Dilfer On Cowherd About the Colt Defense today....

[ColtsHappy]

I don't know if any of you heard this, but Dilger claims that the condensed "bunch" formations used by the Steelers are what caused the demise of our defense - not only in that game - he also claims he watched film of our defenses against "bunch" formations over the past couple of years and we are in his words "pathetic" in defending them. He says the Giants would be crazy not to expolit the exact some type of formations.

 

Colts segment starts around 5:39:

 

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=11815356

 

Comment if you see fit.

 

Would be nice if you would comment on his ideas, rather than the man himself, who I have a feeling is not mr. popularity on here.

 

EDIT:

 

So sorry, of course I meant Dilfer.... 

 

I was kind of in a state of shock from his comments when I wrote this....

[NewColtsFan]

I think you're referring to Dilfer, as in Trent the former Quarterback.

 

He's among the smartest minds out there.   Very sharp.

[shakedownstreet]

i was wondering when ken dilger got into broadcasting... ;)

[Coffeedrinker]

Why wouldn't Dilger be Mr. popular around here?  He was an excellent TE for the Colts for a lot of years and was given a raw deal when he was released (received a letter via FedEx.)

 

That being said, he has a good point.  It's not just the Colts but any team that runs man coverage is going to have problems with the bunch formation, that is why teams run the bunch formation.

[PrincetonTiger]

i was wondering when ken dilger got into broadcasting... ;)

Ken has done some broadcasting

[shakedownstreet]

to be fair, the f is right next to the g on the keyboard 

[ColtsHappy]

Again, sorry for the slip up in the name.

 

Dilfer, the quarterback I meant to say not Dilger the tight end.

 

Only a true Colts fan would make that error though.....

 

:yay:  :yay:  :yay:  :yay:  :yay:  :yay: 

[shakedownstreet]

oh i thought you meant ken dilfer, the famous porn star

[Superman]

I'm generally a fan of Dilfer and his analysis. I think he's got some presumptions about the Colts, though, that are wrong. Dead wrong. And I think he's kind of slow to move off of those presumptions, because he's been so adamant about them in the past. (For instance, he said earlier this year that the Colts have no weapons, the offensive line is terrible and can't block 5 on 4, etc. Things that have been proved dead wrong over the last 6 weeks.)

 

In this case, he says he went back and watched the Colts against bunch formations, and the secondary doesn't play well against them because they can't play bump and run, etc., etc. Fair point. It's true. The Colts aren't good against bunch and stack formations, but most teams have trouble with bunch and stack formations. Look at the Colts passing attack, and much we use bunch and stack formations this year, and think about how much that has to do with our offensive success this season. The Broncos do this also. The Steelers worked the Ravens last night with bunch formations. Like Coffee said, that's the reason teams use them.

 

My beef with Dilfer's comments is that he ignores the fact that our secondary is different this year than it has been in the past couple of years, which he says he's studied (and he's a film junkie, so I believe him). Vontae Davis is better this year than he's ever been, Greg Toler is healthy, we don't have Cassius Vaughn getting torched anymore, etc. 

 

Long story short, I'm not remotely worried about the secondary against bunch formations. Even after last week's miserable performance. 

[superrep1967]

I think you're referring to Dilfer, as in Trent the former Quarterback.

 

He's among the smartest minds out there.   Very sharp.

You are a new Colts fan aren't you? It's Kenny Dilger he was a Colts tight end in the 90's. He does pre-game stuff for the CBS ..affiliate here in Indianapolis.  

[NewColtsFan]

You are a new Colts fan aren't you? It's Kenny Dilger he was a Colts tight end in the 90's. He does pre-game stuff for the CBS ..affiliate here in Indianapolis.  

 

Yes....  I'm new....   (2 and a half years)  but I do know Ken Dilger and knew that's how CH got confused....   I just didn't want to make too big a deal of it.

 

Didn't know KD works in Indianapolis...   good for him!    Like it!

 

Thanks for sharing.....

[1959Colts]

If that's the case...

Then perhaps it's the coaching that should take at least part of the blame for the defensive breakdowns.

[ColtsHappy]

He is explaining it in detail RIGHT NOW (7:57) on ESPN by the way......

[Ja'Crispy]

I was gonna say, Dilfer just said the EXACT same thing!  Makes sense now!

[Superman]

I just watched his breakdown on this. I'm still kind of "meh" about it. I understand what he was saying, but a lot of those plays he showed from last week were zone coverage, which we don't play a lot of, or cross-matches putting Josh Gordy or Darius Butler on Martavus Bryant or Antonio Brown. 

 

To me, it was more a flawed scheme against the Steelers, and still a weakness of our defense defending crossing routes and the middle of the field. It was passive secondary play, which is atypical of our defense. So, yeah, I'm still not too worried about this.

[Cynjin]

Well, we will find out tonight because I have to believe that the Giants will use condensed splits with the receivers in bunch formations.

[Superman]

Well, we will find out tonight because I have to believe that the Giants will use condensed splits with the receivers in bunch formations.

 

That's the other thing, they don't really have a good receiving corps. Are they gonna stack Beckham and Donnell? 

 

I think our secondary will be fine...

[Cynjin]

That's the other thing, they don't really have a good receiving corps. Are they gonna stack Beckham and Donnell? 

 

I think our secondary will be fine.

 

I certainly hope you are right.  I expect the Giants to try those formations, I also expect that the Colts coaches have made adjustments to counter those formations.

[Buck Showalter]

Dilfer was super annoying after the game harping on about this again...

Blah, blah, blah, bunch formation, bunxh formation...

Annoying, & I generally like Dilfer...

[crazycolt1]

I think you're referring to Dilfer, as in Trent the former Quarterback.

 

He's among the smartest minds out there.   Very sharp.

It's a good thing he has a sharp mind because he was not a very good QB. His lifetime QB rating was 70.1. He only played in 113 games in 14 seasons. In the one super bowl he did win he had 14 completions for 153 yards and 1 TD. The Ravens liked him so well they let him go after the super bowl win.

[NewColtsFan]

It's a good thing he has a sharp mind because he was not a very good QB. His lifetime QB rating was 70.1. He only played in 113 games in 14 seasons. In the one super bowl he did win he had 14 completions for 153 yards and 1 TD. The Ravens liked him so well they let him go after the super bowl win.

 

You're right.    He wasn't a very good QB.     But he knows it, and admits it.    He completely owns it.

 

But he's spent all his years since he retired learning as much as he can about the QB position.   I think of him as one of the leading authorities on the position.   Really a sharp guy.

 

And boy did he gush over Luck tonight in the post-game wrap-up and on SportsCenter.    Couldn't say enough good things about Andrew.....

 

I don't always agree with him,  but I think he's a sharp, sharp guy.....

[the cardinal]

I just watched his breakdown on this. I'm still kind of "meh" about it. I understand what he was saying, but a lot of those plays he showed from last week were zone coverage, which we don't play a lot of, or cross-matches putting Josh Gordy or Darius Butler on Martavus Bryant or Antonio Brown. 

 

To me, it was more a flawed scheme against the Steelers, and still a weakness of our defense defending crossing routes and the middle of the field. It was passive secondary play, which is atypical of our defense. So, yeah, I'm still not too worried about this.

But I think the problem is what happens when another team (like the Patriots) forces them out of press.. Hopefully Manusky doesn't go with a soft zone again. Venturi was on all the 1070 shows talking about this last week. Check out Dakich from 10/29: Link

[JPFolks]

Well, we will find out tonight because I have to believe that the Giants will use condensed splits with the receivers in bunch formations.

 

Nope.. not sure why they didn't (until very very late in garbage time) but they didn't.  You'd think they would have tried it.  I am guessing there's more to know about why they might not have (such as the scheme change was too much for a young core of players with no chemistry with their QB yet etc.). 

[Jason_]

You're right. He wasn't a very good QB. But he knows it, and admits it. He completely owns it.

But he's spent all his years since he retired learning as much as he can about the QB position. I think of him as one of the leading authorities on the position. Really a sharp guy.

And boy did he gush over Luck tonight in the post-game wrap-up and on SportsCenter. Couldn't say enough good things about Andrew.....

I don't always agree with him, but I think he's a sharp, sharp guy.....

Regarding dilfer, I agree with you. The fact is there are a lot of guys that are incredibly intelligent and know the ins and outs but can't put it together physically on the field. Another similar guy that comes to mind is Sean salisbury. He was really bad as a qb but he knew it and he owned it, but he had an extremely high football iq and imo is/was a very good analyst. Haven't seen him in quite a while though.

[NewColtsFan]

Regarding dilfer, I agree with you. The fact is there are a lot of guys that are incredibly intelligent and know the ins and outs but can't put it together physically on the field. Another similar guy that comes to mind is Sean salisbury. He was really bad as a qb but he knew it and he owned it, but he had an extremely high football iq and imo is/was a very good analyst. Haven't seen him in quite a while though.

 

I believe Sean is doing local radio in Dallas....   or some place in Texas.

 

He left ESPN (shoved out the door) after a sexual indiscretion with a young female employee....   He made a very unwanted advance and she was not interested.....   there's more to this but I don't want to get a warning point!

 

Sean has talked about it in interviews (print, not video that I'm aware of...)   but I think if you Google his name and leaving ESPN, you might get some interesting stories.....

[Jason_]

I believe Sean is doing local radio in Dallas....   or some place in Texas.

 

He left ESPN (shoved out the door) after a sexual indiscretion with a young female employee....   He made a very unwanted advance and she was not interested.....   there's more to this but I don't want to get a warning point!

 

Sean has talked about it in interviews (print, not video that I'm aware of...)   but I think if you Google his name and leaving ESPN, you might get some interesting stories.....

 

 

wow, that's really disappointing to hear.  didn't know any of that.  then again, the only NFL show I watch anymore other than the games of course is Monday night countdown.

[Cynjin]

Nope.. not sure why they didn't (until very very late in garbage time) but they didn't.  You'd think they would have tried it.  I am guessing there's more to know about why they might not have (such as the scheme change was too much for a young core of players with no chemistry with their QB yet etc.).

You're right, I was surprised they did not try it more. I don't understand why, you would think that they would, at least make the Colts prove that they can stop those formations. Glad to see it though.

[Valpo2004]

Gruden was saying the same thing but the Giants didn't really try it too often.  Either they are right and the Giants in 2 weeks missed it or that wasn't the problem or for some reason the Giants just can't run the plays they like out of bunch formations.

[amfootball]

I'm generally a fan of Dilfer and his analysis. I think he's got some presumptions about the Colts, though, that are wrong. Dead wrong. And I think he's kind of slow to move off of those presumptions, because he's been so adamant about them in the past. (For instance, he said earlier this year that the Colts have no weapons, the offensive line is terrible and can't block 5 on 4, etc. Things that have been proved dead wrong over the last 6 weeks.)

 

In this case, he says he went back and watched the Colts against bunch formations, and the secondary doesn't play well against them because they can't play bump and run, etc., etc. Fair point. It's true. The Colts aren't good against bunch and stack formations, but most teams have trouble with bunch and stack formations. Look at the Colts passing attack, and much we use bunch and stack formations this year, and think about how much that has to do with our offensive success this season. The Broncos do this also. The Steelers worked the Ravens last night with bunch formations. Like Coffee said, that's the reason teams use them.

 

My beef with Dilfer's comments is that he ignores the fact that our secondary is different this year than it has been in the past couple of years, which he says he's studied (and he's a film junkie, so I believe him). Vontae Davis is better this year than he's ever been, Greg Toler is healthy, we don't have Cassius Vaughn getting torched anymore, etc. 

 

Long story short, I'm not remotely worried about the secondary against bunch formations. Even after last week's miserable performance. 

He also said a few weeks ago that Brady hates his coaches and is upset at the org for "not attacking the Super Bowl."

 

Overall, I do like Dilfer and his insights but he likes to be "right" more than be an analyst.

[Superman]

You're right, I was surprised they did not try it more. I don't understand why, you would think that they would, at least make the Colts prove that they can stop those formations. Glad to see it though.

 

I only saw four condensed formations all game, and Eli didn't throw into those formations at all.

[Superman]

But I think the problem is what happens when another team (like the Patriots) forces them out of press.. Hopefully Manusky doesn't go with a soft zone again. Venturi was on all the 1070 shows talking about this last week. Check out Dakich from 10/29: Link

 

We don't have to play press. That's a mistaken assumption that a lot of people have. Our corners can still cover with a cushion, and we gave plenty of cushions last night, for instance. 

 

But there's a difference between man with a cushion at times, and soft zone. The first TD pass against the Steelers was a soft zone where no one ever engaged with or even attempted to cover the receiver. Bad play call, bad execution, 6 points. 

 

So even if you force us out of press, there's still a long way to go before we get back to the weak coverage we were playing last week. Every team plays softer against condensed formations; I expect us to use them to get Hilton off the line against the Patriots. But it's a total misapprehension that the Colts can't cover against condensed formations.

[BOTT]

I believe Sean is doing local radio in Dallas....   or some place in Texas.

 

He left ESPN (shoved out the door) after a sexual indiscretion with a young female employee....   He made a very unwanted advance and she was not interested.....   there's more to this but I don't want to get a warning point!

 

Sean has talked about it in interviews (print, not video that I'm aware of...)   but I think if you Google his name and leaving ESPN, you might get some interesting stories.....

I liked listening to Salisbury, but watching him interact with John Clayton was cringe worthy. He came off as the big jock picking on a nerd.