is there a starter in the nfl that throws a worse deep ball than Luck

[Nancy]

Well, we don't want to win too many games then we won't get a very good draft pick next year to get a super player to go along with Luck! Luck will be fine, he is a brain of the game and each game he'll do better....if he doesn't get sacked and pulled down with a face mask or some kind of other freak thing. O line needs a little better protection imo, but he's goin to do alright & be a superstar!

:dancing: :throwback:

[ConBro]

:HFire:

[Smitto]

Then why don't all QB's throw 70 yard bombs on their pro days?

That's because they aren't asked to show it... the main reason he was asked to is cause they wanted to see how far he can throw

[braveheartcolt]

I'm more concerned with our red zone offense. Ranked 28th. That's not all on Luck, but he doesn't fill me with oodles of confidence down there (yet).

It is indeed early days, but it is not all on the WR dropsies either. Reggie was outplayed as well yesterday, which won't happen every game, but when he is shackled well, Hilton and Avery need to step up. Fleener looked a bit better today, so not all bad. The O-Line is as bad as advertised. My 8-8 is looking a tad optimistic now.

[SLILLINGTON10]

meh, one was a tipped pass, albeit a bad pass, he fumbled after being hit from behind, and threw another int in the endzone when getting beat by 20pts

it wasn't the plays themselves that concered me it was more the poor judgement and there was a couple of balls that he threw that should have been picked off. or like the pick six he threw that got called back cause of PI he should not have tried to fit that ball in there in the firsrt place. but like i said he is a rookie and every snap is a learning experience, Luck will get it figured out.

[GoColts8818]

it wasn't the plays themselves that concered me it was more the poor judgement and there was a couple of balls that he threw that should have been picked off. or like the pick six he threw that got called back cause of PI he should not have tried to fit that ball in there in the firsrt place. but like i said he is a rookie and every snap is a learning experience, Luck will get it figured out.

Exactly he's a rookie and generally speaking the only way you learn NOT to do these things is by doing them.

[SLILLINGTON10]

Exactly he's a rookie and generally speaking the only way you learn NOT to do these things is by doing them.

agreed the sky is not falling

[FightLikeSin]

Luck throws a good deep ball, you need to realize he's getting hit and balls get tipped.

that's what I was going to say. He could would have hit reggie right on the money if he wasn't tackled as he released the ball. They one pass to Avery when he scrambled away was a PERFECT outside shoulder throw. That one was on Avery.

[GoodLuck]

Colts need to groom Hilton and Brazill. Spend draft picks a money on the OL. Not WRs.

[Smitto]

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/1368305-all-22-review-why-is-andrew-lucks-completion-percentage-so-low

This is a good read, luck was inaccurate on a quarter of his passes.. the rest were because of drops, pressure and good coverage.

Arians isn't helping luck either with his massively long developing routes... arians is deviating from what pagan was doing

[Mameluc]

Luck throws a good deep ball, you need to realize he's getting hit and balls get tipped.

besides the OP, i dont think anyone is questioning wether he can or cant throw a deep ball.

but it cant be denied that several times he has missed a man deep, particularly Avery. at least 2 times a game he goes free on a deep route and overthrows him, underthrows him or something. its obviously not a matter of him not having hte arm to go deep, his deep balls seem effortless, is just that he needs to get together with Avery and get to know how fast he is and get a chemistry with him because had he hit Avery on all 4 games at least once of those deep balls Avery would have like 220 more yards by now...and probably 2 more TD

[Boiler_Colt]

Any qb can throw a 70yd bomb when he has no one in front of him or ppl blanketing the wr... you can go back to his college plays and see there were many plays where the receivers had to come back to the ball to make the catch.

Maybe it is mechanics but it looked a lot like arm strength in college and it has looked like that in the NFL as well

You answered your own question by stating that there are always people in his face and our WR's are always blanketed. We have yet to see what he can do when he doesn't have to run for his life in the pocket.

[Smitto]

You answered your own question by stating that there are always people in his face and our WR's are always blanketed. We have yet to see what he can do when he doesn't have to run for his life in the pocket.

Yea you have, you've seen it plenty of times, its not like the oline gives luck no time to throw... being inaccurate on a quarter of your attempts does not include the pressure from opposing teams... its throws that just were not there....

Time will tell what type of qb luck will be but right now he's playing at the level of an avg an... which should have been expected from the get go

[GoColts8818]

agreed the sky is not falling

enh that happened last year if we can make it threw that we can handle this

[IndyJayman]

Luck was beat down yesterday. O line didn't stand up at all! I wonder if that has anything to do with passing? Sarcasm added for effect.

[#12]

Couple of quick points... neither is too big a deal... but wanted them on the record...

In his first year in college, Luck completed 56% of his passes, not 50%... he jumped to 70+% in both his 2nd and 3rd years.

Big jumps. I expect a good jump next year. And another good jump his 3rd year.

The other point is this.... while we're now picking apart Luck's flaws -- and he's got them -- let's not forget that a week ago some here were saying they wouldn't trade Luck for any other QB.

Welcome to the world of being a fan, where we are all Prisoners of the Moment. (Props to Jules, who I think first used this phrase after the loss to J'Ville)

We do good, and some here are talking playoffs. We do poorly and we're down in the dumps.

I've tried to preach patience and to not get too high with the wins or too low with the losses.

With such a young, inexperienced, and frankly, not very talented team, there are going to be some wild swings of performance.

I think someone on one thread today referred to it as the roller coaster ride.

Yup! That's it. So, buckle up, because it's going to be that way for the entire year....

Oh.... and suddenly, there's no more Bruce Arians will get a Head Coaching job next year talk.....

Just sayin.... :cool:

I think you're right, New Colts Fan. After yesterday's performance, I went back and watched his junior and senior years at Stanford. I saw nothing resembling the type of inaccuracy we've seen so far in the regular season. He was consistently putting it on his receivers hands and leading his receivers. So, I think it all comes down to repetition and his comfort level. This is a new offense, new team, new receivers... Next year, or the year after, when it's second nature, when he's protected, the accuracy will improve.

That said, I'm not convinced he will ever play a Manning, Brees, Brady-type of game, so the team needs to be built accordingly. He's more of a gutty type of playmaker. I see more Roethlisberger, Eli and Rivers in him than I do ruthless efficiency.

[BOTT]

it wasn't the plays themselves that concered me it was more the poor judgement and there was a couple of balls that he threw that should have been picked off. or like the pick six he threw that got called back cause of PI he should not have tried to fit that ball in there in the firsrt place. but like i said he is a rookie and every snap is a learning experience, Luck will get it figured out.

still....he threw into double coverage late in a game where they were getting beat by 20...not that uncommon, that qb has to take chances. i saw no problem with the throw to wayne, the pi was obvious and blantant

[ruksak]

I'm more concerned with our red zone offense. Ranked 28th. That's not all on Luck, but he doesn't fill me with oodles of confidence down there (yet).

Yeah, he looks really indecisive and uncomfortable inside the red. Even that last pass to Wayne (the game winner) in the GB game was very very nearly a pick.

All of this is normal. The speed and look of NFL defenses are rattling him. We see in Washington, a young guy that is enjoying a bit more success because he was loaded into a team that had itself well into a reloading phase.

That said, I'm not convinced he will ever play a Manning, Brees, Brady-type of game, so the team needs to be built accordingly. He's more of a gutty type of playmaker. I see more Roethlisberger, Eli and Rivers in him than I do ruthless efficiency.

I think he's capable. I believe the thing that he will be known for in the future will be his hybrid ability to scramble and extend plays combined with the ability to pass with efficiency for a gross amount of yardage.

I think it hurts him that Arians is burdened with HC duties. The kid has so much learning to do.

Every fanbase that acquired a Peyton, Eli, Big Ben, Brady, Brees ......was made to seriously question their new franchise QB early on in his career. It boils down to patience, and being we're coming off one of the winning-est decades in professional sports history, you would think patience would be in more abundance 'round here.

[krunk]

I'm not certain what is causing so many of his sailed and short passes. Looks like they happen when he is moving around a bit and fails to go through his throwing motion.

[Boiler_Colt]

Yea you have, you've seen it plenty of times, its not like the oline gives luck no time to throw... being inaccurate on a quarter of your attempts does not include the pressure from opposing teams... its throws that just were not there....

Time will tell what type of qb luck will be but right now he's playing at the level of an avg an... which should have been expected from the get go

Should have kept Jeff George then, no questions about his arm strength.

[Flash7]

Talent wise, this year's team isn't too different from last year's team. We are still a bottom of the barrel team but with a few new promising players. Luck is the most promising player that we've acquired this year.

Last year, everyone wanted to know what our team would have been like "if we only had a good QB." We have that this year, and in 5 games, we've already amassed the same number of wins from a year ago, with a whole new offensive system, and mostly rookie receivers and TEs.

The problem with this is that everything rides on Luck's shoulders. We do not have enough talent to overcome a bad game from Luck, as has been withnessed in the Bears and Jets games. Even worse, despite a good game by Luck in the Jaguars game where he brought us back and gave the Colts a lead with a minute left on the clock, we still lost. We need super-gutsy performances from Luck to pull out a win, as witnessed in the Vikings and Packers games. Rather than worrying about Luck's deep ball accuracy, I'd rather hope that others (aside from Wayne) start to show up.

[Smitto]

Should have kept Jeff George then, no questions about his arm strength.

I've said this all along the colts don't need a Peyton Manning to win, an Alex smith would be just fine... someone that doesn't turn the ball over, manages the game gets into a shootout when needed but a balanced offense.

Luck did not run an offense where he slung the ball close to 50 times a game, if they wanna make him feel comfortable then they should try harder and adapt the offense to his skills.

Run the ball and intermediate passes

[ruksak]

..... if they wanna make him feel comfortable then they should try harder and adapt the offense to his skills.

One thing that's been troubling me; I feel as if they've been heavily discouraging him from tucking the ball and running for the first down when needed. I've seen many examples of him having an opportunity to do so and instead trying to complete a difficult pass. There was one in particular to Avery yesterday that comes to mind.

When you have a QB that keeps jogging for the first down, it not only gets you the easy conversions but it also plays on the defenses reactions, causing them to have to spy the QB which typically helps to free a receiver.

[Flash7]

I've said this all along the colts don't need a Peyton Manning to win, an Alex smith would be just fine... someone that doesn't turn the ball over, manages the game gets into a shootout when needed but a balanced offense.

Luck did not run an offense where he slung the ball close to 50 times a game, if they wanna make him feel comfortable then they should try harder and adapt the offense to his skills.

Run the ball and intermediate passes

How many games had Alex Smith won when his supporting cast was horrible? You need a Peyton Manning when you do not have many other pieces. Alex Smith will not win ANY games with this team and this defense. Luck gives us a much better shot of winning week-in and week-out. Until we get the other pieces in place, we need Luck to be like Manning.

[willysp]

Everyone knows we have a weak O-line, D-line and ST (except for Adam and Pat). Luck did quite a good job compensating for that in the first 4 games, but not yesterday. First 4 games = he was part of the solution. Yesterday = part of the problem. 1 of 5 is pretty good for rookie, I think. It took Peyton a full year to learn how to carry a weak and mediocre team on his back. Luck has done it 4 of 5 games.

[Blackhawk4]

The worst thread of the year award is going to be hard to choose with more threads like this popping up....

[willysp]

The worst thread of the year award is going to be hard to choose with more threads like this popping up....

Yes - time to close it. If you're a mod, then please do so !

[braveheartcolt]

Why? Because many see the flaws? You cannot sing to the heavens when he leads us to last minute victories and ignore his weaknesses. His deep ball, his RZ efficiency and his risky pass tendencies are evident. Rookie or not. We see it, we talk about it. If we had a worst post of the year......

Or go to the new Colts Homer Forum if you want Peaches and Cream.

[Smitto]

How many games had Alex Smith won when his supporting cast was horrible? You need a Peyton Manning when you do not have many other pieces. Alex Smith will not win ANY games with this team and this defense. Luck gives us a much better shot of winning week-in and week-out. Until we get the other pieces in place, we need Luck to be like Manning.

That's a flat out lie right now Alex Smith is a much better qb than luck and he would have made much better decisions on the passes luck attempted.. any good veteran qb would have.. they need to play to lucks strength like they have with Griffin Newton and others.

One of the main reasons the colts struggled with Manning in the playoffs is because they depended on him too much.. this must not not be the issue with luck and this regime or you'll be seeing early exits out of the playoffs once again

[Smitto]

One thing that's been troubling me; I feel as if they've been heavily discouraging him from tucking the ball and running for the first down when needed. I've seen many examples of him having an opportunity to do so and instead trying to complete a difficult pass. There was one in particular to Avery yesterday that comes to mind.

When you have a QB that keeps jogging for the first down, it not only gets you the easy conversions but it also plays on the defenses reactions, causing them to have to spy the QB which typically helps to free a receiver.

I think arians is trying to duplicate his success like he had in Pittsburgh but the thing is he can't with a line this bad... I wanna know if he's willing to try different things

[PrincetonTiger]

He's still getting use to the speed in the NFL. Give him some time

agreed

[Flash7]

That's a flat out lie right now Alex Smith is a much better qb than luck and he would have made much better decisions on the passes luck attempted.. any good veteran qb would have.. they need to play to lucks strength like they have with Griffin Newton and others.

One of the main reasons the colts struggled with Manning in the playoffs is because they depended on him too much.. this must not not be the issue with luck and this regime or you'll be seeing early exits out of the playoffs once again

I think that for the most part, you and I are talking about the same thing, just focusing on different time periods. I am focusing on the team as it currently is today. And with today's team, we have to rely on Luck because we do not have much else, especially not a running game. We cannot win with a game manager if we do not have all of the other pieces in place. We would be the Jaguars minus Mojo Drew.

As we progress, like you, I would like for the Colts to be a much more balanced team. A team that has a very good defense, and a very good run game to accompany a potent passing game. I however, would like for more from the QB than just a game manager ala- Alex Smith.

Houston is a good current example of a team with a good passing game, a good running game, and a dominant defense. Yes they lost this week, but sometimes good teams lose.

[GoodLuck]

I saw someone say he needs to hit the weight room. He's a lil too bulky up top as it is. He looks like a bodybuilder. Maybe he needs to lose some muscle and become a lil more flexible with his hips.

[shakedownstreet]

:HFire:

:HFire: :HFire: :HFire: :HFire:

[Superman]

http://m.bleacherrep...rcentage-so-low

This is a good read, luck was inaccurate on a quarter of his passes.. the rest were because of drops, pressure and good coverage.

Arians isn't helping luck either with his massively long developing routes... arians is deviating from what pagan was doing

How many of those 11 passes (yes, 25% of his throws yesterday = 11 attempts that were incomplete because he was off) were on third down, or thrown into the end zone?

And that doesn't take into account the poor decisions in the pass game, like throwing to tightly covered Avery instead of running for the first down, taking sacks, etc. Luck just wasn't on yesterday.

[Smitto]

I think that for the most part, you and I are talking about the same thing, just focusing on different time periods. I am focusing on the team as it currently is today. And with today's team, we have to rely on Luck because we do not have much else, especially not a running game. We cannot win with a game manager if we do not have all of the other pieces in place. We would be the Jaguars minus Mojo Drew.

As we progress, like you, I would like for the Colts to be a much more balanced team. A team that has a very good defense, and a very good run game to accompany a potent passing game. I however, would like for more from the QB than just a game manager ala- Alex Smith.

Houston is a good current example of a team with a good passing game, a good running game, and a dominant defense. Yes they lost this week, but sometimes good teams lose.

I know for certain if alex smith was the qb for this team right now the current record would be better... just like if luck was a bit more accurate and didnt force the ball a bit the record would be different... i dont like playing the if game but its true. They arent playing to his strengths

[Smitto]

How many of those 11 passes (yes, 25% of his throws yesterday = 11 attempts that were incomplete because he was off) were on third down, or thrown into the end zone?

And that doesn't take into account the poor decisions in the pass game, like throwing to tightly covered Avery instead of running for the first down, taking sacks, etc. Luck just wasn't on yesterday.

Im not sure what your saying but i think arians can help luck a bit more

[Boiler_Colt]

I've said this all along the colts don't need a Peyton Manning to win, an Alex smith would be just fine... someone that doesn't turn the ball over, manages the game gets into a shootout when needed but a balanced offense.

Luck did not run an offense where he slung the ball close to 50 times a game, if they wanna make him feel comfortable then they should try harder and adapt the offense to his skills.

Run the ball and intermediate passes

I agree with you here, Peyton did not have the best arm strength he just knew the game better than everyone else and knew where his receivers were going to be. All indications are that Luck has similar understanding of the game and work ethic at this stage of his career. In this league that's what makes QB's that win consistently. You can have a rocket like Cutler, Stafford or Flacco but how many times do those guys lose games by slinging it around like .. I expect as the years go on that you will see remarkable improvements in accuracy and execution just like the Manning bros. and Matt Ryans of the world, etc.

[neverstop1863]

The worst thread of the year award is going to be hard to choose with more threads like this popping up....

Holy **** man, you aren't kidding i've voted for a few this month, i think we need to have some sort of "Bad thread playoff" but i gotta say this one i'snt getting my vote.......i question its depth. :S

[Superman]

Im not sure what your saying but i think arians can help luck a bit more

I'm saying that Luck being inaccurate on 25% of 44 pass attempts is still not acceptable. And that, outside of that 25%, there were several bad decisions.

As for Arians play calling and game planning, absolutely, he can help Luck more than a bit, I think. Easy completions, quick hitting plays, maybe a middle screen once or twice a season, etc. Too often, the pass plays take too long to develop, and then if there's good coverage, no one is open. The first third down conversion is a good example. Avery ran a good route and got open down the right side, but if the coverage had been better, Luck wouldn't have had anywhere to go with the ball. And so on. So I agree with the criticism of Arians' play calling.

But I do think Luck deserves some criticism for his inaccurate passing, particularly in yesterday's game. He was all over the place.