The Announcement

[John Waylon]

The announcement of McDaniels coming yesterday is something that has kind of been lost in the fray here. What kind of role did it play in all of this?

 

We know that McDaniels has been wishy-washy on taking the job since late last week. That has been long-reported. 

 

We also know that Ballard compiled a short list of candidates to interview in the event that this happened, so it seems that this wasn’t quite the broadside to him as it was to the rest of us. 

 

Was yesterday’s announcement an effort to pressure McDaniels into following through despite not actually signing the deal?

 

Sidebar: Which is something else that bugs me. In today’s high tech world we could have signed him to a contract if he were literally on the face of the moon. Why did we not lock him in upon his agreement? Even using an antique fax machine would have done the trick. I can’t help but feel that Ballard deserves a lot of egg on his face for not doing more to make it official. Waiting for him to arrive in town knowing he was considering not taking the job seems very reckless on the part of Ballard, so let’s not pretend that McDaniels is the only one to blame here.

 

Or, could the announcement before signing anything have spooked McDaniels and made him change his mind?

 

There are a lot of moving parts to this whole situation, but I think yesterday’s announcement, the lack of making the deal official, and the correlation between the two deserve a little more scrutiny than they’ve gotten. 

[BlueShoe]

Ballard absolutely deserves egg on his face.

 

I will guess that 99% of the forum will hate you for saying it though. I have experience in this. 

 

We got off easy on this one. I am thankful this happened. Yesterdays rejection to the "Announcement" almost proves there is a God, and that he has mercy on Colts fans. 

 

We should be asking what the Colts saw in Josh McDaniels to begin with. Apparently most other teams wanted nothing to do with him. They didn't buy that he had changed. For some reason, Ballard did. 

[AZColt11]

4 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

The announcement of McDaniels coming yesterday is something that has kind of been lost in the fray here. What kind of role did it play in all of this?

 

We know that McDaniels has been wishy-washy on taking the job since late last week. That has been long-reported. 

 

We also know that Ballard compiled a short list of candidates to interview in the event that this happened, so it seems that this wasn’t quite the broadside to him as it was to the rest of us. 

 

Was yesterday’s announcement an effort to pressure McDaniels into following through despite not actually signing the deal?

 

Sidebar: Which is something else that bugs me. In today’s high tech world we could have signed him to a contract if he were literally on the face of the moon. Why did we not lock him in upon his agreement? Even using an antique fax machine would have done the trick. I can’t help but feel that Ballard deserves a lot of egg on his face for not doing more to make it official. Waiting for him to arrive in town knowing he was considering not taking the job seems very reckless on the part of Ballard, so let’s not pretend that McDaniels is the only one to blame here.

 

Or, could the announcement before signing anything have spooked McDaniels and made him change his mind?

 

There are a lot of moving parts to this whole situation, but I think yesterday’s announcement, the lack of making the deal official, and the correlation between the two deserve a little more scrutiny than they’ve gotten. 

It doesn't really matter to me anymore.  The fact is JMD wasn't all in 100% and if you have a guy that's not 100% in why would you want him to begin with?  Time to move on.

[DaveA1102]

20 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

The announcement of McDaniels coming yesterday is something that has kind of been lost in the fray here. What kind of role did it play in all of this?

 

We know that McDaniels has been wishy-washy on taking the job since late last week. That has been long-reported. 

 

We also know that Ballard compiled a short list of candidates to interview in the event that this happened, so it seems that this wasn’t quite the broadside to him as it was to the rest of us. 

 

Was yesterday’s announcement an effort to pressure McDaniels into following through despite not actually signing the deal?

 

Sidebar: Which is something else that bugs me. In today’s high tech world we could have signed him to a contract if he were literally on the face of the moon. Why did we not lock him in upon his agreement? Even using an antique fax machine would have done the trick. I can’t help but feel that Ballard deserves a lot of egg on his face for not doing more to make it official. Waiting for him to arrive in town knowing he was considering not taking the job seems very reckless on the part of Ballard, so let’s not pretend that McDaniels is the only one to blame here.

 

Or, could the announcement before signing anything have spooked McDaniels and made him change his mind?

 

There are a lot of moving parts to this whole situation, but I think yesterday’s announcement, the lack of making the deal official, and the correlation between the two deserve a little more scrutiny than they’ve gotten. 

 

I genuinely don't think it is anything more than McDaniels agreed to become our coach, and the Colts took him at his word, and so announced the appointment.  McDaniels then cowards out and runs back to Papa Bill.

 

The Colts may have been a bit naïve to go without a signed piece of paper, but surely if you take a man at his word, he agrees to come to the press conference the next day to announce his appointment, then you are quite happy that he signs the document then?

[lollygagger8]

 

30 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

Ballard absolutely deserves egg on his face.

 

I will guess that 99% of the forum will hate you for saying it though. I have experience in this. 

 

We got off easy on this one. I am thankful this happened. Yesterdays rejection to the "Announcement" almost proves there is a God, and that he has mercy on Colts fans. 

 

We should be asking what the Colts saw in Josh McDaniels to begin with. Apparently most other teams wanted nothing to do with him. They didn't buy that he had changed. For some reason, Ballard did. 

 

God is real. Watch it. 

 

So Ballard met this "person" multiple times, planned for the future, and actually acquired a staff for him, and Ballard is the one at fault for expecting this person to do what he said he would? 

 

[BlueShoe]

Just now, lollygagger8 said:

 

 

God is real. Watch it. 

 

So Ballard met this "person" multiple times, planned for the future, and actually acquired a staff for him, and Ballard is the one at fault for expecting this person to do what he said he would? 

 

Part of interviewing someone is understanding their intentions. At the very least, Ballard failed to successfully get a good read on the situation. Other teams wanted nothing to do with McDaniels, because of his history.

 

Chris Ballard and our Colts were hoodwinked, and Ballard made all the decisions that led to the Colts falling for it. 

[IndySouthsider]

3 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

Part of interviewing someone is understanding their intentions. At the very least, Ballard failed to successfully get a good read on the situation. Other teams wanted nothing to do with McDaniels, because of his history.

 

Chris Ballard and our Colts were hoodwinked, and Ballard made all the decisions that led to the Colts falling for it. 

I never wanted the guy in the first place. I want someone who hasn’t failed already or has had some success like Doug Marrone had in Buffalo before transforming Jax. 

 

But it I have zero issue with how Ballard handled this. I also don’t believe for a second Irsay is letting Ballard make this decision all on his own. It was always told that we got Dungy because that’s who Jim wanted and sent Polian to get him.

[Mr.Debonair]

Why do ppl always look to blame? McDaniels agreed to be the next Colts coach, contacted and selected assistants and was set. That’s generally how these things go. Someone agrees to take the gig and then they do it. Outside of B.B. himself, in the thousands of coaching changes, rarely does this happen. The PR and Social Media team could have waited a few hours sure, but the understanding by the entire organization was that he was

the Colts new HC. 

[deedub75]

13 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

Part of interviewing someone is understanding their intentions. At the very least, Ballard failed to successfully get a good read on the situation. Other teams wanted nothing to do with McDaniels, because of his history.

 

Chris Ballard and our Colts were hoodwinked, and Ballard made all the decisions that led to the Colts falling for it. 

 

I think Ballard knew, or should have known, that McDaniels wasn’t 100% sure he wanted the job which is why Ballard had a short list of candidates ready to interview. I think Ballard ignored the warning signs and instead of backing out of the deal, he instead tried to convince McDaniels to take the job and it didn’t work. 

[BlueShoe]

7 minutes ago, IndySouthsider said:

I never wanted the guy in the first place. I want someone who hasn’t failed already or has had some success like Doug Marrone had in Buffalo before transforming Jax. 

 

But it I have zero issue with how Ballard handled this. I also don’t believe for a second Irsay is letting Ballard make this decision all on his own. It was always told that we got Dungy because that’s who Jim wanted and sent Polian to get him.

 

Irsay said in the 2017 season finale press conference that he would pretty much rubber stamp the guy Chris Ballard chooses. 

 

Dungy was a different situation. He was absolutely Irsay’s guy, but Polian was 100% on board too.

 

It’s not good management to be in the situation we are in. Chris Ballard is the manager, and even though he was duped and led the wrong way, he is partly responsible. He chose Josh McDaniels. It was his decision. 

[John Waylon]

17 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

 

 

God is real. Watch it. 

 

So Ballard met this "person" multiple times, planned for the future, and actually acquired a staff for him, and Ballard is the one at fault for expecting this person to do what he said he would? 

 

 

Solely?

 

No. 

 

Largely?

 

No. 

 

Free of blame?

 

No. 

 

Ballard knew this was a possibility. And when McDaniels agreed Ballard couldn’t send a fax to lock him in, knowing he had been less than 100% committed to taking the job. 

 

Taking a man at his word is living on the edge, as we’ve seen here. Taking someone at their word is a concept of romanticism. 

 

This whole thing was easily avoidable. We could have covered our own butt with a simple fax. 

 

But we didn’t. 

 

Your argument looks WORSE on Ballard. He took a guy who had not been fully committed to his decision on his word. 

[BlueShoe]

1 minute ago, deedub75 said:

 

I think Ballard knew, or should have known, that McDaniels wasn’t 100% sure he wanted the job which is why Ballard had a short list of candidates ready to interview. I think Ballard ignored the warning signs and instead of backing out of the deal, he instead tried to convince McDaniels to take the job and it didn’t work. 

 

That’s plausible. 

[IndySouthsider]

Just now, BlueShoe said:

 

Irsay said in the 2017 season finale press conference that he would pretty much rubber stamp the guy Chris Ballard chooses. 

 

Dungy was a different situation. He was absolutely Irsay’s guy, but Polian was 100% on board too.

 

It’s not good management to be in the situation we are in. Chris Ballard is the manager, and even though he was duped and led the wrong way, he is partly responsible. He chose Josh McDaniels. It was his decision. 

It also sounds like he was working and had contingency plans in the works.

 

I thought McDaniels was * from the beginning and he is doing nothing to change my mind. If I fault Ballard it isn’t because he got jilted, it’s because he wanted him in the first place.

[Myles]

This sucks for the Colts.   I was excited to have him coming here.  Now we have to find plan B or C.

The Pats screwed us again.

[BlueShoe]

2 minutes ago, IndySouthsider said:

It also sounds like he was working and had contingency plans in the works.

 

I thought McDaniels was * from the beginning and he is doing nothing to change my mind. If I fault Ballard it isn’t because he got jilted, it’s because he wanted him in the first place.

 

Ballard might have had a contingency plan in place. But if he was unsure then why make the announcement? Ballard absolutely could have handled this differently. 

 

I agree that Ballard shouldn’t have wanted McDaniels in the first place. 

[Colt.45]

22 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

Part of interviewing someone is understanding their intentions. At the very least, Ballard failed to successfully get a good read on the situation. Other teams wanted nothing to do with McDaniels, because of his history.

 

Chris Ballard and our Colts were hoodwinked, and Ballard made all the decisions that led to the Colts falling for it. 

 

Stop changing the narrative after the fact. Other teams absolutely wanted McDaniels and over the years he has turned down multiple. How quickly you've forgotten Colts fans panicking when they thought Tennessee was going to 'steal' him.

 

Maybe Ballard made the 'rookie' error of announcing before everything was signed. Detroit did same and it turned out okay. Most other teams in past (last year Niner and Rams) have done same and not dealt with this so while it may have been a rookie-is error, it's not something to nail the GM to the cross for. The intentions seemed clear, even if McDaniels was having second thoughts as was rumored (and Ballard apparently knew), who'd have sanely thought he'd do this? A staff was hired already, guys were in Indy and signed, who'd have thought he'd screw them over?

 

As for the lack of judgement by CB on McDaniels' character, that may be true but the Pats guy had all kinds of major league references so who knows. 

[csmopar]

I'd say that all parties involved deserve a share of the blame, however the majority of the blame goes to Kraft and a larger extent, McDaniels

[BlueShoe]

1 minute ago, Colt.45 said:

 

Stop changing the narrative after the fact. Other teams absolutely wanted McDaniels and over the years he has turned down multiple. How quickly you've forgotten Colts fans panicking when they thought Tennessee was going to 'steal' him.

 

Maybe Ballard made the 'rookie' error of announcing before everything was signed. Detroit did same and it turned out okay. Most other teams in past (last year Niner and Rams) have done same and not dealt with this so while it may have been a rookie-is error, it's not something to nail the GM to the cross for. The intentions seemed clear, even if McDaniels was having second thoughts as was rumored (and Ballard apparently knew), who'd have sanely thought he'd do this? A staff was hired already, guys were in Indy and signed, who'd have thought he'd screw them over?

 

As for the lack of judgement by CB on McDaniels' character, that may be true but the Pats guy had all kinds of major league references so who knows. 

 

I didn’t change the narrative. Not sure what you mean by that comment. 

 

The rumor of Josh McDaniels going to Tennessee was just a rumor. I don’t think it was ever proven to be true. It doesn’t matter what Colts fans believe anyway. Ballard wouldn’t / shouldn’t make decisions based on what Colts fans think. 

[Jaric]

On the bright side, at least we found out now that he who shall not be named is a terrible human being instead of 6 months from now when it's too late.

 

 

[BlueShoe]

4 minutes ago, csmopar said:

I'd say that all parties involved deserve a share of the blame, however the majority of the blame goes to Kraft and a larger extent, McDaniels

 

This. 

 

We have to accept that Chris Ballard owns some of this failure. It’s not completely his fault, but he owns this too. 

[csmopar]

Just now, BlueShoe said:

 

This. 

 

We have to accept that Chris Ballard owns some of this failure. It’s not completely his fault, but he owns this too. 

yeah, he does.  a small part but a part nevertheless

[jvan1973]

4 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

This. 

 

We have to accept that Chris Ballard owns some of this failure. It’s not completely his fault, but he owns this too. 

I assume you take blame if you make reservations and when you arrive the reservation wasn't honored? 

[BlueShoe]

Just now, jvan1973 said:

I assume you take blame if you make reservations and when you arrive the reservation wasn't honored? 

 

If I am making reservations with a shady business then yes. Also, there would probably be signs such as not getting a confirmation email or something. 

 

I would own some of that blame. 

[John Waylon]

1 minute ago, jvan1973 said:

I assume you take blame if you make reservations and when you arrive the reservation wasn't honored? 

 

Not quite the same. 

 

A simple fax would have sufficed. 

 

Hell, I can file my federal taxes with an e-signature. 

 

We weren't making lunch plans. We came to an agreement that called for a binding contract, but we didn’t actually make that happen. 

[Tsarquise]

4 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

 

Not quite the same. 

 

A simple fax would have sufficed. 

 

Hell, I can file my federal taxes with an e-signature. 

 

We weren't making lunch plans. We came to an agreement that called for a binding contract, but we didn’t actually make that happen. 

You don't want someone taking on the grand responsibility of being the head coach of your organization just becasue he is binded by a signature; you want someone who wants to be here, and will give 100 percent. 

 

We dodged a bullet.

 

Bring in Frank Reich, a former Colt. 

[John Waylon]

1 minute ago, Tsarquise said:

You don't want someone taking on the grand responsibility of being the head coach of your organization just becasue he is binded by a signature; you want someone who wants to be here, and will give 100 percent. 

 

We dodged a bullet.

 

Bring in Frank Reich, a former Colt. 

 

You’re not wrong, but that’s a gloss over of the original issue. 

 

Ballard was responsible for locking him up, and should have locked him up as soon as possible in any way possible, that way even if he did pull this, we’d have both he and the Patriots over a barrel to get him back. It would have been a nice compensation for all the effort and trouble we’ve put into considering him for the job the way we have. 

 

Instead we’ve come away with nothing but some assistant coaches that the actual head coach might not want on their staff, or mesh well with. 

 

We didn’t go to the proper lengths to protect ourselves here. 

[Barry Sears]

I believe it's on McDaniels.  He comes here for two interviews, begins picking his assistant coaches, we sign 3 of them.  Then he agrees to the deal and that he will be here for a press conference.

 

None of us were in the room during those interviews or listening on any pone calls, but Chris Ballard had to believe with all that lead up to this about-face, that McD was coming to Indy.

 

We can only speculate, because we don't know the facts of the whole situation.

 

It's just a shame that we wasted 5 weeks and the chance to hire other candidates waiting on this Benedict Arnold.

[Yoshinator]

Well... I wasn't here since the point where McDaniels bailed on us, but this on Chris Ballard to me. It has been said that he had a good relationship with McDaniels. He never got it in writing that McDaniels would be our coach. You have to do that. Most 1st timers wouldn't make that mistake. Ballard has shown to be really gullible recently trusting NE again and also trusting McDaniels without a contract. 

 

If it's shown that McDaniels didn't sign because Luck isn't 100% healthy or there is some other major problem (him and Irsay don't get along), I will apologize. Right now, I'm pretty devastated seeing this as I walk in the door thinking McDaniels is going to sign in a few hours. I hope we get compensation for this from the Pats, but my overall opinion and respect level for Ballard has gone considerably down. Lets hope the contingency plan is good.

[John Waylon]

1 minute ago, Barry Sears said:

I believe it's on McDaniels.  He comes here for two interviews, begins picking his assistant coaches, we sign 3 of them.  Then he agrees to the deal and that he will be here for a press conference.

 

None of us were in the room during those interviews or listening on any pone calls, but Chris Ballard had to believe with all that lead up to this about-face, that McD was coming to Indy.

 

We can only speculate, because we don't know the facts of the whole situation.

 

It's just a shame that we wasted 5 weeks and the chance to hire other candidates waiting on this Benedict Arnold.

 

But why wait to make him sign knowing he was having reservations? When he verbally agreed on (likely) Monday why not fax over a contract and get it signed? Why chance waiting until he landed in town (likely) Wednesday morning on a guy who, again, we knew was having some reservations and second thoughts?

 

We could have done more to protect ourselves in this deal. 

 

We just don’t seem to have. 

[deedub75]

Just now, Barry Sears said:

I believe it's on McDaniels.  He comes here for two interviews, begins picking his assistant coaches, we sign 3 of them.  Then he agrees to the deal and that he will be here for a press conference.

 

None of us were in the room during those interviews or listening on any pone calls, but Chris Ballard had to believe with all that lead up to this about-face, that McD was coming to Indy.

 

We can only speculate, because we don't know the facts of the whole situation.

 

It's just a shame that we wasted 5 weeks and the chance to hire other candidates waiting on this Benedict Arnold.

 

With any other candidate, I think I go with your thought. But this was Josh McDaniels. This is the same guy who entertained the 49ers job last year and even began calling coaches to try to put a staff together before he withdrew his name. This is the same guy who has been scared to take a HC job over the last few years because he was looking for the ‘perfect’ readymade team to coach because he was scared to fail again. This is he the same guy who has worked for years for an unscrupulous Patriots organization. His own boss even pulled the same stunt wit the Jets. 

 

All of these reasons are enough to make him not worth even pursuing much less trusting him enough to announce that he was hired before he signed on the dotted line. 

[Tsarquise]

12 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

 

You’re not wrong, but that’s a gloss over of the original issue. 

 

Ballard was responsible for locking him up, and should have locked him up as soon as possible in any way possible, that way even if he did pull this, we’d have both he and the Patriots over a barrel to get him back. It would have been a nice compensation for all the effort and trouble we’ve put into considering him for the job the way we have. 

 

Instead we’ve come away with nothing but some assistant coaches that the actual head coach might not want on their staff, or mesh well with. 

 

We didn’t go to the proper lengths to protect ourselves here. 

I understand. Yure right in that regard. Not a great look for Ballard. 

[Str8himalaya]

I think a lot of the blame has to go to Kraft. For WEEKS he knew we were pursuing JM and stood by and did nothing. He knew he was in on a second interview, he knew the assistants were being setup and even hired, and he knew it was reported Josh was set to become the next HC of the Colts. He did NOTHING until the last second, one would have to think he did it out of spite more than anything. Nothing was found out yesterday that was already know by Kraft and his team. Only shows more bitterness and poor integrity by the owner in NE. It's all going to be alright, that will come back to get him at some point, just a matter of time honestly. Sure, JM is no better, but Kraft did this on purpose to stick it to us again. Sore losers and ungracious winners. I'm GLAD that we aren't the NE Patriots.

[DougDew]

It just seems to me that you'd wait until someone is ACTUALLY THE HC before you announce he is the HC.  I see no benefit in announcing it before the contract is signed....which was supposedly only one day away.

 

There are rumors that Josh signed something, but it may not have been the actual employment contract.  If he signed an employment contract, then refuses to show up and backs out, I can see where the announcement is justified.

[lollygagger8]

1 hour ago, BlueShoe said:

 

Part of interviewing someone is understanding their intentions. At the very least, Ballard failed to successfully get a good read on the situation. Other teams wanted nothing to do with McDaniels, because of his history.

 

Chris Ballard and our Colts were hoodwinked, and Ballard made all the decisions that led to the Colts falling for it. 

 

Other teams also wanted mcD because of his history, so what? 

 

So, in your house, the one who gets deceived by the deceiver is at fault? 

 

mcD is a con artist, and "hoodwinked" A LOT more people than just Ballard. C'mon man. 

 

[Defjamz26]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

I'd say that all parties involved deserve a share of the blame, however the majority of the blame goes to Kraft and a larger extent, McDaniels

My thoughts exactly.

[csmopar]

7 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

 

Other teams also wanted mcD because of his history, so what? 

 

So, in your house, the one who gets deceived by the deceiver is at fault? 

 

mcD is a con artist, and "hoodwinked" A LOT more people than just Ballard. C'mon man. 

 

ignore him he's been trolling now for 14 hours... 

[Barry Sears]

Interesting that Kraft didn't try and change Patricia's mind.  I've seen several posts referring to this being a "Kraft Hates the Colts" thing.

 

 

[BlueShoe]

8 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

 

Other teams also wanted mcD because of his history, so what? 

 

So, in your house, the one who gets deceived by the deceiver is at fault? 

 

mcD is a con artist, and "hoodwinked" A LOT more people than just Ballard. C'mon man. 

 

 

I am not pointing the finger directly at Chris Ballard. I am saying he owns part of this failure. Some of this falls on him and people should accept that. 

 

Is Chris Ballard dirty? Absolutely not. I believe he an honest man who got duped. That said, getting duped in business is a failure. I am sure there were signs, and he knew who he was dealing with. 

 

Even considering McDaniels was a gamble. Ballard bought in. He took the hook and the sinker. 

[Reboot]

2 minutes ago, Barry Sears said:

Interesting that Kraft didn't try and change Patricia's mind.  I've seen several posts referring to this being a "Kraft Hates the Colts" thing.

 

 

Did you see what the Eagles did to them last Sunday?  You and I playing DE couldn't have done worse.  Goodbye Patricia! 

[BlueShoe]

5 minutes ago, csmopar said:

ignore him he's been trolling now for 14 hours... 

 

I have an opinion based on logic about the team I have followed extremely close for 33 plus years. 

 

I am not a troll. When someone disagrees with you it does not give you a right to call them a troll.