Qb for next year/QB class of 2021 (merge)

[w87r]

12 minutes ago, Rolltide_gocolts said:

As a die hard tide fan... Mac,  this yr has been tua/burrow level good!! I did not expect that at all..  he’s in my top 3 of qbs I’d love wearing the shoe next yr..

 

 Justin fields

 Mac Jones

 Ian book

  

Yeah, he has been very impressive.

[danlhart87]

Where is Book even projected 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I don’t think rivers retires on his own. But let’s say he decides to even though the colts want him back. There is another possibility. We re-sign Jacoby and Eason and him battle it out next season. This team is too good I don’t think ballard wants to turn this over to a rookie QB or Eason yet.  I just don’t see them as of right now telling rivers we don’t want you back because we want a broken QB like Wentz or Darnold. As long as things don’t fall apart we need to build on this year. Hopefully adding more offensive weapons. Why mess with something that actually worked this year for someone you hope you can fix. 

[danlhart87]

24 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I don’t think rivers retires on his own. But let’s say he decides to even though the colts want him back. There is another possibility. We re-sign Jacoby and Eason and him battle it out next season. This team is too good I don’t think ballard wants to turn this over to a rookie QB or Eason yet.  I just don’t see them as of right now telling rivers we don’t want you back because we want a broken QB like Wentz or Darnold. As long as things don’t fall apart we need to build on this year. Hopefully adding more offensive weapons. Why mess with something that actually worked this year for someone you hope you can fix. 

I am on board with Eason but hope Brissett doesn't start 1 game in 21 for Colts

[AZColt11]

My 2021 draft class QB rankins (assuming Lawrence comes out):

1. Lawrence

2. Lance

3. Wilson

4. Trask

5. Jones

6. Fields

7. Newman

 

I think the top 3 are for sure going to be gone by the time the Colts pick, along with Fields who I think is overrated.  They would either need to move up to get one of them or stay put and be in the mix for a guy like Trask or Jones, if they wanted them.  They still have Eason as well.  Competition never hurts and both would be cheap.

[danlhart87]

7 minutes ago, AZColt11 said:

My 2021 draft class QB rankins (assuming Lawrence comes out):

1. Lawrence

2. Lance

3. Wilson

4. Trask

5. Jones

6. Fields

7. Newman

 

I think the top 3 are for sure going to be gone by the time the Colts pick, along with Fields who I think is overrated.  They would either need to move up to get one of them or stay put and be in the mix for a guy like Trask or Jones, if they wanted them.  They still have Eason as well.  Competition never hurts and both would be cheap.

Fields is very overrated 

I won't be upset if he lands in Jacksonville 

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, danlhart87 said:

Fields is very overrated 

I won't be upset if he lands in Jacksonville 

I actually like Trey Lance better than Fields. Lawrence is by far the best QB coming out, by my eye test he is the closest thing to Luck I have seen coming out as far as #1 picks. He is strong like Luck and a proven winner, he has moxie as well. Problem is if he goes to a sinking ship in NY like Burrow did the Bengals will it ruin his career. Luck came here which our franchise is known for winning and we still had Wayne and Mathis - great role models/leaders.

[danlhart87]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I actually like Trey Lance better than Fields. Lawrence is by far the best QB coming out, by my eye test he is the closest thing to Luck I have seen coming out as far as #1 picks. He is strong like Luck and a proven winner, he has moxie as well. Problem is if he goes to a sinking ship in NY like Burrow did the Bengals will it ruin his career. Luck came here which our franchise is known for winning and we still had Wayne and Mathis - great role models/leaders.

I like Lance too 

I fear one of these guys will end up on the Bears and be a joke though 

[2006Coltsbestever]

5 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

I like Lance too 

I fear one of these guys will end up on the Bears and be a joke though 

Yeah of late, the Bears, Jets, Jags, and Bengals have had some bad luck in that area. Dalton was ok but nothing special for the Bengals. I hope Burrow makes a full recovery. He can still be good but he needs a team around him to do anything. That was a gruesome injury.  

[danlhart87]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Yeah of late, the Bears, Jets, Jags, and Bengals have had some bad luck in that area. Dalton was ok but nothing special for the Bengals. I hope Burrow makes a full recovery. He can still be good but he needs a team around him to do anything. That was a gruesome injury.  

I hope Burrow returns to 100%

Bears have the worst luck no 4000 yard passer ever 

[Colts.sb41]

Hey guys, long time reader but this is my first post in a long while. I haven’t read this scenario which I think is my favorite I’ve thought of so far.

 

Colts bring Rivers back shortly after the season which I believe is the majority’s number one option and maybe make a trade on draft day for Sam Darnold for say a 3rd round pick? Why couldn’t he play the roll Jacoby is this year while also getting the opportunity to sit behind Rivers and being much much cheaper? Also Darnold and Eason could battle it out for the #2 and the opportunity to start in 22?

[NFLfan]

2 minutes ago, Colts.sb41 said:

Hey guys, long time reader first time poster. I haven’t read this scenario which I think is my favorite I’ve thought of so far.

 

Colts bring Rivers back shortly after the season which I believe is the majority’s number one option and maybe make a trade on draft day for Sam Darnold for say a 3rd round pick? Why couldn’t he play the roll Jacoby is this year while also getting the opportunity to sit behind Rivers and being much much cheaper? Also Darnold and Eason could battle it out for the #2 and the opportunity to start in 22?

 

Welcome!

 

Good idea! I like Darnold and think he would play so much better on another team. The Jets are awful. 

 

I would love Darnold for my team but we are stuck with Cousins. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

45 minutes ago, Colts.sb41 said:

Hey guys, long time reader but this is my first post in a long while. I haven’t read this scenario which I think is my favorite I’ve thought of so far.

 

Colts bring Rivers back shortly after the season which I believe is the majority’s number one option and maybe make a trade on draft day for Sam Darnold for say a 3rd round pick? Why couldn’t he play the roll Jacoby is this year while also getting the opportunity to sit behind Rivers and being much much cheaper? Also Darnold and Eason could battle it out for the #2 and the opportunity to start in 22?

This is a scenario I would be ok with.  

[Rally5]

23 hours ago, w87r said:

Go look at the salary cap thread that is pinned.

 

 

We don't have $90m in cap space, we have $67m, with only 38 guys signed.

 

If we sign/trade for a QB making $30m, we will have $37m to sign 14 other guys, that doesn't include PS players, which will account for $1.5m. 

 

After all that we would still need to keep some cap for in season spending($5-$10m). So would give us under $30m to fill out the roster really. Tough decisions loom ahead.

 

Go look through salary cap thread at important guys who are FA and potential contracts to resign them.

 

 

That is why $30m doesn't work.

 

Im hoping if Rivers comes back he will take around $20m or less, but even that makes our cap space tight.

Thanks Man!  Helpful!!!

 

[Rally5]

On 12/11/2020 at 10:00 AM, EastStreet said:

I would not put Wentz in the same sentence as Manning. Manning had "bad" years, but only had one sub 70 QBR year (since QBR was introduced), and that was his last year in Denver. Wentz has only had one year over 70. 

 

Not sure it's even the money some think it is. I heard some talking heads suggest the receiving team could end up only being on the hook for 25M for 2021. 

 

I'm not buying the "rareness" sentiment though. I don't think he's that special to begin with, so not really rare to me. Again, not opposed to him, just opposed to paying a ton for someone who's become questionable. I'm really interested to see how Hurts does, before making any hard judgement though.

 

And I'm not sure we're as desperate as some think either, to really be on the needle/haystack search. We have no idea about Eason. Rivers for another season is good possibility (and probably my preference). There are some decent QBs this year (Trask/Wilson) that will likely be available 15ish to 20ish that won't take a lot to move up for (if that was what we wanted to do).

 

If Rivers and Eason aren't in the cards, personally I'd take a shot at Trask. Kid has been lights out. 70+% completions, 38/3 TD/INT, 360 ypg, and had 95ish QBRs against both TAMU and UGA, both who have good SEC Ds. Anyway, we have more options than folks think. We're only really out of the Lawrence and Fields sweepstakes.

I'm not sure I disagree with any of that...I'm pontificating like most and largely unsettled with our current prospects.  That's for all the input, enjoy it as always!

[PRnum1]

12 hours ago, AZColt11 said:

My 2021 draft class QB rankins (assuming Lawrence comes out):

1. Lawrence

2. Lance

3. Wilson

4. Trask

5. Jones

6. Fields

7. Newman

 

I think the top 3 are for sure going to be gone by the time the Colts pick, along with Fields who I think is overrated.  They would either need to move up to get one of them or stay put and be in the mix for a guy like Trask or Jones, if they wanted them.  They still have Eason as well.  Competition never hurts and both would be cheap.

Fields will be the best out of all of them.

 

He can throw with incredible touch and accuracy and had has the cannon to launch it 50 yards downfield. Very mobile and incredibly accurate throwing on the run. Good height too at 6'3

 

He'll be a better pro than Lawrence who has the big arm and mobility but struggles with touch and timing throws.

[danlhart87]

 

[AZColt11]

2 hours ago, PRnum1 said:

Fields will be the best out of all of them.

 

He can throw with incredible touch and accuracy and had has the cannon to launch it 50 yards downfield. Very mobile and incredibly accurate throwing on the run. Good height too at 6'3

 

He'll be a better pro than Lawrence who has the big arm and mobility but struggles with touch and timing throws.

That's the fun part about this.  It's all a crapshoot and everybody has their opinions.  I'm sure if we all had foresight and KNEW who was going to be great every team would be running to draft that guy.  But we don't.  Many people will make lists, and many will be different.  Then we all get to see what happens.

[ColtJax]

Just now, AZColt11 said:

That's the fun part about this.  It's all a crapshoot and everybody has their opinions.  I'm sure if we all had foresight and KNEW who was going to be great every team would be running to draft that guy.  But we don't.  Many people will make lists, and many will be different.  Then we all get to see what happens.

 

Yep,

Manning Vs Leaf, just as many said Leaf has the much bigger upside.

Luck Vs Griffin, many thought Griffin would be the better pick.

 

[w87r]

Going to do a breakdown here of potential options this offseason.

 

Going off projected cap space of $67m fpr 2021 and only having 38 players under contract.

 

Obviously 1st option is Rivers, he could re-sign hopefully for lower than his $25m 2020 cap hit. Even if he agrees to $20m cap space is still tight.

 

Next option would be to roll with Eason, which would allow the team to retain depth and potentially add a couple pieces.

 

Next best option, imo, financially. Is Sam Darnold as he would only count $4.7m against 2021 cap allowing team to retain depth amd maybe add a couple pieces.

 

Other option would be to pick up another QB in the draft, or cheap veteran FA, which would allow us to retain depth and add additional pieces.

 

Other options:(that could make sense if the plan is to pay Rivers $20-$25, but he retires)

Matt Ryan:

2021 cap hit - $25m

2022 cap hit - $26m

2023 cap hit - $30m

 

Matt Stafford:

2021 cap hit - $20m

2022 cap hit - $23m

 

Aaron Rodgers:

2021 cap hit - $22m

2022 cap hit - $25.5m

2023 cap hit - $25.5m

 

Who knows if any of these guys would be available, but they could be available for cap or other reasons.

 

Guy that doesn't make sense and would cripple the team depth and any potential to bring in some additional depth:

Carson Wentz:

2021 cap hit - $31.4m

2022 cap hit - $28m

2023 cap hit - $33m

2024 cap hit - $32m

 

 

Again, I've seen Wentz name brought up to much. If we brought him in, we would have $36m to fill out rest of the roster(14 players to top 53, 10-16 PS players depending on rules next year and in season cap space $5-$10m). Crippling the teams ability to retain depth and add any additional help. Bringing in Wentz is the worst move the team could make this off-season and I would be greatly disappointed if it were to happen. No Colts fan should be routing for this scenario, imo. I suppose we could restructure his deal after a trade saving around $9m next year, but at no point does it make sense as it would just hurt the cap space in the future(2022 and beyond)where we have to extend quite a few other key players.(Nelson, Leonard, Smith).

[danlhart87]

23 minutes ago, w87r said:

Going to do a breakdown here of potential options this offseason.

 

Going off projected cap space of $67m fpr 2021 and only having 38 players under contract.

 

Obviously 1st option is Rivers, he could re-sign hopefully for lower than his $25m 2020 cap hit. Even if he agrees to $20m cap space is still tight.

 

Next option would be to roll with Eason, which would allow the team to retain depth and potentially add a couple pieces.

 

Next best option, imo, financially. Is Sam Darnold as he would only count $4.7m against 2021 cap allowing team to retain depth amd maybe add a couple pieces.

 

Other option would be to pick up another QB in the draft, or cheap veteran FA, which would allow us to retain depth and add additional pieces.

 

Other options:(that could make sense if the plan is to pay Rivers $20-$25, but he retires)

Matt Ryan:

2021 cap hit - $25m

2022 cap hit - $26m

2023 cap hit - $30m

 

Matt Stafford:

2021 cap hit - $20m

2022 cap hit - $23m

 

Aaron Rodgers:

2021 cap hit - $22m

2022 cap hit - $25.5m

2023 cap hit - $25.5m

 

Who knows if any of these guys would be available, but they could be available for cap or other reasons.

 

Guy that doesn't make sense and would cripple the team depth and any potential to bring in some additional depth:

Carson Wentz:

2021 cap hit - $31.4m

2022 cap hit - $28m

2023 cap hit - $33m

2024 cap hit - $32m

 

 

Again, I've seen Wentz name brought up to much. If we brought him in, we would have $36m to fill out rest of the roster(14 players to top 53, 10-16 PS players depending on rules next year and in season cap space $5-$10m). Crippling the teams ability to retain depth and add any additional help. Bringing in Wentz is the worst move the team could make this off-season and I would be greatly disappointed if it were to happen. No Colts fan should be routing for this scenario, imo. I suppose we could restructure his deal after a trade saving around $9m next year, but at no point does it make sense as it would just hurt the cap space in the future(2022 and beyond)where we have to extend quite a few other key players.(Nelson, Leonard, Smith).

Yes Wentz would be an awful decision 

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

Yes Wentz would be an awful decision 

I agree, Ballard will never do it IMO. 

[danlhart87]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I agree, Ballard will never do it IMO. 

Everyone is option at this point. 

Someone posted an article about Jimmy Garrapolo being good fit in Indy too..

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

5 hours ago, ColtJax said:

 

Yep,

Manning Vs Leaf, just as many said Leaf has the much bigger upside.

Luck Vs Griffin, many thought Griffin would be the better pick.

 

Yeah I knew a couple of people at that time that wanted Leaf, if that would've happened we would not have a team in INDY. That is why Irsay is a great owner, he knew along with Polian who to take.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, danlhart87 said:

Everyone is option at this point. 

Someone posted an article about Jimmy Garrapolo being good fit in Indy too..

 

If we finish 11-5 or even 10-6 and at least win 1 playoff game, why not Phil for 1 more year. I would be ok with it.

[danlhart87]

2 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

If we finish 11-5 or even 10-6 and at least win 1 playoff game, why not Phil for 1 more year. I would be ok with it.

Thats the most logical choice

Only person stopping that is Rivers himself 

[w87r]

4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

If we finish 11-5 or even 10-6 and at least win 1 playoff game, why not Phil for 1 more year. I would be ok with it.

Would be my first choice as well, even though it would hurt cap at his current number.

 

Ideally $15m could convince him to give ia a chance. Jist don't see it. 

[danlhart87]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

Would be my first choice as well, even though it would hurt cap at his current number.

 

Ideally $15m could convince him to give ia a chance. Jist don't see it. 

I'm thinking 20m will be enough to convince Rivers

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

Would be my first choice as well, even though it would hurt cap at his current number.

 

Ideally $15m could convince him to give ia a chance. Jist don't see it. 

I think he could take 20 Mill but who knows, he does love it here. 

[danlhart87]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think he could take 20 Mill but who knows, he does love it here. 

[w87r]

2 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

Yeah we posted the same thing at the same time too funny  

[danlhart87]

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2020/12/11/colts-news-carson-wenzt-qb-pat-mcafee-says-not-indianapolis/6509697002/

 

Pat FTW

[w87r]

8 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2020/12/11/colts-news-carson-wenzt-qb-pat-mcafee-says-not-indianapolis/6509697002/

 

Pat FTW

Thanks.

 

PatMc gets it.

 

Tired of reading this notion we just have all this money to throw around from sports writers across the league. Fact is we don't, they should maybe do a little more research into the cap space we have and what we need to do to keep a solid "team" together, than just have lazy articles trying to tie things together.

[danlhart87]

I know how important the QB position is but I don't wanna 1 player alone to fracture the team. Wentz would do that. 

[w87r]

Wanted to delve a little deeper into the following 3:

 

Matt Ryan:(current cap hit if traded to Colts)

2021 cap hit - $25m

2022 cap hit - $26m

2023 cap hit - $30m

 

Potential restructure cap hits:($22m base reduced to $1m with $21m spread over 3 years of deal)

2021 - $11m($14m savings)

2022 - $33m

2023 - $37m

 

Matt Stafford:(current cap hit if traded to Colts)

2021 cap hit - $20m

2022 cap hit - $23m

 

Potential restructure cap hits:($9.5 base reduced to $1m with $8.5 spread over final 2 years of deal)

2021 - $15.75m($4.25m savings)

2022 - $27.25m

 

Aaron Rodgers:(current cap hit if traded to Colts)

2021 cap hit - $22m

2022 cap hit - $25.5m

2023 cap hit - $25.5m

 

Potential restructure cap hits:($14.7m base reduced to $1m with $13.7m spread over final 3 years of deal)

2021 - $12.8m($9.2m savings)

2022 - $30.1m

2023 - $30.1m

 

 

Figure I might as well post the Wentz restructure to show why it is much worse than these potential options.

 

Carson Wentz:

2021 cap hit - $31.4m

2022 cap hit - $28m

2023 cap hit - $33m

2024 cap hit - $32m

 

Restructure figures:($15.4m base reduced to $1m with $14.4m spread over final 4 years of deal)

2021 - $20.6m($10.8m savings)

2022 - $31.6m

2023 - $36.6m

2024 - $35.6m

[danlhart87]

I don't like Ryan either. He's had the benefit of throwing to Jones for years. 

[EastStreet]

more PM on Wentz, with some vids

 

https://heavy.com/sports/philadelphia-eagles/carson-wentz-trade/

 

Like I said. No thanks.

[w87r]

1 minute ago, danlhart87 said:

I don't like Ryan either. He's had the benefit of throwing to Jones for years. 

Yeah don't get me wrong. Im just showing options of guys that I think could potentially be in play. Not necessarily who I want.

 

If not Rivers, Stafford could be a decent option as well as Rodgers.

 

Personally I would just want to take a flyer on Darnold and see if there is anything there, if Rivers is out. Jumping straight to Eason would be scary, bit if that is what we do, I would be behind the move and see wharf happens. Just tough to wrap my thoughts around it with the state of the team(trying to compete)

[danlhart87]

3 minutes ago, w87r said:

Yeah don't get me wrong. Im just showing options of guys that I think could potentially be in play. Not necessarily who I want.

 

If not Rivers, Stafford could be a decent option as well as Rodgers.

 

Personally I would just want to take a flyer on Darnold and see if there is anything there, if Rivers is out. Jumping straight to Eason would be scary, bit if that is what we do, I would be behind the move and see wharf happens. Just tough to wrap my thoughts around it with the state of the team(trying to compete)

If the team chooses Eason chances are we bring in a veteran to back him up. Brissett could be that guy or someone else like Winston.