With Alex Smith out for 2019.....

[CR91]

Redskins need a QB. Flacco would be atleast 15+ a year and in his thirties. Also this is a weak QB class. There is potential to move up to 15 by trading Jacoby and our first. Thoughts?

[KB]

I think Brissett would do well on the Redskins. If Guice makes a good recovery then they should have a decent running game and the defence isnt terrible.

[Kangaroo]

Everyone wants to trade Jacoby away, yet all teams need a good quality backup.  If we trade Jacoby, we need to get a good QB as a backup--as OP said, this QB class is average, so where do you propose to get the replacement?

[CR91]

36 minutes ago, Kangaroo said:

Everyone wants to trade Jacoby away, yet all teams need a good quality backup.  If we trade Jacoby, we need to get a good QB as a backup--as OP said, this QB class is average, so where do you propose to get the replacement?

 

Colts seem to be a fan of phillip Walker. They keep bringing him back

[BleedBlu8792]

18 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

Colts seem to be a fan of phillip Walker. They keep bringing him back

 

That doesn't mean he's capable of being an NFL backup. He's a PS QB and that's probably all he'll ever be.

[CR91]

1 minute ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

That doesn't mean he's capable of being an NFL backup. He's a PS QB and that's probably all he'll ever be.

 

They said the same about Jacoby

[richard pallo]

It's a trade worth exploring.  Even Brissett for their 2nd. would work as well.  I think we can expect Ballard to find a veteran backup to take his place. 

[BleedBlu8792]

32 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

They said the same about Jacoby

 

Come on man, no they didn't. Jacoby, at the very least, was going to be an NFL backup. Walker's career path was always going to be different.

[JPFolks]

I understand the desire to have a back up as good as Brissett on our team, but I am starting to wonder about that really.  With Brissett we won 4 games.   Without him, we'd have had how many wins? And what would that difference mean? Well, a better draft pick.  Because though I am adamantly against tanking a season if it looks like we'll miss the playoffs, there is a HUGE difference from being an 8-8 team that misses and a 4-12 (or worse) team and missing.  When you're down in that territory, and your QB isn't able to get your team to a .500 season, does it matter if you finish 4-12 or you finish 2-14? (and let's be honest, there ARE QB's out there including the likes of Walker, who could win us 2 games or more readily available every year).  On the other hand, what if Luck only misses a couple games? Could they step in and win those two games?   I'd say that Brissett might be able to win one of those two games.  Maybe.  Less likely he wins 2 of 2, regardless of the teams we're playing at the time.  So you have a 50% chance to win one of two games by Brissett if we're being fair since he won 4 of 15 last time around.  (And you could say 1 of 2 in New England, giving him a 5 and 16 record as a starter).  Colt McCoy could do that.  Absolutely.  In fact, he could win MORE than that if he wasn't so small and breakable.  But to fill in 2 games, I give McCoy just as much chance to win 1 of 2 as I give Brissett.  

 

So... McCoy plus a first rounder would be a slam dunk trade for us.  McCoy and a second rounder likely would as well.  McCoy and 2 3rd rounders would work, but Washington has only 5 picks this year with no 4th or 6th rounders.  I doubt they will let go ANY of their picks worthy of Brissett, so it's a moot point.  But the same principle would apply to any other team.  A back up as good (bad?) as McCoy plus a low first or high second round should just about do it.  Perhaps an additional lower round pick if the back up isn't up to snuff or a 4th if there is no back up offered up (or any other position of need that fits our culture).  

 

Just my opinion, I could be right.  Speculation is fun.  

[CR91]

45 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

Come on man, no they didn't. Jacoby, at the very least, was going to be an NFL backup. Walker's career path was always going to be different.

 

Jacoby was a third string QB. Thats basically a PS QB. He would have never played if Brady didnt get suspended and Jimmy G didnt get hurt. No one would have ever heard of Jacoby

[shasta519]

1 hour ago, CR91 said:

 

Jacoby was a third string QB. Thats basically a PS QB. He would have never played if Brady didnt get suspended and Jimmy G didnt get hurt. No one would have ever heard of Jacoby

 

Brissett was a 3rd round pick...Walker was a UDFA. And Brissett was actually on the NFL roster his rookie season. 

 

You can't really compare the two. Brissett actually played as a rookie...and Walker would have still been a PS QB even without the Brissett trade.

[CR91]

4 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

 

Brissett was a 3rd round pick...Walker was a UDFA. And Brissett was actually on the NFL roster his rookie season. 

 

You can't really compare the two. Brissett actually played as a rookie...and Walker would have still been a PS QB even without the Brissett trade.

 

He was on an NFL roster because Brady was suspended. He was gonna be a PS QB

[esmort]

1 hour ago, CR91 said:

 

Jacoby was a third string QB. Thats basically a PS QB. He would have never played if Brady didnt get suspended and Jimmy G didnt get hurt. No one would have ever heard of Jacoby

 

 

2 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

He was on an NFL roster because Brady was suspended. He was gonna be a PS QB

 

 

Not only was JB 3rd rnd pick, he was drafted when Garopollo's rookie contract was nearly up to replace Garappolo as the Patriots developmental QB when they seen Brady wasn't leaving in the near future. He was never going to see the PS.

[CR91]

1 minute ago, esmort said:

 

 

 

 

Not only was JB 3rd rnd pick, he was drafted when Garopollo's rookie contract was nearly up to replace Garappolo as the Patriots developmental QB when they seen Brady wasn't leaving in the near future. He was never going to see the PS.

 

BB didnt wanna trade Garappolo. That was Kraft's move. Brisett was gonna to PS. 

[MPStack]

2 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

BB didnt wanna trade Garappolo. That was Kraft's move. Brisett was gonna to PS. 

 

So, you draft QB with a 3rd Rd pick, to put on the PS. 

[esmort]

Just now, CR91 said:

 

BB didnt wanna trade Garappolo. That was Kraft's move. Brisett was gonna to PS. 

 

I agree BB wanted to keep Garoppolo, but even if they had not have traded him they knew they were losing him in 1 yr ... Garappolo was plan A: Brady leaving in next year or 2 ....  Brissett was development QB plan B: Brady staying 2+ years.

 

Regardless, he was never going to the PS because some team would have poached him immediately.

[Superman]

Every time you think about the Colts trading Jacoby Brissett, you need to keep three things in mind:

 

1) Chris Ballard said he doesn't want to trade Brissett, would rather keep him as a backup, unless he gets a great offer for him. So if you assume Brissett walks as a FA in 2020 -- which is what everyone seems to be so concerned about -- the Colts would stand to get a nice comp pick for him in 2021, let's say a 4th rounder. So are you going to get better than a 4th rounder for him in 2019?

 

2) This list of names: Teddy Bridgewater, Nick Foles, Joe Flacco, Tyrod Taylor. And this list of names: Dwayne Haskins, Kyler Murray, Daniel Jones, Will Grier, Drew Lock, Ryan Finley. Between free agency, trade assets, and the draft, his might be the deepest available QB group ever. Why would Washington or any other team give up significant draft capital in the first round for Brissett? (On the draft pick value chart, pick #15 is worth 350 points more than pick #26. If Brissett's trade value is a 4th rounder, about 116 points at best, we're coming up short by about 230 points.)

 

3) This list of names: Mitchell Trubisky, Patrick Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Josh Allen, Josh Rosen, Lamar Jackson. That's eight first round QBs who are all starters or presumed starters, all of whom were drafted after Brissett. The NFL QB market isn't as dry and tapped out as it was a few years ago, and teams are more willing to play rookie QBs than they used to be.

 

So not only is the Colts' GM not inclined to trade his backup QB, but the market for him will be suppressed by a high level of supply and a low level of demand. 

 

Brissett is most likely going to be a Colt in 2019, and a free agent in 2020, at which point the Colts will either draft or sign his replacement. 

[Superman]

22 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

He was on an NFL roster because Brady was suspended. He was gonna be a PS QB

 

He was drafted in anticipation of Brady being suspended. 

 

No team drafts a player in the third round to put him on the practice squad. If he's worth a third, he's not going to clear waivers. 

[KB]

If we do trade Brissett, how about having Bortles as our backup? He has starter experience and some wheels. 

[CR91]

43 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

He was drafted in anticipation of Brady being suspended. 

 

No team drafts a player in the third round to put him on the practice squad. If he's worth a third, he's not going to clear waivers. 

 

So youre saying the Pats were gonna carry three QBs for 16 games regardless if Brady got suspended or not

[CR91]

57 minutes ago, esmort said:

 

I agree BB wanted to keep Garoppolo, but even if they had not have traded him they knew they were losing him in 1 yr ... Garappolo was plan A: Brady leaving in next year or 2 ....  Brissett was development QB plan B: Brady staying 2+ years.

 

Regardless, he was never going to the PS because some team would have poached him immediately.

 

I doubt it. Jimmy G was supposed to be the next heir apparent, but when they saw Brady still more in the tank, they made the deal. And if they did wanna develop Brisett, why trade him for Dorsett who has been a bust even in NE

[Superman]

3 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

So youre saying the Pats were gonna carry three QBs for 16 games regardless if Brady got suspended or not

 

Nope. I'm saying Brissett wasn't going to the practice squad.

 

And the main point is that Brissett >>> Philip Walker, and anyone who has watched them play can see that plainly.

[CR91]

54 minutes ago, Superman said:

Every time you think about the Colts trading Jacoby Brissett, you need to keep three things in mind:

 

1) Chris Ballard said he doesn't want to trade Brissett, would rather keep him as a backup, unless he gets a great offer for him. So if you assume Brissett walks as a FA in 2020 -- which is what everyone seems to be so concerned about -- the Colts would stand to get a nice comp pick for him in 2021, let's say a 4th rounder. So are you going to get better than a 4th rounder for him in 2019?

 

2) This list of names: Teddy Bridgewater, Nick Foles, Joe Flacco, Tyrod Taylor. And this list of names: Dwayne Haskins, Kyler Murray, Daniel Jones, Will Grier, Drew Lock, Ryan Finley. Between free agency, trade assets, and the draft, his might be the deepest available QB group ever. Why would Washington or any other team give up significant draft capital in the first round for Brissett? (On the draft pick value chart, pick #15 is worth 350 points more than pick #26. If Brissett's trade value is a 4th rounder, about 116 points at best, we're coming up short by about 230 points.)

 

3) This list of names: Mitchell Trubisky, Patrick Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Josh Allen, Josh Rosen, Lamar Jackson. That's eight first round QBs who are all starters or presumed starters, all of whom were drafted after Brissett. The NFL QB market isn't as dry and tapped out as it was a few years ago, and teams are more willing to play rookie QBs than they used to be.

 

So not only is the Colts' GM not inclined to trade his backup QB, but the market for him will be suppressed by a high level of supply and a low level of demand. 

 

Brissett is most likely going to be a Colt in 2019, and a free agent in 2020, at which point the Colts will either draft or sign his replacement. 

 

How do we know what Brisset trade value is? Also teams desperate for good QBs always overpay. The Redskins are projected to draft a QB anyway. Is Drew Lock really better then Brisett

[CR91]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

Nope. I'm saying Brissett wasn't going to the practice squad.

 

And the main point is that Brissett >>> Philip Walker, and anyone who has watched them play can see that plainly.

 

Not arguing that. All im saying is Walker might have potential as a backup QB if given the chance. Hes done well in preseason and the Colts obviously like what they see if they keep resigning him

[Superman]

1 minute ago, CR91 said:

 

How do we know what Brisset trade value is? Also teams desperate for good QBs always overpay. The Redskins are projected to draft a QB anyway. Is Drew Lock really better then Brisett

 

So you don't think any of us have a good idea about Brissett's trade value, so let's just make one up, right?

 

Teams that are desperate for a QB in 2019 will have a lot of options. Which is why we can determine that Brissett won't have a high trade value. 

 

And yes, Drew Lock is better than Jacoby Brissett, and has more upside. Washington would much rather draft Drew Lock -- if he's even still there at #15 -- than trade out for a chance at Jacoby Brissett, a former third round pick who has obvious limitations as a passer. Same is true for every other team in the NFL. 

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, CR91 said:

Hes done well in preseason

 

No he hasn't. Walker isn't good. The reason the Colts are able to keep signing him is because no one else is even remotely interested.

 

Even if the Colts did move Brissett this year, it wouldn't be because they think Walker is capable of backing up Luck. They'd definitely add a better backup. 

[shasta519]

25 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

So youre saying the Pats were gonna carry three QBs for 16 games regardless if Brady got suspended or not

 

I don't understand. They knew Brady would get suspended...which is why they drafted a backup QB in the 3rd round.

 

If Brady isn't goiing to be suspended, some other team probably drafts Brissett and who knows...maybe he is a starter now.

 

When Brady came back, Brissett was on the active roster...just not active. So they carried three QBs.

[esmort]

13 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

I doubt it. Jimmy G was supposed to be the next heir apparent, but when they saw Brady still more in the tank, they made the deal. And if they did wanna develop Brisett, why trade him for Dorsett who has been a bust even in NE

 

I don't know what went on behind closed doors at the Pats.  The Pats were a mess during that whole Brady/BB power struggle; who knows what BB's reasoning was ... maybe it was spite, maybe he figured he was maximizing the value of his TB replacement plans while they had the most value, maybe he legitimately thought there was untapped 1st rnd talent he could get out of Dorsett... who knows? But, regardless of the reason the point remains ... Brissett was never going to the Pats PS.

[shasta519]

16 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

So you don't think any of us have a good idea about Brissett's trade value, so let's just make one up, right?

 

Teams that are desperate for a QB in 2019 will have a lot of options. Which is why we can determine that Brissett won't have a high trade value. 

 

And yes, Drew Lock is better than Jacoby Brissett, and has more upside. Washington would much rather draft Drew Lock -- if he's even still there at #15 -- than trade out for a chance at Jacoby Brissett, a former third round pick who has obvious limitations as a passer. Same is true for every other team in the NFL. 

 

I don't necessarily agree about "a lot" of options. Foles is a legit option...but Flacco is older, expensive and hasn't been good for a long time. Bridgewater and Taylor aren't legit options for a teams looking for a long-term solution. At least Brissett has upside.

 

As for the rookie class...it's nothing special. Teams will surely roll the dice, as they always do...because those teams are desperate for a long-term solution at QB. But that's also why a team out there would give up a Day Two pick for Brissett.

 

I am shooting for a 2nd round pick if I am Ballard...but settling for a 3rd round pick. I think he can get that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CR91]

35 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

No he hasn't. Walker isn't good. The reason the Colts are able to keep signing him is because no one else is even remotely interested.

 

Even if the Colts did move Brissett this year, it wouldn't be because they think Walker is capable of backing up Luck. They'd definitely add a better backup. 

 

Im sure there are options for backup QBs like bridgewater. Walker was just one option.

[CR91]

38 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

So you don't think any of us have a good idea about Brissett's trade value, so let's just make one up, right?

 

Teams that are desperate for a QB in 2019 will have a lot of options. Which is why we can determine that Brissett won't have a high trade value. 

 

And yes, Drew Lock is better than Jacoby Brissett, and has more upside. Washington would much rather draft Drew Lock -- if he's even still there at #15 -- than trade out for a chance at Jacoby Brissett, a former third round pick who has obvious limitations as a passer. Same is true for every other team in the NFL. 

 

I just don't think a 4th is his value. I think hes better then a lot of the QBs hitting the market and this QB class. We should take advantage of that.

[2006Coltsbestever]

I would keep Brissett. He is arguably the best backup QB in the league unless people consider Foles a backup  . Foles could start for several teams in the league (he really isn't a true backup IMO), not sure Brissett could. Brissett is still on a cheap contract and a security blanket just in case Luck does get injured and has to miss a game or 2. 

[Superman]

7 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

 

I don't necessarily agree about "a lot" of options. Foles is a legit option...but Flacco is older, expensive and hasn't been good for a long time. Bridgewater and Taylor aren't legit options for a teams looking for a long-term solution. At least Brissett has upside.

 

As for the rookie class...it's nothing special. Teams will surely roll the dice, as they always do...because those teams are desperate for a long-term solution at QB. But that's also why a team out there would give up a Day Two pick for Brissett.

 

I am shooting for a 2nd round pick if I am Ballard...but settling for a 3rd round pick. I think he can get that.

 

Bridgewater, Taylor and Foles are likely to be FAs. I think teams would rather sign one of those three for something like the $6m Bridgewater got last year, than give up a 3rd for Brissett. 

 

The Saints gave up a 3rd and got back a 6th for Bridgewater. He has a history as a starter that is better than Brissett's history as a starter, and he's only a year older. I think he has more upside than Brissett. 

 

The Ravens will be glad to get a bag of chips for Flacco. He'll be available for less than a 3rd or 4th.

 

And I don't know whether the draft class is special, but I think we agree that a team isn't going to move down from #15 and pass on drafting a QB so they can acquire one year of Jacoby Brissett. 

[Superman]

15 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

I just don't think a 4th is his value. I think hes better then a lot of the QBs hitting the market and this QB class. We should take advantage of that.

 

And I think Colts fans overrate him so they can talk themselves into believing he has a high trade value. 

[austriancolt]

Nice discussion but what you forget is thaht Brissett is in his last year he will be gone after this year anyway and if Luck is injured we are screwed no matter who is the backup. Trading Brissett for a decent pick makes sense if we can land a hit like Leonard.

[CR91]

16 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

And I think Colts fans overrate him so they can talk themselves into believing he has a high trade value. 

 

Im not overrating him. Im just trying to get something better then a 4th round comp pick

[UKColt13]

10 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

Colts seem to be a fan of phillip Walker. They keep bringing him back

 

It’s nice to have a QB like Walker available to have the defenders be able to prepare for a true mobile QB. Luck and Brissett can’t truly mimic that trait he has. I’d say his mobility makes him more valuable as a PS guy than his overall talent to be a backup.

[boo2202]

Jacoby has some trade value, the question is what is his value? There were many reports before and during the season on teams being interested in him. I would think that Ballard received some calls this past year. Ballard coming out and saying a deal would have to blow him away, is a smoke screen. He’s stating that just to get calls and gauge other teams interest and see what offers he might receive. There’s a few teams that would be willing to take a chance on a player that has a 800k cap hit this season than some of the older vets on the market. But I think the most we get is a 2nd. A 3rd is more likely. 

[richard pallo]

6 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

Im not overrating him. Im just trying to get something better then a 4th round comp pick

Trying to peg his worth as a 4th. rd. comp pick makes no sense.  We really have no choice but to let him walk next year.  He's not going to want to sit behind Luck.  This is the year to move him.  According to Ballard and Irsay we had a couple of offers last year.  Just not good enough.  And now Smith is out for a year.  This years incoming class is nothing special according to the experts.  There is a lot of film on Brissett playing at an NFL level and playing well on a bad team. That is going in Brissetts favor and will increase his chances on being traded this year. 

[MPStack]

33 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

  There is a lot of film on Brissett playing at an NFL level and playing well on a bad team. That is going in Brissetts favor and will increase his chances on being traded this year. 

 

I think a lot folk have creatively painted this picture of Brissett being better than what he is.

 

Just, because he came in knowing a limited amount of the playbook and got sacked a bunch, doesn’t mean he’s a starter and worth a lot in a trade. 

 

You think Brissett is the only QB, who could’ve done that? No, there’s plenty. 

 

Brissett’s numbers are below Bridgewater’s, who was obtained for a 3rd. 

 

I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see the value others see in Brissett.