Looks like the trade for Billy Winn has worked out so far ..

[PeterBowman]

True, but David had done his job.  It was up to the ILBs to do theirs.

and true too....but remember the Pats don't commit holding penalties

so that play shouldn't have even counted.

[BlueShoe]

I think with Moore and Irving....freeman and dq are going to be phased out next year.

 

 

 

DQ is leading the NFL in tackles.

[aaron11]

No! No more first round picks for Grigson

Trade back and collect more picks

He stinks with First rounders

dorsett is fine.  our other WRs are not exactly having great years either and PD is coming along.  

 

AJ is gone after this year, and having ty, moncrief and dorsett going forward should be pretty great.

 

im not sure what other player on the board would have been the answer you guys are looking for.  please dont say collins

[aaron11]

and true too....but remember the Pats don't commit holding penalties

 

you mean they dont get called for them

[PeterBowman]

dorsett is fine.  our other WRs are not exactly having great years either and PD is coming along.  

 

AJ is gone after this year, and having ty, moncrief and dorsett going forward should be pretty great.

 

im not sure what other player on the board would have been the answer you guys are looking for.  please dont say collins

or Malcolm Brown

[Surge89]

Amari Cooper & Marcus Peters are having solid seasons

Brandon Sherff out Washington DC having a solid year. I'll see him Sunday live from FedEx. Just look for the only person at FedEx field in apparel

But yeah for the most part the 1st rounders haven't exactly lit up the NFL thus far

No ones talking about Bud Dupree but he's getting sacks and his explosion off the line is downright amazing.

I still feel that the first pick could've been used much more efficiently. At that time we didn't know 2 ILB would've been traded for but Kendricks, Perryman, and Anthony could be getting groomed right now to take starter places in a year or 2. Darby would've been a great number 2 corner when Toler leaves, and Randall would've been a great groom for Adams. Dorsett is nice don't get me wrong and I still think he's gonna be a good player but it was apparent Moncrief had a ton of talent waiting to be unleashed and TY has been consistent. That was my thought process before the draft and still is.

[NewEra]

freemen is the weak link he should've had to earn those starting reps back being that his replacements were doing better than him

Both Irving and Moore have outplayed him. Freeman has been pretty bad this year

[PeterBowman]

you mean they dont get called for them

according to the refs last game especially, both are correct

[gacker65]

and true too....but remember the Pats don't commit holding penalties

so that play shouldn't have even counted.

True.  That wasn't what hurt us.  What cost us the game was change in game plan in the 2nd half.  Went to Zone coverage and panic mode on Offense.

[Surge89]

dorsett is fine. our other WRs are not exactly having great years either and PD is coming along.

AJ is gone after this year, and having ty, moncrief and dorsett going forward should be pretty great.

im not sure what other player on the board would have been the answer you guys are looking for. please dont say collins

Moncrief his having a great year FYI.

And if you are thinking there was a starter there at the end of the 1st there wasn't. It would've all been depth.

[gacker65]

dorsett is fine.  our other WRs are not exactly having great years either and PD is coming along.  

 

AJ is gone after this year, and having ty, moncrief and dorsett going forward should be pretty great.

 

im not sure what other player on the board would have been the answer you guys are looking for.  please dont say collins

Yea, Dorsett is doing fine.  Better than our other WRs.  Spends more time on bench than on the field.  Will be starter in 2-3 years.  Bust as a 1st rounder.  Can't take starting job from an old man.

 

Luck is AJ's problem as far as catches.  The rest of the WRs are having the same problem.  Funny, Matt H comes in and are WRs start looking like Pro Bowl receivers.

 

Dorsett was not BPA and that is per Grigson.  Dorsett is a project plain and simple.  Yes there was others that could have been drafted.  Mostly Defense.  

[krunk]

No ones talking about Bud Dupree but he's getting sacks and his explosion off the line is downright amazing.

I still feel that the first pick could've been used much more efficiently. At that time we didn't know 2 ILB would've been traded for but Kendricks, Perryman, and Anthony could be getting groomed right now to take starter places in a year or 2. Darby would've been a great number 2 corner when Toler leaves, and Randall would've been a great groom for Adams. Dorsett is nice don't get me wrong and I still think he's gonna be a good player but it was apparent Moncrief had a ton of talent waiting to be unleashed and TY has been consistent. That was my thought process before the draft and still is.

 

 

 

I was told Dupree wouldn't be anything more than a Sam Backer in this league.  Looks like my feelings on him are running counter to that.  I figured he could get to the qb based on what I saw on the film.

[krunk]

Yea, Dorsett is doing fine.  Better than our other WRs.  Spends more time on bench than on the field.  Will be starter in 2-3 years.  Bust as a 1st rounder.  Can't take starting job from an old man.

 

Luck is AJ's problem as far as catches.  The rest of the WRs are having the same problem.  Funny, Matt H comes in and are WRs start looking like Pro Bowl receivers.

 

Dorsett was not BPA and that is per Grigson.  Dorsett is a project plain and simple.  Yes there was others that could have been drafted.  Mostly Defense.  

 

 

dude stop being ridiculous

[aaron11]

Moncrief his having a great year FYI.

And if you are thinking there was a starter there at the end of the 1st there wasn't. It would've all been depth.

can't tell if u agree or not by that post. I liked the pick. Moncrief having a decent year hardly means PD was a bad pick. DM took a few games to get going too

[aaron11]

Yea, Dorsett is doing fine. Better than our other WRs. Spends more time on bench than on the field. Will be starter in 2-3 years. Bust as a 1st rounder. Can't take starting job from an old man.

Luck is AJ's problem as far as catches. The rest of the WRs are having the same problem. Funny, Matt H comes in and are WRs start looking like Pro Bowl receivers.

Dorsett was not BPA and that is per Grigson. Dorsett is a project plain and simple. Yes there was others that could have been drafted. Mostly Defense.

Clueless. First round does not mean instant starter. And we went D on the next several picks.

[gacker65]

dude stop being ridiculous

Abou what????  Dorsett is a 1st rounder spending more time on the bench than on the field.  I'll give you that Dorsett has gotten some yardage in garbage time.  Gotten 1 TD that actually meant something.  So what.  So could have any of other WRs.  Dorsett  has shown nothing special.

 

Go back to Pats game and watch McCourty run step for step with Dorsett for over 20 yards. 

 

Got to show more game to be considered a 1st round gem. 

[Surge89]

I was told Dupree wouldn't be anything more than a Sam Backer in this league. Looks like my feelings on him are running counter to that. I figured he could get to the qb based on what I saw on the film.

His explosion is downright amazing. He needs a ton of work when it comes to lane control and zones but as a pure 3rd down rusher I'm not sure if Pitt has anyone better.

[gacker65]

Clueless. First round does not mean instant starter. And we went D on the next several picks.

That is the difference between me and you.  I expect our 1st rounders to start, not take 2-3 years to start.  We are not close enough to being good to take project player.

[Surge89]

can't tell if u agree or not by that post. I liked the pick. Moncrief having a decent year hardly means PD was a bad pick. DM took a few games to get going too

Both lol

I did not like the pick and still don't. But I also don't think Dorsett was a bad pick. I just feel like their were much more effecient picks that (because the draft already happened) would've been considered reaches but imo they would've been excellent value. We were never going to get a starter and I thought that was obvious. But I'd be more comfortable with a 1st/2nd round talent backup at ILB (again before trades) or Corner than receiver because receiver isn't a role that necessarily requires 1st round talent. Plus most receivers will not really maximize until year 3 so a first on a receiver just seems less valuable to me.

Then again all my opinion in regards to drafting efficiency.

[aaron11]

That is the difference between me and you. I expect our 1st rounders to start, not take 2-3 years to start. We are not close enough to being good to take project player.

Project is a harsh word. Especially for a WR. The transition is tough for most of them drafted at the end of the first. His TD was huge too. Its one more than ty has.

Also, look at when we drafted Reggie at about the same spot. He was no higher than third on the depth chart.

[Surge89]

That is the difference between me and you. I expect our 1st rounders to start, not take 2-3 years to start. We are not close enough to being good to take project player.

Receivers usually take 3 years to reach potential regardless of draft status. There are outliers of course but that is the usual expectation. No matter if the receiver is a first round or not.

[aaron11]

Both lol

I did not like the pick and still don't. But I also don't think Dorsett was a bad pick. I just feel like their were much more effecient picks that (because the draft already happened) would've been considered reaches but imo they would've been excellent value. We were never going to get a starter and I thought that was obvious. But I'd be more comfortable with a 1st/2nd round talent backup at ILB (again before trades) or Corner than receiver because receiver isn't a role that necessarily requires 1st round talent. Plus most receivers will not really maximize until year 3 so a first on a receiver just seems less valuable to me.

Then again all my opinion in regards to drafting efficiency.

Fair enough. It was not a great class for line backers. I believe the only ones ready to play went in the middle of the second

[Surge89]

Fair enough. It was not a great class for line backers. I believe the only ones ready to play went in the middle of the second

Right but we don't need them to start we never did.

[Dustin]

DQ is leading the NFL in tackles.

Shows you the worth of that stat.

[aaron11]

Shows you the worth of that stat.

He's having a decent year. You like pff, how are they rating him?

[Superman]

No ones talking about Bud Dupree but he's getting sacks and his explosion off the line is downright amazing.

I still feel that the first pick could've been used much more efficiently. At that time we didn't know 2 ILB would've been traded for but Kendricks, Perryman, and Anthony could be getting groomed right now to take starter places in a year or 2. Darby would've been a great number 2 corner when Toler leaves, and Randall would've been a great groom for Adams. Dorsett is nice don't get me wrong and I still think he's gonna be a good player but it was apparent Moncrief had a ton of talent waiting to be unleashed and TY has been consistent. That was my thought process before the draft and still is.

 

IMO, Anthony and Randall were overdrafted. Collins was meh. Kendricks would have been overdrafted, but he'll probably be a stud, so I would have been fine with that pick. Perryman, no thanks. I feel like a broken record, but reaching for need leads to bad drafting, so it's all kind of moot.

 

Dupree went earlier in the 20s, so he wasn't there. I reluctantly came around on him, but I admit that's partly due to his insane workouts. His film was wildly inconsistent, but he showed the goods enough for me to be okay with him. He's had some nice games so far this year.

[Dustin]

He's having a decent year. You like pff, how are they rating him?

36th ranked ILB.

[akcolt]

I think Grigson did pretty well to replace that whole defensive line with 2 rookies and 3 free agents. 2 of them coming at the last minute in Winn and Mcgill. I still maintain that Grigs is a pretty good GM when it comes to personnel. I just don't think you build an elite roster in 3 and a quarter seasons. First couple years when the cupboard was bare you kind of have to live off free agents. Some will be hits and many wont work out. The Richardson deal was the worst but at least he has learned from it. That's how it is on many teams. Now we are getting to the phase where you have to shed some of those FA with draft picks and I think he did a real good job with the 2015 draft. In 2016 if Irsay isn't silly enough to fire him we can focus almost the entire draft on defense and some OL. Roster should be stacked next year in my mind.[/quote

I agree we need to get more talent on D. Pass rush and CB have to improve. I expect the draft to reflect that.

Grig's hasn't done a bad job. The 2013 class is starting to come around a bit. The other 3 drafts look good.

I think we might take a RB I don't see Robinson being anything special.. I like Davante Booker from Utah. He can catch the ball run it between the tackles but has the speed to get to the edge. Maybe 3rd round depending on who comes out.

[akcolt]

freemen is the weak link he should've had to earn those starting reps back being that his replacements were doing better than him

I feel the same way about Dre let's turn Dorsett loose. Dre had the ball hit his hands twice both would have be good catches but they were catchable.

The two biggest differences in the team's in that game was Brady didn't miss throws and almost always finds the open guy. Andrew has looked off all year back to the preseason IMO. Just misses too many throws.

NE doesn't give up on the run game. Gore was easily having the best of it out of all the RB's but we gave him what 4 touches in the 2nd half.

[dudeski]

DQ is leading the NFL in tackles.

maybe. Tackle stats are worthless

[will426]

I feel the same way about Dre let's turn Dorsett loose. Dre had the ball hit his hands twice both would have be good catches but they were catchable.

The two biggest differences in the team's in that game was Brady didn't miss throws and almost always finds the open guy. Andrew has looked off all year back to the preseason IMO. Just misses too many throws.

NE doesn't give up on the run game. Gore was easily having the best of it out of all the RB's but we gave him what 4 touches in the 2nd half.

facts I agree with you

[krunk]

Abou what???? Dorsett is a 1st rounder spending more time on the bench than on the field. I'll give you that Dorsett has gotten some yardage in garbage time. Gotten 1 TD that actually meant something. So what. So could have any of other WRs. Dorsett has shown nothing special.

Go back to Pats game and watch McCourty run step for step with Dorsett for over 20 yards.

Got to show more game to be considered a 1st round gem.

Mcourty is a safety, he wasn't playing press man coverage and if its the same play im thinking about then Mcourty drew a penalty on the play as well. Nobody drafts a player in the lower portion of the first round and says "Hey if you are not a beast in your first 6 games you are a bust buddy!" Only a fan with a silly outlook does that. I suppose Tavon Austin is a bust too? What is even more comical about you is you see them bringing him along like Moncrief and you blame that on Dorsett? Shame on them for playing a future hall of fame receiver over a rookie! A rookie who they didn't have intentions of forcing in the starting lineup any way. Again name us who you would have picked and tell us what they are playing like right now. There are hardly any of these first round picks playing like stars right now.

[krunk]

That is the difference between me and you. I expect our 1st rounders to start, not take 2-3 years to start. We are not close enough to being good to take project player.

So if the coaching staff has a different plan than you that means its the players fault? And why is your plan better than theirs? Also why does it make said player a bust?

[dudeski]

Shows you the worth of that stat.

that stat is worthless and very inaccurate

[Surge89]

IMO, Anthony and Randall were overdrafted. Collins was meh. Kendricks would have been overdrafted, but he'll probably be a stud, so I would have been fine with that pick. Perryman, no thanks. I feel like a broken record, but reaching for need leads to bad drafting, so it's all kind of moot.

Dupree went earlier in the 20s, so he wasn't there. I reluctantly came around on him, but I admit that's partly due to his insane workouts. His film was wildly inconsistent, but he showed the goods enough for me to be okay with him. He's had some nice games so far this year.

That's what I don't understand. What in the world does overdrafted mean? So if Kendricks is taken at 29 and is a probowler he's still over drafted? That's nonsense. Just like me and Dustin saying literally the whole process that Darby was a first round deserving corner but yet you still say it would've been a reach if we took him. Even though you have seen he can not only produce but most likely produce at a high level in the NFL. Reaching for a draft pick is literally in the eye of the beholder and using it like you do is just seems like it's an excuse for GMs. And here's the kicker you say Anthony was over drafted but mainly because he's starting right away and he's raw. (Hypothetical) If he gets picked up by us and is groomed for 3 years comes out and plays like the next Ray Lewis would you still say he was over drafted? That statement annoys me to no end. Drafting talent is relative to your team regardless if a player is there with a higher grade on other people's boards or a majority. As for Dorsett I've never said it's a reach and I do agree he had talent to equate to our pick area, but the fact is when you have an elite QB you really don't need a bunch of first round receivers and therefore in relation to our team it was not an effecient draft pick.

[GOCOLTS_ROLLTIDE]

I dont get to watch a lot of colts games. So i enjoy getting the highlight plays from you guys...

Hey man invest in the NFL gamepass trust me man its legit

[gacker65]

Project is a harsh word. Especially for a WR. The transition is tough for most of them drafted at the end of the first. His TD was huge too. Its one more than ty has.

Also, look at when we drafted Reggie at about the same spot. He was no higher than third on the depth chart.

Actually not.  Hardest part is learn route names/ numbers.  Remember, Reggie was drafted by a different GM.

[gacker65]

Receivers usually take 3 years to reach potential regardless of draft status. There are outliers of course but that is the usual expectation. No matter if the receiver is a first round or not.

If you continue to wait 3 years on every player you draft, you will never get to the Super Bowl.  Drafting a 1st rounder then saying will have 3 years IMO, means your team is Super Bowl ready or you need a better set of scouts.  Waiting for player to develop means a project player, usually not a 1st rounder unless your team is Super Bowl ready and you are drafting depth.

 

If you need a project player, and are not Super Bowl ready, draft them in rounds 2-7.

 

Just how I see this. 

[Surge89]

If you continue to wait 3 years on every player you draft, you will never get to the Super Bowl.  Drafting a 1st rounder then saying will have 3 years IMO, means your team is Super Bowl ready or you need a better set of scouts.  Waiting for player to develop means a project player, usually not a 1st rounder unless your team is Super Bowl ready and you are drafting depth.

 

If you need a project player, and are not Super Bowl ready, draft them in rounds 2-7.

 

Just how I see this. 

 

Did you even read what I posted?

 

RECEIVERS usually take 3 years to reach maximum potential in the league, regardless of draft stock.  That is just the way receivers work around 75% of the time. Other positions specifically RB and QB can contribute right away. You are harping on the fact that Grigson took a project in the first to which we are telling you that simply isn't correct.  He took a first round talent receiver.   BUT receivers usually take 3 years regardless of their talent level to really get it going in the NFL how hard is that to understand?  

 

Also your black and white approach to the draft is ridiculous btw.  What if the talent pool is extremely shallow?  For example the very draft you are talking about there was close to no chance of us grabbing a starter at the end of the first.  Regardless of what you think.  So no matter what we would have been getting depth, but because you want a result now you would've said it was a failed draft pick regardless.  That is a very shallow view and you will never be happy with any draft of any team for that matter unless the draft falls exactly perfect every year.   

 

tldr: Your argument makes no sense.

[gacker65]

Mcourty is a safety, he wasn't playing press man coverage and if its the same play im thinking about then Mcourty drew a penalty on the play as well. Nobody drafts a player in the lower portion of the first round and says "Hey if you are not a beast in your first 6 games you are a bust buddy!" Only a fan with a silly outlook does that. I suppose Tavon Austin is a bust too? What is even more comical about you is you see them bringing him along like Moncrief and you blame that on Dorsett? Shame on them for playing a future hall of fame receiver over a rookie! A rookie who they didn't have intentions of forcing in the starting lineup any way. Again name us who you would have picked and tell us what they are playing like right now. There are hardly any of these first round picks playing like stars right now.

The play as away from them and McCourty didn't get flagged.  Your are corect that McCourty was in off Man, bu McCourty ran stride for stride all the way to the end zone with Dorsett, 20+ yards.

 

I guess, I'm silly for expecting a 1st rounder to be on the field more than on the bench.  Yes, I'm a comedian for calling him a bust just like I did Werner for the same thing. I'm not saying down the road, he wont be good, I'm saying for where he was drafted he is a bust.  As for the staff bring Dorsett along like Moncrief, that;s on them.  Again, you said he needs time.

 

As far as T Austin, if you watch more than Colts football, you will notice he is getting more playing time.  IMO, T Austin could be starting by end of the Season.

 

As far as how I would have drafted, probably BPA.  Girgson stated after the draft that Dorsett wasn't BPA.  Stated when it came to our pick, he was looking for something that stood out, long way from BPA.

 

Right off the top of my head:  Cooper for the Raiders- having a good year, Shane Ray (can't remember for who)- out do to injury from week 5,  Aghalor (spelling) for the Eagles- doing decent and some of the Linemen.  Dorsett is one of the few spending more time on the bench than on the field.