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Matt Ryan benched for Sam (merge)

John Waylon

By John Waylon
in Colts Football

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RollerColt Ring of Honor

RollerColt

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1 hour ago, MPStack said:


Giving up a ton of draft picks is overrated with FA today as long as you manage the CAP. Not to mention do 100% of those picks pan out?? I doubt SF or Rams will be damaged for decade. It just takes a smart GM to manage the loss of draft capital. JMO

 

 

It’s not the picks I’m talking about. Picks you can recover I agree. Money wise, a quarter of a billion means they have to commit to Wilson.

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MPStack Ring of Honor

MPStack

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9 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

It’s not the picks I’m talking about. Picks you can recover I agree. Money wise, a quarter of a billion means they have to commit to Wilson.


Gotcha. I think the average fan looks at the draft picks given up and wet their pants. 

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RollerColt Ring of Honor

RollerColt

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12 minutes ago, MPStack said:


Gotcha. I think the average fan looks at the draft picks given up and wet their pants. 

Full disclosure, I liked Wilson the QB. Thought he would do well in Denver with an offensive minded, Rodgers collaborating head coach in Hackett, surrounded by Jeudy and Sutton… 

 

I don’t like Wilson the celebrity who’s married to Ciara and thinks he’s too good for everyone else. I think Wilson the celebrity is in Wilson the QB’s head. 

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NorthernColt Active Roster

NorthernColt

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11 minutes ago, Rhodelesstraveled said:

The amount of cap we've blown on QB is why we have no OL

This literally makes no sense at all, you've posted this several times. We have the highest paid G in football. We have the highest paid OL in all of football. The problem is everyone on the OL we've paid, has regressed. Nor are we right against the cap. 

 

Both are problems, but are definitely not related.

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Shive Ring of Honor

Shive

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14 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

What are you talking about?  The Colts have spent more money on the oline than any team in football.

Sorry, that doesn't fit the narrative he's been blasting on here since he joined earlier this year. You don't have to be saying factual things when all you do is sling mud around. :dunno:

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Dobbinblitz Hall of Famer

Dobbinblitz

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Posted

This is from Matt Waldman who runs the Rookie Scouting Portfolio and has the attention of NFL Front Offices.

 

Had this to say about the Colts transition to Ehlinger:

"This is an athletic receiving corps. If the Colts had a quarterback who could extend plays, they could lean less on the conceptual pre-snap adjustments that are difficult for young/inexperienced receivers and lean into extending plays and letting receivers use their athletic ability to re-route into open spaces."

 

From his draft year:

"What is his ceiling scenario? While his opportunity to earn a starting role will be limited due to his likely draft capital, Ehlinger has the athletic tools to become a productive system quarterback in the NFL. With a good team around him, you may even hear fans of his future organization make vehement arguments that has become a legitimate franchise starter.

The first step is getting the ball out at the right time within the scope of a progression. He can’t lean on his legs and off-script plays in the NFL. He must have the vision and confidence to let the ball go at the top of his drops."

 

"Technical: His accuracy is underrated. He makes a lot of pro-caliber throws that good NFL receivers catch but his crew of wideouts has dropped"

 

"Conceptual: He’s better against man coverage than he is zone when it comes to intermediate throws. This is one of the main sources of his difficulties getting the ball out on time and wrecking the designed timing of a play."

 

"Where is the player inconsistent? Ehlinger’s vertical game is spotty. When he’s on, he’s capable of delivering pinpoint at a range of 40-50 yards. However, much like Carson Wentz, there are weeks where his targets beyond 40 yards drop everywhere but within a step of the receiver. The difference is that Wentz never had a good vertical game and Ehlinger has shown steady improvement, which would have caught the eyes of the public if his receivers didn’t drop so many of these pinpoint targets in 2020."

 

"Running: What makes him effective as a runner is ultimately his footwork. He has quick and precise feet to execute pressure cuts or transitional cuts from sideline to downhill and it makes defenders miss and he maintains most of his original pace before the change of direction. Pair this with his size and strength, and Ehlinger is a deceptively effective runner.

These skills and athletic traits will make Ehlinger an effective red-zone runner in the NFL."

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Restinpeacesweetchloe Ring of Honor

Restinpeacesweetchloe

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35 minutes ago, Dobbinblitz said:

This is from Matt Waldman who runs the Rookie Scouting Portfolio and has the attention of NFL Front Offices.

 

Had this to say about the Colts transition to Ehlinger:

"This is an athletic receiving corps. If the Colts had a quarterback who could extend plays, they could lean less on the conceptual pre-snap adjustments that are difficult for young/inexperienced receivers and lean into extending plays and letting receivers use their athletic ability to re-route into open spaces."

 

From his draft year:

"What is his ceiling scenario? While his opportunity to earn a starting role will be limited due to his likely draft capital, Ehlinger has the athletic tools to become a productive system quarterback in the NFL. With a good team around him, you may even hear fans of his future organization make vehement arguments that has become a legitimate franchise starter.

The first step is getting the ball out at the right time within the scope of a progression. He can’t lean on his legs and off-script plays in the NFL. He must have the vision and confidence to let the ball go at the top of his drops."

 

"Technical: His accuracy is underrated. He makes a lot of pro-caliber throws that good NFL receivers catch but his crew of wideouts has dropped"

 

"Conceptual: He’s better against man coverage than he is zone when it comes to intermediate throws. This is one of the main sources of his difficulties getting the ball out on time and wrecking the designed timing of a play."

 

"Where is the player inconsistent? Ehlinger’s vertical game is spotty. When he’s on, he’s capable of delivering pinpoint at a range of 40-50 yards. However, much like Carson Wentz, there are weeks where his targets beyond 40 yards drop everywhere but within a step of the receiver. The difference is that Wentz never had a good vertical game and Ehlinger has shown steady improvement, which would have caught the eyes of the public if his receivers didn’t drop so many of these pinpoint targets in 2020."

 

"Running: What makes him effective as a runner is ultimately his footwork. He has quick and precise feet to execute pressure cuts or transitional cuts from sideline to downhill and it makes defenders miss and he maintains most of his original pace before the change of direction. Pair this with his size and strength, and Ehlinger is a deceptively effective runner.

These skills and athletic traits will make Ehlinger an effective red-zone runner in the NFL."

Good stuff there. That man versus zone is not surprising. A lot of young QB struggle with zone  coverage to start their careers.

 

The athletic WR should help when plays break down. Pierce lived on that in college. I expect bigger plays from Sam in the passing game. Maybe not right away but after a couple weeks.

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Stephen Ring of Honor

Stephen

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13 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Good stuff there. That man versus zone is not surprising. A lot of young QB struggle with zone  coverage to start their careers.

 

The athletic WR should help when plays break down. Pierce lived on that in college. I expect bigger plays from Sam in the passing game. Maybe not right away but after a couple weeks.

Granson will probably be one of his security blankets due to the highschool playtime together. I love the way he readsvthe blitzcand hits his hot read

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Moosejawcolt Ring of Honor

Moosejawcolt

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4 hours ago, Rhodelesstraveled said:

The amount of cap we've blown on QB is why we have no OL

Wrong. We have no Oline because Ballard has invested so many assets in the Dline without really producing a star. I take that back, Grover is a stud but he was a late pick. Ballard continually went back to the draft cupboard and kept drafting Dline as he missed so mu that it left other positions bare. 

39 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I hope we get a few run-run read options. Think Sam would be great for that. 

 

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EastStreet Ring of Honor

EastStreet

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11 hours ago, buccolts said:

Regarding the injury: I think it's a situation where he COULD play if there were no other options, but where you really wouldn't want (and maybe shouldn't) want him to play so he can heal up properly. The timing is convenient to see what Sam can do. 

 

The 'rest of the season' thing is curious. Something else is up, and either the FO has lost confidence in Ryan (could be of his own doing, as well) or Ryan has lost confidence in the Colts, or himself. Though it's not a huge jump to believe this is a shoot from the hip decision, but I'm thinking Ryan had as much input into it as the rest of the FO.

 

Yep, Frank seemed uncomfortable with the whole interview but that could be the result of any one of a number of issues. Or all of them(?).

 

It's entirely possible Sam underwhelms against Washington, and progresses from there. Or he could break out, and we can wait for the league to figure him out. Hopefully, he levels off and doesn't wilt, either way.

 

On this Tuesday, I'm expecting to, at least, be more entertained than I have been for most of the beginning of this season. And, I'll take it from there.

 

Agreed. Curious (the rest season), and totally awkward (presser). 

 

I really love Sam as a kid, but watched him a lot in college. Just very limited. But great at back yard ball. Don't see him as a long term solution. WA is a bad team, so I think Indy has a chance to win this weekend. If we lose to WA, Irsay will be look bad (Wentz circus, and Snyder comments). I definitely have popcorn ready for the entertainment lol.. 

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Moosejawcolt Ring of Honor

Moosejawcolt

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3 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

I'd love to see which play... (down and distance, D formation, and personnel, OL call / protection, and reads/progressions).

 

I'm guessing the 3pt shot turned into a layup lol... Perhaps this was another situation where they put Granson on the DE lol... 

I wouldn't laugh to much at Granson blocking  the Dend. Their Oline can't block any Dline and that is their primary job lol

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EastStreet Ring of Honor

EastStreet

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10 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I wouldn't laugh to much at Granson blocking  the Dend. Their Oline can't block any Dline and that is their primary job lol

 

It is hilarious. They did it two weeks in a row, which turned into catastrophe both weeks. Haven't looked at the sacks and INTs this week. Probably won't. I saw all I needed the previous weeks. Strausser can't solve for twists... So teams will continue to twist... And putting Granson 1 vs 1 on DE, is just *ic. 

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Mighty Blue Practice Squad

Mighty Blue

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I was surprised to hear the news.

But Forum Fans, I believe Coach Reich was still going to play Matt if he did not get injured.:thinking:

I wanted Matt taken out during an earlier game because the defense was going to “ break him.”:woah:

Well Matt, at least you didn’t break a leg, an arm, blow out a knee, broken back, RUPTURED LIVER, broken neck, broken thumb, broken collarbone, punctured lung, or broken neck…I did not see the game, was it a shoulder/upper arm injury?

Or, did your arthritis  just kick in?

 

REALITY CHECK folks…Matt could return as starting QB:grumpy2:

 

Matt, now think…take a look at your checking and savings account…your investments…your health…your family…you can scratch off a Super Bowl ring from your bucket list (ouch!)…your defense blew that for you.:censored2:

Look at your trophy wall(s) and all the other good memories.

I’ll say it, Retire:thinking:

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DougDew

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35 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

I'd love to see which play... (down and distance, D formation, and personnel, OL call / protection, and reads/progressions).

 

I'm guessing the 3pt shot turned into a layup lol... Perhaps this was another situation where they put Granson on the DE lol... 

I think he means more plays than just 1.  Could be just CYA for the press/fans, but I bet with 30 years of NFL experience, he knows the value of a vertical pass. 

 

The elevation of Sam to #2, 2 weeks ago was a sign there was some displeasure with Ryan...that it wasn't just the oline from the coaches point of view.  A change of style was needed and they were prepping Sam for the day it would happen.  JMO.

 

And at this point, I bet Sam has a stronger arm than Ryan...by quite a bit...even before the shoulder.  We'll see if there are any different looks to the O with a new QB.

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RollerColt Ring of Honor

RollerColt

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43 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

I'd love to see which play... (down and distance, D formation, and personnel, OL call / protection, and reads/progressions).

 

I'm guessing the 3pt shot turned into a layup lol... Perhaps this was another situation where they put Granson on the DE lol... 

I’m wondering if Marcus meant they gave Matt the go ahead several times to take a shot, and he chose to not even throw it down there and took the dump off instead. 

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krunk Ring of Honor

krunk

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Sam evaded being sacked multiple times in this win vs Georgia. This is a great aspect of his game coming in to the OL situation we have.. Most of his game is West Coast offense and RPO to me. I didnt see a whole lot of deep passing although i do believe he will press the issue more than Ryan did. I still say our approach will be similar to the Seahawks and Russell Wilson. Its going to be more focused on the ground game. I think we can get the ground game moving again. I dont think we are that far off from fixing that part of the O.

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jonjon

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17 hours ago, FanOutOfTown said:

So basically Irsay stepped in and said no more. Not sure I like that level of meddling from an owner. You pay a GM and head coach to run your team and put the best product on the field. Let them do their jobs or find someone else who you think will do it better.

Like anything, the devil's in the details. He is not his father, but there are times when stepping in is the right move, esp if you have a HC and/or GM who can't seem to see the forest for the trees and stubbornly cling to "their guy." I think this probably happened with Wentz and was happening now. I like Ryan a lot, and I don't think the OL is getting as much blame as they should for him being slaughtered as well as Reich's/Brady's sucky play-calling and offensive moves, but even when he had time, there's too much there on Ryan to ignore. Reich and Ballard might not know when to cut bait, but Irsay does. It's a real shame. I think just about everyone thought the move made sense and would work out.

 

  

18 hours ago, RollerColt said:

So was it Reich's personal decision to tell us that Sam is the man for the rest of the season, or did he get told to say that by someone else? 

 

What is the advantage to telling us and future opponents that Sam is the starter for the rest of the season? Is it to build confidence in Sam? 

Maybe part of it is contractual, but I think it's being a class act and respectful to Ryan as well, whose career may be shot but is also a class act, so they aren't going to play games and have him and everyone else speculating. That's the thing I'm most proud of that Irsay has brought to this team. He doesn't put up with POSs. That's at least partly why D Watson was never an interest. 

 

  

20 hours ago, buccolts said:

Though it's not a huge jump to believe this is a shoot from the hip decision, but I'm thinking Ryan had as much input into it as the rest of the FO.

I very, very seriously doubt it. "Hey Matt, we're looking at benching you for the rest of the season. Any thoughts?" "Yeah bench me already, I suck and am a quitter anyway."  :)  Nah.

 

  

21 hours ago, chad72 said:

You have to do what you have to do. If that means trading JT and 2 first rounders to move up to get the QB, you do it.

And have a very real chance of drafting another Mitch Trubiski or Josh Rosen (I could go on). Ballard is smarter than that. We've whizzed away enough draft capital. A modest price to move up some, maybe. But there is a reason that GMs rarely if ever mortgage the future like that. 

 

My overall take is this: 

- As others have said, I hope Sam E is either really good or sucks. If he's hot and cold, we could end up in QB purgatory, hoping he keeps improving but is never the answer.

- If we are "good" enough not to have a shot at a top QB in the draft, then don't draft one. As someone pointed out earlier, mid/late-round QB picks almost never work out. Just fill other areas (OL being #1 of course) and aim for a top QB in 2024.

- As much as I like Reich, he and Brady should go. They have lost my faith with poor play-calling and other moves.

- Not sure about Ballard. It's easy to rip QB moves AFTER they don't pan out, but I recall little dissent at the time they made them. Wentz seemed riskier and at the time I felt was not worth giving up a #1. Ryan was easily worth a #3 as he was still playing at a high level last year despite having jack to work with and like almost everyone else, I liked the move but was leery of his age and him falling off of a cliff, which appears to have happened.

 

Let's face it all we were spoiled for a long time with Manning and then for awhile with Luck. You rarely get "generational" talents like that at QB and some teams have either never had one or it's been decades since they have and then some. We were due to take some lumps.

 

I just think of Peyton Manning with this D when he has so many sorry- Ds in his career....sigh 

  

 

 

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ADnum1 Ring of Honor

ADnum1

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8 hours ago, EastStreet said:

 

Agreed. Curious (the rest season), and totally awkward (presser). 

 

I really love Sam as a kid, but watched him a lot in college. Just very limited. But great at back yard ball. Don't see him as a long term solution. WA is a bad team, so I think Indy has a chance to win this weekend. If we lose to WA, Irsay will be look bad (Wentz circus, and Snyder comments). I definitely have popcorn ready for the entertainment lol.. 

One thing not mentioned is that he has a weak arm so he loses accuracy on his deep throws. But he is accurate on the short throws.

 

Frank will adjust the offense for him but I don't think he's a long term answer either

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ADnum1 Ring of Honor

ADnum1

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16 hours ago, MPStack said:


 

Two SBs 1 won


Career record of 106-57-1 

297 TDs pass to 90 Int.

 

You need help

Wilson in his prime was a great QB.

 

He was mobile and had uncanny accuracy especially on the deep throws. He only fell to the 3rd round because of his height.

 

I followed his career at NC State and was a huge fan

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MPStack Ring of Honor

MPStack

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Just now, PRnum1 said:

Wilson in his prime was a great QB.

 

He was mobile and had uncanny accuracy especially on the deep throws. He only fell to the 3rd round because of his height.

 

I followed his career at NC State and was a huge fan


He’s one of my all-time favorite QBs. For sure first ballet Hall a Famer. 

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w87r Ring of Honor

w87r

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1 minute ago, MPStack said:


He’s one of my all-time favorite QBs. For sure first ballet Hall a Famer. 

You think Russ is 1st ballet HoF?

 

He very well could be, but I don't see it right now. I think he still has work to do to get there. He has time to do it, but this season hasn't been it for him. He has regressed a little with his mobility declining a bit.

 

What's your thoughts on Eli Manning and his chances of being 1st ballet?

 

 

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MPStack Ring of Honor

MPStack

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4 minutes ago, w87r said:

You think Russ is 1st ballet HoF?

 

He very well could be, but I don't see it right now. I think he still has work to do to get there. He has time to do it, but this season hasn't been it for him. He has regressed a little with his mobility declining a bit.

 

What's your thoughts on Eli Manning and his chances of being 1st ballet?

 

 


Absolutely, I believe he’s first ballet.  W. Moon was a first ballet, with a career record 102-101 and 3-7 in playoffs. Never played in a conference championship. 
 

Same deal with Eli. Two time SB MVP top 10 in a lot of stats.

 

With letting Moon in first ballet, with zero playoff success and inflated stats due to longevity, it kinda set the bar IMO who goes in first ballet. 

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coltsfan_canada Hall of Famer

coltsfan_canada

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2 minutes ago, MPStack said:


Absolutely, I believe he’s first ballet.  W. Moon was a first ballet, with a career record 102-101 and 3-7 in playoffs. Never played in a conference championship. 
 

Same deal with Eli. Two time SB MVP top 10 in a lot of stats.

 

With letting Moon in first ballet, with zero playoff success and inflated stats due to longevity, it kinda set the bar IMO who goes in first ballet. 

He was TO machine also I wonder if that has any effect.

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