Werner "Needs To Get Stronger" - Ryan Grigson

[Dark Superman]

The Colts want OLB Bjoern Werner to get stronger.

Werner, the No. 24 overall pick in last April's draft, appeared in 15 games as a rookie, making one start. He played just 352 defensive snaps and recorded 18 tackles and 2.5 sacks. GM Ryan Grigson stressed that Werner needs to get in the weight room. With Erik Walden and Robert Mathis under contract for 2014, Werner will likely be a rotational player again in his second season.

Source: Mike Chappell on Twitter Jan 16 - 2:41 PM

Can't disagree here..

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

I like it. If the owner tells you what to improve on, then you do it.

[Modern]

Or Grigson could make better picks, maybe a guy who already plays at the position he is wanting to fill.

[DoubleE Colt]

Also said he thought Werner was going to have a big Year 2. But depends on what his standard big is I guess!

[Modern]

Freeney couldnt make that transition very well so he drafts a rookie and asks him to do the same.

Doesnt make sense.

My idea would be to draft guys that already play the position in a similar scheme.

Grigson needs to work some magic in this draft because he dropped the ball last year.

[jvan1973]

I like it. If the owner tells you what to improve on, then you do it.

These were Grigsons quotes, not irsay.

[Jason_]

Freeney couldnt make that transition very well so he drafts a rookie and asks him to do the same.

Doesnt make sense.

My idea would be to draft guys that already play the position in a similar scheme.

Grigson needs to work some magic in this draft because he dropped the ball last year.

 

Who were the 3-4 OLB available in the draft that played in a similar scheme?

 

 

**hint...the only one that went in the first round was Jarvis Jones

 

Several other teams took guys who played primarily 4-3 DE in college to convert them to 3-4 OLB:

 

Cleveland took Barkevious Mingo

Arizona took Alex Okafor

Baltimore took John Simon

 

these are just a few examples off the top of my head

[Balzer40]

I would really like to know what the teams feelings are about Khalid Holmes. I bring it up because I was listening to 1070 earlier today and Mike Wells was on there talking about who he thinks the team will let walk in free agency. Holmes name got brought up and Wells said that the team obviously thinks he's garbage. Pretty strong statement.

[Indygal1218]

Probably easier to teach a new dog a new trick as opposed to an older, scabbed-up, more expensive dog.  Particularly if said older, scabbed-up, more expensive dog doesn't show signs of picking up the new trick after a year.

[BlueCollarColts]

I think Werner will be a good player, and like Grigs said, if he can get stronger and work on his footwork, he will look much improved. I am projecting 7 sacks for Werner next year

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

These were Grigsons quotes, not irsay.

Really? Coulda sworn it said irsay.

Oh well change my quote to GM

[John Dee]

Unless one is ELITE, OLB/DE is a very risky position to draft and one of the most likely to bust.   Bjorn is new to American football, he will get better.   

 

Look at all the "pass rush" linemen taken the last few years that have not panned out.  There are A LOT... 

 

I think Werner will be OK, but I do not see him as  an OLB.   I see him as a DE, thus Grigs feeling the need to "get stronger".

 

I will be SHOCKED if the Colts do not draft an OLB in round 2 or 3, they won't be able to afford a blue chipper in FA.

[John Dee]

Hughes and Holmes are the reasons many are down on Grig's last draft.   Hughes "reportedly" was good in practice but I never really heard much of him through the year..  I think he got hurt late.

 

And Holmes????   With all the turmoil at C and this dude could not get a "SNIFF"???   What is up here?

 

I would really like to know what the teams feelings are about Khalid Holmes. I bring it up because I was listening to 1070 earlier today and Mike Wells was on there talking about who he thinks the team will let walk in free agency. Holmes name got brought up and Wells said that the team obviously thinks he's garbage. Pretty strong statement.

[bavanlan]

Freeney couldnt make that transition very well so he drafts a rookie and asks him to do the same.

Doesnt make sense.

My idea would be to draft guys that already play the position in a similar scheme.

Grigson needs to work some magic in this draft because he dropped the ball last year.

 

It really is impossible for someone to transition from a 4-3 DE to the RUSH linebacker spot.  Look at how much Mathis struggled with it this year.

[DoubleE Colt]

Hughes and Holmes are the reasons many are down on Grig's last draft. Hughes "reportedly" was good in practice but I never really heard much of him through the year.. I think he got hurt late.

And Holmes???? With all the turmoil at C and this dude could not get a "SNIFF"??? What is up here?

[Balzer40]

Hughes and Holmes are the reasons many are down on Grig's last draft.   Hughes "reportedly" was good in practice but I never really heard much of him through the year..  I think he got hurt late.

 

And Holmes????   With all the turmoil at C and this dude could not get a "SNIFF"???   What is up here?

 

 

Yeah, that was the point he was making when he said what he did. He was talking about McGlynn and saying the team was not gonna resign him and then said with as horrific as our interior line was for Holmes to not even get a chance shows that they think he is total garbage. I don't know if he has any real insight to what they really think of players, but I just thought it had a ring of truth to it with him making such a bold statement.

[DoubleE Colt]

Apologies meant to put with above quote. People talk about the 'turmoil' at C but my biggest corncern is theat Pagano and Gigson might actually rate Satele and see no 'turmoil' they seem to be high on him at times for whatever reason.

[John Dee]

SS is not coming back..   They paid this dude pretty well..  so of course they tried to save face with him.   Most teams would. 

 

Interior line I think will be the TOP priority in FA this coming off season.

Apologies meant to put with above quote. People talk about the 'turmoil' at C but my biggest corncern is theat Pagano and Gigson might actually rate Satele and see no 'turmoil' they seem to be high on him at times for whatever reason.

[BrentMc11]

Yeah, that was the point he was making when he said what he did. He was talking about McGlynn and saying the team was not gonna resign him and then said with as horrific as our interior line was for Holmes to not even get a chance shows that they think he is total garbage. I don't know if he has any real insight to what they really think of players, but I just thought it had a ring of truth to it with him making such a bold statement.

I really wonder here Balzer.  He was a pretty good guard at USC before switching to center in 2011.

 

Holmes Always had a rough time with big strong NT types as a center...sounds like the center we URRGH already have.....Mr Head-bob!

[GoDeep]

SS is not coming back.. They paid this dude pretty well.. so of course they tried to save face with him. Most teams would.

Interior line I think will be the TOP priority in FA this coming off season.

If it's not a priority I will have some serious issues with the front office. And I am usually a blind follower.

[Modern]

It really is impossible for someone to transition from a 4-3 DE to the RUSH linebacker spot. Look at how much Mathis struggled with it this year.

Not everyone is Mathis.

My point is we already had the starters in place, why reach when it wasnt life or death.

I hope the guy eventually becomes a star, but if he doesnt then what does that say about Grigson ?

I'm all for finding hidden gems in the draft, but doing so in the early rounds can hurt a team if it doesnt work out.

[Jason_]

Not everyone is Mathis.

My point is we already had the starters in place, why reach when it wasnt life or death.

I hope the guy eventually becomes a star, but if he doesnt then what does that say about Grigson ?

I'm all for finding hidden gems in the draft, but doing so in the early rounds can hurt a team if it doesnt work out.

 

Bjoern Werner was far from a "hidden gem".  He had been projected as high as a top 5 pick in many mocks leading up to that draft.  Here is a list of some of his accolades from FSU:

 

*********** Unanimous All-American ***********

Walter Camp All-American (First Team)*

FWAA All-American (First Team)*

AP All-American (First Team)*

FACA FBS Coaches All-American (First Team)*

Sporting News All-American (First Team)*

CBSSports.com All-American (First Team)

Pro Football Weekly All-American (First Team)

Athlon Sports All-American (First Team)

SI.com All-American (Second Team)

Phil Steele All-American (Second Team)

ACC Defensive Player of the Year

Athlon Sports ACC Defensive Player of the Year

College Football News ACC Defensive Player of the Year

All-ACC (First Team)

Coaches All-ACC (First Team)

ESPN.com All-Conference (First Team)

Phil Steele Postseason All-ACC (First Team)

College Football News All-ACC (First Team)

Bronko Nagurski Trophy Finalist

Ted Hendricks Award Finalist

[jskinnz]

Freeney couldnt make that transition very well so he drafts a rookie and asks him to do the same.

Doesnt make sense.

My idea would be to draft guys that already play the position in a similar scheme.

Grigson needs to work some magic in this draft because he dropped the ball last year.

So has Werner already reached his ceiling? I mean, he has no chance to get better?

[COLTSFAN12to13]

Freeney couldnt make that transition very well so he drafts a rookie and asks him to do the same.

Doesnt make sense.

My idea would be to draft guys that already play the position in a similar scheme.

Grigson needs to work some magic in this draft because he dropped the ball last year.

 

There is no way you can judge Grig's draft the year after it occured. Let's wait 3 years and see where Werner is.

[Modern]

Bjoern Werner was far from a "hidden gem". He had been projected as high as a top 5 pick in many mocks leading up to that draft. Here is a list of some of his accolades from FSU:

*********** Unanimous All-American ***********

Walter Camp All-American (First Team)*

FWAA All-American (First Team)*

AP All-American (First Team)*

FACA FBS Coaches All-American (First Team)*

Sporting News All-American (First Team)*

CBSSports.com All-American (First Team)

Pro Football Weekly All-American (First Team)

Athlon Sports All-American (First Team)

SI.com All-American (Second Team)

Phil Steele All-American (Second Team)

ACC Defensive Player of the Year

Athlon Sports ACC Defensive Player of the Year

College Football News ACC Defensive Player of the Year

All-ACC (First Team)

Coaches All-ACC (First Team)

ESPN.com All-Conference (First Team)

Phil Steele Postseason All-ACC (First Team)

College Football News All-ACC (First Team)

Bronko Nagurski Trophy Finalist

Ted Hendricks Award Finalist

How many awards did he get as an OLB ?

He was given a new position the same time as the game speed and the talent of the players around him increased greatly. Many players can't make the transition to the NFL at a position they have been playing for years. Drafting a guy in the 1st and expecting him to adjust his game to the NFL and to play a new position is rough and I would say many players couldnt handle doing it.

So Werner wasnt a hidden gem at DE, but if he succeeds at what is being asked of him then I would say he was as a linebacker.

Freeney couldnt do it, Mathis could, we will have to wait and see if Werner has success.

[In Luck We Trust]

I like it. If the owner tells you what to improve on, then you do it.

that being said, Grigson isn't the owner, he is the general manager. but you are right, when told what to improve on, then you do it

[In Luck We Trust]

How many awards did he get as an OLB ?

He was given a new position the same time as the game speed and the talent of the players around him increased greatly. Many players can't make the transition to the NFL at a position they have been playing for years. Drafting a guy in the 1st and expecting him to adjust his game to the NFL and to play a new position is rough and I would say many players couldnt handle doing it.

So Werner wasnt a hidden gem at DE, but if he succeeds at what is being asked of him then I would say he was as a linebacker.

Freeney couldnt do it, Mathis could, we will have to wait and see if Werner has success.

I have been against drafting him from day 1. I thought maybe we should have either traded down, or drafted Rhodes for our secondary. yeah Rhodes didn't start out to well this year, but he improved. 

[Modern]

There is no way you can judge Grig's draft the year after it occured. Let's wait 3 years and see where Werner is.

I disagree. The verdict isnt pending on the 2012 draft so why would it need 2 more years in 2013 ? With early round picks you generally know what you have pretty early on, later rounds are where you pick up your project players who need to develop.

[Modern]

So has Werner already reached his ceiling? I mean, he has no chance to get better?

I dont know if he will be good or not, I just think he was a reach with the position change and all. If it works then Grigson is a genius, if not then its all on him.

What worries me with GM's is if you get one who thinks he is the smartest guy in the room and wants to prove it by taking players nobody expected them to take. I hope Grigson isnt one of those guys.

[jvan1973]

I disagree. The verdict isnt pending on the 2012 draft so why would it need 2 more years in 2013 ? With early round picks you generally know what you have pretty early on, later rounds are where you pick up your project players who need to develop.

Completely untrue. It takes many first round picks a couple of years to adjust to the nfl

[backshoulderfade]

He is a rookie who started a new position this season. Hasn't he only been playing football since he was 16. I believe that he has decent upside. Hopefully he can hit about 5-7 sacks next season. That would be a great return.

Especially if Mathis can maintain production.

[jskinnz]

How many awards did he get as an OLB ?

He was given a new position the same time as the game speed and the talent of the players around him increased greatly. Many players can't make the transition to the NFL at a position they have been playing for years. Drafting a guy in the 1st and expecting him to adjust his game to the NFL and to play a new position is rough and I would say many players couldnt handle doing it.

So Werner wasnt a hidden gem at DE, but if he succeeds at what is being asked of him then I would say he was as a linebacker.

Freeney couldnt do it, Mathis could, we will have to wait and see if Werner has success.

What they have asked Werner to do is not uncommon. It happens all the time.

[SteelDragon]

Werner has had a year to get stronger already.  I wonder how much progress he has made during that time.

[Superman]

I dont know if he will be good or not, I just think he was a reach with the position change and all. If it works then Grigson is a genius, if not then its all on him.

What worries me with GM's is if you get one who thinks he is the smartest guy in the room and wants to prove it by taking players nobody expected them to take. I hope Grigson isnt one of those guys.

 

That statement is really conspicuous. It makes me shake my head. I don't know what it is about Ryan Grigson that would make someone feel that way. 

[jskinnz]

I dont know if he will be good or not, I just think he was a reach with the position change and all. If it works then Grigson is a genius, if not then its all on him.

What worries me with GM's is if you get one who thinks he is the smartest guy in the room and wants to prove it by taking players nobody expected them to take. I hope Grigson isnt one of those guys.

The NFL asks this of players all the time. Seems a stretch to say Grigson is trying to out think the room.

[TKnight24]

The entire front 7 (Excluding Josh Chapman cause any bigger he'll explode) needs to get bigger. Can't stop the run if your front 7 can't control/dominate the line of scrimmage 

 

Werner is a rookie so obviously he needs to get bigger to compete with the big boys. But for that to be his 1st year at OLB, he was solid for his size. I thought he had good size, but if Mr. Grigson says get bigger then you get bigger!!

[Superman]

Yeah, that was the point he was making when he said what he did. He was talking about McGlynn and saying the team was not gonna resign him and then said with as horrific as our interior line was for Holmes to not even get a chance shows that they think he is total garbage. I don't know if he has any real insight to what they really think of players, but I just thought it had a ring of truth to it with him making such a bold statement.

 

This board talked about Holmes not getting any burn a lot. I don't think they thought he was ready, but that doesn't mean they think he's "garbage."

 

Mike Wells doesn't know anything, by the way.

[Mouthfire]

I disagree. The verdict isnt pending on the 2012 draft so why would it need 2 more years in 2013 ? With early round picks you generally know what you have pretty early on, later rounds are where you pick up your project players who need to develop.

It's a general truism that you need 3 years to judge any draft, particularly at a spot like pass rushers and CBs, where the transition is typically tougher than at other positions.

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

that being said, Grigson isn't the owner, he is the general manager. but you are right, when told what to improve on, then you do it

Yeah I read irsay there. Not sure why tbh

[Superman]

It's a general truism that you need 3 years to judge any draft, particularly at a spot like pass rushers and CBs, where the transition is typically tougher than at other positions.

 

I think SOP is to refer to you as a Colts homer / Grigson apologist who refuses to be critical of the team, management, players, coaches, etc. Just fair warning...