Denver CB Harris says Wilson is better than Luck [Merge]

[thedude]

I stay out of NFL General at all costs. 

 

I seriously have like 6 posts there, 3 of which in the last week. I don't even stop by there.

But here you are....

[John Waylon]

But here you are....

 

Proving that the thread moved from NFL Gen to Colts Football when I started my topic, and then back again after the merge.

 

Someone tried to pull a fast one...

[thedude]

Truly professional players avoid trap questions, and focus their comments on their team, in a positive light while espousing nothing but support. They avoid comments and questions meant to stir the pot and disrespect fellow NFL players with other teams.

If he was indeed asked which QB he thought was better, how is that a trap question? I think some of you are taking this much too personally.

[thedude]

Proving that the thread moved from NFL Gen to Colts Football when I started my topic, and then back again after the merge.

 

Someone tried to pull a fast one...

And here you still are.....

[pacolts56]

Well, that losing football player had a good view of both of the QBs. They lost to Wilson but the beat Luck and were blowing the Colts out in the first half. I do not find his opinion useless at all. Your opinion on the other hand.......

And Luck led the Colts to a win over the same Seahawks team that humiliated Denver in the Super Bowl.

Or is that just my opinion?

[Clem-Dog]

This argument will be become much clearer after both players sign their $120 m contracts. Remember all the Flacco hype before he got his?

When Russell signs an elite QB contract how will it affect the Hawks roster?

I honestly don't envision a significant drop off on the Colts roster because most of their veteran players are average at best.

[ruksak]

If he was indeed asked which QB he thought was better, how is that a trap question? I think some of you are taking this much too personally.

"Personally"? Huh? I gave my opinion, how does any of this reflect on me, personally? 

 

Anywho......it is a trap question (if he was even asked this directly) because the intent would be to get Harris to say want they want i.e. "GIMME a headline". Hence the trap. 

 

There's no need to eat out of the media's palm. Harris should've just complimented Wilson and left it at that. 

[thedude]

"Personally"? Huh? I gave my opinion, how does any of this reflect on me, personally?

That's what I'm wondering. And I don't see the trap in the question. I just see a question if in fact it was asked.

[rsrobinson]

Pro Bowl LT and Center plus Carpenter is a beast and will be a Pro Bowler this year, I wouldn't call that mediocre or horrible

The Hawks' OL was shredded with injuries last year and was one of the worst in the league, especially in pass protection. They have been improved so far this year but pass protection is still mediocre at best. Wilson frequently has to escape the pocket and make plays.

Wilson has also has had to face top defenses far more often than Luck who is playing in the weakest division in the league. Luck won the fantasy football stats battle yesterday against a terrible Jags team but Wilson was more impressive while facing a much better team and was flawless in overtime.

[thedude]

The Hawks' OL was shredded with injuries last year and was one of the worst in the league, especially in pass protection. They have been improved so far this year but pass protection is still mediocre at best. Wilson frequently has to escape the pocket and make plays.

Wilson has also has had to face top defenses far more often than Luck who is playing in the weakest division in the league. Luck won the fantasy football stats battle yesterday against a terrible Jags team but Wilson was more impressive while facing a much better team and was flawless in overtime.

Their O line is slightly improved, but not significantly. Contrary to popular opinion, Wilson is a pocket passing QB, but he rarely has the opportunity to stay in the pocket to demonstrate that skill. He's usually running for his life. Put a QB like Manning or some other immobile statue on that team and they'd be at best. 9-7.

[TAPLOOK]

Wilson is the most versatile QB in the league with plenty of smarts and a great work ethic. Right NOW he's not only better than Luck but every other QB as well. A month from now things may line up a little different but not by much. The guys fun to watch and knows how to take care of himself so we'll be watching him for years to come.

[GoPats]

Talk to me when Russell Wilson throws for more than 3400 yards in a season, or has 400 in a game.

 

Russell is a good quarterback, but he doesn't have to do much. His job is essentially "don't screw up"

 

Swap "Russell Wilson" with "Tom Brady" and "Andrew Luck" with "Peyton Manning" and this could be a message board post from 2003. 

 

Different generation of fans, same story! 

 

 

The only think I have to say is who cares? It's no difference that the age old Manning vs Brady crap. Now it turns to Luck vs Wilson crap. They are both very good QBs so what difference does it make except to those who want to bicker about it?

 

This, 100 times over. 

 

Both guys have a long, long way to go. Just enjoy it.

[thedude]

It turns out that he was asked the question to compare the two.

[SilentHill]

Russell Wilson has the Ring,  so until someone else from his drafting class matches that,  He will be considered the best of the class.

 

Is he really the best...???    I don't know, but I do know he definitely impressed me with that last winning drive last night.

 

Are you saying that Tom Brady is better than Manning? Or that Trent Dilfer is better than Luck?  Cmon now gramz. we all know rings are a team accomplishment.

[The Old Crow]

I would take either one, heck, I'm happy with Flacco.

[ruksak]

Are you saying that Tom Brady is better than Manning? Or that Trent Dilfer is better than Luck?  Cmon now gramz. we all know rings are a team accomplishment.

To her point, Wilson has been on the biggest stage this sport allows and he played (and won) like a HoF phenom. He's proven his salt, and like it or not, Luck has some catching up to do in this regard. Not his fault that he isn't a SB champ. But.....he isn't and Russell is. 

[The Old Crow]

To her point, Wilson has been on the biggest stage this sport allows and he played (and won) like a HoF phenom. He's proven his salt, and like it or not, Luck has some catching up to do in this regard. Not his fault that he isn't a SB champ. But.....he isn't and Russell is.

We've had this argument many times on this forum, but even though rings are team accomplishments, they still weigh heavily in grading out the greatest QB's of all time. It may not be fair, but it is the way it is.

[rittdk01]

The Seahawks are a better overall team than any other.  Is Russell Wilson better than luck?  No way Jose.  

 

When the Colts played the Broncos their defense gave up 24 first half points.  Seattle's d gave up 3.  If u don't understand what these numbers mean u don't get football.  

 

Ask yourself "would I trade my qb for theirs?"  I don't think u would find one taker that is a Colts fan.  Not so long ago Big Ben was the greatest ever running a similar team.  Big Ben is really good but nobody even hints at him being in the "elite" company of Manning and Brady anymore.

[thedude]

I think Wilson is putting to rest this silly idea that he's a "game manager". As Chris Carter said, "he's a game dictator".

[SilentHill]

We've had this argument many times on this forum, but even though rings are team accomplishments, they still weigh heavily in grading out the greatest QB's of all time. It may not be fair, but it is the way it is.

 

and when a player is in their 3rd season it's completely irrelevant.

[thedude]

 

Ask yourself "would I trade my qb for theirs?"  I don't think u would find one taker that is a Colts fan. .

Quite frankly, I wouldn't trade Wilson for anyone. Period.

[SilentHill]

Quite frankly, I wouldn't trade Wilson for anyone. Period.

 

If I had Wilson, I'd trade Wilson for Luck and I'd give a #1 and a #2

[thedude]

If I had Wilson, I'd trade Wilson for Luck and I'd give a #1 and a #2

If you was a general manager, you'd be fired instantly.

[SilentHill]

If you was a general manager, you'd be fired instantly.

 

Yea, no. maybe if you didn't take the deal.

[GoPats]

I think Wilson is putting to rest this silly idea that he's a "game manager". As Chris Carter said, "he's a game dictator".

 

That OT drive... pretty impressive. When he runs the ball he's got a very good sense of where he is on the field and where he needs to get it to pick up a first down. And he's making some really great reads and throws right now. The thing with any young QB is avoiding mistakes, and he doesn't make very many. 

[Yehoodi]

Are you saying that Tom Brady is better than Manning? Or that Trent Dilfer is better than Luck?  Cmon now gramz. we all know rings are a team accomplishment.

 

so isn't team offense, like team passing yards, TDs, and rushing yards . . . just saying . . . it works both ways if one actually opens their eyes . . . it takes 11 players working together on offense and defense for things to work . . . surely one player can be instrumental in this endeavor but so it one equally instrumental to team wins . . . one needs to be consistent when viewing these type of things . . . many make the mistake of saying one is in the individual category while the other is in the general team category . . .

[The Old Crow]

and when a player is in their 3rd season it's completely irrelevant.

I don't disagree. Way too early

[amfootball]

IMO, finding a QB who senses the moment, is cerebral, understands his limitations, plays within the system, is good situationally and a team leader is far more important in what goes into making a winner, a champion than size, arm strength, etc. Wilson just doesn't look the part physically but he has every skillset beyond the physical that you would want. And even his physical limitations don't seem to affect his game much.

[Yehoodi]

We've had this argument many times on this forum, but even though rings are team accomplishments, they still weigh heavily in grading out the greatest QB's of all time. It may not be fair, but it is the way it is.

 

I hear yah and agree and yes they weigh heavily and the reason is that they have they have an element of a certain players can have a fingerprint on the accomplishment . . . as I indicated in my last post . . . the traditional "individual" stats of QB are actually "team" accomplishments that have been attributed by some to QB, just as some attribute the rings and wins/losses . . . on one hand both are team accomplishments on the other hand they can have a fingerprint from one player . . . the fact remains that for the most part each item needs team players to accomplish the goal or stats . . . I find it interesting in listening to the media and reading newspapers and posts on forums to see how people still want to force feed rings as a team accomplishment while out of the other side of they mouth talk about individualism when it comes to team passing, rushing and TDs . . .  

[thedude]

Yea, no. maybe if you didn't take the deal.

I'd fire him for entertaining the idea. No one else in the NFL would ever hire him again if he was the one who proposed it.

Decisions like that would make Matt Millen look like the most competent GM in history.

[BOTT]

I didn't read any of this thread, but I'm guessing it brought the worst in this kind of fanboy discussion.

[GoPats]

If I had Wilson, I'd trade Wilson for Luck and I'd give a #1 and a #2

 

Are you in any fantasy leagues that I can join?  ;)

[The Old Crow]

I hear yah and agree and yes they weigh heavily and the reason is that they have they have an element of a certain players can have a fingerprint on the accomplishment . . . as I indicated in my last post . . . the traditional "individual" stats of QB are actually "team" accomplishments that have been attributed by some to QB, just as some attribute the rings and wins/losses . . . on one hand both are team accomplishments on the other hand they can have a fingerprint from one player . . . the fact remains that for the most part each item needs team players to accomplish the goal or stats . . . I find it interesting in listening to the media and reading newspapers and posts on forums to see how people still want to force feed rings as a team accomplishment while out of the other side of they mouth talk about individualism when it comes to team passing, rushing and TDs . . .

Absolutely, and just ask Elway what those two rings meant to his legacy at the end of his career. I think why many on this forum use the team accomplishment/ quarterback argument, is due to the Manning/ Brady deal. You can't talk QB individual accomplishments and GOAT without factoring in Championships. It is the goal that matters most to all players and teams. Take the Mattingly/ Jeter Yankees example. Why is Jeter a legend, and Mattingly just a very good Yankee. Answer: 5 titles.

[SilentHill]

Are you in any fantasy leagues that I can join?  ;)

 

Fantasy is different, but Luck is the #1 Fantasy player so far this season, just saying, lol.

[SilentHill]

I'd fire him for entertaining the idea. No one else in the NFL would ever hire him again if he was the one who proposed it.

Decisions like that would make Matt Millen look like the most competent GM in history.

 

Any GM that doesn't take that offer (receiving Luck), would be the butt of every joke for the next decade, not only would they be immediately be fired, and banished from the NFL due to no interest, I'd have serious doubts about them being able to secure a job at Burger King after making a flub like that.

[crazycolt1]

To her point, Wilson has been on the biggest stage this sport allows and he played (and won) like a HoF phenom. He's proven his salt, and like it or not, Luck has some catching up to do in this regard. Not his fault that he isn't a SB champ. But.....he isn't and Russell is. 

I am not knocking Wilson in any way but Luck was on a bigger stage as you call it just because he was the #1 overall pick and went to a 2-14 team. Only your imagination could say how well Luck would have done had he went to a team as talented as Seattle his first year followed by two more. Luck out performed Wilson heads up last season so I think they are more even than you think.

[amfootball]

I am not knocking Wilson in any way but Luck was on a bigger stage as you call it just because he was the #1 overall pick and went to a 2-14 team. Only your imagination could say how well Luck would have done had he went to a team as talented as Seattle his first year followed by two more. Luck out performed Wilson heads up last season so I think they are more even than you think.

The Colts though really were not a 2-14 team. They were in the playoffs the year prior and had no contingency plan when Manning was out with the neck at QB. So really Luck did not inherit a terrible team by any means and they have surrounded Luck with better talent at the skills position than Wilson. That being said, Wilson has the much better defense. I do think Luck has had waay more expectations than Wilson as the number one pick but that is part of the deal when you come out as highly touted as he was. Not sure if it really matters honestly.

[ruksak]

I am not knocking Wilson in any way but Luck was on a bigger stage as you call it just because he was the #1 overall pick and went to a 2-14 team. Only your imagination could say how well Luck would have done had he went to a team as talented as Seattle his first year followed by two more. Luck out performed Wilson heads up last season so I think they are more even than you think.

I'm not in the business of supposing. Wilson was there, Luck was not. The facts aren't asking you for verification on that matter. 

[Superman]

Wilson is the most versatile QB in the league with plenty of smarts and a great work ethic. Right NOW he's not only better than Luck but every other QB as well. A month from now things may line up a little different but not by much. The guys fun to watch and knows how to take care of himself so we'll be watching him for years to come.

 

This time a year ago, people were saying the same thing about Colin Kaepernick. That's the problem with being prisoner to the moment.

[HOFClipboardHolder]

The Colts though really were not a 2-14 team. They were in the playoffs the year prior and had no contingency plan when Manning was out with the neck at QB. So really Luck did not inherit a terrible team by any means and they have surrounded Luck with better talent at the skills position than Wilson. That being said, Wilson has the much better defense. I do think Luck has had waay more expectations than Wilson as the number one pick but that is part of the deal when you come out as highly touted as he was. Not sure if it really matters honestly.

Are you serious? How many of those 2011 Colts still in the league?