Will Marvin be a first-ballot hof'er? [Merge]

[Narcosys]

Anyone who has doubts that Marvin deserves to be in the HOF is just plain ludicrous. Some bring up his off field actions keeping him out? Did off field problems keep Irvin, Sanders, Carter, Dierdorf and Sapp off of the roster? I am sure there are a lot more that can join the list that had less than the good guy image that have made the HOF.

Hall if fame judges are 'not allowed' to take non-on field things into account. Like players that turn coaches, they can only get in on one respect, like as a player or coach. Like John madden. He got in as a coach. But many believe the judges took into account his commentating, and video game accolades aswell. But they shouldn't.

[ColtsFanMikeC]

Hall if fame judges are 'not allowed' to take non-on field things into account. Like players that turn coaches, they can only get in on one respect, like as a player or coach. Like John madden. He got in as a coach. But many believe the judges took into account his commentating, and video game accolades aswell. But they shouldn't.

They shouldn't, but I guarantee they do.

[mahagga73]

Just started thinking about this when reading the 'mt. rushmore' post --

 

IMO, Marvin Harrison should be a hall-of-famer -- he had (number wise) the greatest 8 year stretch of any WR in NFL history (seasons 1999 - 2006).  I always hear a general rule of thumb that to be a HOFer, you need to be dominant for a decade.   After 2006, Marv's production dropped off due to injury, and prior to 1999 he had 3 good, but not 'dominant' seasons. 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvin_Harrison  shows a table of his year-by-year stats -- pretty incredible.

 

 

Marv was the 4th WR in NFL history to surpass 1,000 receptions and 1 of 7 to break 100 reception TDs.  At one time, he was 2nd on the all time reception list (he has since been surpassed by Tony Gonzalez, and the only other active player that I think might pass him any time soon would be Reggie Wayne (he is 134 receptions shy, I hope he has at least 2 more 70+ reception seasons here in Indy, serious injury is the only thing that could stop that, IMO).  If Andre Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald stay healthy, they too have a good shot to surpass Marv in the next 3-5 years.

 

Marv was extremely durable, prior to his knee injury in 2007, he only missed games due to injury 1 other time (1998, when he sat out 4).  He is arguably the best route-runner of all time.

 

Now here is where things get interesting -- Cris Carter (who prior to Marv had the 2nd best numbers of all time) took forever to get into the HOF (presumably b/c of some off-field issues that plagued him early in his career).  While Marvin was in Indy, I always thought he was a stand-up person -- humble, quiet, dedicated-- traits missing from most elite WR's in his era.  I was shocked to hear his affilitation with some thugs in Philly after his retirement, and the accusations that he punched a teenager in the face in HI during pro-bowl week during his career.  While he was never convicted, I have to wonder if the shooting incidents will effect Marv's HOF status.  The other knock against him, which I think is bogus, is going to be that he played with Peyton Manning when the other elite WR's of his time (mainly Randy Moss and TO) did not have a long time to play with 'elite' QBs (TO had Steve Young early in his career, but otherwise never a future HOF QB, while I don't think Moss ever had a HOF QB).  I think it is bogus, b/c Marv and Peyton broke every QB/WR duo record there is, and you can argue that Jerry Rice played with 2 elite QBs in Montana and Young. 

 

Marvin retired very quietly, which I expected from him, but made the headlines for some non-football related troubles.  Will this effect his HOF status?  Does he deserve to be on the Colts Mt. Rushmore b/c of his off-field trouble after his career? 

 

I'd vote 'yes' to the HOF, but after researching a lot of his off-field stuff, I have to question his character a bit.  Because of the off-field stuff, I think Reggie Wayne has become my all-time favorite Colt WR.

 

Thoughts?

Marvin was a better player than Carter. He was much more explosive . Carter had great hands and was also a great player but he is not in Marvin's class. Marvin is a first ballot WR  if I ever saw one.

[mahagga73]

He's probably more deserving then some of the players waiting, but they've been building their cases for years.  He'll might be delayed by Tim Brown and Andre Reed, and the voters apparent reluctance to induct receivers.

Tim Brown and Reed are not in Marvin's class. Marvin is a top 10 all-time player at his position.

[IndyTrav]

Marvin was a better player than Carter. He was much more explosive . Carter had great hands and was also a great player but he is not in Marvin's class. Marvin is a first ballot WR  if I ever saw one.

So was Carter at the time.

Carter has 1 less rec, 3 more TDs, and Marvin had about 700 more yards. You are not talking about a very large discrepancy between the 2 statistically.

Marvin doesn't automatically make the HoF because he was one of our favorite Colts. His case is just as valid as Moss/Owens/Bruce/Brown/Reed/Holt/Hines....And soon retirees Wayne/Tony G...Guys like Gates/Witten/Welker/Andre Johnson/Steve Smith/Roddy White are all in there early 30's, and with a few more years of standard production are right in line to land very high on the all time lists.

Roddy White is 31. His avgs the last 6 years are 94/1296/8....If he gets 3/4s of that over the next 4 years, he ranks 14/16/27th ALL Time in the rec cats, and thats only if he plays for 4 years....If he maintains his pace going into his age 35 season (Marvin was 36, Reggie is 35 now) he will be 9/9/13 All time....And this is Roddy White, an often forgotten man....Imagine the pace Fitz/Calvin are on.....

[BOTT]

Tim Brown and Reed are not in Marvin's class. Marvin is a top 10 all-time player at his position.

Tim Brown is...he just happened to play a good chunk of his career with mediocre quarterbacks

[bluebambi]

The off the field stuff has tarnished my respect for the guy. In fact I don't like him.

It's too bad, but it will and should keep him out of the HoF.

what off the field stuff ? The "allegations" ? So much for innocent until proven guilty .

[colts1993]

I believe sadly he'll have to wait a couple years before he gets in which suck because to me he played like a first ballot hall of famer

[The Fish]

what off the field stuff ? The "allegations" ? So much for innocent until proven guilty .

Watch the video. Pay attention. The D/A won't prosecute because the victim gave a false statement at first. The gun was matched as Harrison's. He was in a altercation, there were witnesses's. Shot's were fired minutes later. 

[Le Neon]

Tim Brown and Reed are not in Marvin's class. Marvin is a top 10 all-time player at his position.

 

I agree about Reed.  Tim Brown is much better then he gets credit, though I still think Marvin was better.  Doesn't mean they won't hold up his selection by splitting WR votes.

[BOTT]

Watch the video. Pay attention. The D/A won't prosecute because the victim gave a false statement at first. The gun was matched as Harrison's. He was in a altercation, there were witnesses's. Shot's were fired minutes later.

That video was pretty flimsy stuff. I really have no idea what happened, but that video doesn't clear anything up.

[crazycolt1]

Yeah, that's not the story. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuXu

 

The off the field stuff has tarnished my respect for the guy. In fact I don't like him.

It's too bad, but it will and should keep him out of the HoF.

This will not keep Marvin out of the HOF.  Just because you don't like Harrison has no bearing on his going to the HOF.  While you are entitled to your opinion it is not shared by many. If the NFL let Dan Deirdorf in the HOF after getting caught and suspended for betting on football that sure will not stop Harrison getting in the HOF.  Since when does suspicion mean anything except for those who are willing to assume someone is guilty in their own opinion regardless of proof.  

[GoColts8818]

Marvin Harrison is going to the Hall of Fame.  His stats make him one of the top five greatest WRs to ever play the game and frankly when he retired he was two or three on every major receiving stat there was.  The only question is will he go in on the first ballot or not.  Before people say well they kept Cris Carter out of the Hall of Fame you need to look at why he was kept out.  He was kept out because people flat out didn't like him and didn't vote for him.  The people who vote for the Hall of Fame don't seem to have that issue with Marvin Harrison.  Marvin has a Super Bowl ring and numbers to back it up and on the field was viewed as the example of how you were supposed to play the game during an era where most players who play his position were viewed as divas.  None of the other guys caught in the WR log jam, (Reed, Carter, and Brown) have all three.  They wont keep him out.  Again, the only question is will he go in on the first ballot.  He might not but he will go in at some point. 

 

As for the stuff after his career.  He was never convicted or even charged with any of it.  Again, to the people who vote on this, they just kinda turn a blind eye to it because there is nothing formally saying he did it.  All of us can sit here and go oh come on he did it but we don't have a vote and the people who do frankly don't seem all that concerned about it.  In fact anytime John Clayton or Peter King gets asked about Marvin Harrison they have nothing but nice things to say about him and often love to talk about how he was a professional on the field.  Those are the guys who vote on this. 

[Gavin]

Marvin Harrison is going to the Hall of Fame.  His stats make him one of the top five greatest WRs to ever play the game and frankly when he retired he was two or three on every major receiving stat there was.  The only question is will he go in on the first ballot or not.  Before people say well they kept Cris Carter out of the Hall of Fame you need to look at why he was kept out.  He was kept out because people flat out didn't like him and didn't vote for him.  The people who vote for the Hall of Fame don't seem to have that issue with Marvin Harrison.  Marvin has a Super Bowl ring and numbers to back it up and on the field was viewed as the example of how you were supposed to play the game during an era where most players who play his position were viewed as divas.  None of the other guys caught in the WR log jam, (Reed, Carter, and Brown) have all three.  They wont keep him out.  Again, the only question is will he go in on the first ballot.  He might not but he will go in at some point. 

 

As for the stuff after his career.  He was never convicted or even charged with any of it.  Again, to the people who vote on this, they just kinda turn a blind eye to it because there is nothing formally saying he did it.  All of us can sit here and go oh come on he did it but we don't have a vote and the people who do frankly don't seem all that concerned about it.  In fact anytime John Clayton or Peter King gets asked about Marvin Harrison they have nothing but nice things to say about him and often love to talk about how he was a professional on the field.  Those are the guys who vote on this. 

Its still an ongoing investigation

[GoColts8818]

Its still an ongoing investigation

Every case that doesn't have someone charged or in jail for it is an "ongoing investigation".  Marvin Harrison has never been charged or arrested with anything related to this.  Till or if he is the people who vote on the hall seem to be going with innocent till proven guilty approache.  The police have been working this case for several years now and have yet to charge Marvin which seems to suggest that they don't have enough proof to say for sure he did it.  So who knows maybe he didn't do it.  Should that change and Marvin does get charged with it and maybe even one day convicted for it then yes they will probably hold it against him however, till they do they aren't going to hold it against him because right now there is nothing to hold against him because he hasn't been charged with anything.  That's my point. 

[trueblueblood]

He's eligible in 2014. What do you guys think? I think he'll for sure be a first ballot

[pacolts56]

The over/under on IndyTrav coming in and saying he shouldn't even get in the HoF is 10 posts.

[Dustin]

The over/under on IndyTrav coming in and saying he shouldn't even get in the HoF is 10 posts.

Yeah Hines Ward is so much better /s.

[Dark Superman]

Marvin deserves to be in the HOF.

[trueblueblood]

The over/under on IndyTrav coming in and saying he shouldn't even get in the HoF is 10 posts.

He's going in regardless, whether it be next year or 10 years from now. I'd love to hear someone's argument that he shouldn't... Should be pretty comical

[jvan1973]

i don't think he makes it on the first ballot. buthe will make it

[Slick_Rick]

He should be, but I'm not sure it'll happen this year. I think his less than stellar exit may have put a sour taste in the mouths of people who vote in the HOF. The whole shooting scandal such may hurt him I don't see him being first ballot.

[pacolts56]

He's going in regardless, whether it be next year or 10 years from now. I'd love to hear someone's argument that he shouldn't... Should be pretty comical

For the record I agree with you....but the logjam of deserving WRs might bump it out to where he isn't a 1st ballot guy.

 

Somehow....that Philly incident probably won't help either. 

[Jason_]

Cris Carter wasn't a first ballot so I don't think there's any way Marvin is.

[Dustin]

He should be, but I'm not sure it'll happen this year. I think his less than stellar exit may have put a sour taste in the mouths of people who vote in the HOF. The whole shooting scandal such may hurt him I don't see him being first ballot.

HOF voters aren't supposed to take off the field transgressions into account.

[Jason_]

He should be, but I'm not sure it'll happen this year. I think his less than stellar exit may have put a sour taste in the mouths of people who vote in the HOF. The whole shooting scandal such may hurt him I don't see him being first ballot.

 

I agree and to be honest, I wouldn't be entirely surprised if that scandal keeps him out of the HOF completely.  

[Jason_]

HOF voters aren't supposed to take off the field transgressions into account.

 

this is the first I've heard of that and if true, I disagree with it

[trueblueblood]

For the record I agree with you....but the logjam of deserving WRs might bump it out to where he isn't a 1st ballot guy.

Somehow....that Philly incident probably won't help either.

Isn't he ahead of all those other wr's though? I know he's way up there in yards, catches and Tds. Not to mention his 143 receptions in 2002 is still a record, even in today's pass-happy league.

[jvan1973]

I agree and to be honest, I wouldn't be entirely surprised if that scandal keeps him out of the HOF completely.

he was never charged or convicted of any crime. Unlike Michael Irvin who is in the hall

[trueblueblood]

Cris Carter wasn't a first ballot so I don't think there's any way Marvin is.

But... Marvin is ahead of him in every category, right?

[Captain Americolt]

Without looking at the original poster I coulda swore IndyTrav made this 

[Thewholefnshow28]

I agree and to be honest, I wouldn't be entirely surprised if that scandal keeps him out of the HOF completely.  

 

If that happened then the voters are *s.  What they do off the field should have no bearing on their place as a player.  Throw in a little blurb about what they did, but put them in if they are good to be in, but voters tend to be sanctimonious in all sports so I would not be surprised if it does keep him out for a bit.

 

I do not think Marvin is a first ballot hall of famer, but I do think he will get in.

[BOTT]

HOF doesn't consider off field incidents....not supposed to anyway.

[Superman]

I think he's deserving, but I doubt he gets in on the first ballot. I think he joins the logjam with Tim Brown and Andre Reed.

[Le Neon]

I think Tim Brown gets in this year, which makes it tougher for Harrison.  

 

My guess is he beats out Reed next time.

[Jason_]

he was never charged or convicted of any crime. Unlike Michael Irvin who is in the hall

 

that's all well and good, and if Marvin does get in then good for him.  with everything that happened, I'm not sure how I feel about him now but regardless of that and just for the record, I didn't say that the scandal should keep him out, only that I wouldn't be surprised if it did.

[pacolts56]

Isn't he ahead of all those other wr's though? I know he's way up there in yards, catches and Tds. Not to mention his 143 receptions in 2002 is still a record, even in today's pass-happy league.

Yes....he is at or near the top in a lot of them.

 

The sportswriters who are the keepers at the gate are unpredictable....but I think he'll make it at some point.

[Coltswarriors]

He should be, but I have a feeling it might take him a while...

[Fx Stryker]

Marvin's off-field issues, true or not, won't get in the way. The hall in Canton isn't a boy's club that looks done on people like the hall up in Cooperstown. Not meant to be a knock at baseball because I love baseball.

 

I think Marvin can be a first ballot, but I don't think he will be. Too many receivers in line.

[SteelCityColt]

I fear not a first ballot with the backlog and regardless of whether of should be taken into account some will hold the rumoured incident against him.

He deserves to be in IMO.