quarterbacks in both games?  The defense was hamstrung by the offense in both games.  The Jax game I feel should have never gotten that bad even with the offense struggling.  There were several turnovers and other freak stuff that happened there.  The head coach is judged on Wins and Losses mainly, mean while on an individual level the coordinators are judged on how the groups they are responsible for performed. 

 

With Manusky we had a long history of mediocre defense, so I can see why they eventually let him go.  Yes you can blame some of that on the offense, but even last year when we scored a lot of points they were only a so so unit.  Some games very good and some games not so good.  People can talk about the personnel, but you can only go so far with that argument because the unit overall has had a number of good performances.  There's enough evidence available to show the numbers coming from the D should have been more consistent.

 

Oh and why would we need to fire the head coach before we fire a Strength and Conditioning coach?  Or the TEs coach?   Or the Rb coach?  Everybody knows if you're winning the lower level guys are always fired before the top level goes.  That's almost anywhere so it's pretty much a pointless conversation to me.

[bababooey]

It's the same every year

 

This year: Pitt, Jax, NE could be 2 tds, Saints was a blowout at first

Last year: Pitt, NE (2x), Dallas (we had the division wrapped up and went for a fake on our own 10)

Year before: CIN, ARI, NE, STL

 

Nothing new.

[Narcosys]

Ever think it could just be the players? 

[coltsva]

For this year, take out NE and put in Buffalo.

[chad72]

15 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

Ever think it could just be the players? 

 

Yes, and no. We weren't run over like previous years due to our DL being slightly improved vs the Patriots but at the cost of our pass defense since our pass rush was still putrid due to lack of play makers.

 

However, when you lose 3 games to NE by 20 pts or more consecutively prior to 2015 and have no answers for their jumbo formations, it does fall on coaches' inability to make adjustments. Most coaches make adjustments within a quarter. That could also explain why they abandoned the Josh Chapman experiment, and let go of Montori Hughes realizing athletes that can disrupt the run by penetrating the line of scrimmage yield better results than just big fatties that cannot make plays. It showed this year with Parry and Anderson who we thought were undersized.

 

Look at Broncos' DL, they have a whole bunch of undersized but athletic and disruptive guys causing havoc in that 1-gap system being top 5 (I think) vs the run.

[GoColts8818]

Pats game wasn't a blow out. 

 

As for the Steelers and Jags game they spiraled out of control in the second half because the Colts just couldn't get anything going on offense and the defense couldn't stop the other team.  It happens.  What bothers me about the second two was the team quit in those games towards the end.  Credit to Pagano he got them back and got them to fight hard the last three games of the year but when things started spiraling you could just see a sense of well here we go again. 

[Narcosys]

4 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

Yes, and no. We weren't run over like previous years due to our DL being slightly improved vs the Patriots but at the cost of our pass defense since our pass rush was still putrid due to lack of play makers.

 

However, when you lose 3 games to NE by 20 pts or more consecutively prior to 2015 and have no answers for their jumbo formations, it does fall on coaches' inability to make adjustments. Most coaches make adjustments within a quarter. That could also explain why they abandoned the Josh Chapman experiment, and let go of Montori Hughes realizing athletes that can disrupt the run by penetrating the line of scrimmage yield better results than just big fatties that cannot make plays. It showed this year with Parry and Anderson who we thought were undersized.

 

Look at Broncos' DL, they have a whole bunch of undersized but athletic and disruptive guys causing havoc in that 1-gap system being top 5 (I think) vs the run.

What do you suggest the answer is when we don't have players the size of theirs and get outclassed in talent and technique as well. 

[Buck Showalter]

NE was a blowout???

[Steamboat_Shaun]

I honestly don't see the point of dissecting 2 road blowout losses with a slew of different backup QBs under center. Like, what are you possibly going to do with that information?

 

As for the New England game... Luck started, and played well. It wasn't a blowout, and had they not completely abandoned the run game in favor of passing on 26 consecutive plays in the second half, there was a very realistic chance of winning that game.

[ricker182]

1 hour ago, GoColts8818 said:

Pats game wasn't a blow out. 

 

 

Not even close.  

We were in it almost the whole time until we got absolutely screwed by the refs on the fumble, then went full desperation mode with the notorious 4th down play.  

  

We could have won that game.  

  

Not even close to a blowout.

[ricker182]

41 minutes ago, Buck Showalter said:

NE was a blowout???

No. Not at all......

[ricker182]

People are reluctant to say this was actually a good season even with having Luck out FOR 9 FREAKING GAMES!  

  

We won 8 games.  

  

To me that really speaks volumes to the talent we actually have.  

  

Just need to get a consistent pass rush.  

  

I liked what I saw from Chud on offense and the only game he and Luck worked together in was the Denver game which was a really good win.

[jvan1973]

6 hours ago, King Colt said:

The very large fly in the soup is the fact that for three games this past season the Colts were trashed to say the least and one by one of the worst if not the worst team in the NFL. Is this due to the coach on the sideline on those three days or is it on the management up in the booth? My memory cannot come up with any season when the Colts were in the running when they were crushed three times in any season and I doubt any team that made the playoffs were beaten so badly three times, once by a team like Jacksonville. Those three loses are not example of the "on any given day" fact that runs in all sports rather it was proof there is a huge gap in the methodology of  keeping a team in the hunt. So we have the same coach and GM while firing assistants. Assistants are part of the backbone so who is to say it is their fault while the HC and GM sip champagne? It took an inexpiable long time (years) to address a monstrous problem which was the offensive line and there can be no valid reason for it. I just hope we are not in for "Four More Years"!

First,  the patriots game wasn't a blow out

 

Second,  the jags are far from the worst team in the league.

 

Third,   congrats on yet another terrible thread started by you

[chad72]

42 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

What do you suggest the answer is when we don't have players the size of theirs and get outclassed in talent and technique as well. 

 

I don't think the coaching is up to snuff, defensively, IMO. There is a lot of Xs and Os that can be improved on defensively. That is why I felt Manusky got fired. I don't think he put players in situations where they could excel more often. An elite DC like Wade Philips does so.

 

[OffensivelyPC]

Hey guys, was NE a blowout???  Can anyone confirm this?  I haven't seen it anywhere on here...

[Track Guy]

5 hours ago, bababooey said:

Year before: CIN, ARI, NE, STL

 

 

They also topped SF, SEA, and DEN that season though. 3 of the 4 conference finalists.

[Narcosys]

14 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

I don't think the coaching is up to snuff, defensively, IMO. There is a lot of Xs and Os that can be improved on defensively. That is why I felt Manusky got fired. I don't think he put players in situations where they could excel more often. An elite DC like Wade Philips does so.

 

You can write all the schemes you want,  but if the players skill is not up to or better than the guy be is going against,  none of it matters.  You can coach a technique all day every day,  but the player must get better.  You have to remember that every other opponent is getting coached too. They are getting coached the same techniques and counters, it is up to the player to put it into practice better than his opponent.  Ours don't. 

 

So the perfect scheme won't work if the player can't execute it better than his opponent.  Everyone is focusing on the strategic level issues and thinking the tactical level will follow suit.  That's not the case. 

[bababooey]

8 minutes ago, Track Guy said:

 

They also topped SF, SEA, and DEN that season though. 3 of the 4 conference finalists.

This thread is about their blowouts, not their victories. We haven't had a big victory minus Denver since Reggie tore his acl against Denver, which derailed the entire season.

[Track Guy]

3 minutes ago, bababooey said:

This thread is about their blowouts, not their victories. We haven't had a big victory minus Denver since Reggie tore his acl against Denver, which derailed the entire season.

Sure but there tends to be a theme that they always get blown out by good teams. That's often been true in '14 and '15 but it wasn't in '13. 

 

In '13 the Colts NFL wide had the fewest turnovers on offense and were top 10 in sacks. Check where they rank in each of those categories since. I don't think there's a huge coincidence that they started routinely getting gashed by top teams after that. 

[bababooey]

3 minutes ago, Track Guy said:

Sure but there tends to be a theme that they always get blown out by good teams. That's often been true in '14 and '15 but it wasn't in '13. 

 

In '13 the Colts NFL wide had the fewest turnovers on offense and were top 10 in sacks. Check where they rank in each of those categories since. I don't think there's a huge coincidence that they started routinely getting gashed by top teams after that. 

I'm aware of all of this. Again, this isn't the thread for this. We are not that team anymore minus the blowouts.

[Track Guy]

1 minute ago, bababooey said:

I'm aware of all of this. Again, this isn't the thread for this. We are not that team anymore minus the blowouts.

It seemed pretty relevant to the topic to me. 

[indyagent17]

6 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

It was not. But the 7 pt. margin did not reflect the fact that it was a 2 TD game where we were in no shape of form going to challenge the Patriots till that garbage TD happened.

 

But I do agree with the OP - consistency outside the division and/or on the road will be the first thing examined next year, defensively and offensively.

 

However, I do not think Pagano and Grigson will get the four more years for certain if the same mistakes keep happening. I'd give them 2 years at best and they will be shown the door if the same blowouts keep happening. 2 more years with new coaches and time to learn from 4 years of mistakes should be plenty to find out if the coaches and GM have truly learnt. I don't think their contracts are guaranteed anyway.

I have said it before but I can't stand that term "garbage points". New England did not want us to score and we did because it became a one possession game at that point. So the score is exactly how it came out. The fake punt gave them the ball on our side of 50. A punt would have them inside their 20. Sure they "might" have still scored but I like our chances a whole lot better with that scenario

Edited January 7, 2016 by indyagent17

[JoshPhilpot]

The Pats game would have ended differently had the refs not robbed Moncrief of that onside kick recovery and Whalen messing up on that special teams play.

[Larry Horseman]

No doubt the black eyes of the Pags era are blow outs and slow starts. I can't help but think it is a combination of both coaching and players. Luck has been a better second half player every year except his rookie year, which could be an anomaly or speak to coaching (i.e., BA instead of Pags/Pep): http://www.nfl.com/player/andrewluck/2533031/situationalstats?season=2012

[King Colt]

7 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

First,  the patriots game wasn't a blow out

 

Second,  the jags are far from the worst team in the league.

 

Third,   congrats on yet another terrible thread started by you

And yet you just can't stay away can you?

[King Colt]

7 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

First,  the patriots game wasn't a blow out

 

Second,  the jags are far from the worst team in the league.

 

Third,   congrats on yet another terrible thread started by you

And yet you just can't stay away can you?

[Jules]

The Jags blowout thing won't happen again next year, our luck literally ran out in the AFC South this year with the big streak.

 

The Pats and Steelers are simply more talented overall then us at times. Our talent levels are overrated. Last year in Pittsburgh though despite giving up a million points......Luck and the offense also tore them up as well:

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/201410260pit.htm

 

 

[Jules]

double post 

 

[King Colt]

The thing about the Pitt.(45-10)-Jags(51-16) blowouts is they were back-to-back. No excuse. I'll back up on the NE game and change it from blowout to yet another very predictable loss in the long list of defeats by NE.

[King Colt]

The thing about the Pitt.(45-10)-Jags(51-16) blowouts is they were back-to-back. No excuse. I'll back up on the NE game and change it from blowout to yet another very predictable loss in the long list of defeats by NE.

[oldunclemark]

This was a lost year with Andrew injured and absent...you can over analyze it

[oldunclemark]

This was a lost year with Andrew injured and absent...you can over analyze it

[coltsfeva]

6 hours ago, King Colt said:

The thing about the Pitt.(45-10)-Jags(51-16) blowouts is they were back-to-back. No excuse. I'll back up on the NE game and change it from blowout to yet another very predictable loss in the long list of defeats by NE.

The other thing was; injuries. Luck was out and Vonte was hurt.

Also, games do have a way of snow-balling out-of-control. Remember the year Denver beat us in the regular season and we ended up beating them by 21 in the playoffs, two or three weeks later?

If the Colts can stay healthy next year, I doubt there is a team that will beat them by a big margin.