With the 18th pick of the 2016 NFL draft the colts select.......

[BProland85]

1 hour ago, COLTS449 said:

 

Parry started off really good, but he hit the rookie wall I guess you could say. I think he'll be much improved next year and I think he's going to be our starting NT for the next several years. Getting Anderson back should give us a pretty good DL. And our young guys like McGill have tons of potential. But with all that said I still think we could afford to upgrade and sign a guy like Malik Jackson. He's a guy who can put pressure on the QB from the DL position and he plays the run very well too.

 

Would love getting Malik Jackson to replace Art Jones if we can afford him.

[LockeDown]

1 hour ago, chad72 said:

 

I am thinking it is a Big Ten OT in Taylor Decker or Jack Conklin. Maybe we trade down and take a chance on Noah Spence??? Not sure.

That's what I'm thinking as well and I would be okay with that unless Jaylon Smith is there, in which case I would be for that move.  

[BProland85]

28 minutes ago, LockeDown said:

That's what I'm thinking as well and I would be okay with that unless Jaylon Smith is there, in which case I would be for that move.  

 

You gotta be sure that your 1st round pick will be a prime player in the NFL. That's why I'm hesitant to take a guy like Noah Spence in the 1st. That's why I'm all the more for trading up a few spots if we have to in order to draft a sure thing in my opinion in Jaylon Smith, Myles Jack, or Jalen Ramsey. All will be great defensive players in the league. I also feel pretty confident about Mackensie Alexander, Vernon Hargreaves, and A'Shawn Robinson in that they'll produce in the NFL as well.

[Defjamz26]

3 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

im not sold. combine results dont always translate to success. for me to take floyd, a number of players have to be off the board

Yeah but just looking for college production isn't going to do it. People always want to find the guys that completely dominated in college and put up ridiculous numbers. But those guys are rare. It's all about PROJECTION to the next level, which is why you have to study the player, not the production.

 

Dontari Poe is a good example. Really only had 1 year of college production coming out. People labeled him a boom or bust project but he blew up the combine. Turned into a really good player.

 

All signs point to Floyd being successful at the next level. He has the things you look for in an explosive 3-4 OLB. The most important thing is that his flaws are fixable and coachable.

[CR91]

1 minute ago, Defjamz26 said:

Yeah but just looking for college production isn't going to do it. People always want to find the guys that completely dominated in college and put up ridiculous numbers. But those guys are rare. It's all about PROJECTION to the next level, which is why you have to study the player, not the production.

 

Dontari Poe is a good example. Really only had 1 year of college production coming out. People labeled him a boom or bust project but he blew up the combine. Turned into a really good player.

 

All signs point to Floyd being successful at the next level. He has the things you look for in an explosive 3-4 OLB. The most important thing is that his flaws are fixable and coachable.

 

what exactly is it about floyd that makes you think he'll be a success in the nfl? sack total alone, hes only had 16.5 sacks in three years and hes had a bit of injury history 

[Defjamz26]

11 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

what exactly is it about floyd that makes you think he'll be a success in the nfl? sack total alone, hes only had 16.5 sacks in three years and hes had a bit of injury history 

 

1. Those 16.5 sacks is misleading. Georgia used him everywhere. They didn't let him just rush the passer every play

 

2. He's got the traits. Speed off the edge, bend (could use some work), high motor, can cover, good length, can rip and dip, clean character, etc...

 

3. Team Defensive MVP in 2014, 2015 Butkus award finalist, led Georgia in sacks for 3 years among other things.

 

The only real knock on him is size but his frame isn't anywhere near maxed out.

[CR91]

17 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

 

1. Those 16.5 sacks is misleading. Georgia used him everywhere. They didn't let him just rush the passer every play

 

2. He's got the traits. Speed off the edge, bend (could use some work), high motor, can cover, good length, can rip and dip, clean character, etc...

 

3. Team Defensive MVP in 2014, 2015 Butkus award finalist, led Georgia in sacks for 3 years among other things.

 

The only real knock on him is size but his frame isn't anywhere near maxed out.

 

in your estimation, what percentage did he rush the passer?

[krunk]

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

Yeah but just looking for college production isn't going to do it. People always want to find the guys that completely dominated in college and put up ridiculous numbers. But those guys are rare. It's all about PROJECTION to the next level, which is why you have to study the player, not the production.

 

Dontari Poe is a good example. Really only had 1 year of college production coming out. People labeled him a boom or bust project but he blew up the combine. Turned into a really good player.

 

All signs point to Floyd being successful at the next level. He has the things you look for in an explosive 3-4 OLB. The most important thing is that his flaws are fixable and coachable.

 

Nose tackle is one of those positions where you are not really looking heavily at stats anyway.  What you want to know at that position is can the guy anchor well?  Can he hold up against the double team?  How well does he hold his position and move down the line if it's zone blocking?  Things of that nature.  You can draft a guy with low stats at that type of position. I don't think you can set Floyds numbers aside at the linebacker position especially when they were created in the SEC which is as close to the NFL as it gets.  

 

He's also got some issues with run defense and one of the first things Pagano and Grigson look at is "Can he set the edge?".  I'm not dissing Floyd but I do have some questions that need to be answered.

[Defjamz26]

22 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

in your estimation, what percentage did he rush the passer?

In a single game? Maybe 45% of the time as a rush OLB they sent him after the passer. They were always doing things with him. I've seen plays with him lined up in the A gaps. Also spent more time at ILB this past season.

[CR91]

1 minute ago, Defjamz26 said:

In a single game? Maybe 45% of the time as a rush OLB they sent him after the passer. They were always doing things with him. I've seen plays with him lined up in the A gaps. Also spent more time at ILB this past season.

 

so youre saying if he just rushed the passer, he would be a roughly 12 sack season type of pass rusher

[krunk]

From the film that I have watched of Floyd I'll say that he can be pretty disruptive coming off the edge on passing downs, and I saw that Georgia used him quite a bit as an ILB on different passing situations for whatever the reason.  My biggest question is what do you do with him on the first 2 downs because this guy is Chicken Hearted against the run to put it nicely.  Even the downs where it appears you may want him out there to cover in the middle of the field like they were doing with him at Georgia and the opponent decides to run a middle screen or some kind of draw or whatever the case.  The plays I saw Floyd he was getting engulfed.  

 

Are we or should we consider taking a kid like this with the 1st round pick just to get an advantage on 3rd down?  I just don't see much of a will or passion for defending the run with this guy to be honest.  I'm not sure how high I am on the kid being a 3 down player in the NFL.  Some of us are dissing Reggie Ragland for not being able play all 3 downs, but I'm not sure if I see Floyd playing any more than one down consistently.  These are just my initial observations, so maybe I'll warm up as I watch more.  I'm not certain I'll get enough evidence to feel like he will improve enough if he gained more weight or whatever the case.

[Defjamz26]

16 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

so youre saying if he just rushed the passer, he would be a roughly 12 sack season type of pass rusher

Possibly. He needs to bulk up and gain more power. And like many young pass rushers, learn more moves (Although Sapp said all you really need is 2). But as a pure pass rusher he would be a double digit sack guy with a lot of pressures to match.

 

 

2 minutes ago, krunk said:

From the film that I have watched of Floyd I'll say that he can be pretty disruptive coming off the edge on passing downs, and I saw that Georgia used him quite a bit as an ILB on different passing situations for whatever the reason.  My biggest question is what do you do with him on the first 2 downs because this guy is Chicken Hearted against the run to put it nicely.  Are we or should we consider taking a kid like this with the 1st round pick just to get an advantage on 3rd down.  I just don't see much a will or passion for defending the run with this guy to be honest.  I'm not sure how high I am on the kid being a 3 down player.

 

He's really light to expect him to have been a force against the run in college. That was Jordan Jenkins' job which is why drafting both of them would be a good idea. He'll play the run if he has to, but you can also use him as a spy for mobile QBs. The key is that he makes the effort. But Mathis isn't great against the run either. He can learn to be better against the run though.

[krunk]

11 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Possibly. He needs to bulk up and gain more power. And like many young pass rushers, learn more moves (Although Sapp said all you really need is 2). But as a pure pass rusher he would be a double digit sack guy with a lot of pressures to match.

 

 

 

He's really light to expect him to have been a force against the run in college. That was Jordan Jenkins' job which is why drafting both of them would be a good idea. He'll play the run if he has to, but you can also use him as a spy for mobile QBs. The key is that he makes the effort. But Mathis isn't great against the run either. He can learn to be better against the run though.

 

Mathis has a will to play the run, but he's often not played it correctly.  I'm not sure if I see much of a will to play the run with Floyd.  I think Mathis has improved and that's keeping in mind that it's taken him his entire career so I'd have to be a bit skeptical as to when that might occur with Floyd.  I do think Floyd can be explosive on passing downs as a rusher.  I do see the talent there, but again are we spending a 1st on a guy who can really only play one down?  The only time I see him on the field in most of the Georgia film whether that be highlights or draft break down it's only in passing situations.  Georgia seems to not even had much confidence in him on the first two downs.  In my eyes there's not a whole lot of evidence to take Floyd in the first other than Potential and I'm not sure how wise that is at this point.  I don't see him as a complete linebacker and I don't know how long it would take for him to get there.   Maybe I'll change my mind, but so far I've watched Tennessee, Clemson, Vanderbilt and Floyd highlights in general.

[CR91]

9 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Possibly. He needs to bulk up and gain more power. And like many young pass rushers, learn more moves (Although Sapp said all you really need is 2). But as a pure pass rusher he would be a double digit sack guy with a lot of pressures to match.

 

possibly is not enough for me especially since we have a rare opportunity to draft in the middle round. we need to take of advantage of this. this is one draft cant afford to take gambles in 

[krunk]

5 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

hes not a natural pass rusher. hes just athletic. he actually reminds of mingo and how did that turn out for the browns. he hasnt a season where hes gotten more then 6.5 sacks. hes too small at his current weight. he has no pass rush moves or techniques

 

KiKi Mingo came across my mind as well with Floyd

[Archer]

My hierarchy (among realistically available prospects) would go like this in Round 1:

Noah Spence

Jaylon Smith (I think)

Eli Apple

MacKensie Alexander

Darron Lee (Not the pass-rusher I would want, but a promising talent nonetheless)

Falling DLs (At least you'll get some immediate utility out of these guys in the wake of Anderson's rehab )

Ezekiel Elliott (Only because I'm out of good options at this time)

 

Note: Floyd isn't on my list either.  I didn't like how he tries to shoot gaps rather than take on blocks, and I only saw him get to QBs on speed rushes, which won't cut it in our Rush OLB role.

 

 

[Dustin]

On 1/31/2016 at 5:08 PM, CR91 said:

 

hes not a natural pass rusher. hes just athletic. he actually reminds of mingo and how did that turn out for the browns. he hasnt a season where hes gotten more then 6.5 sacks. hes too small at his current weight. he has no pass rush moves or techniques

 

He only rushed from the edge on passing downs

[Dustin]

36 minutes ago, Archer said:

My hierarchy (among realistically available prospects) would go like this in Round 1:

Noah Spence

Jaylon Smith (I think)

Eli Apple

MacKensie Alexander

Darron Lee (Not the pass-rusher I would want, but a promising talent nonetheless)

Falling DLs (At least you'll get some immediate utility out of these guys in the wake of Anderson's rehab )

Ezekiel Elliott (Only because I'm out of good options at this time)

 

Note: Floyd isn't on my list either.  I didn't like how he tries to shoot gaps rather than take on blocks, and I only saw him get to QBs on speed rushes, which won't cut it in our Rush OLB role.

 

 

 

You have Apple > Alexander. That's interesting.

[Dustin]

Also, drafting a RT or a G in the first round is not a good use of resources. 

[NewColtsFan]

11 minutes ago, Dustin said:

 

You have Apple > Alexander. That's interesting.

 

He might be two inches taller.    Possibly more?

 

We'll have to wait to see how each measures out at the combine......

 

I know Alexander is a favorite of yours.    You compared him I think to Jason Verrett, the little corner from TCU who had great hips and feet.     That's high praise.     I look forward to seeing tape on Alexander, in part because of your high opinion of him.....

 

[COLTS449]

22 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

Yeah but just looking for college production isn't going to do it. People always want to find the guys that completely dominated in college and put up ridiculous numbers. But those guys are rare. It's all about PROJECTION to the next level, which is why you have to study the player, not the production.

 

Dontari Poe is a good example. Really only had 1 year of college production coming out. People labeled him a boom or bust project but he blew up the combine. Turned into a really good player.

 

All signs point to Floyd being successful at the next level. He has the things you look for in an explosive 3-4 OLB. The most important thing is that his flaws are fixable and coachable.

 

Ziggy Ansah is probably the best example. He had what? Not even 5 total sacks in college?

[COLTS449]

Leonard Floyd has the ability to be the best pass rusher in this class. Its been said over and over that Georgia moved him around and he only rushed the QB a small percentage of his snaps. Ok lets look at Ziggy Ansah. He was a top 5 pick based on projection. Based on what the scouts seen. His natural ability and upside. He was also considered a boom or bust prospect. He played 3 years in college. 1st year - 0 sacks, 2nd year, 0 sacks, 3rd year - 4.5 sacks. Nothing special except his upside and projections. These scouts know what to look for. And now look at Ziggy. He's a pro bowler racking up 8, 7.5, and 14.5 sacks in each of his first 3 years.

[Defjamz26]

1 hour ago, COLTS449 said:

 

Ziggy Ansah is probably the best example. He had what? Not even 5 total sacks in college?

Yup. Same scenario as Poe too. Labeled a boom or bust guy, scouts claimed he was a one season wonder,etc...

 

Floyd is going to be a very special player in the NFL. He's better than Jarvis Jones by a wide margin

[krunk]

   I see more Boss Bailey, Dion Jordan,and KiKi Mingo. 

[Manning1887]

Trade back and take Kendall Fuller CB Virginia Tech. An aggressive man cover corner, reminds me of Marcus Peters.

[Archer]

22 hours ago, Dustin said:

 

You have Apple > Alexander. That's interesting.

 

I do.  I've kinda felt that Alexander was immediately over-rated when he announced his intention to come out.  However, I like him more than I used to.  I watched the championship game, and he was playing injured, but still made a great play behind the line in the 1st series.  Then the announcers talked him up pretty big after he left with another injury.  PFF (I think it was them) just wrote something that said that he benefited more from opponents' mistakes than all but one other CB in college football.   That is, QBs missing the throw when he got beat, WRs dropping the ball, etc.

 

I am an Apple fan.  He seems to me to have similar stickiness in coverage, but maybe a little better contribution against the run.  But, I like them both as our pick if Spence is gone (which I now think he will be).

[Ace Boogie]

Only if Jaylon Smith is gone cause he's my #1 choice by far

 

Noah Spence my #2 choice

Eli Apple

MacKensie Alexander

Decker-maybe

[Solon]

What about this Cody Whitehair kid coming out of Kansas St.? Played tackle and guard in college. NFL.COM draft profile compared him to Zack Martin. Surprised I haven't seen his name on this forum.

[Defjamz26]

8 hours ago, Solon said:

What about this Cody Whitehair kid coming out of Kansas St.? Played tackle and guard in college. NFL.COM draft profile compared him to Zack Martin. Surprised I haven't seen his name on this forum.

He's been mentioned a few times here. 18 is a little high for an interior OL but I wouldn't  be upset with Whitehair because he's a day 1 starter.

 

I don't agree with the people that say he could start at RG though. I think he'd start at LG and you move Mewhort to RG.

[throwing BBZ]

On 2/1/2016 at 9:29 PM, krunk said:

From the film that I have watched of Floyd I'll say that he can be pretty disruptive coming off the edge on passing downs, and I saw that Georgia used him quite a bit as an ILB on different passing situations for whatever the reason.  My biggest question is what do you do with him on the first 2 downs because this guy is Chicken Hearted against the run to put it nicely.  Even the downs where it appears you may want him out there to cover in the middle of the field like they were doing with him at Georgia and the opponent decides to run a middle screen or some kind of draw or whatever the case.  The plays I saw Floyd he was getting engulfed.  

 

Are we or should we consider taking a kid like this with the 1st round pick just to get an advantage on 3rd down?  I just don't see much of a will or passion for defending the run with this guy to be honest.  I'm not sure how high I am on the kid being a 3 down player in the NFL.  Some of us are dissing Reggie Ragland for not being able play all 3 downs, but I'm not sure if I see Floyd playing any more than one down consistently.  These are just my initial observations, so maybe I'll warm up as I watch more.  I'm not certain I'll get enough evidence to feel like he will improve enough if he gained more weight or whatever the case.

 

 Well actually wouldn`t he play in A LOT of 2nd and longs also... of course he would and he should be very good in pass coverage against bubble screens and in space in general.
  And of course teams pass a lot on 1st down so...
 I look forward to following this guy to see where his game is down the road.

[krunk]

49 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 Well actually wouldn`t he play in A LOT of 2nd and longs also... of course he would and he should be very good in pass coverage against bubble screens and in space in general.
  And of course teams pass a lot on 1st down so...
 I look forward to following this guy to see where his game is down the road.

 

How many 2nd and longs do you expect to see if teams know they don't have to pass against you?  They can just run at Floyd and play the Time Of Possession game or whatever the plan is. He doesn't make many plays in pass coverage. There was one almost interception that I noted from the three films I watched.  It was "almost" because he dropped it, and I didn't think he was very aware in coverage.  He was mostly just back there, but I do think he could maybe improve.  I already gave credit to the potential he has against the pass.  I do think he has the quicks to be an effective pass rusher.  That's not one of my issues with him.

 

I just think he's chicken hearted against the run game and the Colts value linebackers who are willing to do both things.  Newsome is a prime example, he started getting pulled from games and what not because he is awful at setting an edge and playing his run fits the right way.  Jacksonville made quite a nice effort to run the read option at Newsome all the time and it worked like clock work.  I don't even see Newsome type of will to play the run game with Floyd.  I don't think a prospect has to be close to perfect when you draft him, but I do believe there are certain things I need to see on film after 3 years to make me believe I can mold a guy into being more effective at the other parts of the game. 

 

Not sure if I see that with Floyd and in the first round I'm looking for complete players, or guys I think can be ready in a reasonable amt of time.  To me I think there is more than one prospect out there who I feel can play the run and put up nice sack numbers. and that's the guy I would be trying to draft in the 1st round.  I don't necessarily have to have a pass rusher that can play coverage.  That's what we have Geathers for,  I want my Pass Rusher chasing quarterbacks so the coverage aspect of it is not that giant for me in regards to Floyd.