Andrew Luck is a Top 5 Quarterback, Top 7 at the worst.

[masterlock]

I'd like to ask Polian what's wrong with Lucks supporting cast other than being young?

And add that Peyton was never well known for having a great supporting cast ( we know different ) I guess my point is this supporting casts seems to have enough talent to be as good as any group Peyton played with ( except at RB maybe )

I'm not big on bashing Polian but thats very hypocritical of him if he's saying that.

"Supporting cast" is way too general a term. If we are talking about a great defense, then no, Peyton never had a great supporting cast. Offensively, it's a different story. Petyon had an outstanding supporting cast consisting of numerous pro-bowl-caliber players and even some future HOF-ers. Notably, he had a very good O-line for years, which enabled great pass protection and great run blocking. It wasn't until around 2006 or so that the O-line began to deteriorate. Even then, they remained fairly good at pass-blocking. That didn't really really go down the tubes until we let players like Jake Scott and Ryan Lilja go.

[Balzer40]

A very, very rare disagreement with Balzar40 for me.....

Polian wanted to keep the 10+win seasons going. He signed players to long-term deals to keep things going. I think it's highly doubtful that during those great times someone here was thinking..... "but some of those players are getting old and are going to get hurt and we could have a couple of bad seasons...."

Hey, that's the price of greatness. The Colts had a great run. Polian was trying to keep it going. So, players got signed to long-term deals and couldn't quite play at a high level all the way through it. That happens everywhere. If you're complaining about last year and this year -- fine -- but then you've got to recognize all the great years you had. And it was more than just Peyton Manning.

Just another view from the outside looking in....

Well, we can't agree on everything. My only point was that I don't think people were saying Polian was bitter because he said he needed to see Luck in regular season games before he proclaimed him to be top 5. Instead they were saying he was bitter because he said Lucks supporting cast was bad, but it was because of him that the supporting cast is where its at. except for the fact that I think Grigson has done a great job making them better.

As for saying Polian handed out bad contracts to those who didn't deserve it, maybe I should have also said that he hung on to a few players for too long to IMO. Sanders mainly, but he gave to much to Brackett (who to my knowledge didn't recieve an offer from 1 other team when Polian gave him 5 million a season. Maybe he was worth that to us, but he wasn't to anybody else therefore he could have kept him for much cheaper IMO. Hayden got a big contract based on 1 play IMO(the pick 6 in the super bowl) I believe Hayden did get other offers but he wasn't worth anywhere near the money Polian gave him. He also hung on to Gonzo for way too long. I don't hate Bill Polian, but I definitely think it was time for him to go. He or his son started making mistakes that were getting harder and harder to cover up, couple that with the fact that he was a first class jerk and Im happy he's gone. After he was fired some of the real stories started coming out as to how he treated others in the organization and it's really no wonder why many were glad he got canned.

[manning04]

Interesting... Top 15 already without playing an actual game. i have no doubt he will be top 10 by seasons end. Top 5 though... is disrespect to those who have played several years and have won some games. there's debate on him being the best QB in our division, lets get a handful of games out the way. Having watched him since his first start in college though barring injury he will be a top 5 qb within a few seasons.

[Qwiz]

Top 5? Already? Wow he's already living it up, and he hasn't even played yet. Must be nice lol.

[BrentMc11]

Top 5? Already? Wow he's already living it up, and he hasn't even played yet. Must be nice lol.

Wheaties Box or bust! Colts still 32 in power ratings...no games...

[Qwiz]

Wheaties Box or bust! Colts still 32 in power ratings...no games...

Wheaties? In the direction this is going, there are going to be Luckies!

[Fx Stryker]

Well I guess anything short of a Super Bowl is a disappointment.

[KarlKuffs]

For the first time in about 5 years, i'm with Polian on this one.

[Vance]

Wheaties Box or bust! Colts still 32 in power ratings...no games...

Not according to...THIS

Oh noes!! Expectations!

[BrentMc11]

Not according to...THIS

Oh noes!! Expectations!

I know right? Do you get Directv down there 87? The game is fee on Sunday ticket....I saw you were wanting to see it.

[Vance]

I know right? Do you get Directv down there 87? The game is fee on Sunday ticket....I saw you were wanting to see it.

Actually it's up here. Lol. And no. Although, a friend has ST and he said I could come over and watch the games. But he's not available this weekend so I have to go to a bar.

[MAC]

I'm not sure how to interpret all this. For a rebuilding team like ours, there is NOBODY that I'd rather have than Luck. Even Rodgers is bit too old for that role, and I'm not even close to being impressed enough by what I've seen from people like Ryan, Flacco, Bradford, or Stafford to boost them over Luck despite his absence of NFL experience. But that's thinking like a GM who plans to have his job for awhile.

But if I had a team that was contending for the Super Bowl right now, he wouldn't be close to my fifth choice. Of course he wouldn't be 20th either. I think what works in his favor in these arguments is that there seem to be an awful lot of young "potential franchise" QBs out there now-a-days. None of them are far enough ahead of Luck in experience or development to make them clear preferences. That says a lot more about the league than about Luck. Ten years ago there might have been another 5-10 solid but unspectacular vets that could clearly outplay him while he is learning.

None of that changes the fundamental accuracy of Polian's comments. People assume bitterness and resentment, while the fact is that if he had been retained he would have drafted Luck himself. His history with the Colts has nothing to do with the fact that he knows it to be ridiculous to elevate an unproven player to such a degree. I'm quite confident that he would have held the same view of Peyton in 1998.

[BrentMc11]

Actually it's up here. Lol. And no. Although, a friend has ST and he said I could come over and watch the games. But he's not available this weekend so I have to go to a bar.

OK...saw it was free ....saw TK could get it down in Texas....I am gonna do some live lookins...should be fun...

[Kenny]

Actually it's up here. Lol. And no. Although, a friend has ST and he said I could come over and watch the games. But he's not available this weekend so I have to go to a bar.

Nothing like the smell of old beer and forty yea old guys yellin at the TV the whole time .

[BrentMc11]

Nothing like the smell of old beer and forty yea old guys yellin at the TV the whole time .

Easy...I resemble that remark ....just do it at home.....

[Kenny]

Easy...I resemble that remark ....just do it at home.....

gotta take shots at the old farts before you become one yourself(Which I know I will )

[NewColtsFan]

I don't know about that. I know there were people on this forum and others that were starting to voice concerns over the job Polian was doing several years ago even when we were winning. I know i was one of them. There is nothing wrong with trying to keep a winning team together, but you have to be smart about how you do it. He had a tendency to greatly overvalue his draft picks and pay them ridiculous contracts. Kelvin Hayden comes to mind immediately. But i don't even think that was the biggest problem, i think the major problem was there drafting. They were not able to replace some of those aging and injured players with draft picks because they busted on too many of them. That forced their hand, forced them to keep some of these aging and injured players out of necessity. Melvin Bullet last year was kept simply because we had nobody else. We signed him late, same day that Eric Weddle re-signed in SD. He was an injury riddled safety who had to have a steel rod in his shoulder the year before. Not surprising, he hurt the same shoulder 2 games into the season and was done. Those missed picks also caused them to waste future picks on the same position because they struck out in trying the first time (Ugoh). That's really how we got in the mess in the first place. Manning was covering for a ton of problems on this team and some of us had been saying it for years. I always predicted 3 wins without Peyton, i was wrong, we could only manage 2.

Well.... we were talking about long-term contracts and then the topic switched more to bad draft picks and not being able to replace them. Two different issues. I appreciate those who did not like Polian's drafts.... but it's another thing to be complaining about who he is signing to long-term deals.... Hard for me to believe that many here were complaining about the contracts before last year rolled around.

Just my hunch....

[MAC]

Nothing like the smell of old beer and forty yea old guys yellin at the TV the whole time .

Had to read this twice. My first thought was "Huh? I didn't know that forty year old guy's had a distinct odor."

[Susie Q]

Too early to tell

My thoughts exactly.

[BrentMc11]

Had to read this twice. My first thought was "Huh? I didn't know that forty year old guy's had a distinct odor."

Good one MAC...and since I am single...you can dis-stink all ya want to at home....

[GoColts8818]

Man I read threw the first few posts here and I had to check the thread title again. Is it about Andrew Luck or is it about bashing on Bill Polian some more?

I think Luck has impressed without question so far. With that said I think Brees, Brady, both Mannings, Rodgers, Stafford, and Rivers are better QBs than Luck is right now. So that is seven alone without thinking too hard. So I would disagree that Luck is already one of the top seven QBs in the NFL. I think he is better than some teams' QBs already and I think he has the talent to be that good one day but I don't think he's there yet.

[Vance]

Nothing like the smell of old beer and forty yea old guys yellin at the TV the whole time .

Hopefully not at my TV, I live in a place where nobody would suspect a Texan or Dolphin fan to be.

[braveheartcolt]

Luck is perhaps top 20 at best right now.

Polian definately bottom 20, ever. Manning - coat-tails - loser.

[cmgww]

"You wanna crown him? Then crown his a**!" Sorry I hear that every day on the intro to Dakich's show and it never gets old...

[SilentHill]

Why Can't Luck be a top 10 QB? Peyton Manning was ranked 50th best player in the league in a poll that is based on your play for the previous season.

Me personally, I think Luck is in the top 15, once we get to week 4 I think he'll be closer to top 10, by the middle of the season I think he'll be inside top 10.

[RGIII]

All I know is for this Chicago game I think we are going to be A okay on offense. I reaffirm that every time I go back and look at the film of Luck playing against the NFL designed Monte and Lane Kiffin coached USC Cover 2 defense. They had pressure on Luck the entire game, Stanford had zero running game, but yet and still Luck put up darn near 50 points on those boys.

That was the exact same defense that we are going to see Sunday pretty much ad verbatim. Even the D coordinator they have now is a former Tampa Bay coach. I'm not saying he will put up 50, but I am saying I'm not worried even if we don't have a running game. It's all going to come down to if we can play stout enough defense and limit big plays on special teams against Devin Hester and Eric Weems.

I'm not sure that you're fully accounting for the wildly disparate talent levels of the USC defense and the Bears defense. I've been impressed with Luck so far but he's still a rookie and he will make mistakes.

Luck is perhaps top 20 at best right now.

Polian definately bottom 20, ever. Manning - coat-tails - loser.

I get that y'all are bitter about the way things ended for the Peyton/Polian era but the hate is just ridiculous and completely over the top. Polian has had a better full career as a GM and personnel guy than most in the NFL ever have or ever will. He may not have finished strong and he may have made his fair share of mistakes along the way... but that describes just about every guy in his position, even those architects responsible for the great dynasty teams.

If you can't come to appreciate what the man did for your team and city then I just feel sorry for you. Those guys don't come around very often and the odds are good that you're in for a rude awakening at some point over the next few years. That's not an indictment against Grigson specifically as a person or his potential to succeed on the job but teams that undergo a complete organizational overhaul rarely sustain or reattain their previous levels of success without a whole lot of additional turnover and strife in between.

[Jules]

Can't go wrong with a man who has the last name Luck and who is wearing the . L ck.

It is just all kinds of symbolic goodness.

:cloud9:

[JParks1221]

Let's let our guy win a game first. I'm thrilled to have him, but lets be patient here

[cranium cramp]

gotta take shots at the old farts before you become one yourself(Which I know I will )

The only good thing good about being an "old fart" is that being an old fart means all our stink has worn off, now all you young farts...........Well lets just say one of you needs to light a match.

[cranium cramp]

I'm not sure that you're fully accounting for the wildly disparate talent levels of the USC defense and the Bears defense. I've been impressed with Luck so far but he's still a rookie and he will make mistakes.

I get that y'all are bitter about the way things ended for the Peyton/Polian era but the hate is just ridiculous and completely over the top. Polian has had a better full career as a GM and personnel guy than most in the NFL ever have or ever will. He may not have finished strong and he may have made his fair share of mistakes along the way... but that describes just about every guy in his position, even those architects responsible for the great dynasty teams.

If you can't come to appreciate what the man did for your team and city then I just feel sorry for you. Those guys don't come around very often and the odds are good that you're in for a rude awakening at some point over the next few years. That's not an indictment against Grigson specifically as a person or his potential to succeed on the job but teams that undergo a complete organizational overhaul rarely sustain or reattain their previous levels of success without a whole lot of additional turnover and strife in between.

Polian is/was a joke a best. If you draft as many players as Polian your bound to hit a home run sooner or later. When a GM is dictating when to rest the starters at seasons end, knowing the results from the last 100 times you have forced the coach to do this. Insults to fans durning radio "Bill Polian show". Choking out a reporter at the Meadowlands. Bill Polian was a blight on this team nothing more. Manning versus Leaf. There was no contest there to anyone with any football knowledge. Edge over head case Ricky Williams. Polian rode the gravy train till the wheels feel off, just glad the gravy train flipped and ejected him on his rump.

[NewEra]

Can't go wrong with a man who has the last name Luck and who is wearing the . L ck.

It is just all kinds of symbolic goodness.

:cloud9:

Been saying that for awhile...its meant to be. Luck, horseshoe...HELLO!?! heh all we need now is some 4 leaf clovers and we're set. hmm, maybe that can be our new wr crew. lol

[Jules]

Been saying that for awhile...its meant to be. Luck, horseshoe...HELLO!?! heh all we need now is some 4 leaf clovers and we're set. hmm, maybe that can be our new wr crew. lol

Ohhh. Me like. Maybe the young guys we have are the 4 leaf clovers.

I said all last year to people this guy just seems meant to be in a Colts uniform. You cannot put a man named Luck on the Browns or something.

[SilentHill]

Ohhh. Me like. Maybe the young guys we have are the 4 leaf clovers.

I said all last year to people this guy just seems meant to be in a Colts uniform. You cannot put a man named Luck on the Browns or something.

If the colts see a WR with the last name Clover they better go get him, even if he plays arena league... lol

Just Imagine, TD pass from Luck to Clover

[RGIII]

Polian is/was a joke a best. If you draft as many players as Polian your bound to hit a home run sooner or later.

It sounds like your expectations are unreasonable. Even teams that draft extremely well don't tend to hit on a high percentage of their picks (a ~38% hit rate is actually very good) and most great teams are built on the back of only a few truly stellar drafts.

Manning versus Leaf. There was no contest there to anyone with any football knowledge. Edge over head case Ricky Williams. Polian rode the gravy train till the wheels feel off, just glad the gravy train flipped and ejected him on his rump.

You're using an awful lot of hindsight here. Manning v. Leaf was a serious debate at the time and there were people with far more football knowledge than either you or I who thought that Leaf was the better prospect. They didn't know what we know now, though. Edge over Williams wasn't a no-brainer, either. Regardless of Williams' status as a bit of a headcase (the full extent of which we didn't learn until much later), the fact is that Polian's decision was the opposite of what most teams at the time would have done. Edge's college career, while solid, paled in comparison to Williams'.

[JWF]

Top 5...muchless Top 10? Without playing a game? Wow. Talk about ridiculous.

[krunk]

I'm not sure that you're fully accounting for the wildly disparate talent levels of the USC defense and the Bears defense. I've been impressed with Luck so far but he's still a rookie and he will make mistakes.

I get that y'all are bitter about the way things ended for the Peyton/Polian era but the hate is just ridiculous and completely over the top. Polian has had a better full career as a GM and personnel guy than most in the NFL ever have or ever will. He may not have finished strong and he may have made his fair share of mistakes along the way... but that describes just about every guy in his position, even those architects responsible for the great dynasty teams.

If you can't come to appreciate what the man did for your team and city then I just feel sorry for you. Those guys don't come around very often and the odds are good that you're in for a rude awakening at some point over the next few years. That's not an indictment against Grigson specifically as a person or his potential to succeed on the job but teams that undergo a complete organizational overhaul rarely sustain or reattain their previous levels of success without a whole lot of additional turnover and strife in between.

We all get that an NFL defense is likely to be more talented than a college defense. The point is the reads will all be the same because it is the exact same defense he saw in college. It shouldn't take Luck long to get adjusted against this scheme. Luck was under pressure the entire USC game and he did well against the pressure with average receivers and no running game. That was a good sign to me because he will likely be under that same pressure against the Bears, and I don't think he will fold from what they are doing. He also has a lot more talent surrounding him than he did at Stanford. I think he may not have a running game against the Bears which will be similar to the USC game.

I think he will not be phased by their pressure, nor do I think they will make him ineffective if we can't run

[braveheartcolt]

I'm not sure that you're fully accounting for the wildly disparate talent levels of the USC defense and the Bears defense. I've been impressed with Luck so far but he's still a rookie and he will make mistakes.

I get that y'all are bitter about the way things ended for the Peyton/Polian era but the hate is just ridiculous and completely over the top. Polian has had a better full career as a GM and personnel guy than most in the NFL ever have or ever will. He may not have finished strong and he may have made his fair share of mistakes along the way... but that describes just about every guy in his position, even those architects responsible for the great dynasty teams.

If you can't come to appreciate what the man did for your team and city then I just feel sorry for you. Those guys don't come around very often and the odds are good that you're in for a rude awakening at some point over the next few years. That's not an indictment against Grigson specifically as a person or his potential to succeed on the job but teams that undergo a complete organizational overhaul rarely sustain or reattain their previous levels of success without a whole lot of additional turnover and strife in between.

Please don't feel the need to feel sorry for me. I really don't need your compassion. I neither dislike nor hate the man, I just did not rate him, and in particularly his arrogant and rude manners. Polian was successful due only to one man, and this was particularly evident last season. Simply put, the Colts win Manning were amazing, without him, they were the worst team in the league, I'll take facts over perception all day, every day.

[StewieG]

If Luck is a top 5 QB already, that means we will finish 10-6 or 11-5 this year.

I think Luck will be top 5 within a few years, but I just don't think its right now.

[BrentMc11]

If Luck is a top 5 QB already, that means we will finish 10-6 or 11-5 this year.

I think Luck will be top 5 within a few years, but I just don't think its right now.

I love the upside as most do, but there is a little thing called 'playing a game' in the NFL first.....against a pretty tuff old bunch of Bears....only good thing is the Bears live and die with the Cover 2...even though it is a more attacking Cover 2.....pick on the backers with TEs and also pick on Tim Jennings. Tillman had a poor pre-season...but is a Pro Bowler...beware. GO COLTS!

[jvan1973]

Please don't feel the need to feel sorry for me. I really don't need your compassion. I neither dislike nor hate the man, I just did not rate him, and in particularly his arrogant and rude manners. Polian was successful due only to one man, and this was particularly evident last season. Simply put, the Colts win Manning were amazing, without him, they were the worst team in the league, I'll take facts over perception all day, every day.

he had a HOF career before he ever took the job in indy... his teams went to six super bowls... quick.. name another gm that can say that