Grades: Week 14 @ Browns

[Superman]

 

 

 

Week 13 grades

 

Offense, C+: 76 plays, 362 yards, 23 first downs (14 passing, 6 rushing, 3 from penalty), 5/16 on third down, 1/1 on 4th down, 2/3 in the red zone, 4 turnovers, 25 points (two defensive scores allowed); why all the turnovers and dropped passes? WHY???

QB: This guy is driving me crazy. Stop trying to avoid sacks at the last minute, please! And the pick-six was just a huge missed read that wound up being very costly. The other pick was another slightly off pass, and the worst happens. Ugh. He also missed a few other throws, and was just super slow to get into any kind of rhythm. He didn't get a lot of help from his receivers, of course, so it wasn't all his fault, but he didn't do his best work either. Then he decided to play, and the Browns were in trouble. He started running, and six plays later, he was putting a juke move on a linebacker while he barreled into the end zone. It wasn't all smooth sailing from that point, but he was ready to play, and despite some mistakes, did just enough to put the game away. C, still too many drastic mistakes, but just enough playmaking

Backs / receivers / tight ends, C+:
Running game: No run game. Luck once again led the team in rushing. The backs both did a decent job in the few chances they got, but they weren't given enough opportunities. Luck scrambled well, mostly. Richardson ran hard. Boom did a GREAT job on the 4th down run. However, he didn't do a good job on the previous run. He left his feet trying to get into the end zone, rather than staying low and plowing ahead for the short yard we needed. Made up for it with the fancy spin move. And when the game was on the line, he was on the field, despite his previous fumble issues. He also out-touched Richardson for the third straight week. B

Passing game: Sooo, I've seen them credited with 6 drops, and I think there was more like 9. Good coverage by the Browns, and they knocked some passes out, but the receivers caused some serious problems. Nicks struggled to reach some passes, Hilton and Moncrief each had drops, and then, Reggie... He's obviously not healthy, and it sucks. He said he felt like he was throwing the game. I hate it. He didn't play well. He was able to get open or work his way to the ball regularly, no matter who was covering him, but he couldn't complete any plays. Allen didn't produce statistically, but he did make a big difference, especially drawing the PI down the field on the final drive. Fleener made some tough catches. C-, too many drops, not enough separation

 

OL / blocking: Quite a few pressures from a line that's being juggled because of injuries, but the pressures didn't really come from the replacements. Shipley gave up a couple, but he and Holmes both played well. Holmes, especially. Reitz can't stay on the field, which is sad, because he's a strong performer at guard. Castonzo and Mewhort were a little sloppy. The run blocking was sufficient, with some nice combo blocks and some nice push at times, but they weren't overpowering at all. And while Mewhort was sloppy in pass protection, he got after it in the run game, locking onto guys and moving them around. There were a couple of counter blocks that were really nice. I think the run game could have gotten going, but the three-and-outs and penalties and the eventual two score deficit made the run game almost a non-factor. C+, a lot of pressures and penalties

 

Defense, B: 63 plays, 248 yards, 14 first downs (7 passing, 6 rushing, 1 from penalty), 4/15 on third down, 1/2 in the red zone, 2 turnovers, 10 points; kept their struggling offense from doing too much of anything

 
Defensive front: Nicely contained the run, aside from a couple of longer carries, but nothing too troubling overall. Everyone tackled better than they have been recently, and the defensive linemen were disruptive against the run. I'm liking the rotation with Chapman, Hughes and Jones in the middle, even though Hughes isn't really a nose tackle. He still inserts himself into the action. The pass rush wasn't consistent, but there were a few big rushes that disrupted the timing on their passes, most of which were blitzes. The Browns wanted to run, though, and stuck with it for some production, including the TD, where Jones was completely washed out of the play, and none of the linebackers were involved, leaving Mike Adams hanging out to dry. Mostly good stuff from the defensive front, though. B, just need more pass rush

 

Pass defense: Surprisingly good game, without our shutdown corner. Stayed close to receivers, the corners got some separations and tackled well, and so did the LBs. Freeman bounced back nicely in coverage, and while he gave up some catches to Cameron, he was pretty much always close to him when the ball got there, just done in by one really nice bucket throw, and another low one that was handled nicely by the receiver. Adams' interception was terrific. Everybody thought Gordy would get torched, and he was way better than I expected, finally getting the pick to seal the game. Toler got beat a couple of times by Gordon, but Hoyer missed a couple of throws, and I thought Toler stayed on his man nicely on all but two or three plays. It will be nice to get Vontae back, whenever that happens, but if we keep using these triangle coverages to lessen the man-to-man load of the corners and safeties, we'll survive. B, maybe Hoyer's bad play made them look better, but they still made the plays

 

Special teams: McAfee had a bad game, wasn't good kicking or punting, and overcompensated with some punts that were too long, leaving his coverage guys out to dry. Coverage wasn't good itself, neither was the return game, with Cribbs not getting close to breaking one open. He also got ate up on some punts that bounced and rolled exactly how the Browns needed. I thought they were borderline decisions, but they all seemed to work out in Cleveland's favor. AV was money. The Boomstick seemed to struggle going to the right, but Vinatieri lined up and drilled a 51 yarder, with no doubt. He's on fire. C+

Coaching / playcalling / game management, B+:
Nearly 4:1 in favor of called pass plays, which is waaay too high. Hard to tell how much control Luck has at the line of scrimmage, and we opened up with two running plays in a row, so it's not like the objective coming in was to throw the ball every down. But that's almost what we did. Also, our screen plays are still terrible. And someone has to get Luck to stop fumbling the ball. B-

Nice defensive gameplan. Made up for the loss of Davis with some zone coverages that were better designed and much better executed than in the Steelers game. Blitzed a ton against the run and the pass, and it worked. A

I didn't like the decision to go for two, just because there was a heck of a lot of time left on the clock, and a lot of possessions to come. I thought the score would work itself out, and if you did need two, you could try later. I do like the more progressive attitude of giving your offense a chance to make plays, but I didn't think it was needed, yet. I also liked the challenge decisions at the end of the game, along with the timeout on third down. Those all seemed to be handled perfectly. B

 

Game ball: TY Hilton, first two TD game of the year, with one of them putting the game away. Struggled through the first half, but showed up when we needed him most. Big time player.

Next up, home finale, hosting the Texans. This one is for the division.

GO COLTS!!!

[sweetsurrender]

 

 

 

 

Week 13 grades

 

Offense, C+: 76 plays, 362 yards, 23 first downs (14 passing, 6 rushing, 3 from penalty), 5/16 on third down, 1/1 on 4th down, 2/3 in the red zone, 4 turnovers, 25 points (two defensive scores allowed); why all the turnovers and dropped passes? WHY???

QB: This guy is driving me crazy. Stop trying to avoid sacks at the last minute, please! And the pick-six was just a huge missed read that wound up being very costly. The other pick was another slightly off pass, and the worst happens. Ugh. He also missed a few other throws, and was just super slow to get into any kind of rhythm. He didn't get a lot of help from his receivers, of course, so it wasn't all his fault, but he didn't do his best work either. Then he decided to play, and the Browns were in trouble. He started running, and six plays later, he was putting a juke move on a linebacker while he barreled into the end zone. It wasn't all smooth sailing from that point, but he was ready to play, and despite some mistakes, did just enough to put the game away. C, still too many drastic mistakes, but just enough playmaking

Backs / receivers / tight ends, C+:

Running game: No run game. Luck once again led the team in rushing. The backs both did a decent job in the few chances they got, but they weren't given enough opportunities. Luck scrambled well, mostly. Richardson ran hard. Boom did a GREAT job on the 4th down run. However, he didn't do a good job on the previous run. He left his feet trying to get into the end zone, rather than staying low and plowing ahead for the short yard we needed. Made up for it with the fancy spin move. And when the game was on the line, he was on the field, despite his previous fumble issues. He also out-touched Richardson for the third straight week. B

Passing game: Sooo, I've seen them credited with 6 drops, and I think there was more like 9. Good coverage by the Browns, and they knocked some passes out, but the receivers caused some serious problems. Nicks struggled to reach some passes, Hilton and Moncrief each had drops, and then, Reggie... He's obviously not healthy, and it sucks. He said he felt like he was throwing the game. I hate it. He didn't play well. He was able to get open or work his way to the ball regularly, no matter who was covering him, but he couldn't complete any plays. Allen didn't produce statistically, but he did make a big difference, especially drawing the PI down the field on the final drive. Fleener made some tough catches. C-, too many drops, not enough separation

 

OL / blocking: Quite a few pressures from a line that's being juggled because of injuries, but the pressures didn't really come from the replacements. Shipley gave up a couple, but he and Holmes both played well. Holmes, especially. Reitz can't stay on the field, which is sad, because he's a strong performer at guard. Castonzo and Mewhort were a little sloppy. The run blocking was sufficient, with some nice combo blocks and some nice push at times, but they weren't overpowering at all. And while Mewhort was sloppy in pass protection, he got after it in the run game, locking onto guys and moving them around. There were a couple of counter blocks that were really nice. I think the run game could have gotten going, but the three-and-outs and penalties and the eventual two score deficit made the run game almost a non-factor. C+, a lot of pressures and penalties

 

Defense, B: 63 plays, 248 yards, 14 first downs (7 passing, 6 rushing, 1 from penalty), 4/15 on third down, 1/2 in the red zone, 2 turnovers, 10 points; kept their struggling offense from doing too much of anything

 

Defensive front: Nicely contained the run, aside from a couple of longer carries, but nothing too troubling overall. Everyone tackled better than they have been recently, and the defensive linemen were disruptive against the run. I'm liking the rotation with Chapman, Hughes and Jones in the middle, even though Hughes isn't really a nose tackle. He still inserts himself into the action. The pass rush wasn't consistent, but there were a few big rushes that disrupted the timing on their passes, most of which were blitzes. The Browns wanted to run, though, and stuck with it for some production, including the TD, where Jones was completely washed out of the play, and none of the linebackers were involved, leaving Mike Adams hanging out to dry. Mostly good stuff from the defensive front, though. B, just need more pass rush

 

Pass defense: Surprisingly good game, without our shutdown corner. Stayed close to receivers, the corners got some separations and tackled well, and so did the LBs. Freeman bounced back nicely in coverage, and while he gave up some catches to Cameron, he was pretty much always close to him when the ball got there, just done in by one really nice bucket throw, and another low one that was handled nicely by the receiver. Adams' interception was terrific. Everybody thought Gordy would get torched, and he was way better than I expected, finally getting the pick to seal the game. Toler got beat a couple of times by Gordon, but Hoyer missed a couple of throws, and I thought Toler stayed on his man nicely on all but two or three plays. It will be nice to get Vontae back, whenever that happens, but if we keep using these triangle coverages to lessen the man-to-man load of the corners and safeties, we'll survive. B, maybe Hoyer's bad play made them look better, but they still made the plays

 

Special teams: McAfee had a bad game, wasn't good kicking or punting, and overcompensated with some punts that were too long, leaving his coverage guys out to dry. Coverage wasn't good itself, neither was the return game, with Cribbs not getting close to breaking one open. He also got ate up on some punts that bounced and rolled exactly how the Browns needed. I thought they were borderline decisions, but they all seemed to work out in Cleveland's favor. AV was money. The Boomstick seemed to struggle going to the right, but Vinatieri lined up and drilled a 51 yarder, with no doubt. He's on fire. C+

Coaching / playcalling / game management, B+:

Nearly 4:1 in favor of called pass plays, which is waaay too high. Hard to tell how much control Luck has at the line of scrimmage, and we opened up with two running plays in a row, so it's not like the objective coming in was to throw the ball every down. But that's almost what we did. Also, our screen plays are still terrible. And someone has to get Luck to stop fumbling the ball. B-

Nice defensive gameplan. Made up for the loss of Davis with some zone coverages that were better designed and much better executed than in the Steelers game. Blitzed a ton against the run and the pass, and it worked. A

I didn't like the decision to go for two, just because there was a heck of a lot of time left on the clock, and a lot of possessions to come. I thought the score would work itself out, and if you did need two, you could try later. I do like the more progressive attitude of giving your offense a chance to make plays, but I didn't think it was needed, yet. I also liked the challenge decisions at the end of the game, along with the timeout on third down. Those all seemed to be handled perfectly. B

 

Game ball: TY Hilton, first two TD game of the year, with one of them putting the game away. Struggled through the first half, but showed up when we needed him most. Big time player.

Next up, home finale, hosting the Texans. This one is for the division.

GO COLTS!!!

 

Thanks for compiling this. I agree with all of this pretty much. Luck is driving me crazy too. Don't understand the slow start and the mistakes but he did recover well for the win.

[Gavin]

On a side note I came away real impressed by Holmes play at RG after Reitz went down, His athleticism showed on a Pull Blocks he did and he can get up to the second level with ease and show some patience instead of lunging, He also showed ability to turn his hips and turn his man and create a hole but unfortunately the run did not go behind him, He picked up his feet and moved really well , I hope Reitz is alright but I hope to see more of Holmes at RG if Reitz cant go....Perhaps Reitz at LG and Holmes at RG while putting Mewhort at RT in the future?  It would mean more mobility among the O Line and that we could Pull either Guard easy, Then again Mewhort has played overall pretty well at LG

[OffensivelyPC]

Totally agree on Luck.  He is always trying to make plays, which is great.  But far too often it seems to bite us in teh rear - at least lately that seems to be the case.  Reggie's health has also been maddening.  I see him letting balls get into his chest more and more.  He almost never does that when he has the opportunity to catch with his hands.  Clearly it's bothering him.

[Danfish98]

Was looking forward to this write up as this is far and away the hardest kind of game to grade.  The resiliency to stick with it and pull out the win at the end was great, but the mistakes putting them in that position in the first place was awful.  Personally I would have graded the offense and special teams lower and given the defense an A.  24 points to the Browns on the surface doesn't look like an exemplary performance, but they were only responsible for 7 of them, a fantastic number.  I can see lowering that a bit though because Hoyer made a lot of unforced errors.  

 

Totally agree on Luck.  He makes lots of wow plays, both good and bad.  If he can finally eliminate the awful turnovers, he will finally, legitimately, be in the discussion for best QB in the game. 

[lollygagger8]

I agree with everything except the game ball. 

 

I'd give the game ball to the Browns OC for taking Joe Haden off of T.Y. Hilton in the 2nd half. 

 

 

 

Boom has to get a good grade for getting that first down TWICE. lol 

[SilentHill]

People are too hard on Luck, it's year 3 man. Peyton didn't really come into form until about year 5. Rogers was also year 5 (3 on the bench) Drew Brees was year 6.

 

The fact that 3/4 through his 3rd season he is keeping up with the big dogs, leading the NFL in TD passes and Yards is simply amazing.

[Yoshinator]

I honestly expected the Browns to destroy Luck, so I'm very satisfied with how he did. There were some really bad plays that he did, but he scored 3 tds and led the team to victory. Hard to fault him for doing average against the best pass defense in the NFL that also holds opposing qbs to the lowest qb rating of any defense and intercept the ball the most. Wayne was the main reason we almost lost.

[Derakynn]

I agree with everything except the game ball.

I'd give the game ball to the Browns OC for taking Joe Haden off of T.Y. Hilton in the 2nd half.

Boom has to get a good grade for getting that first down TWICE. lol

First, DC*, Haden plays defense. Second, Haden was covering Hilton on both of his touchdowns.

[Superman]

People are too hard on Luck, it's year 3 man. Peyton didn't really come into form until about year 5. Rogers was also year 5 (3 on the bench) Drew Brees was year 6.

The fact that 3/4 through his 3rd season he is keeping up with the big dogs, leading the NFL in TD passes and Yards is simply amazing.

I honestly expected the Browns to destroy Luck, so I'm very satisfied with how he did. There were some really bad plays that he did, but he scored 3 tds and led the team to victory. Hard to fault him for doing average against the best pass defense in the NFL that also holds opposing qbs to the lowest qb rating of any defense and intercept the ball the most. Wayne was the main reason we almost lost.

I'm not complaining about Luck. I'm grading him, for fun of course, and his QB 101 violations are pertinent. There's also been one or two a week for several weeks in a row, despite a big deal being made about the coaches hammering him about his mental slip-ups. So I don't know why it's seen as being hard on Luck.

[Superman]

I agree with everything except the game ball.

I'd give the game ball to the Browns OC for taking Joe Haden off of T.Y. Hilton in the 2nd half.

Boom has to get a good grade for getting that first down TWICE. lol

I disagree with the idea that all the good is because the Browns messed up, not because our guys made stuff happen. And like another poster mentioned, Hilton scored on Haden twice. Good matchup, but Hilton definitely outlasted him.

[The Fish]

I generally agree with the Grades, nice write up Superman. But I have a far more important question. Who's TD celebration is better? T.Y's T.Y dance or Luck's spike? Kinda leaning towards the spike.

[lollygagger8]

First, DC*, Haden plays defense. Second, Haden was covering Hilton on both of his touchdowns.

 

 

Oops DC. But Haden wasn't on Hilton quite a bit in the 2nd half. 

 

 

 

That 42 yard TD was a thing of beauty. TY's starting/stopping on a dime ability is uncanny. 

[lollygagger8]

I disagree with the idea that all the good is because the Browns messed up, not because our guys made stuff happen. And like another poster mentioned, Hilton scored on Haden twice. Good matchup, but Hilton definitely outlasted him.

 

I never said that we only did well because the Browns messed up. Haden did do a fantastic job against Hilton in the 1st half, but when Haden wasn't assigned to Hilton every single play in the 2nd is where the DC screwed up. I agree Hilton outlasted Haden in the 2nd though. 

 

 

Plus Luck threw 260+ yards on a pretty good defense. If Wayne doesn't drop 7 or so catches, Luck would've been over 300 yards. 

[SilentHill]

I'm not complaining about Luck. I'm grading him, for fun of course, and his QB 101 violations are pertinent. There's also been one or two a week for several weeks in a row, despite a big deal being made about the coaches hammering him about his mental slip-ups. So I don't know why it's seen as being hard on Luck.

 

Well what are you grading him against? Perfect QB play? If so, then it's exceptional to see a C in a down game in year 3.

[Superman]

Well what are you grading him against? Perfect QB play? If so, then it's exceptional to see a C in a down game in year 3.

Grading is subjective and inexact. But my goal is to grade Luck against his established typical performance. He's a really good QB, on the verge of great, if he isn't already there. So when he's around 50% completions (adjusted for drops), it's a red flag that he didn't play well. When he commits three turnovers, none of which is he without blame for, he gets dinged for that.

You act like I don't know that Luck isn't a polished vet. I'm not one of those guys who runs around pointing out every mistake he makes, harping on the few miniscule flaws that have yet to be refined.

[Jason_]

People are too hard on Luck, it's year 3 man. Peyton didn't really come into form until about year 5. Rogers was also year 5 (3 on the bench) Drew Brees was year 6.

 

The fact that 3/4 through his 3rd season he is keeping up with the big dogs, leading the NFL in TD passes and Yards is simply amazing.

 

there are a few people on this site (less than a handful) that I would say are "too hard" on Luck.  There are far, far more people that are too "hard" on Luck.

 

;)

[NewColtsFan]

Glad to see you graded Holmes well.      A little surprised that you didn't say anything more.    One of the more anticipated moments of the season (Holmes playing meaningful snaps)  and you didn't have more to say about him.

 

Can you elaborate at all?     Run blocking?     Pass blocking?

 

I think all of us would appreciate your view on Holmes....

[Superman]

Glad to see you graded Holmes well. A little surprised that you didn't say anything more. One of the more anticipated moments of the season (Holmes playing meaningful snaps) and you didn't have more to say about him.

Can you elaborate at all? Run blocking? Pass blocking?

I think all of us would appreciate your view on Holmes....

Well he only played 36 snaps. A very good 36 snaps, IMO. He completed every assignment, showed power, showed good feet, range and leverage, handled a couple of stunts, used his hands well, etc. He was good.

It was pretty much what he showed he was capable of in college, except he looked stronger. I think he's really talented and polished, like Hugh Thornton meets Jack Mewhort. Let's see if he keeps it up. Or better yet, if he gets the chance to stay in the lineup.

[NewColtsFan]

Well he only played 36 snaps. A very good 36 snaps, IMO. He completed every assignment, showed power, showed good feet, range and leverage, handled a couple of stunts, used his hands well, etc. He was good.

It was pretty much what he showed he was capable of in college, except he looked stronger. I think he's really talented and polished, like Hugh Thornton meets Jack Mewhort. Let's see if he keeps it up. Or better yet, if he gets the chance to stay in the lineup.

 

 

I think it will be fascinating to watch who starts at C and RG on Sunday.

 

I'm hoping for Shipley and Holmes, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

And if it's Harrison and someone else, it will be interesting to see who gets the nod now that Reitz is out.

 

Would it be Nixon,  or Shipley,  or Holmes at RG? 

 

Inquiring minds want to know....

 

But we won't until we line-up Sunday.....

[Superman]

I think it will be fascinating to watch who starts at C and RG on Sunday.

I'm hoping for Shipley and Holmes, but I'm not holding my breath.

And if it's Harrison and someone else, it will be interesting to see who gets the nod now that Reitz is out.

Would it be Nixon, or Shipley, or Holmes at RG?

Inquiring minds want to know....

But we won't until we line-up Sunday.....

Just like Week 5...

[Superman]

By the way, Holmes had some bad snaps. It wasn't all good. But nothing catastrophic, and he got better as the game went on.

[21isSuperman]

By the way, Holmes had some bad snaps. It wasn't all good. But nothing catastrophic, and he got better as the game went on.

Given the limited action Holmes has had and what you've seen, do you think he should be starting?

[Gavin]

In my opinion Holmes is a LG or RG (RG in our system because that is our primary Pulling Guard) who can play Center if need be, The reason why I say that is this, To have an athletic O Lineman like he clearly is and to pigeon hole him into the Center spot is a failure in my opinion to get the best out of your player....Are there athletic Centers out there? Of course...Alex Mack is the ultimate example of this but in my opinion athletic Centers are not the norm

 

When I think of the Center positon I think of an O Lineman who is not only smart and can adjust all the Line calls accordingly but I think of him as your pile mover, the guy that can hold his own against the bigger DT's in the league, I think given time if he gets better with his technique then that is Harrison, He has shown the ability to bring down bigger DT's, He has gotten multiple pancake blocks since he has started

[mystrymaster]

I agree with everything except the game ball.

I'd give the game ball to the Browns OC for taking Joe Haden off of T.Y. Hilton in the 2nd half.

Boom has to get a good grade for getting that first down TWICE. lol

Except he didnt take him off Hilton. Hilton still put up good numbers against him.

[Superman]

Given the limited action Holmes has had and what you've seen, do you think he should be starting?

Yeah, all things being equal, he's one of our five best linemen. And of course, that's based on a tiny sample size. I'd really, really like to see him against Watt.

Realistically, though, all things aren't equal and decisions like this aren't made in a vacuum. The reason Holmes has been on the bench for two years is because he gets hurt at the wrong times and seems to be a slow healer. Not because he lacks ability. Same thing with Reitz.

[lollygagger8]

Except he didnt take him off Hilton. Hilton still put up good numbers against him.

 

Haden wasn't on Hilton anywhere near as much in the 2nd half compared to the first half. 

[ColtStronger]

Totally agree on Luck.  He is always trying to make plays, which is great.  But far too often it seems to bite us in teh rear - at least lately that seems to be the case.  Reggie's health has also been maddening.  I see him letting balls get into his chest more and more.  He almost never does that when he has the opportunity to catch with his hands.  Clearly it's bothering him.

And he's allowed numerous balls to be tipped, making more INT's against Luck. 

[ColtStronger]

I agree with everything except the game ball. 

 

I'd give the game ball to the Browns OC for taking Joe Haden off of T.Y. Hilton in the 2nd half. 

 

 

 

Boom has to get a good grade for getting that first down TWICE. lol 

Why does Boom get praised for 1 first down?  He had a 3.25 YPC!  If that was Trent people would talk a lot of crap.  Trent had a decent game, but didn't get credited for it.  What's wrong with this picture?

[Superman]

Why does Boom get praised for 1 first down?  He had a 3.25 YPC!  If that was Trent people would talk a lot of crap.  Trent had a decent game, but didn't get credited for it.  What's wrong with this picture?

 

When you have just 8 carries, two goal line situations will drag down that average. Before those last two carries, he was at 4 YPC. Not a bad average at all. I thought Boom had a strong game, rushing and receiving.

[ColtStronger]

When you have just 8 carries, two goal line situations will drag down that average. Before those last two carries, he was at 4 YPC. Not a bad average at all. I thought Boom had a strong game, rushing and receiving.

I definitely agree with your reasoning but last year in particular, it wasn't an acceptable excuse for Trent in that same situation.  He had many 3rd and short and goal line runs, where everybody and there grandmothers knew the Colts were handing it off up the middle.  Then he would get stuffed in the backfield.  My response is if Boom is so good than he should've had a better average before then.  If other people only want to look at the stat sheet at the end of the game and use it as an arguement so can I.  I'm just trying to make a point, I guess.  It's not a good point but it makes sense!

[dw49]

Grading is subjective and inexact. But my goal is to grade Luck against his established typical performance. He's a really good QB, on the verge of great, if he isn't already there. So when he's around 50% completions (adjusted for drops), it's a red flag that he didn't play well. When he commits three turnovers, none of which is he without blame for, he gets dinged for that.

You act like I don't know that Luck isn't a polished vet. I'm not one of those guys who runs around pointing out every mistake he makes, harping on the few miniscule flaws that have yet to be refined.

 

 

Here's the problem with giving Luck grades like a C. I read (Stampede Blue) a stat that states when given the proper amount of time to throw , his QB rating is 2nd in the NFL. He trails A. Rodgers only. The article is in Stampede blue and I happen to agree with the author of that little piece. It's very difficult to be an elite QB when you have a porous O line. Tough to feel pressure all the time . Makes for throws off the wrong foot and some of the bad decisions. Funny with those 3 turnovers ... lots of ways to look at them. You say he's not without blame and I don't dispute that. But on the other hand..

 

1) The fumble... horrible officiating. Even by RULE that play was over before the fumble. Not only was forward progress long stopped but by "RULE" when two defenders have the QB in grasp , the play is OVER. Not reviewable but ridiculous ruling that it was a fumble .

 

2) The pick six was a bad read .. no doubt. But once again .. if the O Line had protected he maybe makes the correct read with more time. Plus he was hit as he was throwing the ball. But I'll give it to him as it was the wrong Receiver to throw to . But he probably makes a better throw if he wasn't wacked for about the 18th time in that game.

 

3) Int #2 was not a horrible throw. Hilton mistimes jump a bit and on target throw a little high to a 5' 8" WR goes off his hands .

[Superman]

Here's the problem with giving Luck grades like a C. I read (Stampede Blue) a stat that states when given the proper amount of time to throw , his QB rating is 2nd in the NFL. He trails A. Rodgers only. The article is in Stampede blue and I happen to agree with the author of that little piece. It's very difficult to be an elite QB when you have a porous O line. Tough to feel pressure all the time . Makes for throws off the wrong foot and some of the bad decisions. Funny with those 3 turnovers ... lots of ways to look at them. You say he's not without blame and I don't dispute that. But on the other hand..

 

I'm not sure which stat you're referring to, and I'm not sure how one would define "the proper amount of time to throw." But per PFF, when he has 2.6 seconds or more to throw, Luck's passer rating is 91.4, 8th in the league among QBs who have taken 50% of their team's snaps. When he has 2.5 seconds or less, Luck's passer rating is 107.3, 7th in the league. He's pressured on 34.5% of his dropbacks, which is too high, but still only the 12th highest in the league.

 

And there have been games this season where Luck was pressured more than he was against the Browns, but he played better, his throws were more accurate, he read his coverage better, etc. Matter of fact, he was really only average without pressure in this game (60% on 33 attempts, 1 TD, 6 yards/attempt. Against the Jags, another game where we made a bunch of mistakes, Luck completed 81% of his throws for 7.2 yards/attempt, on dropbacks with no pressure. He was just a little off against the Browns.

 

Of course, more pressure makes his job harder, but it's also partly on him to handle that pressure, at various stages of the play. By way of comparison, Russell Wilson is pressured on 45.2% of his dropbacks, but he has a higher adjusted accuracy percentage (aimed passes and drops included), even though he has a higher sack rate.

 

I think you know, and I hope others know, that I understand that Luck faces too much pressure, and how that affects his job. He still needs to perform. When his throws are off the mark, when he misses open receivers, etc., that's his issue, regardless of the performance of the line. 

 

1) The fumble... horrible officiating. Even by RULE that play was over before the fumble. Not only was forward progress long stopped but by "RULE" when two defenders have the QB in grasp , the play is OVER. Not reviewable but ridiculous ruling that it was a fumble .

 

???

 

There was no "long stopped" about the play. That play was never close to being whistled dead. He lost control of the ball before the second defender made contact with him, and I don't think he was ever really in the grasp of two defenders, as the second defender hardly got two hands on him.

 

Whether it was bad officiating or not -- and I don't think it was -- it was a bad decision by Luck, period. Protect the football and take the sack. I really don't see how this is arguable. He didn't get hit from behind, he wasn't stripped as he was getting ready to throw, the ball wasn't poked out by a wily defender... He was being careless with the football, trying to salvage a play that wasn't salvageable.

 

2) The pick six was a bad read .. no doubt. But once again .. if the O Line had protected he maybe makes the correct read with more time. Plus he was hit as he was throwing the ball. But I'll give it to him as it was the wrong Receiver to throw to . But he probably makes a better throw if he wasn't wacked for about the 18th time in that game.

 

3) Int #2 was not a horrible throw. Hilton mistimes jump a bit and on target throw a little high to a 5' 8" WR goes off his hands .

 

The pick six was his fault. Again, I understand that pressure makes his job harder, but he threw the ball to the other team. He got hit right when he released the ball, but it's hard to tell that the throw was affected, and even if it was, there was no window for the ball to get to the receiver he was throwing to. Bad throw, no two ways about it, pressure or not. And while the pocket had collapsed, he had a lane to escape and pick up some yardage on the ground. 

 

And the second pick wasn't a horrible throw; I don't think I called it a horrible throw. But it was off the mark. I think it's strange to say that Hilton mistimed his jump on a throw that he shouldn't have had to jump for. The throw should have been out in front of him, not high. And yes, Luck was throwing on the run, and that makes it harder. I understand that. But the bottom line is that the throw was off the mark, and eventually, was intercepted.

 

I think Luck is great. I don't think that means he doesn't have a bad game every now and then. And I definitely don't think that means his mistakes should be glossed over or minimized. Officiating, protection, drops, etc., play a role, but he is responsible for many of them, on his own. This is not me nitpicking him. He legitimately made some bad decisions in this game, and some of his throws were off, and overall, he didn't have a good game. I think that's reflected in the grade. We know what an A-level or B-level game is for Andrew Luck, and it's easily better than that.

[dw49]

I'm not sure which stat you're referring to, and I'm not sure how one would define "the proper amount of time to throw." But per PFF, when he has 2.6 seconds or more to throw, Luck's passer rating is 91.4, 8th in the league among QBs who have taken 50% of their team's snaps. When he has 2.5 seconds or less, Luck's passer rating is 107.3, 7th in the league. He's pressured on 34.5% of his dropbacks, which is too high, but still only the 12th highest in the league.

 

And there have been games this season where Luck was pressured more than he was against the Browns, but he played better, his throws were more accurate, he read his coverage better, etc. Matter of fact, he was really only average without pressure in this game (60% on 33 attempts, 1 TD, 6 yards/attempt. Against the Jags, another game where we made a bunch of mistakes, Luck completed 81% of his throws for 7.2 yards/attempt, on dropbacks with no pressure. He was just a little off against the Browns.

 

Of course, more pressure makes his job harder, but it's also partly on him to handle that pressure, at various stages of the play. By way of comparison, Russell Wilson is pressured on 45.2% of his dropbacks, but he has a higher adjusted accuracy percentage (aimed passes and drops included), even though he has a higher sack rate.

 

I think you know, and I hope others know, that I understand that Luck faces too much pressure, and how that affects his job. He still needs to perform. When his throws are off the mark, when he misses open receivers, etc., that's his issue, regardless of the performance of the line. 

 

 

 

???

 

There was no "long stopped" about the play. That play was never close to being whistled dead. He lost control of the ball before the second defender made contact with him, and I don't think he was ever really in the grasp of two defenders, as the second defender hardly got two hands on him.

 

Whether it was bad officiating or not -- and I don't think it was -- it was a bad decision by Luck, period. Protect the football and take the sack. I really don't see how this is arguable. He didn't get hit from behind, he wasn't stripped as he was getting ready to throw, the ball wasn't poked out by a wily defender... He was being careless with the football, trying to salvage a play that wasn't salvageable.

 

 

 

The pick six was his fault. Again, I understand that pressure makes his job harder, but he threw the ball to the other team. He got hit right when he released the ball, but it's hard to tell that the throw was affected, and even if it was, there was no window for the ball to get to the receiver he was throwing to. Bad throw, no two ways about it, pressure or not. And while the pocket had collapsed, he had a lane to escape and pick up some yardage on the ground. 

 

And the second pick wasn't a horrible throw; I don't think I called it a horrible throw. But it was off the mark. I think it's strange to say that Hilton mistimed his jump on a throw that he shouldn't have had to jump for. The throw should have been out in front of him, not high. And yes, Luck was throwing on the run, and that makes it harder. I understand that. But the bottom line is that the throw was off the mark, and eventually, was intercepted.

 

I think Luck is great. I don't think that means he doesn't have a bad game every now and then. And I definitely don't think that means his mistakes should be glossed over or minimized. Officiating, protection, drops, etc., play a role, but he is responsible for many of them, on his own. This is not me nitpicking him. He legitimately made some bad decisions in this game, and some of his throws were off, and overall, he didn't have a good game. I think that's reflected in the grade. We know what an A-level or B-level game is for Andrew Luck, and it's easily better than that.

 

 

Here's the article I found the claim that he 2nd to Rodgers when no pressure.

 

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2014/12/11/7376637/points-of-emphasis-colts-vs-browns-week-14

 

 

 

 

Here's a link to Mike Pereira's view on the "fumble." It's exactly the way I saw it and I've seen the play about 8 times. My bad on saying two players had control of him . There was one with another closing in. That is how the grasp and control rule is enforced. By rule that play is over as the other defender was there to make the hit also.Plus he agrees that forward progress was stopped.

 

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2014/12/8/7353263/should-andrew-lucks-fumble-really-have-been-ruled-a-fumble

[Superman]

Here's the article I found the claim that he 2nd to Rodgers when no pressure.

 

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2014/12/11/7376637/points-of-emphasis-colts-vs-browns-week-14

 

 

 

 

Here's a link to Mike Pereira's view on the "fumble." It's exactly the way I saw it and I've seen the play about 8 times. My bad on saying two players had control of him . There was one with another closing in. That is how the grasp and control rule is enforced. By rule that play is over as the other defender was there to make the hit also.Plus he agrees that forward progress was stopped.

 

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2014/12/8/7353263/should-andrew-lucks-fumble-really-have-been-ruled-a-fumble

 

I don't know about PFF's passer rating and how it works, so I can't speak to that. But I think we can agree that the pressure on Luck isn't an excuse for him throwing to double-covered receivers or not putting the ball away. I'm not saying we need to cut him and find a better QB. I just think that, regardless of protection, his decision making has to keep getting better. And some of these turnovers are a result of him being less careful with the ball than he should be.

 

As for the fumble, I'll pretty much always defer to Pereira. But I think the play happened so fast that ruling Luck down because of forward progress was never really an option. And I don't think the second defender engaged with him before the ball starts coming out, so "in the grasp" wasn't an option yet, either. And even more important, Luck shouldn't have still been trying to throw the ball. Had he secured it and taken the sack, we'd be talking more about how the protection failed him than how he needs to take better care of the football.

[dw49]

I don't know about PFF's passer rating and how it works, so I can't speak to that. But I think we can agree that the pressure on Luck isn't an excuse for him throwing to double-covered receivers or not putting the ball away. I'm not saying we need to cut him and find a better QB. I just think that, regardless of protection, his decision making has to keep getting better. And some of these turnovers are a result of him being less careful with the ball than he should be.

 

As for the fumble, I'll pretty much always defer to Pereira. But I think the play happened so fast that ruling Luck down because of forward progress was never really an option. And I don't think the second defender engaged with him before the ball starts coming out, so "in the grasp" wasn't an option yet, either. And even more important, Luck shouldn't have still been trying to throw the ball. Had he secured it and taken the sack, we'd be talking more about how the protection failed him than how he needs to take better care of the football.

 

 

Yes he tries to do too much . Maybe if Grigson someday fixes this swiss cheese O Line , his mindset will be a little different. As of now , it's up to Andrew Luck to carry the team. Not a lot different than the Manning era. 

 

The second defender does not have to lay a finger on Luck for that play to be blown dead. Your mistaken as to how the rule reads . 

 

 

"Basically, what Pereira is saying is that the play should have been blown dead.  Firstly, Luck's forward progress was stopped at the two yard line and he was then driven backwards.  Secondly, Pereira says that the defender had Luck in "grasp and control" with another defender closing in.  The "grasp and control" rule is one that the NFL has in order to protect the quarterback (both from injury and from a stupid play) and comes into effect whenever a defender clearly has the quarterback in his control.  The NFL policy is to blow the play dead when this happens."