Salary cap space released!

[vinatierifan4]

This shows a breakdown of all the team's salary cap. Enjoy.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82a421db/article/available-salary-cap-space-for-all-32-nfl-teams?module=HP11_content_stream

[NewColtsFan]

At first, seeing the Colts with so much to spend caught me off guard. Then, I snapped out of it when I realized a fair chunk of that is going to....

-- Luck

-- Fleener

-- Allen

Once those three get signed, those numbers will change dramatically. In other words, almost all of it will disappear!

[FireJimCaldwell]

At first glance I'd say about 40% of that would be left after the 3 yet to be signed draft picks actually sign their contracts.

[shakedownstreet]

the jaguars are trying desperately to spend their remaining cap space, but can't find any takers

[Smonroe]

I wouldn't put a lot of faith in that number. I think that in the off season the top 51 salaries count against the cap. That number may be a bit high.

[Andy]

Good, we have room for Luck, Fleener, and Allen. After that, we'll probably have around 4.5M in space. Keep in mind, they'll be releasing tons of guys.

[Smonroe]

Good, we have room for Luck, Fleener, and Allen. After that, we'll probably have around 4.5M in space. Keep in mind, they'll be releasing tons of guys.

Well, the guys they'll be releasing most likely won't be the ones counting against the cap. In other words, we'll be right up against it once the three rookies are signed.

Which makes me wonder, how could we sign Jenkins even if we wanted to?

[BrentMc11]

I may be wrong, but I feel that there will be more 'cap' contracts released than we all think. I think some OL contracts will be released as well as one or two DL and DBs......I am not going to mention all of the names. The guys posting here know the 'borderline players whom I feel Grigson/Pagano will go with youth or an UFA.

We will see new faces via waiver wires, a camp trade for a CB, as well as more possibilities of FAs. This Salary cap news should be 'good news' for Colts fans.

Edited July 1, 2012 by BrentMc11

[dgambill]

Ok...just looking at this we have aprox. 12.5 million. We haven't signed Luck, Fleener, and Allen. Now last year those contracts for those respective picks were aprox. 4 mil, 950,000, and 550,000 after signing bonuses for those players. Now all of those could vary slightly this year if everything holds similar that should be basically 5.5 million dollars. That leaves us with aprox. 7 million left. That is WAY more than we believed by our cap experts on the board earlier. Either these numbers are off or mine are off but that seems to mean we have plenty of space to add a FA or two if someone gets released due to cap reasons and not performance.

Also looking at this it is clear there are a few teams that could afford Freeney's salary this year as well if we choose to move him....sadly they are mostly AFC South competitors though lol. Anyone else figure these numbers differently or does mine seem right???

Also looking at that it appears Denver has plenty of space left as well if anyone was interested because they didn't have a 1st round pick. Saved a bunch of money.

[Andy]

Well, the guys they'll be releasing most likely won't be the ones counting against the cap. In other words, we'll be right up against it once the three rookies are signed.

Which makes me wonder, how could we sign Jenkins even if we wanted to?

There are many ways to sign him. You give him the majority of the money in the latter part of his contract.

[Gavin]

There are many ways to sign him. You give him the majority of the money in the latter part of his contract.

Based on how well that worked out for us recently I wouldnt do that, if we were to sign him, seeing as how we arent expected to win alot this next year, I would just front load the contract, and when we grow and get real good make him earn the big bucks to play on a good team.....assuming we are real good by then......but I dont want him anyway

[ReMeDy]

There are many ways to sign him. You give him the majority of the money in the latter part of his contract.

You do the NFL 2k5 strategy where you put the majority of his contract on backload and then as the money piles up after the 2nd-3rd season in, you trade him .

[ReMeDy]

^ I should mention though I believe this is no longer allowed in real-life, or even if it is, it's not practical. Agents for players are no doubt going to refuse contracts like that, especially for aging veterans, like Freeney.

[ColtJ82]

There are many ways to sign him. You give him the majority of the money in the latter part of his contract.

That works with solid up front money....which drives up his cap hit. Agents aren't stupid....they know back loaded contracts typically don't get paid out.

[NewColtsFan]

Ok...just looking at this we have aprox. 12.5 million. We haven't signed Luck, Fleener, and Allen. Now last year those contracts for those respective picks were aprox. 4 mil, 950,000, and 550,000 after signing bonuses for those players. Now all of those could vary slightly this year if everything holds similar that should be basically 5.5 million dollars. That leaves us with aprox. 7 million left. That is WAY more than we believed by our cap experts on the board earlier. Either these numbers are off or mine are off but that seems to mean we have plenty of space to add a FA or two if someone gets released due to cap reasons and not performance.

Also looking at this it is clear there are a few teams that could afford Freeney's salary this year as well if we choose to move him....sadly they are mostly AFC South competitors though lol. Anyone else figure these numbers differently or does mine seem right???

Also looking at that it appears Denver has plenty of space left as well if anyone was interested because they didn't have a 1st round pick. Saved a bunch of money.

DG.....

Can I ask the website you use for the salary numbers? I'd love to take a look.

I think the numbers you have for Cam Newton are off. $22 Mill over 4 years. That's 5.5 per year amortized. A Mill for Fleener, a half-mill for Allen (assuming those numbers are correct) and that's $7 Mill for our 3 guys. Still, that leaves a fair amount left-over for any other deals still to be done.

Thanks for the info...

[NewColtsFan]

Following up my own post.... it's amazing what you can (sometimes) find on the internet...

I'm linking a website that has the salary figures for every player in the NFL... I'm linking the 2011 draft...

http://www.spotrac.c...acker/nfl/2011/

Newton (Luck in 2012) $5.5 Mill

the 34th pick (Fleener in 2012) $1.3 Mill

the 65th pick (Allen in 2012) $.700K

So, the 3 players should cost the Colts roughly $7.5 Mill.

Still leaving plenty for all other transactions we need/want to do.

Hope this helps....

[FireJimCaldwell]

Newton's 20011 cap hit was slightly over 4 million.

It's not as simple as 22/4.

[Moncrief]

Jaguars don't want to pay MJD

Ravens are >>>ed if the injury bug hits them

[NewColtsFan]

Newton's 20011 cap hit was slightly over 4 million.

It's not as simple as 22/4.

FJC....

You may indeed be right.... can you guide me to a website where I can read more about it? I'd like to learn more. Salary divided by years has always been the math I've used...

Thanks...

[FireJimCaldwell]

FJC....

You may indeed be right.... can you guide me to a website where I can read more about it? I'd like to learn more. Salary divided by years has always been the math I've used...

Thanks...

The sporttrac you quoted above is likely the best website for it, even though I have noticed it having some errors here and there.

If you look at Newton's page.

 YEAR BASE SALARY S. BONUS MISC. BONUS CAP HIT
2011  375,000  3,629,500  - 4,004,500
2012  1,376,159  3,629,500  - 5,005,659
2013  2,377,318  3,629,500  - 6,006,818
2014  3,378,477  3,629,500  - 7,007,977

The signing bonus is amortized over the 4 years, but he had base salaries that were somewhat staggered adding roughly 1 million to them each year.

I've seen reports that Luck's signing bonus will be exactly the same as Newton's, but it hasn't mentioned on whether there will be any variance over the base salaries.

Taking the contract dollars and dividing by the length can give a halfway decent estimate, but some most contracts are set up in a staggered format where they are cheaper and gradually grow. Rarely would you see a 5 year 60 million contract have a 12 million cap hit each year. Usually it would start out around 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, or something similar to that. Of course then a lot of that would depend on how much of the 60 was guaranteed.

http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/FAQ.aspx

Is a decent site with some examples and explanations.

[Superman]

Following up my own post.... it's amazing what you can (sometimes) find on the internet...

I'm linking a website that has the salary figures for every player in the NFL... I'm linking the 2011 draft...

http://www.spotrac.c...acker/nfl/2011/

Newton (Luck in 2012) $5.5 Mill

the 34th pick (Fleener in 2012) $1.3 Mill

the 65th pick (Allen in 2012) $.700K

So, the 3 players should cost the Colts roughly $7.5 Mill.

Still leaving plenty for all other transactions we need/want to do.

Hope this helps....

As FJC has mentioned, the average per year doesn't equal the cap hit per year. Based on last year's picks:

#1 = $4m

#34 = $900k

#65 = $550k

Total cap space alloted is just under $5.5m. Even if you round up, we're still at about $6m for our top three draft picks, in terms of cap space for 2012.

So if this NFL.com article is correct and we do indeed have over $14m in cap space as of right now, then we're looking at about $8m in remaining cap space. I haven't double-checked that number, but I think the article is taking only the 51 highest paid players on the roster for right now. I expect that number to change once cuts are final.

[NewColtsFan]

Thanks to everyone for the great responses.... good stuff... And agree that contracts are rarely the same cap hit for each hit. Likely almost never. But I thought the numbers would be much, much closer on these newer shorter rookie contracts. That was an assumption on my part. Seemed somewhat reasonable.

Bigger contracts, for larger money and more years, have much wilder cap hit swings from year to year. The player, the agent and the GM all know the deal will either get re-done before the big cap hit takes effect, or the player will be cut to mitigate the damage.

These days in the NFL, you need a Master's or a PHD in Economics to understand a lot of the financial considerations going on... can make your head spin sometimes... :???:

Thanks again....

[bavanlan]

These days in the NFL, you need a Master's or a PHD in Economics to understand a lot of the financial considerations going on... can make your head spin sometimes... :???:

Start Here:

http://images.nflplayers.com/mediaResources/files/PDFs/General/2011_Final_CBA_Searchable_Bookmarked.pdf

p. 90, Art. 13 Sec. 5. It's how I learned.

[dw49]

Start Here:

http://images.nflpla..._Bookmarked.pdf

p. 90, Art. 13 Sec. 5. It's how I learned.

Been trying o get your attention. Question ... could the Colts have signed players by simply giving them a large 2013 guaranteed roster bonus ? Seems to me that if they wanted a big time free agent all they had to do was give a small 2012 base and do a guaranteed bonus paid out in 2013. Or maybe if the player was injured and had to retire , it might make this deal not so good ?

[jimirsaysdog]

Following up my own post.... it's amazing what you can (sometimes) find on the internet...

I'm linking a website that has the salary figures for every player in the NFL... I'm linking the 2011 draft...

http://www.spotrac.c...acker/nfl/2011/

Newton (Luck in 2012) $5.5 Mill

the 34th pick (Fleener in 2012) $1.3 Mill

the 65th pick (Allen in 2012) $.700K

So, the 3 players should cost the Colts roughly $7.5 Mill.

Still leaving plenty for all other transactions we need/want to do.

Hope this helps....

that's a nice site but unfortunately it doesn't tell everything. many players have escalator clauses built into their contracts that can significantly raise their compensation levels in any given season. you can never get a true cap number without those clauses being known.

[Fx Stryker]

We have $14M to spend? Wow nice. Luck should be hitting at a $4M hit, Fleener at $1M and Allen at $600K-ish. That's based on the contracts from the 2011 draft.

Where are the money issues?

[bavanlan]

Been trying o get your attention. Question ... could the Colts have signed players by simply giving them a large 2013 guaranteed roster bonus ? Seems to me that if they wanted a big time free agent all they had to do was give a small 2012 base and do a guaranteed bonus paid out in 2013. Or maybe if the player was injured and had to retire , it might make this deal not so good ?

If the bonus is guaranteed for 2013 for injury and skill it is considered a signing bonus and prorated starting this year when guaranteed. If it's a roster bonus, you can do that because it's not guaranteed, but no one is going to sign that contract because they can be cut the next year and have effectively wasted a year.

that's a nice site but unfortunately it doesn't tell everything. many players have escalator clauses built into their contracts that can significantly raise their compensation levels in any given season. you can never get a true cap number without those clauses being known.

Fair point, except that in dealing with rookie contracts (as they are here), there is no other negotiable compensation other than rookie salary, offseason workout bonus and 5th year (if applicable).

[bavanlan]

We have $14M to spend? Wow nice. Luck should be hitting at a $4M hit, Fleener at $1M and Allen at $600K-ish. That's based on the contracts from the 2011 draft.

Where are the money issues?

Don't forget that we also need to keep about $5-7M in the bank for IR replacements at a minimum of $390K/player.

[FireJimCaldwell]

If the bonus is guaranteed for 2013 for injury and skill it is considered a signing bonus and prorated starting this year when guaranteed. If it's a roster bonus, you can do that because it's not guaranteed, but no one is going to sign that contract because they can be cut the next year and have effectively wasted a year.

Fair point, except that in dealing with rookie contracts (as they are here), there is no other negotiable compensation other than rookie salary, offseason workout bonus and 5th year (if applicable).

I'm not certain that is how a 2013 guarantee would be allocated cap wise.

The 5th year isn't negotiable. It's a team option.

[bavanlan]

I'm not certain that is how a 2013 guarantee would be allocated cap wise.

The 5th year isn't negotiable. It's a team option.

Semantics.

I can't (at least off the top of my head) think up a bonus excluded under Art. 13, Sec. 6(b)(iii) that's fully guaranteed starting in 2012 but not allocated until 2013; and I can't think up a real life example either. The only way those are handled is as a signing bonus prorated in accordance with Art. 13, Sec. 6(b)(i).

[FireJimCaldwell]

Semantics.

I can't (at least off the top of my head) think up a bonus excluded under Art. 13, Sec. 6(b)(iii) that's fully guaranteed starting in 2012 but not allocated until 2013; and I can't think up a real life example either. The only way those are handled is as a signing bonus prorated in accordance with Art. 13, Sec. 6(b)(i).

It's hard to discuss examples without having the physical contracts in hand.

I hate using Florio as an example, but he does have some resources, and at times gets his hands on certain contracts.

Whether its called a bonus or base salary. Mike Vick had some guarantees built into his latest contract that wasn't treated as a signing bonus.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/30/more-vick-contract-details/

Vick’s $20 million compensation for 2011 comes from a $7 million signing bonus, a $10 million guaranteed base salary, and a $3 million roster bonus. His cap number is $14.4 million, which created $1.8 million in additional cap room for the team.

In 2012, Vick earns a guaranteed base salary of $12.5 million. His cap number is $13.9 million.

Vick is also a unique example, because the team certainly didn't want to tie up a large signing bonus that could end up hurting them in the future if he returned to his felon ways of his past.

I've seen other reports of guaranteed dollars, but that amount doesn't equal the signing bonus of said player.

With that said there is a difference between a guaranteed base salary and a roster bonus, and I'm not 100% sure what the intent of DW's question was(i'm not one that can read minds like some around here can). I would say there would be ways to sign someone this year without a huge payout, but with guarantees for next year when the cap space increases.

Now whether or not the NFLPA/NFL would sign off on a deal that paid a player the league minimum in 2012, and then a much larger guaranteed salary in 2013 is another story. One or both sides might balk at the idea.

[bavanlan]

It's hard to discuss examples without having the physical contracts in hand.

I hate using Florio as an example, but he does have some resources, and at times gets his hands on certain contracts.

Whether its called a bonus or base salary. Mike Vick had some guarantees built into his latest contract that wasn't treated as a signing bonus.

http://profootballta...ntract-details/

Vick is also a unique example, because the team certainly didn't want to tie up a large signing bonus that could end up hurting them in the future if he returned to his felon ways of his past.

I've seen other reports of guaranteed dollars, but that amount doesn't equal the signing bonus of said player.

With that said there is a difference between a guaranteed base salary and a roster bonus, and I'm not 100% sure what the intent of DW's question was(i'm not one that can read minds like some around here can). I would say there would be ways to sign someone this year without a huge payout, but with guarantees for next year when the cap space increases.

Now whether or not the NFLPA/NFL would sign off on a deal that paid a player the league minimum in 2012, and then a much larger guaranteed salary in 2013 is another story. One or both sides might balk at the idea.

Excellent point and AFAIK a correct one. 6(d) covers guarantees for injury, skill, and cap and I didn't think it did.

You don't have a Deion or a 30% rule issue since we're not close to the end of the league year.

The biggest issue you may have is that the player has to wait a year or two or three (depending on how it's setup) to get paid.

[dgambill]

Yeah I used the same website as you but the breakdown of the contract varies. So...we have 7 million. If that is the case it makes a lot more sense why we haven't moved Freeney and also is why we were interested in Jenkins and extending him.

This should give us some flexibility if someone gets cut for cap reasons we may be able to afford to pick them up. I will say this also the reason we shouldn't be so fast to say we are going to be in better shape next year. It is clear that our division is in pretty good shape to improve themselves as well...especially the Titans who I think are a team we will continue to have a good rivalry with.

[dw49]

It's hard to discuss examples without having the physical contracts in hand.

I hate using Florio as an example, but he does have some resources, and at times gets his hands on certain contracts.

Whether its called a bonus or base salary. Mike Vick had some guarantees built into his latest contract that wasn't treated as a signing bonus.

http://profootballta...ntract-details/

Vick is also a unique example, because the team certainly didn't want to tie up a large signing bonus that could end up hurting them in the future if he returned to his felon ways of his past.

I've seen other reports of guaranteed dollars, but that amount doesn't equal the signing bonus of said player.

With that said there is a difference between a guaranteed base salary and a roster bonus, and I'm not 100% sure what the intent of DW's question was(i'm not one that can read minds like some around here can). I would say there would be ways to sign someone this year without a huge payout, but with guarantees for next year when the cap space increases.

Now whether or not the NFLPA/NFL would sign off on a deal that paid a player the league minimum in 2012, and then a much larger guaranteed salary in 2013 is another story. One or both sides might balk at the idea.

[FireJimCaldwell]

Yes , you read my question properly. It seems to me that we could in some way load a player up with money to be paid out in 2013. But I don't have that great of an understanding of just what is "guranteed." Vicks contract is mentioned and how about cam Newton's ?I read where the entire 24 mill. is guaranteed. I think the whole issue is whether or not the contract could protect the player for the money we couldn't give him as a 2012 signing bonus (he gets it in 2013) if he has a carrer ending injury or is cut.

I wasn't sure if you were using the term bonus, as the only instrument that could be guaranteed.

Cam Newton's 4 year deal if fully guaranteed. If he went surfing and had his hand bitten off then he's going to get paid his full salary for the 4 years.

From my understanding the team could sign player x to a 3 year deal, and agree to pay him at a lower salary for 2012(possibly the league minimum), but guarantee his salary for 2013 vs. skill/injury/etc.

Let's say that 2013 salary was to be 10 million. If he gets hurt in 2012, he would still be paid. Now if a team tried to get creative and sign a player at a league minimum in 2012, and then pay them 30 million guaranteed in 2013, which could then be converted to a signing bonus after the year is up and extended the contract then the NFL might frown upon that happening. They might look at that as a team circumventing the salary cap.

It all depends on the two sides being comfortable with the deal and the NFL signing off on it as well.

[dw49]

I wasn't sure if you were using the term bonus, as the only instrument that could be guaranteed.

Cam Newton's 4 year deal if fully guaranteed. If he went surfing and had his hand bitten off then he's going to get paid his full salary for the 4 years.

From my understanding the team could sign player x to a 3 year deal, and agree to pay him at a lower salary for 2012(possibly the league minimum), but guarantee his salary for 2013 vs. skill/injury/etc.

Let's say that 2013 salary was to be 10 million. If he gets hurt in 2012, he would still be paid. Now if a team tried to get creative and sign a player at a league minimum in 2012, and then pay them 30 million guaranteed in 2013, which could then be converted to a signing bonus after the year is up and extended the contract then the NFL might frown upon that happening. They might look at that as a team circumventing the salary cap.

It all depends on the two sides being comfortable with the deal and the NFL signing off on it as well.

[bavanlan]

My original thought was that we could give just a small signing bonus and pretty much league min in 2012. Then give a guaranteed roster bonus for 2013 that was big enough to make up for the short fall in 2012. The roster bonus woud then be turned into another signing bonus if so desired. It's possible the Cots might have opted to use up some of the 2013 space. Now if the 2013 roster bonus couldn't be guaranteed regardless of injury or poor performance , then the player would never go for it. I think bav feels that the roster bonus couldn't be fully guaranteed which would make this a no go. If you do it by salary , then I would think that the cap hit would pretty much have to be "eaten" in 2013 . I guess that would probably not make it too tempting for the Colts as you would be blowing such a huge chunk of the 2013 space on one player. Colts would be better served to bring in more help in numbers.

I think you've got it.

[adfisher870]

Well, the guys they'll be releasing most likely won't be the ones counting against the cap. In other words, we'll be right up against it once the three rookies are signed.

Which makes me wonder, how could we sign Jenkins even if we wanted to?

If they can get him for approx 4 mil this year next year if i remeber right we will be top 3 as far as cap space next year. So making room not a huge issue

[Superman]

Let's say that 2013 salary was to be 10 million. If he gets hurt in 2012, he would still be paid. Now if a team tried to get creative and sign a player at a league minimum in 2012, and then pay them 30 million guaranteed in 2013, which could then be converted to a signing bonus after the year is up and extended the contract then the NFL might frown upon that happening. They might look at that as a team circumventing the salary cap.

It all depends on the two sides being comfortable with the deal and the NFL signing off on it as well.

I think that kind of deal happens all the time though. The question is whether the player and his agent are willing to forgo that compensation until Year 2.

The NFL nixed those kind of deals going into the uncapped 2010 season, which is why the Redskins and Cowboys got penalized. But that's usually not forbidden, I don't think.

[FireJimCaldwell]

I think that kind of deal happens all the time though. The question is whether the player and his agent are willing to forgo that compensation until Year 2.

The NFL nixed those kind of deals going into the uncapped 2010 season, which is why the Redskins and Cowboys got penalized. But that's usually not forbidden, I don't think.

I guess the biggest question at that point would be comparing the other offers they have on the table and the situations. If it's guaranteed, then some surely would. Some wouldn't.