"sources" Manning Is Not Progressing/more Than Likely Retire (Merge)

[CCH]

From my understanding, compensatory picks go no higher than the 3rd round, and a year later.

However, if you cut/release the player, you get

no compensatory pick.

Are you sure about that? Because I read somewhere that we lost our 7th round comp. pick from Bob Sanders by signing Kerry Collins, and we cut Bob.

[Chris Greer]

I find it hard to believe that Jim Irsay told people who weren't even on the Colts staff or part of the Colts organization exactly what he had planned to do with the Colts or with Manning. I am not saying Manning won't retire or be released but I think with still over a month left until March 8th that decison has not been made yet. Besides I have read a lot of NFL.com articles and most of the guys who write those articles on that site are clueless.

[Wyld1]

^{It's my understanding that a 3rd round compensatory pick is the highest?}

[Dan]

^{It's my understanding that a 3rd round compensatory pick is the highest?}

I'm pretty sure it is, but highly doubt we'll get one.

[Wyld1]

I'm pretty sure it is, but highly doubt we'll get one.

I agree...the allocation process seems flawed, imo?

Btw, did you enjoy the "Big Kahuna Burger" and Sprite ;) ?

[UndecidedFrog]

Yes, I am pretty sure about not getting compensatory picks for players you decide to cut/release, and about the 3rd round to be the highest.

From a related article thanking the compensatory picks for the Raiders (since they traded away most of their picks for this year): http://raidernationt...ry-draft-picks/

"A team is entitled to compensatory draft picks if it loses more free agents than it gains, although the quality of the players gained or lost can also impact this. The value of this gained/lost formula for a player takes into account what round a player was drafted in, the salary he signed for with his new team and his playing time with his old team.

Players signed to minimum wage contracts do not count towards this formula, neither do players who were cut or not tendered as restricted free agents."

[Dan]

I agree...the allocation process seems flawed, imo?

Btw, did you enjoy the "Big Kahuna Burger" and Sprite ;) ?

It seems very arbitrary, I won't pretend to understand it!

And of course... the cornerstone of any nutritious breakfast!

[geinsteder]

please bring that talent to south beach. I can finally go to a dolphins game that I can enjoy. who knows maybe it will happen?

[Balzer40]

I find it hard to believe that Jim Irsay told people who weren't even on the Colts staff or part of the Colts organization exactly what he had planned to do with the Colts or with Manning. I am not saying Manning won't retire or be released but I think with still over a month left until March 8th that decison has not been made yet. Besides I have read a lot of NFL.com articles and most of the guys who write those articles on that site are clueless.

You don't think that would have been a major topic of conversation from any potential candidate for the job. Im sure this would have been one of the very 1st questions asked by the candidates. Before they would even consider taking the job they would want to know from Irsay what his plans are for Manning. So yes, it is very likely that every single guy that was interviewed knew what the plans were for the Colts future. And why is it, whenever writers write something certain people don't agree with, those writers are all of a sudden "clueless"? I have a feeling it is probably the other way around.

[Peyton and Eli fan]

JimIrsayJim Irsay

No he hasn't been released nor was a decision reached weeks ago

40 seconds agoFavoriteRetweetReply

[presto123]

You don't think that would have been a major topic of conversation from any potential candidate for the job. Im sure this would have been one of the very 1st questions asked by the candidates. Before they would even consider taking the job they would want to know from Irsay what his plans are for Manning. So yes, it is very likely that every single guy that was interviewed knew what the plans were for the Colts future. And why is it, whenever writers write something certain people don't agree with, those writers are all of a sudden "clueless"? I have a feeling it is probably the other way around.

Same thing I posted on the Pacers board. I think Irsay would have to be up front with the potential GM candidates about Manning future because so much of that dictates how you use your great draft picks.

[WSO]

Bright side is we get Andrew Luck. Right? Anybody with me?? Okay

[Balzer40]

JimIrsayJim Irsay

No he hasn't been released nor was a decision reached weeks ago

40 seconds agoFavoriteRetweetReply

This is just Irsay's way of taking a shot at La Confora, Still don't believe for a second Manning will be here after march 8th at the latest.

[presto123]

My Sports Legion also posted on twitter that their sources say Peyton will be released. Who is My Sports Legion?

http://twitter.com/MySportsLegion

[Smonroe]

https://twitter.com/...489294835646464

Irsay: "No he hasn't been released nor was a decision reached weeks ago"

[presto123]

https://twitter.com/...489294835646464

Irsay: "No he hasn't been released nor was a decision reached weeks ago"

I've already seen that. OK....he was 99% sure weeks ago. What is he supposed to say when it going to be a very unpopular decision?

[Balzer40]

My Sports Legion also posted on twitter that their sources say Peyton will be released. Who is My Sports Legion?

http://twitter.com/MySportsLegion

I have no idea who they are, chances are they just picked it up from somebody else, but that don't make them wrong. I don't care about Irsay's recent tweet, anybody that thinks Manning will be here after march 8th are fooling themselves. If im wrong, I'll gladly admit it, because I would love to see Manning tutor Luck for a season or 2 but it simply isn't going to happen IMO.

[Fx Stryker]

My Sports Legion also posted on twitter that their sources say Peyton will be released. Who is My Sports Legion?

http://twitter.com/MySportsLegion

It's just forums site.

http://www.mysportslegion.com/forums/

I'd take a guess it's operated just by normal fans.

[DILLIGAFER]

I have no idea who they are, chances are they just picked it up from somebody else, but that don't make them wrong. I don't care about Irsay's recent tweet, anybody that thinks Manning will be here after march 8th are fooling themselves. If im wrong, I'll gladly admit it, because I would love to see Manning tutor Luck for a season or 2 but it simply isn't going to happen IMO.

If you dont care about what Irsay says, continue to be in the dark. He makes the desicisions and you dont care what he says?

And you think we care what you say.. id rather listen to Irsay. Seems to be the guy making the moves, not you. IMO

[Balzer40]

If you dont care about what Irsay says, continue to be in the dark. He makes the desicisions and you dont care what he says?

And you think we care what you say.. id rather listen to Irsay. Seems to be the guy making the moves, not you. IMO

Boy, your brilliant :rolleyes:. We'll see in a month or so when Irsay releases Manning how much you are willing to listen to Irsay and trust in him. BTW, im not the one in the dark, that would be anybody that still believes Manning will be a Colt next season.

[Jules]

Boy, your brilliant :rolleyes:. We'll see in a month or so when Irsay releases Manning how much you are willing to listen to Irsay and trust in him. BTW, im not the one in the dark, that would be anybody that still believes Manning will be a Colt next season.

Why a month? If they know he is gone why the waiting game? It's like dead man walking here. Are they just waiting for the SB to be done?

[Smonroe]

Boy, your brilliant :rolleyes:. We'll see in a month or so when Irsay releases Manning how much you are willing to listen to Irsay and trust in him. BTW, im not the one in the dark, that would be anybody that still believes Manning will be a Colt next season.

He may well be released --- in six weeks or so --- but that doesn't mean Irsay isn't telling the truth now. What has he ever said that was a lie?

Your guess is no more or less valid than anyone. Everyone is guessing at this point.

[Balzer40]

Why a month? If they know he is gone why the waiting game? It's like dead man walking here. Are they just waiting for the SB to be done?

I have no idea why they are waiting, maybe its because they have had a lot of other business to take care of before they actually sit down with Manning and talk.

He may well be released --- in six weeks or so --- but that doesn't mean Irsay isn't telling the truth now. What has he ever said that was a lie?

Your guess is no more or less valid than anyone. Everyone is guessing at this point.

First of all, Im not saying Irsay is lying. Im just saying I think his recent tweet was just a poke at La Confora. If the decision truely hasn't been made yet for sure then he can say that without it being a lie. Im saying there is no way Irsay will take a chance at dumping 28 million dollars on a QB that may very well never play another down. He would devastate his own franchise by doing so and IMO he absolutely will not take the chance.

[FireJimCaldwell]

Personally I think anything happening will come after the Super Bowl, because Peyton will not want Eli sitting there on media day and having every other question being about his big brother....

[Fx Stryker]

Personally I think anything happening will come after the Super Bowl, because Peyton will not want Eli sitting there on media day and having every other question being about his big brother....

That may happen anyway.

[GoColts8818]

He may well be released --- in six weeks or so --- but that doesn't mean Irsay isn't telling the truth now. What has he ever said that was a lie?

Your guess is no more or less valid than anyone. Everyone is guessing at this point.

I agree I think Irsay has a plan on what he wants to have happen. I think he is being very honest when he says if healthy Peyton Manning will be a Colt next year. With that said I think Irsay has a plan for what the Colts are going to do if he's not healthy, he has to this isn't exactly something you can try to figure out the night before hand you know?

I was listening to Bobby V tonight (who is the one guy in the media I've heard that truly gets it from a Colts fan point of view) and I heard a very interesting quote from Jim Irsay. The quote he played I am guessing came after the presser on Thursday but got over shadowed by him calling Manning a politican. He pretty much said he loves Peyton Manning to death and sounded extremely concerned about Manning's health going forward because this a neck injury and not a normal football injury like a knee or something. I keep going back to what Howie Long said earlier this year about super star players having a hard time accepting when their career has been ended by injuries. I am wondering if Irsay truly feels like Peyton's career is over based on what doctors are telling him and he feels like part of his job is to help Peyton understand that.

With that said none of us know what is going to happen. I do take Irsay at his word and I don't think he's going to make this call till he has to. There is no reason to rush this. It's not like the Colts save more money the sooner they release Peyton Manning. It sounds like the hold is the nerve. Based on the reports I've seen no one knows when it will come back, if it'll come back or how much of it will come back. What I have also seen reported is if it does come back Peyton can ramp up really fast after that. So if the Colts truly want Peyton back next season and this isn't about money like Irsay has said then it's in their best interest to give Peyton as long as they can for him to have a chance for his nerve to heal.

That's why I haven't ruled out the Colts and Peyton maybe pushing the deadline back. If Manning truly wants to be a Colt and if the Colts truly want him then it might be in their best interest to do that. I also think Peyton and Irsay have a good enough relationship they would trust each other if Peyton asked him to promise he would not be traded if Manning agreed to push the deadline back.

Lots of things up in the air right now and I can tell which way things are leaning but I think it's too soon for Irsay to truly have made this decission yet unless he's lying about wanting Peyton Manning to be a Colt. If that were the case I would think the Colts would have already released Manning to try to give themselves as much time as they could to get away from this nightmare before next season starts.

[FireJimCaldwell]

That may happen anyway.

Unfortunately you might be right.

[FireJimCaldwell]

I agree I think Irsay has a plan on what he wants to have happen. I think he is being very honest when he says if healthy Peyton Manning will be a Colt next year. With that said I think Irsay has a plan for what the Colts are going to do if he's not healthy, he has to this isn't exactly something you can try to figure out the night before hand you know?

I was listening to Bobby V tonight (who is the one guy in the media I've heard that truly gets it from a Colts fan point of view) and I heard a very interesting quote from Jim Irsay. The quote he played I am guessing came after the presser on Thursday but got over shadowed by him calling Manning a politican. He pretty much said he loves Peyton Manning to death and sounded extremely concerned about Manning's health going forward because this a neck injury and not a normal football injury like a knee or something. I keep going back to what Howie Long said earlier this year about super star players having a hard time accepting when their career has been ended by injuries. I am wondering if Irsay truly feels like Peyton's career is over based on what doctors are telling him and he feels like part of his job is to help Peyton understand that.

With that said none of us know what is going to happen. I do take Irsay at his word and I don't think he's going to make this call till he has to. There is no reason to rush this. It's not like the Colts save more money the sooner they release Peyton Manning. It sounds like the hold is the nerve. Based on the reports I've seen no one knows when it will come back, if it'll come back or how much of it will come back. What I have also seen reported is if it does come back Peyton can ramp up really fast after that. So if the Colts truly want Peyton back next season and this isn't about money like Irsay has said then it's in their best interest to give Peyton as long as they can for him to have a chance for his nerve to heal.

That's why I haven't ruled out the Colts and Peyton maybe pushing the deadline back. If Manning truly wants to be a Colt and if the Colts truly want him then it might be in their best interest to do that. I also think Peyton and Irsay have a good enough relationship they would trust each other if Peyton asked him to promise he would not be traded if Manning agreed to push the deadline back.

Lots of things up in the air right now and I can tell which way things are leaning but I think it's too soon for Irsay to truly have made this decission yet unless he's lying about wanting Peyton Manning to be a Colt. If that were the case I would think the Colts would have already released Manning to try to give themselves as much time as they could to get away from this nightmare before next season starts.

I remember reading in a book.. It might have been the one with Archie & Peyton, or one about Peyton... They were discussing when Cooper had to give up football and how it really affected Peyton. That Cooper could have it happen to him, and deal with it, but if it would have happened to Peyton they weren't sure how he would have handled it.

Unless the arm strength just isn't there. or a Doctor pulls out a wheel chair and says do you want to sit in one of these for the rest of your life.. Unless it's all going against him, I think he will try to play.

[GoColts8818]

I remember reading in a book.. It might have been the one with Archie & Peyton, or one about Peyton... They were discussing when Cooper had to give up football and how it really affected Peyton. That Cooper could have it happen to him, and deal with it, but if it would have happened to Peyton they weren't sure how he would have handled it.

Unless the arm strength just isn't there. or a Doctor pulls out a wheel chair and says do you want to sit in one of these for the rest of your life.. Unless it's all going against him, I think he will try to play.

Oh I do too. I think it's going to take him getting out on a football field with teammates and seeing he can't do it during a training game for him to accept that he might not be able to play again. I think there is a real chance he signs a one year deal with someone else and if he can't play he has to retire he can and if he can play they can franchise tag him at the end of the season and work out a contract to keep him there to finish his career.

[unitaswestand]

I am actually sick of the media making up stuff. In this off season, when have they EVER been right about what is happening with the Colts?? I have read that Caldwell will be retained, Tressel with be the new coach, Polian and Manning had a huge rift, etc. When are the ever right?

Until I hear it from Irsay or Manning, its all garbage. I have heard Irsay say that if Manning is health, he will be the Colts QB in 2012. I will go by that until I hear differently from him.

[Malakai432]

Never liked nor cared about Jason La Confora. He seems so far up the Patriots back end that it's not worth my time.

It's hard to take a guy who looks like this seriously, regardless the valiadity of his comments.

[GwinnettColt]

Talking to me? I didn't see anyone quoted.

Actually the only instrument that I have even a passing familiarity with is the piano, and they aren't very common in marching bands. No, you didn't "hurt my feelings", although I did consider your suggestion that "only real men can be sportswriters" to be funny in an extremely off-putting way. If that was your intention, than consider me to be laughing with you. On the other hand your above "apology" appears to be intentionally offensive. I'm starting to wonder exactly whose feelings it was that were hurt. If so, "Lighten up. I'm sorry."

Yes, I was talking to you. You and Blazer and I didn't know how to quote two people at once. Whether it was the marching band comment or the La Confora comment, apparently I touched a nerve somewhere. Not my intention. Just voicing my opinion of LaConfora and making a funny comment; then I get responses of "what does that have to do with LaConfora?" Thus, it made me think that either the two of you either really liked LaConfora, marching bands, or both.

Now with the "apology"-more a sarcastic intention than an offensive one. It was a commentary on this being a message board and that you and I will never meet, know each other's real names, nor have anything to do with each other-other than discussing the Colts and the pundits who talk about them. It's a message board, it's not that serious.

Maybe I'd fit in better at Coltfreaks, I'm not sure.

Regardless, not my intention to upset anyone in any sense.

[GwinnettColt]

Never liked nor cared about Jason La Confora. He seems so far up the Patriots back end that it's not worth my time.

It's hard to take a guy who looks like this seriously, regardless the valiadity of his comments.

Just do what I do when I see Edit on television. I turn the channel.

Edited January 29, 2012 by Coltssouth
Politics

[hawkeyes]

How the hedoublel does he know what is going on? All these media guys are working for someone - they are writing stories that will get the most eyes looking at their stories so that they can increase their advertisement coverage! Personally I dont read or listen to any of it - I prefer to get my news straight from the horses mouth!

[MAC]

Yes, I was talking to you. You and Blazer and I didn't know how to quote two people at once. Whether it was the marching band comment or the La Confora comment, apparently I touched a nerve somewhere. Not my intention. Just voicing my opinion of LaConfora and making a funny comment; then I get responses of "what does that have to do with LaConfora?" Thus, it made me think that either the two of you either really liked LaConfora, marching bands, or both.

Now with the "apology"-more a sarcastic intention than an offensive one. It was a commentary on this being a message board and that you and I will never meet, know each other's real names, nor have anything to do with each other-other than discussing the Colts and the pundits who talk about them. It's a message board, it's not that serious.

Maybe I'd fit in better at Coltfreaks, I'm not sure.

Regardless, not my intention to upset anyone in any sense.

To quote two people click the "multi-quote" button next to each post you are quoting, then click the "reply to" button that appears on the bottom right.

I've seen tons of your posts since I've been here, and I don't recall ever being rubbed the wrong way before. I'm sure that you fit in as well as any of us do. Nothing wrong with humor - including sarcasm. I use both at every opportunity - appropriate or otherwise. Sorry if I over-reacted. I do see the humor in your comment. Perhaps if there had been an emoticon I might have just passed by without responding. Just a miss-understanding.

I don't care about La Confora one way or another. Even if I liked him, I wouldn't bother defending an honest criticism. You are entitled to your opinion. I haven't said a word to any of those who posted that they hate him and think he hates the Colts. I couldn't care less. What rubbed me the wrong way was the "real man" nonsense. It reminded me of an argument I was in a couple of months back here about a malicious hit. My suggestion that "intent to injure" hits had no place in the game, was met by multiple "if you can't handle it, why don't you watch a pansy sport and find another forum" comments. It made me want to reach through the internet and punch someone. Not all of us played high school football, and not all of us applaud when someone gets hit so hard they get hospitalized. The thing is, neither are a litmus test for masculinity (or an indication of football knowledge). Life is a bit more complicated than that.

[amff]

I never listen to La Canfora. Did anyone else see him in his fruity faux hawk the other day? The guy is a joke to me.

Ditto! I wanna et paid serious cash to make accusations that no grounds . What a dream job!

[Blackhawk4]

Just do what I do when I see Edit on television. I turn the channel.

hahahaha?

Edited January 29, 2012 by Coltssouth
No politics please

[04DarkShadowGT]

What happens if they do that and Luck tears an ACL or something?

If Luck tears an ACL at the combine, then they draft RGIII imo.

[wercolts]

Just checked Twitter and Jake Queary had a tweet earlier today that he has talked to someone close to Irsay and that Irsay doesn't think Peyton should ever play again. I know I saw someone earlier this week say maybe Irsay's goal is to talk Peyton into retirement. It could very well be.

I also heard an interview with a doctor today who was once an NFL player on the radio. He made a big point to say he doesn't work on necks and hadn't seen any of Peyton's MRIs but based on what he knows if he was Peyton's doctor he would tell Peyton to retire. He then said he doesn't think the football player in Peyton Manning is going to let him do that. He also said if he was a GM of a team and if Peyton could throw the deep ball he would sign Peyton to his team. He said that's the concern is that once someone gets nerve damange there is no way of knowing when or how much of if that nerve will heal. He also stated that the fussion surgery Manning had probably puts him more at risk for another injury later in his career because it changes the natural movement of the spin.

From NFL.com

Dr. Wellington K. Hsu, an assistant professor at Northwestern University with a joint appointment in the department of orthopaedic surgery and department of neurological surgery, spoke with NFL.com on Thursday to shed light on the path facing

Indianapolis Colts quarterback Peyton Manning, who's recovering from his third neck procedure in 19 months.

Dr. Hsu has been recognized as an international leader in the operative treatment of cervical and lumbar degenerative disorders, motion-sparing technology and spinal cord injuries, and he has published a number of studies focused on NFL, NBA, MLB and NHL players.

The Colts confirmed Thursday that Manning underwent single level anterior fusion surgery (which usually involves making an incision in the front of the neck, removing soft disk tissue between the vertebrae and fusing the bones together with a graft). Being a quarterback, will Manning face special challenges?

The quarterbacks in my study did quite well after this particular surgery that Peyton Manning had. Quarterbacks fare pretty well compared to other positions because they can predetermine their movements. Defensive backs and linebackers need to react differently. (QBs) don't rely on neck range of motion as much as a defensive back or linebacker. ... The wide receivers in my study also did pretty well after neck fusion. It really depends on position when it comes to prognosis.

Was this an injury that Manning could have possibly played through?

You can play through it if it's just pain. I don't know Peyton Manning's case specifically, but if it led to weakness that was affecting his arm velocity, surgery would be needed to get back to his normal level of play.

The Colts haven't set any timetable for Manning's return. When can the team reasonably expect to see him back on the field?

In general, depending on his surgery, depending on the graft he had, most surgeons would let him get back to training in six to eight weeks. And depending on rehab, another four weeks after that -- plus or minus a week or so -- he could be back on the field. That's a general timetable I would give for a high-level athlete like Manning.

Is Manning facing any additional risks when he does return?

There's never been a reported risk of catastrophic injury after this surgery, but there is a risk of having a problem develop at another level. Assuming he had one level fused, other areas of the neck could be affected by arthritis. There is only a 5 percent risk of a second operation in a player's career.

Manning doesn't seem to be in unchartered territory. Is that fair to say?

This is a pretty common surgery in professional and NFL players, and they do better than what many people think. I've heard people say it's really hard to get back from a neck injury, how if you have surgery, you don't come back, but that's simply not true. I think Peyton, being the stalwart that he is, playing the position that he does, has a very, very good prognosis for coming back.

[presto123]

From NFL.com

Dr. Wellington K. Hsu, an assistant professor at Northwestern University with a joint appointment in the department of orthopaedic surgery and department of neurological surgery, spoke with NFL.com on Thursday to shed light on the path facing

Indianapolis Colts quarterback Peyton Manning, who's recovering from his third neck procedure in 19 months.

Dr. Hsu has been recognized as an international leader in the operative treatment of cervical and lumbar degenerative disorders, motion-sparing technology and spinal cord injuries, and he has published a number of studies focused on NFL, NBA, MLB and NHL players.

The Colts confirmed Thursday that Manning underwent single level anterior fusion surgery (which usually involves making an incision in the front of the neck, removing soft disk tissue between the vertebrae and fusing the bones together with a graft). Being a quarterback, will Manning face special challenges?

The quarterbacks in my study did quite well after this particular surgery that Peyton Manning had. Quarterbacks fare pretty well compared to other positions because they can predetermine their movements. Defensive backs and linebackers need to react differently. (QBs) don't rely on neck range of motion as much as a defensive back or linebacker. ... The wide receivers in my study also did pretty well after neck fusion. It really depends on position when it comes to prognosis.

Was this an injury that Manning could have possibly played through?

You can play through it if it's just pain. I don't know Peyton Manning's case specifically, but if it led to weakness that was affecting his arm velocity, surgery would be needed to get back to his normal level of play.

The Colts haven't set any timetable for Manning's return. When can the team reasonably expect to see him back on the field?

In general, depending on his surgery, depending on the graft he had, most surgeons would let him get back to training in six to eight weeks. And depending on rehab, another four weeks after that -- plus or minus a week or so -- he could be back on the field. That's a general timetable I would give for a high-level athlete like Manning.

Is Manning facing any additional risks when he does return?

There's never been a reported risk of catastrophic injury after this surgery, but there is a risk of having a problem develop at another level. Assuming he had one level fused, other areas of the neck could be affected by arthritis. There is only a 5 percent risk of a second operation in a player's career.

Manning doesn't seem to be in unchartered territory. Is that fair to say?

This is a pretty common surgery in professional and NFL players, and they do better than what many people think. I've heard people say it's really hard to get back from a neck injury, how if you have surgery, you don't come back, but that's simply not true. I think Peyton, being the stalwart that he is, playing the position that he does, has a very, very good prognosis for coming back.

According to this expert Manning should have been recovered by mid November or so? His timetable is about 12 weeks which is what jives with NSURG's comments about muscle strength returning in 3 months. We are now at February and not hearing good reports. Not looking good at all.