are the patriots in trouble

[MTC]

1. Hernadez didn't have much of an impact, (look at stats) it was all Gronkowski.

2. They are in one of the worst divisions. 

3. Brady is still there.

[ViriLudant]

ROFL at the Colts being better than the Patriots. Now who has blue Koolaid glasses on?

The Patriots have the better QB.

The better O-Line.

The better running game.

The better D-line.

The better LB corp.

I did say that the secondary has great POTENTIAL. Just got to live up to it. If they achieve a high percentage of that potential, they'll be pretty outstanding.

[House]

1. Hernadez didn't have much of an impact, (look at stats) it was all Gronkowski.

2. They are in one of the worst divisions.

3. Brady is still there.

In his time with the Pats he had almost 2000 receiving yards, and I believe 18 TDs. That's a big impact considering he was hurt a fair amount.

[lollygagger8]

They have Tebow, so they will win just by his sheer will power. lol 

[GoColts8818]

They are winners because they have Brady and BB and they are still there.  They will be fine. 

[TAPLOOK]

It's not even a speed bump for the Patriots. BB told Krafty to have some drinks and relax. He'll deal with things when he gets back from Antarctica.

[Jules]

ROFL at the Colts being better than the Patriots. Now who has blue Koolaid glasses on?

The Patriots have the better QB.

The better O-Line.

The better running game.

The better D-line.

The better LB corp.

 

 

We'll see later on my friend......

 

When it matters.

[Warhorse]

Are the Patriots as a team in trouble? No. The Patriot name? A little.

[MTC]

In his time with the Pats he had almost 2000 receiving yards, and I believe 18 TDs. That's a big impact considering he was hurt a fair amount.

Sorry, I meant he didn't have a major impact the past season.

[JerodMayo51]

To me, the Pats would still be a borderline top-ten team this year, but by no means an AFC favorite: I'd put Denver, Baltimore, Cincy, Indy, and Houston ahead of them.

There is no way Indy is a better team than the Patriots right now, I won't buy that for a second. Also Houston, the team that the Patriots spanked twice last season, including once in the post season, is certainly not a better team than them either.

[Valpo2004]

They may not have the star power that they used to have but they should make the playoffs.  And by that time Gronk will likely be back in action.  

[GoPats]

No doubt the loss of talent will prolly have minimal, if any, impact. Of bigger concern will be the potential distraction of players getting subpoenaed, constant barrage of questions from media, etc. I'm not sure any of this is going to go away quickly for the Pats, no matter how much they try to distance themselves from it.

 

No one obliterates a media storm better than Belichick and company. Tebowmania lasted around 30 hours here, lol!

 

Seriously though, I hear what you're saying, but Hernandez was kicked out of Gillette Stadium last week. I doubt any other players have even a shred of knowledge or inside info. They'll be asked, they'll refuse comment, and it won't take long before the media stops asking. If they suspended but did not cut him pending his day in court, maybe a different story. But as of yesterday, he is no longer a Patriot, and the response will be, "I have no comments about that."

[schwamm]

No one obliterates a media storm better than Belichick and company. Tebowmania lasted around 30 hours here, lol!

Seriously though, I hear what you're saying, but Hernandez was kicked out of Gillette Stadium last week. I doubt any other players have even a shred of knowledge or inside info. They'll be asked, they'll refuse comment, and it won't take long before the media stops asking. If they suspended but did not cut him pending his day in court, maybe a different story. But as of yesterday, he is no longer a Patriot, and the response will be, "I have no comments about that."

I'm not referring to Qs from the media, though. I'm talking about some players possibly getting subpoenaed to testify about their interactions with AH. I'm talking about chats between players through the course of the year, with recollections of things said, threats possibly made but not recognized, whatever.

If this guy really is a killer, and possibly a repeat offender, don't you imagine there are going to be a few guys who feel more than a little creeped out by that? I'm not exactly quick to frighten, but the idea that I may have spent a considerable amount of the last 2 years with someone who could easily have snapped on me or one of my friends/family... would cause the hair on the back of my neck to stand.

In a game where focus is everything, that is a huge unwanted distraction, and not one so easily contained by BB.

[LockeDown]

There is no way Indy is a better team than the Patriots right now, I won't buy that for a second. Also Houston, the team that the Patriots spanked twice last season, including once in the post season, is certainly not a better team than them either.

I believe we are the better team this year. We need to learn how to close out games because we are young, but we are the better team. You guys will have to win the way Manning won games for us when we weren't that good.

[Jules]

I believe we are the better team this year. We need to learn how to close out games because we are young, but we are the better team. You guys will have to win the way Manning won games for us when we weren't that good.

 

Speaking of Manning.....surprised nobody has brought it up and I am sure some are thinking about it.

 

Denver is as of now the clear cut favorite to win the AFC. Which could change later (and yes I am not ignoring the Texans solid balanced team Q boy but you know Manning/Brady get first dibs in rankings  ;)) but there are several question marks that remain in the AFC that we cannot determine right now until we see real games. Like the Pats, the Colts, the Ravens etc.....pieces/potential that have to come together.

 

But, Denver has a pretty loaded offense, at least in the passing game. The D might have question marks but is probably "good enough".

[LockeDown]

Denver is the clear cut favorite. Nobody repeats these days so the Ravens are out. Pats couldn't win last year with everybody so this year they will be one and done. Steelers have chemistry problems on offense. This might be the Peyton vs Andrew year.

[Qwiz]

Speaking of Manning.....surprised nobody has brought it up and I am sure some are thinking about it.

 

Denver is as of now the clear cut favorite to win the AFC. Which could change later (and yes I am not ignoring the Texans solid balanced team Q boy but you know Manning/Brady get first dibs in rankings  ;)) but there are several question marks that remain in the AFC that we cannot determine right now until we see real games. Like the Pats, the Colts, the Ravens etc.....pieces/potential that have to come together.

 

But, Denver has a pretty loaded offense, at least in the passing game. The D might have question marks but is probably "good enough".

Let them have the rankings. I like flying under the radar lol.

[JoKeR]

Not a chance, People seem to forget Brady made alot of wr's, Welker is just 1

No chance? Remember when Manning lost all his weapons? He made some new weapons too but they're still weren't the same. P.S. Welker was somebody before Brady. Just about every weapon he's had the Pats saw something in them to build upon. This is different, they have to be scrambling somewhat.

[schwamm]

I'm not referring to Qs from the media, though. I'm talking about some players possibly getting subpoenaed to testify about their interactions with AH. I'm talking about chats between players through the course of the year, with recollections of things said, threats possibly made but not recognized, whatever.

If this guy really is a killer, and possibly a repeat offender, don't you imagine there are going to be a few guys who feel more than a little creeped out by that? I'm not exactly quick to frighten, but the idea that I may have spent a considerable amount of the last 2 years with someone who could easily have snapped on me or one of my friends/family... would cause the hair on the back of my neck to stand.

In a game where focus is everything, that is a huge unwanted distraction, and not one so easily contained by BB.

The more I think about it, the more weirded out I get... I mean, the guy was on my fantasy football team last year, and looks like he was playing AFTER killing a couple dudes... as if nothing happened.

Now I'm worried about the impact on my fantasy team...

[Jules]

Denver is the clear cut favorite. Nobody repeats these days so the Ravens are out. Pats couldn't win last year with everybody so this year they will be one and done. Steelers have chemistry problems on offense. This might be the Peyton vs Andrew year.

 

Oh man....lol

 

I always felt that it might happen before Peyton retires. And I don't just mean the regular season either. Last year it could have happened but seemed a bit too soon.

 

I guess we'll see.....;)

[CR91]

Oh man....lol

 

I always felt that it might happen before Peyton retires. And I don't just mean the regular season either. Last year it could have happened but seemed a bit too soon.

 

I guess we'll see..... ;)

 

colts vs broncos in the AFC championship. i dont think the fans could handle that

[Jules]

colts vs broncos in the AFC championship. i dont think the fans could handle that

 

Enough time will have passed plus a regular season matchup to get fans acclimated IMO if a playoff meeting does result between the two teams.

 

Heck we came a game away in January from it happening but looking back I don't think we as fans were ready plus the Colts team even though the idea really really tempted me at the time.....

[John Dee]

Honestly they are not doomed.    But they are in a spot they have NEVER faced.     If Gronk is not "good too go"    NE is going to be in some trouble.

 

What is the reason for so many NE WR's getting kicked to the curb over the years?   Playbook.

 

I bet that playbook and the tolerance for some players gets really adjusted.       

 

Look at NEs depth chart RIGHT NOW.        

 

This team will lead the NFL in rushing...  ;)

they are DOOMED!!!

[Jules]

Honestly they are not doomed.   

 

 

Don't you love the smell of summer doom?

 

J/K

 

;)

[John Dee]

heehehee..   I bet BB and the Patriots are a "tad" nervous right about now.

 

That O is not easy to learn.       But I bet it gets very VANILLA real fast...

Don't you love the smell of summer doom?

 

J/K

 

;)

[Jules]

Tim Tebow needs to lend support and faith to the battered and bruised Patriots locker room and organization in these times of need.

[amfootball]

I believe we are the better team this year. We need to learn how to close out games because we are young, but we are the better team. You guys will have to win the way Manning won games for us when we weren't that good.

You guys are letting this AH saga make you punch drunk. The fact is this. The only player missing from the Pats roster that they wanted on the team was AH. Every other player the Pats willfully released or chose not to sign. They also had a very good to potentially great off-season signing key defensive pieces and adding depth to the lines and young talent to the receiving corp.

On paper the Pats are not just better than the Colts they are significantly better. Better at almost every position. The only real question marks on the Pats has been the secondary which they addressed in a big way and outside WR. Have to see if the young guys they signed can make an impact. Really if the Pats only had Bill and Brady and me and Quizboy at WR, they would be better than the Colts.

 

I like the Colts and as you know am a huge fan of Mr. Luck. Right now he is in the group of young Qbs that showed great potential in their first year and needs to built on that. I read an article somewhere recently where the author said the Colts will come nowhere close to winning 11 games this season. That very well could be true given the tougher schedule and the sophmore slump that happens to QBs in year 2. Look no further than Cam Newton to see that truism. I am certainly pulling for the Colts to challenge the Texans and get back to the playoffs but reality says they are probably closer to an 8-9 win team this year. Now compare that to the Pats who have won their division a record 10 times and routinely win 12-13 games a season. No one expects that to change especially with an improved defense.

[schwamm]

On paper the Pats are not just better than the Colts they are significantly better. Better at almost every position.

I was mostly agreeing with you, but you went extreme homer in the part I quoted. HUGE exaggerations.

The Pats may be better, but hardly significantly so, and "at every position" would require significantly more proof than your biased say-so. Just off the top, I am comfortable that the Colts will be significantly better at WR, and now at TE too.

In fact, with all the upgrades the Colts have made, I'm only inclined to give the Pats a healthy overall edge right now on reputation alone. I would have given them stability too, but I think this murder case will shake up the team more than people are discussing.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Tim Tebow needs to lend support and faith to the battered and bruised Patriots locker room and organization in these times of need.

 

With Gronk seemingly frail IMO & Hernandez away on his sabbatical this may be a time for improvisation .

 

Tim Tebow   TE  ??

 

Lots of people have written him off & had him exiled to play in Canada @ best & out of the league @ worst , IMO Tebow is wink wink gonna play & train @ the QB position , I believe it would be in the Patriots best interest to have him practice @ the TE position as well it would be IMO the only real way he'll see any playing time during the Brady era IMO .

 

Tebow is a team player considering the circumstances he may be open to the idea ...

[Gramz]

No-0ne knows how any of this season will Play Out...  But I am ready to find out.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

No-0ne knows how any of this season will Play Out...  But I am ready to find out.

  Watching this team with all the new faces & second year players not to mention the addition of Pep Hamilton & his offense has me pretty fired up & the preseason can't come soon enough ...

[Archer]

There is no way Indy is a better team than the Patriots right now, I won't buy that for a second. Also Houston, the team that the Patriots spanked twice last season, including once in the post season, is certainly not a better team than them either.

 

We'll see.  Last season is history, though.  The Pats' O is not what it was last year (that's hard to deny).  There's lots of reasons to believe the D will be better than last year.  What's the net?  My estimation is that the Pats got a bit worse since last year, whereas Houston is probably similar in quality to the play-off team you spanked, and the Colts are significantly better than they were last year.  However, it's hard to quantify the size of each of these effects...

[Archer]

On paper the Pats are not just better than the Colts they are significantly better. Better at almost every position. The only real question marks on the Pats has been the secondary which they addressed in a big way and outside WR. Have to see if the young guys they signed can make an impact. Really if the Pats only had Bill and Brady and me and Quizboy at WR, they would be better than the Colts.

 

We may present the Colt homer view on average, but this is the extreme Pat homer view.  Lat year's Pats were significantly better than last year's Colts.  But, realisically, the Colts are looking up and the Pats are looking down from last year.  I'm talking about team quality, not wins and losses ('cause I know the Colts didn't have the quality of team to consistenly win  11 games last year).  Here's how I see it:

 

Receiving Corps: the Colts have much more talent than the Pats here.  In your words - "significantly better".  Even when you throw in TEs.  Wayne, Hilton, DHB, Brazill, Dwayne Allen, Fleener vs.  Armendola, the ailing Gronk, Jones, etc.  I think you have to concede this one. 

 

OL: Pats by a landslide.  The starting 5 for the Pats is a borderline Top-5 OL.  The Colts have probably built about an average OL this year (up from an NFL worst OL last year).  The Pats also have the best OL coach in the NFL vs. the Colts' relatively inexperience coach.  However, I will say this: the Pats' OL depth is not as good as years past, and the Colts have finally put enough into the OL to field an effective group...

 

QB: Pats get the nod, but not by much.  Luck learned how to defeat coverages geared to stop the pass as a rookie last year, and now he'll get a system that's more QB friendly.  Luck will be elite this year.

 

RB: Looks like a draw to me.  Ridley and Vareen vs. Bradshaw, Ballard, and Brown.  The Pats' running game is better because of the OL, but the RBs don't seem to have any quality difference. 

 

Front-7: It's going to be tough to do the D's, since roles have switched and the Pats claim to be a 4-3 and the Colts a 3-4.  The Pats have some legitimate stars - Wilfork, Jones, Mayo, and Spikes.  The Colts have one definite star (Mathis), one possible star (Chapman), some really talented ILBs (Freeman, Angerer, Conner), some young bucks (Werner and Montori Hughes), and a large number of good (but unspectacular) DL (Redding, Nevis, Moala, Franklin, Jean Francis).  The Colts' depth is better, but the star power goes to the Pats.  How to compare them?  Maybe a slight edge to the Pats right off the bat, but I like the Colts down the stretch with their depth and fresher legs (because of a deeper rotation).

 

Secondary: Games aren't played on paper, or the Colts would get a significant edge here.  In the end, no fans of either team know what to expect from the secondaries.  Between Landry and Toler there's a lot of injury risk there.  But Dowling has a ton of injury risk for the Pats, and McCourty and Dennard have injuries right now too.  Plus, Aquib and Dennard have serous character concerns, and the Pat safeties have little upside.  Bottom line: both have theoretically good CB starters, but little quality depth.  The Colts have better safeties. 

 

Who's the better team?  I go with the Colts, basically because of the second year jumps of the offense skill players and an improved OL, as well as improved familiarity and personnel with the defensive system.  You may think that the Pats will cobble together a great O again, but I don't see Brady being able to do much with that receiving corps... 

[bayone]

NFL AM, on NFL network expects pats to take division, 

 

saying only lost AH, rest of team was built and Kronk back for important part of season and playoffs, throw in a run game and Brady & BB Vs Tannerhil, Sanchez, & re building Bills that always seem to falter when at first seem to be on track and they conclude how can u go against Pats to win division

[amfootball]

We may present the Colt homer view on average, but this is the extreme Pat homer view.  Lat year's Pats were significantly better than last year's Colts.  But, realisically, the Colts are looking up and the Pats are looking down from last year.  I'm talking about team quality, not wins and losses ('cause I know the Colts didn't have the quality of team to consistenly win  11 games last year).  Here's how I see it:

 

Receiving Corps: the Colts have much more talent than the Pats here.  In your words - "significantly better".  Even when you throw in TEs.  Wayne, Hilton, DHB, Brazill, Dwayne Allen, Fleener vs.  Armendola, the ailing Gronk, Jones, etc.  I think you have to concede this one. 

 

OL: Pats by a landslide.  The starting 5 for the Pats is a borderline Top-5 OL.  The Colts have probably built about an average OL this year (up from an NFL worst OL last year).  The Pats also have the best OL coach in the NFL vs. the Colts' relatively inexperience coach.  However, I will say this: the Pats' OL depth is not as good as years past, and the Colts have finally put enough into the OL to field an effective group...

 

QB: Pats get the nod, but not by much.  Luck learned how to defeat coverages geared to stop the pass as a rookie last year, and now he'll get a system that's more QB friendly.  Luck will be elite this year.

 

RB: Looks like a draw to me.  Ridley and Vareen vs. Bradshaw, Ballard, and Brown.  The Pats' running game is better because of the OL, but the RBs don't seem to have any quality difference. 

 

Front-7: It's going to be tough to do the D's, since roles have switched and the Pats claim to be a 4-3 and the Colts a 3-4.  The Pats have some legitimate stars - Wilfork, Jones, Mayo, and Spikes.  The Colts have one definite star (Mathis), one possible star (Chapman), some really talented ILBs (Freeman, Angerer, Conner), some young bucks (Werner and Montori Hughes), and a large number of good (but unspectacular) DL (Redding, Nevis, Moala, Franklin, Jean Francis).  The Colts' depth is better, but the star power goes to the Pats.  How to compare them?  Maybe a slight edge to the Pats right off the bat, but I like the Colts down the stretch with their depth and fresher legs (because of a deeper rotation).

 

Secondary: Games aren't played on paper, or the Colts would get a significant edge here.  In the end, no fans of either team know what to expect from the secondaries.  Between Landry and Toler there's a lot of injury risk there.  But Dowling has a ton of injury risk for the Pats, and McCourty and Dennard have injuries right now too.  Plus, Aquib and Dennard have serous character concerns, and the Pat safeties have little upside.  Bottom line: both have theoretically good CB starters, but little quality depth.  The Colts have better safeties. 

 

Who's the better team?  I go with the Colts, basically because of the second year jumps of the offense skill players and an improved OL, as well as improved familiarity and personnel with the defensive system.  You may think that the Pats will cobble together a great O again, but I don't see Brady being able to do much with that receiving corps... 

Andrew Luck is nowhere near Brady or any other elite QB. I think the guy has tremedous upside. Love his grit and will but his stats were among the worst in the league in terms of completion percentage and TOs. I think both will improve but he will not be anywhere near elite meaning Brady, Manning, Rodgers level in his second year especially given the schedule and the sophmore slump that hits pretty much every QB.

 

I think in terms of the other areas Pats D line and O line are much better and that is really where games are won and lost IMO. Luck needs much better protection than he got last year and run game will not be as good as Pats as the line will not be good enough.

 

I do think Colts have a bright future and will contend for years but this season they are not in the Pats league or Denver either.

[amfootball]

I was mostly agreeing with you, but you went extreme homer in the part I quoted. HUGE exaggerations.

The Pats may be better, but hardly significantly so, and "at every position" would require significantly more proof than your biased say-so. Just off the top, I am comfortable that the Colts will be significantly better at WR, and now at TE too.

In fact, with all the upgrades the Colts have made, I'm only inclined to give the Pats a healthy overall edge right now on reputation alone. I would have given them stability too, but I think this murder case will shake up the team more than people are discussing.

Nothing shakes up the pats off the field. It is only June. By the time Sept rolls around no one remember AH except for the case...

[amfootball]

We may present the Colt homer view on average, but this is the extreme Pat homer view.  Lat year's Pats were significantly better than last year's Colts.  But, realisically, the Colts are looking up and the Pats are looking down from last year.  I'm talking about team quality, not wins and losses ('cause I know the Colts didn't have the quality of team to consistenly win  11 games last year).  Here's how I see it:

 

Receiving Corps: the Colts have much more talent than the Pats here.  In your words - "significantly better".  Even when you throw in TEs.  Wayne, Hilton, DHB, Brazill, Dwayne Allen, Fleener vs.  Armendola, the ailing Gronk, Jones, etc.  I think you have to concede this one. 

 

OL: Pats by a landslide.  The starting 5 for the Pats is a borderline Top-5 OL.  The Colts have probably built about an average OL this year (up from an NFL worst OL last year).  The Pats also have the best OL coach in the NFL vs. the Colts' relatively inexperience coach.  However, I will say this: the Pats' OL depth is not as good as years past, and the Colts have finally put enough into the OL to field an effective group...

 

QB: Pats get the nod, but not by much.  Luck learned how to defeat coverages geared to stop the pass as a rookie last year, and now he'll get a system that's more QB friendly.  Luck will be elite this year.

 

RB: Looks like a draw to me.  Ridley and Vareen vs. Bradshaw, Ballard, and Brown.  The Pats' running game is better because of the OL, but the RBs don't seem to have any quality difference. 

 

Front-7: It's going to be tough to do the D's, since roles have switched and the Pats claim to be a 4-3 and the Colts a 3-4.  The Pats have some legitimate stars - Wilfork, Jones, Mayo, and Spikes.  The Colts have one definite star (Mathis), one possible star (Chapman), some really talented ILBs (Freeman, Angerer, Conner), some young bucks (Werner and Montori Hughes), and a large number of good (but unspectacular) DL (Redding, Nevis, Moala, Franklin, Jean Francis).  The Colts' depth is better, but the star power goes to the Pats.  How to compare them?  Maybe a slight edge to the Pats right off the bat, but I like the Colts down the stretch with their depth and fresher legs (because of a deeper rotation).

 

Secondary: Games aren't played on paper, or the Colts would get a significant edge here.  In the end, no fans of either team know what to expect from the secondaries.  Between Landry and Toler there's a lot of injury risk there.  But Dowling has a ton of injury risk for the Pats, and McCourty and Dennard have injuries right now too.  Plus, Aquib and Dennard have serous character concerns, and the Pat safeties have little upside.  Bottom line: both have theoretically good CB starters, but little quality depth.  The Colts have better safeties. 

 

Who's the better team?  I go with the Colts, basically because of the second year jumps of the offense skill players and an improved OL, as well as improved familiarity and personnel with the defensive system.  You may think that the Pats will cobble together a great O again, but I don't see Brady being able to do much with that receiving corps... 

BTW, no one knows how Pagano will be either. Arians is the one that led the charge last year to the tune of COY. I like Pagano a lot but the book is still out on whether is can be a good HC. I am rooting for him though.

[corgi]

Nothing shakes up the pats off the field. It is only June. By the time Sept rolls around no one remember AH except for the case...

The Patriots are human, things shake them up. Brady will remember AH when he sees who he has to throw to.

[bayone]

The Patriots are human, things shake them up. Brady will remember AH when he sees who he has to throw to.

 

Dobt that, but only thing that lends some credence to it , but this is much longer in the making is Welker saying when he makes a mistake its because he forgets what team he is on and Peyton's route running nuances wanted and all of a sudden he is doing is habits from the longterm Patriot / Brady way of doing things and where he got top passes thrown to yearly so its a hard to break

habit

 

AH hasnt been there that long, has been out alot, and Brady has seen a variety of recivers over the years

 

we will have to wait and see

 

I think the 1 place he may be missed is in his versatility as Catcher/ blocker ,RB  etc so doesnt have to substitute on drives that one wants up tempo

[Valpo2004]

colts vs broncos in the AFC championship. i dont think the fans could handle that

 

The sports media people would lose their minds.  

 

Imagine if that sort of thing was followed up by a Broncos/Giants matchup in the Superbowl?