Colts released Shaq Leonard

[RollerColt]

9 minutes ago, husker61 said:

I wouldn’t call those players great!

[Superman]

3 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

Maybe.  But I don't see any of that as a big deal.  Guys know when things fall out at this level with a staff.  By the time they got to that point where the release happened I am sure there were many conversations had between him, the Colts leadership, probably the owner, and his representation.  Exploring whether Leonard was surprised over being inactive vs being cut, to me that's splitting hairs.  It's the kind of thing the media beats to death for storylines.

 

Steichen is a new head coach.  Guy isn't perfect.  He's got a team leader grossly underperforming what he is being paid.  We can split those hairs with the hows and whys it all went down but in the end the correct decision was made which to me is what is important.

 

It wouldn't be as fun for the media but if they had kept him around the rest of this season I would have been far more critical of the team and their decision making.  It surprised me to see them take that tact, and I think if anything it makes me feel more confident in this young head coach.

 

I can tell you've thought this through. I appreciate your viewpoint, even though there are some areas where we disagree.

 

And to be clear, I can understand why you feel this reflects well on Steichen. I only take issue with the way he handled the presser. Like I said, I think a situation like this one deserves to be handled differently, given the stature of the player and the questions that the decision and its timing raises. 

[RollerColt]

9 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

but if they had kept him around the rest of this season I would have been far more critical of the team and their decision making.

Well at least Ballard can sleep at night knowing he’s got your approval. 
 

I kid, I kid. But I see what you’re saying. 

[GoColts8818]

8 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Imagine being shocked that your antiquated defense can't stop receivers in the middle of the field. Instead of cutting the guy who actually has a penchant for playmaking, and replacing him with **checks notes** a journeyman converted safety who hasn't played a single snap this season, why not try calling a modern NFL defense??

 

I get what you're saying. Our LBs are not good in coverage. I think that applies to all of them, though. Reaching the conclusion that Leonard needed to go right now to salvage our coverage scheme is a leap I can't make.

 

I think they decided to bench him to avoid the 2024 injury guarantee. And then maybe they decided, rather than benching him, it would be best to let him go play for another team -- maybe he gets claimed, but even if he doesn't, the future guarantee isn't an issue. 

Wasn’t exactly the point I was making either which is why I said that was part of why I think they made the change.  Like they went we need to be better in coverage which of our linebackers isn’t playing well enough because someone has to lose snaps for that.  They decided on Leonard.  I’ll agree that alone didn’t cause him to be released.  There were other factors in that as well. The biggest amongst them being that Leonard hasn’t played like the all world linebacker he was playing like when he got that contract for a long time and I am guessing they don’t think he will.

[Superman]

8 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Maybe they would have by now if Woods was ready to play. 

 

I think its cuts are usually about roster spots and upgrading with replacements, ultimately.  With investment in the future a consideration. 

 

Why couldn't they activate Jordan Murray from the practice squad? If it's just about getting rid of the veteran who isn't outplaying his backup...

 

And you think Ronnie Harrison represents an upgrade from Shaq Leonard? That's ... a stretch. He's been on the practice squad all year, and has not been active for a single game. I'm thinking he's inactive this Sunday also.

 

And even if he does play, he would have been eligible as a game day practice squad call-up, so they didn't need the roster spot to give Harrison a shot. 

 

This move, and its timing, is unusual. And I'm becoming convinced that if it wasn't for the 2024 injury guarantee, Leonard would probably still be on the roster.

[Superman]

1 minute ago, GoColts8818 said:

Wasn’t exactly the point I was making either which is why I said that was part of why I think they made the change.  Like they went we need to be better in coverage which of our linebackers isn’t playing well enough because someone has to lose snaps for that.  They decided on Leonard.  I’ll agree that alone didn’t cause him to be released.  There were other factors in that as well. The biggest amongst them being that Leonard hasn’t played like the all world linebacker he was playing like when he got that contract for a long time and I am guessing they don’t think he will.

 

I don't disagree with this, and I wouldn't question any element of it if it happened after the season.

[GoColts8818]

Just now, Superman said:

 

I don't disagree with this, and I wouldn't question any element of it if it happened after the season.

Yeah happening in season caught me off guard.  I thought he would get all year to come back or not.  I’ve felt all along if he didn’t he could be released after the season.

[NFLfan]

56 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I could have phrased that better lol. I guess I meant fans will move on quickly. A lot of great Colts players are hardly discussed anymore. Vontae Davis, Antoine Bethea, Dominick Rhodes, Joeseph Addai, kelvin Hayden, Marlin Jackson, Gary Brackett, Austin Collie, Brandon Stokley, Jack Doyle etc. It is crazy how quickly these guys leave our conversations once they are gone. That’s what I meant. 

 

Someone mentioned Jackson or Hayden last week (the one who sealed a victory for the Colts with an interception one year).

 

Maybe we should have a weekly thread on a Colts player from yesteryear.  

[AwesomeAustin]

2 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

Someone mentioned Jackson or Hayden last week (the one who sealed a victory for the Colts with an interception one year).

 

Maybe we should have a weekly thread on a Colts player from yesteryear.  

That would be a lot of fun!  There are a ton of passionate fans on this board. 

[NFLfan]

1 hour ago, RollerColt said:

Marlin Jackson will always be a God for picking off Brady to finally get us into the big dance. 

 

That is who I was thinking of when I responded to Austin.

[w87r]

45 minutes ago, Superman said:

This move, and its timing, is unusual. And I'm becoming convinced that if it wasn't for the 2024 injury guarantee, Leonard would probably still be on the roster.

Yeah there is a big difference from $8m dead cap to $14.5m dead cap.

 

At that point you almost just keep him, would only save about $5-$6m, Unless you post June 1st him, but at that point you're taking dead money into 2025. No reason.

 

 

I'm sure Malki's actions earlier in the season, don't help the trust issue on that front.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

Why couldn't they activate Jordan Murray from the practice squad? If it's just about getting rid of the veteran who isn't outplaying his backup...

 

And you think Ronnie Harrison represents an upgrade from Shaq Leonard? That's ... a stretch. He's been on the practice squad all year, and has not been active for a single game. I'm thinking he's inactive this Sunday also.

 

And even if he does play, he would have been eligible as a game day practice squad call-up, so they didn't need the roster spot to give Harrison a shot. 

 

This move, and its timing, is unusual. And I'm becoming convinced that if it wasn't for the 2024 injury guarantee, Leonard would probably still be on the roster.

I agree about the guarantee.  I said that a few pages ago, just didn't repeat it in the recent string of comments.  Getting better for the playoffs and improving the roster could simply come in the form of giving the other (and better?) LBers Leonard's playing time.  Maybe go with more safeties, and Leonard was seen as the odd man out.

 

I'm no fan of Cox, but I see him as at least doing one thing better than the other TEs, blocking, so I don't think he is as easy to replace as Leonard.

 

I also think the Team Captain designation had already seemed like a nod to Leonard's stature.  I mean, the guy has hardly played in two years so its kind of hard for him to have actually earn that status in 2023.  And with his comments being less than the company-line many times, I don't think he really had much stature with the FO anymore.  Just a guess.

[Dobbinblitz]

Shaq has cleared waivers - is now a free agent.

[Defjamz26]

7 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Like who?

-Jalen Ramsey-Traded to the Rams for 2 1st

-Stephon Diggs- Traded to Bills at end of rookie deal

-Deforest Buckner- Self explanatory 

-AJ Brown-Traded for a 1st at end of rookie deal

-Chandler Jones- Traded at end of rookie deal

-Khalil Mack- traded in season before end of rookie deal

 

All of those names are guys who play premium positions (well maybe not Buckner because he’s a DT but he’s a great rusher) and are All-pro/ Pro-Bowl players that didn’t see second contracts with their original teams. Obviously you can say some of those moves were terrible decisions, but that’s not the point I’m making. Elite players are either traded or allowed to hit FA every year. 

[NFLfan]

5 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Stephon Diggs- Traded to Bills at end of rookie deal

 

Diggs received an extension after 3 years of his rookie deal. He played five years in MN.

[NFLfan]

12 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Elite players are either traded or allowed to hit FA every year. 

 

That is true. It seems that the Ravens do that a lot. That is one reason why they receive more compensatory picks than any team. Drafting well helps too.

[EasyE]

This is a mutual parting IMO. I don't see a big deal besides just wishing Leonard the best and thanking him for his time as a Colt.

[Defjamz26]

11 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

Diggs received an extension after 3 years of his rookie deal. He played five years in MN.

Thank you for that correction. I forgot he was a later round pick so had to be extended early.

[csmopar]

2 hours ago, husker61 said:

I wouldn’t call those players great!

[csmopar]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Why couldn't they activate Jordan Murray from the practice squad? If it's just about getting rid of the veteran who isn't outplaying his backup...

 

And you think Ronnie Harrison represents an upgrade from Shaq Leonard? That's ... a stretch. He's been on the practice squad all year, and has not been active for a single game. I'm thinking he's inactive this Sunday also.

 

And even if he does play, he would have been eligible as a game day practice squad call-up, so they didn't need the roster spot to give Harrison a shot. 

 

This move, and its timing, is unusual. And I'm becoming convinced that if it wasn't for the 2024 injury guarantee, Leonard would probably still be on the roster.

They have nearly 80 million in cap space for ‘24. Why would they be so concerned about 6.5 million for next year at this stage? 

[Boondoggle]

2 hours ago, RollerColt said:

Well at least Ballard can sleep at night knowing he’s got your approval. 
 

I kid, I kid. But I see what you’re saying. 

I think I could help him.  I do make a mean pot of coffee.

[Dingus McGirt]

6 hours ago, RollerColt said:

Thats all perfectly fine and a good thing to do on the Colts end.

 

I just think their communication sucks. He was a captain and leader of the team and community. He should’ve commanded a bit more respect for the Colts to at least explain their reasoning for letting him walk. 

It’s a personnel matter.  In any business, the reasons an employee is let go aren’t something to be discussed publicly.  I Imagine they laid it out for Mr. Leonard - in private discussions.  He and his team of advisors are free to talk all they want.  The Colts aren’t necessarily as free - in keeping with labor law constraints.  Please correct me if my line of thinking is off.

[RollerColt]

4 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

I think I could help him.  I do make a mean pot of coffee.

You know, I’m inclined to believe that.

[lester]

2 hours ago, Dingus McGirt said:

It’s a personnel matter.  In any business, the reasons an employee is let go aren’t something to be discussed publicly.  I Imagine they laid it out for Mr. Leonard - in private discussions.  He and his team of advisors are free to talk all they want.  The Colts aren’t necessarily as free - in keeping with labor law constraints.  Please correct me if my line of thinking is off.

I think you are correct. My opinion is some sort of HR action took place. Something occurred. Something that would be inappropriate for company Leaders to discuss openly. Something that necessitated the highly unorthodox nature of this release. 

[AKB]

I don't think Ronnie Harrison is Leonard's replacement. Just because they signed a linebacker off the practice squad, after cutting a linebacker, doesn't mean one is replacing the other. 

 

Olubi / Stuard / Speed will probably all see increased snaps. 

[jbaron04]

4 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

-Jalen Ramsey-Traded to the Rams for 2 1st

-Stephon Diggs- Traded to Bills at end of rookie deal

-Deforest Buckner- Self explanatory 

-AJ Brown-Traded for a 1st at end of rookie deal

-Chandler Jones- Traded at end of rookie deal

-Khalil Mack- traded in season before end of rookie deal

 

All of those names are guys who play premium positions (well maybe not Buckner because he’s a DT but he’s a great rusher) and are All-pro/ Pro-Bowl players that didn’t see second contracts with their original teams. Obviously you can say some of those moves were terrible decisions, but that’s not the point I’m making. Elite players are either traded or allowed to hit FA every year. 

All them guys didn’t really have major injuries concerns like nerve damage from back surgeries. 

[GoColts8818]

5 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

-Jalen Ramsey-Traded to the Rams for 2 1st

-Stephon Diggs- Traded to Bills at end of rookie deal

-Deforest Buckner- Self explanatory 

-AJ Brown-Traded for a 1st at end of rookie deal

-Chandler Jones- Traded at end of rookie deal

-Khalil Mack- traded in season before end of rookie deal

 

All of those names are guys who play premium positions (well maybe not Buckner because he’s a DT but he’s a great rusher) and are All-pro/ Pro-Bowl players that didn’t see second contracts with their original teams. Obviously you can say some of those moves were terrible decisions, but that’s not the point I’m making. Elite players are either traded or allowed to hit FA every year. 

Traded yes, free agency not so often.  It happens, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning being two examples, but it’s rare for a true elite player to hit free agency.  They do get traded yes.

[smittywerb]

not surprised Leonard wasn’t claimed off waivers.  No one was touching that contract.  Hoping the best for Shaq.  

[IinD]

 

[throwing BBZ]

14 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Yeah happening in season caught me off guard.  I thought he would get all year to come back or not.  I’ve felt all along if he didn’t he could be released after the season.

 

  Ballard's Capologist has great influence regarding roster management.

 That Shaq çould easily get "hurt" in these last 7 games to guarantee $6.5M of our next year's Cap and would cost us a valuable player or two, was plenty of reason to move on Now.

 His lack of burst and some might believe the necessary reckless abandon earned him fewer if any snaps.

 He has been given an incredible gift. Free agency, late in the season when injuries leave playoff teams in need.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

@NFLfan

 

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Shaq going to a SB contender would be wild. 

[NFLfan]

14 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

@NFLfan

 

 

 

Thanks. Vikings LB Jordan Hicks is out with an injury and the Vikes signed former Viking LB Anthony Barr. I'm not sure if Leonard will sign there. I think he may go to the Eagles or perhaps the Bears.

[BlackTiger]

If someone makes a good offer i guess he should probably take it.  To me it seems like he could use more time off to get his body right and try again next season. 

[Superman]

15 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

-Jalen Ramsey-Traded to the Rams for 2 1st

-Stephon Diggs- Traded to Bills at end of rookie deal

-Deforest Buckner- Self explanatory 

-AJ Brown-Traded for a 1st at end of rookie deal

-Chandler Jones- Traded at end of rookie deal

-Khalil Mack- traded in season before end of rookie deal

 

All of those names are guys who play premium positions (well maybe not Buckner because he’s a DT but he’s a great rusher) and are All-pro/ Pro-Bowl players that didn’t see second contracts with their original teams. Obviously you can say some of those moves were terrible decisions, but that’s not the point I’m making. Elite players are either traded or allowed to hit FA every year. 

 

Okay, then we must be talking about two different things. Elite players are traded or go to free agency all the time, no disagreement there.

 

It's not common for veteran players on guaranteed contracts to be unceremoniously released in the middle of the season, unless there's something else going on.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 hour ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Shaq going to a SB contender would be wild. 

He will go to KC 

[Superman]

15 hours ago, DougDew said:

I also think the Team Captain designation had already seemed like a nod to Leonard's stature.  I mean, the guy has hardly played in two years so its kind of hard for him to have actually earn that status in 2023. 

 

In most cases, players vote for captains.

[Blueblood23]

2 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

He will go to KC 

Why would they want a washed up linebacker?

[RollerColt]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

He will go to KC 

That would be sick. That defense is already elite level. 

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Shaq going to a SB contender would be wild. 

I would be surprised if he doesn’t.  Colts did him a big favor this late in the season.  He gets to pick from a couple of SB contenders.  Merry Christmas Shaq.