what do the colts need for 2020

[CR91]

QB

 

Let me start by saying I think Brisett has done a great job this year. People forget the great start he had in the beginning of the season starting 5-2 while throwing 14 tds to 2 ints. Unfortunately, I think the knee injury was more severe then the colts were letting on and they let Brisett play even though it was hurting the team. Brisett couldn't work inside the pocket causing him to miss throws and when he wasn't missing throws, our inexperienced players were dropping passes. Now do I think the colts need a new QB? Yes and no. Do I think the biggest problem for the colts is the QB? No, but we do need better play from our QB. Brisett just doesn't scream to me someone that a team can rely on at the end of the game to deliver, but I do think he is more then capable of winning us games. What I do think the colts need is better play makers especially at WR. There was just no threat on the outside once Hilton got hurt and because of the lack of a threat on the outside, teams stacked the box and forced Brisett to beat them and he didn't. Hes not Luck. He can't make chicken salad out of chicken crap. He can't carry a team.

 

 

WR

 

This needs to be addressed right away because Hilton is gonna be 31 next year and there is currently no one on the roster that is a WR1 after him. Perhaps Pascal will continue to grow and Campbell will show more flashes, but thats a big maybe. We are not doing Brisett or who ever the QB will be any favors if we don't help improve the offense. Hilton is still playing great, however this year showed exactly how bad the offense is without him. The record without Hilton in the lineup speaks for itself. I know this has been said for years, but we need to finally find someone to take pressure off of Hilton and I really hope Campbell can stay healthy because I did like what I saw in the few games he played this year.

 

Interior Pressure

 

I was impressed with the emergence of Stewart and severely disappointed with Autry and Hunt. Their level of production dipped specifically in the run game and that effected our entire defense. They couldn't hold off linemen and because of that, our LBers were getting blocked. I also blame the line for the secondary's struggles. Unless the front 7 can disrupt the offense, the secondary are sitting ducks to be picked apart while their in their zones. To play cover 2, you need to able to get home because QBs are too good in this league at picking apart zone defenses when they have time.

[John Hammonds]

I agree with you.  Also, the issues at QB and WR are related.  Part of the reason why we need improvement at the QB play is that he doesn't have good targets at WR.  Part of the reason why we need improvements at WR is that the QB isn't that good.

And then the next thing we have to think about is how to address these needs.  And that means, primarily with our 1st round pick.

I can see a scenario where everybody that we were targeting at our primary needs got taken before us.  QB's Burrow, Herbert, Tagovailoa, WR's Jeudy, Lamb, and Higgins, DT's Brown and Kinlaw.  Now what?

[Thunderbolt]

I think on the QB side, Jake Fromm, pro ready, quick release, accurate, read defenses and can scramble if needed. I would take him in a heart beat. 

[CheezyColt]

On 12/26/2019 at 8:39 AM, John Hammonds said:

I agree with you.  Also, the issues at QB and WR are related.  Part of the reason why we need improvement at the QB play is that he doesn't have good targets at WR.  Part of the reason why we need improvements at WR is that the QB isn't that good.

And then the next thing we have to think about is how to address these needs.  And that means, primarily with our 1st round pick.

I can see a scenario where everybody that we were targeting at our primary needs got taken before us.  QB's Burrow, Herbert, Tagovailoa, WR's Jeudy, Lamb, and Higgins, DT's Brown and Kinlaw.  Now what?

QBs Love, Eason, Fromm

WRs Ruggs, Shenault, D. Smith

DTs Marvin Wilson, or the Bama DT

 

I'd probably go Love/Ruggs/Shenault in that situation (no specific order right now) when discussing those 3 positions. Could also grab OL, Edge, or CB and I'd be cool with it.

 

Honestly, if everyone we targeted is gone, Ballard would likely trade down again and try to get a first or 2nd next year. "Love them picks"

[lennymoore24]

A new QB.  Jake Fromm, Nick Foles, or Josh Rosen.

[2006Coltsbestever]

32 minutes ago, lennymoore24 said:

A new QB.  Jake Fromm, Nick Foles, or Josh Rosen.

I like Jordan Love better than those 3. Fromm and Rosen stink and Foles is made of glass. I would take JB over those 3.

[lennymoore24]

18 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I like Jordan Love better than those 3. Fromm and Rosen stink and Foles is made of glass. I would take JB over those 3.

 

What is cool is we all have our opinions and no one is more legit than anothers.  I totally disagree. I think Jordan Love is a very physically gifted player who makes terrible decisions. He is like a more athletic Jameis Winston.  Too turnover prone.  I think Fromm has real potential.  Rosen if we could get for like a 5th would be an interesting gamble.  And I would take Nick Foles over JB any day.  JB has had two years to show that he can't get it done.

[2006Coltsbestever]

6 minutes ago, lennymoore24 said:

 

What is cool is we all have our opinions and no one is more legit than anothers.  I totally disagree. I think Jordan Love is a very physically gifted player who makes terrible decisions. He is like a more athletic Jameis Winston.  Too turnover prone.  I think Fromm has real potential.  Rosen if we could get for like a 5th would be an interesting gamble.  And I would take Nick Foles over JB any day.  JB has had two years to show that he can't get it done.

I respect your opinion, if it came off I didn't, I apologize. I am just not a Fromm fan, he and Herbert both look like bust material. Rosen has just been bad since in the NFL, and Nick Foles is just real injury prone now. Nick Foles 3 years ago would've been sweet. Love looks athletic and strong IMO, I also like Eason. I have been watching a lot of video lately of these guys. 

 

Not sure this is true but wasn't there an article regarding Herbert that said he doesn't even love football and would be happy without it?

[jameszeigler834]

On 12/25/2019 at 9:56 PM, CR91 said:

QB

 

Let me start by saying I think Brisett has done a great job this year. People forget the great start he had in the beginning of the season starting 5-2 while throwing 14 tds to 2 ints. Unfortunately, I think the knee injury was more severe then the colts were letting on and they let Brisett play even though it was hurting the team. Brisett couldn't work inside the pocket causing him to miss throws and when he wasn't missing throws, our inexperienced players were dropping passes. Now do I think the colts need a new QB? Yes and no. Do I think the biggest problem for the colts is the QB? No, but we do need better play from our QB. Brisett just doesn't scream to me someone that a team can rely on at the end of the game to deliver, but I do think he is more then capable of winning us games. What I do think the colts need is better play makers especially at WR. There was just no threat on the outside once Hilton got hurt and because of the lack of a threat on the outside, teams stacked the box and forced Brisett to beat them and he didn't. Hes not Luck. He can't make chicken salad out of chicken crap. He can't carry a team.

 

 

WR

 

This needs to be addressed right away because Hilton is gonna be 31 next year and there is currently no one on the roster that is a WR1 after him. Perhaps Pascal will continue to grow and Campbell will show more flashes, but thats a big maybe. We are not doing Brisett or who ever the QB will be any favors if we don't help improve the offense. Hilton is still playing great, however this year showed exactly how bad the offense is without him. The record without Hilton in the lineup speaks for itself. I know this has been said for years, but we need to finally find someone to take pressure off of Hilton and I really hope Campbell can stay healthy because I did like what I saw in the few games he played this year.

 

Interior Pressure

 

I was impressed with the emergence of Stewart and severely disappointed with Autry and Hunt. Their level of production dipped specifically in the run game and that effected our entire defense. They couldn't hold off linemen and because of that, our LBers were getting blocked. I also blame the line for the secondary's struggles. Unless the front 7 can disrupt the offense, the secondary are sitting ducks to be picked apart while their in their zones. To play cover 2, you need to able to get home because QBs are too good in this league at picking apart zone defenses when they have time.

Brissett isn't the future.

[Stephen]

25 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I respect your opinion, if it came off I didn't, I apologize. I am just not a Fromm fan, he and Herbert both look like bust material. Rosen has just been bad since in the NFL, and Nick Foles is just real injury prone now. Nick Foles 3 years ago would've been sweet. Love looks athletic and strong IMO, I also like Eason. I have been watching a lot of video lately of these guys. 

 

Not sure this is true but wasn't there an article regarding Herbert that said he doesn't even love football and would be happy without it?

I watched tape on fromm, eason, love,hubert, hurts and a few others  Fromm has good pocket  presence  and ball placement.  I think he would be a beast if draft by us.

[2006Coltsbestever]

7 minutes ago, Stephen said:

I watched tape on fromm, eason, love,hubert, hurts and a few others  Fromm has good pocket  presence  and ball placement.  I think he would be a beast if draft by us.

I don't see it but I have been wrong before. He looked real bad vs LSU.

[CR91]

2 hours ago, Stephen said:

I watched tape on fromm, eason, love,hubert, hurts and a few others  Fromm has good pocket  presence  and ball placement.  I think he would be a beast if draft by us.

 

Need to research the QB class more, but I am interested in Herbert

[Two_pound]

When evaluating qb's in this years draft you should also go back and evaluate a qb from the 2018 draft, I think most of you would see he is just as good as anyone in this years draft. and the good thing is he is already on the roster, his name is Chad Kelly. I like Fromm, I think he is the best qb in this years draft, but honestly, Kelly is way above him.

[CR91]

3 minutes ago, Two_pound said:

When evaluating qb's in this years draft you should also go back and evaluate a qb from the 2018 draft, I think most of you would see he is just as good as anyone in this years draft. and the good thing is he is already on the roster, his name is Chad Kelly. I like Fromm, I think he is the best qb in this years draft, but honestly, Kelly is way above him.

 

You wanna bet the house on someone you've only seen play against preseason players?

[Two_pound]

I saw him play some at Mississippi, just like Fromm at Georgia, Herbert at Oregon, Tua, so on and so forth. I'm not an expert, I just watch and see if anything jumps out at me. Kelly is as good as any of these top prospects this year. Maybe that's why he is still on the roster?

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, Two_pound said:

I saw him play some at Mississippi, just like Fromm at Georgia, Herbert at Oregon, Tua, so on and so forth. I'm not an expert, I just watch and see if anything jumps out at me. Kelly is as good as any of these top prospects this year. Maybe that's why he is still on the roster?

[esmort]

4 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

 

What are you confused about? 

 

I am in the draft someone early camp, but if you just look at the film and his skills and didn't know about the off the field issues and put him in this draft class he would definitely be one of the top QBs coming out. The guy has legit skills, it's just getting his head straight. 

[crazycolt1]

2 minutes ago, esmort said:

 

What are you confused about? 

 

I am in the draft someone early camp, but if you just look at the film and his skills and didn't know about the off the field issues and put him in this draft class he would definitely be one of the top QBs coming out. The guy has legit skills, it's just getting his head straight. 

Is that why he was drafted Mr. Irrelevant? 

If GMs thought he had the talent level you do he would have been drafted accordingly no matter his off field issues.

He will have his chance come training camp but as far as him having the talent of the top 5 QBs coming into the draft?  Not hardly IMO. 

Seeing what he did in a pre season game against players that didn't even make a roster is no way to judge a player. Our coaches see him every day so I will trust their judgement over anyone in this forum. 

 

 

[esmort]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

Is that why he was drafted Mr. Irrelevant? 

If GMs thought he had the talent level you do he would have been drafted accordingly no matter his off field issues.

He will have his chance come training camp but as far as him having the talent of the top 5 QBs coming into the draft?  Not hardly IMO. 

Seeing what he did in a pre season game against players that didn't even make a roster is no way to judge a player. Our coaches see him every day so I will trust their judgement over anyone in this forum. 

 

 

 

I'm not talking about just preseason watch some of his college tape and the QB break downs from the the season he came out. I don't watch near as much tape as many here do, but his college tape (and preseason) looks good. I have to think it was the red flags we knew about (and probably even more we didn't... maybe interviews too) that dropped him; it certainly was not the skill set so much as I can see. Maybe someone who does a lot of film study will chime in here, but he looked solid to me. 

[crazycolt1]

15 minutes ago, esmort said:

 

I'm not talking about just preseason watch some of his college tape and the QB break downs from the the season he came out. I don't watch near as much tape as many here do, but his college tape (and preseason) looks good. I have to think it was the red flags we knew about (and probably even more we didn't... maybe interviews too) that dropped him; it certainly was not the skill set so much as I can see. Maybe someone who does a lot of film study will chime in here, but he looked solid to me. 

Like I said, he will have his chance if he is still on the roster come training camp and pre season. 

I highly doubt him being on the roster has any effect on a QB if Ballard does draft a QB in this up coming draft. 

[esmort]

24 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Like I said, he will have his chance if he is still on the roster come training camp and pre season. 

I highly doubt him being on the roster has any effect on a QB if Ballard does draft a QB in this up coming draft. 

 

I definitely agree that his presence won't have any bearing on Ballard's draft decisions when it comes to QB. 

 

But, I think if they put him toe to toe with JB in training camp in a fair competition only basing the decision on skill alone (not who was the more upstanding guy, contract considerations, past mistakes, etc...) CK would have a good chance of beating out JB. 

[shakedownstreet]

On 12/25/2019 at 9:56 PM, CR91 said:

what do the colts need for 2020

 

[Two_pound]

I don't know if Kelly's presence will affect Ballards draft decisions pertaining to the qb position or not. But maybe he will think we're okay at qb and concentrate more on defense and wr and og. I do think that Kelly's skill set is on par with any of the top prospects this upcoming draft, so I would pass on selecting any of them.

[Stephen]

6 hours ago, Two_pound said:

I don't know if Kelly's presence will affect Ballards draft decisions pertaining to the qb position or not. But maybe he will think we're okay at qb and concentrate more on defense and wr and og. I do think that Kelly's skill set is on par with any of the top prospects this upcoming draft, so I would pass on selecting any of them.

Burrow is a beast 

[Stephen]

Move up and draft burrow 

[jvan1973]

Just now, Stephen said:

Move up and draft burrow 

Impossible

[Stephen]

1 minute ago, jvan1973 said:

Impossible

Lol would cost alot

[MPStack]

2 minutes ago, Stephen said:

Lol would cost alot

Do it! 

[Stephen]

12 minutes ago, MPStack said:

Do it! 

Ballard  is at the game

[MPStack]

6 minutes ago, Stephen said:

Ballard  is at the game

I think he’s scouting Fullbacks. 

[Thunderbolt]

A big mistake to be scouting WRs when there is no QB that can throw it to them..

[Stephen]

6 minutes ago, Thunderbolt said:

A big mistake to be scouting WRs when there is no QB that can throw it to them..

Doubt he is scouting burrow  as getting  him would be next to impossible 

[Pelt]

8 minutes ago, Thunderbolt said:

A big mistake to be scouting WRs when there is no QB that can throw it to them..

You do your due diligence on every position of need. 

[Imgrandojji]

If we start with obvious needs, the big one is another TE to replace Ebron. I don't really want Ebron back, he's just not consistent enough as a target to do what we're used to seeing TEs do.  I'd rather have a pure run/pass blocking TE out there than a guy who's almost dependable sometimes as a target.

 

One thing we need to bear in mind is that since Brissett is probably gonna be our QB to start the season next year. this offense is not going to be built around the passing game.  It's probably going to be built around the run, and efforts will be made to make the run game as efficient as possible.

 

That means a good blocking TE unless they think Mo-Allie Cox is that guy (and he might  be, he's a decent blocker).  That means ooking at whether you want to take the plunge and invest in a Fullback.  And most of all, that means keeping the OL as strong as possible.

 

The idea here is that we know we don't have an all world QB, but the replacement options available at the moment don't look like significant upgrades, so instead of spending draft assets trying to get the team back into a shape we're used to, efficient use of assets would be to strengthen the team as it actually is -- accentuate the run, and accentuate run blocking and run scheming.

 

I do however think we need to invest in a good handsy WR who can be trusted to make catches in traffic.  Brissett was having issues making throws into traffic and I'm convinced it hurt his confidence and led to some of the undesirable results in the second half of the year. 

 

TY is good at in traffic catching, but we need a couple of other targets who can go into dirty areas and let the QB be unafraid to take ordinary risks.  that, and additional valid targeting options would help keep TY in the lineup a bit more than he's been in the last 2 years when he's kinda been the only guy defenses have to worry about.

 

So from my perspective, our offseason goals:

 

1: Draft a QB in the second or third round with an eye towards training them behind Brissett this year and starting them next year when Brissett's contract expires.  Don't be afraid to let this QB take over if he looks good, but don't rush anything.

 

2: Investigate what personnel changes need to be made to create the best possible rushing game.  We have a good rushing attack but we got shut down at a couple key points last year and that ultimately exposed Brissett to more pressure than he can handle

 

3: Prioritize bringing in reliable, professional targets that get into an easy rhythm with quarterbacks.  I want to target Danny Amendola if possible as a major target for this team, I think he brings everything we need as a high level depth wideout, and he actually has experience working with Brissett. 

 

And I also one a first or second round pick to be spent on a WR who plays a very workmanlike style.  Less of a focus on speed or raw toolsets, since TY has that covered, but we need pass catchers in the 5-15 yard range with p oise and reliability to keep the pressure off both TY and Brissett.  I'd definitely rather draft for coachability and poise than get the next Dorsett or Cain with raw tools and no idea how to use them

 

4: This is going to sound weird because it seems like a strength for us but I want to see more speed in the linebacker corps.  We need a versatile unit of linebackers who can drop back in coverage and help prevent the secondary from being exposed.  A good pass rush is very useful, but first and foremost I want coverage sacks.  Since our pass game is questionable and we're relying on a possession offense, we need our secondary to be top notch.  I think we have the personnel to do that with our CB and S groups, but we're a little heavy-footed at LB IMHO.

 

5: Look into whether acquiring and scheming for a Fullback fits team plans.  I think that if you're going to be rushing a lot, a good fullback can take pressure off your RBs and increase yardage efficiency enough to be worth having on the roster. 

 

I wouldn't suggest this if we had a good air game, but we don't, we'll be trying to gain a lot of our offense on the ground, and while Mack is great, he's not top 10 and his efficiency suffered against more physical front 7s.  IMHO that means means a FB could help us.

[Yoshinator]

Would an RGIII trade (three 1sts and a 2nd rounder) get it done for Burrow?

[Stephen]

If Brissett  is going to be the qb we need an andre  Johnson,  calvin Johnson  type receiver 

[jvan1973]

49 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Would an RGIII trade (three 1sts and a 2nd rounder) get it done for Burrow?

Probably,   but would be a terrible trade

[i am yoda]

On 12/27/2019 at 5:08 PM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I don't see it but I have been wrong before. He looked real bad vs LSU.

 

I'm a UGA fan.  And I don't think Fromm is starter material in the NFL.  He's a backup at best.

[Four2itus]

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Would an RGIII trade (three 1sts and a 2nd rounder) get it done for Burrow?

That would set on the very same path we had with PM....a possible great QB and high difficulty to assemble a strong team around him. 

[Yoshinator]

9 minutes ago, Four2itus said:

That would set on the very same path we had with PM....a possible great QB and high difficulty to assemble a strong team around him. 

I believe we have a strong team already. With Burrow, we'd be a SB contender IMO. The 2nd round pick wouldn't be much of a loss (we have the Redskins this year), we're receiving the 1st overall pick in that trade. So we're really only sacrificing two 1st rounders for what looks to be a can't miss QB. I honestly have the Andrew Luck 2012 vibe about Joe Burrow.