When Is A. Luck going to get signed?

[tfunky14]

This is stating to get borderline insane. Why has Andrew Luck and the Colts not reached a deal yet? Whats the hold up?

[Dan]

Chill out, loads of first rounders haven't been signed. Griffin hasn't, for example.

[HungarianColtsFan]

I think, it is more important when A.Luck will be back in Indy? I think tomorrow. I thought he would be back already on Friday, but possibly he is celebrating his graduation.

[OZOC01]

Where's the anonymous source when you need them?!?!

[HungarianColtsFan]

Where's the anonymous source when you need them?!?!

LOL I like it...

Seems like B.Krawitz forgot to consult with Johnnie Walker...

[MIColtsFan]

he'll get signed when they get done crossing T's and dotting I's... something about "offset" language for the franchise and Luck's agent wants a better payout schedule for the signing bonus is taking time to work out

[MIColtsFan]

system is froggy today...looks like comment posted twice

[Norm]

Also, what is going on with Fleener and Allen? I know everything is still early, but why wait at this point?

[newb767]

They're waiting to see if Reggie likes the way he throws the ball to him, if not welcome Mr. Harnish!!

[Ohio Colt]

Honestly though, Irsay; quit fluffing people with "A. Luck #12" jerseys and sign the guy. Get it done.

[oldunclemark]

Honestly though, Irsay; quit fluffing people with "A. Luck #12" jerseys and sign the guy. Get it done.

Tell him, OC!!!!

[dgambill]

As stupid as it seems to be crying about this now with no real need for urgency because there is no benefit or real cause for concern because he still is going to be here I will say this.....it is the absolute stupidest thing in the world not to have it done.

We just cut.....CUT one of the greatest QBs of all time to bring this kid in. The contract money is basically already preditermined based on the CBA. Really it is just formalities like guarantees and out clauses but lets be real....our future is tied to this kid. We are going to give him every chance to be the man....drunk driving arrests or prostitution scandals or poor play it won't matter we will ride and die with this kid for the next 4 seasons regardless. And the money is PUNY for starting QB money. Most of the backups in the league have bigger contracts then this kid. Just give him what he wants...because he has all the leverage. We are a last place team with no chance without him and a fan base thats foundation crumbled this offseason with getting rid of the most beloved player we have ever had. Quit playing around and get it done and perhaps you will get a tiny bump in ticket sales. No positives can happen now by continuing to try to force the negotiations. Give him his money and a show of good will to build a since of support because if he plays well he could be holding out by year 3 to get real QB money.

[OZOC01]

Yeah, what ^^^ said!!!

As stupid as it seems to be crying about this now with no real need for urgency because there is no benefit or real cause for concern because he still is going to be here I will say this.....it is the absolute stupidest thing in the world not to have it done.

We just cut.....CUT one of the greatest QBs of all time to bring this kid in. The contract money is basically already preditermined based on the CBA. Really it is just formalities like guarantees and out clauses but lets be real....our future is tied to this kid. We are going to give him every chance to be the man....drunk driving arrests or prostitution scandals or poor play it won't matter we will ride and die with this kid for the next 4 seasons regardless. And the money is PUNY for starting QB money. Most of the backups in the league have bigger contracts then this kid. Just give him what he wants...because he has all the leverage. We are a last place team with no chance without him and a fan base thats foundation crumbled this offseason with getting rid of the most beloved player we have ever had. Quit playing around and get it done and perhaps you will get a tiny bump in ticket sales. No positives can happen now by continuing to try to force the negotiations. Give him his money and a show of good will to build a since of support because if he plays well he could be holding out by year 3 to get real QB money.

I approve this message!

[bavanlan]

People may not believe it at the moment, but his contract isn't a priority unless someone can find a reason other than "I just want it done".

There's little to haggle over and the FO has more important things to do right now than to deal with this, particularly when the players are in the building. Wait till a dead period when the FO has free time, figure it out and move on.

[GoColts8818]

As long as its before camp I don't care when.

[dgambill]

People may not believe it at the moment, but his contract isn't a priority unless someone can find a reason other than "I just want it done".

There's little to haggle over and the FO has more important things to do right now than to deal with this, particularly when the players are in the building. Wait till a dead period when the FO has free time, figure it out and move on.

You are saying a GM has more to do than finalize a contract for his star player and show Andrew Luck goodwill and the show the potential ticket holders and Colts fans his support of Andrew? Please. We all work very hard jobs but he is not too busy....he can't agree with his agent. That to me is stupid because of the reasons I stated above. Build goodwill with Andrew and his agent because I guarantee we will be renegotiating in about 3 years for A HUGE contract. We don't need to give some bad taste in their mouth by making this more difficult than it needs to be. While I agree there is no necessary rush we don't need a story going on about this like the Saints have, and continue to put the Colts in a bad light. They throw away Peyton and now they won't pay Luck....think of how that reverberates through the NFL. Think of the borderline fans and how they will feel.

It isn't a story yet...but if it gets to one that is something that is a black mark on my view of the administration already. Just get it done....there is nothing really necessary to iron out.

[bavanlan]

You are saying a GM has more to do than finalize a contract for his star player and show Andrew Luck goodwill and the show the potential ticket holders and Colts fans his support of Andrew?

Yes. We drafted him #1 overall; you can't support him more than that.

Please. We all work very hard jobs but he is not too busy....he can't agree with his agent.

Baseless speculation.

1) This is a MAJOR player evaluation period for the FO. This is a 6AM - 9PM workday period.

2) Perhaps this is more a hold up on Luck's end either because of not wanting to deal with the details of the contract prior to finishing school and/or his agent also having other contracts to work on now.

3) Regardless no one knows, but the pure silence from both parties (i.e. the lack of 'unnamed sources close to the situation') suggests the parties are more than happy.

That to me is stupid because of the reasons I stated above. Build goodwill with Andrew and his agent because I guarantee we will be renegotiating in about 3 years for A HUGE contract. We don't need to give some bad taste in their mouth by making this more difficult than it needs to be.

No attorney/agent/professional loses goodwill simply because of a good faith negotiation. When they do, things get leaked to pressure the other party to cave.

While I agree there is no necessary rush we don't need a story going on about this like the Saints have, and continue to put the Colts in a bad light. They throw away Peyton and now they won't pay Luck....think of how that reverberates through the NFL. Think of the borderline fans and how they will feel.

I don't think it reverberates at all in the NFL; there's been, what one first round pick signed? Two? Nobody in the top-8? Everyone is doing this.

I don't think making borderline fans happy is the best business model for success.

It isn't a story yet...but if it gets to one that is something that is a black mark on my view of the administration already. Just get it done....there is nothing really necessary to iron out.

I think there's a long way to go before this becomes a story. A LONG way.

[GoColts8818]

You are saying a GM has more to do than finalize a contract for his star player and show Andrew Luck goodwill and the show the potential ticket holders and Colts fans his support of Andrew? Please. We all work very hard jobs but he is not too busy....he can't agree with his agent. That to me is stupid because of the reasons I stated above. Build goodwill with Andrew and his agent because I guarantee we will be renegotiating in about 3 years for A HUGE contract. We don't need to give some bad taste in their mouth by making this more difficult than it needs to be. While I agree there is no necessary rush we don't need a story going on about this like the Saints have, and continue to put the Colts in a bad light. They throw away Peyton and now they won't pay Luck....think of how that reverberates through the NFL. Think of the borderline fans and how they will feel.

It isn't a story yet...but if it gets to one that is something that is a black mark on my view of the administration already. Just get it done....there is nothing really necessary to iron out.

You said the key words it's not a story yet so let's save the worrying about it till it is a story then?

[12Bleed Blue87]

We should really get him signed as quick as possible.

[bavanlan]

We should really get him signed as quick as possible.

Why?

We have his rights and the parties appear to be happy. Why the impatience?

[12Bleed Blue87]

Hello everyone i am new to the forum, I just signed up today. I am from Muncie, Indiana and i am a die hard colts fans!!!!

[funktacious2]

No rush. Everything is going to be fine.

[oldunclemark]

Hello everyone i am new to the forum, I just signed up today. I am from Muncie, Indiana and i am a die hard colts fans!!!!

Good news!

You didnt have to listen to us suffering through last season....

Its all happy days from here on out! :cloud9:

[NewColtsFan]

To those that are saying most of the rest of the first round hans't signed either...... the reason I suspect in most cases is because Andrew hasn't signed yet.

They're waiting to see what happens with his deal. The bonus, the payout schedule. Was anything special created for him.... etc.

Once other agents see what happens with Andrew's contract, you'll see the other deals lined-up to get done like jets lined up at O'hare airport.... they'll come really fast.

But hopefully the Andrew deal gets done ASAP.... that was -- in part -- why the new CBA was created, less hassle's over rookie contracts.

[12Bleed Blue87]

Good news!

You didnt have to listen to us suffering through last season....

Its all happy days from here on out

Yea i think this years team will surprise in the upcoming season.

Good news!

You didnt have to listen to us suffering through last season....

Its all happy days from here on out! :cloud9:

:cloud9:

[12Bleed Blue87]

Yeah i think this years team will surprise this upcoming season.

[bavanlan]

But hopefully the Andrew deal gets done ASAP.... that was -- in part -- why the new CBA was created, less hassle's over rookie contracts.

I don't think you can assume the deal isn't done because it's a hassle; it's really just not a priority.

[NewColtsFan]

I don't think you can assume the deal isn't done because it's a hassle; it's really just not a priority.

Sorry, I don't think I explained myself well enough.... I don't think it's not happening because it's a hassle, but the new CBA has provisions in it to get new contracts done quicker and easier. It's designed to prevent what is happening right now.

I think the idea that it's not a priority is not grounded in fact. I can't spell out what the specifics are, but there's no team that is isn't getting their deals done because they're not a priority. Every contract is a priority. The sooner the better.

[Superman]

Before the rookie wage structure was in place, it was uncommon for first rounders to get signed before July. Sam Bradford signed July 30th.

The NFL allows rookies to work with teams in minicamps and OTAs before their contracts are done. That makes the actual deadline sometime before training camp. There are very few first rounders signed to this point. There is no delay. It just hasn't happened yet.

I assume, personally, that it will get done sometime after this weekend. Luck's graduation is Saturday. He wasn't allowed to participate in the previous OTAs due to school, so he likely hasn't been in town at all since the rookie minicamp the week after the draft. He's in town now, and I'm sure Grigson and Irsay are in contact with his agent. This week would actually be a good time to do it, but again, there's no rush. He can participate in all activities this week, and he can use the facility whenever he wants once he leaves California. Until training camp, there's no issue with him not being signed.

I don't know why everyone is getting so jittery about this.

[Gavin]

Luck was throwing and practicing and calling plays (Arians had to remind him to slow down) either today or yesterday at the Colts complex anyway

[Superman]

Sorry, I don't think I explained myself well enough.... I don't think it's not happening because it's a hassle, but the new CBA has provisions in it to get new contracts done quicker and easier. It's designed to prevent what is happening right now.

I think the idea that it's not a priority is not grounded in fact. I can't spell out what the specifics are, but there's no team that is isn't getting their deals done because they're not a priority. Every contract is a priority. The sooner the better.

Perhaps what bav means is that there are bigger priorities right now.

And I'm not sure what you mean by "what is happening right now." There's nothing happening right now. Luck isn't holding out, there's no quabbling over the contract, there is simply a period of time that's passed since he was drafted. The rookie wage scale was designed to a) limit the money paid to rookies, b) limit, if not get rid of, restricted free agency, and c) eliminate contract disputes based on total value of the contract. None of that is the issue with Luck's contract. The only point of disagreement, if there even is any, is the schedule of bonus payments, which is a minor issue that will be resolved one way or the other.

Just because he hasn't signed doesn't mean there's a bitter dispute between him and the team.

[bahhummbug]

As stupid as it seems to be crying about this now with no real need for urgency because there is no benefit or real cause for concern because he still is going to be here I will say this.....it is the absolute stupidest thing in the world not to have it done.

We just cut.....CUT one of the greatest QBs of all time to bring this kid in. The contract money is basically already preditermined based on the CBA. Really it is just formalities like guarantees and out clauses but lets be real....our future is tied to this kid. We are going to give him every chance to be the man....drunk driving arrests or prostitution scandals or poor play it won't matter we will ride and die with this kid for the next 4 seasons regardless. And the money is PUNY for starting QB money. Most of the backups in the league have bigger contracts then this kid. Just give him what he wants...because he has all the leverage. We are a last place team with no chance without him and a fan base thats foundation crumbled this offseason with getting rid of the most beloved player we have ever had. Quit playing around and get it done and perhaps you will get a tiny bump in ticket sales. No positives can happen now by continuing to try to force the negotiations. Give him his money and a show of good will to build a since of support because if he plays well he could be holding out by year 3 to get real QB money.

I would say it is his agent Uncle wanting just a lil bit more guaranteed and a bigger signing.

[Superman]

I would say it is his agent Uncle wanting just a lil bit more guaranteed and a bigger signing.

Neither of those things are negotiable, per the terms of the CBA.

[NewColtsFan]

Perhaps what bav means is that there are bigger priorities right now.

And I'm not sure what you mean by "what is happening right now." There's nothing happening right now. Luck isn't holding out, there's no quabbling over the contract, there is simply a period of time that's passed since he was drafted. The rookie wage scale was designed to a) limit the money paid to rookies, b) limit, if not get rid of, restricted free agency, and c) eliminate contract disputes based on total value of the contract. None of that is the issue with Luck's contract. The only point of disagreement, if there even is any, is the schedule of bonus payments, which is a minor issue that will be resolved one way or the other.

Just because he hasn't signed doesn't mean there's a bitter dispute between him and the team.

No..... I don't mean there's a bitter dispute far from it. But there is a hold-up of some kind. I think you're right on the reasons. I think all parties will want this deal done as soon as it can get done.

As to my comment about 'what is happening right now' I wasn't referring just to Andrew. I was referring to so much of the first round not being signed. I believe it's much more at this point than it was at the same point last year. And the first round hold-ups are leading to the 2nd round hold-ups and so on....

I could be wrong, but IMO, the Colts deal with Andrew is the main hold-up to all the other deals. I just don't think saying "there's no priority to get things done now" is correct. Far from it. I think every team would want their deals done ASAP.

[Superman]

As to my comment about 'what is happening right now' I wasn't referring just to Andrew. I was referring to so much of the first round not being signed. I believe it's much more at this point than it was at the same point last year. And the first round hold-ups are leading to the 2nd round hold-ups and so on....

There was no CBA at this point last year. There really is no point of reference for how these new rookie contracts should be done, and on what time frame, other than that there's no reason to rush them before training camp. This is the first somewhat "normal" offseason in three years (lockout last year, labor negotiations the previous two, including an uncapped 2010). Once the lockout was over, there was a mad dash to figure out how free agency would work, and then they started working on signing draft picks. Anthony Castonzo missed the first few days of training camp last year.

I could be wrong, but IMO, the Colts deal with Andrew is the main hold-up to all the other deals. I just don't think saying "there's no priority to get things done now" is correct. Far from it. I think every team would want their deals done ASAP.

I really don't think so. The first half of the first round will probably have the same structure of contract, and then the break points will be established after that with regard to guarantees in the 5th year and the pay structure of the signing bonuses. The rest of it is pretty clear cut.

Rookie contracts, especially for first rounders, traditionally get done right before training camp, because that's the actual deadline.

[Malakai432]

For everyone just worried about it just contact Rob Lowe like I did. He told me not to give out his email on the Colts forum though so you'll have to find it yourself. We talked about unicorns, South Park and Chipotle.

[NewColtsFan]

There was no CBA at this point last year. There really is no point of reference for how these new rookie contracts should be done, and on what time frame, other than that there's no reason to rush them before training camp. This is the first somewhat "normal" offseason in three years (lockout last year, labor negotiations the previous two, including an uncapped 2010). Once the lockout was over, there was a mad dash to figure out how free agency would work, and then they started working on signing draft picks. Anthony Castonzo missed the first few days of training camp last year.

I really don't think so. The first half of the first round will probably have the same structure of contract, and then the break points will be established after that with regard to guarantees in the 5th year and the pay structure of the signing bonuses. The rest of it is pretty clear cut.

Rookie contracts, especially for first rounders, traditionally get done right before training camp, because that's the actual deadline.

Superman..... you have a very strong series of posts. But something doesn't add up to me. In your posts there is no incentive for anyone to be signed yet. Except most players are. The ones who aren't are the first round and the some of the 2nd and some of the 3rd.

Why them? If the only incentive to get a deal done is to be in camp by the end of July, why has anyone signed then?

The Bradford signing date isn't relevant anymore. It was before the new CBA. Part of the reason things were set-up in the new CBA is to get kids signed sooner and have them start practicing sooner, etc. Give the rookies a better chance at reaching their potential.

It feels like both of us have pieces of our puzzle missing. And it might be the same piece. What's the incentive to getting a deal done as soon as possible? You get the playbook sooner? You can participate in more practices? Your salary is more protected incase of injury?

There has to be something.

By the way, for the record, I'm not worried at all about Andrew's situation. It'll get done. I'm just in this thread for the discussion. That's all.

[Superman]

Superman..... you have a very strong series of posts. But something doesn't add up to me. In your posts there is no incentive for anyone to be signed yet. Except most players are. The ones who aren't are the first round and the some of the 2nd and some of the 3rd.

Why them? If the only incentive to get a deal done is to be in camp by the end of July, why has anyone signed then?

The Bradford signing date isn't relevant anymore. It was before the new CBA. Part of the reason things were set-up in the new CBA is to get kids signed sooner and have them start practicing sooner, etc. Give the rookies a better chance at reaching their potential.

It feels like both of us have pieces of our puzzle missing. And it might be the same piece. What's the incentive to getting a deal done as soon as possible? You get the playbook sooner? You can participate in more practices? Your salary is more protected incase of injury?

There has to be something.

By the way, for the record, I'm not worried at all about Andrew's situation. It'll get done. I'm just in this thread for the discussion. That's all.

Agreed to the bolded.

To your first point, the players who are signed are players whose contracts aren't going to include any significant signing bonuses or 5th year guarantees, for the most part. The contracts are much easier to finalize. It's basically, "here's your contract," and that's it. It also allows their agents to get those lower round picks done so they can focus attention on the upper round players exclusively.

To the Bradford contract, it's not relevant, but it does give us our last frame of reference. Even without any issues, and giving the player a record amount of guaranteed money, the contract was done before training camp. This is the first "normal" offseason in three years, so any time frames we're seeing now are likely to be the norm moving forward. The few holdouts in the beginning of training camp last year (like Castonzo) were mostly about the new market being set for guarantees in the 5th year. I doubt there are any rookie holdouts this year, as last year's contracts will mostly determine what the break points will be moving forward.

As for the incentive for getting a deal done early, there really isn't any. Rookies can participate in offseason activities, they can receive playbooks, they can use the facilities, etc. There's nothing they can't do until training camp, which is why that's the deadline. There's really not much to worry about, aside from injury, and since the new CBA prohibits contact in offseason work, that's not that big of a concern, especially for first round picks.

[FireJimCaldwell]

It is my understanding that the biggest issue at this point is the off-set language.

Teams want it, players/agents don't, and until one of the top draft choices bend and give into it, or one of the teams will give in and sign them. At this point the teams are in the drivers seat because training camp is still quite a bit away.

Luck's family has money, he has his Nike contract and might have other endorsements lined up. So the financial need isn't a huge reason for him to give in as it might be for one of the other top draft picks that might have the financial capabilities as the Luck family.

Using RGIII as an example, he has an adidas contract.

The agents and players shouldn't be stuck on this off set issue in my opinion. If they are released by their first team and picked up by the 2nd team, they are still going to be paid the same amount, they don't deserve to double dip.

[Superman]

It is my understanding that the biggest issue at this point is the off-set language.

Teams want it, players/agents don't, and until one of the top draft choices bend and give into it, or one of the teams will give in and sign them. At this point the teams are in the drivers seat because training camp is still quite a bit away.

Luck's family has money, he has his Nike contract and might have other endorsements lined up. So the financial need isn't a huge reason for him to give in as it might be for one of the other top draft picks that might have the financial capabilities as the Luck family.

Using RGIII as an example, he has an adidas contract.

The agents and players shouldn't be stuck on this off set issue in my opinion. If they are released by their first team and picked up by the 2nd team, they are still going to be paid the same amount, they don't deserve to double dip.

What would the second bonus date be?