If Luck hits the PUP list, will you still watch the first 6 games?

[Superman]

18 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Any other injury, short or long, has some sort of general timetable (day to day), (out of the season), in Will Fuller's case when he broke his collarbone they immediately said he was out 8-12 weeks I believe. Even Cam Newton got plenty of updates, so you can't use the QB gameplan excuse. Luck is the only player that's being treated in this peculiar way when it comes to updates and it's infuriating. I know there's not an exact timetable, but there isn't for a lot of people and they always say "day to day" or "week to week" with an update later on. That's what I want for Luck, not "we don't know when he'll be back" kind of thing. They may not know exactly, but they have a general idea, and they can release it by saying "week to week" or so forth and still be secretive about it. Just throw me a bone is all I ask.

 

I don't think find it infuriating at all. It's common sense. They don't know how he'll respond to increased activity, whether there will be setbacks, if they'll need to slow down, whatever.

 

If it's that important, why not just pretend they said in January that he'd be ready in 8 to 9 months, and then you'll have a time frame that's probably close to what winds up happening, and is typical for a QB who had this operation on a throwing shoulder. But it won't matter. He'll play when he's cleared to play, whether they tell us what they expect or hope for or not, whether there's a setback or not. Estimating doesn't change what actually happens.

[Jason_]

9 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Thank you for admitting they don't care about the fans. I'm far from self-entitled. Everything I have in life, I've paid for myself. This is a situation where I'm basically helpless to know everything (whether we are poor, rich or whatever, we are all in the same boat here), and I'm fully dependent on the front office to tell me things. You can give me the executive speech all you want, but we depend on the Colts to divulge info about Luck. I don't want free Tickets to games, free merchandise, free Sunday Tickets, or any of that stuff, I just want to hear an injury update on my QB to know if he has any chance of playing in the first 6 games of the season. That's not self-entitled, that's being a good fan.

 

en·ti·tled

inˈtīdld,enˈtīdld/

adjective

 

1. believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.
    
   Self-entitlement is exactly what it is.  The Colt front office has determined that the information you're requesting should not be released yet.  You are saying they are wrong and you deserve that information now. Since they own the information, they own the decision as to when to release it (unless forced to by the NFL).  You want them to release it NOW so it will help you make your decision.  They're trying to strategize as best as possible to win as many games as they can.  Even if you don't consider it self-entitlement, it's at the very least incredibly selfish.  

[Yoshinator]

Just now, Superman said:

 

I don't think find it infuriating at all. It's common sense. They don't know how he'll respond to increased activity, whether there will be setbacks, if they'll need to slow down, whatever.

 

If it's that important, why not just pretend they said in January that he'd be ready in 8 to 9 months, and then you'll have a time frame that's probably close to what winds up happening, and is typical for a QB who had this operation on a throwing shoulder. But it won't matter. He'll play when he's cleared to play, whether they tell us what they expect or hope for or not, whether there's a setback or not. Estimating doesn't change what actually happens.

Oh believe me, I know. Things can change at any time. I do fantasy football and baseball to make extra money, and the injuries can change on a dime. People go from being out from days to weeks to months and so forth. That's why I'm ok if it's subject to change. It's just harder when it's your real life team instead of fantasy where I care a lot less about those players. I'll get over it, but when you pay attention to football daily and the preseason is coming up, it sure takes away the excitement not knowing anything while watching 4 preseason games and knowing you could easily lose the first 6 games even if the preseason games go well. That's all I have to say about this subject.

[Jason_]

20 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Thank you for admitting they don't care about the fans. 

 

Well here's the thing...I'm sure they care to some extent about the overall perception of the team from the perceptive of the collective fan base.  but when it comes to making a decision about what's best for the team, you can bet that "wishes of the fan base" is at the very bottom of that priority list.  And that's exactly the way it should be.

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

en·ti·tled

inˈtīdld,enˈtīdld/

adjective

 

1. believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.
    
   Self-entitlement is exactly what it is.  The Colt front office has determined that the information you're requesting should not be released yet.  You are saying they are wrong and you deserve that information now. Since they own the information, they own the decision as to when to release it (unless forced to by the NFL).  You want them to release it NOW so it will help you make your decision.  They're trying to strategize as best as possible to win as many games as they can.  Even if you don't consider it self-entitlement, it's at the very least incredibly selfish.  

That's not a privilege or special treatment, every team releases general timetables of their team's players' injury recoveries. They may not give an exact date, but they give subtle hints like "day to day", "week to week" or something else. I just want some sort of info like every other team gives. Doing that doesn't interfere with strategy or anything else. In fact, it's required by the league.

[Jason_]

Just now, Jared Cisneros said:

That's not a privilege or special treatment, every team releases general timetables of their team's players' injury recoveries. They may not give an exact date, but they give subtle hints like "day to day", "week to week" or something else. I just want some sort of info like every other team gives. Doing that doesn't interfere with strategy or anything else. In fact, it's required by the league.

 

if they determine that they are not ready to make the information public, then yes you are asking for a privilege or special treatment.  The decision about how much information to release and when is theirs to make, not yours.  That seems to be the part you're not getting.

 

Quote

In fact, it's required by the league.

 

If the Colts were violating a league rule, then the league would be investigating.  

[Yoshinator]

2 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

if they determine that they are not ready to make the information public, then yes you are asking for a privilege or special treatment.  The decision about how much information to release and when is theirs to make, not yours.  That seems to be the part you're not getting.

 

 

If the Colts were violating a league rule, then the league would be investigating.  

I guess you're right on that. We'll see what happens. Really nothing more to say. To everyone on this thread, if this doesn't bother you, then you are a stronger person than me. I get it.

[Luck is Good]

If Andrew misses the first 6 games of the season, that wouldn't be good. However, the Colts have winnable games during that stretch, which includes the Rams, Cardinals, Browns and 49ers. I really hope he doesn't miss time though

[FanFromtheWasteland]

Of course I will. Why not? I might not like what I see but I will watch

[MackAttack]

Yep of course. Qb isn't the only spot for a football team with a better defense we really could win our games even with tolzien in. Imo 

[Coltsman1788]

21 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

The title says it all. I know I will gain some heat for this, but I don't care. I want to watch this season real bad, and I'm extremely excited about all the new players on the team (from the draft and FA's), the thing that upsets me is that Luck, the Coaches, the GM, and the Owner think so little of the fans, and think they so dumb, that they do not deserve an update on Luck's timetable to return and just take it for granted that we'll still watch and buy tickets. I'm a loyal Colts fan, and wouldn't mind weathering the storm without Luck as one because injuries can happen and you have to take the good with the bad, but nobody on the team can even tell us when he is returning, if he is going on the PUP list, or any sort of info that isn't "speculation" from the media. Irsay seems to be taking the fans for granted and figures they'll just show up anyway because they are mindless sheep who will buy whatever he tells them and come to games and watch them no matter what. Every other player that is relevant with an injury on every team has some sort of timetable, whether the injury is short or long. The only one that doesn't is Luck. It's a spit in the face to every fan that wants to be excited about the season, and can't now because of a simple lack of information.

 

So my question is, are you going to watch the first six games? I don't know if I will yet, because I don't feel like being someone that Irsay and the rest of the higher ups feels is an inferior being that doesn't deserve some simple info. Tear me up if you want, I don't care, but at least give a solid response either way. I think we should be treated with a decent amount of respect as fans.

It's how the Colts operate,  I'm numb to it all now though.  I pretty much expect this from them with how they handled things that year Peyton never played.  Wouldn't surprise me at all if Luck ends up missing a significant portion of this season.  Luck or no Luck I'll still watch cause I'm a Colts fan.

[GwinnettColt]

I'll still watch them, but I won't expect much.  

[RockThatBlue]

I'd watch the Colts if Spongebob was the QB.

[2006Coltsbestever]

6 minutes ago, RockThatBlue said:

I'd watch the Colts if Spongebob was the QB.

What about PeeWee Herman?  

[RockThatBlue]

5 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

What about PeeWee Herman?  

That might be going too far lol

[Moe]

14 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

It's just my opinion but as a Colts fan how can you even go in this direction and not support your team?

If Luck plays or not to point a finger at Irsay and think he is trying to pull the wool over the fans eyes is absurd and delusional.

Its the instant gratification, Avery body wants answers and they need them yesterday!

[deedub75]

6 hours ago, coltsfeva said:

My wife and I are driving from Delaware for the home opener. If Andrew is not starting, I will be a little bummed but once the game starts, it won't matter who threw a completed pass for a Colts TD, I'll still go nuts. 

 

If they score a TD without Luck then you should go nuts!

[coltsfanej]

Well I'm a Colts fan, so... 

[ColtsBlueFL]

6 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Any other injury, short or long, has some sort of general timetable (day to day), (out of the season), in Will Fuller's case when he broke his collarbone they immediately said he was out 8-12 weeks I believe.

 

Bones take about the same to heal for everyone, and 8 weeks is always a good estimate.  To cover potential issues, put the - 12 after it. Pretty easy call there.

 

Quote

 

Even Cam Newton got plenty of updates, so you can't use the QB gameplan excuse. Luck is the only player that's being treated in this peculiar way when it comes to updates and it's infuriating. I know there's not an exact timetable, but there isn't for a lot of people and they always say "day to day" or "week to week" with an update later on. That's what I want for Luck, not "we don't know when he'll be back" kind of thing. They may not know exactly, but they have a general idea, and they can release it by saying "week to week" or so forth and still be secretive about it. Just throw me a bone is all I ask.

 

You want a timetable, OK, then I'll give you one:   6 to 12 months. 

A 6 to 9  month recovery isn't too out of the ordinary. 

Here, I believe you need to read this article on managing expectations on post SLAP repair-

 

http://www.physiodc.com/managing-expectations-when-recovering-from-a-labral-repair/

 

Here's relevant material-

"The repaired labrum should see stress very gradually so that it can gather strength. It is important not to re-injure it while it is healing. How much motion and strengthening of the arm is allowed after surgery also depends upon many factors, and it is up to the surgeon to let you know your limitations and how fast to progress. Because of the variability in the injury and the type of repair done, it is difficult to predict how soon someone can to return to activities and to sports after the repair. The type of sport also is important, since contact sports have a greater chance of injuring the labrum repair."

 

At the end of the article is this somber takeaway - " Realistically, many patients are looking at 9 months to 1 year of total recovery time before they feel “normal” again. "

 

This doesn't mean it will take Luck that long, but taking longer than 6 months really isn't out of the ordinary.  They don't necessarily have to get him 'feeling' normal again either, just healed and beyond the point football activity can cause re-injury.  I've read of many instances where people have had a re-tear for any reason, and almost universally they do NOT want another surgery.  I cannot stress how important it is for Luck to be fully healed before he gets out there,  whether that is 6 months, 7 months, 9 months or (heaven forbid) longer.

 

Please, be patient and know that somewhere by the end of this month and September 10, a much clearer picture will unfold. If that isn't timely enough for you to decide on fantasy players, feel respected, or whatever, well, I guess we're all sorry.

 

6 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

That's not a privilege or special treatment, every team releases general timetables of their team's players' injury recoveries. They may not give an exact date, but they give subtle hints like "day to day", "week to week" or something else. I just want some sort of info like every other team gives. Doing that doesn't interfere with strategy or anything else. In fact, it's required by the league.

 

We are in Pre-Season, and Luck is on the Physically Unable to Perform list. We know it is his shoulder.

Beyond that, we even know it was a Labral tear repair.  This alone is already more info than required than even in season injury reports. I do not believe anything more is required. For the injury rules that apply in season for practice and game availability, these are the only things required-

 

"Player injuries must be identified with a reasonable degree of specificity in terms that are meaningful to coaches, other club officials, the media, and the public.  For example, leg injuries must be specified as ankle, knee, thigh or calf.  Arm injuries must be identified as a shoulder, elbow, wrist, hand, or muscle injury.  Listing an injury simply as “leg,”“arm,” “upper body,” or other equally vague description, is not acceptable.

Out – Will not play
Doubtful – Unlikely to play
Questionable – Uncertain if player will play"

 

Nothing more. Even then, players on the Reserve PUP (during the season) that has begun to practice but not yet placed on the 53 man roster, do not even have to be listed on the injury report.

 

HTH.

 

[Yoshinator]

15 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Bones take about the same to heal for everyone, and 8 weeks is always a good estimate.  To cover potential issues, put the - 12 after it. Pretty easy call there.

 

 

You want a timetable, OK, then I'll give you one:   6 to 12 months. 

A 6 to 9  month recovery isn't too out of the ordinary. 

Here, I believe you need to read this article on managing expectations on post SLAP repair-

 

http://www.physiodc.com/managing-expectations-when-recovering-from-a-labral-repair/

 

Here's relevant material-

"The repaired labrum should see stress very gradually so that it can gather strength. It is important not to re-injure it while it is healing. How much motion and strengthening of the arm is allowed after surgery also depends upon many factors, and it is up to the surgeon to let you know your limitations and how fast to progress. Because of the variability in the injury and the type of repair done, it is difficult to predict how soon someone can to return to activities and to sports after the repair. The type of sport also is important, since contact sports have a greater chance of injuring the labrum repair."

 

At the end of the article is this somber takeaway - " Realistically, many patients are looking at 9 months to 1 year of total recovery time before they feel “normal” again. "

 

This doesn't mean it will take Luck that long, but taking longer than 6 months really isn't out of the ordinary.  They don't necessarily have to get him 'feeling' normal again either, just healed and beyond the point football activity can cause re-injury.  I've read of many instances where people have had a re-tear for any reason, and almost universally they do NOT want another surgery.  I cannot stress how important it is for Luck to be fully healed before he gets out there,  whether that is 6 months, 7 months, 9 months or (heaven forbid) longer.

 

Please, be patient and know that somewhere by the end of this month and September 10, a much clearer picture will unfold. If that isn't timely enough for you to decide on fantasy players, feel respected, or whatever, well, I guess we're all sorry.

 

 

We are in Pre-Season, and Luck is on the Physically Unable to Perform list. We know it is his shoulder.

Beyond that, we even know it was a Labral tear repair.  This alone is already more info than required than even in season injury reports. I do not believe anything more is required. For the injury rules that apply in season for practice and game availability, these are the only things required-

 

"Player injuries must be identified with a reasonable degree of specificity in terms that are meaningful to coaches, other club officials, the media, and the public.  For example, leg injuries must be specified as ankle, knee, thigh or calf.  Arm injuries must be identified as a shoulder, elbow, wrist, hand, or muscle injury.  Listing an injury simply as “leg,”“arm,” “upper body,” or other equally vague description, is not acceptable.

Out – Will not play
Doubtful – Unlikely to play
Questionable – Uncertain if player will play"

 

Nothing more. Even then, players on the Reserve PUP (during the season) that has begun to practice but not yet placed on the 53 man roster, do not even have to be listed on the injury report.

 

HTH.

 

Thank you very much for this info. I think this thread has run its course, I got the answer I wanted. Really appreciate it!

[bleevit]

We are the hopeful enthusiastic masses and as such are not entitled to inside information. Shame on us for wanting to know what's up with our star player. Unfair to Luck? We all know he's working to get back. Rub some dirt on it and give us something....anything!

[pgt_rob]

12 hours ago, RockThatBlue said:

I'd watch the Colts if Spongebob was the QB.

 

lol That would be awesome.

 

I'm sure I'm not the only one. But I have a couple friends that are Colts fans but when it comes to them losing or someone is hurt, they just turn off the TV and just completely give up on them. The following game they won't even watch it because they think the team is complete dirt. lol

[RockThatBlue]

25 minutes ago, pgt_rob said:

 

lol That would be awesome.

 

I'm sure I'm not the only one. But I have a couple friends that are Colts fans but when it comes to them losing or someone is hurt, they just turn off the TV and just completely give up on them. The following game they won't even watch it because they think the team is complete dirt. lol

Yeah I think every fan base has people like that lol. Theres some fans that'll watch one game where the Colts win and automatically say the team is super bowl bound. Theres not much of a middle ground in fan bases lol.

[Jason_]

16 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I guess you're right on that. We'll see what happens. Really nothing more to say. To everyone on this thread, if this doesn't bother you, then you are a stronger person than me. I get it.

 

so, just out of curiosity and in wanting to expedite this process in the future...is there anything we can do to help get to this point in under 4 pages?

 

lol

[lollygagger8]

[indyagent17]

Sorry, but that is a silly question. Of course we will watch, We are Colts fans brother!