any elite pass rusher that can fall to us in 2nd round?

[colts2dasuperbowl]

charles harris??

 

[chad72]

Tim Williams, Tyus Bowser, T.J.Watt, Jordan Willis, trust me there will be plenty of options.

 

Hey, Justin Houston of the Chiefs was a round 3 pick. Our own Robert Mathis was a 5th rounder. So, we are not devoid of pass rush options in this deep pass rushing draft.

[COLTS449]

Na. Tim Williams sucks.  .....He's one of the best pass rushers in this class who can be stolen in RD2 bro. Then maybe Takk or Harris or Taco falls. Bowser too.

[colts2dasuperbowl]

2 minutes ago, chad72 said:

Tim Williams, Tyus Bowser, T.J.Watt, Jordan Willis, trust me there will be plenty of options.

 

 

I would be stoked if we can get any one of them!

[Boiler_Colt]

I think if you want one, you gotta trade up. There will be a run on them coming.

[colts2dasuperbowl]

1 minute ago, Boiler_Colt said:

I think if you want one, you gotta trade up. There will be a run on them coming.

I don't mind moving up, but I don't want us to give up too much....

[GoColts8818]

I'd like to have Watt just so the Colts can have one for a change...

 

id part with a pick to go up and get which ever one slips if Ballard likes him.

[Jackie Daytona]

I think Ballard will be ok with Simon and Sheard this year, unless someone falls.

[Coltsman1788]

Charlse Harris; Takk McKinley and TJ Watt are all off the table now.

[Tmoney]

Malik McDowell

[BlueShoe]

I have the Day 2 Edge Rushers ranked in exactly this order:

 

Player	PS	College	HT	WT	Rank
Jordan Willis	EDGE	Kansas St.	6'4"	255	23
Tyus Bowser	EDGE	Houston	6'3"	247	40
Tim Williams	EDGE	Alabama	6'3"	244	44
Carl Lawson	EDGE	Auburn	6'2"	261	57
Ryan Anderson	EDGE	Alabama	6'2"	253	60
Derek Rivers	EDGE	Youngstown St.	6'4"	248	69
Trey Hendrickson	EDGE	Florida Atlantic	6'4"	266	72
Daeshon Hall	EDGE	Texas A&M	6'5"	266	79

 

Lawson and Anderson are probably playing SAM.

[bigt]

Depending on whose still available based on BPA at position of need, I would say;

 

Jordan Willis

Tim Williams

Tarell Basham

Tyus Bowser

 

Kevin King

Chidobi Awuzie

Quincy Wilson

 

Joe Mixon

Dalvin Cook

Alvin Kamara

 

Forest Lamp

[stitches]

6 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

I have the Day 2 Edge Rushers ranked in exactly this order:

 

Player	PS	College	HT	WT	Rank
Jordan Willis	EDGE	Kansas St.	6'4"	255	23
Tyus Bowser	EDGE	Houston	6'3"	247	40
Tim Williams	EDGE	Alabama	6'3"	244	44
Carl Lawson	EDGE	Auburn	6'2"	261	57
Ryan Anderson	EDGE	Alabama	6'2"	253	60
Derek Rivers	EDGE	Youngstown St.	6'4"	248	69
Trey Hendrickson	EDGE	Florida Atlantic	6'4"	266	72
Daeshon Hall	EDGE	Texas A&M	6'5"	266	79

 

Lawson and Anderson are probably playing SAM.

I love Tim Williams, Derek Rivers, Carl Lawson, Bowser and Daeshon Hall... I'd prefer them in this order.

[BlueShoe]

2 minutes ago, stitches said:

I love Tim Williams, Derek Rivers, Carl Lawson, Bowser and Daeshon Hall... I'd prefer them in this order.

 

No love for Jordan Willis?

 

Willis is probably the only player on the board I would be willing to trade up for. 

 

Maybe Lamp too. 

[stitches]

Just now, BlueShoe said:

 

No love for Jordan Willis?

 

Willis is probably the only player on the board I would be willing to trade up for. 

When I went to watch his tape I got more impressed by Elijah Lee... and he's a 4th-5th rounder probably. His tape doesn't correspond to his testing numbers. I don't know what to think about him. It's not that I don't like him... it's just that I like the others better.

[GoColts8818]

5 minutes ago, stitches said:

I love Tim Williams, Derek Rivers, Carl Lawson, Bowser and Daeshon Hall... I'd prefer them in this order.

Some mock drafts had us getting Williams in the first round a little while back,

[Shive]

18 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

I have the Day 2 Edge Rushers ranked in exactly this order:

 

Player	PS	College	HT	WT	Rank
Jordan Willis	EDGE	Kansas St.	6'4"	255	23
Tyus Bowser	EDGE	Houston	6'3"	247	40
Tim Williams	EDGE	Alabama	6'3"	244	44
Carl Lawson	EDGE	Auburn	6'2"	261	57
Ryan Anderson	EDGE	Alabama	6'2"	253	60
Derek Rivers	EDGE	Youngstown St.	6'4"	248	69
Trey Hendrickson	EDGE	Florida Atlantic	6'4"	266	72
Daeshon Hall	EDGE	Texas A&M	6'5"	266	79

 

Lawson and Anderson are probably playing SAM.

I think Rivers will probably go above some of the guys you have rated above him, but I think that's pretty solid rankings. Also, I see Anderson as a SAM, but I think Lawson (as long as he stays healthy) will be a really good rush OLB.

[stitches]

1 minute ago, Shive said:

I think Rivers will probably go above some of the guys you have rated above him, but I think that's pretty solid rankings. Also, I see Anderson as a SAM, but I think Lawson (as long as he stays healthy) will be a really good rush OLB.

Besides his injury concerns, the thing that's knocking Lawson down are his incredibly short t-rex arms. I absolutely love his tape and he tested well, but damn... I'm not sure how Ballard would feel about his length.

[DougDew]

Who cares about pass rusher.  We need 1 great and 2 more very good cornerbacks.

[chad72]

I expect Ballard to go BPA again at our scheduled 2nd round pick. However, depending on whether it is a CB or OL or RB or pass rusher, I would not be surprised if we give up a 3rd and 4th to go get a 2nd rounder with starter potential at the top of round 3 if we really like him.

 

The reasoning is that if even we get the best pass rusher on the board, there would still be a CB or OL or RB position that could provide quality help and it might be too late to wait if a run happens. Just have to see how the draft plays out, I guess.

 

How far can we move up with our 3rd and first 4th?

[GoDeep]

13 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Who cares about pass rusher.  We need 1 great and 2 more very good cornerbacks.

Well, I care about a pass rusher.

 

With a pass rush, even the corners we have improve.  I'm tired of QBs sitting back and shredding us.

[chad72]

1 minute ago, GoDeep said:

Well, I care about a pass rusher.

 

With a pass rush, even the corners we have improve.  I'm tired of QBs sitting back and shredding us.

 

I think he is being sarcastic.  

[GoDeep]

Just now, chad72 said:

 

I think he is being sarcastic.  

It's early.

[lollygagger8]

15 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Who cares about pass rusher.  We need 1 great and 2 more very good cornerbacks.

 

We need both. Even Ballard himself said with a good pass rush it will help the secondary. 

 

I'm positive he'll address both issues (just don't the order) 

[DougDew]

25 minutes ago, GoDeep said:

Well, I care about a pass rusher.

 

With a pass rush, even the corners we have improve.  I'm tired of QBs sitting back and shredding us.

We signed two this offseason, yet no CBs, and Vontae got a year older.

[DougDew]

25 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

 

We need both. Even Ballard himself said with a good pass rush it will help the secondary. 

 

I'm positive he'll address both issues (just don't the order) 

Should've addressed either CB or Pass rusher at 15 then get your raw centerfielder FS sometime in round 3 or 4.  Oh well.  At least we wont be picking a raw inexperienced FS this year in round 2.

[DougDew]

7 hours ago, BlueShoe said:

I have the Day 2 Edge Rushers ranked in exactly this order:

 

Player	PS	College	HT	WT	Rank
Jordan Willis	EDGE	Kansas St.	6'4"	255	23
Tyus Bowser	EDGE	Houston	6'3"	247	40
Tim Williams	EDGE	Alabama	6'3"	244	44
Carl Lawson	EDGE	Auburn	6'2"	261	57
Ryan Anderson	EDGE	Alabama	6'2"	253	60
Derek Rivers	EDGE	Youngstown St.	6'4"	248	69
Trey Hendrickson	EDGE	Florida Atlantic	6'4"	266	72
Daeshon Hall	EDGE	Texas A&M	6'5"	266	79

 

Lawson and Anderson are probably playing SAM.

Only Willis and Rivers are potentially better EDGE players than who we signed as FA.  I doubt Williams is even on our board.

[Valpo2004]

Williams from my information is one of the best pure pass rushers in the draft class.  Problem is he's a one trick pony in that regard, can't cover or defend the run very well.  

 

I wouldn't get too attached to a pass rusher right now.  We can just go BPA that makes sense with all the talent that is left our defense is bound to improve.  

[lollygagger8]

44 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Should've addressed either CB or Pass rusher at 15 then get your raw centerfielder FS sometime in round 3 or 4.  Oh well.  At least we wont be picking a raw inexperienced FS this year in round 2.

 

He wouldn't have been around until the 2nd. 

 

All these Ed Reed comparisons don't get you hype? 

[Valpo2004]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Should've addressed either CB or Pass rusher at 15 then get your raw centerfielder FS sometime in round 3 or 4.  Oh well.  At least we wont be picking a raw inexperienced FS this year in round 2.

 

Best player that makes sense.  

 

Hooker is by far a superior prospect to anyone left on the board at CB or pass rush.  In terms of best players that make sense it was between him and Allen.  I don't know the extent of Allen's shoulder issues so I'll trust the Colts made the right call on this one.  But either way logically it was between Hooker and Allen at 15.  Anything else would have not been the best player that makes sense.

 

Now if Marshon Lattimore had fallen to us then you could have made an argument for him over Hooker and I probably would have agreed with that argument.  But he didn't fall to us and the CB's and edge rushers on the board while still talented are not as good of prospects as Hooker is.

 

We can still address pass rush and CB in the 2nd and 3rd.  There is a ton of talent still left on the board.  

 

But Hooker is a top 10 prospect that fell to us because the Bears managed to kick off a general panic on quarterbacks and offensive players.  You can't turn down that kind of value because your heart was set on a CB or edge rusher.  

 

And Hooker is not a raw prospect either.  He knows how to cover and play the position.  He had 7 interceptions last year.  

 

  

[DougDew]

10 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Best player that makes sense.  

 

Hooker is by far a superior prospect to anyone left on the board at CB or pass rush.  In terms of best players that make sense it was between him and Allen.  I don't know the extent of Allen's shoulder issues so I'll trust the Colts made the right call on this one.  But either way logically it was between Hooker and Allen at 15.  Anything else would have not been the best player that makes sense.

 

We can still address pass rush and CB in the 2nd and 3rd.  There is a ton of talent still left on the board.  

 

But Hooker and Allen where both top 10 prospects that fell to us because the Bears managed to kick off a general panic on quarterbacks and offensive players.  

Ozzie Newsome picked Marlon Humphrey at pick 16.  Same defense.

 

I hope Willis or Rivers is there when we pick.  I doubt they will be since there are 14 picks before us.

[krunk]

I think after the 1st round the talent grades and gaps get closer so I figure we'll start taking some needs.  I'm expecting most likely to see a pass rusher taken with this 2nd round pick.  I'm hoping it's somebody like Tarell Basham or maybe Tim Williams(maybe sort of), Carl Lawson etc.

 

I know Malik Mcdowell isn't a pass rusher, but I wouldn't be totally made if we landed him. Another Defensive Line addition won't hurt either.

[Valpo2004]

9 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Ozzie Newsome picked Marlon Humphrey at pick 16.  Same defense.

 

I hope Willis or Rivers is there when we pick.  I doubt they will be since there are 14 picks before us.

 

And you think Ozzie would have passed up Hooker had he been at 15?  I highly doubt it.  

 

Either way don't get your heart too set on one position.  Between Guard, RB, ILB, Edge, and CB there will be a talented player at one of those positions for us in the 2nd.  

[DougDew]

11 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

And you think Ozzie would have passed up Hooker had he been at 15?  I highly doubt it.  

 

Either way don't get your heart too set on one position.  Between Guard, RB, Edge, and CB there will be a talented player at one of those positions for us in the 2nd.  

I don't know.  My point was that its not like Humphrey is still on the board.  He was the very next pick, so I assume the grades were fairly close.

 

Its not like Hooker was number 7 player and fell due to an act of God.  He fell because other GMs passed on him in favor of other players, so I assume Humphrey and Hooker are ranked fairly closely.

[krunk]

8 hours ago, bigt said:

Depending on whose still available based on BPA at position of need, I would say;

 

Jordan Willis

Tim Williams

Tarell Basham

Tyus Bowser

 

Kevin King

Chidobi Awuzie

Quincy Wilson

 

Joe Mixon

Dalvin Cook

Alvin Kamara

 

Forest Lamp

If we go corner I'd have no problem with Awuzie.  I really like that guy. Wilson ain't bad either.  As far as BPA is concerned I could see Ballard picking up Joe Mixon if they are comfortable managing that situation.  Talent wise I'm sure he's highly ranked on their boards over defensive need positions.   Forest Lamp is also still on the board so I could also see him being selected as BPA over a defensive player.

[ColtsBlitz]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

I don't know.  My point was that its not like Humphrey is still on the board.  He was the very next pick, so I assume the grades were fairly close.

 

Its not like Hooker was number 7 player and fell due to an act of God.  He fell because other GMs passed on him in favor of other players, so I assume Humphrey and Hooker are ranked fairly closely.

Teams passed on Hooker because they all started panicking once the early offensive haul began. The Bears might've actually helped us out a lot by trading up for a QB. It started the rush, and we quietly took the best safety in this years draft without moving from 15. I would say that is a successful round 1. 

[Valpo2004]

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I don't know.  My point was that its not like Humphrey is still on the board.  He was the very next pick, so I assume the grades were fairly close.

 

Its not like Hooker was number 7 player and fell due to an act of God.  He fell because other GMs passed on him in favor of other players, so I assume Humphrey and Hooker are ranked fairly closely.

 

They passed on him because there was a general panic on quarterbacks and many of the other teams had offensive needs. 

 

You can tell this because of the three different teams that gave away the farm to get themselves a quarterback.  

[SkyBane]

6 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I don't know.  My point was that its not like Humphrey is still on the board.  He was the very next pick, so I assume the grades were fairly close.

 

Its not like Hooker was number 7 player and fell due to an act of God.  He fell because other GMs passed on him in favor of other players, so I assume Humphrey and Hooker are ranked fairly closely.

Actually an act of god basically describes exactly why teams passed on Hooker. There was this mad dash for mediocre offensive skill players that I still can't explain, by a bunch of panicked teams desperate for a quick fix. The Bears and Texans in particular made moves that leave them particularly vulnerable to their high risk gambles collapsing their franchises for a couple years if they don't pan out. Just some silly stuff went down yesterday.

[Valpo2004]

1 minute ago, ColtsBlitz said:

Teams passed on Hooker because they all started panicking once the early offensive haul began. The Bears might've actually helped us out a lot by trading up for a QB. It started the rush, and we quietly took the best safety in this years draft without moving from 15. I would say that is a successful round 1. 

 

Adams was considered the best safety mostly due to a higher ceiling.  Hooker though from my understanding is more polished and still a pretty good safety.

 

Personally I prefer to get the more polished players in round one.  Drafting for ceiling IMO is folly.  

 

But the rest of what you are saying is absolutely true.  The Bears kicked off a general panic on quarterbacks which caused the Texans and the Chiefs to give away a lot of draft capital to move up and grab quarterbacks. 

 

On top of that the thin class at the offensive positions other then RB actually helped the panic because teams felt if they didn't grab their offensive needs early they wouldn't be able to get them in the later rounds.  

[DougDew]

10 minutes ago, ColtsBlitz said:

Teams passed on Hooker because they all started panicking once the early offensive haul began. The Bears might've actually helped us out a lot by trading up for a QB. It started the rush, and we quietly took the best safety in this years draft without moving from 15. I would say that is a successful round 1. 

Actually, what changed the top half of the draft was TNs pick of Corey Davis, which came out of nowhere,and KCs trade up for Mahomes.  Still, Hooker was passed up in favor of other players so its not like he was considered to be far and away an elite player.

 

If he was elite, he should have been selected higher considering that Conley, Foster, and Allen dropped.