Andrew Luck partial shoulder subluxation (Merged)

[crazycolt1]

Fire Grigson cause Grigson hired Pep and forced him on Pag. Pep is a horrible OC. He is part reason Luck holds onto the ball so long with his stupid throw deep ball plays. There is nothing wrong with going deep. But if your oline is getting your qb killed you need to hit the short fast stuff like we did with MH and Luck in the 4th against Tenn.

So let me get this correct. A team should fire the GM for a bad coaching hire? If that is the case there would be a lot of GMs out of a job. You do not fire the GM. You just hire another coach. And how do you know exactly who forced who? The only thing you base your comment on is hearsay.

[ColtsBlueFL]

for what it's worth Pagano said today he hadn't heard that and it's just a sore shoulder. With that Pagano never said it wasn't this. I also heard someone else say a bruise would be consentent with this form of injury. So everyone might very well be right here and be being honest. Just to different levels of it.

 

Well it is possible the doctors didn't really tell Pagano the 'real' injury, but a typical 'bruised' shoulder is called a contusion. Nowhere has that term been tossed around.  A shoulder popping out of socket is referred to as a dislocation. No where has that term been thrown around.  slight separation, and subluxation have been. Those are associated with AC (Acromioclavicular) joint injuries. As is dislocation, at times. There are 6 grades of injury, where type I being least and VI being the greatest. A Type I or Type II is slight or minimal separation, but is also very painful and would keep an NFL QB from playing.  As painful as a contusion can be, I don't think that would keep an NFL QB on the sidelines.  Besides, I'll wager Pagano knows as much about medical issues as Bill Belichick knows about the science of footballs and the Ideal Gas Law.

[Colts_Fan12]

Cool so we are gonna throw luck out there with our god awful line and allow the best damn defensive player in the NFL to rip him apart. so we can try and win this crap division just to get blown out in the playoffs.

Really hate this FO and coaching staff...

[crazycolt1]

Cool so we are gonna throw luck out there with our god awful line and allow the best damn defensive player in the NFL to rip him apart. so we can try and win this crap division just to get blown out in the playoffs.

Really hate this FO and coaching staff...

I really need to borrow your crystal ball. I can use a little help with the lottery this week. So let all the Colts nation know exactly what a terrible job the FO had done over the last three seasons. We all know what a great team the Colts were before the FO took over.

[Bowlingguy300]

No way we have 3, 11 win seasons without luck, does he hold on to the ball and try and make something happen? of course he does. and that is why we came back and won so many games when we show up unprepared and out coached the last few years. I am just amazed that this is the first time he has been hurt like this getting hit more then any other QB out there game after game and year after year.  Pagano, Pep and And Grigson have to go. I think Pep should go immediately no waiting. hate letting go if a head coach, but it is on Pagano no getting this team ready week in and week out. he has kept his job because of Lucks success and his cancer.  he is an amazing man, but a bad coach.

[Bowlingguy300]

No way we have 3, 11 win seasons without luck, does he hold on to the ball and try and make something happen? of course he does. and that is why we came back and won so many games when we show up unprepared and out coached the last few years. I am just amazed that this is the first time he has been hurt like this getting hit more then any other QB out there game after game and year after year.  Pagano, Pep and And Grigson have to go. I think Pep should go immediately no waiting. hate letting go if a head coach, but it is on Pagano no getting this team ready week in and week out. he has kept his job because of Lucks success and his cancer.  he is an amazing man, but a bad coach.

 

[Defjamz26]

Cool so we are gonna throw luck out there with our god awful line and allow the best damn defensive player in the NFL to rip him apart. so we can try and win this crap division just to get blown out in the playoffs.

Really hate this FO and coaching staff...

My thoughts exactly. I don't get the people saying they hope he plays on Thursday. I don't think winning is more important than the QBs health. No one should be looking forward to Luck starting. If there was ever a time for Irsay to step in and intervene, now would be the time.

[jvan1973]

My thoughts exactly. I don't get the people saying they hope he plays on Thursday. I don't think winning is more important than the QBs health. No one should be looking forward to Luck starting. If there was ever a time for Irsay to step in and intervene, now would be the time.

If the doctors don't think he can go he won't. If he is healthy, there is no reason to sit him.

[AllYouNeedIsLuck]

My thoughts exactly. I don't get the people saying they hope he plays on Thursday. I don't think winning is more important than the QBs health. No one should be looking forward to Luck starting. If there was ever a time for Irsay to step in and intervene, now would be the time.

If he's fine, he'll play. If not, he won't. Simple as that. The doctors know best

[Colts_Fan12]

I really need to borrow your crystal ball. I can use a little help with the lottery this week. So let all the Colts nation know exactly what a terrible job the FO had done over the last three seasons. We all know what a great team the Colts were before the FO took over.

we are building this damn team the same as the naming years * poor O line average D and a ton of weapons on offense

[crazycolt1]

we are building this damn team the same as the naming years * poor O line average D and a ton of weapons on offense

Really? I seem to think the defense has been built a little more than the offense. So a championship team is built in three seasons? OK, If you think so. Please let all the owners and GMs in the NFL your thoughts on how things need to be done. Also for your information the FO office has not even come close as to what the former FO has done. Has this FO experimented with free agents like the former? Has this FO put the Colts in cap room hades? Does this FO have the same mind set of the former in the sense that the old mentality is the way it's going to be no matter? No, I think your negative mentality has to be clouding your capabilities to see a difference. Just some food for thought. Right now the Colts have the same or better record as 23 other teams in the NFL. So maybe the crystal glass ball you are looking at is half full and not as empty as you think.

[Colts_Fan12]

Really? I seem to think the defense has been built a little more than the offense. So a championship team is built in three seasons? OK, If you think so. Please let all the owners and GMs in the NFL your thoughts on how things need to be done. Also for your information the FO office has not even come close as to what the former FO has done. Has this FO experimented with free agents like the former? Has this FO put the Colts in cap room hades? Does this FO have the same mind set of the former in the sense that the old mentality is the way it's going to be no matter? No, I think your negative mentality has to be clouding your capabilities to see a difference. Just some food for thought. Right now the Colts have the same or better record as 23 other teams in the NFL. So maybe the crystal glass ball you are looking at is half full and not as empty as you think.

I know they are perfect and do no wrong in your eyes. all of us that you preach the same crap to get it. cool story bro move on

[Defjamz26]

If the doctors don't think he can go he won't. If he is healthy, there is no reason to sit him.

So you risk re-injuring him? From the looks of all the posts that have been posted about the details of the type of injury, it doesn't seem like he'll be 100%.

It's not smart to start a 75% Luck on a short week with the same O-line. Starting Luck just to win a game is incredibly selfish and short sighted.

[Warhorse]

If the doctors don't think he can go he won't. If he is healthy, there is no reason to sit him.

There you go, being all logical and stuff. What if I want to just spew emotion and blame someone? Look....I listened to the pundits who said we were going to be all that. I bought in. Now that we are 2-2, someone HAS to be blamed. I mean what do want me to do? Support my team? Whatever.....

 

[Warhorse]

So you risk re-injuring him? From the looks of all the posts that have been posted about the details of the type of injury, it doesn't seem like he'll be 100%.

It's not smart to start a 75% Luck on a short week with the same O-line. Starting Luck just to win a game is incredibly selfish and short sighted.

As a bystander, I don't see where Jvan said anything about wanting to risk the Colts QB. If I was to throw a guess into this discussion, I would reckon that there are likely no decisions made by this franchise more scrutinized and "eggshell" sensitive, than Andrew Lucks health. If he is not at risk of furthering damage because of the previous injury, he will play...that simple

[SkyBane]

So you risk re-injuring him? From the looks of all the posts that have been posted about the details of the type of injury, it doesn't seem like he'll be 100%.

It's not smart to start a 75% Luck on a short week with the same O-line. Starting Luck just to win a game is incredibly selfish and short sighted.

First off, it's not a short week for Luck, it's a long one. Secondly, it's football, nobody is ever 100%. At a certain point, players gotta play.

[Colts_Fan12]

First off, it's not a short week for Luck, it's a long one. Secondly, it's football, nobody is ever 100%. At a certain point, players gotta play.

but for what why take the risk? So we can try and win the division just to get owned by the real teams in the AFC

[crazycolt1]

I know they are perfect and do no wrong in your eyes. all of us that you preach the same crap to get it. cool story bro move on

If that is what your reading comprehension told you I guess you might need some lessons on that subject and what it means. It really makes no difference because of your none stop negative attitude and wouldn't make a difference to you one way or another. So stay in your negative frame of mind and keep the negative thoughts alive. There are always two sides of the coin but in your mind there is no coin.

[crazycolt1]

So you risk re-injuring him? From the looks of all the posts that have been posted about the details of the type of injury, it doesn't seem like he'll be 100%.

It's not smart to start a 75% Luck on a short week with the same O-line. Starting Luck just to win a game is incredibly selfish and short sighted.

 Looking at all the post and not realizing these post are not made by the doctors who are treating Luck. NFL requires the team to put out injury reports, that is all. By law a persons medical condition can't be made public and discussed by anyone. That is why the terms doubtful, probable, questionable and out are used in football medical terms. I am confident that Lucks health is the top priority in Irsay's, Grigson's and Pagano's mind. Ay this point there is no one who knows the severity of Lucks injury except Luck, the doctors and the front office. All these other opinions and speculations mean zero.

[SkyBane]

but for what why take the risk? So we can try and win the division just to get owned by the real teams in the AFC

This line of thinking has been rampant lately and needs to stop. The NFL made 4 divisions per conference and made the winner of each division matter.

The Colts didn't choose their division, but the most important goal of every team in every regular season is win the division. Unless you are actively suggesting tanking, then yeah, the very idea would be to do everything possible to win the division.

The Titans, at least, appear to be getting better, so this excuse won't last for much longer anyways.

[Defjamz26]

First off, it's not a short week for Luck, it's a long one. Secondly, it's football, nobody is ever 100%. At a certain point, players gotta play.

I actually said that exact same thing in regards to Dwayne Allen a few months ago. You just can't apply to the franchise QB, especially when the injury in question is his throwing shoulder.

Play through a sore back? Sure. Sore Ribs? Get the new flak jackets all the QBs are getting and get out there? Play with a partially torn shoulder that could become chronic if re-aggravated? Nah, doesn't sound smart for the long term, and here's why:

1. If his throwing arm isn't at 100%, his accuracy and velocity is likely to suffer which could cost the team

2. This is an offense where regardless of what the game plan is, he ends up throwing a lot. That alone could aggravate the injury. Don't give me "we'll just make him throw less", it never happens.

3. Nothing with the OL has changed, and even so you can't predict when a QB will get hit. Even with the best OL you can't completely prevent hits. Basically, re-injury is likely given the position he plays .

I think the Colts need to just sit him, and then do the dye injection procedure to see how bad the labrum is and if he'll need surgery. Better safe than sorry. Regardless of what the doctors say. Because if he's good to go they'll clear him, and if he's not then they won't. That's their job. It isn't their job to advise them what the best option would be.

[Restored]

So is it on Grigson for the hits that Luck brings upon himself by holding the ball to long and or running like he was a running back? He also has a pretty slow delivery.   I do understand that the O-line needs work but a lot of those hits are caused by Luck himself.

 

The fact that you are trying to make it seem like it's Luck's fault that he got hurt is baffling to me. He's clearly taken the most amount of hits and sacks since he's come into the league and everyone and their mother knows that the Colts offensive line is medicore on its best day. If you want to live in denial of that, that's on you.

 

 

So let me get this correct. A team should fire the GM for a bad coaching hire? If that is the case there would be a lot of GMs out of a job. You do not fire the GM. You just hire another coach. And how do you know exactly who forced who? The only thing you base your comment on is hearsay.

 

So your solution is to repeat the same failed process over and over again.

[jvan1973]

So you risk re-injuring him? From the looks of all the posts that have been posted about the details of the type of injury, it doesn't seem like he'll be 100%.

It's not smart to start a 75% Luck on a short week with the same O-line. Starting Luck just to win a game is incredibly selfish and short sighted.

You must have missed the part where I said if the doctors deem him healthy to play. They aren't going to let him play at 75%. All reports at this point are simply speculating to what the injury is.

[crazycolt1]

 

The fact that you are trying to make it seem like it's Luck's fault that he got hurt is baffling to me. He's clearly taken the most amount of hits and sacks since he's come into the league and everyone and their mother knows that the Colts offensive line is medicore on its best day. If you want to live in denial of that, that's on you.

 

 

 

So your solution is to repeat the same failed process over and over again.

 

Is that what I said? If you would re read my comment it is pretty self explanatory. But if you think different that is on you. As of right now I think there is more money spent on the defense. Might check with Superman on that? Grigson does not run this team the same way as Polian did and if you cant see that I am sorry to inform you that you need glasses. Has Grigson hit on all his moves? No. But it's not from the lack of trying. The moves he has hit with a few have been very good. The Colts are a work in progress and there will be ups and downs. That is no different than any other NFL team that has started basically from scratch. You say fire some of the coaches and GM? The other side of the coin is be careful what you wish for because believe me it could be a lot worse. A championship team is not put together in three season when you start with a whole new team. Common sense will tell you that. Without a block buster trade there has never been a team that has done as well as the Colts have in three seasons and if you expect more your expectations are too high. This team has over achieved the last three seasons and now that the Colts have hit a low spot you want changes? IMO there will be no changes this season and you can whine, cry, wish, cuss and anything else you care to do but it's not happening.

[Restored]

Is that what I said? If you would re read my comment it is pretty self explanatory. But if you think different that is on you. As of right now I think there is more money spent on the defense. Might check with Superman on that? Grigson does not run this team the same way as Polian did and if you cant see that I am sorry to inform you that you need glasses. Has Grigson hit on all his moves? No. But it's not from the lack of trying. The moves he has hit with a few have been very good. The Colts are a work in progress and there will be ups and downs. That is no different than any other NFL team that has started basically from scratch. You say fire some of the coaches and GM? The other side of the coin is be careful what you wish for because believe me it could be a lot worse. A championship team is not put together in three season when you start with a whole new team. Common sense will tell you that. Without a block buster trade there has never been a team that has done as well as the Colts have in three seasons and if you expect more your expectations are too high. This team has over achieved the last three seasons and now that the Colts have hit a low spot you want changes? IMO there will be no changes this season and you can whine, cry, wish, cuss and anything else you care to do but it's not happening.

 

There's a difference between putting band-aids on a problem that has clearly need surgery. He has only spent one 1-2nd round draft picks on an offensive linemen and its ironically turned out to be his best in Jack Mewhort. You and others seem to think by going out and overspending on mediocre to bad players that it means Grigson is trying.

 

It's really simple. By your logic, the value of Grigson spending 10 pennies compared to 1 quarter makes you believe he's tried very hard to get good players because he's put those 10 pennies down. Unfortunately, those 10 pennies are not worth the 1 quarter that Grigson should be putting in to get good players. Spend a first round pick on an offensive linemen and you might be surprised by what you get.

 

This team has overachieved the last 3 seasons despite not having much talent. Tell me, with all this money Grigson has spent on the defense, name a player outside of Vontae Davis that is truly a game-changer? Don't count Mathis either considering Grigson didn't even draft him. I'll wait.

[DougDew]

He has only spent one 1-2nd round draft picks on an offensive linemen and its ironically turned out to be his best in Jack Mewhort. You and others seem to think by going out and overspending on mediocre to bad players that it means Grigson is trying.

 

It's really simple. By your logic, the value of Grigson spending 10 pennies compared to 1 quarter makes you believe he's tried very hard to get good players because he's put those 10 pennies down. Unfortunately, those 10 pennies are not worth the 1 quarter that Grigson should be putting in to get good players. Spend a first round pick on an offensive linemen and you might be surprised by what you get.

 

This team has overachieved the last 3 seasons despite not having much talent. Tell me, with all this money Grigson has spent on the defense, name a player outside of Vontae Davis that is truly a game-changer? Don't count Mathis either considering Grigson didn't even draft him. I'll wait.

Just for the record, Grigson didn't need to spend a 1st on a LT, since AC was already here, but he did just sign him to 1st round free agent money.  Grigs spent a 3rd on a G and a 4th on a C, which is where those positions have their value.  Only Dallas, Miami, and Pitt spent firsts on Centers, (Frederick Pouncy and Pouncy) and 2 of those 3 QBs are out with injuries. 

 

That's a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th, on the OL, and you want to fire him because the 3rd and 4th weren't at least a 2nd and 2nd?  Okay then....

[Colts_Fan12]

There's a difference between putting band-aids on a problem that has clearly need surgery. He has only spent one 1-2nd round draft picks on an offensive linemen and its ironically turned out to be his best in Jack Mewhort. You and others seem to think by going out and overspending on mediocre to bad players that it means Grigson is trying.

It's really simple. By your logic, the value of Grigson spending 10 pennies compared to 1 quarter makes you believe he's tried very hard to get good players because he's put those 10 pennies down. Unfortunately, those 10 pennies are not worth the 1 quarter that Grigson should be putting in to get good players. Spend a first round pick on an offensive linemen and you might be surprised by what you get.

This team has overachieved the last 3 seasons despite not having much talent. Tell me, with all this money Grigson has spent on the defense, name a player outside of Vontae Davis that is truly a game-changer? Don't count Mathis either considering Grigson didn't even draft him. I'll wait.

totally agree! sure he got Anderson this past draft and he looks good but besides him and vontae the rest are just average or bad players

[Colts_Fan12]

This line of thinking has been rampant lately and needs to stop. The NFL made 4 divisions per conference and made the winner of each division matter.

The Colts didn't choose their division, but the most important goal of every team in every regular season is win the division. Unless you are actively suggesting tanking, then yeah, the very idea would be to do everything possible to win the division.

The Titans, at least, appear to be getting better, so this excuse won't last for much longer anyways.

sorry id rather get a good pick we win the division we will most likely get an early playoff exit and will be stuck picking at 21st this team is in desperate need of talent

[csmopar]

So question, is this sublaxtion thing been confirmed or is this just per "sources" still off of a twitter?

[tfunky14]

whats today's practice schedule?

[csmopar]

sorry id rather get a good pick we win the division we will most likely get an early playoff exit and will be stuck picking at 21st this team is in desperate need of talent

high picks dont always work out......

[Colts_Fan12]

high picks dont always work out......

true just a higher chance of getting a game changer

[csmopar]

true just a higher chance of getting a game changer

perehaps, i mean i get what you're saying about sitting Luck and I agree, im thinking sit him this week, gives him plenty of rest for the 18th, where we WILL need him

[JPFolks]

So there's a chance it can be a recurring injury? Like any time he takes a tough hit, he could re-aggravate it?

 Yeah, to me this sounds worse than an ACL tear which can heal and never be a problem again.  Sure, you miss a season but it usually doesn't cost you a career.  Now if this turns into missing extended time and in fact means he's a high risk of recurrence and being done for a career.... what does that mean for his big upcoming contract? What a disaster this is.  Even if he plays Thursday. now every single time he is touched (or like an * tries to make a tackle) we'll be waiting to see if he can continue on a level we've never had to do in Indy.  

[Colts_Fan12]

perehaps, i mean i get what you're saying about sitting Luck and I agree, im thinking sit him this week, gives him plenty of rest for the 18th, where we WILL need him

that's for sure we have zero chance of beating the pats without him

[JPFolks]

high picks dont always work out......

Well, it's not just one chance, every single round you get a better player than you would have otherwise.  With the rampant injuries on our Defense, it is starting to look like a lost season, something we're not very used to in Indy but perhaps we're falling back to the pack and reality finally.  Sad. 

[csmopar]

 Yeah, to me this sounds worse than an ACL tear which can heal and never be a problem again.  Sure, you miss a season but it usually doesn't cost you a career.  Now if this turns into missing extended time and in fact means he's a high risk of recurrence and being done for a career.... what does that mean for his big upcoming contract? What a disaster this is.  Even if he plays Thursday. now every single time he is touched (or like an * tries to make a tackle) we'll be waiting to see if he can continue on a level we've never had to do in Indy.  

Well, like ive been asking....this is all based off of ONE twitter post, from an unnamed and thus unconfirmed "source".  Until we hear the Colts confirm it, or Luck confirms it, let's not completely panick

[JPFolks]

Well, like ive been asking....this is all based off of ONE twitter post, from an unnamed and thus unconfirmed "source".  Until we hear the Colts confirm it, or Luck confirms it, 

Is the guy who made the tweet a reliable source? I don't know who he is?

[Defjamz26]

Is the guy who made the tweet a reliable source? I don't know who he is?

Well there's an article about it on Bleacher report too and you can't make the stuff they're saying up based on no facts. It's too specific to be just "chatter"

[Defjamz26]

that's for sure we have zero chance of beating the pats without him

Not much of a chance of beating him with Luck this season with the way we've been playing.

But I don't think anyone really cares about winning games at this point. I'm more concerned about the health of the Franchise QB