Leonard seems displeased with his role

[Hawkeyecolt]

6 hours ago, Solid84 said:

So on 39 snaps he had 10 tackles? How is that not impressive?

7 of them for at least 7-11 yard gains.  He actually made 3 tackles near the line of scrimmage.  He was average today which is better but he came off the field on passing downs because Olubi is significantly better in coverage. Olubi’s drops were quicker, had more depth, and he actually picked up guys running crossing routes. He didn’t tackle as well as Zaire, but I was impressed with him in coverage. 

[husker61]

8 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

7 of them for at least 7-11 yard gains.  He actually made 3 tackles near the line of scrimmage.  

this is the issue I have said for years with colts lb’s that have had high tackle numbers but they are mostly down field. So many here just use tackle numbers to say how good a defender is. The same with other stats that can be misleading for other positions. That’s why scouts watch games and not just look up stats!!

[Hawkeyecolt]

3 hours ago, husker61 said:

this is the issue I have said for years with colts lb’s that have had high tackle numbers but they are mostly down field. So many here just use tackle numbers to say how good a defender is. The same with other stats that can be misleading for other positions. That’s why scouts watch games and not just look up stats!!

I said that about Leonard specifically for years. Most of his tackles were 7-11 yard gains, he would disappear for long periods of time, he couldn’t shed blockers, and regularly beat by TE’s then bam he would create a impactful turnover. Dynamic and a great playmaker but overrated as on overall player. Especially when people would call him the best in the game. He was no Warner or David as complete linebackers. I would be happy with doing his job at WILL and create a couple turnovers then see how his body reacts at camp next year. If he’s the same I would move on. I would also make sure to draft a young LB. 

[chad72]

4 minutes ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

I said that about Leonard specifically for years. Most of his tackles were 7-11 yard gains, he would disappear for long periods of time, he couldn’t shed blockers, and regularly beat by TE’s then bam he would create a impactful turnover. Dynamic and a great playmaker but overrated as on overall player. Especially when people would call him the best in the game. He was no Warner or David as complete linebackers. I would be happy with doing his job at WILL and create a couple turnovers then see how his body reacts at camp next year. If he’s the same I would move on. I would also make sure to draft a young LB. 

 

Wasn't it Aaron Rodgers who said Fred Warner was still the best LB in the business, over Leonard when Leonard was having his best year?

[Boondoggle]

On 11/5/2023 at 5:56 PM, jvan1973 said:

How do you know how the coaches coach on practice?  Your take is in your mind.   He was benched a couple weeks ago.   That's as much as a pro can get a boot in the rear.  Some of the takes here are hilarious 

Bradley isn't a great leader, that's how I know.  He's not the guy who has the gravitas to tell a player of Shaq's quality and complexity that he needs to do better.  He's the kind of guy who will make excuses and protect his players and that doesn't jive well with a former elite player who got paid and put his feet up.

[Boondoggle]

On 11/5/2023 at 5:39 PM, NewColtsFan said:

Let me give you a compliment….

 

If someone had told me about that post, without telling me who wrote it, it never would have occurred to me that you wrote it.   You’re a smart guy and a good poster, but everyone makes a bad post, everyone.   It’s the nature of internet message boards, it comes with the territory.  And I’ve made some REALLY bad ones.   What?  Was?   I?  Thinking?     We all make bad posts, and you just did.  
 

I can think of 100 other posters who I would not be surprised if they wrote it.  Honestly, it’s beneath you.   It’s the viewpoint of a frustrated fan — nothing more.   Hold yourself to a higher standard.  

 

All my comments should be viewed as compliments to you.    Honestly. 

This reminds me of the suit that sold me my first car.  And that should not be viewed as a compliment.

[2006Coltsbestever]

On 11/5/2023 at 6:25 PM, Boondoggle said:

I've done things that are embarrassing.  Like getting too drunk at my sister's wedding and dirty dancing with her new husband's mother.  But that post was not one of them.

That is hard to top. 

[throwing BBZ]

On 11/6/2023 at 3:22 AM, Hawkeyecolt said:

7 of them for at least 7-11 yard gains.  He actually made 3 tackles near the line of scrimmage.  He was average today which is better but he came off the field on passing downs because Olubi is significantly better in coverage. Olubi’s drops were quicker, had more depth, and he actually picked up guys running crossing routes. He didn’t tackle as well as Zaire, but I was impressed with him in coverage.

 

 I was hopeful about Olubi. He looked lost out there and was awful. Shaq did stick his nose into the action a few times but was meh overall.

[AustexColt]

Shaq against the Panthers was a LB that was a shadow of his Maniac days. We should help him retire after this season. 

[1959Colts]

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2023/11/7/23949255/colts-winners-losers-week-9-panthers

 

Colts’ Winners & Losers: Week 9 @Panthers

 

Winners...

...Segun Olubi

Olubi played on 97% of the defensive snaps in Zaire Franklin’s abscence, and got the game sealing interception late in the game. Franklin is not one to miss games, so this amount of playing time will probably not be consistent, but he took full advantage of his opportunity.

 

Losers...

...Shaq Leonard

Despite having the most tackles in the game, Shaq is still a loser because he played on a season low 53% of the snaps on defense. Leonard has taken some time to return to his old self, and he does not look 100% yet. Now at the halfway point of the year, he should start making more plays or who knows what the future holds for the talented linebacker.

[Solid84]

1 minute ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2023/11/7/23949255/colts-winners-losers-week-9-panthers

 

Colts’ Winners & Losers: Week 9 @Panthers

 

Winners...

...Segun Olubi

Olubi played on 97% of the defensive snaps in Zaire Franklin’s abscence, and got the game sealing interception late in the game. Franklin is not one to miss games, so this amount of playing time will probably not be consistent, but he took full advantage of his opportunity.

 

Losers...

...Shaq Leonard

Despite having the most tackles in the game, Shaq is still a loser because he played on a season low 53% of the snaps on defense. Leonard has taken some time to return to his old self, and he does not look 100% yet. Now at the halfway point of the year, he should start making more plays or who knows what the future holds for the talented linebacker.

Shaq is too expensive for what he does, but he's still our best LB. I think Ballard hangs on to him for one more year at least, because he tends to hold on to "his" guys for too long.

[1959Colts]

5 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

Shaq is too expensive for what he does, but he's still our best LB. I think Ballard hangs on to him for one more year at least, because he tends to hold on to "his" guys for too long.

Leonard has done little to be called our best LB. It has been several years since he was a factor. While Franklin has been near the top of the league in tackles last season and so far this year. The team could do just fine minus Leonard. But the defense would definitely struggle without Franklin 

[Solid84]

17 minutes ago, 1959Colts said:

Leonard has done little to be called our best LB. It has been several years since he was a factor. While Franklin has been near the top of the league in tackles last season and so far this year. The team could do just fine minus Leonard. But the defense would definitely struggle without Franklin 

Franklin also leads the team in missed tackles by a good margine. He's entirely average and downright bad in coverage. He gets a lot of attention because he has a high motor and is involved in a lot of plays.

 

Leonard got called out by a poster here for having a lot of tackles after 5-10 yards. Franklin does exactly the same thing and misses a lot on top of that.

 

I'm not saying Leonard is the answer going forward. He needs to play a lot better than he does to justify keeping him on that contract. But Franklin isn't better than current Leonard.

[Zoltan]

1 hour ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2023/11/7/23949255/colts-winners-losers-week-9-panthers

 

Colts’ Winners & Losers: Week 9 @Panthers

 

Winners...

...Segun Olubi

Olubi played on 97% of the defensive snaps in Zaire Franklin’s abscence, and got the game sealing interception late in the game. Franklin is not one to miss games, so this amount of playing time will probably not be consistent, but he took full advantage of his opportunity.

 

Losers...

...Shaq Leonard

Despite having the most tackles in the game, Shaq is still a loser because he played on a season low 53% of the snaps on defense. Leonard has taken some time to return to his old self, and he does not look 100% yet. Now at the halfway point of the year, he should start making more plays or who knows what the future holds for the talented linebacker.

 

I've seen multiple Colts Reporters think Olubi had a great game, which aside from the interception I thought he had a horrendous game. He had 5 missed tackles and often found him laying on the ground while the runner continued by. While leonard had a way better game even doing well in pass coverage. I just don't get this narrative.

[1959Colts]

1 hour ago, Solid84 said:

Franklin also leads the team in missed tackles by a good margine. He's entirely average and downright bad in coverage. He gets a lot of attention because he has a high motor and is involved in a lot of plays.

 

Leonard got called out by a poster here for having a lot of tackles after 5-10 yards. Franklin does exactly the same thing and misses a lot on top of that.

 

I'm not saying Leonard is the answer going forward. He needs to play a lot better than he does to justify keeping him on that contract. But Franklin isn't better than current Leonard.

Entirely average? We will have to agree to disagree on that one. He is still leading the league in tackles, even after missing this past game. He is the heart and soul of our defense. Personally, just based my watching of the games, I think Zaire Franklin is by far one of the top LBs in the league. He is my favorite Colt. Franklin flies to the ball carrier and makes many tackles for little to no gain. I believe Franklin is a way better LB than Leonard.

[1959Colts]

edit

[Dobbinblitz]

Damn good player / teammate  /Leader on a good contract for the Colts.

 

 

[throwing BBZ]

59 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

 

I've seen multiple Colts Reporters think Olubi had a great game, which aside from the interception I thought he had a horrendous game. He had 5 missed tackles and often found him laying on the ground while the runner continued by. While leonard had a way better game even doing well in pass coverage. I just don't get this narrative.

 

 Anyone that says he wasn't bad is to be Ignored.

[throwing BBZ]

1 hour ago, Solid84 said:

Franklin also leads the team in missed tackles by a good margine. He's entirely average and downright bad in coverage. He gets a lot of attention because he has a high motor and is involved in a lot of plays.

 

Leonard got called out by a poster here for having a lot of tackles after 5-10 yards. Franklin does exactly the same thing and misses a lot on top of that.

 

I'm not saying Leonard is the answer going forward. He needs to play a lot better than he does to justify keeping him on that contract. But Franklin isn't better than current Leonard.

 

 Bobby was overall a little more effective than Z. And we let him go.

I would let someone else pay Z anything more than $12 over 2 years. And be drafting his replacement.

[Hawkeyecolt]

On 11/6/2023 at 2:50 PM, chad72 said:

 

Wasn't it Aaron Rodgers who said Fred Warner was still the best LB in the business, over Leonard when Leonard was having his best year?

Yes and Leonard got his panties in a bunch about it.  

[Stephen]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

Yes and Leonard got his panties in a bunch about it.  

To be fair Leonard  wasn't getting  enough  credit then

[Hawkeyecolt]

10 hours ago, Boondoggle said:

Bradley isn't a great leader, that's how I know.  He's not the guy who has the gravitas to tell a player of Shaq's quality and complexity that he needs to do better.  He's the kind of guy who will make excuses and protect his players and that doesn't jive well with a former elite player who got paid and put his feet up.

If Leonard was upset because he was told that he’s not making enough impact plays. Who do you think told him that?  Coaches will and should protect them to the media.  

[Tsarquise]

9 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

If Leonard was upset because he was told that he’s not making enough impact plays. Who do you think told him that?  Coaches will and should protect them to the media.  

Absolutely, and what's funny is Leonard aired the dirty laundry himself when telling the world the coaches are not pleased with him. Just silly. 

[Boondoggle]

22 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

If Leonard was upset because he was told that he’s not making enough impact plays. Who do you think told him that?  Coaches will and should protect them to the media.  

I find your logic irritating.  Forcing me in fact to consider that perhaps my dislike of the DC is driving my opinion on this topic.

[Superman]

On 11/7/2023 at 6:42 PM, throwing BBZ said:

 

 Anyone that says he wasn't bad is to be Ignored.

 

He had a nice play for an INT, and for most people that's the only play they noticed him on, so that means he had a good game. /s

 

I like Olubi, liked him in preseason, he has a motor, plays hard, he's fast and rangy. But it seems like he's not a good tackler, and like the rest of our LBs he seems unclear about how to play his coverages. It's strange that he would step into the Mike role and get 100% of the snaps, rather than giving Leonard the dot. I don't know if Leonard will ever get back to where he was -- and he was never physically imposing, always a drag down tackler, not great in coverage, but he made A TON of plays -- but he seems to be holding up okay physically halfway through the season. That seemed like the right game to give him a chance.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

This just got even worse today.

 

 

[Superman]

So he says they told him 'wait til November,' and now it's November and his reps have gone down. I don't blame him for being frustrated.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

So he says they told him 'wait til November,' and now it's November and his reps have gone down. I don't blame him for being frustrated.

To me he looks scared. I think he is having a hard time realizing he isn’t the same player. Looks like a guy having a hard time realizing his career is in jeopardy. Coaches are seeing something they don’t like.

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

To me he looks scared. I think he is having a hard time realizing he isn’t the same player. Looks like a guy having a hard time realizing his career is in jeopardy. Coaches are seeing something they don’t like.

 

I don't see that from him at all. At this point, I'm pleasantly surprised that he has not had a physical setback. If what he said is true and the coaches told him to wait until November, then I don't know if I've seen anything that makes me think he's not physically able to handle a full workload. And in a game where Franklin is out, giving the lion's share of snaps to a STer and CUTTING Leonard's workload is weird. I could understand if he looked slow and incapable during games. He's not the same guy he used to be, but he looks fine.

 

Also, his comments sound like they haven't given him an indication that they're seeing something they don't like. He sounds like he's in the dark as much as we are. We've only heard his side so far, so I'll wait to see if the coaches have something else to say. But if what he's saying is true, then I get his frustration.

[richard pallo]

11 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

To me he looks scared. I think he is having a hard time realizing he isn’t the same player. Looks like a guy having a hard time realizing his career is in jeopardy. Coaches are seeing something they don’t like.

Scared?  Don’t see that at all.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Scared?  Don’t see that at all.

Just looks like a guy who was once great and is having a hard time realizing he isn’t the same. If you guys want to see what Bradley said watch this. It’s from Tuesday. I was kind of shocked Bradley was this open.

 

 

[SSColts]

If he's getting paid the amount of money he is, he HAS to be playing more. I understand his frustration. Yes, it seems like he's limited but it doesn't help when the coaches add to that limitation.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, SSColts said:

If he's getting paid the amount of money he is, he HAS to be playing more. I understand his frustration. Yes, it seems like he's limited but it doesn't help when the coaches add to that limitation.

Coaches are clearly seeing something and don’t trust him.

[Superman]

Meh. Bradley addressed it. I don't hear him refuting anything Leonard said, or explaining why Leonard can't play Mike when Franklin is out, or why Leonard and Speed can't play nickel together in that situation, or why Leonard can't play more third downs. He did admit that the rotation hasn't worked out the way they hoped it would. He said they are monitoring how many plays in a row they want Leonard to have, and that's part of the rotation decisions. I get why Leonard is frustrated with 39 snaps and virtually nothing on third down.

 

Side note, hearing Bradley talk about developing young players, like not giving up on Baker and seeing him have a better game and stay locked in, it explains why Bradley and his staff have the reputation of being good teachers. I appreciate that about him.

 

1 minute ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Coaches are clearly seeing something and don’t trust him.

 

That's definitely NOT what Bradley said.

[Solid84]

49 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

This just got even worse today.

 

 

Completely understand him. Hope the coaching staff puls their collective heads out..

[RollerColt]

4 minutes ago, Superman said:

Meh. Bradley addressed it. I don't hear him refuting anything Leonard said, or explaining why Leonard can't play Mike when Franklin is out, or why Leonard and Speed can't play nickel together in that situation, or why Leonard can't play more third downs. He did admit that the rotation hasn't worked out the way they hoped it would. He said they are monitoring how many plays in a row they want Leonard to have, and that's part of the rotation decisions. I get why Leonard is frustrated with 39 snaps and virtually nothing on third down.

 

Side note, hearing Bradley talk about developing young players, like not giving up on Baker and seeing him have a better game and stay locked in, it explains why Bradley and his staff have the reputation of being good teachers. I appreciate that about him.

 

 

That's definitely NOT what Bradley said.

Do we think Bradley is just having a hard time figuring out how Shaq fits in this defense? 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

Completely understand him. Hope the coaching staff puls their collective heads out..

Are fans going to feel the same if he is out there and blows the game? 

8 minutes ago, Superman said:

Meh. Bradley addressed it. I don't hear him refuting anything Leonard said, or explaining why Leonard can't play Mike when Franklin is out, or why Leonard and Speed can't play nickel together in that situation, or why Leonard can't play more third downs. He did admit that the rotation hasn't worked out the way they hoped it would. He said they are monitoring how many plays in a row they want Leonard to have, and that's part of the rotation decisions. I get why Leonard is frustrated with 39 snaps and virtually nothing on third down.

 

Side note, hearing Bradley talk about developing young players, like not giving up on Baker and seeing him have a better game and stay locked in, it explains why Bradley and his staff have the reputation of being good teachers. I appreciate that about him.

 

 

That's definitely NOT what Bradley said.

I never said that is what Bradley said. I said behind the scenes they clearly don’t trust him. Their actions are louder then words.

[RollerColt]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Are fans going to feel the same if he is out there and blows the game? 

Feels like a double edged sword honestly... Some are upset he's not getting a chance, others will be upset if he does get the chance. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

If Leonard feels like he can play, I say give the guy at least 50 snaps and let him have had it. He deserves that kind of respect. He brought a lot to the franchise from 2018-2021. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Also the guy that replaced Franklin last week played 100% of snaps and got a int. Can’t argue with that result.