Trade Deadline (MERGE)

[BProland85]

Would love the Colts to inquire about Surtain to get massive help at CB opposite Brents. Apparently Diana Russini says the Broncos are willing to deal defensive players. 
 

 

[NFLfan]

10 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Maybe so but I was here every day and there were some pretty upset people that we signed JT to a new deal. There were even a few that wanted us to trade him for like a 4th round pick while he still wasn't extended. 

 

With me, I want to make it clear, I am not defending JT because he is a Colt. I post that because I have been accused of defending Colts players in the past because they play for us. I just really believe at worse he is a top 3 RB in the league is why I defend the signing. I thought it was the right thing to do for the Giants to extend Barkley and I don't even like the Giants. Barkley is top 5 IMO.

 

Not everyone has to agree. You can defend Colts players as you wish.

 

I think that some fans did not want JT to be re-signed because of what happened during the summer with him and his agent. From the perspective of some fans, JT seemed more concerned about himself than about the team. They wanted him to suffer the consequences of his actions/decisions.

[Solid84]

3 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

This is backing up your point.

 

Some Colts fans “the Colts needs depth.”  Some of those fans when the Colts have depth a position “let’s see what the Colts can get in a trade for this depth”

I don’t know if this was directed at me, but specifically to the Moss-situation:

 

Moss is a free agent next season. With the play he’s put up so far he can go to another team and be RB1 - why would he stay here to be JT’s backup?

[Solid84]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

In your previous post to me you said Taylor was healthy for 4 weeks.   Now in your first sentence you say he was hurt in week 4.   That is NOT the same thing.   
 

And showing that he averaged 1.5 yards per carry less does not prove your point, it proves mine.  That things with the Colts were so terrible in 2022, that you can’t blame the falloff on Taylor, which you do, you can blame it in the disastrous OL and terrible QB play.

 

You give away the weakness of your argument by writing comments like the Colts are now saddled with Taylor.   You think the Colts front office has completely blown this entirely.   You’re determined to prove you’re right.   I think you make bad arguments to prove your point.   You’re not happy the Colts signed him.   You think Irsay, Ballard and Steichen all got this wrong, but you have it right.  Hence your list of reasons that you use to make your point.  As if Colts management isn’t aware of those points.  
 

I’m afraid we’re going to have to agree to disagree and move on.  

Oh brother… 

 

He didn’t play the rest of the game after he was hurt during the Titans game week 4. So call it 3.5 weeks if you want to be pedantic. Doesn’t change his numbers or his health for those 3.5 weeks. 
 

Again, I’m not blaming the fall off on Taylor!!!! Get off it! Jesus! I’m saying THE OLINE IS THE REASON HE WAS WORSE IN ‘22 THAN ‘21 ERGO THE OLINE HAS HAD A HUGE IMPACT ON HIS PLAY!!! As it does for ANY RB. Oline and scheme is what’s most important for a teams run game - not the RB.

 

Do you get it now!?!

 

You’re COMPLETELY misrepresenting my point of view. 
 

Do I think the Colts brass made a mistake? Absolutely I do. As they’ve done before, by the way - they’re not infallible. 
 

And I think I’m right on this? Of course I do. Don’t you think you’re right when you give your reasoned opinion? Get off your high horse…

I’ve yet to see one convicing reason why this signing is the right thing for the Colts long term when compared to league wide behavior. It mostly boils down to him wearing the shoe…

 

Now get off my back or at least give me a reasoned opinion why it’s a good signing. 

[w87r]

29 minutes ago, BProland85 said:

Would love the Colts to inquire about Surtain to get massive help at CB opposite Brents. Apparently Diana Russini says the Broncos are willing to deal defensive players. 
 

 

https://horseshoeheroes.com/posts/hypothetical-trades-colts-2023-trade-deadline-jerry-jeudy-patrick-surtain-terry-mclaurin-justin-jefferson-01hd1he4f16z

 

Couple scenarios in here. 1 trade that for sure isn't happening JJ, at least not for that package.

 

They have 

 

Colts get: Jeudy + 6th

Broncos get: Pierce + 4th

 

Colts get: McLaurin

Commanders get: 3rd

 

Colts get: Surtain

Broncos get: '24 2nd + '25 2nd

[GoColts8818]

34 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I don’t know if this was directed at me, but specifically to the Moss-situation:

 

Moss is a free agent next season. With the play he’s put up so far he can go to another team and be RB1 - why would he stay here to be JT’s backup?

Not directed at you.

[2006Coltsbestever]

46 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

Not everyone has to agree. You can defend Colts players as you wish.

 

I think that some fans did not want JT to be re-signed because of what happened during the summer with him and his agent. From the perspective of some fans, JT seemed more concerned about himself than about the team. They wanted him to suffer the consequences of his actions/decisions.

I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me, that is what the forum is for. Plenty disagree with the JT extension. With me it isn't about defending a player because he plays for the Colts, it is about defending a player that is great. I defended Barkley, he isn't a Colt but he is a great RB.

[NewColtsFan]

34 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

Oh brother… 

 

He didn’t play the rest of the game after he was hurt during the Titans game week 4. So call it 3.5 weeks if you want to be pedantic. Doesn’t change his numbers or his health for those 3.5 weeks. 
 

Again, I’m not blaming the fall off on Taylor!!!! Get off it! Jesus! I’m saying THE OLINE IS THE REASON HE WAS WORSE IN ‘22 THAN ‘21 ERGO THE OLINE HAS HAD A HUGE IMPACT ON HIS PLAY!!! As it does for ANY RB. Oline and scheme is what’s most important for a teams run game - not the RB.

 

Do you get it now!?!

 

You’re COMPLETELY misrepresenting my point of view. 
 

Do I think the Colts brass made a mistake? Absolutely I do. As they’ve done before, by the way - they’re not infallible. 
 

And I think I’m right on this? Of course I do. Don’t you think you’re right when you give your reasoned opinion? Get off your high horse…

I’ve yet to see one convicing reason why this signing is the right thing for the Colts long term when compared to league wide behavior. It mostly boils down to him wearing the shoe…

 

Now get off my back or at least give me a reasoned opinion why it’s a good signing. 

Do I think I’m right when I write an opinion?  Sure.   But here’s an opinion I try hard never to give…..   I try not to say I’m smarter than the front office.   And that’s what you’re doing.   You think your position is smarter than the knowledge that Irsay, Ballard and Steichen have.   Do you really want to lecture me about my high horse?   
 

And that was always my view since becoming a member here back in 2012.   Even a bad GM knows more than a smart fan.   I might not always agree or understand a decision made by Grigson or Ballard, but I never think I’m smarter.   I think they have inside information that fans will never have.   And I give the GM the benefit of the doubt.   I’m not sure you can say the same.   
 

On a more personal note:  I’m sorry I have misunderstood your position.  Please chalk it up to total exhaustion that I’ve written about these last two days.   I’ll try to do better.   

[NFLfan]

What trades are you interested in before the deadline?

[NFLfan]

1 hour ago, Solid84 said:

Do I think the Colts brass made a mistake? Absolutely I do. As they’ve done before, by the way - they’re not infallible. 

 

31 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

.   I try not to say I’m smarter than the front office.   And that’s what you’re doing.  

 

The forum encourages different opinions. Both of you have made your positions known. I think we can move on from this now. It is not that important.

 

Let's talk trades.

 

From the Athletic: Link

 

Quote

The Denver Broncos are not having a fire sale despite a troubling start to their season. Multiple people with the team told me that they will listen to offers on every player but aren’t selling the roster. I was told to look for them to move pieces on the defensive side of the ball. 

 

What about a trade for Patrick Surtain?

[VikingsFanInChennai]

I'm just waiting to see how people will justify paying 20+ million a year to a Normal WR, after being stingy about the money being paid to a great RB. 

[NewColtsFan]

25 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

 

 

What about a trade for Patrick Surtain?

I don’t think Ballard would have any interest in a deal for Surtain.   And he’s very good.   But Ballard has only shown interest in having one quality outside corner at a time.   He drafted Rock in 2019,  he signed Gilmore as a FA in 2022,  and now he’s drafted Brents in 23.   
 

Also, Ballard has never shown any interest in paying a top corner big money.   Dallas just recently signed Trevor Diggs to a 5/95 deal.  $19 mill per.   And Surtain would want something close to that.   The most Ballard has ever spent on a corner is 2/20 for Gilmore.  Much less expensive and far fewer years.  
 

I believe Ballard prefers a zone defense, in part, because you can get good play for much less money than corners who play mostly man to man.   
 

I think Ballard’s actions for his 6 1/2 years here support this viewpoint. 

[Solid84]

8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Do I think I’m right when I write an opinion?  Sure.   But here’s an opinion I try hard never to give…..   I try not to say I’m smarter than the front office.   And that’s what you’re doing.   You think your position is smarter than the knowledge that Irsay, Ballard and Steichen have.   Do you really want to lecture me about my high horse?   
 

And that was always my view since becoming a member here back in 2012.   Even a bad GM knows more than a smart fan.   I might not always agree or understand a decision made by Grigson or Ballard, but I never think I’m smarter.   I think they have inside information that fans will never have.   And I give the GM the benefit of the doubt.   I’m not sure you can say the same.   
 

On a more personal note:  I’m sorry I have misunderstood your position.  Please chalk it up to total exhaustion that I’ve written about these last two days.   I’ll try to do better.   

No I don’t think I’m smarter than the front office. I think in this instance they’ve made a mistake when what 30+, 40+, 50+ (?) other GMs haven’t had success doing what they’ve just done over the last two decades. 
 

How about that then? Does SO many other GMs know better than ours? Or is he just the bestest ever?

 

I’ve said these things before and you are making assumptions and frankly some pretty wild accusations about me right now. 

It’s all good man. Sincerely hope you’re feeling better. 

[Solid84]

I like Surtain, but I think it’s an evaluation year for this team. While our secondary could use a veteran presence don’t think Ballard will make a move until the off season. 

[NFLfan]

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I don’t think Ballard would have any interest in a deal for Surtain.   And he’s very good.   But Ballard has only shown interest in having one quality outside corner at a time.   He drafted Rock in 2019,  he signed Gilmore as a FA in 2022,  and now he’s drafted Brents in 23.   
 

Also, Ballard has never shown any interest in paying a top corner big money.   Dallas just recently signed Trevor Diggs to a 5/95 deal.  $19 mill per.   And Surtain would want something close to that.   The most Ballard has ever spent on a corner is 2/20 for Gilmore.  Much less expensive and far fewer years.  
 

I believe Ballard prefers a zone defense, in part, because you can get good play for much less money than corners who play mostly man to man.   
 

I think Ballard’s actions for his 6 1/2 years here support this viewpoint. 

 

You're probably right.

 

I am a big fan of Surtain..

[w87r]

https://nfltraderumors.co/2023-nfl-trade-catalog/

 

 

Current list of potential WR trade targets, if that's what we are looking at.

 

Probably glance down at that CB list too. Lol

 

WR:

Hollywood Brown

Jerry Jeudy

Courtland Sutton

Hunter Renfrow

Rondale Moore

Darnell Mooney

JuJu Smith-Schuster

Terrance Marshall

Sterling Shepard

Parris Campbell

KJ Osborn

Kendrick "Jason" Bourne

DeAndre Hopkins 

 

 

Out of these guys, most intriguing options are:

Brown

Jeudy

Sutton

Marshall

Osborn 

 

Maybe Rondale Moore

 

 

CB:

Jaylen Johnson

Donte Jackson

Kaiir Elam

Chandon Sullivon

James Pierre

Kristian Fulton

David Long

Adoree Jackson

Darnay Holmes

 

 

Johnson, Jackson and Elam are of most interest. Fulton could be intriguing.

[OhioColt]

Will say living here in Ohio do hear the fans complain a lot about letting go of TE Hayden Hurst and the offense struggles without a solid tight end.  My trade idea is a player swap our TE Mo Alie-Cox, which helps frees up cap space for the Bengals LCB Chidobe Awuzie.  The Bengals drafted DJ Turner II to take over for Awuzie might just need to help advance the process.  I said this once before in another thread, why the HE double hockey sticks is Darrell Baker Jr. still doing on this team and starting.  Sorry but Baker should be on the * or off the team as we clearly need an upgrade for starting cornerback and Awuzie would be that for us.

[w87r]

2 hours ago, OhioColt said:

Will say living here in Ohio do hear the fans complain a lot about letting go of TE Hayden Hurst and the offense struggles without a solid tight end.  My trade idea is a player swap our TE Mo Alie-Cox, which helps frees up cap space for the Bengals LCB Chidobe Awuzie.  The Bengals drafted DJ Turner II to take over for Awuzie might just need to help advance the process.  I said this once before in another thread, why the HE double hockey sticks is Darrell Baker Jr. still doing on this team and starting.  Sorry but Baker should be on the * or off the team as we clearly need an upgrade for starting cornerback and Awuzie would be that for us.

Saw a trade with Cox and Bengals yesterday.

 

It was:

Cox + 7th

For

4th

 

I would be game.

 

Wouldn't mind Awuzie either though.

[hoosierhawk]

What could we get for Leonard?

[Stephen]

On 10/22/2023 at 1:27 AM, VikingsFanInChennai said:

I'm just waiting to see how people will justify paying 20+ million a year to a Normal WR, after being stingy about the money being paid to a great RB. 

If we let him go then we need to draft two wrs

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

After seeing how good AR was I wouldn’t be shocked if colts go trade for a younger player that could be here long term. It’s not about this season but the future. That could mean a defensive guy in the secondary.

[JediXMan]

AFC South tour lol.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Pittman would probably have had 3 straight 1k yard seasons had the joke  at QB hadn’t happened last season. He was close again last season.

[w87r]

Saw Blackmon's name coming up as a possible trade piece.

 

He's been playing great last 3 weeks, FA after the season.

 

Have Cross waiting as well.

 

 

I would prefer to pay him and bring him back, but if we can get a good piece, it might be worth looking at.(if they don't intend to pay him)

[Hawkeyecolt]

I would take a swing at Surtain.  He would be the ideal piece to add to Brents, Jones, and Flowers.  If they could figure out a deal without giving up a #1 I would be all for it.  

[Yoshinator]

We might trade someone like Isaiah McKenzie, Zack Moss, Mo-Allie Cox, or Shaq Leonard.

 

Not a whole lot we can trade at this point. 

 

If we want to acquire someone, I'm guessing it'll be a WR or CB. Maybe an O-Lineman. 

 

I hope we trade a few people and acquire draft picks. We aren't contending this season IMO unless we make the playoffs and Richardson returns for them.

[Hawkeyecolt]

An elite CB allows a DC to be pretty creative with his defenses. Denver may hold to their guns and keep Surtain off limits since he’s pretty cheap.  However, I think after seeing Steichen turn an anemic offense into a top 10 offense the Colts will be all in the next two years. Surtain will be under team control for two more years.

 

If they could land him for two number two’s.  The Colts could spend their #1 on a WR and use the rest of the draft on depth at OL, LB, DL, RB, 

 

Unlikely, but my dream scenario for the deadline. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

If colts could pull of a trade for Surtain that would be awesome. In this case I wouldn’t even care if it’s a higher draft pick. A young guy that could grow with this team and we are short at CB.

[Solid84]

I'd like Surtain, but it would likely cost a 1st rounder and that means not drafting a WR. 

 

Bolles also looks good, but he's likely too good to be a backup.

[masterlock]

On 10/18/2023 at 3:24 PM, Fluke_33 said:

I'm assuming the rumors regarding jeudy are true so i said yes to that.

 

There's no way they trade for Jeudy. Nah-gah happen.

 

On 10/18/2023 at 3:53 PM, ProblChld32 said:

Unpopular opinion but I believe Zach Moss has put ALOT on tape and could be shipped out before the deadline. You don’t pay your work horse all that coin to have him split carries. I think Miss could be trade bait and get draft capital in return. I don’t think they trade for a player especially with AR out for the year I think this is a throwaway season and they’ll look to just close out the season and hold decent position to get a solid pick come draft.

Zach Moss' utility value to the team greatly exceeds value in draft capital. I don't see it happening

 

I think a trade is possible, but it would be a low-level trade for a solid CB. That would be the only reason for a trade.

[richard pallo]

32 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I'd like Surtain, but it would likely cost a 1st rounder and that means not drafting a WR. 

 

Bolles also looks good, but he's likely too good to be a backup.

Surtain is worth a 1st rounder.  He’s a young player entering his prime.  Jeudy was a 1st rounder.  Your draft position guarantees us nothing but a rookie and hope.  Now that we have our quarterback using a 1st rd pick on a proven young talent seems like the way to go if you can find him and a team is willing to trade him.

[Solid84]

1 minute ago, richard pallo said:

Surtain is worth a 1st rounder.  He’s a young player entering his prime.  Jeudy was a 1st rounder.  Your draft position guarantees us nothing but a rookie and hope.  Now that we have our quarterback using a 1st rd pick on a proven young talent seems like the way to go if you can find him and a team is willing to trade him.

I agree Surtain is worth it, but I'd rather improve the WR unit than the CB unit at this point. We have Flowers and Brents out and they would be available again next season. I wouldn't object to Ballard trading a 1 for Surtain though.

[w87r]

1 minute ago, Solid84 said:

I agree Surtain is worth it, but I'd rather improve the WR unit than the CB unit at this point. We have Flowers and Brents out and they would be available again next season. I wouldn't object to Ballard trading a 1 for Surtain though.

 

Surtain

Jeudy

2024 6th

 

For

 

2024 1st

2025 4th

 

?

[Solid84]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

 

Surtain

Jeudy

2024 6th

 

For

 

2024 1st

2025 4th

 

?

Sure, that's possible, but I'm just not very hot on Jeudy. I don't really see how he makes us better and I really don't like his attitude.

[ProblChld32]

35 minutes ago, masterlock said:

 

There's no way they trade for Jeudy. Nah-gah happen.

 

Zach Moss' utility value to the team greatly exceeds value in draft capital. I don't see it happening

 

I think a trade is possible, but it would be a low-level trade for a solid CB. That would be the only reason for a trade.

As I said with another poster, we can agree to disagree. With Taylor back Moss can easily be expendable. If draft capital is available in return I can easily see them moving on. I also believe Moss is in a contract year as well. 

[masterlock]

2 minutes ago, ProblChld32 said:

As I said with another poster, we can agree to disagree. With Taylor back Moss can easily be expendable. If draft capital is available in return I can easily see them moving on. I also believe Moss is in a contract year as well. 

I'd love for Zack Moss to have an opportunity to be THE guy somewhere. My thought was simply that the Colts don't really have anyone proven behind Taylor without Moss. So I just don't see them parting with him. But who knows?

[ProblChld32]

7 minutes ago, masterlock said:

I'd love for Zack Moss to have an opportunity to be THE guy somewhere. My thought was simply that the Colts don't really have anyone proven behind Taylor without Moss. So I just don't see them parting with him. But who knows?

 

While I do agree with you (that there is no one proven behind him). You just don’t pay someone that amount of money to split touches with another guy. We may very much so keep Moss and I wouldn’t be upset at it, he’s played VERY well. I just gave my unpopular opinion, I could easily see him being shipped off somewhere else for a mid 4-5 round pick. 

[masterlock]

5 minutes ago, ProblChld32 said:

 

While I do agree with you (that there is no one proven behind him). You just don’t pay someone that amount of money to split touches with another guy. We may very much so keep Moss and I wouldn’t be upset at it, he’s played VERY well. I just gave my unpopular opinion, I could easily see him being shipped off somewhere else for a mid 4-5 round pick. 

Let's say they trade Moss for a 4th or 5th. Then what? Do they draft an RB with a 4th or 5th? And if so, is that player going to be as good as Moss? With Moss, you know what you have, and given the RB market, I'm not sure I see him commanding a large salary. If the Colts can get him on an affordable contract, then why use a pick on an RB when there are other needs. I'm not saying your opinion is wrong--an opinion can't be wrong since it's an opinion. But I just don't see what the Colts gain by trading away a capable backup when there's always a risk that Taylor could get injured. This is especially true when you're giving him a heavy workload.

[dw49]

On 10/24/2023 at 4:03 AM, w87r said:

Saw a trade with Cox and Bengals yesterday.

 

It was:

Cox + 7th

For

4th

 

I would be game.

 

Wouldn't mind Awuzie either though.

 

I think that one is utterly insane. Colts would be all over that one is its were real...