Arthur jones

[Nesjan3]

Who else watches and grades every player on every play of every game, then publishes them? Do you?

no I don't, I just think its funny how everybody jumps on there horse and takes their word for it when they put our grades out, im just saying these guys aren't perfect and cant be relied upon to provide realistic and perfect analysis all the time. anyone who thinks so and goes to them as a backstop is dumb

[Superman]

no I don't, I just think its funny how everybody jumps on there horse and takes their word for it when they put our grades out, im just saying these guys aren't perfect and cant be relied upon to provide realistic and perfect analysis all the time. anyone who thinks so and goes to them as a backstop is dumb

 

I don't prop PFF up as gospel. I think their grades are recreational, at best. But there's some insight to be gained from scrutinizing games the way they do. So I'm also not as dismissive of their grading as others are. No way anyone -- even league personnel -- can claim that their grading/rating is completely objective and infallibly accurate, but there is some value to what they do.

 

And their charting speaks for itself.

[Nesjan3]

I don't prop PFF up as gospel. I think their grades are recreational, at best. But there's some insight to be gained from scrutinizing games the way they do. So I'm also not as dismissive of their grading as others are. No way anyone -- even league personnel -- can claim that their grading/rating is completely objective and infallibly accurate, but there is some value to what they do.

 

And their charting speaks for itself.

You have a great point they do provide insight, but as I am preaching they are not perfect, they are not coaches, they are not NFL personel, they are people who stand on the side on grade players on a week to week basis with the same limited NFL knowledge that most of us outside the league have, therefore I don't see them as the most reliable source for evaluated players

[dudeski]

I always look forward to your incredibly insightful posts.

i will try to post more

[OLD FAN MAN]

Arthur Jones was PFFs worst rated defensive player for the Colts (2nd worst overall to Aquib Takin). -3.0 overall, -1.0 run, -1.1 pass rush.

Cory Redding is our stud and Erik Walden is playing really well. Those 2 guys jump off the screen. Also, Newsome looks to be a good one in the making. Strickly speaking of d-line and OLBs.

pff rating - 10 by me, they need more study of the game, they may improve but doubtful

[Superman]

You have a great point they do provide insight, but as I am preaching they are not perfect, they are not coaches, they are not NFL personel, they are people who stand on the side on grade players on a week to week basis with the same limited NFL knowledge that most of us outside the league have, therefore I don't see them as the most reliable source for evaluated players

 

I'd argue that they have more NFL knowledge than the average NFL fan. But that's not really the point. Even if they don't, it's not that hard for someone to watch a play and say "that guy did a good job," or "that guy did a bad job." It's not rocket science, it's football. 

 

Again, I'm not trying to defend their grading. A lot of the time I disagree with it, but I don't chart every player on every play of every game, so it's kind of hard for me to really argue with their grades. I could be impressed by 25% of a player's snaps, and not paying a whole lot of attention to the other 75% of the plays where that player wasn't doing a good job. Without charting, it's impossible to really argue against the grades/ratings of an organization that has 2-3 people watch every player on every play of every game. Especially on the basis of "they don't know what they're doing," as if I know them personally and can claim that I know the game better than they do.

[Nesjan3]

I'd argue that they have more NFL knowledge than the average NFL fan. But that's not really the point. Even if they don't, it's not that hard for someone to watch a play and say "that guy did a good job," or "that guy did a bad job." It's not rocket science, it's football. 

anybody could start grading players week in week out, start a website and start charging money to see there grades, these guys got lucky and blew up and became popular..just saying

[dudeski]

I'd argue that they have more NFL knowledge than the average NFL fan. But that's not really the point. Even if they don't, it's not that hard for someone to watch a play and say "that guy did a good job," or "that guy did a bad job." It's not rocket science, it's football.

Again, I'm not trying to defend their grading. A lot of the time I disagree with it, but I don't chart every player on every play of every game, so it's kind of hard for me to really argue with their grades. I could be impressed by 25% of a player's snaps, and not paying a whole lot of attention to the other 75% of the plays where that player wasn't doing a good job. Without charting, it's impossible to really argue against the grades/ratings of an organization that has 2-3 people watch every player on every play of every game. Especially on the basis of "they don't know what they're doing," as if I know them personally and can claim that I know the game better than they do.

its easy to argue against them.

[Superman]

its easy to argue against them.

 

Show me your pass coverage grade for Vontae Davis in yesterday's game.

[ColtsLegacy]

its easy to argue against them.

 

When have you ever formed an argument?

[basspapaw]

I can say without any doubt something or someone made this team slow down the run, for the most part the of the year the d-line was very porous, and now it looks pretty solid,So is it jones or something else?  

[Superman]

I can say without any doubt something or someone made this team slow down the run, for the most part the of the year the d-line was very porous, and now it looks pretty solid,So is it jones or something else?  

 

I don't think the run defense or the defensive line was porous. I think, aside from the Pats game and the two Texans games, the run defense was pretty good. Take out those three games, and we gave up 99.6 yards/game on the ground. Those three games, we gave up 173 yards/game. 

[OffensivelyPC]

anybody could start grading players week in week out, start a website and start charging money to see there grades, these guys got lucky and blew up and became popular..just saying

Yes, and perhaps in the website's infancy, that's all it was.  But like with most anythign else, the more experience you have in doing something, learning from mistakes and trying to improve, the better you are going to get at it.  People don't learn this stuff overnight and the fact that those guys have been doing it since 2004 (2008 was when they nailed down the process to what you see now on tehir website, according to them) is better than most fans like us. 

 

After watching that many games, players, and player snaps, you not only can watch a player and say that he did good/average/bad, but you can develop a system of rules and guidelines when you are grading to normalize your grades (i.e. comparing positions across teams).  This ensures that you are grading consistently and not just looking at everything in a vacuum.  So i mean, yeah, people can start grading players, but if I started today for hte first time, I'm not going to have the experience as someone who's been doing it for 10 years, much less the system of grading that is tailored to what I am seeing.

[Dustin]

Yes, and perhaps in the website's infancy, that's all it was.  But like with most anythign else, the more experience you have in doing something, learning from mistakes and trying to improve, the better you are going to get at it.  People don't learn this stuff overnight and the fact that those guys have been doing it since 2004 (2008 was when they nailed down the process to what you see now on tehir website, according to them) is better than most fans like us. 

 

After watching that many games, players, and player snaps, you not only can watch a player and say that he did good/average/bad, but you can develop a system of rules and guidelines when you are grading to normalize your grades (i.e. comparing positions across teams).  This ensures that you are grading consistently and not just looking at everything in a vacuum.  So i mean, yeah, people can start grading players, but if I started today for hte first time, I'm not going to have the experience as someone who's been doing it for 10 years, much less the system of grading that is tailored to what I am seeing.

 

Not only that, but NFL teams (about 1/3) pay tons of money fore their analysis. 

[TheJACKCOLT]

Anyone can see that the run defense is better when Jones is on the field, it doesn't take grades from PFF (which I enjoy) you can see it with your own eyes. I would imagining grading the defensive lineman would be the toughest to grade. RB have yards,  CB catches against them, and so forth, but DL can stop a play without making a tackle, buy occupying blockers and shutting down lanes, I would imagine services like PFF would have a tougher time grading DL than any other position, either way the eye test shows that the defense is much better with Jones on the field and that is exactly what the Colts signed him for.

[Dark Superman]

Jones has been playing some great football, as well as Chapman.. If we cut RJF and Redding retires, we need to keep adding to this defensive front..

[OffensivelyPC]

Not only that, but NFL teams (about 1/3) pay tons of money fore their analysis. 

That signature line is hilarious.  "Royalties, son." 

[throwing BBZ]

Holmes is the weak link in the line. At first viewing I thought he was solid last week but watching it again and reading Ben Gundy's line review at Colts Authority, he is the clear weak link and he is on the ground way too much as a lineman.

Our line play the last two weeks has been solid but not great. Run blocking this week was awful. Andrew Luck has maneuvered himself in the pocket masterfully to cover up a lot of holes, missed assignments, and poor blocks.

As for Author Jones, I haven't seen him do anything special. I'm not using PFF as my bible but it just reaffirms my feelings about him so far.

 

 Castonzo stuck out like a sore thumb as the weak link Sunday.

[ColtsLegacy]

Castonzo stuck out like a sore thumb as the weak link Sunday.

Wrong, as usual. He wasn't as good as he generally has been this season but he certainly wasn't the weak link.

You've had it out for Castonzo this whole season even though he's had a very good, if not excellent, season.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

Played his best game as a Colt Sunday!!

[dudeski]

Show me your pass coverage grade for Vontae Davis in yesterday's game.

b+

[dudeski]

Anyone can see that the run defense is better when Jones is on the field, it doesn't take grades from PFF (which I enjoy) you can see it with your own eyes. I would imagining grading the defensive lineman would be the toughest to grade. RB have yards, CB catches against them, and so forth, but DL can stop a play without making a tackle, buy occupying blockers and shutting down lanes, I would imagine services like PFF would have a tougher time grading DL than any other position, either way the eye test shows that the defense is much better with Jones on the field and that is exactly what the Colts signed him for.

catches against a cb is a horrible way to judge a cb

[Superman]

b+

 

That grade is terrible, you don't know what you're talking about, you don't know football.

[ColtsLegacy]

b+

Trash.

[CardiacColts]

b+

Thank God I never had you as a teacher . That must be the grade on one of those sliding spite scales. Vontae is a stud, plain and simple. Game changing impact player and top 3 corner in the NFL.

[TheJACKCOLT]

catches against a cb is a horrible way to judge a cb

Damn dude that's just an etc.... not even the point.

[esmort]

pff is trash

 

 

anybody could start grading players week in week out, start a website and start charging money to see there grades, these guys got lucky and blew up and became popular..just saying

 

Since you both think it is either "trash" or easy and "something anyone could do"  I think you should both start breaking down every colts player every week ... not just a simple letter grade either, but an understandable systematic numbered break down of multiple variables .... Then post the results for some peer review.  

[ColtsLegacy]

anybody could start grading players week in week out, start a website and start charging money to see there grades, these guys got lucky and blew up and became popular..just saying

 

You sound very ignorant. Just saying.

[SteelCityColt]

doesnt make it accurate or legit

 

The same could be said about 99% of what you post according to some people's opinion, the joys of having critics hey? At least PFF try and substantiate their "opinion" of players. 

[SteelCityColt]

That grade is terrible, you don't know what you're talking about, you don't know football.

[vitoaf27]

I agree that having Jones is obviously a huge plus to our defensive front... but did anyone watch him on CJ Anderson's 22 yard run? Left a bad taste in my mouth with how bad he got manhandled, opening up the huge cutback lane.

[mystrymaster]

Arthur Jones was PFFs worst rated defensive player for the Colts (2nd worst overall to Aquib Takin). -3.0 overall, -1.0 run, -1.1 pass rush.

Cory Redding is our stud and Erik Walden is playing really well. Those 2 guys jump off the screen. Also, Newsome looks to be a good one in the making. Strickly speaking of d-line and OLBs.

 

Arthur Gets Double Teamed, Chapman gets Double teamed, Redding is the man they count on being able to beat 1-on-1.  Not that Chapman is better than Redding but you have to get the middle solved or it wont matter.

 

 

Jones attracting those double teams is allowing the rest of the defense to get 1-on-1's and they are beating them right now.

 

PFF is all about individual effort but football is not an individual sport.  Vontae is a great cornerback but if you ask him to cover a receiver for 8 seconds he wont still be on him and will receive a bad PFF grade because he gave up the completion even though it was the D-line's fault for not getting pressure on the QB.

[indyagent17]

for some reason, I expect a huge game from Josh Chapman, Call it a feeling but its a strong one

[ColtsLegacy]

Vontae is a great cornerback but if you ask him to cover a receiver for 8 seconds he wont still be on him and will receive a bad PFF grade because he gave up the completion even though it was the D-line's fault for not getting pressure on the QB.

 

This is absolutely wrong. You should read up on how they do their grading before making incorrect claims.

[Dustin]

Arthur Gets Double Teamed, Chapman gets Double teamed, Redding is the man they count on being able to beat 1-on-1.  Not that Chapman is better than Redding but you have to get the middle solved or it wont matter.

 

 

Jones attracting those double teams is allowing the rest of the defense to get 1-on-1's and they are beating them right now.

 

PFF is all about individual effort but football is not an individual sport.  Vontae is a great cornerback but if you ask him to cover a receiver for 8 seconds he wont still be on him and will receive a bad PFF grade because he gave up the completion even though it was the D-line's fault for not getting pressure on the QB.

 

No, he wouldn't. 

[Superman]

PFF is all about individual effort but football is not an individual sport. 

 

While that's not exactly true, it is part of the issue with grading individual players. However, if you recognize that, you can keep individual grades like what PFF does in their proper perspective. 

[dudeski]

Pff is the worst thing to happen to football in years. Complete waste of time

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

b+

 

Your grade is a F

[PrincetonTiger]

He has been the reason the D has played so well

[ColtsLegacy]

Pff is the worst thing to happen to football in years. Complete waste of time

How old are you? Your act on this board is that of a self-righteous teenager.