DeflateGate: Brady suspension expected (mega merge / updated)

[ColtsBlueFL]

Posted Today, 07:57 AM

amfootball, on 08 May 2015 - 05:51 AM, said:

The report says nothing about Brady in relation to the AFCCG. Nothing. There are no texts, no conversations, nothing. All they have is a ball boy ducking into a bathroom. The texts they do have is from the Jets game when Brady angrily told his guys to make sure the refs don't inflate to 16 psi and then you have the ball boy calling himself the deflator. You have the psi measurements prior to the game that were not written down but going off of memory and Anderson "thinks" he used the same gauge for all the balls. Then two separate measurements at halftime with varying psi levels and the science part not able to be completely refuted either. I don't know about you but I think a mediator would have a field day with this.

 

So you think that a ball boy ducking into a bathroom to deflate footballs was done without any knowledge or direction from Brady...wow.

 

Well, Mark Brunnell, a starting QB of 151 games in the NFL, totally agrees with her.  Oh.... wait.....   Nevermind.  My bad.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xb5x0pfE6uY

[ColtsBlueFL]

   Wrong there are Rules in football - And laws about drunk driving for instance if Aaron Hernandez had only violated a NFL rule he would'nt be in orange .  The 2 are nothing alike ..

 

Getting caught drunk is serious twice in 5 years is a felony . Terrible comparison IMO only a drunk could believe this .

 

I 'v been sober 25 years I had friends who would wake up in the driveway with a cooler of beer & they did'nt know if they had just arrived or were just leaving .

 

With a drunk behind the wheel of a 2000 pound weapon people can & do die all across this country a life is not a game & should never be used

 

Drunk driving laws save lives its for the greater good - Deflated balls don't drive down the road & if you throw one it won't hurt you .

 

He agrees with you.  You must have missed the sarcasm emoticon.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

At the end of the day the report was not CONCLUSIVE.

 

 

Your correct it was probable the threshold needed to met out punishments .

 

I realize Patriots fans heads barely rise out of the sand so dust off grab a q-tip  so at least your up to speed if you would like to debate bring it on ...

 

Just understand you don't need to yell conclusive it has no bearing & is just your way to muddy the waters .

 

Do you believe Tom Brady has told the truth concerning this issue ?

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

He agrees with you.  You must have missed the sarcasm emoticon.

 

Thank You I did but it did'nt register . 

[wig]

Great interview here from Brady's agent on the report, Brady's testimony and why he did not hand over his phone. After listening to this, there is no doubt the league will have a dog fight on their hands with this report regardless of punishment, http://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2015/05/08/ac-intv-tom-brady-attorney-don-yee.cnn

 

Yeah, no.  Not cooperating with a league investigation is against the rules and considered detrimental to the league.  Nothing a lawyer says changes that.

 

It's coming.  Probably today,  maybe Monday.

 

Yeah, probably this afternoon.  NFL likes releasing these things on Fridays because it cuts down on the media coverage.

 

My gosh. I have answered over and over. Yes, I think so. My whole point in his has been the report itself and it lacks to prove anything in regards to the AFCCG. Not sure how you can punish when there is zippo other than an attendant taking a pee. Those psi measurements pre game were based on memory and then the two different sets at halftime with only 4 Colts being gauged. This was a botch job and a half. Brady and the Pats have a real case to fight this tooth and nail and I expect they will pending what the league says.

 

It proves that the footballs were deflated, Brady thought doing that was worth the ball he passed for 50,000 yards with, and Brady had enough incriminating evidence on his phone that he refused to let anyone see it.  He's getting hammered.  Deal with it.

[corgi]

   Wrong there are Rules in football - And laws about drunk driving for instance if Aaron Hernandez had only violated a NFL rule he would'nt be in orange .  The 2 are nothing alike ..

 

Terrible comparison IMO only a drunk could believe this .

 

It was an extreme example (on purpose) to show the insane depths to which some will go to defend Brady. One is most definately worse.

[lollygagger8]

Wow, as if there was any respect to lose from this chump. What's sad is that the cheater's fans are in as much denial as he is. 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/07/us/nfl-deflategate-report/

 

But when Brady was asked to comment on the "Deflategate" scandal and the recently released report that said it was likely he knew New England Patriots staffers were altering footballs outside NFL rules, the four-time Super Bowl winner dodged.

"I don't have really any reaction," he told sports reporter Jim Gray, who asked Brady a few questions before the Patriots' star quarterback spoke at Salem State University in Massachusetts.

"Our owner commented on it yesterday. It's only been 30 hours so I haven't had much time to digest it fully but when I do I'll be sure to let you know how I feel about it," he said to loud cheers.

He added he hopes he will be able to address the issue more fully soon.

"There's still a (NFL disciplinary) process that's going forth right now, and I'm involved in that process, whenever it happens it happens, and I'll certainly want to be very comfortable in how I feel about the statements that I make," he told Gray, who asked Brady a series of questions before the quarterback spoke to 4,000 people, many of whom chanted "M-V-P! M-V-P" before the program began.

Brady said the controversy has "absolutely not" detracted from the joy of winning the Super Bowl, and said he's thankful for the support of his teammates and family.

"We'll get through it," he said.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

It was an extreme example (on purpose) to show the insane depths to which some will go to defend Brady. One is most definately worse.

 

I apologize   I was just thinking the best way PM or this I thought this was best .

 

I'm a caveman & sometimes not the sharpest pencil but I realize when I'm wrong .

 

I sincerely hope that you will except my apology .

[PeterBowman]

given what is transpiring and how far back this is going, how much of a revolt would be there around the league if there is just a slap on the wrist given to them?

[PrincetonTiger]

I love how TB's agent has said the Colts worked with the NFL to perform a sting

I guess to 30+ point loss was part of the plan

[PrincetonTiger]

given what is transpiring and how far back this is going, how much of a revolt would be there around the league if there is just a slap on the wrist given to them?

Extreme

[OffensivelyPC]

Those who read it for what it is ~  "get it"

 

Those who don't want to read it for what it is ~  Never will.

I don't get what's so bad or hard about just owning up to it.  I mean, even if it Brady was just like, "Look, I like underinflated balls.  I underestimated how serious a violation this was.  It won't happen again," we wouldn't be discussing this as much as we are.  But instead, he lied and assisted in the cover up, and was not very cooperative with the investigation.  To me, the inflation of the footballs is not that big a deal.  I mean, if you get busted breaking the rules, you should be punished.  It's worth adding that, according to Polian on Mike and Mike today, it is a very serious infraction, worse than Atlanta or Cleveland's recent transgressions.  But what I have a serious problem with was that (and why Polian said it was such a serious infraction is), in order to get the footballs to the deflated levels, the Patriots staff had to take the footballs into a locked bathroom in order to deflate them.  If it wasn't a big deal

 

 

Posted Today, 07:57 AM

amfootball, on 08 May 2015 - 05:51 AM, said:

 

 

Well, Mark Brunnell, a starting QB of 151 games in the NFL, totally agrees with her.  Oh.... wait.....   Nevermind.  My bad.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xb5x0pfE6uY

 

To me, the inflation of the footballs is not that big a deal.  I mean, if you get busted breaking the rules, you should be punished.  And on some level, perhaps I don't understand the seriousness of the infraction.  I'm not a QB in the National Football League.  But for people such as Brunnell, it is much more serious - and this is a guy who did play in the NFL with longevity.  It's worth adding that, according to Polian on Mike and Mike today, it is a very serious infraction, worse than Atlanta or Cleveland's recent transgressions.  

 

But what I have a serious problem with was that (and why Polian said it was such a serious infraction is), in order to get the footballs to the deflated levels, the Patriots staff had to take the footballs into a locked bathroom in order to deflate them.  If it wasn't a big deal, they would have done it in plain sight.  The Panthers and  Vikings were "altering" footballs in plain view.  They were told to stop and did.  Teh Patriots on the other hand, had to abscond with the balls and alter them without anyone else's knowledge.  Had they done it in plain sight and the refs found them doing it, they would have responded the same way as they did in the Vikings/Panthers game, reinflated the footballs and there's no problem.  At worst, the Pats would have gotten a reprimand - verbal warning similar to how they reacted to McNally's 2004 flop with trying to introduce practice balls.

 

And that doesn't even touch on the cover up after the fact.  I think any Patriot fan who thinks the NFL will go light on the Patriots is just wishful thinking.  I find it even more contentious when someone says that this report was so one sided that Wells and/or the NFL has it out for the Patriots.  This is horrible for the NFL.  One of it's most beloved players and a certain first ballot HOF'er was found to have broken the rules, lied about it, tried to cover it up, and then was uncooperative with investigators.  The NFL doesn't want this - why would it?  Competition depends on fairness and an equal playing field.  The second you put that in question, the competition loses everything.  It's one of the reasons why I don't follow basketball like I used to with the referees admitting throwing games.  PED's are a problem, too.  But there is testing for that, so at least the NFL does what it can to uncover it.  Guys get suspended all the time for it, including our own Robert Mathis.  There's at least a way to discover it.  But it's more difficult to discover violations of this sort, and when it is, you change the rules accordingly so it doesn't happen again.  I fully believe the NFL will do just that.

[dw49]

Just finished watching Tom Brady on ESPN with Jim Gray interview at Salem State University about 50 miles from Foxboro.

The take I got was : Not once did he deny any wrongdoing. Not once did he state he was innocent. Not once did he tell the packed overwhelming pro-Brady fan base at Salem he was not involved. He stated he wants to wait for the "right venue".

To me, if a man is innocent, he's screaming at the top of his lungs to verify that to whom ever will listen. He had a huge chance to do that this evening and declined. That is not someone who claims to be innocent. Sorry, Pats fans. And I mean that sincerely and with sadness in my words here.

 

 

He didn't even try to hint that he was innocent. I give him a little credit that he's letting his dad , Kraft and some of the talking heads ale *s out of themselves instead of him. I guess they really aren't lying ( Kraft is lying) as there are no doubt not very bright.

[ColtRider]

Just heard Don Yee on Mike & Mike/ESPN. Bottom line - Brady's innocent. (Of course he is)n't. He will "more probable than not" fight if punishment is doled out. And, sounds like he's gonna throw these guys who underflated the balls under the bus.

What class.

What leadership.

What a role model.

What a ****bag!

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

given what is transpiring and how far back this is going, how much of a revolt would be there around the league if there is just a slap on the wrist given to them?

 

Its probable that is why this was such a lengthy investigation . The Patriots & there fans are unable to come to grips with the reality of the situation .

 

The flip side of there weak arguments is had Peyton Manning & the Colts acted over a decade as the Patriots there heads would explode collectively ..

 

There fanaticism is off the charts & blinds there common sense .

[krunk]

I'm hoping they don't punish him too hard.  I want him to be around for the Colts vs Pats matchup for sure.

I want them to have all their boys available. 

[PrincetonTiger]

Just heard Don Yee on Mike & Mike/ESPN. Bottom line - Brady's innocent. (Of course he is)n't. He will "more probably than not" fight if punishment is doled out. And, sounds like he's gonna throw these guys who underflated the balls under the bus.

What class.

What leadership.

What a role model.

What a ****bag!

Wow

[dw49]

I don't get what's so bad or hard about just owning up to it.  I mean, even if it Brady was just like, "Look, I like underinflated balls.  I underestimated how serious a violation this was.  It won't happen again," we wouldn't be discussing this as much as we are.  But instead, he lied and assisted in the cover up, and was not very cooperative with the investigation.  To me, the inflation of the footballs is not that big a deal.  I mean, if you get busted breaking the rules, you should be punished.  It's worth adding that, according to Polian on Mike and Mike today, it is a very serious infraction, worse than Atlanta or Cleveland's recent transgressions.  But what I have a serious problem with was that (and why Polian said it was such a serious infraction is), in order to get the footballs to the deflated levels, the Patriots staff had to take the footballs into a locked bathroom in order to deflate them.  If it wasn't a big deal

 

To me, the inflation of the footballs is not that big a deal.  I mean, if you get busted breaking the rules, you should be punished.  And on some level, perhaps I don't understand the seriousness of the infraction.  I'm not a QB in the National Football League.  But for people such as Brunnell, it is much more serious - and this is a guy who did play in the NFL with longevity.  It's worth adding that, according to Polian on Mike and Mike today, it is a very serious infraction, worse than Atlanta or Cleveland's recent transgressions.  

 

But what I have a serious problem with was that (and why Polian said it was such a serious infraction is), in order to get the footballs to the deflated levels, the Patriots staff had to take the footballs into a locked bathroom in order to deflate them.  If it wasn't a big deal, they would have done it in plain sight.  The Panthers and  Vikings were "altering" footballs in plain view.  They were told to stop and did.  Teh Patriots on the other hand, had to abscond with the balls and alter them without anyone else's knowledge.  Had they done it in plain sight and the refs found them doing it, they would have responded the same way as they did in the Vikings/Panthers game, reinflated the footballs and there's no problem.  At worst, the Pats would have gotten a reprimand - verbal warning similar to how they reacted to McNally's 2004 flop with trying to introduce practice balls.

 

And that doesn't even touch on the cover up after the fact.  I think any Patriot fan who thinks the NFL will go light on the Patriots is just wishful thinking.  I find it even more contentious when someone says that this report was so one sided that Wells and/or the NFL has it out for the Patriots.  This is horrible for the NFL.  One of it's most beloved players and a certain first ballot HOF'er was found to have broken the rules, lied about it, tried to cover it up, and then was uncooperative with investigators.  The NFL doesn't want this - why would it?  Competition depends on fairness and an equal playing field.  The second you put that in question, the competition loses everything.  It's one of the reasons why I don't follow basketball like I used to with the referees admitting throwing games.  PED's are a problem, too.  But there is testing for that, so at least the NFL does what it can to uncover it.  Guys get suspended all the time for it, including our own Robert Mathis.  There's at least a way to discover it.  But it's more difficult to discover violations of this sort, and when it is, you change the rules accordingly so it doesn't happen again.  I fully believe the NFL will do just that.

 

 

The worst guy in all this is Kraft. I've said for over a year now that he is a rotten individual and he's proved me right in this. Besides the ridiculous stance he took at the outcome of this , he now id deflecting everything back to those that did the Wells report. Forget the fact that it's obvious they are guilty. Its "how long they took , how slanted they were ... bla bla bla. Then he claims they fully co operated with the investigation. He backs this up by the 3 of times they were allowed to interview. Nothing about the last refusal and all the things Bradfy refused to turn over. He's just one bad man.

[Lawrence Owen]

After a day to soak it in, and alot of articles read, I have come to a conclusion.

 

"In-game cheating is punished harder than out of game actions."

"Ignorance is not an excuse"

 

Kraft and B.B. will be punished because Goodell did say "ignorance is not an excuse" in previous indictments.

 

Hardy's case had less evidence, (only photo's of a beaten woman,and hearsay from other people) and was even an out of game action but he got a 10 game suspension.

 

There is direct evidence implicating Brady in this.  Brady also withheld evidence from the investigators. And lied.  Plus the text's go back WAY before the AFCCG.

 

The wordage "More probable than not" is the second most damning wordage an NFL investigator can use.  more damning than the wordage used in the Hardy, NO, and Atlanta investigations. It's meaning saying that the evidence is so heavily one sided there is little doubt.

 

He will get a fine of course,..But he will receive a HEFTY suspension also.  

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

He didn't even try to hint that he was innocent. I give him a little credit that he's letting his dad , Kraft and some of the talking heads ale *s out of themselves instead of him. I guess they really aren't lying ( Kraft is lying) as there are no doubt not very bright.

 

The punishment phase is where were at now & at least he understands his words can make it worse .

 

IMO  When your in a hole quit digging .

[dw49]

Wow, as if there was any respect to lose from this chump. What's sad is that the cheater's fans are in as much denial as he is. 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/07/us/nfl-deflategate-report/

 

But when Brady was asked to comment on the "Deflategate" scandal and the recently released report that said it was likely he knew New England Patriots staffers were altering footballs outside NFL rules, the four-time Super Bowl winner dodged.

"I don't have really any reaction," he told sports reporter Jim Gray, who asked Brady a few questions before the Patriots' star quarterback spoke at Salem State University in Massachusetts.

"Our owner commented on it yesterday. It's only been 30 hours so I haven't had much time to digest it fully but when I do I'll be sure to let you know how I feel about it," he said to loud cheers.

He added he hopes he will be able to address the issue more fully soon.

"There's still a (NFL disciplinary) process that's going forth right now, and I'm involved in that process, whenever it happens it happens, and I'll certainly want to be very comfortable in how I feel about the statements that I make," he told Gray, who asked Brady a series of questions before the quarterback spoke to 4,000 people, many of whom chanted "M-V-P! M-V-P" before the program began.

Brady said the controversy has "absolutely not" detracted from the joy of winning the Super Bowl, and said he's thankful for the support of his teammates and family.

"We'll get through it," he said.

 

 

That last line is pretty close to saying "i'm not going to be able to beat this by lying more." He , IMO, will be very transparent and not admit or deny guilt.

[SteelCityColt]

You are stunned by your assessment of colts fans lack of outrage but not stunned by anything your team did.  Not the first time we've tripped your 'stun-o-meter'.

 

You fault the NFL for not catching the Pats deflating the balls and stopping it before the AFC championship...and in any event, it was just gamesmanship (we do what we want and it's your job to catch us in a timely and fair way)

 

And the NFL has the worst black eye in history for not catching the Pats sooner, not giving them a heads up that they were going to catch them and issuing a report that used the words "more probable than not"

 

I don't understand your selection of things to be stunned about.   I AM STUNNED by your zero outrage for what your team did.  

 

I am proud of the Colts for catching this and shining a light on it.  Proud of the Colts for rising above the deflection.

 

I am disappointed by the Pats organization and them not acknowledging it was wrong.  This wasn't rule bending, it was rule breaking.

 

And yes I think that what the Pats did was also unnecessary and petty.  So why do it?

 

If they truly believed that they didn't break the rules, they would say (as they have before)......."that's right, we found a loophole in the rules.  Aren't you jealous?"

 

They aren't saying that though........and you're not saying it........because you know that the rules were broken and broken intentionally.......and then covered up

 

You can close your eyes and cover your ears but whatever the NFL did or did not do.........doesn't change what the fact that the choice to circumvent rules was made by your qb

 

And now everybody knows it

 

[dynasty13]

After finally getting through the report, I think it's clear that McNally illegally deflated footballs after the officials had approved them. What isn't clear is Tom Brady's role in the whole thing. Yes, the report makes it very easy for those who want to implicate Brady to do that...but even the harshest critic can admit that there were some leaps made and inferences that really didn't do much to prove his guilt. 

 

Again, I want to go on record as saying that I dont necessarily believe he was innocent, I am just trying to play the other side and actually take the report for what it is. A couple f things stood out to me about the text messages.

 

First, it sounds mostly like Jastremsky is the one who talks to Brady, NOT McNally. When talking about the gifts, McNally was telling Jastremsky what shoe size he would want. That leads me to believe that Jastremsky is the 'middle man' in the communication. So when people say Brady lied about not knowing McNally...that may not be true and he may only have really had a relationship with Jastremsky. And as has been mentioned, it is common practice for players to give the equipment guys gifts and autographs etc...so making the point that Brady is paying these guys for their silence is not fair or accurate.

 

And about the cell phone...who cares if Brady didnt turn his over? Who knows what kind of personal stuff is on that phone, I would be a little worried too in this day and age if I was world famous and married to a supermodel. Should any texts from Brady show up on the other guys phones anyways? 

 

I don't know...I just feel like a lot of the things people are saying that proved his guilt are the biggest assumptions in the report. Yes yes...I know the terminology used is enough for the NFL to find guilt, but can you guys honestly say that if this was your team then you wouldnt find the holes and the things left out and the leaps made a little disconcerting? It isnt that outrageous for Patriots fans to defend Brady based on how the report was written. It certainly felt like there was a conclusion that Wells wanted to reach, and the report than wrote that narrative. 

 

Nobody is defending what happened. Clearly there was some funny business going on. Patriots fans are just questioning their quarterback's role in it and saying that it is NOT clear in the report that he was involved to the extent that many are assuming. And I dont think its that's too crazy. Any fan would of any team would act the same way.

[corgi]

I apologize   I was just thinking the best way PM or this I thought this was best .

 

I'm a caveman & sometimes not the sharpest pencil but I realize when I'm wrong .

 

I sincerely hope that you will except my apology .

No worries at all dude. Sarcasm gets lost on the internet a lot of the time.

[dw49]

The punishment phase is where were at now & at least he understands his words can make it worse .

 

IMO  When your in a hole quit digging .

 

 

That's a good point

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Just heard Don Yee on Mike & Mike/ESPN. Bottom line - Brady's innocent. (Of course he is)n't. He will "more probable than not" fight if punishment is doled out. And, sounds like he's gonna throw these guys who underflated the balls under the bus.

What class.

What leadership.

What a role model.

What a ****bag!

 

The lawyer is moronic his actions will not help .  

 

My lawyer once told me you do not talk to the police you  give them my number thats my job .

 

This dude has given terrible advice & hindered the investigation , And continues to smear the NFL not helping ..

[OffensivelyPC]

The worst guy in all this is Kraft. I've said for over a year now that he is a rotten individual and he's proved me right in this. Besides the ridiculous stance he took at the outcome of this , he now id deflecting everything back to those that did the Wells report. Forget the fact that it's obvious they are guilty. Its "how long they took , how slanted they were ... bla bla bla. Then he claims they fully co operated with the investigation. He backs this up by the 3 of times they were allowed to interview. Nothing about the last refusal and all the things Bradfy refused to turn over. He's just one bad man.

After the report came out, he would have been better off just saying that they will wait to hear from the league and deal with whatever the consequences are.  I wouldn't even care if he had said he disagreed with teh findings.  I mean, it's his franchise, and if there's one person that has to defend it, it's the owner.  But his response completely came across as a temper tantrum.  Many Pats fans followed suit.  Which is ironic, because after the story initially broke, everyone calling the Pats cheaters were told by Pats apologists that it didn't matter, they won, deal with it, and stop crying about it because it's over.

[katberg]

The Governor Called out Tom Brady! video is below

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7O8tvoFX97M

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

That's a good point

 

 

I used it on my son in high school had him write it thousands of times until he got it ,  Thru my use of this simple statement my boy who had been a failure caught up his grades & graduated .

 

A life lesson for him learned at 16 . 

[ColtsBlueFL]

After a day to soak it in, and alot of articles read, I have come to a conclusion.

 

"In-game cheating is punished harder than out of game actions."

"Ignorance is not an excuse"

 

{snipped good speculative punishment info}

 

Oh yeah it is.  Though some just want to have the 25k fine dished out and move on.  smh...

 

Here are direct quotes form the NFL Governance site-

 

“Our primary goal is to protect the competitive equity. We want the game to be decided on the field, between the two teams.”

 BLAKE JONES, DIRECTOR OF NFL FOOTBALL OPERATIONS

 

The NFL takes infractions of Game Operations rules seriously — so much so that clubs risk fines as high as $500,000 for violations “affecting the competitive aspects of the game.”

 

The league takes violations seriously because it takes its responsibilities seriously. Good governance is an essential component in producing a fair, safe and entertaining game.

[dw49]

After finally getting through the report, I think it's clear that McNally illegally deflated footballs after the officials had approved them. What isn't clear is Tom Brady's role in the whole thing. Yes, the report makes it very easy for those who want to implicate Brady to do that...but even the harshest critic can admit that there were some leaps made and inferences that really didn't do much to prove his guilt. 

 

Again, I want to go on record as saying that I dont necessarily believe he was innocent, I am just trying to play the other side and actually take the report for what it is. A couple f things stood out to me about the text messages.

 

First, it sounds mostly like Jastremsky is the one who talks to Brady, NOT McNally. When talking about the gifts, McNally was telling Jastremsky what shoe size he would want. That leads me to believe that Jastremsky is the 'middle man' in the communication. So when people say Brady lied about not knowing McNally...that may not be true and he may only have really had a relationship with Jastremsky. And as has been mentioned, it is common practice for players to give the equipment guys gifts and autographs etc...so making the point that Brady is paying these guys for their silence is not fair or accurate.

 

And about the cell phone...who cares if Brady didnt turn his over? Who knows what kind of personal stuff is on that phone, I would be a little worried too in this day and age if I was world famous and married to a supermodel. Should any texts from Brady show up on the other guys phones anyways? 

 

I don't know...I just feel like a lot of the things people are saying that proved his guilt are the biggest assumptions in the report. Yes yes...I know the terminology used is enough for the NFL to find guilt, but can you guys honestly say that if this was your team then you wouldnt find the holes and the things left out and the leaps made a little disconcerting? It isnt that outrageous for Patriots fans to defend Brady based on how the report was written. It certainly felt like there was a conclusion that Wells wanted to reach, and the report than wrote that narrative. 

 

Nobody is defending what happened. Clearly there was some funny business going on. Patriots fans are just questioning their quarterback's role in it and saying that it is NOT clear in the report that he was involved to the extent that many are assuming. And I dont think its that's too crazy. Any fan would of any team would act the same way.

 

 

Your forgetting to add one thing to what is somewhat reasonable above. You make the "leap " and pretty much admit that the balls were tampered with. And tampered with in a very "bad" way. Snuck into a bathroom at the opportune time and deflated. So once you have that part of it , you have to go to motive.

 

Here you pretty much have 3 choices.

 

1) The equipment guys did it on their own. Forget the talk of gifts or any other texts. INO , you really don;t even need the text if you can prove these guys did it, But you have the text , the guy calling himself the deflater etc etc. So thinking these guys would do it on their own is just not a logical conclusion.

 

2) BB, He would know Bray likes a deflated ball and his team would have better ball security. We're looking for motive and opportunity here. Just because the Wells report says there's no evidence connecting him , it does't have to be the case.

 

3) Tom Brady . He's connected by the text messages , he likes the balls on the soft side , he did not co operate fully and he appeared to ne guilty as heck in his pressers. 

 

So , IMO , once you come to the conclusion that # 1 is not the case , you have to go with 2 or 3. Our justice system works that way on a consistent basis. They put circumstantial evidence with motive and convict by MUCH higher standard than what the Wells reports as "more probable," 

[Superman]

Would the Falcons still be worse if the Patriots had under inflated all season ?

 

I'm not sure how to answer that. I think what the Pats did was worse, even if it was just one game (which it's pretty obvious that it wasn't).

[dynasty13]

Your forgetting to add one thing to what is somewhat reasonable above. You make the "leap " and pretty much admit that the balls were tampered with. And tampered with in a very "bad" way. Snuck into a bathroom at the opportune time and deflated. So once you have that part of it , you have to go to motive.

 

Here you pretty much have 3 choices.

 

1) The equipment guys did it on their own. Forget the talk of gifts or any other texts. INO , you really don;t even need the text if you can prove these guys did it, But you have the text , the guy calling himself the deflater etc etc. So thinking these guys would do it on their own is just not a logical conclusion.

 

2) BB, He would know Bray likes a deflated ball and his team would have better ball security. We're looking for motive and opportunity here. Just because the Wells report says there's no evidence connecting him , it does't have to be the case.

 

3) Tom Brady . He's connected by the text messages , he likes the balls on the soft side , he did not co operate fully and he appeared to ne guilty as heck in his pressers. 

 

So , IMO , once you come to the conclusion that # 1 is not the case , you have to go with 2 or 3. Our justice system works that way on a consistent basis. They put circumstantial evidence with motive and convict by MUCH higher standard than what the Wells reports as "more probable," 

 

There is another option. It sounds like Brady was * after the Jets game where the balls were inflated to 16 PSI. We know Brady...I'm sure he threw a tantrum and yelled at Jastremsky for how the balls were prepared, assuming they just did a poor job. But as the texts showed, it was actually the officials who inflated them too high, but the equipment guys got yelled at anyways because Brady likes the ball on the lower end. Clearly McNally held some ill will towards Brady based on the text, and it isn't unreasonable to assume that it was because he was blamed for those balls during the Jets game.

 

For all we know, that could have been the end of any conversation Brady had with them about the balls...but to avoid ever getting yelled at by Brady again, they went and made sure that the balls were as deflated as they could get them. The rest of those text messages read as playful banter between McNally and Jastremsky. Nowhere in the report does it say Tom Brady called him the deflator. Nowhere in the report is there any communication shown between Brady and McNally. The gifts weren't payoffs...it is common practice to 'tip' the equipment guys in that kind of way. 

 

Is that really such an 'out there' theory?

 

It's no crazier than some of the assumptions made in the report...it's perfectly reasonable to consider that as a possibility.

[amfootball]

After finally getting through the report, I think it's clear that McNally illegally deflated footballs after the officials had approved them. What isn't clear is Tom Brady's role in the whole thing. Yes, the report makes it very easy for those who want to implicate Brady to do that...but even the harshest critic can admit that there were some leaps made and inferences that really didn't do much to prove his guilt. 

 

Again, I want to go on record as saying that I dont necessarily believe he was innocent, I am just trying to play the other side and actually take the report for what it is. A couple f things stood out to me about the text messages.

 

First, it sounds mostly like Jastremsky is the one who talks to Brady, NOT McNally. When talking about the gifts, McNally was telling Jastremsky what shoe size he would want. That leads me to believe that Jastremsky is the 'middle man' in the communication. So when people say Brady lied about not knowing McNally...that may not be true and he may only have really had a relationship with Jastremsky. And as has been mentioned, it is common practice for players to give the equipment guys gifts and autographs etc...so making the point that Brady is paying these guys for their silence is not fair or accurate.

 

And about the cell phone...who cares if Brady didnt turn his over? Who knows what kind of personal stuff is on that phone, I would be a little worried too in this day and age if I was world famous and married to a supermodel. Should any texts from Brady show up on the other guys phones anyways? 

 

I don't know...I just feel like a lot of the things people are saying that proved his guilt are the biggest assumptions in the report. Yes yes...I know the terminology used is enough for the NFL to find guilt, but can you guys honestly say that if this was your team then you wouldnt find the holes and the things left out and the leaps made a little disconcerting? It isnt that outrageous for Patriots fans to defend Brady based on how the report was written. It certainly felt like there was a conclusion that Wells wanted to reach, and the report than wrote that narrative. 

 

Nobody is defending what happened. Clearly there was some funny business going on. Patriots fans are just questioning their quarterback's role in it and saying that it is NOT clear in the report that he was involved to the extent that many are assuming. And I dont think its that's too crazy. Any fan would of any team would act the same way.

That was my take away too from reading it. Nowhere is Brady telling or texting his guys to make the balls below league minimum. There is absolutely no communication from Brady the day of the AFCCG either that ties him directly to McNally.

 

Did you see/hear Yee's interview on CNN last night? http://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2015/05/08/ac-intv-tom-brady-attorney-don-yee.cnn

 

It is clear that Brady is going to fight this report no matter the punishment. I think he is just waiting to see what the league rules in terms of punishment to see what form of legal action he should take. The Herald had a great break down of his legal recourse in this.

[DougDew]

 

 

First, it sounds mostly like Jastremsky is the one who talks to Brady, NOT McNally. When talking about the gifts, McNally was telling Jastremsky what shoe size he would want. That leads me to believe that Jastremsky is the 'middle man' in the communication. So when people say Brady lied about not knowing McNally...that may not be true and he may only have really had a relationship with Jastremsky. And as has been mentioned, it is common practice for players to give the equipment guys gifts and autographs etc...so making the point that Brady is paying these guys for their silence is not fair or accurate.

 

And about the cell phone...who cares if Brady didnt turn his over? Who knows what kind of personal stuff is on that phone, I would be a little worried too in this day and age if I was world famous and married to a supermodel. Should any texts from Brady show up on the other guys phones anyways? 

 

 

Nobody is defending what happened. Clearly there was some funny business going on. Patriots fans are just questioning their quarterback's role in it and saying that it is NOT clear in the report that he was involved to the extent that many are assuming. And I dont think its that's too crazy. Any fan would of any team would act the same way.

I'm not responding to you directly but some of the things you have said have been said by multiple people so I am responding to that group.

 

If Brady was not directly involved in deflating the balls for the AFCCG, then this is more damming, IMO, because then it suggests that there was an ongoing understanding that balls would be deflated prior to many games.  McNally would not have done such if he was not told.  How would he know that Brady preferred softer footballs unless either Brady or BB told someone?  The fact that Brady was not directly involved in this particular incident strongly suggests there was an ongoing process to deflate footballs over multiple weeks...if not seasons....if not an entire career.  OTOH, if Brady was directly involved in this incident thaen he could make the excuse is was a one time deal, and the equipment guys had to be told before the game since they would not have otherwsie known to deflate them.

 

The report suggests, to me, that the lack of direct communication from Brady suggests there was an established process that carried over for multiple weeks, if not seasons.

 

Is the cell phone in question an NFL/Patriots phone or was it his personal phone?  If the phone was issued for busines purposes (or the Patriots comensate him for using his personal phone) then everyhting on the phone is subject to review by the NFL and investigators.  Corporate issued phones come with the understanding that they may be used for personal use....but that all personal items would become part of the corporate record....so people need to be careful with what gets placed on a company phone (or a personal phone used to conduct company business).  The fact that one player is a celebrity with a celebrity wife does not change that...nor does it allow for his phone to not be turned over where as a rookie UDFA phone might have to be.  Bottom line...if this phone is used to conduct NFL business, Brady should not be stupid enough to put embarrassing or highly personal information on the phone in the first place.  He should have a separate phone for that.

 

Pats apologists and pop-culture worshippers are saying that it is understandable Brady should not have to turn over the phone because he is married to Gisele.  Its an excuse.  Brady should not have personal info on a phone that he uses to conduct corporate business.  He needs to turn over the phone.  Too bad for him and Gisele.

[amfootball]

That last line is pretty close to saying "i'm not going to be able to beat this by lying more." He , IMO, will be very transparent and not admit or deny guilt.

His agent already said last night that he and Brady believe he is innocent. He is not backing down or admitting any lying ...

[Superman]

And about the cell phone...who cares if Brady didnt turn his over? Who knows what kind of personal stuff is on that phone, I would be a little worried too in this day and age if I was world famous and married to a supermodel. Should any texts from Brady show up on the other guys phones anyways? 

 

It doesn't bother me that Brady didn't turn over his phone. I probably wouldn't turn over my phone under these circumstances, in the name of privacy. 

[Superman]

So , IMO , once you come to the conclusion that # 1 is not the case , you have to go with 2 or 3. Our justice system works that way on a consistent basis. They put circumstantial evidence with motive and convict by MUCH higher standard than what the Wells reports as "more probable," 

 

Yeah, Brady himself said that no one would mess with his footballs without his approval. 

[wig]

 What isn't clear is Tom Brady's role in the whole thing. 

 

Who has possession of the football used to surpass 50,000 yards?  And why?

 

As far as not handing the phone over. . . it's not a choice!  It's a clear violation of league rules, which isn't up for debate.

[PrincetonTiger]

It doesn't bother me that Brady didn't turn over his phone. I probably wouldn't turn over my phone under these circumstances, in the name of privacy.

It makes everyone think you are guilty of something