2019 - 2020 Indiana Pacers and everything NBA thread

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 hour ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

the lakers are the main reason Reggie didnt get a ring I hope they suck for the rest of time

That 2000 team that lost to LA was just overmatched and that wasn't even our best team IMO. We had no answer for Shaq, nobody did that whole year. We made the Finals but the 1998 team was better that took MJ 7 games (ECFinals). If we get by them and we should've we would've played an older Jazz ream who had a banged up Jeff Hornacek. We may have won that series.

[oldunclemark]

10 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  I agree, trading Sabonis for Aaron Gordon and his $18M per for 3 years is a good fit.

I think we'd have to match salaries...and why would, Orlando so that

The team that needs Sabonis is Boston

 

But we have Sabonis for 2 more years. No need to do anything yet

[oldunclemark]

..and of the seven unrestricted free agents on our roster at the end of last year.

We resigned none of them.

Not one.

[2006Coltsbestever]

3 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

..and of the seven unrestricted free agents on our roster at the end of last year.

We resigned none of them.

Not one.

Kind of surprising to me. 

[oldunclemark]

8 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Kind of surprising to me. 

Yeah, me too.

Disappointing...

 

I understand. Apparently, Bogdonavich wanted the 4th year that Utah gave him.

If we're serious about playing Domas and Myles together, it made no nonsense to sign Thad Young for multiple years.

 

Matthews wanted to start and he has a chance to do that in Milwaukee.

Cory Joseph got a very good deal in Sacramento.

 

We didn't need Kyle O'Quinn….we have 3 centers now..

Darren Collison retired and Tyreke apparently gave up Pacer Gold for 'China White'

 

I understand it all. I really do.

But we've got a lot of new players I'm not overly familiar with.

And a top draft choice from parts unknown.

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

Yeah, me too.

Disappointing...

 

I understand. Apparently, Bogdonavich wanted the 4th year that Utah gave him.

If we're serious about playing Domas and Myles together, it made no nonsense to sign Thad Young for multiple years.

 

Matthews wanted to start and he has a chance to do that in Milwaukee.

Cory Joseph got a very good deal in Sacramento.

 

We didn't need Kyle O'Quinn….we have 3 centers now..

Darren Collison retired and Tyreke apparently gave up Pacer Gold for 'China White'

 

I understand it all. I really do.

But we've got a lot of new players I'm not overly familiar with.

And a top draft choice from parts unknown.

 

We are going to miss Bogey and Thad but Brogdon is a very good player and he's young. I hope he and Vic find a great chemistry.

[rock8591]

[oldunclemark]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

We are going to miss Bogey and Thad but Brogdon is a very good player and he's young. I hope he and Vic find a great chemistry.

I know all that...but its seven players I knew fairly well replaced by four (and more to come) that I honestly do not know as 'our' players.

 

Last year's team had a certain nature..  They rode hard for two years.

You could easily root for them. Now we have a group of strangers.

It will take some getting used to

[w87r]

Looks like our 1st round pick in Brogdon deal is lottery protected through 2025, unprotected in 2026.

 

 

 

[oldunclemark]

1 hour ago, w87r said:

Looks like our 1st round pick in Brogdon deal is lottery protected through 2025, unprotected in 2026.

 

 

 

Then we don't necessarily lose our No.1 pick next season?

Milwaukee can take it any year they wish to?

[aReggie7]

I saw an article on Bleacher Report for post free agency trade ideas.

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2843625-5-blockbuster-trade-ideas-early-in-nba-free-agency#slide4

 

One of the ideas involved the Pacers trading Domantas Sabonis to the Spurs for Derrick White and Chimezie Metu. 

 

I'm still in the doubting Sabonis/Turner playing together works camp. Adding another versatile guard is intriguing to me. I think Victor, Malcolm, and White could all play well together. Bring Lamb off the bench as a 6th man scorer.

 

How good is Derrick White though?

[MTC]

8 minutes ago, ar7 said:

I saw an article on Bleacher Report for post free agency trade ideas.

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2843625-5-blockbuster-trade-ideas-early-in-nba-free-agency#slide4

 

One of the ideas involved the Pacers trading Domantas Sabonis to the Spurs for Derrick White and Chimezie Metu. 

 

I'm still in the doubting Sabonis/Turner playing together works camp. Adding another versatile guard is intriguing to me. I think Victor, Malcolm, and White could all play well together. Bring Lamb off the bench as a 6th man scorer.

 

How good is Derrick White though?

 

That trade would make zero sense for the Pacers.

[w87r]

1 hour ago, oldunclemark said:

Then we don't necessarily lose our No.1 pick next season?

Milwaukee can take it any year they wish to?

No, if we make the playoffs next year, it goes to MIL. 

 

If we miss the playoffs the next 5 years(we don't lose our pick), the pick will be unprotected after that. 1st playoff season from now, the pick will be gone. Most likely next year.

[Myles]

I like Sabonis and I hope we keep him.   Personally I would rather trade Turner.   I know that is unpopular but Sabonis is a much better offensive player and a better rebounder.   Not as good on defense though (except defensive rebounds).  

[throwing BBZ]

14 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

I think we'd have to match salaries...and why would, Orlando so that

The team that needs Sabonis is Boston

 

But we have Sabonis for 2 more years. No need to do anything yet

 

 We do have to match salaries of course.
 And i would rather have Sabonis. That trade was actually silliness.
 Turner won't play over 28 minutes, so Sabonis will play many minutes at center.
  And i believe our head coach isn't stupid, so he will mix it up plenty on the starter minutes based on matchups.
 There is no issue with playing Sabonis and Turner together over an 82 game schedule.
 Yes there will be matchup issues to deal with when you get to playing the best teams in the Playoffs, but we are what we are. A young, small market team, that competes fairly well most years.

 JMO that we have a good shot at being Very Competitive in 2020-21 season.
Our young guys must get better.

[Chrisaaron1023]

Should ya'll go for Cousins? 

[BleedBlu8792]

1 hour ago, Chrisaaron1023 said:

Should ya'll go for Cousins? 

The Pacers have 3 C's now, they don't need a 4th.

[MTC]

2 hours ago, Chrisaaron1023 said:

Should ya'll go for Cousins? 

 

No. Not worth the headache. 

[RockThatBlue]

Pacers signed TJ McConnell

[RockThatBlue]

4 hours ago, Chrisaaron1023 said:

Should ya'll go for Cousins? 

We would have to get rid of either Turner or Sabonis to do it. 

[w87r]

19 minutes ago, RockThatBlue said:

Pacers signed TJ McConnell

Quality signing. Holiday and Brogdon can both slide to the 2 also.

 

Brogdon, Holiday, McConnell

Lamb, Sumner, (VO)

Warren, McBucketts, Bowen(2way)

Sabonis, Leaf, Johnson

Turner, Goga

 

Still could use a wing and 1 more big.

 

I don't know if we used cap space of part of our exception?

 

2yr $7m

[IndyScribe]

On 7/2/2019 at 9:35 AM, throwing BBZ said:

 

  I agree, trading Sabonis for Aaron Gordon and his $18M per for 3 years is a good fit.

How would that work salary wise? It makes no sense for the Magic as well.

[IndyScribe]

9 hours ago, Myles said:

I like Sabonis and I hope we keep him.   Personally I would rather trade Turner.   I know that is unpopular but Sabonis is a much better offensive player and a better rebounder.   Not as good on defense though (except defensive rebounds).  

And Turner is a much better defender. Turner is pretty much a key part of this team's D, and is a modern 5 that can also shoot. We also don't know how much of Turner's offensive struggles are on Nate.

 

On 7/1/2019 at 10:34 PM, BleedBlu8792 said:

No different than in the 90's with Jordan, I wouldn't have wanted him anywhere but Chicago. I don't like seeing the East being weak and just to make it "easy" for the Pacers. How I miss the 80's and 90's NBA..

If the Pacers were a historical franchise, like the Spurs or Celtics with a ton of rings, sure, the challenge would be fun. But they're not. I don't care if it's "easy", "undeserved" or Pacers get lucky like the Raptors, I just want a championship. If that means having an easy East, then that's completely fine with me.

[IndyScribe]

Good signing. TJ is supposedly a high character, great locker room guy. He will be the third PG off the bench, and 76ers fans love him. Do we have all the TJ's in the league?

 

The league isn't ready for 3J. 

2 hours ago, w87r said:

Quality signing. Holiday and Brogdon can both slide to the 2 also.

 

Brogdon, Holiday, McConnell

Lamb, Sumner, (VO)

Warren, McBucketts, Bowen(2way)

Sabonis, Leaf, Johnson

Turner, Goga

 

Still could use a wing and 1 more big.

 

I don't know if we used cap space of part of our exception?

 

2yr $7m

I think I read somewhere Pacers have 2.18 mil left + the exception. I don't think that's enough for one more player. I think you can sign a good backup with the exception. Maybe trade McDermott after July 6th?

 

 

Also, I'm lowkey excited for Summer League. That starting 5 has me hyped and I think (I know, overly optimistic), that every player could be a decent contributor. Brian Bowen has a massive chip on his shoulder, from what it looks like.

[MTC]

3 hours ago, RockThatBlue said:

Pacers signed TJ McConnell

 

Insurance if Aaron Holiday doesn’t work out.

[oldunclemark]

2 minutes ago, MTC said:

 

Insurance if Aaron Holiday doesn’t work out.

..and here's a guy who came of the bench and made something happen.

He's a Firestarter....

He cant shoot 3s but he hill D-up any 'small' guard.

 

2 years.....3.5 mi. a year? I love this acquisition...

I'm not sure Holiday won start with Brogdon until Oladipo gets well.

He takes the Cory Joseph-role and he'll be a crowd pleaser with his hustle

[oldunclemark]

37 minutes ago, IndyScribe said:

 We also don't know how much of Turner's offensive struggles are on Nate.

 

 

None of them are.

....Turner wasn't a good offensive player before Nate got here..

Myles Turner has NEVER been an above average offensive player at any level

[BleedBlu8792]

6 hours ago, IndyScribe said:

And Turner is a much better defender. Turner is pretty much a key part of this team's D, and is a modern 5 that can also shoot. We also don't know how much of Turner's offensive struggles are on Nate.

 

BUT... Myles doesn't shoot like he should and is soft on the block. He's a subpar rebounder and still can't handle the better big's in the league. If he can't score nor stop those guys, you have a big soft-a33 waterboy running up and down the court. I'd take Sabonis' offensive ability everyday over Turner's defense. Sabonis would abuse Turner in one-on-one situations if they played each other. 

 

6 hours ago, IndyScribe said:

If the Pacers were a historical franchise, like the Spurs or Celtics with a ton of rings, sure, the challenge would be fun. But they're not. I don't care if it's "easy", "undeserved" or Pacers get lucky like the Raptors, I just want a championship. If that means having an easy East, then that's completely fine with me.

 

I guess our outlook on the integrity of the game is different and I can promise you these guys don't want the "easy" path either. 

[aaron11]

8 hours ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

BUT... Myles doesn't shoot like he should and is soft on the block. He's a subpar rebounder and still can't handle the better big's in the league. If he can't score nor stop those guys, you have a big soft-a33 waterboy running up and down the court. I'd take Sabonis' offensive ability everyday over Turner's defense. Sabonis would abuse Turner in one-on-one situations if they played each other. 

 

i would have been open to trading either one of them if it were up to me.  they are both good players with different skill sets that we could build around.  i dont see how they fit together though

 

turner would be tough to trade now after getting that contract, thats why there is so much trade sabonis talk 

[Myles]

15 hours ago, IndyScribe said:

And Turner is a much better defender. Turner is pretty much a key part of this team's D, and is a modern 5 that can also shoot. We also don't know how much of Turner's offensive struggles are on Nate.

 

 

I think Turner is what he is at this point.   The potential part is pretty much done.   What he is has value.  It's nice to have a guy who can block shots.   For his size, it would be better if his rebounding was better.   Sabonis is better in almost every aspect other than pat of defense.   Sabonis is a much better defensive rebounder though.   I wouldn't give up on them being able to play together.  Nate should be able to find a way to make Sabonis  being on the floor a way to open Turner up on the offensive side.   Bitadze is going to add something that I really cannot predict how it will play out.  He's kind of a turner/sabonis hybrid.  

[throwing BBZ]

15 hours ago, IndyScribe said:

How would that work salary wise? It makes no sense for the Magic as well.

 

 Obviously it doesn't. His suggestion was "out there". 
 Not sure why the Magic wouldn't do it. They get as good a player, or better, and save about $28M over 2 years. 

[throwing BBZ]

29 minutes ago, Myles said:

I think Turner is what he is at this point.   The potential part is pretty much done.   What he is has value.  It's nice to have a guy who can block shots.   For his size, it would be better if his rebounding was better.   Sabonis is better in almost every aspect other than pat of defense.   Sabonis is a much better defensive rebounder though.   I wouldn't give up on them being able to play together.  Nate should be able to find a way to make Sabonis  being on the floor a way to open Turner up on the offensive side.   Bitadze is going to add something that I really cannot predict how it will play out.  He's kind of a turner/sabonis hybrid.  

 

 Turner's best basketball should start 2-3 years from now, at age 25-26, just like most hard working big men.

 Our defensive guru Dan Burke places a very high premium on being able to defend the rim. Turner is doing this at a high level with more upside, Sabonis unfortunately, is poor at it with little upside. That is why Goga is held as a Big pick for us as he plays "above the rim" as a defender.

  I too look forward to seeing Turner's offense, his number of 3's should go up the more minutes he plays with Sabonis, as his stroke is very good. I'd rather Sabonis just keep that tool in the lockeroom. 
 

[throwing BBZ]

15 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

None of them are.

....Turner wasn't a good offensive player before Nate got here..

Myles Turner has NEVER been an above average offensive player at any level

 

 GOTTA LAUGH when i read ____  sh__ like this. The guy is 23 years old.
 Turner is coming along fine for his experience. Check back when he has played a couple more years as he nears his Prime Years.

[oldunclemark]

2 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 GOTTA LAUGH when i read ____  sh__ like this. The guy is 23 years old.
 Turner is coming along fine for his experience. Check back when he has played a couple more years as he nears his Prime Years.

BBZ.....You're laughing because you don't understand the situation.

The  majority of NBA players are what they are (or on an ascending scale) after 2 or 3 years.. Myles has played 4 years.....

….He's never averaged 15 points a game..

..with Paul George......without Paul George

With Oladipo...….without Oladipo

..with Nate McMillan...without Nate McMillan

 

In contrast:

Domantas Sabonis averaged 5.9 points and 3.6 rebounds in 81 games his 1st year

Sabonis averaged 11.6 points and 7.7 rebounds in 74 games his second year

Sabonis averaged 14.1 points and 9.3 rebounds in 74 games last year

Why are his numbers getting better?

 

When we needed Myles to score last year..he averaged 13.3 points a game..

Myles averaged 14.5 three years ago with 7.3 boards

When we really needed him to up his game last year..he was 13.3 and 7. 2

Why are his numbers NOT getting better?

Its not his fault. He is what he is.

Turner is 'fine' if you accept that he's a 15 and 7 guy

But our biggest team weakness....is simply our lack of our players to get/take and make shots

 

..and check back when we get Brogdon and Oladipo on the floor and Myles is getting even fewer shots

 

 

 

[w87r]

I would love to add Igoudala, he is exactly what we need.

 

Not sure of numbers would work, but could offer them Leaf and McBuckets, and a few 2nd round picks?

[throwing BBZ]

On 7/4/2019 at 1:08 PM, oldunclemark said:

BBZ.....You're laughing because you don't understand the situation.

The  majority of NBA players are what they are (or on an ascending scale) after 2 or 3 years.. Myles has played 4 years.....

….He's never averaged 15 points a game..

..with Paul George......without Paul George

With Oladipo...….without Oladipo

..with Nate McMillan...without Nate McMillan

 

In contrast:

Domantas Sabonis averaged 5.9 points and 3.6 rebounds in 81 games his 1st year

Sabonis averaged 11.6 points and 7.7 rebounds in 74 games his second year

Sabonis averaged 14.1 points and 9.3 rebounds in 74 games last year

Why are his numbers getting better?

 

When we needed Myles to score last year..he averaged 13.3 points a game..

Myles averaged 14.5 three years ago with 7.3 boards

When we really needed him to up his game last year..he was 13.3 and 7. 2

Why are his numbers NOT getting better?

Its not his fault. He is what he is.

Turner is 'fine' if you accept that he's a 15 and 7 guy

But our biggest team weakness....is simply our lack of our players to get/take and make shots

 

..and check back when we get Brogdon and Oladipo on the floor and Myles is getting even fewer shots

 

 

 

 

 

 Your 2-3 year premise is bunk. Especially for Big Men.
 I would agree that Sabonis is near peak by your standards. He is never going to be a good defender, and he may never average 10 rbds a game because of it.
 Myles is going to get more shots outside of 15 ft as his career goes on and that will slightly affect his rebound numbers, while Always Helping Sabonis if he Can't earn his keep stretching D's.
 It is great that Sabonis got to clean up all those 3 misses from Vic, Thad, T Evans to bump his boards and shooting % to 59. Let's see how that works out next season.
 It is a matchup League, so all the ways in which a player contributes in the minutes he gets has to be considered. 

[Colts_Fan12]

1 hour ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 

 Your 2-3 year premise is bunk. Especially for Big Men.
 I would agree that Sabonis is near peak by your standards. He is never going to be a good defender, and he may never average 10 rbds a game because of it.
 Myles is going to get more shots outside of 15 ft as his career goes on and that will slightly affect his rebound numbers, while Always Helping Sabonis if he Can't earn his keep stretching D's.
 It is great that Sabonis got to clean up all those 3 misses from Vic, Thad, T Evans to bump his boards and shooting % to 59. Let's see how that works out next season.
 It is a matchup League, so all the ways in which a player contributes in the minutes he gets has to be considered. 

literally the only thing I've ever agreed with BBZ on. people need to stop crapping on myles 

[aaron11]

1 hour ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 

 Your 2-3 year premise is bunk. Especially for Big Men.
 I would agree that Sabonis is near peak by your standards. He is never going to be a good defender, and he may never average 10 rbds a game because of it.
 Myles is going to get more shots outside of 15 ft as his career goes on and that will slightly affect his rebound numbers, while Always Helping Sabonis if he Can't earn his keep stretching D's.
 It is great that Sabonis got to clean up all those 3 misses from Vic, Thad, T Evans to bump his boards and shooting % to 59. Let's see how that works out next season.
 It is a matchup League, so all the ways in which a player contributes in the minutes he gets has to be considered. 

 

so turner is too young to have peaked, but sabonis who is basically the same age has peaked?  interesting take.  turner just isnt good at rebounding and sabonis is, its not complicated 

 

i would still trade doma since i dont see them fitting together and turners contract is too big to trade now

[Colts_Fan12]

1 minute ago, aaron11 said:

 

so turner is too young to have peaked, but sabonis who is basically the same age has peaked?  interesting take.  turner just isnt good at rebounding and sabonis is, its not complicated 

 

i would still trade doma since i dont see them fitting together and turners contract is too big to trade now

too big many believe Turner's contract is a bargain 

[aaron11]

1 minute ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

too big many believe Turner's contract is a bargain 

do they think hes a max player or something and 18 million a year is a steal?