Jordan Love combine presser

[stitches]

2 hours ago, DougDew said:

I never said he has swag.  Someone else said he has swag.

 

The broader point is, everything favorable I've read about Love on this forum has absolutely NOTHING to do with anything important.  THE most important thing in a NFL QB is decision making...knowing where to throw the football.....and even more precisely...where NOT to throw it.

 

So if/when the comments about Love start to center around how well he has command over his ability to see the field and know coverages, then the chatter will get to the important stuff.  Right now, just about any other discussion point is a waste of time, and has been for several weeks.

 

He's a nice kid with a great attitude.  Whoopie.  I say that about Fromm too, whoopie about leadership and personality.  In Fromm's case, will his hand size and physicality be a problem.  Fromm will nail the presser, and I could care less.

 

And we all know about Eason's work ethic, and his faults under pressure.  Yet, we hardly ever hear about Loves decision making,  even though decision making far far far outweighs hand size, arm talent, or turning your back under pressure (however, I'd say work ethic is up there with decision making)  

 

I disagree with a lot of this. First, his weaknesses are plenty talked about and his strengths are rarely mentioned. In fact I feel like the majority of posts here about Love talk about his poor decision making/interceptions first and foremost, before anything else is mentioned.

 

I actually think his biggest strengths are the ones that are least talked about. And are some of the most important ones in evaluating QBs. Love's pocket presence is elite and one of the best in this draft class... I can argue it's the best or at the very least in the general area of that of Burrow. This is extremely important element of QB play in the league. Love's touch and variability of throws is another strength of his. He has multiple different deliveries of the ball and he has much better accuracy than most gunslingers. To me his touch is more impressive than his fast ball. It's really beautiful to watch him lob passes over defenders(when he sees them  ), it's beautiful to watch him put air under the ball and drop it in the bucket right next to the sideline over the receiver shoulder. His accuracy throwing to receivers with any sort of separation is again second only to Burrow in this class(23 big time throws vs only 2 turnover worthy throws), etc.

 

My biggest questions with him are:

1. his understanding of the game... this should answer a lot of his decision making questions - teams should be drilling him on this one... they need to know if he knows why he's made some of his poor decisions and whether this is fixable or not. Can he be taught and reined in or is his processing of the game just not up to par.

2. drive and determination, competitiveness, attitude - is he the type who will work on his weaknesses and not let it go until it's fixed, does he have it in him to be relentless with his work ethic and pursuit of improvement? Because he does have clear weaknesses that need fixing and a lot of work. Can you rely on him to do the hard work? If not, I wouldn't draft him.  

 

Unfortunately we don't really have the answers to those, so I will defer to Ballard and his staff on those. I love his talent. I love his traits. But that's not enough. 

[Shive]

20 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

 

Random but when I hear Herbert talk I kinda feel like his personality is...meh. I don’t know, especially in his combine presser, just seems interesting.

That seems to be a big point of discussion around Herbert. He's definitely more introverted than most QB's, although he's made strides to become more vocal and commanding as a leader. TDN had a piece on him this morning about that: https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/justin-herbert-nfl-combine-2020

 

It's honestly a really hard thing to evaluate and project for him as a potential franchise QB. The one piece that makes me feel good about Herbert & his personality is that he has shown to be very willing to push himself to be uncomfortable in his pursuit to be a better leader.

 

The piece about it not being in his best interest to start right away is an oddly honest answer. Most QB's would tell you that they're ready to start day one and I don't know if Herbert doesn't think he's ready to do that or if it was more of a statement about how he knows sitting for a year, not getting thrown into the fire, would help him in the long run (ie: Mahomes/Rodgers vs Rosen/any number of highly drafted QB's thrown into the fire that fail).

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

That is not what Reich said, he said good feet, stated the game is played from the ground up, so what that means is good mechanics not the ability to run.

 

For example, Manning had great feet but was not a running threat.  Many people knocked Manning for his "happy feet" but he used it to keep time with his receivers.  

 

He did, later on when someone asked about a "running type" Qb he said that they don't want to be a copy cat but they do look at the newer styles and try to incorporate that into what they want to do.

I can go find you the article from the fan that was up with quotes if you would like. It’s very clear what they want in a QB. They have both said the ability to extend plays. I wasn’t talking about running like a Lamar Jackson.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 hour ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

 

Random but when I hear Herbert talk I kinda feel like his personality is...meh. I don’t know, especially in his combine presser, just seems interesting.

Everything I have heard his team mates love him. He isn’t a alpha though. Is he going to demand hard work from his team mates. He seems to be really robotic instead of just being himself. 

[Coffeedrinker]

3 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I can go find you the article from the fan that was up with quotes if you would like. It’s very clear what they want in a QB. They have both said the ability to extend plays.

You don't have to find it, he just talked about it yesterday at the combine.

 

https://www.colts.com/news/frank-reich-takeaways-2020-nfl-scouting-combine-draft

 

Starting at about 7:35 in the video.  5 things he looks for

 

Toughness - mental and physical toughness

Accelerated Vision - How fast do you think on your feet

Accuracy

Good feet - Most sports are played from the ground up.

last thing - the intangibles, the leadership, are you the playmaker in the big moment.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, Coffeedrinker said:

You don't have to find it, he just talked about it yesterday at the combine.

 

https://www.colts.com/news/frank-reich-takeaways-2020-nfl-scouting-combine-draft

I seen one about a week ago with quotes also. I wasn’t talking about running like a Jackson. They have said in the past the ability to extend plays is important.

[Coffeedrinker]

13 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I seen one about a week ago with quotes also. I wasn’t talking about running like a Jackson. They have said in the past the ability to extend plays is important.

Those are the 5 things Reich looks for directly from him.  Ability to extend plays is not one of the top 5

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Kevin Bowen mentioned on his podcast today he was impressed with Fromm, TUA, and Love in there pressers yesterday. He also like Anthony Gordon. He mentioned he thought Jacob Eason acted like he was to good to be there. I got the same vibe when I watched his presser. 

[Stephen]

1 hour ago, Chloe6124 said:

Kevin Bowen mentioned on his podcast today he was impressed with Fromm, TUA, and Love in there pressers yesterday. He also like Anthony Gordon. He mentioned he thought Jacob Eason acted like he was to good to be there. I got the same vibe when I watched his presser. 

Just seen another article  saying  we have interest in rivers. If we do sign rivers I wonder if Brissett  gets cut or another qb gets drafted

[WifiGuy]

7 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Those are the 5 things Reich looks for directly from him.  Ability to extend plays is not one of the top 5

actually those were the exact words . Able to extend plays.    

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

33 minutes ago, Stephen said:

Just seen another article  saying  we have interest in rivers. If we do sign rivers I wonder if Brissett  gets cut or another qb gets drafted

If we sign Rivers I think that means we are probably drafting a QB. 

[Stephen]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

If we sign Rivers I think that means we are probably drafting a QB. 

Yea, but when is the only question 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 hour ago, Stephen said:

Yea, but when is the only question 

To me it’s not a question. They are looking at this draft. They want him to help groom a QB. He could only play a year so drafting a QB in 2021 wouldn’t make sense. 

[Stephen]

10 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

To me it’s not a question. They are looking at this draft. They want him to help groom a QB. He could only play a year so drafting a QB in 2021 wouldn’t make sense. 

No what I meant is what round will they take the qb

[richard pallo]

13 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

To me it’s not a question. They are looking at this draft. They want him to help groom a QB. He could only play a year so drafting a QB in 2021 wouldn’t make sense. 

Unless the plan is to sign a veteran like Rivers and have Kelly be the backup and future. They did make him the highest paid practice squad player in the NFL last year.  Why do that after you signed Hoyer for a couple of years.  They must see a high upside.  Rivers might be the perfect mentor for Kelly.  Who knows but I guess anything is possible in this QB landscape.  

[Moosejawcolt]

On 2/25/2020 at 2:00 PM, #12. said:

 

Yeah, I'm with Chad on this one.  If Ballard is openly talking this much about Love, they're looking elsewhere.

 

 

 

U have no idea what Ballards intentions r.  There is so much crap bring thrown out. Plus, even though he talks about Love, they still talk highly of Brissett.  None of us have any idea what they r thinking.  For all we know, they could love Anthony Gordon.  I take the opposite approach.  If Ballard is talking this much about Love, it would lead me to believe he wont pick him. Teams only let out what they want to get out. Everyone is forecasting Love to the Colts.  If that is true, they will never land him.  Someone will jump in front if they truly believe Ballard wants him.  Ballard cant be that stupid.  I truly believe if he was their guy, they would stay far away from him. Just my opinion

[Moosejawcolt]

On 2/25/2020 at 4:08 PM, coming on strong said:

tons of teams need a Qb . steelers pats , saints and a lot more .  When drafting a QB they get taken ahead of where they should all the time when you believe you found a QB that is a franchise guy you have to take that risk , the reward is way to high to pass it up.

 

if the colts do not take love and some other team does and he plays well and becomes elite trust me you will feel sick to your stomach watching jacoby struggle .

Or the Colts take him at 13 and he is a bust.  Ballard and Reich will b gone and get ready for another rebuild

[EastStreet]

3 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Or the Colts take him at 13 and he is a bust.  Ballard and Reich will b gone and get ready for another rebuild

If he bust, you move on and take another shot. At least you're trying to get better (which every team is trying to do). A lot of GMs never have to make a QB decision and still fail and get fired. This will be Ballard's first. And fear of busting should never be greater than the effort to improve. And we definitely need to improve.

[Moosejawcolt]

13 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

We’ll see. Ballard has the best poker face in the league. It’s always hard to guess what he’ll do. He’s got 3 drafts under his belt and all of them look different. He holds all the cards close to him. Plus we don’t know how the picks before us will go besides picks one and two. Plus he’s never had to draft a QB before so we don’t even know what he’s looking for.

 

If I had to put a bet on it, I’d say there’s a 60% chance he’ll draft a QB in the first.

Really???? Poker face.  I actually find Ballard talks to much.  He keeps harping on 3 technique,, which we need badly.  So other teams know what he wants

[Moosejawcolt]

1 minute ago, EastStreet said:

If he bust, you move on and take another shot. At least you're trying to get better (which every team is trying to do). A lot of GMs never have to make a QB decision and still fail and get fired. This will be Ballard's first. And fear of busting should never be greater than the effort to improve. And we definitely need to improve.

Ballard may not survive if he picks a qb and he busts out.  Lets b honest here.  His win loss record is not that good.  Do u really think he would survive 2 more losing seasons if the qb he chose is not the future!?!?? I doubt it 

[Moosejawcolt]

11 hours ago, Shive said:

It's been more than well discussed on this forum that decision making and reading coverage are the biggest concerns with Love. Why would they be talked about favorably?

 

Stitches liked how Love carried himself with confidence in the presser. That's a relevant observation in the larger evaluation of Love as potentially the face of a franchise.

 

Based off of the quoted post, if the conversation isn't favorably discussing Love's decision making, we shouldn't be talking about Love at all? That's asinine. It's a holistic view of him as a prospect and just because your concerns about him as a prospect aren't being addressed, doesn't mean other observations aren't relevant.

 

If you don't want to be a part of the discussions about Love that aren't about his decision making, then STOP COMMENTING ON THEM. You have a habit of trying to dictate what's worthwhile discussing, while offering nothing of substance in the course of that discussion. We're discussing the the many attributes as a part of evaluating a prospect and if you don't see value in what's being discussed, just don't join the conversation.

So is getting caught smoking dope 2 days after declaring for the dfaft. No one wants to talk about that . Do i really care bout players smoking pot? No.   Do i care bout my franchise qb smoking pot? U betcha. And its really not bout smoking pot.  Its about Love's decsion making.  Appears to b poor on and off the field.  Just saying.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

27 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

U have no idea what Ballards intentions r.  There is so much crap bring thrown out. Plus, even though he talks about Love, they still talk highly of Brissett.  None of us have any idea what they r thinking.  For all we know, they could love Anthony Gordon.  I take the opposite approach.  If Ballard is talking this much about Love, it would lead me to believe he wont pick him. Teams only let out what they want to get out. Everyone is forecasting Love to the Colts.  If that is true, they will never land him.  Someone will jump in front if they truly believe Ballard wants him.  Ballard cant be that stupid.  I truly believe if he was their guy, they would stay far away from him. Just my opinion

He was asked a question. Found it interesting he new Matt Ryan’s Stats compared to Love. That tells me he has done a lot of homework on Love. Reich was asked about Herbert but I don’t know what he said.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

8 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Ballard may not survive if he picks a qb and he busts out.  Lets b honest here.  His win loss record is not that good.  Do u really think he would survive 2 more losing seasons if the qb he chose is not the future!?!?? I doubt it 

Ballard may not survive if he ignores taking a QB. I trust our coaching staff. We have a good organization.  

[Moosejawcolt]

Just now, Chloe6124 said:

He was asked a question. Found it interesting he new Matt Ryan’s Stats compared to Love. That tells me he has done a lot of homework on Love. Reich was asked about Herbert but I don’t know what he said.

Yeah and the home work he has done has mayb lead him to the conclusion, he is not the guy. He probably has done a ton of homework on the top 6 qbs.  Thats his job

[Coffeedrinker]

3 hours ago, WifiGuy said:

actually those were the exact words . Able to extend plays.    

I quoted his exact words

[Moosejawcolt]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

Ballard may not survive if he ignores taking a QB. I trust our coaching staff. We have a good organization.  

I just think it will b a guy that makes everyone fall off their chair

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I have zero concern Love will bust. I trust the coaches and Ballard they make the right evaluations. I have a feeling that Love impressed in interviews. He says he watches a ton of football and is a junkie. He also said when asked about his interceptions it was easy because he had already watched them over and over. I think it’s going to come out he has a high football IQ.

[DougDew]

11 hours ago, stitches said:

I disagree with a lot of this. First, his weaknesses are plenty talked about and his strengths are rarely mentioned. In fact I feel like the majority of posts here about Love talk about his poor decision making/interceptions first and foremost, before anything else is mentioned.

 

I actually think his biggest strengths are the ones that are least talked about. And are some of the most important ones in evaluating QBs. Love's pocket presence is elite and one of the best in this draft class... I can argue it's the best or at the very least in the general area of that of Burrow. This is extremely important element of QB play in the league. Love's touch and variability of throws is another strength of his. He has multiple different deliveries of the ball and he has much better accuracy than most gunslingers. To me his touch is more impressive than his fast ball. It's really beautiful to watch him lob passes over defenders(when he sees them  ), it's beautiful to watch him put air under the ball and drop it in the bucket right next to the sideline over the receiver shoulder. His accuracy throwing to receivers with any sort of separation is again second only to Burrow in this class(23 big time throws vs only 2 turnover worthy throws), etc.

 

My biggest questions with him are:

1. his understanding of the game... this should answer a lot of his decision making questions - teams should be drilling him on this one... they need to know if he knows why he's made some of his poor decisions and whether this is fixable or not. Can he be taught and reined in or is his processing of the game just not up to par.

2. drive and determination, competitiveness, attitude - is he the type who will work on his weaknesses and not let it go until it's fixed, does he have it in him to be relentless with his work ethic and pursuit of improvement? Because he does have clear weaknesses that need fixing and a lot of work. Can you rely on him to do the hard work? If not, I wouldn't draft him.  

 

Unfortunately we don't really have the answers to those, so I will defer to Ballard and his staff on those. I love his talent. I love his traits. But that's not enough. 

You're reverting back to praising his arm talent.  IOW, irrelevant stuff.

 

1. and 2. don't matter if he simply does not see that defender over there.  He tries real hard to, but never does.

 

Or...swaggishly thinking his arm talent can whiz the ball past the defender (aka Winston) is a flaw that's not reliably coached away.  

 

But that's future stuff we all hope works out for him.

[Smoke317]

Ballard was doing an interview with JMV, and the thing that stood out to me was what he said about the Chiefs & their drafting of Mahomes.  Said he (they)  knew that Mahomes was gonna be a star before the draft.  And that he loved the way they did their homework & pulled the trigger on trading up to go get their man.

 

That basically told me that Ballard has done his homework on Love.  And if Love continues to light up the combine (very key component), Ballard will be forced to pull the trigger and move up to get his man. 

 

In that scenario, no way he gets past the Chargers at 6 & maybe even the Dolphins at 5.  So my bold prediction is that we trade with the Giants and move up to 4th & take Love.  Could some of our resident draft experts give me some examples of what it would take to go from 13 to 4???

[EastStreet]

45 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Ballard may not survive if he picks a qb and he busts out.  Lets b honest here.  His win loss record is not that good.  Do u really think he would survive 2 more losing seasons if the qb he chose is not the future!?!?? I doubt it 

His W/L record is simply due to JB (Luck being hurt and then Luck retiring). His financial management and talent evaluation has been spot on. And the JB years were out of his control for the most part, and he gets a pass. He'll more or less get a blank slate with a new QB.

 

Drafting a QB isn't going to put him on the hot seat regardless of boom/bust. There's always risk/reward in the draft, teams do it every year, and owners know the %s. As long as his overall report card is good, he really has nothing to worry about. Signing a FA who is a known quantity that fails, or sticking with JB (also a known quantity) and failing, would put him on the hot seat because he's making a conscious decision with known quantities.

[EastStreet]

1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

Ballard was doing an interview with JMV, and the thing that stood out to me was what he said about the Chiefs & their drafting of Mahomes.  Said he (they)  knew that Mahomes was gonna be a star before the draft.  And that he loved the way they did their homework & pulled the trigger on trading up to go get their man.

 

That basically told me that Ballard has done his homework on Love.  And if Love continues to light up the combine (very key component), Ballard will be forced to pull the trigger and move up to get his man. 

 

In that scenario, no way he gets past the Chargers at 6 & maybe even the Dolphins at 5.  So my bold prediction is that we trade with the Giants and move up to 4th & take Love.  Could some of our resident draft experts give me some examples of what it would take to go from 13 to 4???

Pick 4 has a value of 1800

 

13+34+44=2160

13+34=1710

13+34+75=1925

13+44+75=1825 (closest to value of 1800).

 

Of course some want more, some want less, but those are the approximations based on the chart and calulators.

 

Here's a calculator if you want to play.

https://www.calculatorsoup.com/calculators/games/draft-pick-value.php

[stitches]

2 hours ago, DougDew said:

You're reverting back to praising his arm talent.  IOW, irrelevant stuff.

 

1. and 2. don't matter if he simply does not see that defender over there.  He tries real hard to, but never does.

 

Or...swaggishly thinking his arm talent can whiz the ball past the defender (aka Winston) is a flaw that's not reliably coached away.  

 

But that's future stuff we all hope works out for him.

How the hell can you state that arm talent is irrelevant to playing QB? this is becoming ridiculous. I don't get this. There are legitimate reasons not to take Love. Underselling all his good traits and skill is not a legitimate way to go about this.

[EastStreet]

12 minutes ago, stitches said:

How the hell can you state that arm talent is irrelevant to playing QB? this is becoming ridiculous. I don't get this. There are legitimate reasons not to take Love. Underselling all his good traits and skill is not a legitimate way to go about this.

A lot of Love's issues in 2019 was lack of talent at WRs (incredibly slow, incredibly small, no separation). That, mixed with his refusal to give up on plays or over confidence, and playing from behind a lot, led to a lot of those INTs. He won't have incredibly slow and small targets in the NFL that can't get separation. As long as he can be coached to throw the ball away, his INT issue doesn't worry me all that much. I don't think it's an issue of "not seeing" at all. He showed what he could do with medium level talent in 2018, and just ran out of runway with bottom tier talent in 2019.

 

Here's one of many reviews, but most of the good say the same.

 

Quote

Love has ideal size, arm strength and athletic ability. He operates in the gun and he's very fluid and smooth in his setup. He throws from a variety of platforms and arm angles. The ball jumps out of his hand. He is at his best on skinny post drive throws and over the top deep balls. His decision making was very concerning this season. He forces too many balls into crowds and he doesn't ever give up on a play -- to a fault. His supporting cast isn't very good, but he still fell into too many bad habits. He uses his athletic ability to escape and extend plays, but there are occasions when he fails to climb and reset his feet. Overall, Love is a raw prospect who will need some time to develop. There is risk with him, but the payoff could be huge.

 

[DougDew]

6 hours ago, stitches said:

How the hell can you state that arm talent is irrelevant to playing QB? this is becoming ridiculous. I don't get this. There are legitimate reasons not to take Love. Underselling all his good traits and skill is not a legitimate way to go about this.

Because if a QB does NOT know where to throw the ball, or, as enough swag to love his arm talent and doesn't care that much where the defender is, having arm talent is irrelevant.

 

You're not following.  Arm talent is relevant.  Its very relevant, extremely relevant, but only AFTER he knows the correct spot to throw the ball.

 

We know that Love has great arm talent.  We're not sure yet if it evens matters.

[stitches]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Because if a QB does NOT know where to throw the ball, or, as enough swag to love his arm talent and doesn't care that much where the defender is, having arm talent is irrelevant.

It's still NOT irrelevant. Unless you think he does that 100% of the time, which he does not. Him missing dropping defenders and forcing throws are a well documented things. And those things are still a small sample of his body of work. And when he actually makes the right read and make the right throw it makes it much more likely he will be able to complete the required passes.

 

Think of it like this... he did have a bad season, he did force a ton of throws he shouldn't have, he was throwing to horrible receiving talent and was (not) protected by horrible OLine... and he still completed 62% of his passes. This is still about 5-6%+ higher than someone like Josh Allen who went no. 8 in the draft and had similar strengths, but nothing close to the arm talent and accuracy...

 

This is also still higher completion % than the master of reading the field and accuracy and decision-making in Jake Fromm, who was playing behind one of the best OLines in the country and had 5 star talent all over the field. 

 

So yeah... arm talent matters and it is not irrelevant. Even when you make a ton of mistakes and have a horrible season, it still helps you maintain a certain level of efficiency. 

 

Quote

You're not following.  Arm talent is relevant.  Its very relevant, extremely relevant, but only AFTER he knows the correct spot to throw the ball.

 

We know that Love has great arm talent.  We're not sure yet if it evens matters.

Again - of course it matters. You can see it mattering all the time if you watch his tape... Just like you can see some of his poor decision making on the tape. Both matter. The question is - can his aggression and YOLO nature be reined in and channeled into a more effective and positive direction?  

[Smoke317]

9 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Pick 4 has a value of 1800

 

13+34+44=2160

13+34=1710

13+34+75=1925

13+44+75=1825 (closest to value of 1800).

 

Of course some want more, some want less, but those are the approximations based on the chart and calulators.

 

Here's a calculator if you want to play.

https://www.calculatorsoup.com/calculators/games/draft-pick-value.php

Thanks East. I’d definitely do that 13, 44, & 75 deal. One more question for you though. I think Ballard will be reluctant to part with both 13 & 34.  But I think he would be willing to part with 13 & next year’s first. Also, JB has a history with the Giants organization. Could we include him in the package (he’d make a great backup for Jones)?  How would this year’s & next year’s first plus JB or our later 2nd matchup in a trade for 4?

[Defjamz26]

11 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Really???? Poker face.  I actually find Ballard talks to much.  He keeps harping on 3 technique,, which we need badly.  So other teams know what he wants

He’s also said enough about all the positions that it seems like he can go anyway. He also praised the WR class and has talked about how they always want to add an explosive element to the offense. He’s also always talking about the trenches. He’s said they look at QBs every year too.

 

Ballard says a lot but doesn’t often reveal his hand. No one saw him drafting Rock Ya-Sin or Malik Hooker.

[DougDew]

2 hours ago, stitches said:

It's still NOT irrelevant. Unless you think he does that 100% of the time, which he does not. Him missing dropping defenders and forcing throws are a well documented things. And those things are still a small sample of his body of work. And when he actually makes the right read and make the right throw it makes it much more likely he will be able to complete the required passes.

 

Think of it like this... he did have a bad season, he did force a ton of throws he shouldn't have, he was throwing to horrible receiving talent and was (not) protected by horrible OLine... and he still completed 62% of his passes. This is still about 5-6%+ higher than someone like Josh Allen who went no. 8 in the draft and had similar strengths, but nothing close to the arm talent and accuracy...

 

This is also still higher completion % than the master of reading the field and accuracy and decision-making in Jake Fromm, who was playing behind one of the best OLines in the country and had 5 star talent all over the field. 

 

So yeah... arm talent matters and it is not irrelevant. Even when you make a ton of mistakes and have a horrible season, it still helps you maintain a certain level of efficiency. 

 

Again - of course it matters. You can see it mattering all the time if you watch his tape... Just like you can see some of his poor decision making on the tape. Both matter. The question is - can his aggression and YOLO nature be reined in and channeled into a more effective and positive direction?  

I get all of that.  I'm not discounting that superior physical abilities makes for a superior QB.  I'm simply saying that I can't get too excited about Love at this point....anything about him.....until I see that he has the ability to use all of those abilities correctly.  At least use his attributes in a better way than the next guy.

 

If we draft him, I still might have the exact same attitude three years later if he still has not shown that he has a grip on the really important stuff first.  I'm not going to be wowed over ANY of the pretty 25 TDs if he also has 20 INTS (that are his fault).

 

That was the whole basis of me entering this thread, that I think its jumping the gun to get sloppy over nice attitudes in pressers, when the important attribute of a QB is yet to be resolved...and in fact....he's probably the worst QB on the list in that regard at this point.

[stitches]

13 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I get all of that.  I'm not discounting that superior physical abilities makes for a superior QB.  I'm simply saying that I can't get too excited about Love at this point....anything about him.....until I see that he has the ability to use all of those abilities correctly.  At least use them better than the next guy.

 

If we draft him, I still might have the exact same attitude three years later if he still has not shown that he has a grip on the really important stuff first.  I'm not going to be wowed over ANY of the pretty 25 TDs if he also has 20 INTS (that are his fault).

 

That was the whole basis of me entering this thread, that I think its jumping the gun to get sloppy over nice attitudes in pressers, when the important attribute of a QB is yet to be resolved...and in fact....he's probably the worst QB on the list in that regard at this point.

Absolutely agree with the bolded part of your post. His press-conferences are nice to see, but not anywhere close to the most important things for him. His interviews with the Colts are much more important, but unfortunately we won't hear about them unless we end up drafting him. 

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11 hours ago, EastStreet said:

His W/L record is simply due to JB (Luck being hurt and then Luck retiring). His financial management and talent evaluation has been spot on. And the JB years were out of his control for the most part, and he gets a pass. He'll more or less get a blank slate with a new QB.

 

Drafting a QB isn't going to put him on the hot seat regardless of boom/bust. There's always risk/reward in the draft, teams do it every year, and owners know the %s. As long as his overall report card is good, he really has nothing to worry about. Signing a FA who is a known quantity that fails, or sticking with JB (also a known quantity) and failing, would put him on the hot seat because he's making a conscious decision with known quantities.

 

Good point to the bolded. I always love when people try to bring up Ballard's W-L record. Lynch with the 49ers still has a losing record even after this year's SB run. Are people going to say he's a bad GM too?