Without a Franchise QB - The window is Closing for the Colts

[Nickster]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

Their defense also made a lot of plays, without which they don't go to the SB. 

 

I don't understand where you're taking exception to what I'm saying. The Chiefs had the most potent offense in the NFL. Of course they were able to win with a B level defense (but give their defense the credit it deserves, it wasn't a bad defense). 

 

That's the exact point I'm making to begin with.

 

We clearly don't have the Chiefs offense. We likely won't have an A level offense with Rivers, because he's not going to be a dynamic passer at 39 years old. So if we bring him back, we need to make significant upgrades on defense. Because we're not a real contender without at least one side of the ball being better than it was in 2020.

You took exception to one of the things one of the other posters said.  I thought it was cute to make a pun on the Offense scores points and Defense wins championships mantra which meant that Defesne was more important, by saying Defense holds teams to FGs while Offense wins championships which means Offense is more important.

 

And I don't understand really where you are taking exception to that, and frankly, I am pretty sure you think Offense is the way to go.  Am I wrong about what you think about the relavtive strengths of OS and Ds?

[shasta519]

20 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

The year the Chiefs were top 5 offensively with Smith, Smith was suddenly an incredible playmaker, and I think he led the league in explosive pass plays that year. Totally opposite of the way he played his entire career. So yeah, really good QBing.

 

Right...really really good QBing. And we are back to a key element of a top 5 offense...explosive plays. But expecting Smith to maintain that level of play and efficiency was a dubious proposition...and Mahomes took the offense to a new level.

[Nickster]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

The offense, for sure, because I think we're basically a dynamic passer away from being a top 5ish offense, and can stay that way for several years if we get the right guy. Having a great QB means you always have the potential to be a top 5ish offense.

 

I still want us to have a better pass rush, at a minimum.

bing dude we agree

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, chad72 said:

Football is indeed the ultimate team game and Ballard's team building and emphasis on special teams is ahead of what Polian ever did, just need the O and D to elevate their play making come playoff time.

 

In general I agree with this, and Ballard's work in the trenches on both sides is better than Polian's (through four years, at least). But Polian was better at WR and edge, and those are specific spots where we need better players/production.

 

Of course, Ballard hasn't spent any first rounders on either position, so that might be the only reason Polian was better at those positions. Would be nice to find a Robert Mathis, though...

[Superman]

1 minute ago, shasta519 said:

 

Right...really really good QBing. And we are back to a key element of a top 5 offense...explosive plays. But expecting Smith to maintain that level of play and efficiency was a dubious proposition...and Mahomes took the offense to a new level.

 

Smith became a playmaker after they drafted Mahomes. Either he saw the writing on the wall (and it made him $134m), or the way they coached the QBs changed in 2017. Or maybe both. But yeah, they weren't going to keep Smith beyond that year.

 

That whole situation worked out really well for everyone involved, up to the day that Smith got injured.

[SteelCityColt]

There seems to be an awful lot of focus on points and yards for defense. Allowing that today's league is more suited to high scoring passing attacks, D's that can consistently turn the ball over have a huge role to play. 

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

Smith became a playmaker after they drafted Mahomes. Either he saw the writing on the wall (and it made him $134m), or the way they coached the QBs changed in 2017. Or maybe both. But yeah, they weren't going to keep Smith beyond that year.

 

That whole situation worked out really well for everyone involved, up to the day that Smith got injured.

 

I feel like this is one of the few good news stories of 2020. I mean his recovery, not the injury obviously.

[chad72]

8 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I think you all are making similar arguments here. Everybody wants a balanced team...but offense is the key differentiator.

 

In a perfect world...you would have a team that is top 5 in both offense and defense (like TB). But if I had the choice between a team with a top 5 offense/top 15 defense OR a top 5 defense/top 15 offense...the choice is pretty easy. Even a team with a top 5 defense/top 10 offense isn't going to beat that top 5 offense most of the time.

 

In this example...the first choices are GB and BUF...and the latter is IND or LAR. 

 

The key to defense is to have playmakers that can make big plays in a game and flip the field. But you have to have the offense to execute and score points. That's what it comes down to. Of course scores are typically lower the further you go into the playoffs...possessions become more important and teams eat more clock.

 

2 areas I have seen teams be good at on defense on high scoring offenses is the safety position and pass rusher position. Bills' safeties are very good at not allowing WRs to go off, which leaves them vulnerable to TEs because they don't have great coverage LBs, IMO, Kelce is going to be a problem. Browns played him with Denzel Ward, he still juked Ward out. 

 

2012 - Ed Reed and company

2013 - Earl Thomas / Chancellor

2014 - McCourty / Chung

2015 - Stewart / T J Ward

2016 - McCourty / Chung again

2017 - Malcolm Jenkins' defense on James White

2018 - Lose count of Patriots safeties, they invest so much in secondary  

2019 - Tyrann Mathieu making plays

 

I am thinking exceptional safety play is more important than corner play for SB winning teams lately. Pass rushers, goes without saying, interior or exterior.

[shasta519]

19 minutes ago, stitches said:

I don't know how we can be an A-level defense without any A-level EDGE player or A-level CB. The most important things in modern football - pass-defense we are nowhere close to A level at. We ranked in the 20s in pressure rates, and in the middle of the pack in coverage. This was not an A-level defense. We had great run-defense, but the rest needs tons of improvement to get to A level. 

 

They also stuffed the stat sheet against abysmal OLs. All teams do this of course...but I agree...for a team that won't blitz...they need much better talent at EDGE and CB to pressure the QB at a high rate. The more I think about their needs at high-value (high cost) positions...getting a young cost-controlled QB is really paramount.

[stitches]

1 minute ago, shasta519 said:

 

They also stuffed the stat sheet against abysmal OLs. All teams do this of course...but I agree...for a team that won't blitz...they need much better talent at EDGE and CB to pressure the QB at a high rate. The more I think about their needs at high-value (high cost) positions...getting a young cost-controlled QB is really paramount.

Yep, I will keep banging that drum until it happens. Or until I'm proven wrong of course, but I doubt that. I see much better chance at contention in the short to medium term with a young cost-controlled QB than with Rivers/Ryan/Carr type of rethreads/pre-retirement QBs who will take away from your ability to address other important areas of the team. 

[Superman]

7 minutes ago, SteelCityColt said:

There seems to be an awful lot of focus on points and yards for defense. Allowing that today's league is more suited to high scoring passing attacks, D's that can consistently turn the ball over have a huge role to play. 

 

Yup. Points is more important than yards, but obviously context is still important. The Texans scored 31 on the Chiefs in the playoffs, but only 7 after the first quarter. The Chiefs forced a lot of teams to throw, and didn't care as much about stopping the run. We have to look at multiple factors when judging the quality of a defense.

[shasta519]

1 minute ago, chad72 said:

 

2 areas I have seen teams be good at on defense on high scoring offenses is the safety position and pass rusher position. Bills' safeties are very good at not allowing WRs to go off, which leaves them vulnerable to TEs because they don't have great coverage LBs, IMO, Kelce is going to be a problem. Browns played him with Denzel Ward, he still juked Ward out. 

 

2013 - Earl Thomas / Chancellor

2014 - McCourty / Chung

2015 - Stewart / T J Ward

2016 - McCourty / Chung again

2017 - Malcolm Jenkins' defense on James White

2018 - Lose count of Patriots safeties, they invest so much in secondary  

2019 - Tyrann Mathieu making plays

 

I am thinking exceptional safety play is more important than corner play for SB winning teams lately. Pass rushers, goes without saying, interior or exterior.

 

I agree about S play. KC also had Thornill as a rookie...and he was a stud that year (though he fell off this season). 

 

I don't know if I see the Colts S group making those types of plays in a playoff run. 

[chad72]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

Yup. Points is more important than yards, but obviously context is still important. The Texans scored 31 on the Chiefs in the playoffs, but only 7 after the first quarter. The Chiefs forced a lot of teams to throw, and didn't care as much about stopping the run. We have to look at multiple factors when judging the quality of a defense.

 

Yes but the Titans controlled the game for a half with timely passing and the Chiefs had to step up against the run till they got the lead vs the Titans in the AFCCG. The same thing in the SB, just good enough to keep things at bay vs the 49ers who were gashing the Chiefs in the first half but once the Chiefs eventually pulled away with enough defensive stops and scoring, the 49ers could not keep up. It was truly only 24-20 before a blown run D assignment resulted in a 31-20 in favor of the Chiefs making it seem like the Chiefs were in control of the game if you did not watch the game, which they were not till the last few minutes of the SB.

 

Same thing in the Saints-Colts SB, the final score 31-17 does not reflect how tight it was up until the Saints got to 24-17 and then came the pick six. Good offensive teams tend to remain balanced if they have to, that is why I wonder how long the Bills can sustain passing predominantly. Last true teams I saw wing it around in the passing game aggressively and consistently was the "lightning in a bottle" Foles and then the "lightning in a bottle" Flacco again. Most of the others have been methodical in their passing because like the Peyton days, we know good Ds play their safeties deep challenging the good offenses to run.

[chad72]

7 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I agree about S play. KC also had Thornill as a rookie...and he was a stud that year (though he fell off this season). 

 

I don't know if I see the Colts S group making those types of plays in a playoff run. 

 

Needless to say, our only SB came on the heels of stellar safety play from Bob Sanders and Antoine Bethea. Good pass rush would negate the need for great corners, just need good corners if that is the case (ala 2007 and 2011 Giants). That would work for our scheme too. However, you will need sound safety play to bridge the run D and pass D together to get to a certain level of competency.

[Nickster]

18 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

In general I agree with this, and Ballard's work in the trenches on both sides is better than Polian's (through four years, at least). But Polian was better at WR and edge, and those are specific spots where we need better players/production.

 

Of course, Ballard hasn't spent any first rounders on either position, so that might be the only reason Polian was better at those positions. Would be nice to find a Robert Mathis, though...

I'd say that's probably it.  But yeah getting mathis like production with the 138th pick woiuld be nice

[jvan1973]

43 minutes ago, King Colt said:

"probably" means probably. It's a little early to start posting the roster.

Ballard all but said he was gone.    

[chad72]

30 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

In general I agree with this, and Ballard's work in the trenches on both sides is better than Polian's (through four years, at least). But Polian was better at WR and edge, and those are specific spots where we need better players/production.

 

Of course, Ballard hasn't spent any first rounders on either position, so that might be the only reason Polian was better at those positions. Would be nice to find a Robert Mathis, though...

 

Ballard spent 2 second rounders on the WR position and 3 second rounders if you count Turay, Lewis and Banogu. Just that we don't have a lot to show for it except maybe Pittman and a little bit with Turay. Either he gets too cute or the quality is not the same as quantity that he thought he was gaining by moving back and gaining picks. 2 average dart throws at the draft dart board is not the same as 1 real good dart throw if that dart throw results in a Pro Bowler at pass rush. If you add RYS and Quincy Wilson, that 2nd round looks not so good on his resume so far with Leonard and Smith being his biggest saving grace to date. 

[poilucelt]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

The Eagles apparently want to keep Wentz; I don't know how they're going to make that work, get under the cap, and keep Hurts, but whatever. If they want to move him, I'd take him on the Colts for sure, but the question is about compensation. I wouldn't spend major compensation for him.

agree: I get all the theorizing about Reich & Wentz reuniting to recapture their old magic, but there's no way I'm giving up much (if any) draft capital for a guy who played like Wentz did this season--not to mention his humongous contract

[Nickster]

34 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

2 areas I have seen teams be good at on defense on high scoring offenses is the safety position and pass rusher position. Bills' safeties are very good at not allowing WRs to go off, which leaves them vulnerable to TEs because they don't have great coverage LBs, IMO, Kelce is going to be a problem. Browns played him with Denzel Ward, he still juked Ward out. 

 

2012 - Ed Reed and company

2013 - Earl Thomas / Chancellor

2014 - McCourty / Chung

2015 - Stewart / T J Ward

2016 - McCourty / Chung again

2017 - Malcolm Jenkins' defense on James White

2018 - Lose count of Patriots safeties, they invest so much in secondary  

2019 - Tyrann Mathieu making plays

 

I am thinking exceptional safety play is more important than corner play for SB winning teams lately. Pass rushers, goes without saying, interior or exterior.

It has been.  Teams attacked more in the seams and with short passing games which is where safeties eat.

 

this is how NE and PHI attacked.  The middle and short.  I think D's have adjusted and there is going to be a larger emphasis on outside talent again.  I think it's pretty evident this year with who is left in the playoffs.

 

Teams finally adjusted to Belechik and other teams' short/seam attack

 

 

[Nickster]

16 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Ballard spent 2 second rounders on the WR position and 3 second rounders if you count Turay, Lewis and Banogu. Just that we don't have a lot to show for it except maybe Pittman and a little bit with Turay. Either he gets too cute or the quality is not the same as quantity that he thought he was gaining by moving back and gaining picks. 2 average dart throws at the draft dart board is not the same as 1 real good dart throw if that dart throw results in a Pro Bowler at pass rush. If you add RYS and Quincy Wilson, that 2nd round looks not so good on his resume so far with Leonard and Smith being his biggest saving grace to date. 

I like Ballard alot, but I don't blindly trust the dude, especially in the 2nd round.

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, poilucelt said:

agree: I get all the theorizing about Reich & Wentz reuniting to recapture their old magic, but there's no way I'm giving up much (if any) draft capital for a guy who played like Wentz did this season--not to mention his humongous contract

 

His contract is manageable for a team that trades for him. And personally, while the link to Reich is a positive, my draw to Wentz is that he's good, has a great arm, he's mobile, and a playmaker. He had a bad year, but everyone writing him off is kind of crazy, especially after I've just watched some of his 2020 games. The Eagles were a mess in a lot of ways last year.

[Superman]

17 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Ballard spent 2 second rounders on the WR position and 3 second rounders if you count Turay, Lewis and Banogu. Just that we don't have a lot to show for it except maybe Pittman and a little bit with Turay. Either he gets too cute or the quality is not the same as quantity that he thought he was gaining by moving back and gaining picks. 2 average dart throws at the draft dart board is not the same as 1 real good dart throw if that dart throw results in a Pro Bowler at pass rush. If you add RYS and Quincy Wilson, that 2nd round looks not so good on his resume so far with Leonard and Smith being his biggest saving grace to date. 

 

Had a lot of games lost to injury from those second rounders, too. 

 

But Polian had Freeney at #10, inherited Marvin, and later got Reggie. 

 

I'm okay with Ballard building up the trenches, and I'm okay with the second round receivers (they've just both been hurt), but we gotta do something about edge rush.

[shasta519]

13 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Ballard spent 2 second rounders on the WR position and 3 second rounders if you count Turay, Lewis and Banogu. Just that we don't have a lot to show for it except maybe Pittman and a little bit with Turay. Either he gets too cute or the quality is not the same as quantity that he thought he was gaining by moving back and gaining picks. 2 average dart throws at the draft dart board is not the same as 1 real good dart throw if that dart throw results in a Pro Bowler at pass rush. If you add RYS and Quincy Wilson, that 2nd round looks not so good on his resume so far with Leonard and Smith being his biggest saving grace to date. 

 

I think there are several factors...but we aren't privy to their process. One thing that hasn't really continue to work out is putting a huge emphasis on the Senior Bowl. Worked tremendously well with Leonard and Smith...but not so well with others.

 

But I think the plan was to build the trenches first...with an overall focus on the defense. The problem is that just using early picks at those positions doesn't necessarily work. Other teams are smart too...and truly good pass rushers and CBs don't last very long. So in effect, they were over-drafting EDGE guys at times.

 

A bigger aspect too...is that many of these players were projects...either through where they were in their development OR how they intended to use them. 

 

Then you have the Sweat trade back. Ballard is clearly not averse to risk...so I will never get how he passed on a chance to draft an SEC EDGE who put up 30 sacks over two seasons (and had just blown up the Combine). There is just no way to spin it...either they missed the evaluation OR they liked Banogu more. But that one move would have changed the outlook of their team needs dramatically. As would have drafting Brown or Metcalf.

 

On that note, it wasn't until his 3rd year that they spent a Day 1-2 pick on a skill position...and even that player was a project. They still have yet to draft a TE early...despite how much they utilize the position (and despite both Ballard and Reich coming from organizations that had tremendous success from investing in the position).

 

But I understand why they took their initial approach...and fortunately it seems to have shifted...with the drafting of Pittman and Taylor...and I hope they continue to invest on that side of the ball.

 

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

Then you have the Sweat trade back. Ballard is clearly not averse to risk...so I will never get how he passed on a chance to draft an SEC EDGE who put up 30 sacks over two seasons (and had just blown up the Combine). There is just no way to spin it...either they missed the evaluation OR they liked Banogu more. But that one move would have changed the outlook of their team needs dramatically. As would have drafting Brown or Metcalf.

 

Simpler explanation is that they excluded Sweat due to medical.

[NewColtsFan]

30 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I think there are several factors...but we aren't privy to their process. One thing that hasn't really continue to work out is putting a huge emphasis on the Senior Bowl. Worked tremendously well with Leonard and Smith...but not so well with others.

 

But I think the plan was to build the trenches first...with an overall focus on the defense. The problem is that just using early picks at those positions doesn't necessarily work. Other teams are smart too...and truly good pass rushers and CBs don't last very long. So in effect, they were over-drafting EDGE guys at times.

 

A bigger aspect too...is that many of these players were projects...either through where they were in their development OR how they intended to use them. 

 

Then you have the Sweat trade back. Ballard is clearly not averse to risk...so I will never get how he passed on a chance to draft an SEC EDGE who put up 30 sacks over two seasons (and had just blown up the Combine). There is just no way to spin it...either they missed the evaluation OR they liked Banogu more. But that one move would have changed the outlook of their team needs dramatically. As would have drafting Brown or Metcalf.

 

On that note, it wasn't until his 3rd year that they spent a Day 1-2 pick on a skill position...and even that player was a project. They still have yet to draft a TE early...despite how much they utilize the position (and despite both Ballard and Reich coming from organizations that had tremendous success from investing in the position).

 

But I understand why they took their initial approach...and fortunately it seems to have shifted...with the drafting of Pittman and Taylor...and I hope they continue to invest on that side of the ball.

 

It isn’t hard to figure out why we passed in Sweat...   the guy has a serious heart condition.  Why do you think a top-10 caliber player fell all the way to pick 26.   So plenty of other teams passed on him too.  
 

Often a decision on a player with that kind of serious health issue isn’t made by the GM.   It’s made by the team doctor and the owner.  Because if you draft this guy and something goes wrong, the team and the doctor are open to a large lawsuit. 
 

[Imgrandojji]

2 hours ago, stitches said:

I don't know how we can be an A-level defense without any A-level EDGE player or A-level CB. The most important things in modern football - pass-defense we are nowhere close to A level at. We ranked in the 20s in pressure rates, and in the middle of the pack in coverage. This was not an A-level defense. We had great run-defense, but the rest needs tons of improvement to get to A level. 

My point is the talent was there.  A lot of our issues on defense came down to soft scheming that can be fixed at the coaching level.

 

Every unit needs to be defined not just by talent but by talent and execution.  Frankly I think the Colts are a fair bit more talented than people let on, but they're held back by a small litany of fatal flaws and a lack of scheming around those flaws.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, chad72 said:

 

Ballard spent 2 second rounders on the WR position and 3 second rounders if you count Turay, Lewis and Banogu. Just that we don't have a lot to show for it except maybe Pittman and a little bit with Turay. Either he gets too cute or the quality is not the same as quantity that he thought he was gaining by moving back and gaining picks. 2 average dart throws at the draft dart board is not the same as 1 real good dart throw if that dart throw results in a Pro Bowler at pass rush. If you add RYS and Quincy Wilson, that 2nd round looks not so good on his resume so far with Leonard and Smith being his biggest saving grace to date. 

Ballard has traded down substantially only once.   We traded back 20 picks with Washington 26 to 46 and we gained a high 2nd round the following year.   That’s called getting good value. 
 

Any other second round move down have been small...   down 2-3 picks to gain a 5.   And we weren’t hurt by any of those moves. 
 

Your frustration over the lack of production is understandable up to a point.   Turay, Lewis, and Banagu have underperformed relative to expectations.  But, as Ballard has repeatedly noted, these guys need more pro coaching, better health, and more experience on this level.   Patience is needed.   As for guys like Rock, he needs better health and more experience.  Campbell simply needs better health.   
 

Just look at our two second picks this year.   Once Pittman got healthy he started to flash his potential.  It took Taylor about a half a season for the game to slow down for him.   And he was the #1 rookie RB in the second half of the season.   Patience was rewarded. 
 

It’s not as black and white as just good and bad; hits and misses.   It’s more complex than that. 

[shasta519]

23 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Simpler explanation is that they excluded Sweat due to medical.

 

Who knows. But Ballard doesn't strike me as the type to just take a player off a draft board...especially for something that was reportedly a misdiagnosis. Maybe even if was character-related...but not something like that. Regardless, it's never been reported that he had and of course the local media wouldn't ask Ballard why he passed on a stud pass rusher.

 

But even if Ballard was one of the few teams that had taken Sweat off their board...if that is the case...then it's still part of a misevaluation. All I am saying is...any way you slice it...they got it wrong with Sweat. And I think it speaks to the overall approach they have taken on the DL. 

 

But while we are speculating on that trade...I don't even think it was the medical info. I think they wanted to trade back...and they have repeatedly said this when asked about the trade. On the "With the Next Pick" series...they actually show the war room when they Colts go on the clock...and they all almost immediately agree to take the trade when WAS calls. There isn't any talk about staying there and taking player X...they just want the picks. Then in the presser, Ballard talks about how he loved the depth in the draft. Ultimately, they valued that depth (plus a future pick) over any player that was available. I can respect that decision...but it was a risky move.

 

I know it's pointless to critique every draft pick (or non-draft pick)...but there have been a couple that have left me scratching my head...and Sweat is one of them.

 

 

 

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

The media did ask Ballard why he passed on Sweat. He declined to answer why. It was a dumb move not taking him in my opinion. It’s not like it was a top five or top ten pick. He fell right into their laps.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I didn’t even realize Banogu turned 25 today. I know he just finished his second year be he is pretty old for only a second year player. He doesn’t post much on IG but does he work with Mathis as much as Turay does?  Lewis is turning our ok but to me he falls short where he was drafted.

[Superman]

30 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Who knows. But Ballard doesn't strike me as the type to just take a player off a draft board...especially for something that was reportedly a misdiagnosis. Maybe even if was character-related...but not something like that. Regardless, it's never been reported that he had and of course the local media wouldn't ask Ballard why he passed on a stud pass rusher.

 

But even if Ballard was one of the few teams that had taken Sweat off their board...if that is the case...then it's still part of a misevaluation. All I am saying is...any way you slice it...they got it wrong with Sweat. And I think it speaks to the overall approach they have taken on the DL. 

 

But while we are speculating on that trade...I don't even think it was the medical info. I think they wanted to trade back...and they have repeatedly said this when asked about the trade. On the "With the Next Pick" series...they actually show the war room when they Colts go on the clock...and they all almost immediately agree to take the trade when WAS calls. There isn't any talk about staying there and taking player X...they just want the picks. Then in the presser, Ballard talks about how he loved the depth in the draft. Ultimately, they valued that depth (plus a future pick) over any player that was available. I can respect that decision...but it was a risky move.

 

I know it's pointless to critique every draft pick (or non-draft pick)...but there have been a couple that have left me scratching my head...and Sweat is one of them.

 

If medical said he had a heart condition, and they come to a consensus to take him off the board, that's not a misevaluation. Just have to take the info you're given and make a decision. 

 

It would be nice to have the local media ask real questions from time to time.

[NewColtsFan]

40 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Who knows. But Ballard doesn't strike me as the type to just take a player off a draft board...especially for something that was reportedly a misdiagnosis. Maybe even if was character-related...but not something like that. Regardless, it's never been reported that he had and of course the local media wouldn't ask Ballard why he passed on a stud pass rusher.

 

But even if Ballard was one of the few teams that had taken Sweat off their board...if that is the case...then it's still part of a misevaluation. All I am saying is...any way you slice it...they got it wrong with Sweat. And I think it speaks to the overall approach they have taken on the DL. 

 

But while we are speculating on that trade...I don't even think it was the medical info. I think they wanted to trade back...and they have repeatedly said this when asked about the trade. On the "With the Next Pick" series...they actually show the war room when they Colts go on the clock...and they all almost immediately agree to take the trade when WAS calls. There isn't any talk about staying there and taking player X...they just want the picks. Then in the presser, Ballard talks about how he loved the depth in the draft. Ultimately, they valued that depth (plus a future pick) over any player that was available. I can respect that decision...but it was a risky move.

 

I know it's pointless to critique every draft pick (or non-draft pick)...but there have been a couple that have left me scratching my head...and Sweat is one of them.

 

 

 

 

It’s very hard to tell if you’re being deliberately argumentative or not?   But there are a long serious of falsehoods stated in your post.

 

1.)   It isn’t Ballard who removes a player from the board like Sweat for medical reasons.  At this level its typically the team doctor and the owner.  
 

2.)  It wasn’t a “few teams” that removed Sweat from their board.  He was a top-10 kid at a premium position.   So 16 other teams removed him.  If you think he was a top-16 kid, then 10 other teams removed him.  That’s more than “a few”.

 

3.)  Where’s the “misevaluation”?   You didn’t explain that.  If he’s off the board, he’s off the board.  He wasn’t removed for talent,  he was removed for health.  How is that a misevaluation?

 

4.)  How do you know they “got it wrong with Sweat”?    Do you know what will happen with him tomorrow, next month, next year, the year after?   Of course not.  It’s the call of the doctor and the owner.  Even if he has a 10-year great career, it’s not a misevaluation. Doctors aren’t always right.

 

5.)  The medical misevaluation you mentioned was the position of Sweat’s camp.  But it looks like most teams did not accept that.  They took Sweat off their boards as the Colts did.  And that came from multiple doctors at the combine and then agreed with by a long list of team doctors who removed him from consideration. 
 

6.)  The Colts “Next Pick” series is a courtesy to the fans from the team.  It is not a documentary done by a neutral third party.  They might show 10-20 seconds about any given decision.  A decision that might have involved 5 minutes of negotiations, possibly even more.  The Colts are not showing you EVERYTHING.  You’re just getting a small slice.   And they’re not going to include anything negative about a player.  That’s clearly not the Colts way.

 

7.)  The call from Wash was likely one of several calls where terms of the deal are negotiated.  There were likely calls made days ahead of the draft to gauge interest.  Then one during the first round to see if Wash is still interested.   Then the final call to officially consummate the deal.  Again, you’re just making a series of giant assumptions based on tiny bits of information. 
 

Ask yourself this....   why would a man like Chris Ballard,  who clearly values pass rush, take a pass on a top pass rushing defensive end?   Wouldn’t you think he’d have to have a darn good reason?   He made the best of an unfortunate situation.   You’re badly over-thinking this because you don’t like the decision. 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

6 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

Hmm...none of the QBs threw for 300 yards in the divisional round and balance was the name of the game for all division round winners EXCEPT The Bills who believe in playing to their strengths. Only 2 teams scored 30 points or more with their defense playing a big part in generating field position for the offense. A big contrast from the regular season where points galore was the name of the game.

 

The key is having fresh enough legs on both ends without tiring them out because of long spells of ineptitude giving up long drives on defense or going first down and out or 3 and out on offense.

 

 

 

Holding a team to under 30 doesn't quite deserve to be called 'great'. Not that you did but these days many do lol. 

Imo, a championship team needs a franchise QB that plays at high level in post season while the Defense isn't porous. A defense that makes you work for what you get against them and capable of making a big play like a sack/interception. 

 

[chad72]

12 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

 

Holding a team to under 30 doesn't quite deserve to be called 'great'. Not that you did but these days many do lol. 

Imo, a championship team needs a franchise QB that plays at high level in post season while the Defense isn't porous. A defense that makes you work for what you get against them and capable of making a big play like a sack/interception. 

 

 

2007 and 2011, none of the Giants' opponents scored more than 20. The Chiefs, outside a bad divisional round 1st quarter, gave up 7 to the Texans after that 1st quarter and 20 points to both the Titans and 49ers. I chose those examples because the 2013 Seahawks and 2015 Broncos were legendary in terms of history (top 10 Ds overall in SB era) and I was making a point one did not need such phenomenal Ds to win the SBs. The Giants and Chiefs offenses stayed on the field, even if the results did not result in a TD every time. We saw what the Bucs did vs the Saints, stayed patient, dinked and dunked with 10 plus play drives just like the Patriots have done all these years. Brady's style that worked in the playoffs took over Arians' style, clearly. The Saints dinked and dunked us to death in the Saints-Colts SB, we all remember that. 

 

Like I said, SB runs like Flacco and Foles are "lightning in the bottle" runs where their offenses took a lot by surprise and kept winging it, they are far and few between. Otherwise, it has been clock control, don't make mistakes and let the other one self destruct. The reason we were in the Bills game was because we did not commit turnovers. The reason the Saints game got away from them eventually was they committed turnovers. That has been the Patriots' ammo for years. 

 

3rd down defense and 3rd down offense shine the most in the playoffs to extend drives and allow the D's legs to be fresh or tired based on how the results go, IMO. No wonder Peyton won his first SB as a Colt where they were able to run the ball real well. Coaching also shines the most because it is the small details that help teams win close games decided by less than a TD.

[ColtStrong2013]

17 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Smith became a playmaker after they drafted Mahomes. Either he saw the writing on the wall (and it made him $134m), or the way they coached the QBs changed in 2017. Or maybe both. But yeah, they weren't going to keep Smith beyond that year.

 

That whole situation worked out really well for everyone involved, up to the day that Smith got injured.

In the words of Chris Ballard "Look... It's all about competition." 

I don't know if that's an actual quote or not, but it sounds like him. I'd say Smith stepped his game up the minute Mahomes came in because that type of talent would push any qb to elevate their game a notch.

[King Colt]

21 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Ballard all but said he was gone.    

Meaning he has not said it.

[King Colt]

22 hours ago, Superman said:

 

We knew the day he got hurt that Mack was done as a Colt.

It's amazing how many people here know things that have yet to materialize. If the Colts stick with Rivers they are going to need all the help they can get with RBs.

[Superman]

1 minute ago, King Colt said:

It's amazing how many people here know things that have yet to materialize. If the Colts stick with Rivers they are going to need all the help they can get with RBs.

 

You still catching up??

[jvan1973]

4 minutes ago, King Colt said:

It's amazing how many people here know things that have yet to materialize. If the Colts stick with Rivers they are going to need all the help they can get with RBs.

Rivers retired this morning.   Also,   Mack won't be back

[Superman]

I can't wait for Mack to re-sign with the Colts so you can come back and rub our faces in it for being wrong. I'll readily admit to being wrong when that happens.

[EastStreet]

I wouldn't be shocked at all to see Mack resigned on the cheap. Won't be surprised if he doesn't either. IMO, no team is going to give him big dollars, or a long term deal after that injury. His best bet is to come back to Indy on a cheap 1 year deal and prove he's still got it.