Colts select Ryan Kelly, C, Alabama

[Colts_Fan12]

2 hours ago, Dustin said:

 

Yeah terrible value, but at least he's a good player. 

Yeah I agree but will always be a reach IMO 

[rockywoj]

Am I the only person here that is sick and tired of all this incessant "BPA" baloney that so many trump as being inflexible gospel?

 

At pick 18,  do you BPA lemmings REALLY think that there is a definitive, substantial talent difference between players 15 to say 20 to 25?  There are at almost every spot in the draft a grouping of 5 players or more with very similar talent and prospect for success, and I strongly consider all this BPA talk as just the latest trendy fashion garbage talk.

 

TEAM building will always necessitate balancing BPA talk with well rounded roster needs.  

 

Regarding Kelly, IF what the "experts" are saying is true, that he's a day 1, 10 year starter that will spend the majority of his career playing at a Pro Bowl level, then all the BPA naysaying is utter lunacy.   On offense, OC and ROG are THE team's biggest offensive needs and if the evaluation on Kelly is correct, then you just solved what is arguably the team's biggest offensive need.

 

I have not heard ANY day 1, 10 year starter, perennial Pro Bowl level consensus talk about ANY defensive players available at 18th.  Rather, I heard a lot of speculative projections about players that might turn out to be good, or (in the case of Jack) consensus about talent, but that mitigated by strong health concerns.

 

BPA, pfft, trendy fashion.  

 

I am VERY pleased with the selection of Ryan Kelly!   Now I hope Noah Spence falls to the Colts in the 2nd round, but I am sure there are a lot of decent D prospects still to be had, so it's all looking A-OK to me so far.

[SP_21]

4 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Watch his tape over his three years at starting at Bama.  If you are going to judge a player over one game after three seasons of doing nothing but winning awards then I think you are pretty narrow minded. Now maybe it is you who needs to look at all the tape and get back to me.

Just stop. Why are you taking this so personally? I said I was fine with the pick. I think we could have found more value elsewhere but I'm fine with Kelly. That Clemson game came to mind and I mentioned it wasn't great. I'm certain he's had better games. 

 

Are you actually Ryan Kelly? Can I get an autographed jersey hahaha? 

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, akcolt said:

I'm by no means panicked and I don't care about our grade from the talking heads.Kiper is wrong more than the weatherman. 

 

If he fixes the OL I'm thrilled. Some seem to think that is a foregone conclusion. I don't think he was the best player or great value. I think a C at 18 was a reach. I don't see the huge gap between him and Martin or Seumola. Bama players and the hype make me nervous. 

 

 

Go watch the tape of Kelly. Look for yourself. Just because you don't like a center taken in the first round the Colts though different. Before telling yourself a center is not worth a first round pick go look at the history of centers taken in the first round. All 6 ended up being pro bowl players. A center is a premium position when you have a premium player playing center.

[Track Guy]

21 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Kelly is much better than any other center in the draft. He's twice as good as Boehm. It's really not close.

 

Not a good value, sure, but that's not because there are other centers in this draft. Kelly blows them all away. JMO

 

Agreed. He's the best center. The second best real center to me is Nick Martin. And honestly I think the drop off from Kelly to Martin is at least as big (and probably bigger) than some of these later 1st round edge rushers or DTs people want compared to what will be available at 48. There are lots of good players left. Alexander, Ragland, Reed, Jones, Spence, Billings, Bullard, Jack, Thompson, Fackrell, Correa, Calhoun. That's just 12 defensive guys off the top of my head who are pretty good prospects. At least a few should be available at 48. 

[Jackie Daytona]

2 hours ago, coltsfanatic24 said:

It was a safe pick but he wasn't the BPA. Myles Jack and Lawson are much better players then Kelly.  Premium picks on lineman are a waste. Should have went defense. Grigson needs to go. 

Lol I love the sarcasm!

[21isSuperman]

Does he sound very similar to Anthony Castonzo when he talks, or is that just me? 

[esmort]

Just now, Gavin said:

Or you could use a bit more logical here and know that there was a shift in draft philosophy with this first pick unlike the last few years 

 

So the new philosophy is draft for need ... nice to know we can switch philosophies when need be ... too bad he didn't realize this with some of his other picks or he didn't run his mouth about things he that now make him look like a *.

 

None of which changes the fact Kelly was not the best player we could have gotten.

[Jackie Daytona]

28 minutes ago, stitches said:

I like the pick, but I'm left with a bittersweet taste in my mouth, because we passed on my favorite player in the draft(Lawson).

 

With all that said, I've been getting warmer and warmer towards getting Kelly in the first and I'm actually happy we finally have a good center.

Lawson is a nice player, but he would be more DE for us at 270 lbs, even if he played OLB, he's much more Courtney Upshaw than he is Von Miller

[braveheartcolt]

2 hours ago, coltsfanatic24 said:

Those are outliers and only Pace won a superbowl. Defense wins championships in every sport. Jack and Lawson IMO would have helped out the team a lot more then Kelly. 

You do know that Barcelona have been the most successful soccer team in the world over the past 10 years. They have had no better than an average defence over this period. Their success is based on attack! So I poo-poo your 'every sport' comment.....

 

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, Track Guy said:

 

Agreed. He's the best center. The second best real center to me is Nick Martin. And honestly I think the drop off from Kelly to Martin is at least as big (and probably bigger) than some of these later 1st round edge rushers or DTs people want compared to what will be available at 48. There are lots of good players left. Alexander, Ragland, Reed, Jones, Spence, Billings, Bullard, Jack, Thompson, Fackrell, Correa, Calhoun. That's just 12 defensive guys off the top of my head who are pretty good prospects. At least a few should be available at 48. 

 

To me, Kelly is at least a full round better than Martin.

[Jackie Daytona]

4 minutes ago, Track Guy said:

 

Agreed. He's the best center. The second best real center to me is Nick Martin. And honestly I think the drop off from Kelly to Martin is at least as big (and probably bigger) than some of these later 1st round edge rushers or DTs people want compared to what will be available at 48. There are lots of good players left. Alexander, Ragland, Reed, Jones, Spence, Billings, Bullard, Jack, Thompson, Fackrell, Correa, Calhoun. That's just 12 defensive guys off the top of my head who are pretty good prospects. At least a few should be available at 48. 

I agree, and I am a die hard ND fan, and know Martin pretty well... Martin is a good prospect, but he was never the same after his leg injury prior to last year....

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, esmort said:

None of which changes the fact Kelly was not the best player we could have gotten.

 

Who was?

[SP_21]

11 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I never said you said he wasn't the best center, sooo....

 

Just because you can get a center later in the draft doesn't really mean anything.

You really think there's a huge difference between them? CBS and NFL.com have Kelly graded slightly higher and the biggest difference is Boehm lacks ideal size. 

 

I think Boehm is gonna make some team extremely happy. 

[Gavin]

5 minutes ago, esmort said:

 

So the new philosophy is draft for need ... nice to know we can switch philosophies when need be ... too bad he didn't realize this with some of his other picks or he didn't run his mouth about things he that now make him look like a *.

 

None of which changes the fact Kelly was not the best player we could have gotten.

Ok so your just going to gripe at Grigson either way so Ill leave you to that and not get into a long drawn out pointless discussion on this. By the way maybe you should consider the change in philosophy was dictated to Grigson from Irsay......hmmm

[esmort]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

To me, Kelly is at least a full round better than Martin.

 

How much does that difference translate on the field though especially compared to other positions?  If he is not perennially a top 3 center. All Pro, etc ...,  than who cares if he is the 5th best or 15th best ... as long as he isn't at the bottom like our previous centers I don't think we are going to notice that much difference.

[Derakynn]

Even though I didn't want to draft a center in the first, I think it'd ridiculous how much people are complaining. I read a stat from Twitter that said Kelly allowed 4 QB hurries and 0 sacks the entire season. I don't know about you, but that sounds like some play that would help me get over the fact I wanted to go defense. 

 

Also, the pick already happened. Stop dwelling in the past. It literally could not matter less what could have been done. The question is: what CAN be done NOW? And that is all that really matters. There are more picks in this draft. We are just getting to the rounds where Grigson really shines. So put on your adult pants and get on with it. 

[crazycolt1]

2 hours ago, coltsfanatic24 said:

Grigson will never change. The guy just doesn't get it. Defense wins championships. 

Not when your starting QB is on the sidelines on IR.

[NewColtsFan]

10 minutes ago, esmort said:

 

So the new philosophy is draft for need ... nice to know we can switch philosophies when need be ... too bad he didn't realize this with some of his other picks or he didn't run his mouth about things he that now make him look like a *.

 

None of which changes the fact Kelly was not the best player we could have gotten.

 

Why do you view it as a "fact" that Kelly was not the best player?

 

If you accept that every team sees things differently then why is it hard to accept that Kelly was at least the 18th best player?

 

[crazycolt1]

2 minutes ago, Derakynn said:

Even though I didn't want to draft a center in the first, I think it'd ridiculous how much people are complaining. I read a stat from Twitter that said Kelly allowed 4 QB hurries and 0 sacks the entire season. I don't know about you, but that sounds like some play that would help me get over the fact I wanted to go defense. 

 

Also, the pick already happened. Stop dwelling in the past. It literally could not matter less what could have been done. The question is: what CAN be done NOW? And that is all that really matters. There are more picks in this draft. We are just getting to the rounds where Grigson really shines. So put on your adult pants and get on with it. 

That don't feed the argumentative needs of the negative mindsets.

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, SP_21 said:

You really think there's a huge difference between them? CBS and NFL.com have Kelly graded slightly higher and the biggest difference is Boehm lacks ideal size. 

 

I think Boehm is gonna make some team extremely happy. 

 

I don't even think Boehm is close. He's nice for a mid round guy, but he doesn't have length or good lateral movement (which means if he's too slow picking up a rusher, he can't make up for it with his arms). He might be a steal for someone in the 4th or 5th, but he's nowhere near as good a prospect as Kelly.

 

Again, JMO, but I've watched them both, and a handful of the rest.

[braveheartcolt]

2 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

We can still get 2 or 3 Good Defensive players in Rounds 2-7. If we don't protect Luck we don't have a team.

What, like Anderson and Parry? 

[NewColtsFan]

46 minutes ago, SP_21 said:

Watch his tape against Clemson and get back to me. 

 

I haven't seen the tape,  but Lawson and Dodd are ends....   Kelly is the center.     How often do you think Kelly was responsible for taking care of an end?   

 

I appreciate that stunts are done and Kelly is going to be the guy some of the time,   but no where have I seen Kelly criticized for what happened in that game.

 

You're the first person I've seen anywhere to bring it up....

 

[will426]

Lol draft oline Grigson they say..then he drafts a center in the first...why didn't you take something else in the first Grigson they now say.....now we have a future center..and that's been the worst spot on the line..and you're mad that it's in the first who the hell cares people 

[crazycolt1]

23 minutes ago, akcolt said:

I'm by no means panicked and I don't care about our grade from the talking heads.Kiper is wrong more than the weatherman. 

 

If he fixes the OL I'm thrilled. Some seem to think that is a foregone conclusion. I don't think he was the best player or great value. I think a C at 18 was a reach. I don't see the huge gap between him and Martin or Seumola. Bama players and the hype make me nervous. 

 

 

I don't get this great value deal. They are all under rookie contracts. It pretty much falls in line with the pick. If Kelly becomes a starter he will be under paid for a few years so its a mute fact IMO.

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, esmort said:

 

How much does that difference translate on the field though especially compared to other positions?  If he is not perennially a top 3 center. All Pro, etc ...,  than who cares if he is the 5th best or 15th best ... as long as he isn't at the bottom like our previous centers I don't think we are going to notice that much difference.

 

That's not really my point; I'm only saying that if the Colts had Kelly as a first rounder and Martin as a second rounder, then I agree with them. Maybe I'm wrong about how good he is, but that's unknown for a couple years.

 

As for the center position, I agree with the thinking that a) the difference between a good and very good center doesn't really translate to wins, and b) the position is the least physically demanding of any OL position, which means you can get away with a lesser player at that position, if any. That's why, traditionally, centers don't go that high in the draft and don't make a lot of money, except for the very best.

 

Yet, if the Colts could redo the 2013 draft, I think everyone would be okay with taking Travis Frederick instead of Werner at #24. 

[NewColtsFan]

25 minutes ago, akcolt said:

I'm by no means panicked and I don't care about our grade from the talking heads.Kiper is wrong more than the weatherman. 

 

If he fixes the OL I'm thrilled. Some seem to think that is a foregone conclusion. I don't think he was the best player or great value. I think a C at 18 was a reach. I don't see the huge gap between him and Martin or Seumola. Bama players and the hype make me nervous. 

 

 

 

If you think Kiper is the only one who signs the praises of Kelly, you're wrong.

 

Most EVERYONE loves the guy.     Almost every analyst mocked Kelly in the first.

 

One of the most common comments I read about Kelly was that he was easily the best center in the class, and there was no close second.      In fact, the other quote I read a lot was that Kelly was the best center prospect since Frederick and he came out in 2013.

 

The guy is good....   really, really good.

 

[Superman]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

I don't get this great value deal. They are all under rookie contracts. It pretty much falls in line with the pick. If Kelly becomes a starter he will be under paid for a few years so its a mute fact IMO.

 

Draft value, not contract value.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, coltsfanatic24 said:

It was a safe pick but he wasn't the BPA. Myles Jack and Lawson are much better players then Kelly.  Premium picks on lineman are a waste. Should have went defense. Grigson needs to go. 

 

Did you happen to notice that every single team passed on Miles Jack?     Do you know what his medicals are?

 

And that Lawson fell to 19?     It's not even clear that Lawson is a scheme fit.

 

[esmort]

10 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Why do you view it as a "fact" that Kelly was not the best player?

 

If you accept that every team sees things differently then why is it hard to accept that Kelly was at least the 18th best player?

 

 

No one can never know for sure .... I just don't believe that it really happened that by sheer coincidence a position of need that Grigson has consistently struck out on happened to be the BPA based purely on talent. 

 

Not that I have been/or am a proponent of sticking to that philosophy .. but according to Grigson he supposedly has such a philosophy.  And if we were going to deviate from that philosophy we could have benefited on other picks in previous drafts .. or we did and Grigson is just full of it and whiffed ... hmmm

[Superman]

21 minutes ago, Shafty138 said:

Lawson is a nice player, but he would be more DE for us at 270 lbs, even if he played OLB, he's much more Courtney Upshaw than he is Von Miller

 

He's a better pass rusher than Upshaw, IMO, and aside from the shoulder news (which I didn't see until after he was drafted) I would have been fine with him at #18. 

[cbear]

Very happy!!  I never understood this idea about centers and guards.  Seems like they are considered almost irrelevant with the idea that you can pick them up anywhere and make do.  Well, tell that to Andrew or any other QB who's getting the middle of the line pushed back in his face, or an RB who's always having to run into the back of his OLmen.  C, G, T...to me, they are all important and we got the best one.  I'm happy.

[RockThatBlue]

Very good pick.

 

Luck now has his Jeff Saturday.

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

Draft value, not contract value.

Draft value don't tell the whole story. We both know that. We both also know no matter who was taken there would be some who would have a problem. IMO Kelly was a fine pick.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, coltsfanatic24 said:

Lawson is actually fast. Grigson drafted for need again. Kelly is a solid player but drafting him won't stop Luck from getting hurt again. The Cowboys had a great O-line and Romo got hurt. I'm fed up with Grigson, so tired of him drafting offense in every 1st round when there's not much talent on defense. 

 

Drafted for need.....    again?

 

You mean like last year when this website had a meltdown over Grigson drafting Dorsett as BPA and he passed on our primary needs?

 

 

[braveheartcolt]

2 hours ago, SP_21 said:

You're right. And we could have used one of our 6 other picks on a center. 

 

Im not furious over the pick. I think Kelly is a fine player but he was not a good value and Luck has hurt himself as much as the O-line has let him down. 

Pray tell, how do you know someone is not 'good value' before they have played one single snap in the NFL? You must have a top quality crystal ball.......looking forward to your season predictions in a few months.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, coltsfanatic24 said:

Grigson will never change. The guy just doesn't get it. Defense wins championships. 

 

We have picks in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th rounds.     I'm expecting most, if not all of them,  will be used on defense.

 

[Superman]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

Draft value don't tell the whole story. We both know that. We both also know no matter who was taken there would be some who would have a problem. IMO Kelly was a fine pick.

 

Nothing tells the whole story. That's why we're talking about everything (except contract value, which isn't relevant at #18). 

 

I agree with the bolded. 

 

Truth is, there was no consensus at that spot. Not here, not among media people, nowhere. Pundits were in love with mocking Decker, and he went at #16 (which is kind of a laugh, IMO, but whatever). Lately, the pick has been Eli Apple, who went 10th. Lawson has the shoulder. Jack has the knee. 

[Superman]

5 minutes ago, esmort said:

No one can never know for sure .... I just don't believe that it really happened that by sheer coincidence a position of need that Grigson has consistently struck out on happened to be the BPA based purely on talent. 

 

 

I ask again, who was?

 

What player who was picked after Kelly represented a better pick on the basis of BPA?

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, akcolt said:

I'm not a fan. Let's sit back and watch Martin be there at 48 maybe  even in the 3rd I'm not convinced Kelly would not have been there at 48. He certainly wasn't the best player on the board at 18. Epic fail. 

 

The end of the sesson the board was upset we didn't lose more games to get a better pick. This board was reallly mad winning games. I wasn't one of the lose for a better pick gang. What's the point of a better pick now? We had our chance and we took a C

 

The talent on the D still left on the board. Impact players is what we need that was the cry on this board. We won't have a shot at a pick this high in years. I heard it from a lot of people. We reach for  Kelly at 18 and everyone's happy with that? 

 

I know it was a need. I totally agree the biggest need on the team. It MIGHT solve our problem at C. I don't think Kelly is that much better than Martin if at all. Seumola is right behind them. Kelly is not guaranteed multiple pro bowls because Kiper said so. Does anyone really think he was the most talented player available? Spence, Billings, Jack, Jackson, our pick of the litter on D. 

 

I'm surprised by the pick and more than a little disappointed. Did Grig's change his draft stragety or suddenly find hidden value in the C position?  Throw out the QB's we should have the 16th best player in this draft and we don't  I can't get behind that. We should have walked with one of the best 10 players on D. 

 

 

 

Goodness gracious.....   for a guy who appears to love and follow the draft,  this post reflects that you paid almost no attention to most anything.

 

Quit being stuck on Kiper.     Almost everyone LOVES Kelly.    This has nothing to do with Kiper.

 

Look at the names of who you think the Colts should've taken.      Spence, Billings,  Jack. 

 

Hello,  there's three names that are still available.    All the teams passed on them.     All of them.

 

This is a strange post from you........