CBS/98.5 Sources: Under-inflated balls OK'd by refs pregame

[BOTT]

Did not even bother to click the link and read the story.

It's not surprisingly if/when the pats get away with cheating once again.

Kraft runs the league. But no matter what the talking heads will try and spin it, in court of public opinion they are cheaters and everything they've done and will do is tainted and has a mental asterisk attached to them.

That's their Legacy!

How does Kraft run the league? You really think the other 31 billionaires give 2 poops about Bob Kraft?

[Superman]

...aaaaand it's official - NFL didn't log the PSI's of the balls pre-game, so there's no proof that they weren't approved in an under-inflated state.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/01/29/nfl-didnt-log-the-psi-of-each-patriots-football/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs

 

They don't need to log the PSI pre-game. It's not part of the process.

 

And whether they did or not has nothing to do with whether the balls were under-inflated at halftime, which they were. It's already been confirmed that the refs checked the PSI with gauges prior to the game, and during halftime.

 

Nice try, though.

[pacolts56]

Now it looks like the NFL and Patriots are in bed together.  If true, that's even worse than the patriots just cheating.

Yep.....and there goes what little was left of the National Football League's credibility....

 

[OffensivelyPC]

They don't need to log the PSI pre-game. It's not part of the process.

 

And whether they did or not has nothing to do with whether the balls were under-inflated at halftime, which they were. It's already been confirmed that the refs checked the PSI with gauges prior to the game, and during halftime.

 

Nice try, though.

I assumed it would have needed to be logged.  Thanks for hte save.

[Superman]

I assumed it would have needed to be logged.  Thanks for hte save.

 

Watch this: http://mmqb.si.com/2015/01/22/deflategate-video-how-nfl-officials-check-game-ball-pressure/

[OffensivelyPC]

Watch this: http://mmqb.si.com/2015/01/22/deflategate-video-how-nfl-officials-check-game-ball-pressure/

Wow, it's surprisingly like what you'd expect.  It doesn't really support the Patriots position unless you've got rogue refs.

[Bad Morty]

They don't need to log the PSI pre-game. It's not part of the process.

 

And whether they did or not has nothing to do with whether the balls were under-inflated at halftime, which they were. It's already been confirmed that the refs checked the PSI with gauges prior to the game, and during halftime.

 

Nice try, though.

 

Again - the league has been thoroughly embarrassed by this witch hunt and I fully expect they will invoke the phony "low burden of proof" standard to slap a penalty on the Pats to save face despite having no proof that the Patriots tampered with the balls. We also know that they can't tell us exactly how much the balls supposedly deflated as there is no beginning reading...for either team...which makes the claim that the Colts balls didn't experience any drop 100% unverifiable. This story was weak to begin with, and it'w weaker now. Nice try though.

[OffensivelyPC]

Again - the league has been thoroughly embarrassed by this witch hunt and I fully expect they will invoke the phony "low burden of proof" standard to slap a penalty on the Pats to save face despite having no proof that the Patriots tampered with the balls. We also know that they can't tell us exactly how much the balls supposedly deflated as there is no beginning reading...for either team...which makes the claim that the Colts balls didn't experience any drop 100% unverifiable. This story was weak to begin with, and it'w weaker now. Nice try though.

Yeah, but what you expect means nothing.

[Superman]

Again - the league has been thoroughly embarrassed by this witch hunt and I fully expect they will invoke the phony "low burden of proof" standard to slap a penalty on the Pats to save face despite having no proof that the Patriots tampered with the balls. We also know that they can't tell us exactly how much the balls supposedly deflated as there is no beginning reading...for either team...which makes the claim that the Colts balls didn't experience any drop 100% unverifiable. This story was weak to begin with, and it'w weaker now. Nice try though.

 

Yeah, that's one perspective. It's incredibly skewed, but we all know that.

[Bad Morty]

"n other words, although the Patriots did play with under-inflated footballs, the NFL hasn’t kept detailed records of whether those footballs were slightly under-inflated (which could be the result of a change in temperature) or significantly under-inflated (which would indicate that someone purposely let air out of the footballs)."

[crazycolt1]

How does Kraft run the league? You really think the other 31 billionaires give 2 poops about Bob Kraft?

How many other owners does Goodell party with? It is common knowledge that Kraft is known as the second commish around the league. I have heard that long before this issue was around.

[DougDew]

I picked up on this a while ago...and the argument has been twisted into finding out who deflated the footballs.

Who says they were inflated to the proper PSI to begin with?

The rule is that the team must play with footballs that have a psi of 12.5 to 13.5. The Pats played with footballs that were in violation of the rules.

If nobody deflated them, fine. They could have just never been inflated to the proper PSI to begin with. It doesn't matter if the refs didn't check the PSI, the failure to inflate the footballs to the proper psi is the same thing...

Intentionally playing with footballs that violate the rules.

Its the ol' bait and switch. Get drive-bys and the masses to focus on the specific issue of deflating the football's, then prove the footballs were never deflated as a means to fool people into believing innocence.

Nice try. Not falling for it.

[crazycolt1]

Again - the league has been thoroughly embarrassed by this witch hunt and I fully expect they will invoke the phony "low burden of proof" standard to slap a penalty on the Pats to save face despite having no proof that the Patriots tampered with the balls. We also know that they can't tell us exactly how much the balls supposedly deflated as there is no beginning reading...for either team...which makes the claim that the Colts balls didn't experience any drop 100% unverifiable. This story was weak to begin with, and it'w weaker now. Nice try though.

So what old Patriot fan are you? 72 post with this name. How many under your other old name?

[OffensivelyPC]

Yeah, that's one perspective. It's incredibly skewed, but we all know that.

I would have gone with comical.  But skewed works as well.

[Qwiz]

Easy! Get some water and mix it with some Kool Aid powder and sugar. Add some activated yeast and let the mixture ferment. Presto! Water into wine!

Meh, too much work. I'm lazy

[BOTT]

How many other owners does Goodell party with? It is common knowledge that Kraft is known as the second commish around the league. I have heard that long before this issue was around.

It was the afc championship party that the patriots footed the bill for...what's the big deal about that?

And who told you that? Your mailman?

[ponyboy]

"n other words, although the Patriots did play with under-inflated footballs, the NFL hasn’t kept detailed records of whether those footballs were slightly under-inflated (which could be the result of a change in temperature) or significantly under-inflated (which would indicate that someone purposely let air out of the footballs)."

 

If they used a gauge to measure the PSI pre-game, they would know the balls were AT LEAST 12.5 PSI even if they didn't record the values.  There still no good explanation for losing 2 PSI (if that's accurate) in a couple hours without there being some sort of intentional deception (air let out, balls filled with hot air, etc).  If they didn't use a gauge, then the embarrassment lies with the NFL and not the Pats -- even if the Pats are guilty of trying to slide under inflated balls past the refs.

[Superman]

If they used a gauge to measure the PSI pre-game, they would know the balls were AT LEAST 12.5 PSI even if they didn't record the values.  There still no good explanation for losing 2 PSI (if that's accurate) in a couple hours without there being some sort of intentional deception (air let out, balls filled with hot air, etc).  If they didn't use a gauge, then the embarrassment lies with the NFL and not the Pats -- even if the Pats are guilty of trying to slide under inflated balls past the refs.

 

It's simple math.

 

If the Colts footballs were compliant before the game, the MOST they could have been inflated is 13.5 PSI. We know that the Colts footballs were compliant before the game, and we know that they were compliant at halftime.

 

The Patriots footballs reportedly "lost" at least 2 PSI by halftime. 

 

If the Colts footballs had lost a similar amount of pressure by halftime, they would not have been compliant at halftime. They would have lost around 2 PSI, and would have measured in at 11.5 PSI, out of compliance.

[Bad Morty]

If they used a gauge to measure the PSI pre-game, they would know the balls were AT LEAST 12.5 PSI even if they didn't record the values.  There still no good explanation for losing 2 PSI (if that's accurate) in a couple hours without there being some sort of intentional deception (air let out, balls filled with hot air, etc).  If they didn't use a gauge, then the embarrassment lies with the NFL and not the Pats -- even if the Pats are guilty of trying to slide under inflated balls past the refs.

 

my guess is that no gauge was used pre-game. That reeks of the refs covering their butt. We already know that it's common for the refs to eyeball and feel the balls pre-game. So I'll bet this was a half-assed check before the game and these balls went into play under-inflated, the same way some of Aaron Rogers balls got into play over the maximum. There are also a number of reports contradicting Mortensen's original report that all the balls tested at 2 lbs below minimum and that instead all but one of the balls were within 1 lb of the minimum. That's a huge difference, and the fact that the NFL hasn't leaked the exact measurements tells me that those measurements don't support the story they've been trying to float.

[da_pats_troll]

How many other owners does Goodell party with? It is common knowledge that Kraft is known as the second commish around the league. I have heard that long before this issue was around.

 

That was the "regularly" scheduled AFCCG party. Kraft hosted it. Why wouldnt the commish be invited?

[da_pats_troll]

It's simple math.

 

If the Colts footballs were compliant before the game, the MOST they could have been inflated is 13.5 PSI. We know that the Colts footballs were compliant before the game, and we know that they were compliant at halftime.

 

The Patriots footballs reportedly "lost" at least 2 PSI by halftime. 

 

If the Colts footballs had lost a similar amount of pressure by halftime, they would not have been compliant at halftime. They would have lost around 2 PSI, and would have measured in at 11.5 PSI, out of compliance.

 

Supposedly Mort is backing off that 2 psi story now, and is reporting the 1 psi..go figure. Its a greek tragedy. 

[crazycolt1]

That was the "regularly" scheduled AFCCG party. Kraft hosted it. Why wouldnt the commish be invited?

I guess you had a hard time comprehending what I was referring to.

[da_pats_troll]

I guess you had a hard time comprehending what I was referring to.

 

If I misread your post, I apologize. No need being rude.

[The Old Crow]

Ridiculous theory number 57, to get the cheaters past the SB game, so it can be swept under the rug.

[Bad Morty]

Ridiculous theory number 57, to get the cheaters past the SB game, so it can be swept under the rug.

 

I believe now that it's clear what happened...both teams balls were in fact checked and found to be legal pre-game. The Pats balls were right at the minimum, the Colts were at the maximum (of course, we can't know this for sure as no readings were logged). Then somehow or other, the Colts managed to tamper with their balls to get them above the legal max, the same way Aaron Rogers likes his balls. Then over the course of the first half, the elements deflated each team's balls, such that when they are re-tested at the half, the Pats balls are now below the legal range and the Colts balls are back in the legal range. I think an investigation needs to be launched immediately on the Colts, and if found guilty Pagano should be fired and Luck should be suspended, because he HAD to know about this inflation scheme.

[Gramz]

It's way beyond comical now...

[da_pats_troll]

Ridiculous theory number 57, to get the cheaters past the SB game, so it can be swept under the rug.

 

I believe we are at 42. But its hard to keep up.

[Bad Morty]

It's way beyond comical now...

 

It started out that way...this has been a joke from the beginning. Here's what the lack of logging the PSI does...it wipes out the circumstantial case that was based around the idea that ONLY the Pats balls supposedly deflated in the elements but not the Colts. The fact is, we can't say now whether or not the Colts balls deflated. All we know is that they were supposedly legal pregame and still legal at the half. If they started at the high end of the range, that means they could have theoretically deflated by as much as a pound and still been legal, while the same pound of deflation on the Pats balls would put them a pound below...which is what Mortensen is now saying they read at.

[crazycolt1]

It started out that way...this has been a joke from the beginning. Here's what the lack of logging the PSI does...it wipes out the circumstantial case that was based around the idea that ONLY the Pats balls supposedly deflated in the elements but not the Colts. The fact is, we can't say now whether or not the Colts balls deflated. All we know is that they were supposedly legal pregame and still legal at the half. If they started at the high end of the range, that means they could have theoretically deflated by as much as a pound and still been legal, while the same pound of deflation on the Pats balls would put them a pound below...which is what Mortensen is now saying they read at.

So Mortensen is an expert now? I have a question for you. What name were under before Bad Morty? 76 post in the last few days. Were you kicked out of this forum under another name? Or did you just make up this name to come into the Colts forum to stir up trouble? It's pretty obvious. But it don't matter to me because you are off to the ignore list right along with all the other Patriot trolls.

[Bad Morty]

So Mortensen is an expert now? I have a question for you. What name were under before Bad Morty? 76 post in the last few days. Were you kicked out of this forum under another name? Or did you just make up this name to come into the Colts forum to stir up trouble? It's pretty obvious. But it don't matter to me because you are off to the ignore list right along with all the other Patriot trolls.

Oh Noes!! Not the ignore list!! : ...and for the record, I was this same name on the Indy Star forum years ago. I just stopped posting because your teams stopped being competitive.

[crazycolt1]

If I misread your post, I apologize. No need being rude.

I have no problem with your response. I just figured you were defending the owner of your team. My comment was made because it is common knowledge that Goodell and Kraft have a closer relationship than what an employer should have with an employee. It's called conflict of interest for most. Another point I would like to make is since when does opinion and or rumor become a source?

[crazycolt1]

Oh Noes!! Not the ignore list!! : ...and for the record, I was this same name on the Indy Star forum years ago. I just stopped posting because your teams stopped being competitive.

That's funny. Member started on Jan. 19, 2015. So now you want someone believe the Colts haven't been competitive since the old days of the Indy star?  Do you really think that is believable? Welcome new member and good bye.

[da_pats_troll]

I have no problem with your response. I just figured you were defending the owner of your team. My comment was made because it is common knowledge that Goodell and Kraft have a closer relationship than what an employer should have with an employee. It's called conflict of interest for most. Another point I would like to make is since when does opinion and or rumor become a source?

 

Its all good. Alot of ppl have been going on about the picture of them a couple weeks back, so I did jump to the conclusion thats what you were specifically referring to, and not the relationship in general. 

 

Before I jump to another (possibly wrong) conclusion, I dont get the gist of your last question/point. Can you elaborate?

[DougDew]

We already know that it's common for the refs to eyeball and feel the balls pre-game. So I'll bet this was a half-assed check before the game and these balls went into play under-inflated

They probably never have checked them with a gauge before any game..as a matter of procedure...which is why BelliKraft cheated this way. They know NFL procedures, and figured there would be no way they would get caught.

Same thing with the conceal-a-receiver scheme against the Ravens. They know that the NFL officials don't take enough time to properly announce to everyone who is abnormally eligible when it needs to be done.

Same thing when Willie McGinest fakes an injury to stop the clock and get a breather. NFL procedure is not to question the player too much at the time.

Its all about understanding how the officials go about enforcing the rules...and taking advantage of the weaknesses in law enforcement. Just like a bank robber who cases the joint for a few days to know where the cameras and security guards usually are.

I can't believe that Kraft, BB, and Brady are even allowed to be in the NFL.

[PrincetonTiger]

As I have said multiple times this will tarnish the Patriot Legacy for everyone outside NE

[crazycolt1]

Its all good. Alot of ppl have been going on about the picture of them a couple weeks back, so I did jump to the conclusion thats what you were specifically referring to, and not the relationship in general. 

 

Before I jump to another (possibly wrong) conclusion, I dont get the gist of your last question/point. Can you elaborate?

I was referring to all the different reports and so called sources that have come from both sides of the fence. There have been untold amounts of people who have these sources that have no names. A lot of people have opinions and theories that in fact have all of a sudden been labeled sources. I spoke my opinion in earlier post and don't care to debate or argue about them any longer. We are all in a wait and see mode at this point so all this banter back and forth is exactly that. It serves no purpose but to cause conflict. I crawled out of that mindset and refuse to fall back into it when I realized that too many on both side do nothing but argue. If a Patriot fan comes into the forum with nothing but the intentions of just aggravating then it's off to the ignore room for them. There have been a few so called new Patriot fans who have changed names and or started new names with the intent just to cause friction. I am going to wait and see the finale results before making anymore comments.

[da_pats_troll]

I was referring to all the different reports and so called sources that have come from both sides of the fence. There have been untold amounts of people who have these sources that have no names. A lot of people have opinions and theories that in fact have all of a sudden been labeled sources. I spoke my opinion in earlier post and don't care to debate or argue about them any longer. We are all in a wait and see mode at this point so all this banter back and forth is exactly that. It serves no purpose but to cause conflict. I crawled out of that mindset and refuse to fall back into it when I realized that too many on both side do nothing but argue. If a Patriot fan comes into the forum with nothing but the intentions of just aggravating then it's off to the ignore room for them. There have been a few so called new Patriot fans who have changed names and or started new names with the intent just to cause friction. I am going to wait and see the finale results before making anymore comments.

 

Its the nature of the news media. They need to be relevant in the football story of the year. Each has their "source", and will run with what they are told. As fans, naturally, we are going to concentrate on the "news" that favours our side of the story. The bar for using unnamed source is low for both the media and ourselves at times.

 

Some people have a driving need to be right. They will argue black is white, and when you finally give up and agree, they will argue the shade of white. I have tried, mostly successfully, to not argue opinion. Its about as useful as trying to get a 3 year old to clean their room. I have had some good conversations with many Colts fans here about this subject.

 

I said it before to someone, my weakness is I do like the debate, the back and forth, so at times I come across as very argumentative. Heck, you could pick a subject, tell me which side you want me to argue, and I would be a happy camper. When I'm wrong, I'll say so. Mostly .   I don't need to be right, I like it when I am tho!

 

Looks now we may hear the outcome of the "investigation" sometime around..the draft I guess we can pick it up then.

[hawkeyes]

The NFL and the Patriots have hired a team of professional nonsense creators who are working hard at coming up with a nonsense explanation that will fool just 51% of the public ... likely creating / leaking several of the nonsense stories to see how many will stick to the wall .... thats all they need to do and then the story will vanish in time and they will live to cheat another day!

[ColtsBlueFL]

So let's re-set this "Scandal"...the NFL has never said that the balls were measured with a gauge pre-game...only that they were "checked", which we know often means simply that the Refs felt them by hand and said yes or no. If a gauge WAS used, no log was kept of the readings, so there is no actual way to say how much (if any) either teams balls deflated from the beginning of the game to the half.

 

Yep...I'd say this story just dropped dead. I'm sure the league will still issue some face-saving fine down the road, but the reality is that there is little to no evidence on which to really drop the hammer here.

 

As pointed out numerous times, the VP of officiating said they were properly "Tested".  That process involves using a gauge with a bleed valve, and inflator pump to be used accordingly for those balls that do not fit the "13 psi, plus or minus 0.5 psi" standard.  Every game.  Pre season, regular season, and post season!  All games!!

 

You make a bold claim that I highlighted above.  Bold claims demand bold proof.  But before you can attempt any meager excuse that we'll never know yada yada... I'll show proof of officials doing 'their job correctly' in a November of 2013 video, well before deflategate!!

 

 

{EDIT: I see Superman posted this earlier, but it still is valid!}

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/01/22/deflategate-video-how-nfl-officials-check-game-ball-pressure/

 

Peter King got invited backstage to witness what these guys did in private for every game.  Notice, they did not log psi.  I guess since they were all checked and then guarded, they and the NFL never expected someone to tamper with them post approval.  Well those days are done now.  They'll probably have NFL Security guards watch over and deliver the checked and approved balls to the teams equipment manager on the sideline at a specific spot where a HD-CCTV is focused and recording for the duration of the game.

 

So your assertion is what 'dropped dead'.  Unless you now also assert the NFL is aiding the Patriots to cheat by knowingly allow the Patriots to use illegal footballs during the game when their offense is on the field.  And that would demand bold proof as well.

 

But I'll be sure to send a message to Ted Wells that he and the whole team can drop everything and go home, becasue you said refs only checked the balls by hand so there's nothing to prove and it it's all good.  {good grief}

[ViriLudant]

Blandino stated yesterday in the press conference that the balls weren't checked with gauges .

So... Yeah. Great job , NFL.