Richard Sherman wins the Madden cover vote

[Qwiz]

Exactly QuizBoy, Mr. Sherman is no thug. He is highly educated, well spoken, & he never forgot where he came from. I have profound respect for this man & his remarkable accomplishments on & off the football field.

He deserves this rare honor & I wish him nothing but continued success. He is a model citizen & gifted writer in his own right.

But he yelled during a T.V. interview! He must be a gangster! /s I wish that he has continued success as well and that he overcomes the Madden curse. Unless he's going against the Texans in the Super Bowl

[southwest1]

This something that, I think, is hard for people to appreciate sometimes.

 

Richard Sherman was born with a deficit. He's a young black man from Compton. The odds of him living to be 21 without going to prison or dying are significantly lower than a white guy from Decatur, Alabama. His odds of graduating high school weren't all that much better. He beat those odds like nobody's business, not only graduating high school, but earning a 4.2 GPA and being accepted to Stanford. Got a full ride, too. In doing that, he made tough decisions that showed that he understood that his decisions -- including the way he portrayed himself -- were important. He chose not to go to USC partly to make a point to himself, his family, his friends, young kids from Compton who would come after him. He gets all of this.

 

But most people don't know all of this about him. And despite how much things have changed, he still carries that deficit around with him, in many respects. He's still a young black man, and he'll still be looked at and treated differently than a white guy from Decatur, Alabama, by many people. That's before he ever opens his mouth.

 

I'm not saying it's right, and I'm not defending it. But my parents and their parents before them dealt with significant adversity, so that my peers and those who come after me could walk down the street without being harassed because of the color of our skin. So that one day, a young black man from Compton, CA, could get a full ride to Stanford. Jackie Robinson dealt with out and out racism, much worse than being called a thug, so that people in my generation and the generations after me could use their talents to overcome the deficit that they have had since birth.

 

So when Richard Sherman goes on national TV and feeds into the stereotypes that we all know exist, that we all know are working against him already, he's not helping himself. When my parents see him "screaming at" a little white girl with a microphone, pounding his chest, they facepalm, because they know how much was sacrificed so that he could be on national TV in the first place.

 

It's not that he's a thug, or that he was being a thug or acting like a thug. It's that he gave people a reason to label him that way in the first place. A young black man from Compton, CA, is going to face things that a young white man from Decatur, Alabama, won't, because of the way he looks. I'm sorry that that's the way things are, but that's truly the way things are. And Richard Sherman knows that.

A beautifully written post Superman & 100% accurate too I might add. No, I am not a black man, but Richard Sherman understands systematic racism & prejudice & he is able to rise above it making people notice him through him through his exceptional NFL skill set that allows him to be known for his charitable good deeds off the field.

 

What makes Mr. Sherman special is that he can operate in both the academic world & prejudiced world at the same time & not allow small mindedness to drag him down. That's why I admire him so much. 

[southwest1]

But he yelled during a T.V. interview! He must be a gangster! /s I wish that he has continued success as well and that he overcomes the Madden curse. Unless he's going against the Texans in the Super Bowl

     Thanks for making me almost roll on the floor with that 1 buddy! Just like the saying: "Just because you are a character; it doesn't mean you have character." Just kidding pal! 

 

Texans will have a darn good bounce back year IMO. I like Ryan Fitzpatrick at QB & I will watch Houston very carefully. I know how dangerous your squad is... ;)

[NFLfan]

This something that, I think, is hard for people to appreciate sometimes.

Richard Sherman was born with a deficit. He's a young black man from Compton. The odds of him living to be 21 without going to prison or dying are significantly lower than a white guy from Decatur, Alabama. His odds of graduating high school weren't all that much better. He beat those odds like nobody's business, not only graduating high school, but earning a 4.2 GPA and being accepted to Stanford. Got a full ride, too. In doing that, he made tough decisions that showed that he understood that his decisions -- including the way he portrayed himself -- were important. He chose not to go to USC partly to make a point to himself, his family, his friends, young kids from Compton who would come after him. He gets all of this.

But most people don't know all of this about him. And despite how much things have changed, he still carries that deficit around with him, in many respects. He's still a young black man, and he'll still be looked at and treated differently than a white guy from Decatur, Alabama, by many people. That's before he ever opens his mouth.

I'm not saying it's right, and I'm not defending it. But my parents and their parents before them dealt with significant adversity, so that my peers and those who come after me could walk down the street without being harassed because of the color of our skin. So that one day, a young black man from Compton, CA, could get a full ride to Stanford. Jackie Robinson dealt with out and out racism, much worse than being called a thug, so that people in my generation and the generations after me could use their talents to overcome the deficit that they have had since birth.

So when Richard Sherman goes on national TV and feeds into the stereotypes that we all know exist, that we all know are working against him already, he's not helping himself. When my parents see him "screaming at" a little white girl with a microphone, pounding his chest, they facepalm, because they know how much was sacrificed so that he could be on national TV in the first place.

It's not that he's a thug, or that he was being a thug or acting like a thug. It's that he gave people a reason to label him that way in the first place. I'm sorry that that's the way things are, but that's truly the way things are.

Now, that I can appreciate. No one wanted to turn off the television faster than I when I saw what Sherman did. Like you, I did not want to be associated with that kind of behavior. In the ensuing days, I spoke with many people about this. Most people my age and younger supported Sherman. My parents were horrified; however, they did not label him. They asked "What's wrong with him? Why is he behaving in that manner?" Now, the younger folks told me that Sherman should be free to express himself as he wishes. I saw it more like you and your parents did -- someone who is Stanford-educated and who is an intelligent person should not act this way. But, "thug" was far from my mind and it is not because I have a limited vocabulary.

Anyhow, my issue is with how fans labeled Sherman. I understand other people here using words such as "thug" because they either don't know any better or it is in their nature to think the worst of people. But I just did not expect that from you.

Thank you for this one.

[Superman]

Now, that I can appreciate. No one wanted to turn off the television faster than I when I saw what Sherman did. Like you, I did not want to be associated with that kind of behavior. In the ensuing days, I spoke with many people about this. Most people my age and younger supported Sherman. My parents were horrified; however, they did not label him. They asked "What's wrong with him? Why is he behaving in that manner?" Now, the younger folks told me that Sherman should be free to express himself as he wishes. I saw it more like you and your parents did -- someone who is Stanford-educated and who is an intelligent person should not act this way. But, "thug" was far from my mind and it is not because I have a limited vocabulary.

Anyhow, my issue is with how fans labeled Sherman. I understand other people here using words such as "thug" because they either don't know any better or it is in their nature to think the worst of people. But I just did not expect that from you.

Thank you for this one.

 

I don't mean to label him as a thug. I don't really think I did.

 

My point is that I understand why people would associate his outburst with thuggery. And I think he should understand it also; in fact, I think he does. I wish he'd avoid behavior that would lead ignorant people to label him, keeping in mind that he's already fighting an uphill battle.

 

Piggybacking on that, I disagree with outrage from people who think he shouldn't have been criticized at all. Another poster in this thread made light of his outburst -- he yelled on TV, oh no! As a black person, I know that it is far deeper than that. I don't like to see that kind of behavior encouraged, defended, trivialized, etc., because it feeds and reinforces the harmful stereotypes that already exist, making people who lean on those stereotypes feel validated.

[southwest1]

Sherman does seem like an intelligent and nice guy

But he is volatile.

 

Now Erin Andrews said she wasn't upset........and that she 'loved it' so maybe people like to push his buttons

 

But if he keeps going on camera to talk smack.......he'll get remembered for it.

I chalk it up to an alter ego that allows Sherman to play with aggressive tendencies just like a mild mannered guitarist rock star who becomes bombastic & almost belligerent on stage Nadine. Adopting a new persona for a few hours lets the adrenaline flow & permits the decompression chamber take hold of the civilized person again like The Incredible Hulk becoming ordinary David Banner again. 

 

I must admit that I do like alter egos personified on a football field. It's mesmerizing to witness the transformation & metamorphosis unfold firsthand. 

[southwest1]

Anyhow, my issue is with how fans labeled Sherman. I understand other people here using words such as "thug" because they either don't know any better or it is in their nature to think the worst of people. 

 

 

 

 

My point is that I understand why people would associate his outburst with thuggery. And I think he should understand it also; in fact, I think he does. I wish he'd avoid behavior that would lead ignorant people to label him, keeping in mind that he's already fighting an uphill battle.

You both make valid points NFLfan & Superman. I never care what millions may think of me just as long as my core group of friends respects me. Richard Sherman is not in business of appeasing other peoples self interests & shortcomings. If he needs to become an arrogant alter ego to win football games in the NFL; I have no problem with adopting this strategy at all. JMO.

 

Life is too short to be worried about flipping the wrong symbolic apple cart...Be who you are...I detest phonies & hypocrites...Sherman is a genuine article & his own man...

[crazycolt1]

Sorry you missed it, but Jeremy Shockey was called a thug and worse. Bill Romanowski predates this era of media coverage and social networking, so it's kind of pointless to bring him up, but he didn't have a great reputation either.

 

And it is justifiable to describe a person as a thug when they're acting like a thug. I can agree that the term has racial overtones, at times, and that's a good reason for people to think before they use the term. 

 

I don't recall people calling Richard Sherman a thug before his outburst. Some people didn't like him, but thug? Not that I remember.

Romanowski was called a racist for spitting in JJ Stokes face. I have a feeling Romanowski would have spit in anyone's face. He was a known steroid user even though he was never caught by the NFL. He later admitted he used steroids and HGH during his playing days. He even ended a team mates career by breaking his orbital bones in his face. He was a strong example of roid rage.

[Nadine]

I chalk it up to an alter ego that allows Sherman to play with aggressive tendencies just like a mild mannered guitarist rock star who becomes bombastic & almost belligerent on stage Nadine. Adopting a new persona for a few hours lets the adrenaline flow & permits the decompression chamber take hold of the civilized person again like The Incredible Hulk becoming ordinary David Banner again. 

 

I must admit that I do like alter egos personified on a football field. It's mesmerizing to witness the transformation & metamorphosis unfold firsthand. 

 

yeah, not me.  To me thats Wrestling behavior

So these guys don't like each other........whatever

I'm a fan of sportsmanlike behavior and found shermans rant 'I'm the best........blah blah blah....." unsportsmanlike

 

I'm not a fan of the drama.

[lollygagger8]

Sherman is a racist jerk who runs his mouth every chance he gets. 

 

Can't wait to watch T.Y. make him look like a fool again. 

[Dustin]

Sherman is a racist jerk who runs his mouth every chance he gets.

Can't wait to watch T.Y. make him look like a fool again.

Racist? That's a new one.

[amfootball]

Sherman wants the legion of boom on the cover, not just him, http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11060486/richard-sherman-wants-seattle-seahawks-teammates-legion-boom-madden-nfl-15-cover

[lollygagger8]

Racist? That's a new one.

 

No, it isn't. 

[Shane Bond]

Sherman is a racist jerk who runs his mouth every chance he gets. 

 

Can't wait to watch T.Y. make him look like a fool again. 

 

Sherman will take TY burning him every year as long as he wins the SB.

 

I mean atleast have a better expectation man.

[lollygagger8]

Sherman will take TY burning him every year as long as he wins the SB.

 

I mean atleast have a better expectation man.

 

I don't expect him to be in the SB, man. But if he does, and it's against the Colts......ya, that'd be pretty awesome. 

[Qwiz]

Sherman wants the legion of boom on the cover, not just him, http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11060486/richard-sherman-wants-seattle-seahawks-teammates-legion-boom-madden-nfl-15-cover

That would be epic.

[SilentHill]

I don't get how this has or had anything to do with race? I love Sherman's call it like it is attitude. If I were him I'd do it the same way. Don't hate him because he's expressing himself, and don't say that race has anything to do with it. The NFL and it's fans would have had the same response if Eric Decker or someone else had some wild outburst after a game, either way people are too up tight in caring about how other people carry themselves, just worry about you and your direct family.

[Superman]

I don't get how this has or had anything to do with race? I love Sherman's call it like it is attitude. If I were him I'd do it the same way. Don't hate him because he's expressing himself, and don't say that race has anything to do with it. The NFL and it's fans would have had the same response if Eric Decker or someone else had some wild outburst after a game, either way people are too up tight in caring about how other people carry themselves, just worry about you and your direct family.

 

Fair or not, Richard Sherman's actions affect more than just him and his direct family. He knows that.

[SilentHill]

Fair or not, Richard Sherman's actions affect more than just him and his direct family. He knows that.

 

That is only because of mind numbing drones who care what he does...

 

Probably the same people who cared when Kim and Kanye got married.

[Superman]

That is only because of mind numbing drones who care what he does...

 

That's one way of looking at it. It's incredibly narrow-minded and out of touch with modern reality, but feel free...

[SilentHill]

That's one way of looking at it. It's incredibly narrow-minded and out of touch with modern reality, but feel free...

 

Or maybe the people who care about how someone carry's themselves are behind the curve......

[Superman]

Or maybe the people who care about how someone carry's themselves are behind the curve......

 

I've spent many words in this thread already explaining why other people care about how Richard Sherman portrays himself. I'll just say that I disagree with you, and I think it's a selfish attitude for anyone in his position, coming from his background, to pretend that the things he does don't affect other people.

[SilentHill]

I've spent many words in this thread already explaining why other people care about how Richard Sherman portrays himself. I'll just say that I disagree with you, and I think it's a selfish attitude for anyone in his position, coming from his background, to pretend that the things he does don't affect other people.

 

I understand where you are coming from, that his actions affect other people, but the actions are not wrong, the society is wrong for caring about the actions. The blame here needs to be placed on the people who care about his actions, not the person who is expressing his freedoms within this country.

[Superman]

I understand where you are coming from, that his actions affect other people, but the actions are not wrong, the society is wrong for caring about the actions. The blame here needs to be placed on the people who care about his actions, not the person who is expressing his freedoms within this country.

 

The actions didn't hurt anyone, and aren't illegal or against any league rules. So technically, they weren't wrong. That doesn't mean there's nothing wrong with the way he acted.

 

Society is messed up in a lot of ways. The "reality TV" mentality is overly intrusive, and people almost demand access into the private lives of public figures. It's stupid. We agree about that.

 

Sherman's situation is different. He was on national TV, being interviewed in connection with a public event. This isn't about him getting into an argument with his girlfriend at home (in which no laws were broken, no one was hurt, etc.... I'm not invoking Ray Rice at all.) It's about the way he portrayed himself to the world. If he thinks that how he portrays himself doesn't affect other people, he's wrong, and he needs someone to sit him down and talk some sense into him. I don't think he feels that way, though. I think he understands that his actions -- specifically his public actions --  impact other people.

[BOTT]

Who actually called Sherman a thug? Please tell me it wasn't some dopes on twitter....I really get tired of twitter *s driving the conversation.

[BOTT]

Please explain to me "going full ghetto". I often wonder why those NASCAR drivers that get out there and fist fight never get stereotyped the label thug. Is that not acting like thugs? How come those tags only get thrown on black players with big mouths and/or tattoos?

 

Before the Super Bowl, the media turned this into a "good guy vs bad guy" thing cause we had to be reminded every 5 seconds that Manning is the classiest and greatest person in the world as a role model and Sherman is just a loud mouthed thug, boo hoo.

They are just called rednecks

[Jules]

All he did was have a big testosterone filled outburst after winning the NFC title game. Some people acted like he threatened to rape Erin Andrews then said "Children of America......you follow Satan, follow him now."

 

[Shane Bond]

If he thinks that how he portrays himself doesn't affect other people, he's wrong.

Affects who and why is that his fault. If you are so sensitive to what others say, stop watching TV and live underground.

Problem is your expectation. Why do you expect him to behave the way you want him to?.

It's like liking a girl and expect her to like you back and if she doesn't she is a baatch.

Seriously, this whining over Sherman is becoming comical.

[shecolt]

I'm gonna go ahead and respond, not to incite anything, but just because we're having a discussion. Feel free to ignore if you're done with this. Either way, I hope I haven't offended you in any way, nor do I intend to.

 

I agree that the whole situation was blown out of proportion. That's not surprising, given the state of the media.

 

Also, I'm obviously not claiming that rappers and gangsters represent black people as a whole. I'm not sure why you think I'm suggesting that, or even if you think I'm suggesting that. (It's also not just marketing. The rapper T.I. owns his own very successful record label, he's been in movies, he owns other businesses. Yet, he's done time in prison for various charges, and none of them were white collar crimes. He's not just pretending to be about guns and drugs and beating up cops; he's actually done it.)

 

What I am saying is that people in general view rappers (let's just set gangsters aside) as thugs, because they portray themselves in that manner. The music talks about drugs and violence and degrading women, which is thuggish. Many of them talk like they have no education. The entire industry centers around braggadocio. Many of them wear oversized clothes, including pants hanging off their butts. Even when some switched to skinny jeans, they still hung off their butts. Tattoos and braids are commonplace. They're loud and aggressive and confrontational. You don't have to pay attention to their music; all you have to do is watch TV or go on the Internet, and you'll see depictions of that "lifestyle."

 

A lot of them look like Richard Sherman. There's nothing necessarily wrong with Sherman's look. I don't like his hair, and some people associate tattoos with a rebellious attitude; he couldn't work for Disney and look that way. But the way a person looks doesn't define who/what they are.

 

What defines who and what you are is what you do. And for many people, their first real interaction with Richard Sherman was his overly confrontational outburst on national TV. Add to that the fact that he looks like what a lot of people think rappers look like, and a lot of people associate rappers with thuggery, and I get why people responded the way they did.

 

What's sad is that Sherman seems to be a smart, thoughtful and generally good person. He responded in the heat of the moment, and he didn't come across well, but if you throw microphones in people's faces in the heat of the moment, you're not always going to get well thought out responses. I think the media and a lot of fans are hypocritical in that regard; you want access because you want to see the behind the scenes, but then your first reaction when you see something you don't like is to judge and condemn, rather than acknowledging that everyone has bad moments. And then when you get the media savvy responses, you call it fake and rehearsed. There's no winning.

 

Either way, yes, labels, stereotypes, and outright racism and discrimination are a big problem. (It's not just this country, by the way.) But a lot of stereotypes exist for a reason. I live not too far from where Richard Sherman grew up. I've been to his high school. I know about the riots after football games. I know about the guys who have been arrested for drive-bys and armed robbery. I know some of them. I know what others look like. Stupid people come in all shapes, sizes, colors, and from all over the world. Thuggery is not exclusive to young black guys with dreadlocks and tattoos, nor is it some sort of predisposition. Yet and still, there is a reason people associate angry, screaming, dreadlocked black men with thuggery, and I don't think it's just racism. I wish people -- particularly young black men -- would stop feeding those stereotypes, especially on national television. And I wish other people would stop defending that behavior as if it's okay.

 

I probably should have edited your post to shorten it, but I found so much wisdom in your words that I hated to do so.

 

Anyhow,  just wanted to say that I am in total agreement and I think Bill Cosby would be also. 

[Superman]

Affects who and why is that his fault. If you are so sensitive to what others say, stop watching TV and live underground.

Problem is your expectation. Why do you expect him to behave the way you want him to?.

It's like liking a girl and expect her to like you back and if she doesn't she is a baatch.

Seriously, this whining over Sherman is becoming comical.

 

Who's whining? Who's sensitive?

 

You're comparison to a girl who doesn't like you is entirely off-base.

 

It's really interesting to me that whenever someone is critical of someone else, it always gets thrown back at the person being critical. No one ever wants to be told that they're wrong, even if they are. In this particular case, Richard Sherman apologized for his outburst, saying that he took attention away from his teammates and didn't react or respond in the best way he could have. Why am I wrong for agreeing with him?

[Superman]

All he did was have a big testosterone filled outburst after winning the NFC title game. Some people acted like he threatened to rape Erin Andrews then said "Children of America......you follow Satan, follow him now."

 

 

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman

 

My criticism of Richard Sherman's outburst has a lot more to do with him being aware of how his actions are perceived that it does with the black and white of what he actually did.

[Dustin]

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman

 

My criticism of Richard Sherman's outburst has a lot more to do with him being aware of how his actions are perceived that it does with the black and white of what he actually did.

 

Ha! I was in the process of replying with that exact link when your post came up. 

[Shane Bond]

Who's whining? Who's sensitive?

 

You're comparison to a girl who doesn't like you is entirely off-base.

 

It's really interesting to me that whenever someone is critical of someone else, it always gets thrown back at the person being critical. No one ever wants to be told that they're wrong, even if they are. In this particular case, Richard Sherman apologized for his outburst, saying that he took attention away from his teammates and didn't react or respond in the best way he could have. Why am I wrong for agreeing with him?

 

I commented to your exact post "his behaviour affecting others".

 

Affects who and why?.

[Superman]

I commented to your exact post "his behaviour affecting others".

 

Affects who and why?.

 

Take the time to read my other posts in this thread, if you really want to know. Or not...

[Superman]

Ha! I was in the process of replying with that exact link when your post came up. 

 

I should have credited you.

[jvan1973]

Sherman wants the legion of boom on the cover, not just him, http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11060486/richard-sherman-wants-seattle-seahawks-teammates-legion-boom-madden-nfl-15-cover

that's actually a cool idea

[Nadine]

this thread made me wonder what being on the cover of madden pays

All I found was that it pays between $100 and $200 thousand dollars..........and that it is mostly about the honor of being on the cover.

I guess for the guys who get picked that's true. 

Takes me a lot more than one photo to make that kind of $

[Jules]

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman

 

My criticism of Richard Sherman's outburst has a lot more to do with him being aware of how his actions are perceived that it does with the black and white of what he actually did.

 

I think it is pretty clear we have both laid out our opinions on all of this so far. So we are both resorting to little at this point. You think it means more then I did. And my stance is that what he did was not a big deal but people MADE a bigger deal of it then they should have. As if Sherman after winning the title game was supposed to be thinking of how what he said was going to effect an entire community of blacks and the perception of anyone. If that is actually the case then we have not made nearly the progress in this country that people like to think we have if an emotional and overall meaningless outburst following a big game really makes that much of a difference to sway public opinions.

 

If a white man had an outburst people IMO would not judge him so harshly and I truly believe this. Women and minorities will always have a tougher time, period. The progressions and evolution in this society has become a farce when these types of things to me become so widely scrutinized and even used by the mainstream media at times.

 

But, overall I have enjoyed the discussion. But, I do think we have to walk on egg shells at times in society because everyone is overly judged by the way they look and talk and appear...

 

We are just mere human beings at times too. We cannot always be perfect. And at times I don't consider athletes role models since they are very imperfect people. They get arrested, they take drugs, they say stupid stuff and sometimes they abuse women. And heck they get paid big bucks just to play a game. It all can be a mess if we decide these are our role models in society at times.

[Shane Bond]

Take the time to read my other posts in this thread, if you really want to know. Or not...

I did and why I asked you.

Thanks for the explanation.

[amfootball]

I think it is pretty clear we have both laid out our opinions on all of this so far. So we are both resorting to little at this point. You think it means more then I did. And my stance is that what he did was not a big deal but people MADE a bigger deal of it then they should have. As if Sherman after winning the title game was supposed to be thinking of how what he said was going to effect an entire community of blacks and the perception of anyone. If that is actually the case then we have not made nearly the progress in this country that people like to think we have if an emotional and overall meaningless outburst following a big game really makes that much of a difference to sway public opinions.

 

If a white man had an outburst people IMO would not judge him so harshly and I truly believe this. Women and minorities will always have a tougher time, period. The progressions and evolution in this society has become a farce when these types of things to me become so widely scrutinized and even used by the mainstream media at times.

 

But, overall I have enjoyed the discussion. But, I do think we have to walk on egg shells at times in society because everyone is overly judged by the way they look and talk and appear...

 

We are just mere human beings at times too. We cannot always be perfect. And at times I don't consider athletes role models since they are very imperfect people. They get arrested, they take drugs, they say stupid stuff and sometimes they abuse women. And heck they get paid big bucks just to play a game. It all can be a mess if we decide these are our role models in society at times.

The only thing I would add is Sherman already had a history of brash behavior, i.e. showing up Brady; saying he was better than Revis; etc. So he was not some innocent target that just happened to explode and then receive backlash. Given his past behavior, it really did not seem all that out of character to me to be honest. I think that is who he is when he plays. I agree with Superman though that perceptions carry weight and Sherman is a smart man and understands the way he carries himself publicly has an affect. We can debate to the cows come home that it is unfair but it is reality. Actions have consequences which is why after Carroll got a hold of him he toned down his speech prior to the SB.