Colts draft Donte Moncrief, WR, Ole Miss [Merge]

[krunk]

One of the best things I like with this kid is when he gets deep people are often trailing behind him a couple steps.

They are not running stride for stride with him in many cases. The kid has really good speed, and he was doing this

in the SEC.  Averaging 16 yards per catch........

[Burls' Kid's]

I'll trust Grig's judgment on WR'S; He has a good track record at picking them...thus far.

[Dustin]

But we didn't.

Great detective work.

[ty4atd]

5th? Really?

 

Yeah if he doesn't beat out Rogers which I'm not confident he will be able to. Wayne Nicks TY and Rogers then Mr Moncreif

[YOUR GM]

Wanting to run the ball effectively, and even wanting to run it more than 40% of the time, doesn't mean you don't want to throw the ball. And it doesn't mean you want a "ground oriented offense." I think that's a stretch.

To me, Pagano's strategy is far more nuanced than that. But to sum up, I think he wants our run game to not suck, so we can take some pressure off the QB and shorten games for the defense. I'm sure we'll make good use of our passing game.

If early last season (before all the injuries) is any indication of what our offense is supposed to look like, we will be a ground oriented team. We went away from that when our backs and Reggie went down. Had to reinvent the offense for the rest of the season to a spread attack. Now, I hope Chuck and Pep are smart enough to shift the offense more this year, given all the weapons added, but Pagano has made too many public statements about wanting to be a power run team, and "delivering body shots.." and whathaveyou. That likely will be his same approach going forward. And I won't lie, I'll be very disappointed if we still plan on using Havili on an extended number of snaps. Why stockpile on receivers and then have them sit behind a fullback for much of the game? And we still have Allen and Fleener who will both see the field plenty, don't forget

[YOUR GM]

Yet, Luck has attempted 1200 passes in two yrs

That tends to happen when you're constantly playing catchup. I'm pretty sure Pagano is aware of that statistic as well, and likely wants that figure to go down the next 2 seasons

[Burls' Kid's]

Great detective work.

 

 

Still stewin' over the passing of brooks, i see. Don't take it too hard kid.

[Dustin]

Still stewin' over the passing of brooks, i see. Don't take it too hard kid.

Aren't you that adaywithoutrain guy?

[Burls' Kid's]

Aren,t you that adaywithrain guy?

 

 

I'm a former SEC guard.

[feedmoncrief]

Kids Great. Life Long Ole Miss fan and I prefer to follow players from Ole miss rather than certain teams. Hopefully he can produce. The big thing at Ole Miss was "Feed Moncrief" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUxbIxCRcAs highlights of 2012 egg bowl with the song feed moncrief which kinda sucks, but they played it twice for the first time when he scored and it was awesome. Anyways, the song sucks but Ole Miss fans are gonna try to keep the "Feed Moncrief" thing going. There were Ole MIss shirts with feed moncrief on it and everything so yea looking forward to watching some colts 

[OffensivelyPC]

I just watched his Arkansas tape, and he caught a comeback, the defender missed the tackle, and Moncrief ran past the rest of the secondary for a 50 yard TD. Someone was going to take him, no doubt, because he's just too physically gifted not to get drafted. So I don't think he was a bad pick.

 

But his body catching leads to a lot of drops (watch his Alabama tape; you said you watched his 2013 LSU tape, there are drops in that game as well. There's one where the ball glances off his shoulder when he could have made a nice hands catch). And the other issue is that, because he doesn't attack with his hands, he doesn't use his hands as effectively as he should. There's a play in the GT game, watch the draftbreakdown tape at about the 5:00 mark, where they throw a fade to the end zone. Because Moncrief wants to let the ball drop into his bread basket, instead of attacking it with his hands, he loses sight of it as he falls behind the defender and drops the pass. If he had gone up and attacked it like the monster his physical tools say he should be, that would be the kind of play that separates him from everyone else. 

 

This is what separated him from pretty much everyone above him. Even Allen Robinson, who doesn't run a lot of routes and occasionally body catches, uses his hands better. Davante Adams has a ton of catches in the end zone where he highpoints the ball over two defenders and snatches it out of the air. Very few of those plays from Moncrief. There are some; in the same GT game, he makes a sideline grab that reminds me of Reggie, because he reaches out from his body toward the sideline and plucks the ball out of the air, with a defender all over him.

 

It's like I said above, it is a nitpick, but I think it's a very important trait for a successful receiver in the NFL to have. And not trusting your hands is a big deal.

I get the body catch critcism, and he does do it.  Sometimes it causes drops, and I agree, that he shouldn't be dropping passes that he should catch.  But for the most part, the catches that were dropped (i.e. the GT endzone drop) are passes that would have been difficult to catch, no matter how hard you tried.  It hit him in the hands, it was catchable, but to me, it's not like he was wide open and uncovered. I see it as an issue, like you.  I don't think it's quite as bad to warrant a comparison to DHB (I know you were using it to illustrate the point, not saying he would be the next DHB).  Every receiver has drops, and his are few and far inbetween if you ask me for collegiate games.  The question is, and your concern, is if the body catching leads to drops in the NFL.  We'll see, but I think he'll be a fine receiver.  I saw a guy that could use his hands to pluck the ball if needed, but caught with his body when it wasn't a contested ball, and occasionally drop contested balls he tried to catch with his body.

[NewEra]

Well hopefully he works on his hands like Reggie instead of the opposite like DHB. Problem is his hands never got better. The highlight I saw he was using his hands. So gives me hope.

[Adonai]

I didn't really think we needed a WR this early but Grigson & Co know best about Reggie's recovery.

 

Considering people are raving about his athleticism, perhaps he's a great pick here. 

[Superman]

If early last season (before all the injuries) is any indication of what our offense is supposed to look like, we will be a ground oriented team. We went away from that when our backs and Reggie went down. Had to reinvent the offense for the rest of the season to a spread attack. Now, I hope Chuck and Pep are smart enough to shift the offense more this year, given all the weapons added, but Pagano has made too many public statements about wanting to be a power run team, and "delivering body shots.." and whathaveyou. That likely will be his same approach going forward. And I won't lie, I'll be very disappointed if we still plan on using Havili on an extended number of snaps. Why stockpile on receivers and then have them sit behind a fullback for much of the game? And we still have Allen and Fleener who will both see the field plenty, don't forget

I think early last season happened because the coaches were trying to force the run game. It worked a couple times, and when things are great you'll see games like the Niners game, with 25 passes and 40 runs. But more likely you'll see games like Seattle, Denver, etc., where we get some balance but Luck still gets plenty of chances to throw the ball.

I don't think being a power run team means you aren't going to use your passing attack.

[Superman]

Well hopefully he works on his hands like Reggie instead of the opposite like DHB. Problem is his hands never got better. The highlight I saw he was using his hands. So gives me hope.

DHB worked on his hands incessantly.

[Adonai]

Wow. Loved the tape....but he definitely won't be wearing #12 anymore.

[Burls' Kid's]

DHB worked on his hands incessantly.

 

 

Do you honestly view donte as another DHB? I think grig's has done well with picking WR'S (HILTON/BRAZILL), thus far in his career. I hope he's another boldin (similiar player) .

[Adonai]

Considering our last 4 WR additions have been big boys - Whalen may be out. We will see how competiton at camp plays out.

[ColtsBlueFL]

I'm on board with WR.  Well done.  Come to accept the OT ( G - C ) pick too. Can we get similar awesome value for our secondary now?

[Superman]

Do you honestly view donte as another DHB? I think grig's has done well with picking WR'S (HILTON/BRAZILL), thus far in his career. I hope he's another boldin (similiar player) .

 

I don't think he's another DHB. I'm only saying that some players can put in all the work, but it doesn't translate to game day. According to what we were told about DHB, he worked as hard as anyone else. Didn't help.

[Buddy Lee]

Having Moncrief may actually help the continued development of Rogers. Rogers was the only non-smurf WR on the roster and I think he knew that. Now he has a physical equal, or superior (faster), to compete against. Good news for Rogers and the Colts.

[Superman]

I get the body catch critcism, and he does do it.  Sometimes it causes drops, and I agree, that he shouldn't be dropping passes that he should catch.  But for the most part, the catches that were dropped (i.e. the GT endzone drop) are passes that would have been difficult to catch, no matter how hard you tried.  It hit him in the hands, it was catchable, but to me, it's not like he was wide open and uncovered. I see it as an issue, like you.  I don't think it's quite as bad to warrant a comparison to DHB (I know you were using it to illustrate the point, not saying he would be the next DHB).  Every receiver has drops, and his are few and far inbetween if you ask me for collegiate games.  The question is, and your concern, is if the body catching leads to drops in the NFL.  We'll see, but I think he'll be a fine receiver.  I saw a guy that could use his hands to pluck the ball if needed, but caught with his body when it wasn't a contested ball, and occasionally drop contested balls he tried to catch with his body.

 

To the bolded, that's the first part of it.

 

The second part is the mentality associated with body catching. That's why I singled out the GT endzone drop. Like you say, it's a difficult play regardless, a 50/50 ball. But I'd rather see him go up and try to grab it over the DB, even if he doesn't come down with it. Waiting for it to drop in is what ruined any chance he did have of making the catch. And that's against a college DB who was off balance and physically outmatched. A good DB is going to contest that pass, and 99 times out of 100, it's not going to drop in. You have to go get it. So what's even the point of throwing a 50/50 fade route to your biggest, most physically gifted guy, if he's not going to use his size and physical gifts to give himself the best chance of making the play.

 

I don't know if he has that mentality of "this ball is MINE," to go along with the freakish size and athleticism. It's certainly not on display on plays like the GT endzone drop. It's more like "I don't trust my hands, so let me wait for this to drop into my body." 

 

Physically, he's Julio Jones / Larry Fitzgerald. I'd like to see him realize that potential.

[PrincetonTiger]

With this pick Whalen and/or Brazill will be gone

[ricker182]

This guy at espn.com thinks Moncrief is the steal of the draft.

http://espn.go.com/blog/sec/post/_/id/82898/take-two-secs-top-draft-sleeper?ex_cid=espnapi_public

Wow #1 WR on day one? That's quite the compliment. I hope he's as good as that guy says.

[ricker182]

With this pick Whalen and/or Brazill will be gone

I like both of them too.

[BOTT]

That tends to happen when you're constantly playing catchup. I'm pretty sure Pagano is aware of that statistic as well, and likely wants that figure to go down the next 2 seasons

If they were constantly playing catch up they wouldn't have made the playoffs the last two yrs. and I hope Pagano wants that stat to go down.

[HGRekks]

The hands thing, I get. The DHB thing, I don't get. Keep in mind that DHB is not the only Colt to have to work on his hands while possessing elite measurables. A guy named Garçon came in with bad hands and loved to body catch, and I think he turned out just fine with work.

 

It's possible to overcome. It's not a death sentence, but it's also not necessarily a non-issue.

[NewEra]

DHB worked on his hands incessantly.

Yeah I know, that was my point. Didn't improve where Reggie's hands have continued to improve. But DHB was drafted in pretty much just his speed. Good old Al ;)

[JoKeR]

[JoKeR]

Wayne, Nicks, Hamilton, Moncrief, Rogers, BrazilorWhalen

Just wow.

Throw in Fleener and Allen.

I don't think the Colts will have to make moves at those positions for years to come.

[ColtsHoosiersBB]

I don't understand the idea of getting another receiver when we have a stable full of

able bodies at that position. The Colts will always be a finesse team with this

drafting mentality.

 

Build the lines then defense, in that order!!!

[Andy]

I hope so. Like Andy said, hopefully he is a deep reserve this year and just works on his craft. He also looked lost in the run game sometimes, not knowing who to block or which way to block them. Not a big deal, but he needs to study a lot.

Physically, he's a monster, but he doesn't always play like it. Sometimes gets outbattled by smaller DBs, like the beginning of the LSU game. But if he starts attacking and learns to use his body better, I think he'll be fine.

 

95% of receivers in college are bad or below average blockers. What teams look for is their willingness to block. The technique is taught in the NFL.

[zibby43]

I didn't really think we needed a WR this early but Grigson & Co know best about Reggie's recovery.

 

Considering people are raving about his athleticism, perhaps he's a great pick here. 

 

I can understand your sentiment but Reggie can't play forever.  We need to build a long-term corps of solid receivers for Luck so we don't have turnover at the position ever year.

 

Rapport and chemistry with the receivers is invaluable. 

[zibby43]

I don't understand the idea of getting another receiver when we have a stable full of

able bodies at that position. The Colts will always be a finesse team with this

drafting mentality.

 

Build the lines then defense, in that order!!!

 

I don't think we have a stable of "proven" receivers, though.  If you're going to win big in this league, you need more than just mere able bodies at the position. 

 

Wayne is coming off a devastating injury late in his career.  T.Y. is an emerging star but was banged up much of the season.  Nicks is coming off an injury.  And Brazill was inconsistent until the end of the year.

 

Our receiving corps was not one of our strenghts last year.  Remember the epic struggles after Wayne went down?

 

In Donte Moncrief, the Colts finally have a big-bodied WR than can run (4.40 40-yard dash).

[feedmoncrief]

The Story of Donte Moncrief: 

 

He comes from the poor town of Raleigh Mississippi which has a population of 1500 people. As a kid he did not have enough money to buy a football so he and his friends played with empty coke bottles filled with rocks. He was offered a scholarship to Ole Miss where he quickly became the name of the School. "Feed Moncrief" became the big thing and there was a song, t shirts, and a huge saying. He stated that he declared for the draft early because his family has no money. He has a 3 year old daughter who lives with his parents in a 1 room house. 

 

This kid is not like a lot of people in the NFL. He had to fight for everything. The kid is a fighter, and willing to learn. I think Wayne will teach him this season so next season when he really can step up, he will have better hands and will make an immediate impact. I love this pick and cannot wait.

 

Feed Moncrief! 

[Warhorse]

Are Moncrief's college stats and level of play better than Rogers' college numbers? I say no. This was not a need nor an upgrade, rather a wasted opportunity. We already have Nicks to replace Wayne, and Rogers as our 'potential' player.

The underlined statement is the type of belief system that gets GM's fired. There is no way to know he will be all that, or if he is...he will want to stay or that we can afford him. 

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

Got to admit he looks pretty good. Wasn't happy & still not that we didn't address S or CB but took best available is cool!

[YOUR GM]

If they were constantly playing catch up they wouldn't have made the playoffs the last two yrs. and I hope Pagano wants that stat to go down.

 

I'm not sure what you're getting at??? It's a fact that we've won a lot of come from behind games the last 2 seasons. I'm not making this up. Where have you been?

[YOUR GM]

I think early last season happened because the coaches were trying to force the run game. It worked a couple times, and when things are great you'll see games like the Niners game, with 25 passes and 40 runs. But more likely you'll see games like Seattle, Denver, etc., where we get some balance but Luck still gets plenty of chances to throw the ball.

I don't think being a power run team means you aren't going to use your passing attack.

 

I'm not saying we'll never pass it. I'm just saying I doubt we'll ever become some spread attack offense long-term, as long as Pep and Pagano are here. I don't much see the point in loading up on receivers when we have a coordinator who prefers to operate with 2 TE/2 back sets, and pass off play action, to begin with.

 

I'm all for shoring up the position in the future, but not if it's at the expense of addressing more pressing needs in the present. It's like they're obsessed with finding Reggie's replacement,  but meanwhile, we don't have a starting free safety or depth at multiple positions. So essentially, we're splurging on a position that we probably won't even fully utilize, while ignoring glaring weaknesses currently on the roster. It's a total waste

[NewEra]

The underlined statement is the type of belief system that gets GM's fired. There is no way to know he will be all that, or if he is...he will want to stay or that we can afford him.

Exactly! Not to mention Nicks own injury problems. No thx to going through what we did last year with injurys to wr, rb, te